In my opinion, no. You are providing constructive feedback, and it's clear from the loss of control by the red car that _they_ were going way too fast.

If you are calling the driver of the red car the victim who was racing to get ahead to go off on the 1st exit, then yes 🙂 I think the subtext to your text is that you are TELLING us that YOU are NOT victim blaming ANYTIME, when every time you give constructive advice to victims so they can learn how to do BETTER if the same situation arose in the future, in terms of how they can keep safe., certain commenters , every time , accuse you of victim blaming.

No. Since the instructor submitted the video, it is clear they were looking for analysis, and that in the full knowledge that you are an honest broker in that respect. There's a balance between blaming the victim and assessing what could have been done to avoid the incident, which you clearly said was the fault of the Citroën driver. Those with no axe to grind will now keep an eye out to avoid this same situation.

No because there wasn’t a cyclist involved 😉 Seriously though, I have had many conversations about this with people and I like to give examples that have happened to me. The first one, I had a collision many years ago, hit and run, where a driver overtook on a bend, clipped my bike and sent me flying. I have a nice scar on my knee where the brake lever went in. Technically the other drivers fault for overtaking when not safe. However I could’ve prevented it by taking a more confident line into the bend to discourage/ prevent the overtake. Do I blame myself? No. Did I learn from it? Yes. Another one is when I was driving and almost got sideswiped by another vehicle. They should’ve checked their mirrors but I shouldn’t have been camped next to them and I now drive in a staggered formation. What these examples hopefully show is the subtle difference between blame and education…what you do and most accept is education. Those that believe they don’t need to be taught anything will see it purely as victim blaming

No your not

Ashley's posted plenty of clips that prove more care is not shown around learner vehicles. Alot of drivers display much disdain towards learner vehicles wether there is a learner driving or a fully qualified driver driving

Caution? More likely impatience, rage and pettiness.

@@ts757arse Practically no one checks their blind spots either. And most people never even look at their mirrors before pulling off, changing lanes etc.

people often show less caution around learners because they view them as inferior and a roadblock

@@ts757arse hey sir this is 2024, no more jokes!!! 😡😡😡

Insurance companies don’t own the footage.

​@@ZachAsaDI think they meant instructor

​@CustardSpaceRIP our George He would definitely have some material. For what's going on in our days.

@LewisSkinner "it's great to learn from your mistakes, but much better to learn from someone else's" What a brilliant line!! You dad is wise!

yep 100% careless driving from red car

Of course the red car was at fault but the entire point of this channel is to not focus on blame but to think what all parties can do better to avoid crashes. The instructor could have done better, the danger was clear and they could have avoided the crash if they paid it more mind. It doesn't mean they are to blame, or a bad driver or anything else - it's just a good opportunity for other drivers to learn so they would avoid the, at fault, red car in a similar situation.

It was the instructors fault and of course the red cars fault. I am an ex ADI and in that situation as soon as my pupil was stationary,I would have immediately looked over my right hand shoulder to observe the flow of traffic behind and tell my pupil not to move,because of the danger. Al instructors MUST observe vehicles from behind with mirrors and check blindspots BEFORE any maneuver by their pupil.

Looks like a case of "oh shit a learner car. MUST OVER TAKE!"

driving quickly doesn't mean you are to blame, what kind of logic is that?

anyone that believes you don't need a right mirror check or blind spot check should ride a motorbike for a month and then get back to us...

I always keep in mind, "yes it slows you down a bit, but not near as much as being in a crash does."

Agread that could of easily been a rear ender

Conversely, the driver of the red car is probably nursing a growing sense of injustice.

What will the instructor do better next time though? The red car came so fast that there really wasnt any time to react.

@@SomeoneSmarter Better observations...

@@colinsmithers6961 That's easy to say but even if he had seen the red car coming could he have stopped the car quick enough for the bull in a china shop red car driver to have enough space to go across the front of the instructors car. I don't think so. The red car driver should have received a ban for dangerous driving in my opinion.

Sounds like a nice manager. A manager these days will just fire you

I have this on my daily commute. My motorway junction is one of the weird ones where both lanes go right at the roundabout. It's painted in 12 foot paint on the lanes, but there's no sign either side to repeat it, so with queueing traffic it's common that people don't see the markings. Also they're often only looking at their own lane marking. This leads to people in the right lane attempting to merge across into the left halfway round when they don't need to, and I've seen so many near misses on the one roundabout in the last 5 years, I just can't get my head around why they wouldn't put a repeat sign next to the road as well as the painted markings.

