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Audiophile Roundtable Discussion: Original Vinyl vs Audiophile Vinyl repress + Some crate dig gems!

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Steve Westman

Steve Westman

Күн бұрын

Please join your host Steve "The Audiophile" Westman with Audiophile roundtable's Tim "University of Vinyl" Tolbert and Norman "Mazzy" Maslov:
The boys discuss:
Original Pressings vs. Audiophile represses. What offers more bang for you buck? Do you really need every pressing?
Steve does a little Vancouver record store crate digging. Find out what he found. Any Gems?
Tim does a crate dig in Denver. Find out what he found.
Mazzy compares some of his Originals pressings with his MOFI pressing. Find out which ones he think sounds better.
Please much more.

Пікірлер: 140
@christopher.cordova
@christopher.cordova Жыл бұрын
Shoutout to Mazzy for keeping his friend’s memory alive. You’re a good dude, sir.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
👍
@ConcertBuddie
@ConcertBuddie Жыл бұрын
Tim and Mazzy are great. Always enjoy hearing their POV’s on the hobby.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Yes. They are awesome.
@mazzysmusic
@mazzysmusic Жыл бұрын
Kiss ass 🤠😎🤓 thank you Chance 🕊️
@franksmusic2880
@franksmusic2880 Жыл бұрын
Great discussion, I hope to see you guys do more of these talks..👍
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Much appreciated. Happy you enjoyed it.
@latheofheaven
@latheofheaven Жыл бұрын
The BC Beatles box as Mazzy (the masher!) says, is completely random as far as which individual albums you are getting, although most are very good as you said. For me, I was able to score from a nice Steve Hoffman member an individual very early (1971-1973) Parlophone 2-box stereo Revolver with the Gramophone rimtext which was tube-cut, and it sound amazing and is very clean. THAT is the best way to get the early Parlophone 2-boxes that sound the best, however, the later ones in the BC box are still usually very good. It's just not guaranteed exactly which pressings you are getting.
@brettnelson5091
@brettnelson5091 Жыл бұрын
Love today's show, any guest gives great insight and information, always like learning about pressing and what is a great pressing ect. keep up the great work, Regards from New Zealand.
@nicholassheffo5723
@nicholassheffo5723 Жыл бұрын
Because outstanding videos like this, people can realize how many great, older pressings out there for low prices while they last at discount stores and the like. Thanks again guys!
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Thanks so much.
@The_Music_Sanctuary
@The_Music_Sanctuary Жыл бұрын
Great round table Steve, enjoy the weekend...cheers ✌️
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Much appreciated. You too brother.
@jeffcaudill5467
@jeffcaudill5467 Жыл бұрын
I would like to point out that if all the Audiophiles got together and agreed on what pressing sounds best that would end the vc. I guess you could talk about music😊
@mazzysmusic
@mazzysmusic Жыл бұрын
Yeah what a concept 🎉
@RF-lz9cd
@RF-lz9cd Жыл бұрын
I bought the Grateful Dead American Beauty from Rhino AAA by Chris Bellman for $30 CAD instead of the Mofi $100 CAD!! I’m glad I did because also I bought the debut album of the Grateful Dead AAA CB from Rhino also for $30 and I still had money to spare. Glad I didn’t bite at the Mofi. Both those Rhino albums also came in thick single sleeve Stoughton jackets. More labels need to learn from what Rhino has done in the past with fantastic AAA pressing and packaging for non-audiophile prices. Kudos to Rhino
@jasonarsenault3791
@jasonarsenault3791 Жыл бұрын
Great work fellas. Love the topic.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Thanks Jason.
@Bootradr
@Bootradr Жыл бұрын
I was another of the badly dinged corner customers of Rhino. They should have known better. Thankfully it was only one corner and I'm not going to fool with it because it sounds like too much of a hassle. I never could even get a tracking number to see when it was coming? It just showed up about 3 or 4 days ago. I don't know if my packaging was from the first generation that everybody was having problems with or from a second generation, supposedly upgraded packaging. But either way it had no protection inside and it was just the cheap box. If I remember right the box wasn't even dinged but the corner most definitely was on the record sleeve! Thankfully it sounded good. Brian in Fort Worth 🎶
@scottwheeler2679
@scottwheeler2679 Жыл бұрын
I love the idea of artists' entire catalogues being released on these most deluxe reissues. If it's an artist I love there's a good chance I'm getting them all.
@MrLovell1971
@MrLovell1971 Жыл бұрын
Another Great talk guys I think those one steps and UHQR are going to continue to decline because people are definitely looking at their wallets . So many jazz reissues I began to become very selective I have many duplicates and I’m beginning to trade and sell the ones that doesn’t sound to my liking . Steve , Mazzy and Tim you guy were on point with what is important in vinyl collecting. Lovellandrew
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Thanks so much for watching.
@seannryon
@seannryon Жыл бұрын
Great channel, Steve!
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Thanks Sean. Much appreciated.
@marcjohnson9270
@marcjohnson9270 6 ай бұрын
Good chat. I think you've found the right blend of guests. Any more than three or four is too much. Tim is the "working man's" audiophile.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 6 ай бұрын
Thank you. That one was a while ago.
