am i first

@@ecodersofficial You are

Bro please read my email😭😭

@@thadeoussnyders5932 NO

@fireship Bro you are the peoples' champion. The peoples' champion reads emails.

lol

And didn't think of learning anything else because it was interesting at the beginning and now it's too late to learn anything else and improve on it

No? I love it

That was painful

If still broke then make sense

Exactly, you make enough money to buy the membership at the gym that's next to the office or your home and hit an hour or two there every day before going to the first meeting and eating the protein bars meant for snacks. It's the perfect time because most people won't be there while you can just flex your hours. Also, check the free-for-all fridge that's anyway packed with drinks for quarks, greek yoghurt and/or protein puddings to get the protein in. There's no reason not to be the biggest at the office.

TRUE

I read Atomic Habits and I literally work out 5 days a week after work now. Has helped a lot with my mental health.

I also work out 5 days a week. Most of us really have time to do this, but we find ways to make excuses. A planet fitness membership. I believe costs between $10 and $20 depending on the tier that you get

I started working out at night after going to random stuff classes I signed for, then transitionated to going right after lunch, it's so effing hard for me to wake up early in the morning :c

hey, at least you have friends

Javascript can be valuable too. Entering patient data into a web app, or making it possible to view your x rays within a few minutes of taking them, for example. Lots of things contribute to society in various ways. Not everything has to be literally saving someone's life. Even improving the quality of life is valuable. I am not saying every programming project does this, but it CAN.

Well, if you live long enough for humans to be replaced with synths (if we haven't already), you might one day write an api call that saves a life. You never know.

Uncaught ReferenceError: savingPeople is not defined...

Trust me, we have a much, much easier job than nurses or paramedics. I'll take writing code for money, and having hobby interests any day over the meat grinder that is healthcare

no need to do ASM to complain with that

Me too. In that order too.

> I started with ASM, 𝚠𝚊𝚒𝚝.

omg Are you me? Did you also program microcontrollers?

@@deadbeef576 16F88 a lot! Others too, but the 16F denomination will stick with me till I die

I've met two programmers who have been at it for around 60 years.. I sometimes check their github to see if they are still alive.. best people I've met in the industry by far! and I love how they are just like you (and me) still absolutely in love with it all!

Yes it does

a wise told man me once "go out and get f cked", going out makes things happened or you can stay inside and gets bitter from what you see on the internet

wow the same bruu

A minute spent touching grass is a minute lost that could be used to code.

Yea, i got the nerd neck for looking at the screen for countless hours, i think i should do the same

your comment might as well save my life, so you have that for your change. I always thought that i will not go out, will not have friends, will not indulge in any activity except coding so i can earn but if it is true that you are also making money even after prioritising things other than coding then, ill just leave now i was seriously fed up with the coding grind, i enjoy it but it is so stressful, thanks man

RIP Terry

He died for our sins

Idiot also admires simplicity 😂

truly a programming legend

Terry was that "anomaly" in the system! He was truly one of a kind! Rest In Peace, Terry! You were too good for this world!

I got passionate about programming because of him. I only knew the landscape because of him

omg ! this is the best comment so far thanks a lot bro , i can not express my gratitude over you

technically, he is a strong link in a the programming pyramid scheme.

Yeah, but did he centered a div?

Absolutely right! Love this guy's energy and passion! He keeps me inspired in my journey of breaking into the tech industry and becoming a developer. Well said, @matanp103!

MY MAN!

the amount of toxic jobs that comes with the career that affects your health is not worth the money

Work at a place where the software generates the money, not where software is seen as a cost.

THIS!!!

What was your learning journey like, how long did it take you to get a job and what stacks or languages do you know?

One thing I would add though, is try to do as much as you can before you have children. I was on a good upward trajectory transitioning from data analytics to engineering, but it completely bricked out as soon as I had kids, was perpetually exhausted and had almost no free time left to spend on projects or at least no time where my brain wasn't fried enough from dealing with baby/toddler from 6.30am to work-start, work-end to 9pm and all weekend. Now I just wish I either did a LOT more before I had kids, or that I just stayed happy as an analyst with much less post-work hour study requirements as I can't keep up in the slightest. I just do not have the time.

