Back in the days when I went to audio shows, I was surprised how many audiophiles seemed to have little interest in music. Demo discs went off in all directions. For a time the most important track was a garage door slamming. The used marketplace also shows a lot of recent equipment on sale, suggesting a lack of sense on the part of the original buyer. So yes I think there are a good deal of nuts in the audiophile world.

They listen unbalanced most of the time ;-)

Like any hobby, you will find fanatics.

Lol, I loved how you ended the mixed-up package recipient story with, “yeah! Pretty normal people...” 😂😂

"a sword fight with those big long things" cracked me up there Paul!

I’ve met a few audiophiles at shows (for owners systems, not commercial) that are passionate and highly eccentric, one guy that sticks in my mind was wearing a full yellow tartan suit with a long tailcoat and had a truly gigantic horn loaded system which cost more than my house... and didn’t sound very good.

Audiophelia nervosa: that feeling that nothing is ever quite right. G.A.S. Gear acquisition syndrome- the need to buy gear In China, audiophelia is referred to as "the sickness" and some are indeed obsessed to the point of mental illness. Continually spending money and changing gear every few months is not mentally healthy. Nor is continually getting into fights over a subjective thing. Nor is leveraging your obsessive spending like some exclusive thing to Lord over others who have not gone off the deep end.

Informative and funny as always, thank you Paul. I have an old friend who spent $40K on an old Ford Mustang that I would consider a piece of junk, he laughs when I spend $350 on a set of cables. We are both passionate about our thing.

An unstable person will always say that they're stable

Your story really got me laughing. Hats off to you Paul.

Audiophiles are very stable until you question the $1000 dollar 6ft HDMI cable

OMG, HELL YES! Audiophiles are quite mentally unstable indeed. I used to be one, so I ought to know. I still love good audio equipment, and I still have plenty of it. But I sure as hell don't lose my mind about it, or about possibly not having the latest greatest piece of shit which somebody wants to sell me. That includes Mr. PS Audio's million dollar audio cables and speakers. They just would NOT possibly make a bit of difference. Only if you think it does in your head. If you're that sort of audiophile, then you're building your life around your audio equipment, rather than adapting your audio equipment into your life. Above all else regarding this hobby, it's the music which matters the MOST. It's like the sort of idiot who has to buy a new car every six months. It never ends.

I agree Paul, I'm a car guy/automotive engineer. Some would say I'm mentally unstable when I talk about cars but, it's really a passion. High end audio is a hobby to me.

Stop listen to your gear instead listen to music.

Great listening to you! Great insights!

Paul, Thanks again for another properly produced and well written video. I believe that the original question was not about the presence of unstable, violent or physically destructive mental defect in audiophiles but about the potential for audiophiles to be insecure in themselves and wildly obsessed with audio equipment to the point of absurdity and potential harm to their lives and livelyhoods. The second part of the question about audio sales people refers to the potential of those salespeople to take advantage of the insecurity and obsession to sell audiophile customers equipment that does not improve on what the customer already has, at great cost, just to pad the sales peoples' bottom lines. The salespeople can do this because of the tendency of audiophiles to hear what they want to hear or are told to hear rather than what they actually hear. There have been a number of actual statistically significant double blind studies over the years which debunk a number of claims made by audiophiles. Actual musicians of all genres also tend to disagree, sometimes vehemently, with claims made by audiophiles. When members of the non audiophile pubic, especially those with a STEM background such as doctors, engineers, etcetera, hear some of the claims made by audiophiles, and observe some of the claims without being presented with empirical research to back up the claims, those members of the public can become skeptical, critical, or even convinced of defective mental processes to arrive at those claims.

Investing in hi-fi is a far better habit than boozing, gambling, buying expensive clothing that you'll only wear once- plenty of things cost a huge amount of money that only bring short term pleasure. Being an audiophile doesn't have to be hugely expensive and it's long term joy that can last for years.

What percentage of people who have to have the latest greatest cell phone, video game clothes, car, ...... are unstable?

I was in a hifi shop in Glasgow ,Scotland and within 10 minutes 3 different people wanted to fight me ,dangerous place

Thank you for the talk :)

Audiophile obsessions = Neurosis Extremus...a buddy of mine went insane after being convinced the capacitors in his power amp needed to be encased in bees' wax.

