had this with my jags .i also had my setups at the time similer to yours with divider.. i belive it because he stuck his head through the divider n liplock as u said with the followin struggle that ensues i believe because the larger male cant twist n pull away the female gets the upper hand n twists and disclocates the jaw ... since then i remove dividers for breeders n make sure female has hides small enough that the male cant get to her and havent had it since ,, just my thoughts and experiance on same situation ... unfortunately i not long got rid my trimacs as was after some of your fry from a mutual friend of ours but missed out ... sorry for loss.. churchill was a big fave of mine i adore trimacs ... keep up the vids good or bad ..its all knowledge for other keepers 🐟

Sad that this keeps happening, don't let it get you down Andy we all know you love and do your best to provide all of your fish with happy and healthy homes. Keep up the great work Andy

Good educational video. Sorry for your loss Woodsy. Hopefully you get another pairing soon. The Dovii pairing look incredibly stunning 😍

I just found your channel yesterday and have watched quite a few of them so far. I find it fascinating and informative. Thank you and I am so sorry for your loss. Wish I had some kind of insight on the problem. Keep on keeping.

Terribly sorry for your loss, Andy. Been following your videos for a while. Churchill was one of my favorite fish. He's probably up there thanking you right now for being such a great fish-keeper. I guess it was just his time to go. You've done such a wonderful job of raising them up and keeping them healthy.

That’s too bad! Love your video’s! Thanks and have fun.

Sorry for your loss Andy, the video was very much appreciated its all a part of the hobby and passing on your experiences may be helpful to others in the future.

Hi Andy. I am very sorry for your losses. My condolences to you. Keep your head up and continue to be positive. Much love and and support to you Sir.

Hi Andy, thanks for sharing what's obviously a sad and difficult topic! Gutted for you mate, Churchill was beautiful beast of a fish! My first thought same as others here, head stuck, bones broken pulling back out, but obviously not they case as you confirmed others didn't have the divide! So sadly as you indicate, this may be opening a can of worms, with what successful multi-generational fishkeeping requires! Particularly when it comes to these bigger 'special' diurnal fish! I'm guessing that a lot of these big Central's are diurnal from relatively clear water habitats so plenty of Sun, so plenty of Vit D, but probably plenty of calcium from whole prey items too, I see most proprietary foods have Vit D, but at what level and how much calcium do they have available to utilise with it?! I'm thinking these big Central's are probably the worst case scenario too, massively, weighty built heads and bodies, that they violently throw about, so much more prone than other fish to expose such a weak point! So maybe this means more research is needed particularly in those 2 nutrient profiles when it comes to these fish, and maybe things like feeding whole fish prey rather than fillets, to give more calcium and seeing how much is in other items too! Sorry for the essay, just a really interesting if sad subject! Keep going bud!👍

Sorry for your loss and thank you for sharing 👍

I’m sorry this happened again, Mr. W. Thank you for the update.

Andy mate thats really sad I had the same with Mr Wimpy as you know and its heartbreaking hope you are OK bud 🙏

Sorry for your loss andy! The intro didn't have the same vibe to it. I love your channel and you and Mr. Wolfy has inspired to me make room for a dovii. Absolutely incredible creature

So sorry about the sad news Andy. Keep up the good work

Keep up the good work andy 🔥you've inspired me to take my hobby to the next level- big cichlid pairs !

My condolences Andy i've never seen something like this happen i hope you keep strong

So sorry for your loss Andy....

Love your videos. Sorry to hear for your lost sir

Sad news Andy, I’ve not come across this before, and the fact it’s the third time - gutted for you. Hope you get some more Trimacs soon, and keep making the videos.

I hate to see this Andy, so sorry about Churchill. Because of you (and Churchill) i was inspired to keep trimacs and now I have an 8” male named pickles that is by far my favorite fish I have ever kept! Thank you for all you do👍🏻

Andy I’m so sorry this happened! I didn’t even know that could happen. Thank you for the information and break down of the anatomy. I have many large cichlids and have enjoyed your channel for years. Wish you the best with the rest of your livestock

Would love too see a Final December 2021 Full Fish collection tour with the tanks from the fishroom and in the house. I think just this once since the year is ending we would all appreciate an hour long video with no cuts showing every fish you own while waffling on and everything.

Sad to hear about your Trimac Churchill. You have inspired alot of people to keep big cichlids.

Sorry for your loss

We all hope you are doing better now that a little time has gone by.

My favorite fish I’ve ever had was a hybrid Texas jag that got to 14 inches that I was breeding with a 10” jag and this happen to him. I noticed before it happened they had fry and he was a monster. He spent most his time at the top of the tank trying to fight anything that came near it and she would nip at him right where it dislocated. I think she got ahold of him and broke it loose. Broke my heart. I wasn’t aware this was a thing until this video. Thank you for sharing.

