As a Reformed Baptist myself, I’ve been thinking through these doctrines without any presuppositions from my own traditions. Thank you guys for helping me see from your perspective and think more critically about my own beliefs.

As a lifelong, multi-generational Lutheran, I love these videos! They help me appreciate my church and understand the viewpoint of those outside of it. Thank you!

Realizing that Baptism and the Supper are God's work, which we receive by faith, but are actually JESUS HIMSELF, in the room with us and doing miracles, wow... There was no going back at that point. Assurance of salvation like I never believed was possible in this life, as well as a tangible closeness to God so many churches promised, but you could never know for sure if it was gonna happen. And this is better than what they would give, too!

I love how these difficult things are being discussed and grappled with. I’ve been studying and rethinking my eschatology and now believe strongly in partial-preterism rather than a dispensationalism, as previously. Now I’m rethinking baptism.

What a great conversation. Thank you, gentlemen. Also, I want to sing in those acoustics...

This is outstanding. Thank y’all for doing this!

I have learned so much insight about faith and baptism through the Lutheran tradition that I am thankful for though I be not Lutheran. Grateful for Flame and Rev. Bryan and Lex for this conversation

Love the conversation.

Thanks for this video! My husband and I are meeting with the local LCMS pastor today to talk about baptism. We’re coming from a reformed Baptist perspective and so far this is the point of doctrine that is hardest to wrap my mind around. I get close to understanding then I get confused. Honestly, I just think it’ll take some time to “un-indoctrinate” myself of my Baptist ways of thinking, if that makes sense.

Thank you for showing the joy that is provided for all who know the Word and let us all teach such to those missing out because of reductionist “Christianity” - those clinging to mental achievements over what Jesus Christ has achieved and taught!

Just found your channel thru this interview, as I’m a long time follower or Pastor Wolfmueller, and now of you. God Bless!

Thank you for sharing this conversation! I always struggle to explain baptism clearly to my non- Lutheran friends. But thankfully, while I don't understand it all, I hold fast to God's promise in 1 Peter 3:21 and the baptism I received at just 6 days old. Anyway, thanks again for the convo which has helped me to better understand and equipped me to better explain baptism!

Flame, i love what you are doing! Keep up the epic awesome work!

This was absolutely awesome to watch and brings such clarity. Thank you for this help-now I have something to point my Evangelical friends to!!! Now to “win and argument “ but to bring clarity and peace to their faith!!! Amen.

This was so good!!

Great convo bro because the lack of understand and education of some believers dont understanding this type of convo

I personally am reformed Presbyterian by category. This conversation has been very interesting and a blessing to me. Thanks for the conversation and the song!

Always love when my pastor (Jason from Being Lutheran) gets a shout out as one of the homies! 😂❤

I too am an ex-Reformed Baptist. I am beginning to see the value of baptism in my limited understanding of Lutheranism. However one aspect that I have yet to understand is what is the theology of those who are baptized, but leave the faith never to return? As a Reformed Baptist, it is simple - they were deceiving themselves and were never truly saved. If "baptism saves" then how to understand those who are baptized but leave and never return?