@thevinylbeadollsweetheart7356
@thevinylbeadollsweetheart7356 Жыл бұрын
Great chat. Steve Hoffman would be a fantastic guest.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
He has not said no to me but maybe at a later date 🙏
@taralewis9916
@taralewis9916 Жыл бұрын
Love these round table discussions
@babylemonade2868
@babylemonade2868 Жыл бұрын
My favourite looking record label is the yellow harvest labels. Cool video
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Thank you.
@jptabja
@jptabja Жыл бұрын
Not all originals are the same. For example, I am a Genesis fan and many of my best sounding Genesis albums are from Italy. I have Trick of The Tail UK 1st press, Germany 1st press, US 1st press, France 1st press and Italy 1st press and the Italian press is the best. Bottom line it is important to understand the end to end process of producing a vinyl record which starts from the recording, mastering for vinyl and lacquering facility/lacquer cut, stamper version, pressing plant (today Pallas and RTI are probably the best plants but in the past there were many more) and vinyl material. All these factors have an impact on the final result. My understanding of the process to produce a vinyl record back in the 70s 80s is the following: Master tapes of the songs were delivered to the mastering process. During the mastering process the Mastering Engineer transfer the tapes to the lacquer (doing adjustments for optimal playback) and at the same time a tape was generated (exactly the same as the 1st lacquer). For example in the case of Genesis this happened in a London facility. First press of the LP release is using stampers generated from this lacquer. But what was distributed to US, Canada, Italy, France...worldwide? At that time, copies of the tape (the one that is exactly as the lacquer) were distributed worldwide. When the tape arrived to any country the record company of the country used the tape to create their own lacquer and stampers and pressed the Lps using their pressing plants / technology and vinyl quality. In the US sometimes happened a slightly different process. For example Robert Ludwig mastered an LP at Masterdisk but Masterdisk actually created the stampers for distribution to different plants in US and sometimes abroad (to Canada, UK, Japan). In this case the only difference will be the pressing plant and quality of vinyl. Bottom line....many things to explain in the process of producing a vinyl record. To confirm this I will provide another example. Camel, also one of my favorite bands, released an album in 1984 (Stationary Traveler) . The recording of the album was outstanding. However I got my copy from the UK and the sound was OK but you noticed the cheap quality of the vinyl (by that time in the UK were pressing a lot from recycled material). Some time later I managed to get a copy from Holland/Netherlands and it was day and night. Amazing sound. Again..in this case my best version of Camel - Stationary Traveler is the one from Holland (by the way, I have the Canadian and German version and none beats the Holland pressing). Bring Steve Hoffman, Bob Ludwing, Bernie Grundman to explain all this! Thanks!
@johns126
@johns126 Жыл бұрын
Very interesting chat - learned a lot. Very impressed with your “Church” pick up being an Aussie myself. When I was younger I mainly shunned Aussie artists and focused on UK and US bands/artists. I am now slowly catching up with Aussie output and loving it. I would recommend Richard Clapton, The Sunnyboys and Paul Kelly.
@analoguecity3454
@analoguecity3454 Жыл бұрын
I feel you on those bad distorted pressings Steve, I have quite a few! I wanna know why also! But I think the stamper is like the bottom of a shoe! While new , the shoe makes very sharp and detailed imprints on the mud! But 10 years down the line, the bottom of the shoe is all worn to a point you don't recognize it anymore! The print in the mud will reflect that! I hope that makes sense! 😊😅
@therealdonelaitis
@therealdonelaitis Жыл бұрын
Found a NM Beatles BC-13 box, 1982 UK press, at a local record store in Seattle for a super fair price. Couldn’t be happier.
@gvaldes
@gvaldes Жыл бұрын
.....absolutely agree with Mazzy concerning ABRAXAS
@sidesup8286
@sidesup8286 Жыл бұрын
RE: Early Mobile Fidelity lps (late 1970$ to mid 1980s). These things are consistent versus the original regular pressing lps. 1. Mofi sound is sharper. This does have something to do with the Mofi tipped up treble 2. Original regular lp will have deeper tone colors. Something in the Mofi chain was resulting in a drier sound with bleached tone colors. This could be anything from cables use to anything really. Listen to the tone colors on the Mofi & regular press. The regular press (especially in the midrange) will have tone colors that are more varied, deep and more vibrant 3. Mofi ; quieter vinyl. 4. Regular pressing will have better spatiality. More open sounding on the regular pressing. Half speed mastering was most effective at cleaning up the highs; least effective at preserving phase timing which openness and soundstaging are dependent on. Some say half speed mastering destroys spatiality. 5. Mofi will have more extended upper treble and lower bass. It's boosted so it sounds more impressive. 6. Fuller midrange with more presence on the regular pressings. Mofi did their own EQ, not being faithful to the original. Only one Mofi have I ever seen on the old The Absolute Sound Super Disc List, which went many pages long, too long for them to still publish the list with printing costs I guess. Slowhand by Clapton was the one album that made the list. Bad cd mastering on Clapton I've tried on that format. So Mofi lps (the early ones) were a mixed blessing. All the above qualities are consistent, no matter what album. Their smiley face eq with sharp sound worked better on some music than others. I liked Fleetwood Mac, Waiting For Columbus, Dark Side, Finger Paintings, Aqualung, Slowhand, Aja, Year Of The Cat, Cosmos Factory, Crime Of The Century, Katy Lied and some others. It was a tough choice sometimes, whether to spend the extra $10. Accuracy isn't everything, I guess. Have no idea how their later expensive pressings sound. You will come away more confused than when you started on what pressing on Hoffman forums.
