Epoch 12V 460Ah (Affiliate link. Coupon code "Epoch10" gets 10% off! $200 savings): www.epochbatteries.com/products/12v-460ah-lifepo4-battery-ip67-heated-bluetooth-victron-comms?rfsn=7352625.50494d LiTime 12V 460Ah: www.litime.com/products/litime-12v-460ah-lifepo4-lithium-battery-250a-bms-5888wh-energy?ref=XBIA62RFcalHns Victron 12V Inverters: www.currentconnected.com/product-category/inv/12-volt-inverters/?ref=wp Victron Solar Charge Controllers: www.currentconnected.com/product-category/solar/charge-controllers/?ref=wp Mobile 48V System for Beginners: www.mobile-solarpower.com/mobile-48v-system.html *Does off-grid solar confuse you?* Check out my DIY friendly website for solar system packages and product recommendations, and so much more! www.mobile-solarpower.com *Join our DIY solar community!* #1 largest solar forum on the internet for beginners and professionals alike: www.diysolarforum.com Check out my best-selling, beginner-friendly 12V off-grid solar book (affiliate link): amzn.to/2Aj4dX4 0:00 Intro 0:44 Spec Sheet Comparison 1:50 Exterior Comparison 4:21 Teardown! 7:10 Conclusion *30% more and 25% cheaper. Oops *Does off-grid solar confuse you?* Check out my DIY friendly website for solar system packages and product recommendations, and so much more! www.mobile-solarpower.com *Join our DIY solar community* #1 largest solar forum on the internet for beginners and professionals alike: www.diysolarforum.com *Check out my Book* Best-selling and beginner-friendly guide to 12V off-grid solar! amzn.to/2Aj4dX4 If DIY is not for you, but you love solar and need an offgrid system, check out Tesla Energy! They will price out a system and get your house offgrid: ts.la/william57509 *My DIY Solar Equipment Recommendations (Constantly updated! Check here first):* 12V/48V Lithium Solar Batteries: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solar-batteries.html Complete Solar System Component Directory: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solarcomponents.html Complete 48V System Blueprint: www.mobile-solarpower.com/48v-complete-system-blueprint.html Plug-N-Play System Recommendations: www.mobile-solarpower.com/full-size-systems.html Complete "Add to Cart" 48V System Kits: www.mobile-solarpower.com/complete-48v-solar-kits.html DIY Friendly Air Conditioner/ Heat Pumps: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solar-friendly-air-conditioners.html *My Favorite Online Stores for DIY Solar Products:* *Signature Solar* Offgrid One-Stop-Shop. Best Value 48V LiFePO4, Victron and Offgrid Specific Heat Pumps: www.signaturesolar.com/?ref=h-cvbzfahsek *Current Connected* SOK, Victron, Mr.Cool Heatpumps and High Quality Components. Fantastic customer support: currentconnected.com/?ref=wp *Litime* My favorite 12V budget battery!: www.litime.com/?ref=XBIA62RFcalHns *Epoch Batteries* My favorite high-quality 12V battery: www.epochbatteries.com/products/12v-460ah-lifepo4-battery-ip67-heated-bluetooth-victron-comms?rfsn=7352625.50494d *Renogy* A classic 12V solar store that has been around for ages! DC to DC Chargers and more! renogy.sjv.io/n1VjXx *Rich Solar* Renogy's biggest competitor! Similar products, but at a better price: richsolar.com/?ref=h-cvbzfahsek *Battery Hookup* Cheap cell deals bit.ly/2mIxSqt 5% off code: diysolar *Contact Information:* I am NOT available for personal solar system consult! If you wish to contact me, this is my direct email: williamprowsediysolar@gmail.com Join the forum at diysolarforum.com/ if you wish to hang out with myself and others and talk about solar *FTC Disclosure Statement and Disclaimers:* Every video includes some form of paid promotion or sponsorship. Some links on this youtube channel may be affiliate links. We may get paid if you buy something or take an action after clicking one of these. My videos are for educational purposes only. Information is subject to change/update at any time. Electricity is DANGEROUS and can kill. Be smart and use common sense :) DIY Solar Power with Will Prowse is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, An affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com

"Quality will be remembered long after price is forgotten." .... Me.

The Epoch is actually 33% higher than the Li Time, 33% of $1500 is $500. Although the Li Time is 25% less than the Epoch. Definitely would buy Epoch.

