A fascinating video! Hats off for your ability to be self-critical and learn from the whole experience.

This was gold and must've been tough to make. Many thanks Adam. We all think we're thick-skinned and can take criticisms until we actually hear them. Then our hearts sink and it's too easy to get defensive. I really enjoy this channel and wish you all the best.

Going back to one's earlier creations and criticizing them from a distance is a great exercise :) I did that with a novel I wrote and learned how much I learned since writing it.

A great retrospective! I loved playtesting Thrown, and remember thoroughly enjoying the wild swings, last minute victories, and epic fails! But in the playtest group the onboarding was done for us... we didn't have to decipher the rules or special cards ourselves, so perhaps had an unrealistically smooth ride.

This is so helpful. Many game designers on KZfaq focus on their successes, but hearing your truth about a game that flopped was more instructive by far than most of the success stories. Bravo. Your willingness to be brave is of huge benefit to us all.

Great video. I'm sure very difficult (and cathartic) for you to make, but extremely useful and insightful for other designers. I appreciate how objectively you put your own game through your review process. Thank you so much for this rare type of insight.

Very insightful and heartfelt video! Lots of lessons to learn from this one!

Thanks Adam. I felt lost because of the feedbacks that I got on my latest board game. Your video helped me to organize my thoughts and to understand what I can do better next time. I wish you a lot of creative ideas and success for your current projects.

This was the first video of yours I’ve seen. I was really impressed. In fact, I just bought the game. I’d never heard of it, and to be honest it didn’t LOOK like a game I’d buy. But I think the concept sounds really cool.

Thanks for this retrospective review of your own product. This is very helpful. I especially liked the end bit when you mentioned the dice tower review and how it affected you and the product. This part sounds very related as someone who is yet to have their first game published but also loves the DT

What a great breakdown and honest look at your own work. I love trick taking games so keep at it. I have one of my own that I think strayed a little too far from the core of trick taking, and maybe I'll go back and tweak it one day to see if I can get it to a point where it climbs high enough on the ladder.

Thanks a lot for making this. Can't have been an easy one to put out.

Such a useful video for those of us working on our first designs. So many great lessons learned and shared here. I suspect every well-known designer and publisher have had these types of flops happen, yet we rarely hear about the lessons they learned from them. Kudos!

Hi Adam, just want to echo the comments of other's that this is a really inspiring video and thank you so much for sharing your experience. I'm a new designer and to keep perspective I often look through failed Kickstarters, negative comments on bgg for poorly received games and interviews with the designers etc. This is by far the most honest, accepting and insightful post-mortem I have come across. Love your usual content too!

You got the game published - I count that as a success. Very good video regarding the whole thing really and the last section on how you felt once it was released. I like the idea that it is experimental in a way

Great video! Some really good lessons.

Really insightful breakdown Adam, thank you for doing this though I’m sure it wasn’t easy to do!

Loving all your content and I commend you for the bravery of this video. Very pertinent for me, as my latest game (which I thought was!) an innovative, elegant design, just flopped in a contest. I'm still pretty new to this, so I see plenty of self-reflection ahead! Glad to know it's all part of the journey...

Really love your content, Adam. Another great video and your application of HCD analysis to board games is always interesting and well informed.

You show great humility by looking into it so open minded. The only thing that matter is what you could have done differently because the only player you control is yourself.

Thanks for the honest and open video Adam.

Love this vid. I haven't played Thrown yet personally, but honestly it sounds fun to me. I really appreciate hearing about your experiences in game design.

Hi Adam! I can't believe I haven't found your channel sooner. You have such amazing and useful content, even for a published designer like me. Loved every video of yours I've watched so far, and I'm off to binge the rest.

This video is a gift to all aspiring designers out there. Thank you for your honesty and candor.

Great open and honest retrospective. I highly appreciate your authentic and personable delivery. I'm gonna have to check out Thrown now. Not because it is my type of game, rather because you are my type of designer.

Really appreciate your honest lookback and criticism of your game. After a recent playtest of my game, I'll be looking at my game through a similar lens

Hi Adam, another really useful and detailed analysis of the design and production process. As a fairly new designer I sometimes struggle to gain a sense of perspective of my own games. This video is excellent because of its direct, honest and ‘forensic’ approach to the whole process. I’m sure the passage of time has afforded you an objectivity that wasn’t totally apparent during the design and original launch. It so hard because we are creatively inspired and fuelled by that initial enthusiasm for our latest project! Great insights and reflections as always and some lessons and tips that I can try to use and apply in my own (as yet) unpublished designs. Thanks Mark.