@dank.6942
@dank.6942 11 ай бұрын
Broad generalization: the jazz reissues (vs. original pressings) are easily worth it to me because they were often EQ'd for old-school phonographs, and are hard to find in great shape nowadays. For pop and rock, I'm blessed to have a local shop that has a ton of OGs, reasonably priced, so I'll seek them first (over reissues) but for huge, legendary albums, I appreciate the reissues for the ability to find clean pressings.
@latheofheaven
@latheofheaven Жыл бұрын
BTW, FWIW, the sonics of the 2-45 Analog Production pressings of Jeff Beck's Wired, Herbie Hancock's Headhunters, and Ted Nugent's S/T are frigg'n OUT OF THIS WORLD AMAZING! And, yes, all the MFSL pressings of Miles sound fantastic!
@dcrook232323
@dcrook232323 Жыл бұрын
100% concur.
@terrykeenan4308
@terrykeenan4308 Жыл бұрын
Really enjoying these roundtable conversations. Regarding the issue with The Cars, it’s been over a week and I’m still waiting for mine. Hopefully that means they are packaging better. A great find on that Church album, I would love to get my hands on that one. I just picked up my 50th anniversary Tom Waits Closing Time from my local shop in black vinyl, and it sounds great!
@ianmelville452
@ianmelville452 Жыл бұрын
I think you are correct that some of the less often discussed audiophile record labels should get more press. They often bring high quality re pressings and are much more affordable. Speakers Corner, Pure Pleasure and Impex great work. Also and since you know Kevin Gray well can you ask him what his top 20 albums he has mastered to be please? I just think it would be very interesting.
@davidpetersen7091
@davidpetersen7091 Жыл бұрын
I "ENJOY" your conversations. Thanks! Mr. Pete----------> aging hippie
@robertendsley8312
@robertendsley8312 Жыл бұрын
Don Henley - Building The Perfect Beast
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Good album. Thanks.
@jameshogg11
@jameshogg11 Жыл бұрын
People I'd enjoy seeing on the roundtable in no particular order: Steve Guttenberg, Paul Rigby (The Audiophile Man), Tom Port again, Scott from The Pressing Matters, Guido from Ana-dia-log, Ron Beaudry. There's a few for you to go and contact ☺
@dcrook232323
@dcrook232323 Жыл бұрын
Charles Barkley would be the best!! 😉
@jameshogg11
@jameshogg11 Жыл бұрын
I have another suggestion for guests... Get Miles Showell and Kevin Gray on the same roundtable to have a discussion about half-speed mastering 🙂
@LifelongMusicJunkie
@LifelongMusicJunkie Жыл бұрын
Both my new Rhino High Fidelity editions had seam splits, and even the inner sleeve of the Coltrane was split. Ironic that I put in in a MOFI sleeve since they are the notorious seam-splitters!
@latheofheaven
@latheofheaven Жыл бұрын
I KNOW bloody well that Mazzy was indeed a hitman and I'm terrified!!! 😲😳
@tdow5677
@tdow5677 Жыл бұрын
Hello guys, let me start off about how I enjoy watching the roundtable videos on Saturday mornings. It starts my weekend off on the right foot, or ear in this case. I wanted to know if the group could talk about import pressings vs. U.S. pressings? I would like to start collecting imports and your input could really help me (and I am sure other collectors) find better quality pressings than U.S. or other country's pressings. I know that the first English pressings of certain bands like Black Sabbath, Pink Floyd and Zeppelin are usually better than the U.S. pressings but they cost a small fortune on Discogs for VG+. Are there any imports out there that best the U.S. pressings that cost $40-$50 plus shipping out there? I have read on the Hoffman forums that the Canadian pressing of Led Zeppelin III is one of the best out there, have you happened to hear that one Steve? That copy also costs a pretty penny in VG+ condition, but to me might be worth it if it is THAT good. Also, do you think that the Hoffman forums and other like minded forums drive the prices up of discussed "best pressings"? I think this might be a good conversation for your group of knowledgeable people to discuss. Have a great week fellows, and I will be watching for your next video.
@F1fletch
@F1fletch Жыл бұрын
Enjoying these round table discussions. Just chiming in here, I do NOT like the whole 45rpm push and these $150 Steely Dan records are a great example. Why aren’t we getting 33’s first? I think some labels are getting a little greedy. A properly cut 33 can sound almost as good as a 45. I really, really appreciate Rhino’s approach to audiophile pressings, focus on doing the best you can with 33’s mastered by the best engineers and keep them at 5k. I hope MoFi and AP come around to Rhino’s way of thinking to be honest and that’s just my opinion. On MoFi, I totally agree with what Steve said about some of the pressings from the 80’s from MFSL. These are simply some of my best sounding records…full stop. And finally I am fascinated by the whole mother, father, how many can be made before the master lacquer is no longer good enough. I often here that metalwork is used from previous remasters, does that mean they make a new mother/father from the master lacquer or are stamper left over….I have heard that 5k is about the most you want to stamp before replacing the metalwork. A great topic!!
