"You're welcome to apply to our junior positions" lmao

btw you actually have 10 years of experience in The Exact Same Joke

Haha 😂 exactly. Just like react is 9 years old and companies are looking for react developers with 10 years of experience.

😂😂

That's the reality of HR department.

Sale 20% OFF new brush tutorial (Beginners Lv)

in fact if there is a new javascript framework everyday that means there are new monalisas being made every day. Because those javascript frameworks are built with Javascript by frontend devs. If you're switching the entire architecture before evening shipping your product, it's your problem, other devs are shipping their products, each one of those frameworks is a product on their own.

🤫

Brilliant.

just because someone makes a new framework every day doesn't mean you need to use them. Just stick with one and make some cool shit

All in the name of backwards compatibility.

Webassembly is a good step

@@sycration WEBSSEMBLY IS THE FUTURE. MAKE IT HAPPEN RIGHT NOW. FUCK THIS HTML CSS JS buLLSHIT I WANNA CODE IN C++

@Civic you seem irate. I think you need a new JS framework

@@zekicaneksi you are absolutely correct, this shit daunts me that is I left js for now

Yes please

Please Fireship 🙏

@@WhyDoesYTUseHandlesNow There's a couple of CDNs like skypack that will serve the contents of npm packages with transformations applied to run on deno; it works well for most simple packages, but ultimately you will still run into interop issues with some packages that do funky things with CJS exports.

Deno doesn't even type-check. What's the point of using TypeScript without type-checking?

@@uziboozy4540 for real???

Fuck Node.

it was built by a deno core contributor, luca casonato

It won't happen probably. Node has already taken his piece of cake and replacing ruby, php at the moment. There is no need in deno at all. It's the same as with this new framework. Angular and React won't give front end to something like this for sure.

@@likle7163 this is a poor comment. ryan is trying to fix the mistakes he made in node with deno. as a developer who's seen many different types of "web" tech stroll on through, deno has been the most successful and promising project since react. also this framework, as mentioned in the video, is based off of preact... so, it's not really trying to replace it, it's just taking a bunch of good things (react and deno, specifically deno deploy) and putting them together. deno is a great project and should be seen as such.

Yeah, using node as a server is just terrible

Nonsense. This concept of serving JS only when you need it is TOTALLY BRAND NEW. Didn't you watch the video? ISLANDS!!

@@hadesflames Also, HTML + back end code in one file? So new man, it's not like I did the same thing in ASP in 2003.

PHP

Im learning to master laravel and this concept is oddly similar to Laravel Inertia...

Now, time to run even more laps around the circle.

My thoughts exactly. I'm sure this will be less clumsy than php and easier to use than JSP but I truly thought we were over that hill already.

As a PHP developer for the last decade it’s been pretty fun watching the JavaScript community go full circle from huge monolithic SPAs back to server-side rendering. Meanwhile we’ve been building high performance server-side apps that just deliver static HTML and minimal JavaScript this entire time 😆

@@christopherwhite6173 you can't compare template engines to SSR SPA apps 🤣

@@christopherwhite6173 yeah but you had to do it in PHP, so we still win.

this joke is overused really, real company who will pay you accordingly won't do this kind of stupid mistake

not untrue

nah, probably 5yr

@@busetgadapet exactly, 10 years min

​@@busetgadapet employers: are you sure about that.

There have always been layers of abstraction with web development. If you understand JavaScript do you understand the underlying technologies? Not at all. And ALL experienced web devs today understand JS/CSS/HTML, so is it any different?

