Are Pro Tile Installers ABANDONING Schluter Systems?

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4 жыл бұрын

In today's video the guys from Hamilton Tile talk about their loss of faith in Schluter Systems. There has been a lot of discussion and modification to the tradition of trust and good faith when it comes to water proofing showers using Schluter products. Well, today we talk about the end to the good faith and our diversification into new fronts to better provide peace of mind and a superior product to our wonderful customers that trust us with so much of their hard earned money.
Special thanks to @tilecoach, Isaac O for all your hard work. Probably feels like your shouting into a void, but man, you're opening minds! check out his channel at / 916tile
Another thanks to D's Tile! Donnie D.! You are the man, sir!
/ @dtileandremodeling
Follow us on Instagram @HamiltonTileGA
Follow us on Facebook @HamiltonTileGA
Comment with your feelings and experiences with Schluter Systems. Let us know how and what you think. Continue the movement and let's get Kerdi-Coll to the U.S. to solve these problems.
Let's not accept the answer of "don't worry about it." We're too good for that!
Let's work to have the TCNA standards modified!
Like and subscribe, much more to come from Jason and I!
visit my blog at www.hamiltontilega.com/a-tile...

Пікірлер: 267

@chrismachado193 4 жыл бұрын

Hallelujah! Thanks Hamilton Tile!! You guys are awesome.

@HamiltonTileGA 4 жыл бұрын

thanks for saying that! right back atcha

@valeriej291 3 жыл бұрын

I used the full Kerdi system in our basement shower 4 yrs ago. When I did the water test there was significant wicking up the thin set. It made me wonder. Last month I had to remove about 18 tiles where the quartz company messed up slope. I’m happy to report that the kerdi looked brand new underneath even though that area had standing water for up to a week after a shower. I’ve since patched and retiled. It made me appreciate the Kerdi. Going to rip out our fiberglass master shower soon. Hard to know what exactly to use....

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Not saying it is or isn't a problem, just saying we want to know "WHY"

@moneymakingmikeg.9555 4 жыл бұрын

It's crazy to hear Jason say he's been using it for over 15 yrs. Until I started watching YT tiling videos I didn't even know it existed!! Way to go, on asking for Schluter for explanations or at least opening up the dialogue to help further the industry. Hoping all is well guys, Dirty Jersey out!!

@HamiltonTileGA 4 жыл бұрын

Yeah, Jason really breaks it down. You can tell his more somber, rationale and non-confrontational style compared to mine😂 Everything is great Money Making Mike! Thanks for checking out the video! You probably know far more about tile than you'd ever need to!

@crazycrackalacka Жыл бұрын

I'm just binging on tiling videos in the KZfaq world. Thanks for the year experience and knowledge for us that are interested

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

Happy to help. Thanks for the positive comment! I appreciate seeing it!

@brentsmith2384 3 жыл бұрын

I've been laying tile since the 80's.i go to tile,meet n greats with reps every year.know a lot about Schuler systems....never used 1 in my life.i do like their trim stuff thou.but you can't go wrong with a simple pan,correct installation of cement board.use some pro red on your curb,nail heads.eazy peazy...

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

never use the "E" word again (easy) thanks.

@josephsmontana8283 2 жыл бұрын

(facepalm) Lmao!

@constitutionalbacker1stame787 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for bringing this to my attention, you're saving me aggravation.....I was skeptical when I heard of Schluter system....Now I am seeing where people are saying this product does not work as advertised.

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

it works as "good as it has to" when you install it according to their American specifications. That's just not good enough for us.

@f.b.1735 Жыл бұрын

The Problem is that in america you dont have the same rules as we have in Germany. In Germany you MUST use a product like 8+9 for every Inside/outside corner and band.

@supermotoboy3664 Жыл бұрын

If you put kerdi fix between seems and then mud and tape using the kerdi strip, wouldn’t this stop the wicking?

@troymcg 3 жыл бұрын

I just installed a schluter shower system. After having misgivings about the seams, this time I put an additional layer on top of the base, with several inches extra length and width, folded the corner and attached to the framing before putting on the wall board. This way I reckon the tray is 100% waterproof, but would be happy to hear any criticisms of this technique. My other question, I grew up in a family of seven, one bathroom, alcove tub with tiles installed on drywall, no waterproofing. Probably 50,000 showers easily in that bathroom over the decades, no water problems. Are we overthinking this about the waterproofing?

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

I'll address the second part first. Some showers like you're talking about last for years, like the one you mentioned. Others last days. You just don't know. Showers built like you mentioned, do fail. all the time. See it constantly. When you're talking about wood and water, our position is that it is good to over think things. As for your first technique, I can't visualize what you are talking about.

@troymcg 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA The schluter base already had its membrane attached, I put a second one on top, (mortared down with thinset) way you install a rubber pan liner when making a mortar bed, folded up on the sides, no cuts, so three or four inches higher than the base all the way around. Then stapled to the studs, installed the kerdi board down over the top, then sealed all the joints like normal with the kerdi band and inside corners. Basically the extra piece I added is a redundancy. It is the kerdi inside corners that made me lost sleep, now if there is wicking or even a drip through I reckon it cannot make it past the second membrane as there are no cut seams. Sorry that it not much of a better explanation.