@@XTSonic too true. It’s just treading water after procreating. Eventually we all drown

you're not a true game dev until you write your own game engine

Actually the most comforting thing I've heard in life

​@@XTSoniccongratulations for the kid

This morning I spent 3 hours learning how to write a one-liner script file to output a value of something because the current way requires 3 clicks and about 5 seconds total wait time.

Research and experiments aren't time lost.

such is life.🤣😥

You made me double over laughing with how real that is.

@@gehirndoper unless you forget about it and have to do the exact same research a few years later

Yeah the stories from a ex paramedic friend I know... man, that is horrible. I can't imagine having to see that in my life, let alone everyday. They have to have shut off empathy and sympathy, like their brain has to be wired to be similar to a psychopath's in order to NOT have PTSD. That's basically impossible imho unless they're born that way.

Apparently the Nic Cage film "Bringing Out The Dead" was practically a documentary.

Exactly. Well said. I would never envy someone being a paramedic.

Everything has upsides and downsides, be as informed as you can and be ready for them. Some extra advice I would give is be careful about caffiene intake, make sure you know the effects and are ready to tone it down if it starts affecting you too much.

How do you get a job without tutorials?

What algorithm are you using to keep track of them?

my biggest regret is that I didn't track my regrets

Keep those regrets in MongoDB. You won't regret it.

what sorting method have you tried to keep track of them

sounds like a project idea for you to work on

Tough work tho, bro. I don't fancy the chances of being injury free in 40 years as a welder. As a programmer we can mostly guarantee our own safety, excluding back aches and carpal tunnel.

@@applepie9806 My dad did it. Not being an idiot really helps in the "not getting injured" department.

Same, I want to make visualizations for weird algorithms in JS/CSS but no one wants to pay for eye candy they don't necessarily understand or have any use for

What are you doing nowadays? What's the new career look like?

@@pieterjanspoelders8636 Apologies for the wall of text. Just scrolled up after writing all this to let you know I got a bit carried away. I work at the service desk for a company that provides temporary security software/hardware (for construction sites, for example). We have a webapp for registering and managing who can access the construction site, which company they work for, when they clock in/out, etc. We also provide turnstiles and the like that are connected to the registration environment. (Our company also provides cameras, but that's a separate department). I help end-users when they're having problems with the software and/or hardware, or when they need to do or change something in the system that they don't have permission to change themselves. I like how I no longer need to plan and manage my time with long-term projects. I get a phone call, help the person, and file the ticket. When there's no phonecalls waiting, I open an email, help the person, and file the ticket. When there's no unassigned emails left either, I have some time to relax. I can work at my own pace (mostly), and I don't have to worry about schedule slip, because there _is_ no schedule. It's nice to be not just caught up, but _done_ at times, instead of always having several new features waiting to be implemented. One downside is, when the software is broken or malfunctioning in some way, I have to wait for Product Management to fix the code. I can't dive in to discover the cause. Sometimes I use the browser devtools to temporarily fix something on my own end, and whatever PHP nightmare they have on the backend shines through. Judging by the wildly jumping indentation of the resulting HTML, there's some pretty complex stuff going on there. Kinda glad I don't have to deal with that, because I just _know_ I wouldn't be able to stop myself from trying to refactor that. Also, the fact that I'm the only one on the service desk team with programming knowledge means I can contribute in unique ways. For example, one part of the webapp consists of multiple nested accordion menus, and there's no search bar. If you need to find something, and it's not on the "top layer", you're gonna have to open the options one by one until you find it. Better hope it's not multiple layers deep. I didn't want to deal with that, so I wrote a quick bookmarklet that finds the right item in the html code, unfolds all of the necessary layers above it, and then scrolls the item into view. I wrote it over a lunch break, but my colleagues had been waiting for that kind of functionality for months if not years. Now they have my bodged together solution until PM makes something better.

Dude, just *start over* from scratch. (You're welcome in advance.)

What are you doing now?

Recursion is merciless when you first start 😂, hang on bro you'll get through it eventually

coding interviews that force you to implement algorithms are so pointless and utterly useless

Why dsa for job tho? I mean, you do need it for job and can just know what exists so you can just use it when needed. But why do you need that do get a job?