I already got 2 of the Epoch units going in my boat with full victron system. I bench tested them with the Victron and they work great.

Brother, Thank you for another great teardown! While I love my 12v 230Ah LiTime in my camper, with low temp protect. IF I were buying a 400+Ah today, I'd definitely go with all the extra features of the Epoch in my RV! Cheers, Eric

This is solid content. No long intro. Just compact well scripted content

LiTime because it is built good enough for what application it will be likely used for and to save 25% is a big savings

When you reviewed the Li Time 100ah 12.8v ... you said, "It is a really good cheap battery, and it works." I bought 10 of them. Im off grid and use about 200 watts per hour 24 hours a day. 3000 watts of solar

LiTime excellent choice for stationery usage, Epich quality of construction is good for Overlanding usage👍

I will be starting a high end offgrid van build this year. As of right now, I will be going with the Epoch batteries. I appreciate all the information you provide. Take care fella.

I bought an Ampere Time 200Ah for an emergency backup home unit built on a hand truck using your guides. It has kept my refrigerator and other essentials running through multiple power outages over the last couple of years. For my purposes it has been the perfect solution and I don't require anything more. Thanks, Will!

7:21 The more simple, less change of something braking, nice al the communication futures but they can break.

For me, the choice would depend on the application. Harsh vs protected environment, stationary vs mobile, etc...

I love how Epoch integrates the BMS heatsink into the exposed emblem plate.

I don’t know enough to know what I need… I’m building out a cargo trailer. I need to be able to charge/run a couple of laptops, charge camera batteries and ideally run a small heater/AC when absolutely necessary. I need to be able to plug in and charge at campsites and at some point install some panels to power the system. Right now I live off a Jackery, generator, and my trucks alternator, and campsite power when I can get it. Thanks for being here Will! I hope to get it figured out this year. Saving for the system will likely take a year or more.

I am not sure I believe what the LiTime people are saying about cycle time to 80%. You can say whatever you want, who's going to know.

Smiling! Been researching these batteries to replace my old gel cell I use for back up for my Ham Radio. We do some emergency traffic net check ins to test our back up power, just in case the world goes crazier, and this kind of battery looks like it would do the trick. We also have a couple of 2-meter band repeaters that could use them on the solar system, their batteries are getting weak. Great info and I like the way you rip them apart to see the sloppy or good craftmanship. K5EDD 50 years of ham radio.

I bought the Epoch for my trailer. The price (Holiday sale was an additional 15% off) made it the lightest and lowest cost per amp hr compared to anything else. Especially when factoring in all the features.

I love 12v systems, when I get my shed I will try and set up a small solar set up to power lights and possibly kettle 👍🏻

My 2 Ampertime 400ah batteries fit in my stock battery box and small compartment with heaters on my class c motorhome. Had them for years with no issues. 👍🏻

The Epoch , i have already bought one and installed it . This was ordered the time you did the first review .

I'd also go with the Epoch. Thanks, Will, for another great video.

LOVE watching your content. Alas im in the 4x4 12v community. Im main concern is road corrugations, it is the most brutal stress test we have on africa expeditious. Could you please test the corrugation / vibration effect?

You handled the contents of this video very well. It was clear and concise. I bought the Litime 12.8V 100Ah Max Lithium Battery LiFePO4 Deep Cycle Battery, Built-in 150A BMS, 1280Wh Energy, 4000+ Cycles, 1920W Load Power.

Love our Epoch 460Ah battery in our RV.

I bought 4 x 230Ah Li Time (with low temp cut off) based on your recommendation and videos. Unfortunately, 2 of the batteries showed up with only 3.2v, and after trouble shooting with customer service (which took some time since they are only in China), I had to send them back. They quickly replaced the two faulty batteries, but 50% failure is unacceptable. In any event, I own these 4 batteries and they are doing very well in my RV. They are charged easily by the existing MS2812 inverter charger whether connected to shore power or by 10Kw generator. I do not have solar and don't plan on installing since I already have the genset which works during times of rain, cloudy days, night, and so on. Additionally, I installed a Victron shunt to monitor SOC. I was able to buy each battery for $618 delivered, using discount codes provided in their emails. Thanks for your videos and help on these projects.