@franciscoibarra1232 Жыл бұрын

I've started using the Ultra Lite Max Laticrete to me its perfect, the ardex is great but the 2 part isn't necessary for the Ultralite max

@Obshowersyndicate 3 жыл бұрын

I used the USG system til they stopped making them . Price was way better and they worked with modified thinset

@roberthall843 2 жыл бұрын

Personally I've been doing tile shower since I was a kid. I've seen a lot of up-to-date showers fail. But I've seen 50-year-old showers not have a crack in them or a leak. Personally don't trust schluter, but I do think there are some good aspects that can be mixed with old ways that should work out perfectly. Now I'm not saying everybody should run chicken mesh and 3 in of backing. LOL. Just kind of think it's has a feel of old cars versus new cars. They don't make up the last anymore just like everything else and I feel as if looters doing the same thing. Not got my opinion matters just an observation

@ewa2929 3 жыл бұрын

The membrane should not be the first and last line of defense.Your red guard type waterproofing is a must.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Red Quard aint for me, but point taken.

@franciscoibarra1232 Жыл бұрын

I also tend to use laticrete systems and I use the sheet Membrane but on the seams of the shower floor I also use hydro ban quick cure, it's great stuff

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

That's all good stuff!

@danbartstow9829 9 ай бұрын

All I can say is Outstanding representation of the tile trade! Thank you guys! Our trade is evolving into something that will be better for all installers to be able to sleep at night knowing there will be no callbacks for any negative issues…..👍🏻

@HamiltonTileGA 9 ай бұрын

That's what we're after! My identity is that of a worker, tradesman, craftsman business person, so, I'm gonna wear it like a badge and do my best at it, as this is where God put me. We can do good at it and graduate, but backwards can't happen!!!! Thankyou!!!

@DIYTileGuy 4 жыл бұрын

I'm pretty sure Wedi will cover the labor on their warranty. They're the only one that I know of.

@HamiltonTileGA 4 жыл бұрын

I hear they are the most slippery about their warranty. It's all hearsay never experienced a claim process though!

@Obshowersyndicate 3 жыл бұрын

What about using redguard on the seams like a 2 " swathe . When i first saw the Shulter system i thought how is water not going to soak through the seams thinset absorbs water

@SigmaDG 3 жыл бұрын

That’s what I have done.

@dustinhenry1101 3 жыл бұрын

Red guard doesn’t dry completely between layers. Watch Issac on TILE COACH he has a great video with an explanation.

@SigmaDG 3 жыл бұрын

Don't use red guard between layers. Installed the Kerdi and band as prescribed with thin set then used redguard over all the joints and everywhere where the thin set is exposed to moisture once the thin set was dry.

@PoisonJarl71501 3 жыл бұрын

I use denshield with fiber mesh tape and liquid waterproofing membrane. Never had a problem. How much is a Schluter system cost, $600 or more?

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Depends on what you're building. They have a whole line of products.

@sonofthunder. 3 жыл бұрын

its capillary action ,i used hydroban over seams in wet areas,modern systems rule ,not a fan of the hollow sounding foam pans,but they have their place,

@hamletshome220 Жыл бұрын

Been doing tile for 28 years the old fashioned way pvc liners morter beds no problems its way harder but works for us so were not changing.

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

if you do em right and don't skip steps they work great, as you know!

@Dtileandremodeling 4 жыл бұрын

Well said guys!

@HamiltonTileGA 4 жыл бұрын

Thanks Donnie!

@brendanfranklin5924 3 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the info! I use their kerdi pans for tiled bases all the time, I also use durock on the walls, tape the seams, use thinset and mesh tape, then let it dry completely. For the edges where the durock meets the kerdi pan, I use kerdi band tape, then thinset it, then let it dry. Then I go over everything with thin coats of redgard, 2-3 at the least and let it dry between coats. I flood test every pan overnight and haven't had any issues yet over the last 10 years of tiling. I like Schluter but I dont trust the pans entirely to not fail, especially when there is a human standing on it and walking around it, it will flex and the grout will eventually crack. The redgard eliminates all this

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Flood test is key. Do what you do so that you can sleep at night and stand by your work. I respect that 100%

@terepin09 Жыл бұрын

I just installed a kerdi pan with hardi backer walls. I am starting to get nervous after seeing water wick after the flood test. I was going to waterproof everything with hydro barrier until it just peels off the backer no matter how I clean it. Do you have any problems like this with 8 +9? Thinking of trying it. Help!

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

Never seen that happen with 8+9

@ragtop50 3 жыл бұрын

I used this method on my 48 x 60 shower, the corner pieces and kerdi band on the floor were installed with Ardex 8+9, and the whole thing was then coated with Ardex 8+9 for extra assurance.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

my man.

@Archangel0804 3 жыл бұрын

Kerdi Coll works extremely well. Problem is getting it here in the States. It is required in Europe. That will eventually change in the States, from what I hear. Then it won't be an issue of using Ardex 8+9

@liquidsnake6879 Жыл бұрын

It's not required in America? What do Americans use to seal the joints then? Thinset!?