I think its from swimming into the glass too hard and it forcing their chin up while their body continues forward towards the glass. Thanks for the videos. You have a great setup!

Hey mister Andy Woods Happy New Year to you coming very soon I hope we get a video from you also very soon we're all wondering how you're doing we hope that you found yourself a nice pair of trimax

Damn Andy so sad to see that he’s gone,sorry for your loss

That ia crazy I would never have known that is possible very informative video. Sorry for your loose.

All the best Andy. Could possibly be sharp rocks hooking on to the gill area.

Hi Andy. Firstly, sorry for your loss. I don't think the lack of natural sunshine would be a factor. Where we live in the East Midlands, the water is pretty calcium heavy (whether they lack Vitamin D from the sun I don't know). I think you hit the nail on the head regards to overzealous tank banging.

Sad to see this happen, Andy. Do you think supplementing calcium into their diet would help reduce the likelihood of this happening?

RIP Churchill!

Sorry for the loss. I lost my flowerhorn about a month ago. Got 3 baby jags.. down to 2 now. 1 is almost twice the size and already showing color and super aggressive.. have hopes for that one but only about 3in so has lots of growing to go

Hi Andy, sorry for loss of this beautiful fish. Just wondered where do you get the large tank dividers I have a 7ft x 24” x 36” tall - and cannot see any dividers that work for my tank?

Andy everytime this happened was a divider in the tank

i didn't expect the title to mean quite litterally

Hi andy very sad Sunday morning to hear the news of what happened to Churchill, I've never had it happened thank God but someone said maybe he stuck his head through the divider that makes a lot of sense ,anyway I saw the tears in your eyes and I have them to .your the best fishkeeper I have ever seen I look forward to your videos every weekend it's the makes everything in life better knowing that there's going to be a new Andy Woods video posted soon. keep up the good work and please get right back into it and find yourself a couple of trimax and start the heel process thank you my friend good luck and happy fish keeping to you too also. Please come back with a new video very shortly all of your fans are worried about you

Sad news Andy , gutted for you mate , I recently lost my 12 inch male festae so I know what it feels like. Churchill was one of my favourite fish that you have, will you be trying to purchase another pair ? All the best mate, unfortunately keeping cichlids you get bad times as well as good.

I'm so sorry Andy! You've suffered a lot lately, and I sympathize. Churchill was probably my favorite of your fish sir. He will be missed by us all. Not as much as you I'm sure.

Damn sorry about the loss

Hi Andy, missed your videos lately. Wondered what was going on. Sorry for your loss. Hopefully you post some more updates soon.

I feel your pain.

Hi so sorry , this is so sad love your channel

This has happened a couple of times to me mate,sucks balls,absolutely devastating,it happened to a jaguar cichlid two years ago and a bay snook 6 months ago,my thoughts are they swam flat out to the end of the tank,i don't divide my tanks and there's nothing in the tank for them to get stuck in,as far as i no it happens when the lights are out,so i guess they get spooked. R.I.P Churchill and partner 🤧😪💙

Takes courage to share this video so thank you, my theory is the gravel and stones layout. When the male fish aggressively dig during spawning time and rearrange their territory to court the female do you think them picking up mouth full of rocks/pebbles/gravel and swinging them around cause the jaw to dislocate? Have you tried to keep your pairs in tanks with just sand and maybe one or two large boulder for them to spawn on. Fish can still dig and move sand but may not be detrimental to their jaw structure. I have seen fish with broken jaws when the slam against rocks. Most of your setups seem to have large stones so maybe freeup the bottom half with less obstructions.Clearly the egg crate did not catch the jaw. Just a thought!

Did all 3 cases have a divider? I've seen my fish get there heads stuck when fighting through the divider and then maybe they get dislocated from trying to back out with their gill plates stuck? Never had this happen myself but it doesn't seem far fetched.

Between your channel and cichlid dojos my house is filling up with tanks faster than I can fill them with pairs.

Happen to my dovii from aggressively shaking his head back and for by the glass.

Sorry to hear this. Very very interesting though.

Andy question for you. How do you get rid of water lice in your aquarium? I see them on the glass on the side of the tank, crawling on my filters, and I also see them hoping around in the water when I’m doing a water change. I don’t know how I got them, but please tell me how to get rid of them.

Wonder if he got his head stuck in the divider and dislocated his head freeing himself swimming backwards. Did the other fish that die have dividers? If so maybe this could be a theory. Anyway good luck with the fishroom and thanks for the content as always looking forward to seeing more.

Hate when this happens in the fish room. Death sucks especially when you can't make out what happens.