@@CRAETION_I mean if you don't even get recursion... Even FizzBuzz filters out a surprising amount of people.

Paying attention in college wouldn't have saved you from leet code hell. The only way to avoid it is to not go through it. It's what I did. F faang 😂

Yes. Programming or problem solving in general still has charm for me even thought I’m going through a moment of doubt and regret about it.

Bruh!

Maybe back in the '80s. Nowadays, you need insane amounts of money and limitless resources to genuinely hope to make a breakthrough in the industry. Long gone are the days of two college roommates building a multi-million business out of a "Dude, that'd be fucking crazy, but what if we just...?" type idea they came up with during a LAN party over some pizza and weed smoke.

@@yarpen26 That's what people thought back then as well. Sure, if you want to make a breakthrough in a particular field that is already adopted by everybody and their grandmother you're going to have a hard time with limited resources. You have to become a pioneer in something new.

@@sakkii Things ain't that easy anymore though, not least because of the Internet. Whenever a new opportunity arises, you already have thousands of people grilling their brains trying to squeeze it dry and then sell it to the biggest players for a shitload of cash. Back in the early days of IT, there was effort involved in getting hold of those new developments-effort and lots of luck. The further from the US (especially Silicon Valley) you lived, the less likely were you to have a chance to, say, attend a lecture by a promising engineer you could seek partnership with or even have him in the circle of your friends' friends. Between some 1850 and 2000 things were largely beneficial to lone wolves: literacy was common and press available just enough to create big crowds of people skilled in particular fields, but not saturated so as to render individual research worthwhile. With the Internet, the window of opportunity is just so ridiculously narrow, most people can't even properly process the new information before some big fish has patented its fundamentals.

@@sakkii I posted a reply but this app is too fucked up to do something as basic as actually save it so we'll need to leave it at that. (Jesus Christ, this is embarrassing. The biggest IT conglomerate in the world, everybody...)

so eventually you wouldn't have designed anything from the start?

francois de saint exupery: “Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.”

@@dmitryjoy I've had that quote displayed since my first "real" programming job twenty four years ago. Been laughing at bad coders ever since.

@@dmitryjoy Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

If you chase 2 rabbits, you will lose them both.

you are right. every time I spend more than 2 hours coding I came out more depressed and antisocial. it's all these problems and bugs takes its toll on mental health. I wonder if it's same for police detectives always seeing the worst of people

That is so true! I have these kind of thoughts every day but at the same time if I don't go to work I won't be able to pay my bills, buy my loved ones gifts. I started my game dev careers with a lot of dreams but then I got absorbed into making tons of meaningless casual games with horrendous amount of ads. I can't even remember what I've done in the last 2 years

Man the grass is always greener on the other side my dude. People spending that much time with their friends and family are either incredibly privileged through mostly stupid luck or are miserable because they have no money and skills (ask me how I know). I'd literally kill to trade places with you as a 37-year-old who spent his entire life avoiding work to "enjoy" life. "Life is hard and then you die". This existence is a nightmare no matter what you do, but people seem to not want to acknowledge that. Life is hell. Reproduction is a narcissistic evil.

​@@philj9594 You good my dude?

@@philj9594 Life is hell if you are alone. If you have a wife and a kid and share your time with them supporting, encouraging each other, hugging, kissing, etc. This is beautiful life. And most importantly you can think of it like this. If you were never created by your parents you would never existed, what is worst than knowing you might of never existed this is even worse than the most miserable life.

I'm just sad.. hope you find your path

@@comoyun ❤

This happened to me, All my precious and well optimized code got so much hate from him. So I quit the job.

Soon there will be no need of programmers, there will be just reviewers of AI code. So just remember the good all times and find a job dealing with water, it is the new gold, soon people will kill each other for it.

Wait 10 years as programmer - it gets worse.

yoo , no comment ? lemme fix that !