@dennispaulik3206
@dennispaulik3206 Жыл бұрын
The Intervention Records Peter Frampton vinyl set is limited to 2500 and they have committed to changing stampers every 500 copies. Release date expected late July. One of you needs to get the intervention Records CEO on this round table or your own channel (Mazzy?)
@anthonyburke223
@anthonyburke223 Жыл бұрын
You Canadians and Americans are lucky …in Australia the old Australian record pressings we’re dubious quality…and drunk Australians in the 70’s and 80’s trashed them .
@love2spinvinyl
@love2spinvinyl Жыл бұрын
100% agree. I’ve been slowly upgrading my Aussie first pressings to UK or US first pressings, but my Oz quadraphonic first pressing of DSOTM is awesome.
@Wreckords-Marcel
@Wreckords-Marcel Жыл бұрын
I think we will have a decrease in reissues by the audiophile reissue labels like Mofi and AP. However, we will have more audiophile reissues in general because of labels stepping up and doing it in house (craft, Rhino, blue note, maybe sony?). I think this may have been partially by these Mofi and AP pushing the one steps/UHQR opening the market for more reasonably priced audiophile reissues.
@festersuncle6298
@festersuncle6298 Жыл бұрын
Rubber Soul MOFI sounds huge to me. I love it. Especially Norwegian Wood. The "C" series from the 80's are great sounding too.
@dcrook232323
@dcrook232323 Жыл бұрын
Good stuff guys; entertaining, cogent discussion but I expect nothing less from your triad.👍 I can't echo enough, your comments, at ~12min mark!! Moreover, you three VC publishers particularly understand & must have the patience of Job on the subject!? Is probably MY "nails on the chalkboard"😖 VC proclamation on vinyl forums and/or YT Comments, etc. for a decade+. Which is that, THEIR OG LP or reissue LP or pressing is absolutely the best or the worst version and all others' LP(s) are absolutely in error. When the reality is of course there's no more varible and/or falible music playback device than our beloved TT player or TT system.👍 Continue to remind the younger/newer VC followers to enjoy & play their vinyl music versus collecting & complaining! 👍
@mahabkhatib9377
@mahabkhatib9377 Жыл бұрын
I received Rhino albums (The Cars and John Coltrane) over 2 weeks ago. I had the same issue as Tim with 2 corners damaged on the Cars jacket. I reached out to Rhino that same day I received them, I got the link to email another department which I did. The vinyl is in a great shape and the sound is incredible, so I requested a replacement jacket, the way Acoustic Sounds (AP) or Impex do, but no response so far after I sent pictures of the damage. I hope Rhino would resolve this issue. I won’t send back the vinyl unless I get another in as good condition. I would get originals always, but I love music and good sound so I don’t mind buying good reissues, especially if the sound is like The Cars (Kevin Gray’s), the Harvest, and Rumours. I agree with you about the comparison. There’s no need to compare if you’re enjoying the music, the sound is breathing in your room and you’re engaged in the listening experience. By the way, the reissue of Calexico is amazing, very enjoyable. The ECM (Luminescence Series) is wonderful and deserve the attention. Thank you for the fun video and the great shares!
@LPfingstag
@LPfingstag Жыл бұрын
Steve Albini would be fun
@mymixture965
@mymixture965 Жыл бұрын
"It is the system stupid". Mazzy has B&W speakers, I have Sonus Faber, so most what Mazzy say about sound I have to be careful. The system and the room can change everything. I have a dedicated Mono system, guess what, the old mono jazz records always sound better than the reissues on MY system.
@LPS-R-US
@LPS-R-US Жыл бұрын
Great round table. I was one of the first to post on rhinos poor packaging. I bought three CARS LPS, and they were shipped 3 in an Amazon type box loose. It's very perplexing given its RHINO.
@hi-fidelityrecords
@hi-fidelityrecords Жыл бұрын
Love it 👏🏼
@mccarthyd6603
@mccarthyd6603 Жыл бұрын
Good stuff guys👍 In the minority...but everytime I finish watching these podcasts and listening to Tim, I can't wait to go out and get my hands dirty crate digging, searching for minty OG pressings and checking out dead wax and runouts....no interest at all in these new reissues.....cheers boys 🍺👍🍸
@rixvspinner
@rixvspinner Жыл бұрын
That's the way to go if you can. It's a real find when you get those unexpected OG's like the Rubber Soul Parlophone mentioned in Steve's video- $15 USD, bargoon.
@bklynbass
@bklynbass Жыл бұрын
Sorry, Steve that’s not an original Giant Steps! An OG stereo would have a blue and green label similar to Mazzy’s Rascals LP… in any case thanks for the great discussion.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Yes. I know now. Thanks. Still sounds pretty good.
@tdow5677
@tdow5677 Жыл бұрын
Hi Steve, have you reached out to Eddie Kramer? He has some great memories of recording Hendrix, Zeppelin, and a ton of other artists. I have had the pleasure of meeting him a few times, and he is a great guy.
@andysmusicden
@andysmusicden Жыл бұрын
Interesting discussion. From a collector point of view it’s more interesting to have an original, but for 50-60’s jazz I go for the audiophile reissues. The originals are simply too expensive. For other genres it’s a mixed bag for me. If it’s a very pricey original and there is a well mastered reissue, I go for the reissue. I do the research, look in my wallet and take it from there. I don’t have multiple copies of records, with very very few exceptions. I’d rather spend my money on titles that are new to me. Having said all this, a large number of records in my collection are only pressed in one version. I don’t have to chose.