Sword fighting w/dildos- “We’re pretty normal”. Lmao!

I think audiophiles are obsessive to a degree that quickly exceeds anything rational. For me the line where you lose your way is when how music sounds is taking more of your time and interest than the music itself does. I listen to my music on a hifi system, audiophiles listen to their systems while they are playing music.

The Vegas story is hilarious. 😂

Thats really funny story. Thanks for sharing!!

As soon as I saw the title for this video, I thought to myself I just had to watch this! 😂

I've been a stamp collector, coin collector, camera collector, vinyl and cd collector, book collector, etc., and I've found that, at least in my case, collectors have a perfectionist, obsessive spirit. This also applies to audiophiles and yes, I'm one of those, too. If that's mental illness, then I plead guilty.

I think it is funny that you remember where the porno convention was located but don’t remember where you were staying. Stories are wonderful. Your sales “trick” of listening is great advice for everyone in sales.

We have so much and we are still always unhappy. As Lou would say: We have so much, to you who have so little, to you who don't have anything at all.

This is why I got out of audio, I started when I was 8 and graduated to high end audio when I read my first issue of the abso!ute sound in he the mid 80's, by the late 90's I was more than happy to get out of it.Beside the insane costs of equipment its all the absolutely crazy people you have to put up with.Remember the george tice clock???

I started in HiFi retail in '70. Going from part time while in college for Electronics, to full time repping and travelling 6 states selling to and training retailers. I learned and then taught that a good salesperson helps a customer MAKE the purchase. Yes there are any number of sales tricks we employee. A good sales person will use them to HELP a customer make a buying decision. A bad salesperson will use them to con someone into buying something. A clerk will do neither. But statistically some percent of audiophiles would be unstable, psychopaths, tall, short, ....

When ever people say I am, or we are the most stable people, it is time to excuse myself. Actually, I was very busy.

My wife seems to think different Paul, when I come with a new amp or speaker's, she's like "Are you crazy, what did you buy that for, you must be mad spending all that money" so by her book I'm totally certifiable! LOL 🤪🤣😂😃😄😁😊🙂

OMG... I literally just told my friend, in the midst of lamenting my currently inoperable amplifier that I was going to chain it around my ankles and chuck it in the ocean... Bizarre!

So Paul...is it really "all about the music" or, as Steve Guttenberg says .."all about the gear" ?

To me it's about making my music sound better but i only buy used hi fi stuff . Because i am spending more money on music . And as you know old speakers never really die as long as you can rebuild them thank god for that .

Best story thus far. Hope it makes it in the book. So when the book comes out are you going to accompany it with books on high bias, open reel, mastering tape for us crazy audio files? Lol just kidding. Have a good one. :)

I went to Vegas once for CES and the Adult Video News was going on at the same time. I got to see a lot of well known porn stars walking by. My favorite speakers at that show were the Sound Labs which sounded almost the same as my Acoustats.

When listening for difference, an almost always used trick is to tell the audience what they shall here of difference: "and now the omnidynamic 2VII cable! If you listens you will here a more defined bass, a higher headroom…." . And there are two reason for him doing that, It primes you and tells your brain what it should here and on top of that, It is impossible for humans to remember so fine details in more than 10-20 seconds, so his speech is to insure that your brain know what to expect to hear and have enough time to forget how the "before" sounded. To round the trick of, he will ask: "how many could here the CLEARLY MORE defined bass?! I bet you have already experienced that if you have been to any a hi-fi show. :-)

Absolutely.

As long as you don't attempt to tell people who aren't interested what they have is garbage then it really doesn't matter what you decide to do in the hobby as long as it doesn't ruin you financially. A lot of people just enjoy the upgrading and trying stuff out as much as the listening. A lot of people miss that. It isn't purely about the music. Music is only part of the fun. My brother couldn't care less about my audiophile headphones and so I don't try anymore to persuade him to upgrade. He is truly in it for the music. Could he do better? Sure. But if he is happy then it really doesn't matter. Maybe I envy him a little but I enjoy upgrading, listening, and learning about what affects sound. It is a part of the hobby. Probably why active speakers aren't more popular despite their obvious benefits because you can't mix and match components.