Thank you for everything Will! Tough call. Just depends on your budget. One thing I take into account is a least going 24v or 48v if you have enough solar voltage. My small solar project doesn't justify two of these so I do 4 -100 Amp 12v (cheap $260 at the time) in series - parralel to get to 24v. I think theres merit to going 24/48 even on an RV. I found out it's really a balancing act. Too many panels not enough battery no good. Too much battery not enough panels no good. 2 or 4 of these bad boys would be awesome if you have enough panels. I guess I would go LiTime, because I'm always thinking of ROI. That build and fuse on the Epoch really is nice tho.

Built my first off grid style backup generator, with manual transfer switch about 12 months back..Powerqueen parellel 100ah x 4 VICTRON Blue 150/70 charge controller with dongle, blue tooth monitor, 3000 watt Renergy, inverter and 1 kw Thunderbolt monocrystaline panles in Series with upgrade MC4 connectors, awesome little system for emergency Backup and can handle a couple small window ac units all day with full sun.

Thankyou for the comparison video. My use case is for a motorhome, however the cost difference is an issue for me as I am buying more of the Litime batteries I installed the LiTime 8 months ago and it's worked amazing. Life changing actually. I diy'ed a low temp compartment heater using a ws1209 temp sensor and 3 1157 light bulbs (75w) that keeps the compartment warm on cold desert nights. I use a BT thermometer to monitor compartment temps Have a Renogy Soc meter that is honestly the worst part of my setup. Thanks.

I did buy the 230 Plus w/low temp... dropped it on the tongue of my travel trailer. Works like a champ (San Diego). Do have the Victron Bluetooth BMS. Rennogy 60A charge controller. It all just works.

I have one of Epoch's 12v 100AH units and I've installed a 51.2v60ah kit on a golf cart. I was really surprised on the quality of the components of the golf cart kit, and how well everything integrated. On top of that, I did have a small self caused technical issue. Made a phone call, spoke to a person immediately, and my issue was resolved by a tech in less than 5 minutes. I wouldn't hesitate to go Epoch again.

I just received my 300 Ah Epoch battery and it's impressive. During my decision phase I watched you and other reviewers discussing the battery that I ordered in December and just received. And because I am doing a major upgrade to my motorcoach it still we be a month or so till I place it in service, but currently have it attached to my Victron Solar Control to top it off. But I'm convinced that this is the battery of choice and definitely beats LiTime on the low end of price and the Battleborn battery on the upper price range. I will be ordering a second battery in the near future to make my system a two battery system, and the only fault I see at the moment is the delay waiting for a purchased battery to be delivered.

Needed a small self heated 12v lithium battery. Got an epoch B grade 50ah self heated on sale. Got a small tote, insulated it and wha la. Works great in my hunting blind. 10 amp mppt with 400 watts of solar panels. Only 1 problem when I got it, wouldn't turn on. BMS battery lead wasn't plugged in. Great customer service at Epoch. IMO

I use 24v so its been LiTime for me. so far so good

I use a renogy deep cycle 12v 300ah with heater and low temp protection for $1280 CAD. Been happy with it and it still runs in cabin at -45c with a r5 box

Thanks for a great video which was extremely helpful for me since I am looking at these very two batteries to replace four AGM batteries in my RV. I'm very likely to go with the Epoch if I can find a way to make the conversion without frying my alternator while still still retaining the ability to charge with the alternator, shore power, and the onboard generator (plus solar down the road.

We have been using the LiTime for a couple of years now and love them. They work for what we use them for and have a reasonable price for what you get

There's a new Epoch 460 sitting in my garage for the van. The remote power switch is really nice. One touch, no more shutting down the inverter and fuse panels when not in use. Yes, I'm lazy, lol

Good to see you coming back to life! I like the Li Time

Choice would depend on application. For me, using it on a sailboat as an off-grid system, I would go with the LiTime. Bang for buck it would provide what is needed for a long time!

Low temp charger protection I think would be a must have feature. Built in T fuse, included shunt, and self-heating are all big pluses.

These are 12v so likely intended for an rv. Would love to have the epoch, but it’s too tall for the battery compartment in ours. Skinnier and higher is not necessarily a good thing, footprint operates in 3 dimensions, not just on the floor.

Bought 4 200 amp hr last year for the catamaran. Still work well , no problems. If you are in a warm climate and dont need to charge in the cold, they are perfect. And cheap. $$.

Thanks Will ! TAKE CARE..