@Archangel0804 Жыл бұрын

@@liquidsnake6879 Kerdi band held in place by thinset. Been using it this way for more than a decade, not a single leak yet. So it works but not the absolute best solution

@hmonster1XL 3 жыл бұрын

Try GoBoard by Johns Manville! It is more rigid, high compression (that doesn’t dent) lightweight and cheaper then Schluter or Wedi. They use a sealant for seams like Wedi so no thin set to create seams. Also they are coming out with GoBoard Pro

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Go Board is good stuff! We use it for back splashes. Have yet to use in for a shower.

@donnbialik9085 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA It's amazing for showers. Side note. Had to rip out a GoBoard install to change the shape of the stall once. The Pro Sealant caulking they sell is unbelievably strong, and infinitely waterproof. My go to system for everything.

@TileMoney 4 жыл бұрын

Coming out party 😂 good stuff

@tomdoe4295 9 күн бұрын

Setter for over 25 years, never fully trusted Kerdi water proofing. All new production homes in Idaho use Kerdi. I use Kerdifix on the banding where the walls meet the pan. The extra expense is worth the peace of mind.

@HamiltonTileGA 9 күн бұрын

Yeah, we are doing things completely differently at this point.

@justinkeppler9860 Жыл бұрын

I could be wrong but seeing as you referenced issac more than once, pretty sure he said he quit using ardex 8+9. As far as the wicking goes schluter has acknowledged 1/4" of wicking in joints which is why they require 2"over lap are seeing more than 1/4"?

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

Yes

@Nebulation 9 ай бұрын

Isaac never used it to join seams. He used it to cover the seams.

@bec5gtr 2 жыл бұрын

Can we use apex 8+9 on top of kerdi foam?

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

oh yeah.

@j.johnson8360 2 жыл бұрын

Why not float walls?

@MaxRunia 2 жыл бұрын

2 years later and CNN is actually crumbling. That was a good analogy!

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

nose diving!

@ed-gw3ov Жыл бұрын

Guess you missed Fox is about to lose 1.6 Billion dollars to Dominion Voting Systems. I don't see CNN being sued for blatant lies...

@robertmendoza4718 3 жыл бұрын

Waterproof membrane is cheaper and is waterproof and I'll never get water issues like expensive sluder system

@TheTechGuider 3 жыл бұрын

Lot more labor instensize to install tho

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

You know tile is expensive right? Do you try to be cheap? Is that something you're proud of?

@robertmendoza4718 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA my customers are tight okay

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

@@robertmendoza4718 they should be getting plastic then. Tile is a luxury.

@patrickm9366 3 жыл бұрын

Would hire these guys in a heartbeat

@michaelhartman851 3 жыл бұрын

I've never used these style of waterproofing I stick with a standard style pan using red guard and have never had a single issue with a shower and I live in California were we have lots of earthquakes, I feel your more likely to have the rubber membrane flex and move than the stuck down layer of material.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

I've started the feelings train a rolling.

@bigdog4574 2 жыл бұрын

I would agree schluter tries embers hard for their reps to be convincing but for every one good install fhere is usually three horror stories… sticking to what I know and what makes sense

@michaelhartman851 2 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA yeah your probably the one crying I've done over a hundred showers and never had a single call back so I'll keep doing what I do and you can deal with shitty foam backers that never last...😂

@tinman1955 Жыл бұрын

Schluter may be the best method for busy contractors with expensive labor and tight schedules but is it best for the DIY guy? What if I'd rather wrestle with heavy, dusty cement board and the bother of RedGarding it rather than pay a preposterous price for walls made of packing peanuts? Does Schluter system offer any advantage to me? Planning to re-do my own shower and studying the options.

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

Redguarding your shower, building with a topical waterproofing *correctly* meaning according to manufacturer standards will be just as expensive as Kerdi if you account for YOUR LABOR. We have done the math. Yeah, you can throw up some cement board and do the seams and one coat it, yeah, it'll be cheaper but that aint "correct"

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

The advantage of Schluter is it's mostly idiot proof so yeah, perfect for DIY. LOL

@tinman1955 Жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA If Schluter was idiot proof you wouldn't have made this video. But I take your point - it needs two coats of RedGard to be "correct". But you may have convinced me to use 8+9 instead. Thanks for tip. Incidentally, why don't they call it Ardex 17?

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

@@tinman1955 we call it 17!!! So funny. 8+9 is a great product, use that and you'll be good. I said "MOSTLY" idiot proof on purpose, in fact I backspaced and added it! Lol

@suspicionofdeceit 2 жыл бұрын

Schulter needs to make Kerdi-Coll available in the US, that’s the solution.

@abacab87 4 ай бұрын

The Schluter all-set doesn't wick, check Tile coach 7 (or 14, can't remember) full immersion test.

@SomeDumUsrName 3 жыл бұрын

I love some Schluter products. Their damn "waterproof" system is not one of them. You know why? BECAUSE THINSET IS NOT WATERPROOF. Never HAS been and never WILL be. What is it about that that's been so fkn hard to understand for most?!? Geesh! Personally, I don't give two cents of weight to the word of ANY setter that says that the Schluter Kerdi system is "waterproof." That's one of the stupidest statements that I've EVER heard yet, SO many not only SAY it; they BELIEVE IT.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Lot of "belief" out there on a range of topics. Humans gotta "believe" in something.