Interesting! I think it is very important to see if a game has contradicting audiences, thank you for making me fully realizing this! Good luck on later projects! : )

This must have been a tough one to film. Well done Adam

I see some broad categories of mechanics * Player control. They give players control. For example, if you want to turn right with your car, you will probably succeed. Make player be able to control the turn. * Randomness and automation/AI. In some areas, you plan, but things do not always go as planned. Or sometimes player has no control of something so automation is needed. For example, the base game of Rebellion automated combat with dice. No player control as player is the strategist only. Others are doing the combat. It is a good use of dice automation. However, players wanted more control and the expansion granted this. Downforce us superior to Formula D. Formula D uses dice to solve car moves that are not random. So it us frustrating to see that something that would not rely on luck in real life, relies on luck in a game. Downforce gives player direct control. * Rock paper scissors. If there is a duel it is the right mechanic. The game What About Baseball uses dice automation for the game, which is very clever. The problem is that contact is the result of a duel between batter and pitcher and the game dice automates it. So the easy fix is to make players do a rock paper scissors move with their hands (or "I cut you choose" mechanic) to solve contact. If batter does not win, roll green die until you get anything but contact. And that easy fix makes it a tremendously exciting game for fans of baseball. This mechanic can be implicit too. In Battletech there is no perfect mech. There is a trade off between speed, firepower and armor. By picking a mech variant there is a rock paper scissors move. * Bookkeeping. Unless bookkeping is intellectually challenging and rich, minimize it. The tabletop Masters of the Universe has bureaucratic bookkeeping to support a generic tactical game. Choosing mechanics poorly leads to failure. And if your game has a level of storytelling, do good writing. People can spot tropes and generic writing. And most important... A game should not have a fixed winning strategy. * In Monopoly, hoard house miniatures, do not buy hotels * In Starship Captains, allocate all resources to play missions. Leave other mechanics for remnant resources. * Star Wars Risk. Focus on attacking bunker. Ignore soace battle and duel between Vader and Luke. Once bunker is down, attack Death Star.

Broo I felt this video so much. I have imagined having a game of my own published and reviewed by Tom, and imagined him bashing the game. I felt my heart get ripped out of my chest just thinking about this, leaving a hole, while I am paralyzed in shock. You worked on this for a long time, you loved it, it’s YOUR BABY! There is nothing more heartbreaking than people rejecting a creation that you feel proud of and that you love because you want it to bring them the joy that it brought you. It’s like giving someone that you care about a gift because you love them, but not only did they dislike the gift, they expressed anger towards it. Ouch! I can imagine the heart pumping hard and fast while reading and watching every game review, only for it to be stopped in awe and disbelief when they expressed that it flopped. I just know this feeling too well from my own experience with video game ideas and that’s why I am particularly emotional about this video. Anyways, I don’t know if this is a correct statement, but maybe the idea could have also flopped because it was released in the wrong time, the wrong era. I’m saying thay perhaps the gamers of today weren’t ready for a game of this nature. Of course, that’s one reason on top of the many others you listed such as disconnected Theme, or not listening to playtesters enough, etc. One thing is true, this game’s publishing was not a mistake. As you’d be far more regretful for never sharing this with the world. And the lessons learned were invaluable.

Awesome video! You are going to have some huge games one day no doubt.

This is very useful, I am working on a game of fantasy with card and dice, and I am trying to review mine and trying to be neutral, however the ladder engage system is a bit confusing, the categories are ok, but then you deduct points from new categories that were not included. I am also wondering what is exactly "Meaningful Interactions". You mean interactions between the components, the players, the mechanics? Following your own review, I think what I miss the most on these games you mentioned, is having a strong thematic immersion at the core, I get the same feeling when I see a casino machine with fantasy labels and illustrations. Fantasy is genre of creative storytelling first. Thank you again for the great video, as all of them in your channel. I am really interested in ways to review and score my games, so I hope you can share more about your system.