These batteries are SO nice. Was just doing 18650 banks not long ago.

During the Black Friday season I purchased three 12v 100ah LiTime batteries to make a portable battery-inverter system for about half the price of what you could buy the ready made units. I was able to get the 300ah of batteries for $825, and bought a large Pelican case to house everything. I wanted a battery-inverter set-up that was larger than what is available, and I ended up paying the same ~$2k in the end. I didn't need the features that the Epoch offers.

I would definitely buy the EPOCH Battery, having the extra features and being able to communicate with the Victron Inverter is great. My battery compartment is in the middle of my coach behind a panel in the basement.

Sold on li time! I'm a big fan of simple, same with chargers and battery monitoring. No Bluetooth, all onboard displays, less dependent on always having my phone

I chose the middle ground and went with three 230 amp hour La time batteries with low temperature cut off. The Epic battery is an amazing piece

I got the 24v Ampere Time / li time, from a few years ago. I got them off amazon with gift cards I collected. Would of liked to get server racked brands but getting the cash to them was the problem, and paying the full amount all in one go.

When ever I can afford one is what I will get but I thank you for the information six stars

I'd go for the LiTimes...That said, I already own several of the Victron ecosystem components on different battery banks. I own some LiTime batts and they don't disappoint. Also, a few years ago (on your advice) I purchased several SOK 206AH batteries. I use those with Victron setups and they perform flawlessly. All 12V batts, but my SOKs are configured into 24V a system.

I already have 4 of the 12v 200ah litime batteries in series. I have had them a year and a half and so far so good.

Would love to see you utilize micro inverters in a design. While there may be some drawbacks, it seems like the design is straightforward, though I need a better understanding that your experience can provide. Thank you!

It would be great to see a build with the internal fuse used and communication with the Victron system.

Been happy with EPOCH golf cart and marine 12v batteries, will continue to do business.

I have trouble fitting two Epochs into my Ford Transit. I'm able to stack two Li Times vertically with an 8020 rack while keeping the bed above them at 22 inches.. I don't have the room to stack the Epochs vertically, I'd hve to raise the bed 4 inches higher. The only way I could use the Epochs is if I mounted them sideways, which would surely confuse the temp sensors & heaters. Also, Epoch has been out-of-stock for a month now.

Great comparison! For a higher end system like you said in your previous video, the Epoch is the way to go. With everything being so expensive these days that Li Time is looking better and better lol

Looks to me like you would want the LiTime for a static setup that was indoors and well insulated and you needed like three or four of them. The Epoch is more for a plug-n-play adventure setup like your 20 foot jon boat or your backwoods hunting/fishing camper you tow behind a 4x4. Something temporary that has to go with you when you leave. For my purposes, the Epoch appears to be the best deal. But you just said 12 volt is insane. Should I buy four of these things?

Simple is always better, too much tech always gets complicated with time. I am from Uganda and I only need high temperature disconnect because we have never reached 17 degrees C. LiTime is my choice for simplicity. Appreciate your work Sir

I'd have to go with the LiTime mostly because I don't have the budget for Epoch

Well, I think it depends on usage. If i was getting 1 or 2 for a mobile application, (say my boat) I would go with the Epoch. On the other hand if I was getting 4 or more for a stationary situation i would probability go with the Li Time.

I have a lot of the Ampere Time/LiTime LiFePO’s. They do the job. If you have an oopsie and drain one dry, then sometimes the BMS requires a seance to be brought back to life. I do prefer pairing them with Victron gear to bridge some of the functionality the OEM batteries lack and to keep that functionality uncoupled. I believe these batteries will follow a Moore’s law trajectory and I can just keep pairing the Victron gear with larger capacity batteries and save a little along the way.

Thanks Will for the video, I bought zooms battery 3 years ago and now I think it’s redodo and looks exactly the same as LiTime and same capacity and size Bms etc. I had to buy second battery so I decided to go with redodo although LiTime was tempting after your video but I wanted to best matching to Zooms and it just came in and size a lot smaller in width than a Zooms battery but exact same height and length. For 12V system like you said simple like mine with victron shunt and Cerbo gx I would go chipset way for battery as victory does the rest for my color mining off grid system.

Something to be said for simplicity. If it was me it would be the LiTime, but I do have others running perfectly! Great vid as always!