+1

That's nice buddy 👏🏾🚀

My experience with PLCs is limited and long ago, but I imagine that would be a fine career. Straight, simple, to the point, does what you tell it unless something's broken. Software isn't like that! No layers of useless abstraction built in four different languages, or surprise hidden actions like with C++ constructors. A bit is a bit, a switch is a switch, a motor is a motor, etc. What is the job market like for that kind of work?

what the hell is a PLC?

​@@phillipanselmo8540its kind of a programming language for robots and machines. PLC short for Programmable Logic Controller

@@phillipanselmo8540 I think it's Programmable Logic Controller?

@@phillipanselmo8540 next u will be asking what is a pld pld is even cooler than plc

Not a programmer, but I think you may be right. Professional programmer - employed to write code to meet some vague 'deliverable' that may or may not make sense. Other professional with programming skills - uses code to solve the real world problems they encounter in their everyday work.

Yeah, I spent the first fifteen years of my life after high school building and repairing things, and now I move invisible numbers around for a few minutes every day and try to look busy for the remaining 7 hours. I make 3x the money but I still don't know if it's worth it.

A lot of engineers put too much emphasis on this and over-do it though. Writing reusable libraries & frameworks is the most productive thing a senior dev can do. But libraries & frameworks are often more complex than the code they replace so many supposedly senior devs fight against re-usability. But building up a sizable library of good quality reusable code not only makes the developer who writes it much faster and better, but it can make all the other developers who use the code faster and better to.

Being a programmer is similar to being an engineer, but not at all identical. As an engineer, your goal should be to build something as cheaply as possible. This is why simple tools and "if it ain't broken don't fix it" prevail. As a programmer, your goal is to build something as cheap, maintainable, and efficient as possible, in the shortest amount of time. You are forced to strive for perfection in basically every scenario, which is why simple tools will never be enough.

i like to write the shortest code possible to do the job but then i realize sometimes making it shorter means sacrificing performance and speed

@@okie9025 software engineer

@@okie9025 as an engineer, ur goal is to solve a fuckin problem wat u said is for a businessman, which is why the world now sucks, everything is cheap and break within 5 years

Suggest to your boss that the daily meetings should be held at lunch time, while everyone eats. That way you can eat together but choose to ignore casual talks, people's goals and achievements. When you're not in the mood, excuse yourself and go to the bathroom.

I was really surprised when I realized how bad R actually is.

I feel like I have to say something. I worked as an architect for 3 years before I moved on to programming for a living. During those 3 years I have a reasonable doubt my work hardly made anyone's life better (except for the few profiting from it), even though I didn't agree with it, my job (and many other architect's job) was to do shitboxes for people to buy at an astronomical price and spend the rest of their lives paying for them. Then I started programming in a small company where I could see the programs I did had an impact somewhere, be it an automation that saves a coworker time and effort or an application that helps monitor some valuable metric. From there I jump into another company that I believe provides a service fundamental to society. What I am trying to say is you have to find meaning in every job and in everything you do, not everything is saving lives, that's the epitome of doing good but good can also be the app that makes your local hairdresser be more productive and thus earn more for the same effort, being relieved from a repetitive or tiring task.

Yea, theres also the option to freelance or Do it Remotely and just like coding was passion and now A job, maybe you will have another passion which you can do at the side I am also starting fear the AI part, but I dont think it will affect my country much. So atleast 10 years and I ll be a senior dev

Yes, thinking as well of trying to move away - but this is not easy - you need to show some experience to move to a new field - its like starting from zero. Best way is to go to a large company and ... drift.

Or, you can move to a new industry where programming is used. Manufacturing, etc.

Yep, I'm looking for the exit from the 'tech' industry. Been there in various guises since 2009 and have now had enough - it's not grabbing me anymore and my brain fels like a lump of concrete.

this thread giving me second guesses But I ll still code, With a side valueable passion on the side

It's "Turing machine" named after Alan Turing bro, and you can stop spinning that laptop now.

True

Yeah bro I'm getting dizzy please stop

Turning machine isn’t that a lathe?

Mine taught both. I practiced programming enough to be able to learn more on my own, but I feel I benefitted a lot from the theoretical foundations and hardware understanding.

knowing that what you are spending so much time on is actually creating a difference in the world has a huge impact on being happy with your career

It always happens when something works perfectly, then I ask myself why? That essentially comes down to bits. 0s and 1s written using electrons. You're telling me I wasted last few hours of my life for some electrons to go that very specific path in my cpu?