@@skylarkesselring6075 agreed

It's not that hard to keep up with and try one of them when you do a quick side project. Most are fundamentally the same: split up your app into reusable components instead of manipulating the DOM directly like a caveman. The specific ways in which these components are written may differ (JSX for (p)react/solid/vue, templating for svelte/vue) and these "languages" have a lot of specific quirks, but the larger features of the frameworks you use to create the app (Next, Nuxt, Sveltekit, Fresh) have a lot more similarities in the way things are structured and what they're capable of. There's only so many ways to do routing, server/static/client rendering, where to serve it etc that once you're familiar with the possibilities of one it's pretty easy to look at a new framework and just look at how it does things differently. Of course there's a ton of tiny little differences in how you can do things between everything, but broad strokes everything's pretty similar. Angular is probably the most different from all the others, and "plain JS"/your own shitty framework will probably be wayyy different (worse) from everything else.

Lol these new stacks will die just like all the others that came out last year and the year before it

Year? I think you meant week 🙂

u mean every week? 🙂

but you dont

My favourite part about Deno is the almost instant typescript compilation.... wow.

Php does the same things since 1995

@@snowflaxxx yes, but I wouldn't choose php over a js framework. the pros of php can very easy turn into its cons

@@mattmurphy7030 🤣

you do not use this word. blazingly fast. that word only reserve for theprimeagen

Deno for the win!

You can do top level await in node...

now introducing "stable" only gets updated every other year!

wait I know this.. that's what we're doing at work.

I think that's what they actually do.

Angular.

i mean, that's exactly how new frameworks appear in the first place "this is too much for me, I'm gonna make my own framework instead"

Hahahaha, loved it.

Great comment

+1 xDD

Lol, atheists won't get this

2 folders deep is considered deeply nested?

Since it just mimics REST, I don't see how it would become so nested.

@@mattmurphy7030 we have to go leaner. if you have 2 nested folders, why aren't you breaking it up into 2 projects already? SMH.

There Is no need to learn everything new. If your company doesn’t use It and you are not planning to make a project with It, then there Is no need to learn a new technology. There Is nothing new In the tech world really, just a constant reinvention of the wheel. For frontend I use react at work with nextjs but also learned svelte because I love how simple It Is and use It on my side projects and don’t really see the need of learning anything else because there Is nothing I can’t do with react or nothing I can’t do a lot easier than with svelte. Some people say things like “You gotta learn everything to stay afloat” which Is In my experience Is complete BS. It’s like chopping a tree but you still didn’t chop the tree because instead of chopping and improving your technique, you were stuck around constantly changing axes and getting used to them.

Try Elm.

This is not just a new framework, it is on a newish runtime (Deno). Deno (now with Fresh) lets you focus on the art of programming, minimising the pain of Javascript programming/web development/web configuration. So I would recommend you give this a look (You'll likely still hit problems along the way, but hopefully less of them).

Im starting in this industry right now and honestly, the fact that there is literally thousand of frameworks, tools, etc...its shocking af mostly cuz i dont understand most of the things right now xd

​@@wiredelectrosphere "There Is nothing new In the tech world really, just a constant reinvention of the wheel." I wouldn't say tech world, this is mostly an issue within webdev which is small part of the tech world. But just considering webdev i fully agree with that statement.

@@hwfq34fajw9foiffawdiufhuaiwfhw and 99% of that time was trying to get `twind` intellisense to work in vscode

was something wrong with nextjs or were you just bored

@@joepetrillo6185 curiosity. I always try something new. My news aggregator told me about a new calendar app developed by the deno team (I thought it was odd they would make an app like this). Then I saw the most recently updated repo was a web framework and it was all over

@@brennenherbruck8740 i like to think it as it's like playing a new character (s) in a MOBA game, trying to see how good thay are lol

Right "Islands" just shows a problem in soft dev of giving things new labels that aren't even that good at describing the issue without a visual aid or several paragraphs for the uninitiated. Islands == sections == divs == modular == components == separation of concerns, etc etc matron fowler probably has a ton more listed. And it's just a plain bad physical metaphor used with digital FED.

@@TheNewton I don't think Fresh aligns much with Martin Fowler's way of doing things. Fowler is heavily focused in enterprise apps and OOP.