@davidpetersen7091
@davidpetersen7091 Жыл бұрын
Mine were both fine. Mr. Pete----------> aging hippie
@billa5289
@billa5289 Жыл бұрын
It sure would be nice if everyone who buys an audiophile pressing would then release one of their other copies on the used market. Why do you need a bunch of copies? Pick your favorite 1 or 2 and let the rest go on the used market. It would help the market immensely if collectors weren't hoarders, right?
@dcrook232323
@dcrook232323 Жыл бұрын
Watcha about to sell from your LP music collection?
@LPfingstag
@LPfingstag Жыл бұрын
Please have Mazzy and M45 on at the same time 😂😂😂
@mazzysmusic
@mazzysmusic Жыл бұрын
🎉🎉🎉
@ConcertBuddie
@ConcertBuddie Жыл бұрын
(Monster truck rally voice) ONLY ON PAY-PER-VIEW!
@Dbriskit
@Dbriskit Жыл бұрын
Get Chris Bellman on the show. Only seen him on one other channel and he was great value.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Ok. Will reach out.
@revelry1969
@revelry1969 Жыл бұрын
The problem with the recent Beatles stuff is the Miles 1/2 speed mastering. They stink. The digital version sounds better. If they had cut at full speed with a quality engineer like Bernie or Mr. Gray would have been much better
@mccarthyd6603
@mccarthyd6603 Жыл бұрын
The Half Speed Abbey Road Rolling Stones reissues are the worst sounding of this process in my opinion.....Sticky Fingers and Exile on Main Street need a MAJOR reissue upgrade 🙏🙏🙏🙏
@nandopelusi7699
@nandopelusi7699 Жыл бұрын
I have five different copies of Elton John's CARIBOU. The sound quality varies: In ascending order, with the worst being the new Mercury pressing, then a US original, a German original, a Pickneyville pressing, and a Japanese pressing. The Japanese best of all. The worst sound from streaming Apple Music.
@gerardfletcher1203
@gerardfletcher1203 Жыл бұрын
great conversations gents loved it need tracy chapman and early joan armatrading show some emotion
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Thanks so much. I just played my original Tracy Chapman last night. Incredible record.
@scottwheeler2679
@scottwheeler2679 Жыл бұрын
Vinyl thickness is significant depending on the turntable. Thinner records are more susceptible to the effects of the platter of the TT. The thicker vinyl is some what more immune to it.
@user-yk4gd1fl4z
@user-yk4gd1fl4z Жыл бұрын
????
@RockNRod.
@RockNRod. Жыл бұрын
Mazzy, runs the West coast mafia, lol.
@analoguecity3454
@analoguecity3454 Жыл бұрын
Everyone hates the led zepplin 2014 reissues, I never had a problem with em except it has an annoying "overly neat" sound to it! But someone ask me "they sound decent to you? , compared to what?" That's my point, this is the only time I heard it on LP, and it's certainly better than the CD (my opinion only) because the source is higher resolution 96k/24bit! The CD can only capture up to 44.1k/ 16bit! The point is I've only heard led zepplin on CD and cassettes before this reissue, I have nothing to compare it to! I don't have earlier pressings, because I don't want to spend a couple hundred dollars on it (I can't actually), and I don't want to spend $30 on a "beat to death" copy!
@devnull1313
@devnull1313 Жыл бұрын
No complaints here about availability of AAA factory fresh vinyl at the "reasonable" price of $40. Mofigate was all about: "You can't do more than 5000 copies from analog masters!!" So, here we are.
@scottwheeler2679
@scottwheeler2679 Жыл бұрын
UK London Decca and EMI classical were using plastic inner sleaves starting back in the early 60s
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
I hate those paper sleeves they used here in North America.
@scottwheeler2679
@scottwheeler2679 Жыл бұрын
@@stevewestman7774 The U.S. Londons were terrible in every way.
@mazzysmusic
@mazzysmusic Жыл бұрын
Yeah Classical labels frequently used them.
@FleagleSangria
@FleagleSangria Жыл бұрын
Steve, is there anyway you can ask someone at Rhino who mastered the Alice Cooper? Are they new masterings or the 2017 Chris Bellman masterings. Thanks.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
I certainly can. The Rhino Killer album that came out in 2020. Was mastered by Randy Kling and the lacquers cut by Chris Bellman.
@FleagleSangria
@FleagleSangria Жыл бұрын
@@stevewestman7774 Thanks Steve, curious if they just used the Bellman cuts or if these new Deluxe "School's Out" and "Killer" are remastered and recut by other mastering engineers and who they are.
@audiotomb
@audiotomb Жыл бұрын
I never had an album with non-fill in it from the 1970s-1980s
@mahabkhatib9377
@mahabkhatib9377 Жыл бұрын
I would invite Hoffman with Gray together, Steve might be convinced to share his experience, if Kevin is there or talk him into it.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Hmmmmm. Interesting 🤔
@dangaucher2245
@dangaucher2245 Жыл бұрын
Steve have you been to Apollo Music in Poco? I think i have talked to you there a few years back!
@robertnitsche8410
@robertnitsche8410 Жыл бұрын
I ordered both Rhino Cars and Coltrane 6 days ago, and haven't received any shipping notification yet. I was wondering after your last video if there might be a shipping delay to correct some issues.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Hmmm maybe. I just got mine 2 from Rhino last Wednesday. Both had no issues.
