It was lucky to gave survived that long. This line made no more for the original builders who sold the line to the NER for half of what it cost to build. It was the only line I know of that could be closed by a little sea mist.

@@neiloflongbeck5705I think the point being made was of it’s value as a heritage line ,similar to the north York moors line ..I can imagine people paying to travel on it .. of course in the mid 60s this was probably harder to visualise.

@@davidcousins3508 in the 1930s the LNER looked at these lines as during the summer they lived up to the Late and Never Early Railway nickname with trains needing to call twice at each station. They worked out what would need to be done and found that the costs outweighed the benefits, especially as a report on the lines around Whitby commissioned by the LNER and compiled by Leeds University found these lines to have little commercial viability. The line from Loftus to Whitby with equally scenic views of the North Sea ever even made it to the Beeching era. By 1964 the value of such lines was appreciated for tourist lines, but only if they could find a buyer. The bad news was that the northern terminus for this line as a tourist line would not be Whitby but Robin Hood's Bay as the line to Hawsker was to be retained by BR for the planned potash mine close to Hawsker (close to where they are currently digging for potash/polyhydrite) reducing it's attractiveness. And at the southern end the line would go no further than just north of Gallow's Close carriage sidings as BR retained them until the 1980s further reducing the attractiveness of the line. Contrasting this with what became the NYMR with 2 stations at the terminii of the line, one connected to the last remaining line into Whitby and which had people wanting to buy the line including a single track through out the line from shortly after its closure to freight traffic in 1966 (negotiations starting in 1967). They could have chosen the old Scarborough and Whitby Railway's line which closed around the same time, but with the provisos detailed above they didn't.

​@@davidcousins3508 Well said 👍

YOU sound as though you are on the SAME °°WAVELENGTH as ME !

or a "Tesco's Supermarket">

I could say the same for the Somerset and Dorset Railway or the Matlock to Buxton line.

MORE'S the PITY. If IT could be made OPERATIONAL AGAIN ▪︎▪︎▪︎ IT would certainly REDUCE ● GRIDLOCK ● & PROVIDE an ESSENTIAL lifeline Between ALL OUTLYING VILLAGES Etc & COASTAL AREAS , ( ESPECIALLY in ADVERSE WEATHER CONDITIONS. ) But THAT'S far TOO •▪︎• SIMPLE •▪︎•FOR POLITICIANS !!

I wonder if that was Mr. John Edser, who appeared on television quite a lot around the 50th anniversary of the publication of the first Beeching Report in March, 1963? In a way, Whitby was lucky to be left with any rail links whatsoever, given the amount of taxpayers' money that British Railways was losing in the mid-1960's. I believe that the Transport Users' Consultative Committee reported that closure of the Scarborough to Whitby Railway would cause "severe hardship" to the inhabitants of Ravenscar and Robin Hood's Bay, but even that plea failed to keep the line open.

Jenny Hann twaddle, pure twaddle. Even the LNER knew that none of the lines going to Whitby were viable, financially. It was only the need to move school children that kept Whitby on the national network in an era when winters were routinely harsher than today. Services to Goathland were reinstated during the winter of 1964 when snow closed the moorland roads. But as soon as the snow was gone the trains were withdrawn.

Typical of these treacherous creatures. A "We know better than thee' mentality all the way.

Live by the State,die by the State.

To be quite honest, i have been wondering who the person who killed the line is and wanted badly to punch them in the face. Glad to know there's a slim chance i still may get to. My words to him would not have been kind ones.

It's not Super-8, though that format was available at the time, having been introduced the previous year; Super-8 cameras were not common at that date. The perforations are in the wrong place and are the wrong size. On Super-8 film they would be smaller and vertically centered on the fram, not on the frame lines, as these are. this is the older standard 8 mm format.

soundnicetome these lines were all built to make money, the LNER knew that none of the lines to Whitby made money and they would have liked to have closed at least some of the stations, as they did on the York-Scarborough line, if they couldn't close the lines themselves. To travel directly from Whitby Town station to Scarborough you needed to time consuming and expensive reversals, as you were limited to 2 coaches when proppelling a passenger trains, with the leading vehicle when being propelled being a brake. DMUs speeded this process up, but still took time.

In fact this line never made a penny in profit.