A lot has to do with the fact that the browser wars caused a lot of fragmentation and frameworks and polyfills helped paper over that hellscape. Now that browsers mostly cooperate on standards, javascript modernized over the last decade (and chromium is swallowing up everything for better or worse) frameworks and build steps are becoming less useful and the original way of web dev is beginning to return because that's all that's needed. That's my thinking anyway.

Stick to your usual guns, re-evaluate your stack every few years but stay in touch with new developments. You really don't need to jump on the newest thing when it launches. Take a seat in the back and watch how it plays out first. Even if a new framework emerges and becomes more popular than React or Vue, you have plenty of time to learn it because React and Vue jobs aren't going to disappear just like that.

@@V3LOXy Exactly what I will settle with now, indeed!

@water no pun intended but do you think its worth it studying PHP because in my location PHP is still prominent

@@ikkenzo3948 Yes, PHP is definitely worth studying. Never listen to a frontend user, they don't know what reliability means. PHP is a reliable language with ugly syntax, but _it works amazing_. PHP is prominent everywhere and it's not going to stop, it's not like JavaScript is a "better language", it's completely fragmented and disorganized, which is the complete opposite of what's needed to make something that actually works.

@@NoorquackerInd if your Javascript disorganized, it doesn't mean that Javascript in general disorganized.

No it isn't

@drag (Avdan OS Developer) Or, or.... hear me out. We program in vanilla JS and just teach developers how to build PubSubs.

@@Justin73791 You sir are a sensible man

@drag (Avdan OS Developer) It's great until you need a team of professionals to work together and write consistent readable code

I disagree. Translating from one to another isn't very difficult at all.

@@Justin73791 Yeah, and eventually every developer will develop his own little crappy framework and we end up worse than we started.

I've been in this game for 25 years. Everything old is new again.

Boomers were smarter than us after all.

Also, remember when all new languages wanted to get away from OOP. Now those languages are trying hard to go back to it.

e.g. I see SolidJs as a very bold contender for frontend web dev but I don't think it will compete anytime soon for real market share with React, etc.

No, they all die after 6 months anyways

Nope; they're not really supposed to, either, in my eyes (depending on the specifics). The teams making these frameworks are trying to introduce new paradigms and gauge their viability to see if they would be beneficial to the larger ecosystem. Then the hope is that either a) the big frameworks will adopt those features or b) the features will be so good that a new framework will become big

@@gusslx SolidJS is super solid and its not gonna die anytime soon. One time rendering is super OP, and REACT is missing that feature from the structure. Hope REACT will implement the same logic in the future ...

Yeah there are a number of solid mature frameworks out these days for important work and a bunch of new experimental ones that might become tomorrow's, just commit to something and don't chase trends

I completely agree with you. Also what often happens is that existing frameworks borrow the ideas from a newer one.

I hate this industry

@@AndyPotts0 😕

There are no inovations tho. Just reheated old ideas.

Which is sad..

Flutter says hello

@@tiagosantos680 but flutter is slow on the web

@@creativeminds5222 also sucks at accessiblity

That doesn't actually sound like a very good idea; layout and styling each deserve their own DSL.

Rust stands head and shoulders above anything else.

Server-side rendering can speed up page load times, which not only improves the performance but also the user experience.

@@Lucas-hh4oh my question was concerning, by how much does it improve the performance. Like JSP was also server side rendering right?

99.99% of users don't give a rat's ass about it. we only pick and chose to show off to other devs (or piss them off, depending on who you are talking about)

@@Felipera_ exactly as a user i don't care if my website takes 1 second longer to load or if there is no reloading when clicking some links (routing) As long as it dosent look like a scam website and serves it's purpose i am happy But tech companies these days want to implement simplest of websites in angular, react and what not

@@Felipera_don’t be stupid if you have a shopping app and you didn’t cache your images in a server your first load time would be 5 seconds with ssr it can be instant

My favourite part of using a LAMP stack: It enlightens your experience (HA, am so funny)

Amen to that, it works and its fast. Sluggish js frameworks to hell.