@robertnitsche8410
@robertnitsche8410 Жыл бұрын
@@stevewestman7774 That's encouraging. Did Rhino send you a notification when they shipped?
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
@@robertnitsche8410 yes I got an email saying it’s been shipped.
@bautistarafa70
@bautistarafa70 Жыл бұрын
Scorpion 12 lp
@gonzaljevic
@gonzaljevic Жыл бұрын
What is the record that mazzy first started talking about?
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Little Feat’s Waiting for Columbus.
@Licoricedisc
@Licoricedisc Жыл бұрын
Shoot outs can never be very accurate just from the fact that you can even take multiple examples from the same release and find that they can sound different....
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
I have done a bunch of shootouts on my channel. It can all be so subjective. The room, the gear etc.
@tomdemaline8869
@tomdemaline8869 Жыл бұрын
Is the reissue Revolver better than the OG?
@mazzysmusic
@mazzysmusic Жыл бұрын
Nope
@dennispaulik3206
@dennispaulik3206 Жыл бұрын
Invite Shane Buettner, CEO Intervention Records. Very accessible in my experience. He personally responds to my emails and I am just a customer.
@scottwheeler2679
@scottwheeler2679 Жыл бұрын
That's not an original Coltrane Giant Steps. That's a 70s reissue
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
Thanks Scott. Like I said. I have not looked at the matrix yet.
@scottwheeler2679
@scottwheeler2679 Жыл бұрын
@@stevewestman7774 No problem. The original issues are recognizable by the labels. Atlantic has quite a history of their evolving labels over the years. The thing is there is always the possibility that they used earlier masterings. That is particularly true with Jazz as it never sold like mainstream rock and did not need as many new lacquers. I hope it sounds great!
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
@@scottwheeler2679 yes me too. I will spin it this weekend. The vinyl is shiny and a solid VG+ so I feel it was a good deal. I’m hoping it sounds great.
@andysmusicden
@andysmusicden Жыл бұрын
@@stevewestman7774you don’t have to look at the matrix, it is enough to look at the label. Sorry to be “that guy”, but I think you should check it before you make a video claiming you bought an original for 40 cad, when it is a reissue. An original in that condition would go for 200-300 cad I think.
@stevewestman7774
@stevewestman7774 Жыл бұрын
@@andysmusicden yes. Thank you
@poisonflour6723
@poisonflour6723 Жыл бұрын
Buy new music stop buying the same thing over and over again
@scottwheeler2679
@scottwheeler2679 Жыл бұрын
Audiophile reissues aren't "the same thing" they come with the possibility of better sound on a much loved recording. And personally I do buy plenty of new music. It's not an either/or proposition
@mrleetheteacher
@mrleetheteacher Жыл бұрын
Not to be unpleasant, but Steve talks over / cuts people off too much. I like what he has to say, but I would enjoy these discussions more if Steve would let others talk more.
@HMSiegal
@HMSiegal Жыл бұрын
In reality - no original recording from the 70s sounds anywhere as good as a remastered AP or MOFI - very simple. Go listen to Skynyrd collection for an example
@simonemurray1345
@simonemurray1345 Жыл бұрын
Lol what? As a big mofi and AP fan, with 50+ of their products, that's absolutely ridiculous. Mofi has been incredibly hit or miss, even before the scandal. Off the top of my head I can list a bunch. The cars s/t, the stranger(and other billy joels), the band s/t(RL), CSN one step, hall and oates, Eldorado, she's so unusual, tapestry, fragile, Allman bros fillmore east(pink capricorn), pretenders(UK mono), foreigner, the Linda ronstadts, imagine, and the two recent eagles. All of these have been heavily considered worse than the originals. Hell, a mofi has yet to win any of Patrick the vinyl archivists shootouts. Even the most lauded Bob Dylan desire, lost to the often criticized original. Same with the beloved eagles s/t onestep, with users voting blind. Thats also leaving out all of the poorly reviewed old mfsl pressings, and a bunch of 60s ones. Hell you can get a $20 mono that sounds better than mofis cheap thrills. And those old beatles titles are horrible, especially compared to the UK abbey road. Oh and I forgot to mention the biggest one, thriller. Very few people preferred the mofi. Even when mofi does well, they're often overly analytical where a bunch of the cohesiveness is lost. If you go to a critical forum, like hoffman, people have been questioning tons of mofi before the scandal ever happened. On places like discogs, all the new vinyl noobs rate the music, where any new release is a 4.5+. You can press a literal turd into a record, and it'd get a 4.63 on discogs. Most records sound great with no comparison, which is why folks like michael45 were so pro mofi only due to the name. If you actually compare and listen, they're often worse, and if better often are waaay too analytical, losing any sense of drive or punch. Also some APs have been criticized, with many people preferring a 1st press can't buy a thrill. It's debatable if AYE was an improvement as well. The doors s/t is worse than a 1st monarch or even Allentown, due to being a dub tape. Same with a mono 1st press strange days being better than the AP. Most beach boys are the best, but surfs up and sunflower are no better than 1st press artisans. A ton of aqualungs were poorly pressed, and many still prefer a 1-A reprise. I personally prefer the 1st lynyrd AP by a bit, but there's many who are underwhelmed and prefer the original due to more top end. Also most fans prefer the early 70s mono Carl and the passions two-for pet sounds to the mono AP(though their stereo is the best it's ever sounded). To say such a blanket statement makes me believe you're probably someone like Michael who never actually compared these things, instead going off of brand name or heresy. Because even as a huge fan of AP and mofi, I find such a statement ridiculous from experience. If you don't directly compare, pretty much any record will blow you away, especially if you have the bias that it's "the best". There's an actual scientific reason why originals are often better. First is tape degradation, also the massive loss of mastering talent, an artisan trade thats passed on(which is why BG, KG, and CB do 99% of audiophile