@SomeDumUsrName 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA Corporations are doing a great job of ridding the human repertoire of critical thinking. The abundance of “professional” shower builder’s calling the Kerdi system “waterproof” is great evidence of that amd one of countless examples. Did you know Schluter stopped using the term “waterproof” when describing the Kerdi system? Replaced it with “fully bonded.”

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

@@SomeDumUsrName I've heard of Schluter's change in language. It helps to understand that you're constantly being sold something or marketed to. I don't think humans are really designed for all the stimuli coming at them, so the "critical thinking" can get overwhelmed. I think we may be able to be in agreeance with "keep it simple stupid"

@SomeDumUsrName 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA That's exactly the point: "Keep it simple stupid." Forget the fancy marketing. Forget the hype. Forget the fact that it's a multi-million dollar company. The keep-it-simple-stupid FACT is that THINSET IS NOT WATERPROOF! It's amazing that there is so much back and forth with installers on this because, for me, the base fact that "thinset is not waterproof" is both the beginning AND END OF DISCUSSION.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

@@SomeDumUsrName Man, the back and forth with other installers is a dead end. I've use about 30 minutes here today LOL

@BlacGyver Жыл бұрын

I don't understand why people still use this stuff, Just like when Kerdi first came out it was the wave and set the standared...now there are other products out there. I wouldn't be looking for an explanation, i'll be looking for replacement. I just the foam cement foam boards. plenty of companies make them, and you can install and tile the same day.

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

There certainly a lot of options at this point.

@MadMax-ht8iu Жыл бұрын

Did you guys take the Schluter course before you installed it?

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

Yes. We are students of the trades. Surprised you can't tell.

@JESUSCHRISTISLORDTHEALMIGHTY 3 жыл бұрын

Why use kerdi then? Roll with durarock and 8+9 with 40 mil liner.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Schluter has good products. Kerdi is one of them. It has this ONE problem that is solved by how we install it and how they install it in Europe.

@Obshowersyndicate 3 жыл бұрын

Bring back the USG shower system

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

we used that a bit.

@joshmartin7558 Жыл бұрын

I've been in the trade over 20 years. Started when I was 15, I'm 38 now. I've used many types of thinset. Laticrete being my favorite. Saying that, I think Allset is the most unimpressive thinset I've ever used. You would think schluter would have done better. It is EXTREMELY gritty, and when you're relying on that to make a seal, it doesn't make me feel too good. I usually use Laticrete MML for all of my banding, even though it's not "schluter approved". I do however find it ironic they say you can only use modified thinset if it's their thinset. "Allset". As if allset is some type of premium, better than the rest, thinset

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

I have a similar assessment of the original and first couple trys of the all set thin set. I used some as little as 2 weeks ago, and they have improved the formula. That said, yeah, many better thin sets out there than all set. I mean if we are talking BUSINESS, schluter does some, BUSINESS. those ppl are pros.

@joshmartin7558 Жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA oh man. You arent kidding. They are raking in the bucks!

@zachrawlings6523 Жыл бұрын

Love what you're saying here. Just goes to show people really don't know what the hell they're talking about when they say they do. That's what's frustrating. Just own up to your shit

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

Trust but verify. We verified. Yeap, not engineers, not scientists...But we see what we see and we gotta stand behind our work, so it is what it is!

@zachrawlings6523 Жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA is what it is, til it ain't no more! 😂

@zachrawlings6523 Жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA I had seen/heard the same things about the euro-'coll'-version and wondered the same amount of fcuks. Sounds like you gents came up with a competent solution, so sharing your experience is much appreciated.

@johnhender 3 жыл бұрын

One trick I do now is use the 10" band for all my seams and corners I actually prefer this way now and have never had an issue with water

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

I didn't even know they had 10" band. What do they make it for?

@johnhender 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA It is in their catalog I use it on all the shower floors, seams and corners where I can now , now, it is just cheap insurance- because when a shower leaks the plumber are always blaming the tile guy or whomever installed the pan- I just went through this on. a huge 8x8 shower I did 4 years ago and of course it was a water pipe issue but everyone loves blaming the tile guy that is why I always take pictures from start finish on any shower floor I do. zI get good support from Schluter when I have a question, I trust the system but I am really careful on my installs and I let the kerdi dry at least a day or 2 before I tile

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

@@johnhender "everybody blames the tile guy" aint that the truth.

@cmbmail42 9 ай бұрын

@private8559 that's why everything should be sloped properly and 100% coverage. There shouldn't ever be standing water in your shower

@Nebulation 9 ай бұрын

Old video here, but I thought I’d say there’s many systems that use thin set for membrane, but only Schluter seems to catch the heat for it.

@HamiltonTileGA 9 ай бұрын

Good point. I've only seen the wicking with kerdi and thin set

@Nebulation 9 ай бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA Out of curiosity, do you still ardex the seams of these?