As this fascinating film clip so graphically illustrates, the disused Whitby to Scarborough railway line was indeed "mothballed" by British Railways for two years, between closure in 1964 and track lifting in 1966. During this period, as the film clip again illustrates, the infrastructure had deteriorated due to factors such as vandal attacks and weed growth. Is "soundnicetome" suggesting that a cash-strapped British Rail, desperate to fund important infrastructure projects such as the Preston Area Resignalling on the West Coast Main Line, should have diverted funds from this for the purpose of sending weedkilling trains along a line which had been closed because it was losing shedloads of money, whilst the rails continued to rust and the sleepers continued to rot, with their scrap value going unrealised, regardless of the cost to the taxpayer?

@@neildahlgaard-sigsworth3819 then why build it in the first place? Love from a Scarborough lad.x

This line never made a profit.

If 90% of what we had pre-1960 had been upgraded and electrified, there would be lots of very expensive electric trains running up and down the Wye Valley, between Monmouth and Tintern, beneath some very expensive overhead wires, with no-one aboard them apart from a (very expensive) Driver and Guard.

Quite right, Simon. Too many railway enthusiasts live in a world of make believe.

The management of British Railways during the 1950's has often been criticised for being unimaginative and defeatist, but many of the things that were done during that decade - such as the introduction of car-carrying, overnight Motor Rail trains between London and Scotland - were both exciting and innovative. In some Regions the introduction of low-cost, lightweight Diesel Multiple Units preceded the 1955 Modernisation Plan. In 1959, as an alternative to closing the lossmaking branch lines from Kemble (Gloucestershire) to the prosperous market towns of Cirencester and Tetbury, slow and dirty steam trains were replaced with stylish new Railbuses imported from Germany. The problem was that as soon as the average lower-middle or skilled working class family got its hands on a secondhand car, and took it for a spin on the Preston Bypass, they voted with their feet and their wallets by turning their backs on rail travel forever.

The real problem is that they sold off the land to be built over. It should've been mothballed. We can't re-open these lines now because the land was sold off and built over. Lots of lines did need to close in the 60's but now they need to be reopened. We now have large commuter/dormitory towns with no rail connections. A very short-sighted policy.

Only a very small percentage of the lines closed in the '50 and '60s would be useful today. Many of the lines closed should never have been constructed in the first place because there was no sensible business case for them even 150 years ago.

And no hi vis as well, how did they manage to survive 😂

I am with you - I have walked Whitby to Ravenscar many times - but I never saw the stations as they were long gone bar the odd building, or piece left behind now. Such a shame to have allowed this to happen.

The problem with being a bright, foreseeing individuals is that the majority ignore you, and when it dawns on the majority that your views are accurate, and well formed it is too late. I have personal experience of this in the modern world, driven by the know it all generations who listen to no one - be under no illusion the next Beeching moment is already in motion.

I cycled along it yesterday. It's a fantastic local tourist resource. Perhaps it would be an even more beneficial resource if it'd remained a railway...

Unionised labour for you…

What a shame that more people didn't use the Whitby to Scarborough railway when they had the opportunity!

Hardly surprising though is it with all the reversals etc it wouldn't make it today

Well i'm glad to be of help.

The film was made by Frank Dean. R.I.P Frank Dean

Odd that - we were forced into our cars by the Politicians of the day, and then further forced into diesel cars - oddly all now are under the cosh as being not suitable for our climate - funny that what goes around. I do wonder if one day an electric train will run these old lines as the only form of transport left viable to the less well off.

The original line bed is still there - although had a few landslips in recent years - but by and large it would have survived many more years without too much trouble.

It was! The line climbed from Robin Hood's Bay to Ravenscar on a gradient of 1:40 and the DMU's which British Railways introduced in 1957 really struggled in wet weather when the rails were slippery.

They removed the old A171 bridge near the old Hawsker station in the late 80's or early 90's to create todays road configuration. Prior to that you had to drive over a huge odd hump in the road that allowed the railway to pass beneath it.

British Railways replaced steam trains with cheaper DMU's on the Scarborough to Whitby line as early as 1957 in an effort to reduce operating costs and to increase patronage. Sadly, having to pay the wages of two traincrew as opposed to three (no Fireman on a DMU) couldn't save this scenic route. I wonder if One Man Operation with a single-unit railcar (just like a 'bus, where the Driver also sells the tickets) was ever considered? Apparently it works in rural Japan!