pressings outside of KW at mofi). Once a tape degrades, you're not getting those sonics back. No matter how good a mastering is, you can only highlight or minimize what's in the tape, you cannot add sonics. Which is why mofi and AP rely heavily on cutting 45s as opposed to 33s, because that way there's some added fidelity to a 33. This reminds me of the crazy erc fans who try to argue a severely damaged, flat transfer, doors mono sounds better than the OG. When 2 mastering engineers, including the tapes creator, said it was way too damaged to even press a $40 analog copy. Yet because it's erc, fanboys ignore the massive defects. Mofi and AP shine when the original record was poorly mastered, especially 60s stuff where they were just learning stereo. Like Jeff becks truth and the jefferson airplanes. They did really good with iron butterfly and vanilla fudge, but in Gadda sounds weird without reverb. I respect your opinion, but a vast majority of people would disagree with such a blanket statement. Even most of mofis biggest supporters. There's amazing sounding mofis and APs, but there's alot of OGs that sound far better. The reissues only really win with surface noise, but that's comparing to often shredded OGs. I really have never met an experienced vinyl collector making such ridiculous statements, not even at the height of mofi did the biggest mofi fans think every single one was better than the original. Only new buyers who bought mofi to begin with due to brand name and buzz like michael45 blindly thought all mofis were the best. And even he, the once biggest fan, realized how much better many 1st pressings are.
@rixvspinner
@rixvspinner Жыл бұрын
@@simonemurray1345 Some OG's are consistently well recorded like Linda Ronshadt. Most of the Geffen Records and his first label Asylum were very well produced and recorded albums. This is why I won't be buying the Joni Mitchell Mobile titles. Besides, they should have done Shadows & LIght, Joni's superb 2nd live album from 1979. This was with her best band ever in my opinion. All the Joni OG's and very early reissues sound great.
@HMSiegal
@HMSiegal Жыл бұрын
@@simonemurray1345 Appreciate your passion and knowledge. Only speaking from my experience. Have maybe 500 records mostly 70s. All upgrades I have purchased are substantially better sounding. Majority are MOFI and AP. Only exception is Foghat Fool for the City which is very poor. I am personally very impressed with their products..to my ear it seems so obvious.
@sidesup8286
@sidesup8286 Жыл бұрын
Re: Simone Murray. I agree with you on many of the Mofis versus the originals being better; but it took you 120 lines to clobber that guy. If he responds, I hope it is more brief.
@scottwheeler2679
@scottwheeler2679 Жыл бұрын
I would be pissed off if MoFi reissued Abraxas. My issue is that I expect to get what is advertised. If you sell a record or anything else on the promise of a limited edition and you reissue it you have in effect lied in your promotion. It's what is known as a rug pull. It's dishonest and a form of illegal market manipulation.
@The_Music_Sanctuary
@The_Music_Sanctuary Жыл бұрын
Tell that to Chad Kassem, and the Bob Marley Exodus uhqr that are not numbered, including mine, when in fact he stated "limited number".
@mazzysmusic
@mazzysmusic Жыл бұрын
A limited edition is only limited for that particular edition. An edition is a specific release and of course there could be a totally different un numbered or colored and even a signed edition. Limited in perpetuity doesn’t really exist. If you have the first edition, then there is value in owning that.
@simonemurray1345
@simonemurray1345 Жыл бұрын
​@Norman Maslov yeah mofi already did this with iron butterfly. First was strictly limited to 3000, so they got around that with a super vinyl.... Also they've already broke their rules for Jeff becks truth. When it came out it was misprinted as 5000 copies on the sleeve, but they confirmed multiple times it was a misprint, and that there's only 4000. Well after the scandal and Jeff becks death causing demand/need for income, they've now printed another 1000, breaking their word and the past limitation. Now the interesting thing with Abraxas is it was so early where it wasn't on supervinyl, it's a regular vinyl onestep. So they can absolutely make a supervinyl version if they get the licensing. But some people will be furious because the new edition would be more desirable due to the vinyl quality, and being dsd there's no real provenance with a 1st edition in this case. But mofi would make a ton of more people happy, and could make serious money, so I could see it happening and it would be a big net positive. Also it follows what they're doing with miles Davis and the iron butterfly releases, using supervinyl to get around the limited restriction. Any reason to be against it is purely selfish from financial reasons. Thus is why it's dumb to buy modern records as a long term investment. If you can't afford it crashing, only buy 1st pressings that will never be made again in that mastering. If youre worried about invesment money, you're far better off spending a bunch on a unpeeled banana velvet underground, or an OG mono 13th floor elevators, than on anything mofi or AP put out in the past 20 years, because with the vinyl resurgence mostly everything will be repressed if popular enough, especially as the market recedes to create demand, which is why manufactured collectibles is a dumb route for investment. Most actually valuable records aren't expensive due to being intentionally limited, but due to increased demand over the years. Mofi will most definitely press Abraxas again on supervinyl, either the 33, a onestep, or a non onestep 45, if they can get licensing. They're going to do every big title they can again. Now I do feel bad for the poor people who paid over $1000 for something defined as strictly limited, but most who'd be angry are those who bought it to make money. If you're buying $1000 records, yet can't afford it crashing, then that's just financially irresponsible. Though I do believe companies need to stop with this falsely limited crap and deceitful advertising to create fomo while manipulating customers. Even if a small pressing, just put the records out there so the fans can buy it, not flippers or hoarders only concerned about the value.