@t.caseyclarke7729 Жыл бұрын

I find it funny how all the reasons everyone is abandoning Schluter systems today, were all the concerns pros had about the product when it first came out over a decade ago. How long before there's a mass exodus from Laticrete's Hydroban systems due to the success of their products being totally dependent on a proprietary sealant in a tube. It's just a matter of time.

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

It gives me hope in man. I'm happy for the changes that come with time and experience. Great point for sure!

@andyhoms2001 Жыл бұрын

I am about to tile over a dry mortar shower pan, covered in Kerdi membrane, for a client. I did the pan liner, so that it runs up the walls, and curb at least 3 inches. The corners have Kerdi corners underneath the liner. Schluter All-Set was the mortar used. The only venerable areas are the corners. I have decided to use a narrow and small amount of Kerdi fix along the seams in those corners. Also, I am curious if the All-Set you used was mixed correctly? If it was mixed for setting tile (with less water,) instead of for setting the membrane (more water,) that could be a big problem. As I'm sure you know, the Kerdi All-Set needs to be mixed with a measured amount of H2O. This is something I almost never do with normal thin-sets. Also, I checked into the tile/thin-set adhesion to small areas of Kerdi fix. Here is the article: www.johnbridge.com/articles/showers/tiling-over-kerdi-fix/

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

Sounds like you got a lot going on there! Flood test it and tell me if it works! Yeah, the all set, we used it back when it first came out and it was a much much different thinset!

@andyhoms2001 Жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA I did the flood test already. No problem. But your video got me a little worried. Lol. And now I'm concerned about several past projects. Not because of the quality of my work. But if there is something wrong with these products. Thanks for the reply.

@JaketheRake16 3 жыл бұрын

I did a shower for a family that had 4 sons using it all on different schedules and it failed, I completely re-installed a new shower and it eventually failed as well and a rep over the phone told me the system needs to dry out in between uses and was getting too much use and was failing because it couldn’t dry out. Put in a fiberglass shower base with good ol’ Hardie Backer and RedGard and never had a problem after that.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

very interesting. Jason always says, "it's as waterproof as it has to be" obviously not, in your case.

@radman999 3 жыл бұрын

Sounds like you fucked up

@moridin73 3 жыл бұрын

we've gone to the fiberglass where the homeowner is willing to spend the money. solid mud base running 6: up the wall with wire lath and 2 coats of hydroban on top of it all. Only fail point I can see would be the drain.

@stacks04 3 жыл бұрын

I haven't used schluter in years except the moldings. I've switched to different products and methods for the floor that are so much better. Much respect for going public with this stuff so people aren't fooled.

@Gary-cq8zw 3 жыл бұрын

What products do you use

@suspicionofdeceit 2 жыл бұрын

What’s better for the floor?

@dodgeguyz 3 жыл бұрын

I’ve seen enough Shluter review and tear down videos to know I wouldn’t install anything like it. I don’t care what kind of warranty or guarantee it has, if it leaks even a little bit it’s going to damage far more. I’ll trust a rubber liner every time!

@prefersoxygen9373 3 жыл бұрын

Same here, but then again, I was using one when my son was conceived 😂😂😂😂

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

problem is most people can't handle putting in a rubber liner.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Throw those rubbers away and have a couple more. Kids are GREAT and the FUTURE.

@bradjohnson1229 Жыл бұрын

Guys... Stop and think for a moment. Do you know what kind of liability they would be opening themselves up to? Every poorly done job by every yahoo would be claimed. At best I would expect them to quietly tweak the recipe to try and fix the problem.

@jcmase72 2 жыл бұрын

Wicking is the issue and what's being wicked into the lapped joints are all the cleaning products. That's what the real issue is. I am an early installer of all Schluter products and this was the problem in question from day one.

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

interesting.

@gordonlam2757 3 жыл бұрын

So have you heard anything back from Schulter?

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

no. it's essentially "don't worry about it" we'd like to see the TCNA address it in their standards.

@hermessanchez7955 3 жыл бұрын

So if you use a system and there is something going wrong...and the company tells you "don't worry about it"...why continue using it and worse...solve the problem for them and keep using it

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

good point. They do make good products. We have this one dispute.

@zerohourinferno 2 жыл бұрын

Just use red guard over the kerdi board

@JustinMentionedIt Жыл бұрын

Seems if it’s installed right it shouldn’t leak ?

@HamiltonTileGA Жыл бұрын

That's the word on the street.

@abacab87 4 ай бұрын

That's what Isaac Ostrom says, which is why Schluter will never honor a warranty. It's not a system for the DIY, one tiny mistake and you have trouble. I think there are probably systems that are just as good and allow more for operator error. Personally I'd like to see a backup (say before the shower pan goes in) in case there is a leak.