Yes. “Without music life would be a mistake.” - Nietzsche.

Wow. *That* one really hit home for me! But we're not as bad as other types.

I'm sitting here imagining the current You, Scott and everyone else having a huge "swordfight".

I laughed so hard when I read the title lmao

That story was great

Let's be honest. Audiophilia is the situation where you seek to have the most representative and accurate recording of a performance in your own space. In that sense it is a pursue of convenience and time. The best representation one can have of music is actually being there. So If one has spent 100k on audio gear, imagine how many concerts they could have attended... Instead they choose to fuff around with gear. So it is not a pursue due to love of music. Is a pursue of convenience.

Funny story, thanks :)

It's just another form of desireable "Spiritual Madness"

That was really funny .. you handled it magnificently... I'm a professional recording engineer .. I deal with everything that goes into recordings .. you do your best to unravel it .. I'd love to have a big long chat to you one day about your IRS's.... oh and bi wiring too.... Bye for now ..

There used to be a funny video of these 'crazy' Greek audiophiles on KZfaq, but the fun Police blocked the whole audio content due to a copyright claim :s

I think what the questioner was getting at is our unending quest for the best we can afford, always hoping it will be good enough to make the magic happen, to transport us to a place of total immersion and pleasure. I find that while occasionally there are times that it happens for me, it is unpredictable and less common than I would like. The hobby does not stand still. You can say that of an aficionado, I suppose.

I find reactions to my system run all the way from people who rave about the imaging and dynamics to people who would just as soon listen to a clock radio. Those clock radio people don’t get it and think I’m a little nuts. That’s fine with me.

I like your RCA dog!

sword fights......I dont know when I last laughed THAT hard.

Did he use a 245 triode for a sex toy? It has better Freudian symbolism than the 833-A which has my personal favorite sound.

so I'm building a system and questioning my stability. and then I see this.

MY FAMILY ALSO THINK ABOUT ME. I HAVE SO MANY SPEAKERS IN MY HOUSE. SCATTERED HERE AND THERE

Haha "mentally stable? Of course we are, we just got done sword fighting with dildos addressed to my wife" 😅 love youe videos always knowledgeable and funny

Pretty normal, humble people, even if sorta inversely wired up. If sword fights broke out with dildos, i don't wanna imagine what would happen if a package of vintage swords were sent to the wrong address at an audio trade show.

If pedophilia is a crime, so is audiophilia.

Yes, obsessive compulsory disorder plus comorbid persoanlity disorders, most of the times!

Just use your gear everyday until it wears out.

Well, technically a spin is stable which is why the early mail pilots used an intentional spin to get below the cloud deck when caught on top. Of course they were counting on the ceiling being more than 1000 feet. :D

for the most part their normal, im basing that off my dad and his groups. but when you start buying $1000 power cables you've went off the deep end. like micheal f....never mind

The story is hilarious.

Boat owners are unstable. They sink more in a boat than I sink in a sound system, and they use it 6 weekends a year. But they don't use hi end cables.

As an audiophile, I find the question highly offensive. The answer is: Yes.

Are audiophiles mentally unstable, Then segues into the Sword fight story lol... no not at all, In all seriousness Paul thank you for these videos Your time and effort inspire me .

I think they are more stable than most people, how many to day can be sitting still long enough and listening to two-channel music?

so obviously, you don't know me and my audiophile friends, we referred to ourselves as members of the order of the blue striped apron a reference to the traditional attire of butchers, not concerned about going crazy, that happened many decades ago in our country politicians claim to be sane, (YMMV)and I'm quite happy to be different. thanks for the video as enjoyable as ever

I've Aspergers according to several family members! I doubt a Psychiatrist would even dream of diagnosing it. I'm just fussy, eh?

probably some of them they have same level of autism i believe cos autism is also related with an obsession for some particular argument, which can be the continuing research for a better sound

Correlation does not imply causation.

Audiophiles are just different, as what we all are from each other.

If he remembers right. Wink Wink

I guy I know - old and a bit deaf like me, he reckons to be able to tell the difference "better electricity" makes if you use old rubber insulated, cloth covered mains cable, you only get now for electric irons????