LiTime and similar quality. Though i am 24 v as i started the investment before 48 was as popular. Ibwould go 48 now, but i use my own t class on the 24 v and my own heating/shutoff. I am in alaska. I also have a secondary LTO system if i have to leave in an emergency and i need power daster as the cabin heats up.

Well I would go with the LiTime because I took your word and bought 16 of them. LoL. I'm still happy with mine. If I was going to buy only one or two, I would do the Epoch.

Personally I would buy the Epoch. Just better quality built and has more to offer. It never really is just black and white. Like my Honda 2200 generator. One can buy two generators for the same size out put but what many do not realize is the Honda has a larger motor there buy having less voltage drop. When you buy quality it comes at a cost. I'm a firm believer of buy once cry once. Buying cheaper normally turns out more expensive in the long run. Never new about Epoch batteries until you showed it too me, Thanks .

I've had two LiTime batteries so far (200 Ah and 100 Ah). I didn't need any monitoring, because I did it with various attachments that I used with the battery. The only thing I wished it had was low temp protection. It never was an issue for me because I had my fifth wheel trailer and solar panels covered during the cold winter months up north, but I can see how you would want it in case you get a cold streak when traveling in the South. $400 bucks is $400 bucks, though. I'd go with a good quality, cheaper build every time.

I would use the third option Signature Solar EG4 LL in 12 Volt and 400 amps. The cost is $1495 with free shipping until Feb 28, 2024. This model has the LCD display which shows Voltage current and state of charge. Failing that I would go for the Epoch for the ability to monitor the state of charge and the low temp protection and the better build quality.

The EG4 12/400 is on sale for 999$ thst seems to be the best deal at the moment over all, however both the litime and epoch look like great options depending on your own dimensional requirements or limitations and your feature preferences.

I am 69 years old will be looking for a battery that I can travel and maintain my fridge while on the road. Will not be doing extensive boon docking and either option would out live me. LiTime works in my case. Great review Wil

I would pay more for the safety features and the built-in shunt. Epoch hands down!

I think it depends upon your application. You don't need a fancy case with waterproof connectors indoors. The shunt, Bluetooth, etc can be external to the battery itself. I think you have plenty of videos showing how it's done. For me, the bells and whistles aren't worth the extra expense.

Good comparison Will. I'm expecting you to come up with the perfect portable system (gadget) that Will change our world. Keep it up.

The question for me is whether the additional features are necessary, and if so, worth $500 for just one battery. For someone using it as the sole battery mounted 24/7 in an RV, it may be worth it. I’m an amateur (ham) radio operator. So, I have no use for an energy-depleting inverter. Everything running on the battery is DC. I also don’t connect high-current or inductive loads to my LiFePO4 battery. The most I’ll draw in total is less than 25A for short durations when transmitting a 100W signal. Furthermore, I don’t leave my battery unattended in the cold. If it is outdoors, so am I, right beside it. When I use a portable solar panel to charge my battery, if it’s too cold to charge it, it’s too cold for me too. So, I’m not concerned about low-temperature charging. If I must charge it in freezing temperatures, it’s going to be snuggled in a warm tent or vehicle, just as I am. The only add-on I would use with the battery would be a shunt-based capacity meter. I would rather have it be external to the battery so I can transfer it to whatever battery I’m using at the time. Generally speaking, a very effective means to extend the capacity of a battery is to avoid converting to AC or to different voltages. Install only DC equipment in an RV. Instead of plugging wall warts into an inverter, run DC-powered items, like laptops, WiFi routers, LED lights, and phone chargers by way of buck and boost converters instead.

Another great video, short and complete! One detail, though -- $2,000 is 33 pct more than 1500 (500/1500}, not 25 pct more. But the Litiime IS 25 pct cheaper -- (500/1,999}.

I'm converting my small system on a 5th wheel to lithium and a larger inverter. Since I'm going all Victron, the Epoch is a no brainer. And I do camp when it's cold so I need the self heating function.

The markers on the bolts usually identify they have been Torque checked in normal industry.

IDK, from what you've presented, both seem like they could be a good choice, depending on the details of a particular system (like for example, would you ever really need to worry about cold temps there in Vegas, esp if they were inside a garage / building). If you can afford the extra $500 / battery, clearly the Epoch is a battery with superior features. LiTime seems like a lot of bang for the entry level buck. Call it the stripped down base model car vs the one from the factory with all the bells and whistles. If you need "basic" capability at absolute minimum cost, seems like the Li might be the choice. If you have a bit of room in the budget, or simply need the features, Epoch is worth the extra cost.