@@DaveSuperThomas the DMUs couldn't always get upto Ravenscar from Whitby if there was a sea mist.

I doubt there would be very many people travelling on a train from Scarborough to Whitby (or vice versa) at lunchtime on a weekday in mid-February. For a few months at the height of Summer the route would doubtless be reasonably well-used, but in the depths of the Winter it would be a very different matter .....

@@KempSimon Grateful thanks to you, the Obergruppenführer. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obergruppenf%C3%BChrer SK = 🤡

No doubt that is why the track was allowed to remain in place for almost three years after the line closed in March 1965!

At least it shows those of use who weren't even born when this scenic coastal railway closed how the line was operated, and how attractive the countryside was through which it passed!

@@DaveSuperThomas True

Stay free, A, R 💚

Marples lost his marbles.

They even named the housing estate at West cliff station "beechings Mews" when it was redeveloped in the late 90s

River Huntingdon the Vivarail trains would not have been able to cope with the inclines from Whitby on the direct Scarborough line, especially in a haar set in.

2 trains per day outside if summer Saturdays on this line. United buses had a more frequent service between Scarborough and Whitby. Mothballing costs money and for how long do you retain it just sitting there? 2 years? 5 years? 20 years? 40 years?

The reason for that ruling may be to do with the gradients on the line. The steepest being 1:39. When DMU's were introduced in the late 50s, with them being one unit, it made it easier to operate. Capacity could increase on these services but with car ownership becoming ever more popular, the railways lost favour with the public. Shame this branch was closed as it now means a 5 or so hour journey from Whitby or Scarborough via Middlesborough and York.

@@LEVELCROSSING225 provided you got one of the direct services (in October 1950 there were only 2 services from Scarborough to Middlesbrough taking just under 3 hours leaving at 11:40 and 16:35). Why not take the bus, it only takes an hour to get to Scarborough from Whitby and parallels the railway's route, just as it did in the 1960s. The gradient at Prospect Hill was the cause of the shortness of trains being propelled, as I've since learnt that longer trains could be propelled provided they had brakes at each end at Guisborough. Unfortunately DMUs were not ideal on this line as sea dogs could make the rails too slippery for their light weight to get grip on the way up to Ravenscar.

+Benjamin Leith It has all gone.

Sadly the railway has long gone, closing in 1965. However almost all the route is walkable, and most stations still intact, with Scarborough Central, and Whitby Town still open for a few trains today.

If Mr. Marples (or anyone else, such as a Local Authority) had been prepared to subsidise the high costs of running of the Whitby to Scarborough railway line then I'm sure that Dr. Beeching would have been quite happy to have kept it open.

In fact discussions were conducted to try to preserve the line but the NYMR was saved instead. In it's working life the Scarborough - Whitby line never made a penny. It was also hard to work because of the severe 1 in 39 gradients to Ravenscar.

Dr. Richard Beeching didn't close the Scarborough to Whitby railway line. Secretary of State for Transport Mr. Ernest Marples did. Dr. Beeching was tasked to turn the finances of the heavily lossmaking British Railways around. This thankless job was made all the harder because Mr. Marples refused Beeching's not-unreasonable request that central government should grant-aid all of the unprofitable branch lines (such as Looe to Liskeard) which the Government of the day had declined to close. The fact that British Rail left the tracks of the Whitby to Scarborough line in place for nearly two years after closure should have provided enough time for anyone who wanted to preserve the route (in whole or in part) to raise some money and to make a reasonable offer. Finally, please could you explain to me how Dr. Beeching forced lower-income families to buy their first pre-owned motor car during the late 'fifties and the early 'sixties, and thereafter completely disown the railways as a means of personal transport?

Daryl Kemp the line from Whitby West Cliff to Loftus closed before Beeching was involved with the railways. None of the 3 surviving routes were financially viable(even the LNER knew this).

The fact Marples was a major shareholder in one of the country's biggest roadbuilders, is of course pure coincidence. As is conducting user surveys on wakes weeks, school holidays and re-timetabling local trains to ensure they missed their connection. And the fact Marples fled to Monaco at short notice to avoid prosecution for tax fraud. It's the same old story - roads are "invested" in, railways are "subsidised".

You mean the railway system that had too many duplicated lines and was by 1960 losing £100,000 per day? The railway system that meant freight spent more time in marshalling yards than on the move?

Shut up moron

@@ponline3170 Shut up moron.