Aboud 99%

frequencies make the difference ...in our heads.

Tbh if I was addicted to black tar heroin and I met someone who is also addicted to black tar heroin id think he was a pretty stable guy.

Haha trick question Paul.. everyone appear to have some issues these days..

Yes! (I didn't even watch the video. I just threw that in there.)

Yes yes and yes. Take your meds, kids.

In a goddamn world where everybody stays to themselves on a smart device uhhhhh duh goddammit

Yep

Sword fighting... haha

I believe if you're not obsessed with at least one thing in your life right now, you could be happier.

Not if you use balanced cables, and spikes

Yes they are

I was upset to hear that Arnie Nudell died recently.

mentally unstable no, obsessive compulsive yes. (work or job related that is fine). In other words some are OCD just as much as a car perfectionist who spends 2 weeks to detail one car. I prefer to get into things with a hobby enthusiast level, spend a decent amount of cash and time but spend most of my time using the equipment rather than building, setting up, researching. When you spend less using and being happy you've gone to far.

Some of them definitely are. $15,000 for a cable??? There is no way to justify that by any standard. A rip off, and con game. W.C. Fields was right. There is a sucker born every minute.

My wife votes Yea!

Not nuts, but very gullible :- )

for 45 years -yes and no

Stable or not... much of the salesmanship in consumer electronics can border on the non sensical . I have had a number of consumer electronics people, sellers and users, who state they can hear subtleties in music from a CD using mass market speakers or even audiophile speakers and gear. They go on to argue that the recording engineers are just flunkies (paraphrased) who know very little so who would care about their opinion on good sounding speakers etc. A CD is a significantly reduced file size of original recorded material. How is that a copy played in a stereo store can show flaws or details in a recording more than the original recording and creators could not.?? The discussion of directional cable and power cleaning also tends to illustrate some of the fanatical nature of non pro audiophiles. Speaker placement I would argue will play a much greater role in the reproduction of sound over alot of components that audiophiles find pertinent. There have been tests done at high bit depths of 24 and sample rates of 96KHZ or higher to determine if they yielded any differences to the human ear. The files are much bigger but we enter into the world of diminishing returns. Very hard to hear much difference mostly because human hearing is so limited and is affected by age and of course speaker placement. It is more subjective than anything. I did hear a story from a recording engineer friend of mine who said that Bryston engineers did a blind test on speaker wire ... using lamp cord and high quality speaker wire to compare the sound differences. In this example, people could not hear any difference. But if you go to a stereo store catering to the audiophile you get alot of bashing on about the cable choice/etc. I would agree that a good A/D converter will make a very big difference as a bad one will tend to make some music more brittle and can give you ear fatigue.But even with A to D once you get into a reasonable level of quality any increase in cost to squeeze smoother more musical sound will be marginal from my experience. A dome tweeter vs a ribbon tweeter is an area of difference I can say will yield measurable results. Obviously isolating a turntable from floor rumble will yield results maybe in ultra quiet sections of music. My preference is to gain as musical a sound as possible and keep cabling as short as possible simply to reduce the possibility of RF interference... more possible with unbalanced non pro setups. So I do believe that some audiophiles who are playing back FLAC files or CDs can get a bit fanatical about every little component to a level of obsessiveness. Are they unstable? Who knows.... for some it is an obsessive hobby. But sound is very influenced by physics like room size, shape and material not to mention speaker placement or even person and ear placement. Our ears are also very susceptible to volume effects. We simply do not hear low frequencies as easily at lower volumes which is why many people like to listen to music at higher volumes or use a loudness control to even out the perceived sound. As well, our hearing does change considerable over our lifetime so it's not like we own a couple of scientific instruments on our heads.

I don't think i am?

Cryogenic wire. For Instance.

The truly crazy people are those who comment here about how others can't possibly be hearing what they do because whatever they are hearing can't be measured. Like Transient Intermodulation Distortion that audiophiles were hearing back in the late 1960s, long before it was "discovered" and described in the early 1970s. They're just gifted psychics I guess ;-)

Well i`rd say quite a few .