I would go with the Epoch for the features . Would be cool to see a video on what the parts already on the Epoch would cost individually , that the LiTime doesn't have . And , as you mentioned . What is up with the huge difference in life expectancy !?

Depends on the use case. If it is a system that I set up once and then it will sit in a room/garage that is temperature controlled for the next 5 years, I don't need the extra features and higher quality connectors. If I put them in a golf cart or a boat or RV, I'd go with the better quality.

I purchased four Li Time 230 aH batteries in November '23. They are working well in my new fifth wheel. I was able to get a black Friday sale price AND they gave me an 8% military discount! I already have a Victron Shunt and temp control through my Cerbo, so I don't need the added features of the Epoch.

2:30 "bolting them together" isn't a problem Simply build a mounting rack out of metal channel (known in the UK as unistrut ). It comes in sizes 40 × 25 shallow × 40 deep × 80 double. Simply bolt the batteries onto the channel using L brackets, channel fittings come in M6/8/10/12 . The channel itself can be Used build the server racks much cheaper and far stronger than anything you are likely to be able to purchase of the shelf I used to build and work on offshore unmanned gas platforms the battery backup systems were constructed like this the cells were about ×4 the size of those featured and overall each battery bank measured around 4×4×6 (ft)

I like it when Will says 'buttons' without the letter T.

Being a retired 78 year old with limited structured income, I welcome projects like this as it is a do-able one for me. I'd be installing this project in my 40' diesel motorhome taking advantage of the budget option you have mentioned. And , like all of my projects, I have the wife to convince... Wish me luck!

Got 2 of the 460 ah Epoch as soon as they came out

4 years ago I bought 2 battleborn batteries for 2000 dollars. Now I can get twice the battery for the same money. I live in Minnesota in the batteries live in my van. So i definitely want the heater. Doing it now I might step up to 48v... Things are changing your yearly so who knows....

I have the skinny 200 amp hour, Lossigy batteries, four of them. They have worked great for the past two years. I live full-time in my motorhome and 99% of the time they are charged with solar.

My only problem with the epoch batteries is the discharge cutoff temp they set them too. We regularly see temps below that threshold, for that reason alone I will buy the cheap one and add the features I need. Also the heaters in them only turn on when you are trying to charge the battery.

Love these battery teardowns. Please do more, especially of the worst / cheapest batteries, it makes for great entertainment IMHO :)

On the cycle life comparison, I couldn't find anywhere that the Epoch battery stated the DOD for the 3500 cycle life. When I started working with LiFePO4 batteries in the early 2000s, the cycle life was stated as 100%DOD until the battery had either 80% or 70% of rated capacity. Typically, the quality cells were rated to 80% and the cheaper ones to 70%. Given that the LiTime battery lists 4000 cycles at 100%DOD, I suspect that the cells in the LiTime battery are not necessarily better than in the Epoch battery. Since neither one lists the rated capacity degradation, not much comparison can be made other than the longer warranty of the Epoch battery. For me, I would go with the Epoch battery because of the extra features built in.

I do warm climate camping. Li Time has been around long enough to trust them if used properly. That's my vote.

Epoch.. The T class fuse, low temp charging protection and shunt are worth the added cost, and that's 2 things you'll typically need in a system anyways. The better case and build quality are just bonuses at that point.

Thumbs UP! Get the server rack battery in 24 or 48 volt - done!

It depends on the build. For a cheap battery backup with a simple 3000 watt inverter that you use once or twice per year when the power goes out the LiTime would be fine. If I was putting this in an RV then the Epoch would be the way to go. For home backup I think 48V is the way to go.

The answer really depends on the application, for a typical RV installation I would be fine with the LiTime if it had low temperature charging protection.

To me, Scottie said it best, “The more complicated the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the drain”. I’m happy with my Eco-Worthy that look exactly the same as the Li time. Of course, my opinion. JimO

I'd personally prefer the Epoch battery. Fun fact: about 3 years ago, I built a 400AH battery inspired by you Will. The total cost (then) was just over $1500. How times have changed.

Well as I will have to get everything, batteries, shunt, vivtron inv/charger, monitor etc. probably the Epoch.