@scottwheeler2679
@scottwheeler2679 Жыл бұрын
@@mazzysmusic depends on how it is advertised.
@dcrook232323
@dcrook232323 Жыл бұрын
​@Norman Maslov Absolutely correct NM. Newsflash to the newer/younger vinyl collectors (vs music vinyl listeners), as Mazzy states, there's hardly EVER reissue (of popular albums) that's not eventually reissued & oftentimes, might be improved upon in some modest manner or some "truer to the original" intent.
@davidbryanbartlett4071
@davidbryanbartlett4071 Жыл бұрын
MO-FI Inner sleeves are way overpriced/ they are made in China like most/ Big Fudge are your best bet
@jamesjoyce2528
@jamesjoyce2528 Жыл бұрын
What a waste of money. Buying plasticized versions of DSD masters, so you can listen to pops and clicks and tell us how great a particular “pressing” is. C’mon man, no one believes this. Inferior technology, inferior sound.
@myronhelton4441
@myronhelton4441 Жыл бұрын
I have an ear for the best sound. In 1972 & after, almost all records sound awful. They are not virgin vinyl. All the great engineers quit. Neil Young- Harvest 1972 The sound isnt great. The only great records in 1972 & after is the Little Feat Waiting record, Yes-Close to the Edge, & Alan Parsons- I Robot. The original Cat Stevens Catch Bull at Four 1972, the sound is great. The Cars record has great dynamics, but is way too harsh. Dark Side of the Moon is a harsh album, & only one song on it is good. Fleetwood Mac & Eagles the sound isnt great & the music isnt rock. I think people have the Eagles, Pink Floyd, & Fleetwood Mac way too much on the brain with their remasters. The very first original Abraxas is better than the $3,000 version. The Burrito Brothers sound isnt great. The Lou Reed record has great sound. Bob Dylan Unplugged is the only record of his with great sound. Dylan Blood on the Tracks has only good sound. The best sound Beatles record is the original Revolution. Beatles Love has great sound. Beatles-yellow submarine 1999 remaster has great sound. Paul McCartney-Ram has great sound. All the other Beatles remasters sound terrible. Led Zeppelin 3 is passable. The remaster Who Live at Leeds is better than the original, & the sound is above average. Norah Jones- Come Away with me, the remaster is best & great, great, great. Paul Simon, the sound isnt great. Why dint you guys talk about analog records like Jazz at the Pawnshop, & Norah Jones-Come away with Me, & Ry Cooder- Meeting By The River, & Patricia Barber Cafe Blue. Led Zeppelin How The West was won has great sound. James Gang-Rides Again has great sound. James Gang Live in concert 1971 has great sound. Nobody ever talks about Hendrix 3 records with great sound. Hendrix-Blue has great sound. I dont like Beck. Jennifer Warnes Raincoat has great sound, but is a little harsh.
@user-yk4gd1fl4z
@user-yk4gd1fl4z Жыл бұрын
lol, maybe in America after 72. Gotta love these broad general statements based on....nothing.
@myronhelton4441
@myronhelton4441 Жыл бұрын
@@user-yk4gd1fl4z sabuf
@Universityofvinyl
@Universityofvinyl Жыл бұрын
Whoa, I respectfully disagree on several of these “statements” ✌🏻
@myronhelton4441
@myronhelton4441 Жыл бұрын
Put Cat Stevens tea for the tillerman up against these sorry records, then you will realize how sorry sounding these records are. The guitars on most of Dark Side of the Moon is no talent. You have 2 untalented women instrumentalists on Fleetwood Mac, this isnt music, this is singing. Joe Walsh was so much better in James Gang, in the Eagles he was terrible. These albums are remastered every 5 years to rob sheeple. Sorry, you are wrong. America-America 1971 was a great sounding record, in 1972 they didnt sound as good. Same goes for Led Zeppelin, the Rolling Stones, & the Who. Even the older different Pink Floyd bands records sounded better than the new Pink Floyd. All the bands I complained about wasnt a band in 1971. The Rolling Stones Beggars Banquet & Let it Bleed sounds so much better than their later records. Unlike Pink floyd, at least the Rolling Stones guitars sounded great. Even the older Pink Floyd group had better guitarists.
@sidesup8286
@sidesup8286 Жыл бұрын
Myron is obviously one of those guys who thinks his experience using whatever he uses for equipment is Bible. There were/are many great recordings even to this day and they didn't stop in 1972. Pretty ridiculous. Actually you wouldn't have enough hours in your life to hear all therecords released in even just one year.
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