I really like the work of Stephen Wolfram, and I feel the opposite way. Computation is way more awesome and foundational than we appreciate. We do cool stuff on the regular.

@@hetmanfoko Yeah, and your thoughts and ideas are just neurons moving a certain way inside your brain. Just because it’s based on something simple doesn’t mean that it can’t add up to be something meaningful.

I wonder how deep that rabbit hole goes.

Mark Twain: "I apologize for the long pull request-I didn't have time to write a short one."

Nikola Tesla: "If I was paid more, I would've pretended to notice the CVE you introduced in this PR. Having said that, LGTM!"

- Franklin D. Roosevelt: the only thing we have to code is the code itself. - You must be the diff you wish to see in the world - Mahatma Gitdhi

😂😂😂

"I would have refactored my code prior to committing" -Abraham Lincoln

I feel the "it's either CRUD or copy-paste". I started (more like forced to learn) programming because it is required of me and I feel backed into a corner doing it. Especially in my college Capstone project years where my deadbeat groupmates did not even care touch programming. I feel trapped doing programming and the fact that I also feel "i'm not doing something new or do anything that makes me feel worthy", Like if Wordpress and other CMS can do what I'm doing faster and being up-to-date with syntax might almost be impossible because the framework I'm using is always updating(Laravel), then what is even the point of improving and spending my time with coding?! The "script boy" thing hits hard on me too, I feel that one because I am also one. I guess the silverlining is that now I am competent that I can build a website better than my official university website. And maybe I could slightly impress employers with my coding background, other than that I am starting despise coding too. Web development for me is just CRUD + API Integration/Testing + Web Hosting, that's it. Stoicism is one of the things that helped me in my bittersweet coding journey and made me realize to embrace my fate no matter what, everything else is beyond my control. @elliotanderson1585 I'm sorry your comment just completely resonated with me. If there is any advice you can give me (either programming related or not) I would gladly appreciate it. I'm contemplating learning pentesting or QA Testing but I feel like those are dead end traps as well.

@@pkp4761 I'd suggest you try as many things that you are interested in as possible. Granted, IT is a big field, but sometimes it's just not for everyone. I know I'm doing it because the payment is good, for now, but nobody knows what the market will look like five years later; actually, it's already gone downhill. So, you can try to learn other things like pen testing, which you've mentioned, or AI, or you can try other things that are not related to the field, like writing (I just realized I really enjoy writing fiction novels). But definitely do it in your free time and keep your job before you are certain you want to and can switch careers, as that takes time. and good luck.

@@pkp4761 Hi, for some unknown reasons my replies didn't show up, so I had to type them again. I have to admit, the only reason that I chose programming is because the marketing was good and so is the payment. Though IT is a big field, many subfield jobs do require some highly specialized skills. If you just do coding monkey work, you can be easily replaced, but if you spend many hours just sinking into a field you don't like, it will be miserable and you probably won't last anyway. I can only suggest that you try as many different things that you are interested in as possible. For example, pen testing, which you mentioned, AI technologies, etc. You can also try fields that are not related to CS (I actually found myself quite enjoying writing fiction novels). But before you find the things you love to do, definitely keep the job at hand; it takes time to switch careers. And good luck.

@@pkp4761 just go straight learning cloud, getting some cloud certification from AWS (or Azure depends on your area) and you'll be paid basically doing nothing other than configuring some configs and then you can focus doing fun challenging side projects/contribute to OSS

interesting insight

Most of his videos give me depression but I can't stop watching them.

so true

​@@wombozomboi seen few content creators that are depressed and into questioning the matrix we live in. FireShip and Daily Dose Of Internet.

same here bro 😔 fr fr

Broo me too I don't know why but just listening my gut

I paused the video and started googling.

Side note for anyone wondering, it’s Calcium that Calcifies your glands (even the Tstes over time) but Fluoride binds to the calcium. Which is why if your kid sneaks into the bathroom at night and eats all the toothpaste from the Costco multipack, the Doc’s recommendation is to give the now grounded child some milk.