@JustinMentionedIt 4 ай бұрын

@@abacab87 not exactly true, it comes with a book that gives all the info and detailed. not any legal mumbo jumbo and it says what you can and can’t do it’s fairly short too, iv installed a ton never has issues before

@abacab87 4 ай бұрын

@@JustinMentionedIt I've changed my views somewhat after watching more, Isaac made a lot of mistakes in his installation, which again points to very low tolerance for operator error if even a respected professional gets it wrong. This video changed my thinking: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/qeCFdMmozaemlGQ.html

@tilemonkee5510 3 жыл бұрын

All I can say is , with wedi you have a much higher performance product, and you can have your shower built,waterproofed and start tiling on DAY.ONE. Done deal. Schluter sucks, and the only people who use it are suckers for punishment . Wayyyy more work,for an inferior product.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Dude, "built, waterproofed and start tiling" on day one? For some reason I doubt that in all but a small percentage of showers. Even if you could, WHY is that something to be proud of or strive for? You're "FAST" congrats. you've denigrated the tile trade into some kind of contest in your head where SPEED is the highest virtue. You and all the other speed freaks just JONESIN to win the RACE.

@bestbid1320 3 жыл бұрын

Throw some kerdi board in a pool overnight and watch it warp pure junk in my opinion

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

hold your head under water for a couple hours and see what happens. kerdi board wasn't intended for that genius.

@donnbialik9085 3 жыл бұрын

Toss GoBoard in water.

@davegordon6943 2 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA everybody bow down to the tile guys. Acting like you actually do something important. Acting like you care about customers when in reality you're just another dipshit on you tube. Damn near every response and you're damning anybody that posts. Sure as hell doesn't come across as helpful, just high and mighty. Get over yourself. You install tile

@user-uq6vv2dz1k 4 ай бұрын

Toss denshield in water and nothing happens to it. Been using it for 20+ years not one call back. I found a scrap that got tossed in the bed of my truck over the winter and when i cleaned out my truck in the spring, after being buried in the melting snow and rain for months it was like new, execpt for a few scrapes dents, which is even more testimony to it'sdurability@donnbialik9085

@michaeltm123 2 жыл бұрын

Need to check out Build it fix it youtube chanel. It will answer all of your questions

@abacab87 4 ай бұрын

Use Schluter all-set. It doesn't wick, and Isaac Ostrom has tested it on his 7 or 14 day immersion test.

@HamiltonTileGA 4 ай бұрын

I beg to differ.

@abacab87 4 ай бұрын

It was actually a 21 day immersion test, and it held up. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/m8qcmMuo06fNnmw.html @@HamiltonTileGA

@abacab87 4 ай бұрын

kzfaq.info/get/bejne/m8qcmMuo06fNnmw.html actually a 21 day immersion test @@HamiltonTileGA

@abacab87 4 ай бұрын

kzfaq.info/get/bejne/m8qcmMuo06fNnmw.html (actually a 21 day immersion test)

@tubingtomtom 3 жыл бұрын

Okay I was with you till cnn became the topic, the I bounced...

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Just like I've heard all my life: "don't like it, change the channel." you exercised your choice. Also speaks to my CNN analogy. LOL

@josephsmontana8283 2 жыл бұрын

While that would solve the "Problem", why increase cost to "fix" an inferior product when one can just use Laticrete lightweight shower system with a lifetime warranty from the start? I,ve sold all the systems, Schluter, GoBoard, Noble, Wedi and Laticrete, Bar none, Laticrete system is the Best hands down.

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

A lot of it, for us, is availability. Laticrete is simply not available to us, but it is coming into reach recently. Laticrete is great. 100%

@rafaelrcordova171 3 жыл бұрын

Shit I just did one without 8 plus nine

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

it works, but how well.

@robertmendoza4718 3 жыл бұрын

Sluder system is tooooo expensive and profits are given to crappie sluder system

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

If you read the thumbnail, the logo, the multiple times I wrote "Schluter" you can COPY what I wrote and what you read...literally, type it out letter for letter...and you will magically be able to spell.

@groth3395 3 жыл бұрын

not thrilled watching this after installing schluter membranes on shower floor and walls and curb per schluter instructions and using their expensive "all set".....even Isaac who in one video swears by Ardex....in another "I'll never use ardex again"..it's always something....there are red guard devotees and aqua defense devotees and schluter devotees and wedi devotees...and everyone swears their way is best. Fact is, on new home construction, the tile subs throw a shower together with minimal waterproofing concerns and 5, 10 , 15 years later the homeowner has to deal with the mess. There should be some codes (other than basin membrane and leak test)..but maybe that is too restrictive. Not sure what the answer is. Bathtubs?

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

if it was flood tested and it works, and put in to their specs, it's on schluter.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

definitely code and standard modifications are in order!!!

@moridin73 3 жыл бұрын

stop letting hacks in the trade. But seroiusly have you noticed the old school wire and mud showers seemed to hold up over time.

@johnhender 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA That may be the case, but who is going to inspect the tile jobs, and there is already standards for installing in the TC&A book. I am certified in Schluter levels 1 & 2. I have lot of these systems out there and no issues. My own place has Schluter with no issues . Every tile system has a weakness. The reps are a call away and mine has never not pick up

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

@@moridin73 It weighs a million pounds and people have to work their ASSES off to install that stuff. NOT great for a remodeling scenario. There's a reason less and less people are doing it that way.

@brentdeutsche5151 2 жыл бұрын

Why are we talking about this! The system does not work, it fails! Rubber membrane poured pan, never fails!