Thank you for the video. Yeah, it isn't easy when we want to share a game with lots of other people and can't get it to sell well. Finding good play testers who don't know you is important to getting honest feedback.

The way I see this is with BANG! most people in group either love the card game or the dice game and will always complain when we play one over the other.

Great video!

Love the honesty

Thanks for the candid post-mortem of your game. I only ever heard of it from your channel, but somehow missed it had a trick-taking flavor. Now I want to read the rules :) Nokosu Dice is one example of a trick taker + dice that is popular among connoisseurs. Your hand is half cards, and half partly open-information dice, where the dice are drafted before the hand is played. When playing into a trick, you can use either dice or cards.

Your sincerity made me to subscribe. And your critical thinking applied to self criticism made me to like the video.

This video is amazing. I think/hope many people can relate to your feelings after Dice tower review even if they never publish a board game. I have multiple questions: 1) If the game is so bad, why/how did it get published? 2) Why don't you do your game marketing? Please correct me if I didn't notice it. 3) Are you going to make version two of the game?

I love your honesty. It’s really hard to take criticism even though it’s part of the designing process, sometimes we blindly believe our own bs. We really have to swallow our pride and ego to take this kind of disapproval from our peers. Having said that, it’s a way of learning from our mistakes. We need to identify those mistake early in the process before it’s too late. Take everything in consideration and constructively analyze everything. BTW, love the video. Cheers!

This was really interesting! Enjoyed the insight into the entire process starting from the simple idea, to a completed product. Are you planning on making more videos featuring some of the other games you've designed? Going through the design process and such?

I see someone made a copy on table top simulator, I shall give it a try soon.

After all you said and showed, I still have the feeling I got when you explained the rules: that sounds fun, I want to play that!

This video is incredible, well done.

Brave and honest of you to be subjective about your own game - well done

It really sounds like an interesting game to play. Is it possible that the publisher might allow it to be posted on Board Game Arena? I loved how well you analyzed the reasons of its lack of commercial success. Although the individual drawings look fine, the visual theme, and especially the cover, do indeed look a bit dated and uninspired - something more cartoonish would probably convey the game's feeling, take-that-ish mechanics, and quirky concept much better. It's great to see that you keep exploring new ideas, and hope your next one is a real hit!

I have not played the game, but it's interesting to hear the process you went through anyway. You've mentioned you are done with this game, so maybe this isnt such a useful comment. Or maybe it applies generally. I think things pulled this game in many directions. You mention the cover and theme not providing context, or worse suggesing one that isn't there. You also mention trick taking audiences and push your luck audiences, etc. I've found there are many people who don't know those terms like tricks, trumps, etc. so, unfortunately if you use them outright in the rules, you're going to be teaching some people how to play Spades before you even get to your game. Let alone the basic strategy of those games that one turn leads to another, etc... This isnt unique to this game, but having these things pulling in different directions I think is a big challenge. Your peacock game is easy to understand as trick taking where you dont see your cards. That only means something to people that know trick taking, but "you can't see your cards" is simple and so maybe you just have to explain trick taking. Trick taking, but take that, and random values, and special changing abilities every turn... is a lot to explain.

Very carthartic video. The absolute worst is that void you spoke about upon release. Good or bad, just please SOMEONE say SOMETHING about the game. I have friends that work at Wizkid's so I don't want to criticize too much, but I also have multiple game design friends who have signed games with them. They have an established and robust distribution channel. You deserved more.

I would disagree with your statements “people love dice”, “people love trick taking”. Personally I go, Who plays dice rolling games? Who plays trick taking games?? And people in my group are the same 😃😃 I do not enjoy rolling dice whatsoever and never play a trick taking game -I bought two to see what that is about? (Cat in the box and skull king) But I have to yet play them. Great vid. Thanks a lot for sharing!

Thanks for the video! Do you think that the *theme* could have also been a factor here? When thinking of fantasy games with heroes, I (personally) want to have a strong connection with the characters, while the artwork in the game had a more generic feel (like "OK, I have 5 wizards, 3 warriors, and 1 priest" as opposed to "I have Merlin the wizard with an upgraded staff+3").