They feed us poison so we buy their cure

@@CoClock That boy need some milk!

@@CoClock That hit a little too close to home. Speaking from experience?

Really? Are out there more crappy things than these: #) highly stressful deadlines, #) carrying your work at home(frequent overtimes), #) getting the middle finger frequently by a random IDE/library error whom the creator never fixed and you will spend countless hours on fixing it by yourself. #) arguing every day to explain to non technical manager clowns that this needs more than "10 minutes of work". #) babysitting juniors for many hours everyday cause they are too lazy to read code before asking for help (by the way this means your own tasks are getting delayed due to this). #) getting "backstabbed" in various ways from coworkers cause they are scared you may take their job sooner or later. This doesn't happen in most fields cause the salaries dont differ that much like they do in IT field. I have worked in retail too, it was paradise compared to the above.

​​@@John__K Law, business, entrepreneurship. All points except #3, though each have equivalents. I spent a whole of 5 seconds in thinking of these three, and 15 to double check with your list. Thinking a bit more, I just figured that the way to avoid all your points is a trade job or anything that doesn't involve that big city competition (or most things from college). Open a coffee shop in your town. Work retail. Have a workshop. Do manual labor (though not necessarily the intense/rough kind). Humble life, stress free, done by our ancestors, none of that brutal competition among colleagues. I see the appeal. It's that, or becoming a bourgeois elite through some huge success in some company you make. I don't judge if you seek the simple life. It is a good path for good men, tried and tested.

​@@John__KYou should really do a 10 minutes think about what other careers do, because is funny you think those "crappy things" are unique to programming jobs.

@@rbasket8 I didn't say all of them are unique, however the unique ones are much worse then the common ones with other fields. Like i said, i have also worked in retail and several big corporate companies.

99.7% of statistics are made up

Guess new comers have alot of chances than.

JUST before*

👏👏👏

I wish I had know this beforehand.

nothing gayer than a software manager

Theyre too dead to appreciate it

Lol. I sincerely doubt people will find useful, or ever even open, the millions of repositories of shitty code (that still exists), as opposed to mathematical theorems made by widely known scholars / scientists.

No surer way to make a mathematician cry than find a practical use for their work.

@rustix3 I like your comment. Money is real, but the concept of money isn't. Many real things are undetectable by the human eye. So, to me, programming feels real, too. Somewhat abstract, sure, but as real as anything else in life.

Hmm, that's theoretical mathematics. A bit different from spending three months making an Admin dashboard for a manager of a subdivision of a subdivision of an enterprise that will only be used three times before rotting away in some bitbucket repo... Perhaps theoretical computer science will have an impact down the line, but most of the code you and I write probably won't. Kinda sucks to write this all out now that I think about it.

If you cant see yoursef doing your job for much longer, then it's probably not the right job for you

same xD

mummified*

With how sea levels are rising, that's 💯 the more relevant and marketable skill.

@@GSBarlev fr, there are no underwater programmers, so when there is no more land and we all live under the sea, all your time spent programming will go to waste

Everything is so interesting that i can't just choose one thing i want to learn

As someone that did specialize, I can tell you the next regret you'd have is what you chose to specialize in.

​@@Basoosh Reminds me a lot of that famous quote from Kierkegaard: "Do something or do not do it. You will regret either choice."

This video might cheer you up kzfaq.info/get/bejne/lc-Yi5WWnsrSiYE.html , it's from the guy that made the OG Fallout game, and he laments the 'decline of generalists' in favour of everyone being specialists, which he acknowledges is useful and necessary, but there is a loss of interdisciplinary understanding which can slow down the whole project of teams... However, he is talking about generalists mostly regarding understanding of different fields, such as 3d modeling, animation, programming, networks, compiling, etc., not specifically 'generalist in programming languages'.

At least you might have the c++, html, rust, python, react, mongo,, sql, angular, schema and assembly language experiences everyone is looking for.

DEA, open up

why mate?

YOE?

@@Jack32421 Because my musician friends get laid more.

@@Jack32421 doomerism is funny

@@sussusamogus7981 why>

exactly!