RIP CHURCH HILL

Sorry for your losses. Way too many things could have happened. Mysteries of fish keeping,

Did the previous fish have the same dividers in the tanks? Looks like it could be from chasing the females through them..

Most likely got stuck in the divider holes and pulled loose trying to get free again

Oh man 40 years keeping fish and over 30 keeping cichlids and have never had this happen gutted for you such bad luck.

1st of all sorry mate for your loss..I've been there..one day fine, next day females gone..?? As far as female passing afterwards, speculation of course but im a helpless romantic. I believe these animals have feel just like we do to a point..when elderly couples lose there loved one usually the other goes within a short while.. I've kept fish that were so human like , that all that they needed was to talk!!! They feel emotions!!! have a blessed day thanks for sharing..I just lost my Dovii Papa Lobo and His oldest son.. Really weird circumstances...take care mate

Yeah more info needed did the 3x it happen in divided tanks?

Hi Andy sorry to hear what happened, i have an Oscar at the moment with a similar issue the ball joint has separated but he still seens to be ok and feeding, is it likely to probe fatal in the end?

I'm sorry for your loss, this is a a topic that really needs discussion, so we all can figure out this problem, my guess its all in how the fish developed from birth, inbreeding young fish certainly hasn't strengthen the quality of fish in the hobby, proper fish diet on fry is important I always wonder about the calcium or do fish also get vitamin D from sunlight, a lot to discuss, so let me know when you gonne do a live pod cast 😀

Rip Churchill

Sorry about your loss. I can only guess it's probably a combination of things. Calcium deficiency, vitamin D deficiency, and fighting with his head in the divider. I've seen discussions about UV lights on aquariums, but never anything definitive.

Andy only just got round to seeing this video I was just thinking do you think the dividers have anything to do with it you mentioned that they would hang locked together on these dividers for hours I can imagine the mall getting stuck did you have dividers with the other fish that had the problem I wonder Maybe this damages the male in someway just a thought He was a beautiful fella ☹️👍

I lost my peacock bass the same way but he survived 2 days with that broken jaw. I was thinking my silver arowana did it.

Any chance this could be a calcium deficiency? What do you feed? In the wild you would think they would be eating a lot of little fish.

Sad to know that. This hobby is surprising.

Could it be that Churchill got his head stuck in the divider and panicked and broke his own neck...? Did the other fish that you lost, have the divider in the tank also. This is the only thing that I can think of that may have happened. Also, did this occur with the lights on or off.

Hey Andy. Every week I hope we hear from you, But we as fans we don't .wish you luck if you are done with you tube.

I dont see any fight marks.... Looks more like his head got stuck in the opening and pulled or twisted himself up.... Maybe some 24hr cameras.

When my Oscar where just over a year, I woke up to the sound of water and banging, my female had my male by the bottom lip and was shaking him just like a dog, split his lip almost all the way down the middle. He survived and they've been living happily for years. His bottom lip healed but you can now see right up into his gills and to that bone. I've had Africans lock lips and a few ended up smacking the glass and dying. They most definitely can snap each other's necks. I have one right now that i separated because i was sick of listening to the fighting iny bedrom from my tank downstairs.

sorry to hear about churchy, at first i thought it might be the divider but u said in comments this is the only 1 that had divider so that leaves food ,lighting an female just getting to strong for the males ? maybe a uvb 10% for a few hours a day might help like ud do for reptiles an id say some calcium powder but i don't know how you'd get it in the fish dont know what u could do if it is the females getting to be to strong for the males i guess that's nature then as u said weak boys dont get none hope u find a new trimac boss surely there's some of Churchills grandkids about somewhere

My best guess is that this was the result of a rare and extreme liploicking accident. While she had his lower jaw they both made a twist in opposite directions. Crack! Combine this with a vitamine D deficiency due to lack of UV-light. Poor Churchill, poor female. I am feeling with you, Andy,

Gutted Andy. Found my male rtm this morning , same thing happened the bone at the bottom of his gills has become detached.

Sorry man. Churchill was a spawn from Big Mac, right?

When it’s happened, has the tank always had a divider? I suspect it could be getting their head caught in the divider, but this is only speculation.

I have trimac babies 2to 4 in.the problem is I live in New Jersey and don't think they would survive a trip to Great Britain .what do you think would give to you for free

Such a shame.......

Maybe he got stuck in the divider

People need to see the good and ugly of fish keeping.

Gutterd for ye Andy poor church hill 🥲🥲🥲🥲

Their*

Is it not that he is trying to get in to the female side and caught himself in the divider?

Sorry to hear that. I’ve had my large male lyonsi kill two females and a female festae kill a large male in the same manner.

Not looking foward to this part of the hobby. Sorry Andy.