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

I wouldn't paint with that broad of a brush.

@salpacheco2532 3 жыл бұрын

Ditch schluter. Over priced kits. Except the drain and flange kit that I use for zero entry shower stalls. Hardi backer and red guard works excellent.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

There's a lot of "excepts" with Schluter.

@joegrimes6485 3 жыл бұрын

You guys are awesome.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

thanks for the compliment! been going through the dumb and hate comments and this was very nice. GOOD MAN.

@joegrimes6485 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA I’ve been trying to figure out a system to work with and thought schluter was the way to go . Thanks for the info . Keep up the great work.

@EJEDEL 3 жыл бұрын

Elasto what? Metric?

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

jibberish

@bigdog4574 2 жыл бұрын

A schluter system just doesn’t make sense… you just can’t effectively waterproof Seams with the thin set! Even rdx doesn’t make sense …. Red guard is the best way

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

That's why we do it with Ardex 8+9. Not to mention virtually no build up. big improvement.

@bigdog4574 2 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA I’ve seen three of these fail… one with ardex and two with what appeared to be some other thinset … of course I wast the one who put them in but ardex or no ardex the water will still seep through at the joints ardex is not waterproofing

@builditwell Жыл бұрын

schluter designs things with a millimeter of failure. if that line is crossed they can blame the installer. it's like a brilliantly engineered mercedes that is one forgotten minor maintenance task away from mechanical catastrophe. they once rated ditra for exterior waterproofing. no more. its one dropped utility knife or badly mortared seam away from failure.

@Kudeghraw Ай бұрын

That is the thing about a mercedes. Just takes one missed maintenance to kill the engine. Now look at a Mazda or a Toyota. Not a good idea to miss maintenance, but those Mazdas and Toyotas can take the beating.

@mariosilva3530 3 жыл бұрын

I been demo bathroom & building in connecticut for 19 years in state of Colorado for 6 years ... The ones has the tile glued to the plaster are 20-25 years old. In colorado The ones with Schluter only 1 to year 7 year old..all this videos just confused the new generation of tile installers as I see you are so yung accusing each other in this videos.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Where do you come up with "We are accusing each other" in this video? Are we watching the same video? I know it's YOUR perception but come down to earth. To say we are "confusing" the new generation implies that people don't have a mind of their own. Half of what you said, I can't even comprehend because it doesn't even make sense. Jason has been doing tile for 23 years, my guy, so slow down.

@brianmcclelland1370 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, WEDI is the better way to go. Light weight, quicker installs, and they back their products 100%

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

We saw a wedi shower fail recently. Installer error 100%. I think wedi is a harder system to install.

@theamericanhandyman3213 2 жыл бұрын

I don't get it I just did a shower the shower curb shower pan the shower walls hundred bucks simple I do my own hot mopping 30 bucks

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

my dad worked in a shingle factory and said it was the worst job he's ever had.

@Mr.Pop0 2 жыл бұрын

I switched over to laticrete, never liked schluter. Too cheap and expensive.

@HamiltonTileGA 2 жыл бұрын

Laticrete has the right idea by getting into floor and decor...but here is the stupid part...they aren't selling the WHOLE SYSTEM. you can only get certain parts.

@danpan4425 3 жыл бұрын

Don’t shower 🤣

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

I have no idea what this means but I'm glad you made yourself laugh!!

@guerrerojaguar4619 3 жыл бұрын

Just call a real Waterproofing Pro instead of letting the Tile installers save some bucks , that will be regretted later.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

We water proof for a living. So, we are pros.

@robertsnow4593 3 жыл бұрын

Yes left in the dust a long time ago. Just another money grabbing invention🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Those pesky money grabbing inventions. Give back your computer and internet. Not necessary. another "money grabbing invention"

@robertsnow4593 3 жыл бұрын

Yes yes yes pesky. Took the words right out of my mouth. Thanx man

@radman999 3 жыл бұрын

Always the same. Lots of talk and "what ifs" and not a single documented case of failure in a properly installed example.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

If you don't like talk, stay off the chat shows. You missed the point.

@radman999 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA Sorry you can't take criticism

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

@@radman999 The point is we want an explanation from a Schluter engineer about the problems we are seeing. We never said ONE THING about a failure. What's wrong with wanting a breakdown of what we see and our concerns addressed? Here's me taking criticism and I hope you address my statement and don't GLOSS OVER what I said like you did to what we said in the VIDEO.

@radman999 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA All of the certifications and international testing is made available in the data sheets. These large companies don't have time to deal with random KZfaq channels. What is your concern? When the product is misused and incorrectly applied as a pond liner, you see moisture after a week of soaking? Come on.. The product has been used in Europe longer than you have been alive.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

@@radman999 "pond liner" we've seen this during a 24 hr test, sir. No one said anything about using it as a "pond liner" I'm a "random KZfaq channel" but I'm also a customer. My concern was addressed in the video. Sir, Did you even watch and listen to what we said in the video or are you watching Isaac's videos and coming here and creating strawmen for me burn up?

@joelbacame7423 3 жыл бұрын

Pro installers never used schluter !!!

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

hater.