That’s very true. Some improved road arrows are cheap for councils to implement and make the junction/ roundabout more clear.

@JoPOW7 I have one near me which is two lanes to turn right, marked on the road and sign posted as well, but the exit is one lane…not even a merge in turn a short distance along. That causes a few issues as well 🤷🏻‍♂️

Exactly this. If as many cars are getting this wrong as we can see here then maybe it's time for the council to rethink the road layout

it's just a ridiculous roundabout layout

​@@gameclips5734 I agree, it's a weird layout but it's not ambiguous. The lane markings are quite clear. If you are in the right lane, you effectively have to to give way to the drivers in the left lane to leave the roundabout or else you'll be driving around for eternity. The driver of the red Citroën should have known better than to effectively change lane straight into somebody else. Having said that, I get the impression that Liverpool has much more than its fair share of entitled reckless idiots behind the wheel and this might just have been one of them. IMHO the only real fault with Ash's instructor was not sufficiently taking into account the wilful ignorance of the other drivers.

Sometimes theres no markings and just a sign.

Happened to my sister on her 2nd or 3rd lesson, first go ahead roundabout! Didn't drive again for a few years.

@@oliverlane9716 If it is not your mistake, carry on learning , noting that others can make errors and sometimes having to allow them to drive wrongly to avoid an incident

@@highpath4776 she has a lot of issues with anxiety and was a very nervous reluctant learner anyway. It spooked her badly that something could just happen for no reason. However eventually she did get back and did an intensive course. I think that was better for her nerves

I think this was an instructor doing everyday driving (not with a student) though I may be wrong

Think you are right.@@lwo7736

Definitely. And imagine if it had been a cyclist instead of a driving school car. Lack of caution on roundabouts throws a heavy burden on the rest of us.

on US dashcam channels, I often find myself pointing out it's a roundabout, not a racetrack.

@@kenbrown2808 Americans are more obsessed with "my right of way" than just avoiding the collision by just yielding

I said the same thing but in a comment similar in length to war and peace, it has exits set up so you are crossing the path of people turning left, which seems bonkers to me.

@@dorianleakey If you find yourself in the right lane and you're unwilling to give way to anyone then you're condemned to drive round and round forever! A cruel joke. Whoever designed this junction should really change profession from road engineer to comedian.

"hidden by all the metal work and blind spots" cars have rear view and wing mirrors for a reason...

I think I have heard this somewhere before…if only I can remember where…

@@smilerbob Ashley really should adopt this as a slogan shouldn't he.... ;)

a clear violation of the Pauli Exclusion Principle.

To be honest, that fits with using the left lane to go straight on with the physical shape of this roundabout and two lanes at the exit in question. You are crossing the path of people just going the correct way the layout of the roundabout suggests, sure we know we are meant to be in the left lane when going straight ahead on a roundabout, but physically this roundabout doesnt support that. It needs markings to discourage that.

But that's normal, I intentionally make sure I pass the pedestrian and then stop and hold (even if there is a gap for me to go) exactly where the pedestrian needs to walk behind me so that they can cross if I stop short then (let them cross in front) cars on the other Lane are most likely just going to simply drive past and then potentially putting the pedestrian at risk Pedestrians expect this especially at roundabouts, anything els just confuses them why you have stopped and makes them rush

Most UK roundabouts are round. But there are many variations! Spiral, mini, shaped etc etc.

I suspect the red Citroën driver was driving 'on autopilot', not really paying attention and missed the indicator on the learner car. Either that or they're a reckless entitled POS. Tertium non datur.

Glad someone else said this, its bonkers.

Yes but local knowledge should also tell you these type of accidents happen here. Then again a local would probably use the right lane to go straight as most people using the left are going left

We're muddling through, I'm just waiting on the repairers to get the new front offside wing and bumper for my imported Buick Encore, which although very similar to the Vauxhall/Opel Mokka, is subtly different forward of the A-pillar, so they're going to have to be sourced from the US. My delightful other half managed to get her hand caught in the wheel while turning right and sideswiped a granite wall 🥴Fortunately it's still driveable and will still be ok for its MOT next month, but it's annoying just the same 🙄 Above all, no-one was hurt, that's the main thing.