Yeah but then you miss out on the experience of never being at good at any tech stack because all your time is wasted on learning the latest (often poorly-thought out) fad. All kidding aside, I'm happy in the DevOps space, where I also don't need to learn a framework every month. Linux and Jenkins aren't going anywhere

And then having to use 30 lines of code which I can do in 5 lines. Yeah, LAMP is so "cool" 🤣

@@manmanmanichfindekeinennam7613 what, you have frameworks for PHP/python/perl too

Not sure why this stupid attitude has become so popular over the past couple of years. Nobody is forcing you to use any of the newer frameworks. In production React is the unofficial standard, so it's not like the landscape has become crazy with new frameworks or anything. All it really does it is highlight how thriving the Javascript eco system is, such that extremely well written frameworks just keep cropping up. All of the newer frameworks that gain attention also influence some of the decisions the bigger, more widely used frameworks make - which makes all of our lives better. You really aren't cool for just repeating that shit without a second thought.

lol if you don't want another javascript framework just don't code.

@@kb_dev man layed out a whole paragraph 💀 does this look like microsoft word?

@@MrDgf97 what?

@@MrDgf97 lmao

What if it doesn’t? ( not that that is probable )

@@mattmurphy7030 don't spit completely unrelated phrases when you find yourself unable to add anything to a discussion, - or, in other words, go touch some grass, u jrkey

"I love X, I just wish it had feature Y from frameworkd Z" and it's all downhill from there. I feel like we are always either on "it's too barebones for a real project" vs "it's too bloated" and striking a balance is actually impossible.

deno runs ts code

@@trickeddev ya but the build step runs implicitly anyway right?

you could check out this kzfaq.info/get/bejne/pqiTea2etpy5hoE.html video where Ryan Dahl explains about Fresh and Deno. I didnt understand it fully but it has to do something with Deno using JIT instead of Ahead Of Time compilation

the idea of "framework" is only helpful if you're developing for a large enterprise with like 100,000 users. vanila JS works like a charm for 90% of businesses.

honestly I can see this happening, even if you were half joking. it might be the only way to cope with this madness is to create your own then there will be the issue of working in teams because we all have our own unique framework. but that's not problem, we will just over-engineer a new solution, cross framework compatibility stack merge

@@bribes_for_nounsabsolutely, you said right about the over-engineer part. In short JavaScript gonna stay even after the world ends..

Caramba! Você por aqui? kkkk

Why? So you waste your time doing something in a technology most likely will never go mainstream?

@@Titere05 "why would you waste your energy and time to make those stupid wheels, when you can walk?"

justify*

angry man screams at cloud

But I need new frameworks to justify why my old frontend sucks to my stakeholders man

It's not at all complicating things for the sake of complicating, less JS = faster app as you can cache all the generated stuff and deploy it closer to the user through a cdn. Granted, people seem to be trying to also move the rendering to the edge, but that's still pretty new. Similarly the move to server mostly happened because these better ways of creating web apps (react etc) now have frameworks which make doing so easier, making the separation between backend and frontend much smaller, meaning you don't have to fuck around in php anymore. The other main reasons are that it has also become clear that search engines just aren't as good at indexing client rendered pages as they said they are, so having all the pages fully rendered already really helps with SEO. I know it seems like "going back", but it's more "we had a better way making apps but but it was only client side but now we can easily do this server side + Google is a liar"

@@tefkah These are all fair points and I do agree with them. My main point for the cynical post was that in my long development career I have seen a lot of going around in circles and mostly not for the best. While web is always evolving and many good improvements came out, not everything is justified. But again you have some very good points there.

10 what? There's like a 100 frameworks.

@@johnnyapplesmith More like 1000

And yet everybody ends up using React, Angular or Vue or their SSR counterparts

Nextjs for me, thanks, hehe.

At this point a new framework is like a new altcoin, everyone says it's going to be great, ends up in oblivion