@joseoviedo1644 3 жыл бұрын

@joel became Then how do you go about building a steam shower “pro installer?”

@joelbacame7423 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA no I admire you're work but I just never used schluter. Personal choice.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

@@joelbacame7423 Okay, you won me over with a nice compliment and a reasonable response....MY MAN LOL

@grimendancehall 3 жыл бұрын

Classic installers tryna figure out engineering. HEY PAL JUST FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS.. This is way out of your guys' league, no offense.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

Hey PAL, TRUST THE FOOD PYRAMID. Get your CARBS in. It's like SCIENCE and stuff. Engineering is wrong all the time, through out history and there's nothing wrong with regular people using their brains and questioning things. Henry Ford was a regular person before he changed the world.

@jimbandelean5802 3 жыл бұрын

Showers no politics

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

This is where we're at. What should be seen as an innocuous observation (and true) triggers this response. I'll say what I say (and here comes some "Politics") we'll continue to live in a country where people can state their opinions. Maybe an opinion you don't agree with, but inoffensive and innocent.

@johnwhite2576 3 жыл бұрын

No axe to grind here but discouraging to say the least that see you distracted in such an unrelated context to let your political feelings burst out. There were many more people who voted last time, on BOTH sides, and one side lost. It was an unusually polarized election, and it was easier to vote. But this one was not even close, the amount of fraud was more thoroughly investigated than any previous election , and evidence was ,to say the least , not there in over 40 courts of law, many before judges who also didn’t like the outcome. 2020 was not even close to Bush v Gore - why are you unable to move on his time and keep it out of your vocation ?

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

@@johnwhite2576 I made this video WELL before the election. Commenting on a cable channel isn't inherently political. I could use many other instances as an example. This is just what came to mind. What I said is not "unrelated" to what I was talking about in the video: A big company doesn't listen to it's consumers so people MOVE ON to something else. People are BLINDED by politics and polarization. I said NOTHING offensive or political to have you tell me about the election. YOU'RE out of "context". YOU made this video into something about an ELECTION that I couldn't care less about. 3 kids under 3 my friend. THAT's what I care about.

@BGraves 3 жыл бұрын

@@johnwhite2576 dude, you're losing your mind lol

@lrc87290 3 жыл бұрын

Wedi for me!

@Jeziorski7 3 жыл бұрын

Isn’t that like way more expensive

@lrc87290 3 жыл бұрын

@@Jeziorski7 I think so. But really easy.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

I know, solve the problem with some sealant that thinset doesn't stick to and use a really poorly designed drain.

@lrc87290 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA poorly designed drain. I'll give you that.

@Jeziorski7 3 жыл бұрын

@@HamiltonTileGA what?

@donnbialik9085 3 жыл бұрын

Once you go GoBoard, you'll never go back.

@johndavid1585 3 жыл бұрын

“FAKE” Thinset.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

What the heck are you talking about.

@mikehands61 3 жыл бұрын

Use PVC liner and you won't have any of these problems.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

the old way: the solution for the new way. I agree in many instances.

@suspicionofdeceit 2 жыл бұрын

Seen many of these “systems” fail and be torn out.

@user-uq6vv2dz1k 4 ай бұрын

But you will have mold

@mikehands61 4 ай бұрын

not if done correctly @@user-uq6vv2dz1k

@mikehands61 4 ай бұрын

@@user-uq6vv2dz1knot if done correctly

@grrinc 7 ай бұрын

I'm seeing all the failures of this plastic trash after only 3 years. Any decent tradesman should trust their gut instinct - avoid it

@HamiltonTileGA 7 ай бұрын

I like that, trust your gut. Thats good advice, Id say that's what we do, in hindsight. We tradesmen have a good practical mind a lotta times, doin the math in our heads, building person street smarts are often, "yeah, that aint right" the runaround by corporate is what put us over. Make it make sense to the tile guy!

@painterdave3614 3 жыл бұрын

Everything fails guys "everything" where theres water it will fail at some point

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

water is a BUMMER

@rafaelrcordova171 3 жыл бұрын

They suck lol cnn I mean

@BGraves 3 жыл бұрын

This is all so complicated and tedious. Fiberglass is probably just the way to go lol

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

If you can't afford to pay someone who is intelligent and gives a crap, yes.

@ginawhite7980 3 жыл бұрын

Did you seriously bash CNN in a video about a building product? Trump lost. Alex Jones is a grifter. The sky is actually blue. Lots of people trust CNN. I appreciate the product info but could definitely do without the political slant.

@HamiltonTileGA 3 жыл бұрын

A harmless, innocuous observation, depending on the mental state of the observer. All your comments are true. As is mine. It's widely acknowledged by experts that people have lost trust in ALL media and institutions as well as corporations and large companies (Schluter), leaving room for alternatives. A fact just as much as the sky being blue. My mistake not broadening my metaphor.

@Guy4UnderDog 3 жыл бұрын

Gina White: By even indirectly supporting Biden, you lose all credibility. The Republic is dead...you'll miss it.

@suspicionofdeceit 2 жыл бұрын

If you trust any mainstream media source you are a fool.

@robertdoyle240 8 ай бұрын

Trump won and you know it