@@TestGearJunkie. Wow, sorry to hear that but the main thing as you mentioned is that no one was hurt. Hope you get the required parts quickly from the USA and that repairs can be done in a timely manner. That's an intruiging American import you have there. I'm well aware of the Opel / Vauxhall connection with Buick here in the USA where I currently am. In fact, just yesterday here in Bellevue WA, I saw a Buick Regal which is the US equivalent of the Vauxhall Insignia. On the subject of imports, even importing a car from the USA to Canada involves considerable work. For example: Speedometer and mileometer have to be converted to kph & kilometers. Headlight power is also slightly different. All labels on the car have to be changed to be in both English and French, Canada's two official languages. And various paperwork for taxes and duties plus a full safety inspection. I'd imagine also your Buick is a left hand drive? And a rear number plate that's almost square to fit into the American sized slot? Plus all kinds of other modifications, especially lights. Do you get it serviced at a Vauxhall dealership? I'd imagine they do a bit of a double take. On the subject of imports, around Vancouver Canada I've seen a few Japanese right hand drive imports. Made me think I was back in the UK for a while. Although not an import. I would love to have a very last shape Saab 9-5. They can be picked up at surprisingly reasonable prices but spare parts can be quite an issue. I was talking to a 9-5 owner on the Saab stand at the NEC Classic Car Show last November and they mentioned if he ever needs a new windscreen, it might br a big issue. Gorgeous car in my opinion but the spares issue would worry me. Anyhow I'm sure your Buick will be back to normal soon.

@@ibs5080 I came by it in a strange way. I'd always (for some weird reason) wanted to try driving LHD in the UK and I found a dealer that specialises in them. Most of his stock are European cars which he sells to people moving to France, Spain or wherever, but sometimes he comes across interesting ones like the Buick. It was brought into the country by a serviceman in the US Air Force at Mildenhall in 2015 and it only had 31,500 miles on it when I bought it in May last year. I haven't had it long enough for it to need a service yet but it's due its MOT next month so it will go into a local garage. The local Vauxhall dealers didn't want to know, as they couldn't find the model in their database, but the place I'm going to has a little more common sense than that..! The number plates are indeed US sized, but that's an allowable exception to the UK rules as being an imported car, UK sized plates simply won't fit. The front lights are slightly different as well, there's a blue component to them that the MOT guy was a bit worried about, but the local DVSA inspector said that while it wouldn't be permitted on a UK model, it's acceptable as it's an imported vehicle. Just as well, it's passed all its MOT tests since it's been in the country..!

They were going way too fast for the situation in any case. I doubt they did it on purpose, as at the very least it would have been a partial blame accident (and as it happened they got the full blame).

The Red car deffinatley do deliberately. More just going through through the motions and not taking in what's happening, tunnel vision

I definitely agree that speed is a factor and for me I really disagree with very fast passing speeds as this means there are so many ways for accidents to happen

Eloquently put, as ever, Pedro.

Absolutely, my mantra is 'inappropriate speed equals less time to see, react & stop'​@@wallace-bv4rl

There are many with two exit lanes that merge in a fairly short distance, sometimes on rising gradients as well. At those junctions, it pays to assess what is in the left one to decide what to do.

I agree fully, stopping for the pedestrian at that roundabout like you did was dangerous Ashley. You made no allowance for the stupidity of others and you put the lady waiting to cross at risk by putting her under pressure to cross!

They love roundabouts near the Wirral

Be careful on Merseyside Roads, Red Lights, some people think they’re optional. 🤦‍♂️

Try Birmingham if you really want some fun (not) 🥴

This junction should really be a turbo-style roundabout, where lane 1 only leads to the first exit and lane 2 everywhere else. It would be so much safer!

@@filipkonopacki1547 yes, very true. I don't recall layouts like these back in my early days of driving. Common sense protocols seem to have been thrown out of the window in many cases.

Yes, plenty of roundabout designs seem to cause potential conflict by their very nature! Slower speed definitely helps as the red car proves. Personally, I avoid exiting to a second lane when I can, to try & avoid the situation. If there are vehicles to my nearside then I have to exit into lane 2, so you risk someone in lane 1 suddenly overtaking into your nearside, or the dreaded 'in left lane but continuing on roundabout' crash!

Never assume anything. You'll almost always be wrong.

🤦‍♂️😂

which does add to the fact it wasn't seen. Probably wasn't there one second and was the next.

They certainly can be wrong. Also, most roundabouts only have painted arrows on the approach rather than signs, not much use if they are covered by queuing traffic!