I admire your self-reflection, and trying to evaluate your game objectively. Per usual, you have offered a lot of really valuable advice. I don't know if it's worth anything, but from what you've shown, here are my thoughts about the game. I think the artwork alone put the game at a huge disadvantage, though that obviously isn't your fault. The art is extremely generic, almost like clip art. I know you noted that the art was quite serious, but I find it quite childlike, but lifeless at the same time - though if they captured the humor you imagined, that would have been a great improvement. It would have added a lot of much-needed personality. The demographic seems unclear to me, even though it's published by a company called WizKids. It looks like it's for children, but the rules seem a little too complicated for kids. I know you said you find the rules quite simple, but I couldn't help but feel lost as you explained it. I really like the clever title "Thrown", but honestly, it feels like the only reason dice are in the game is because of the title, rather than the other way around. The tactile elements are very nice, but it seems cluttered to have cards, dice, coins, and squares. I could see the dice potentially working, but not with all the other elements. It's innovative, but I think this would have been a situation where less, and simple is more. A well-executed fantasy card game may sound generic but could be really wonderful - though I understand it would be a very different game at that point, and that would have required sacrificing your vision for the game. With that being said, I'd still love to give this game a go!

Great video, the self analysis is admirable. Did the game go through a development phase with the publisher or just you?

A game is like a book. If your style correction for the book does not work properly, readers will do the style correction for you and that will impair their reading experience.

Thought about re-releasing it addressing all of its flaws you mentioned in this video? :)

The characters should be fighting over who gets to sit on a throne on the box artwork, at least all the artwork should have the contrast and saturation bumped up and the silver background on the box is uncomfortably grey which makes it look even more dull. Scoring a 0 on thematic immersion seems too harsh without having played the game, thiefs doing thief things and knights doing knight things should bump that up to at least a 1 but maybe I am not understanding your rating system correctly, while most unengaging games are going to be bad, you could come up with an infinite amount of bad engaging games so I don't think it's a giant flaw in your engagement rating system to have poorly performing games score well.

Really interesting video, I liked your reflexion. Insta sub

Nokosu Dice came out in 2016.

«It is really hard to be critical of your own product.» Okay. I think I see where you went wrong… *points to quoted sentence*

Loads of people don't like lightweight games without a board. Not hardcore enough. I like them but I'm into abstract strat more so I'm minority.

I’ll be honest with you, Adam. I normally don’t love your videos, because your advice feels rigid. It almost seems like you're trying to tell us about a get-rich-quick scheme. But in this video, you show us your soft underbelly. I can tell that you’ve really racked your brain trying to figure out what went wrong with Thrown. I see the pain in your eyes. It’s heartbreaking, beautiful, and actually inspiring. Hats off to you. You earned back my subscription!

Your a good dev and I think you've handled the faiure well but... I don't hink it deserved to die it was half baked and flawed but not a bad idea. It's just you'll blew past the editing phase and put your first draft into production... Which is bad but not unfixable... Like I could have released my Universal Table top Wargame/RPG in Alpha Year 2 of dev all it needed was conetent I thought at the time but it would not be as good as it is now now that I"ve delayed 1-3 years, 1 year later So it's been in devlopment for 4 years now and it's going great and it's alo one of those imposible games! So yeah maybe you could do a series redesigning the Trown here on youtube with us and self publish it on Table top simulator or a print on demend site? As I like the Idea it just needed alot of work to well work.

For your biggest stinker, it sure still sounds like an intriguing game

Join the club, buddy :D I have put out a ton of games, and they all have bombed... but that is normal for any creative effort.

Do you ever play test a persons board game?

An interesting deconstruction, but, I think like your confirmation bias with the playtesting - "I think it is good, therefore I listen to people who agree and ignore those who don't" - your focus here is mostly on the quality of the production and not enough on the quality of the game. You passingly mention that Tom lambasted the components, but that wasn't his principle issue with the game - I went to watch his review, and note that he has a huge theme and art issue in his first Fantasy Realms review. His problem was with the luck based mechanics which make the winner feel like a winner of purely of chance and the losers, purely losers of chance. That's not a 'trick taking audience' issue; that's an everyone issue. I think in your deconstruction you should be more interested in how you would redesign the game to mitigate the harshness on the luck, not in how a better look and a nice review may have saved it. The lesson's learned is a great summary but it would have been more interesting to hear what the negative playtesting feedback was that you ignored