A brother who was very influential in my salvation. Preaching the gospel to me and showing me the love of Christ. First gave me a flame album in 2004. Being from Philly and in the middle of my State property/ Roc-a-fella era of Rap. I thought it was the corniest rap I ever heard and threw the CD 💿 in the 🗑 trash !! A couple of years later in 2006 when I finally got saved. I went back and started listening to flame again and he became my favorite Christian rapper. And I was listening to a lot of Shai Linne and lamp mode back then too. But flame was the first one who helped me understand limited atonement in his first album. Listening to that it finally clicked and I excepted the doctrine of particular redemption for the first time. Now come on flame 🔥 come on brother !! You mean to tell me that 18 years in the reformed church and you never read or listen to R.C. Sproul’s “What Is Reformed Theology” or back then the book was still called “Grace Unknown”. The very beginning of the book. In the section on sola Fide/ Faith Alone. One of the first things RC Sproul talks about is Luthers reformation breakthrough. An alien righteousness, Extra Nos, and simul iustus et peccator, simultaneously being saint and sinner at the same time. I knew about that stuff my first year being saved as a reformed Calvinist. Because I liked that doctrine so much I went on to read more stuff from Luther “the bondage of the will”, “The Augsburg apology”, “The smackald articles”, The whole book of Concorde. Philipp Melanchthon’s loci communis. Gerhard o forde "The Theology Of the Cross" And my favorite Lutheran book by CFW Walther “the proper distinction between law and Gospel”. Martin Chemnitz “examination of the council of Trent” and “the two natures of Christ”. I just find it hard to believe that you never knew about this stuff in the Reformd circles. It was one of the first things I learned being catholic, evangelical, and reformed !! I read more of Luther back then when I first got saved before I even opened John Calvin’s “Institutes of the Christian religion”. It sounds like to me you were in a very very weird reformed Baptist Church from the things you are saying here on this video. And I just feel bad for you that you were in such a weird church and never got none of this foundational stuff, if you really are telling the truth and never even heard of “extra NOS” your whole time being reformed. I really don’t believe you.. I think you are exaggerating if I’m wrong please let me know? As for me and I thought the same for all Reformd people. The first thing I learned was Justification by Faith Alone, a historical objective redemption, “Alien 👽 Righteousness”, that is found “Extra Nos” outside of our selves, and the proper distinction between the law and the gospel. I learned all that stuff in the first book I ever read from RC Sproul called “what is reformed theology”. And the different views of the Real Presence between Luther and Calvin on in the sacraments. My first year of being saved as a Reformed Calvinist. That’s why I find it hard to believe you never heard of none of the stuff it’s foundational the fundamental to Reformd theology. We are “Catholic” because of Athanasius, Anselm, and Augustine, “evangelical” because of Luther, Philipp Melanchthon, and Chemnitz, reformed because of Calvin, John Knox, Theodore Baeza, and of course RC Sproul lol 😂 we are just dwarfs standing on the shoulders of giants !! I thought everybody who was reform held to the orthodox historical views of the church.

Good stuff Flame thanks for the insight. I m just wondering what southside rabbi think about this topic.

Absolutely Dope!!!! frfr!!!! 👏🏾 Very Informative!!! I'm glad you doing this!!!! Much needed!!!!

Good book on this is Rock & Sand - Fr. Josiah Trentham.

Great video! Also, where can one get the Evangelical Catholic sweatshirt?

Thanks for this conversation, very informative and I have a question 🙋🏿‍♂️... In addition to seeing baptism as a gift that saves are you saying that Christians who have not been baptised with this knowledge need to do it again with the new knowledge? Or is it a matter of simply now accepting what was done as the gift. (I personally don't like the idea of getting re-baptised but thought it best to ask as I'm sure many will be wondering this.) Bonus question: are you saying that your not saved until you're baptised with this knowledge?

Jesus Christ did everything as an example unto us so shouldn’t we want to be baptized

The Point of View of Other Denominations about Baptism is more on the basis of obedience as in a public confession of faith that Jesus Died for our sins and believe in his promise that we are saved by faith that Jesus is our saviour..... but it is an interesting concept how you guys view it very differently which I feel it's not wrong but I can't wrap my brain on it it's a struggle indeed but I feel you guys for some reason are not in the wrong but for me it's hard to understand... Either Way God Bless You All this was an interesting topic

Great interview. What is the music starting at 41:32 during the outro? Is that in Word and Water?

The “Reformed” Baptist tradition is so odd and really tend to contradict themselves when it comes to the doctrine of infant baptism, not all, but speaking from experience.

I come from a Lutheran background and have listened to many of the ministers that appear on the Issues etc. program. I've read through the whole Book of Concord and, of course, the Scriptures. I have also read through the doctrinal stances of the various (and many) Lutheran denominations. The problem I see in the Lutheran Church Missouri Synod phraseology is that it is stated that Baptism is Necessary. And then, the pastors of the LCMS (at least, those to whom I have listened) go on to say something like the following. "Baptism is necessary for salvation. But, there are exceptions. Some are saved without it." Confusing. So, according to these assertions, Baptism is necessary for salvation (except, when it is not). This brings me to a place where, in a very real sense, it is hard for me to understand how Baptism is not a synergistic God/human work. My Lutheran grandfather fanatically held the position that he must get his and his community's children baptized. Without it, they could not be saved. "It is necessary and efficacious." I understand that the: the work performed in Baptism is not of the work of the baptized. The baptized are totally passive. I have never heard of a self-baptism. But, even though that is true, my grandfather's work was work, pure and simple. It was something he did. He did it to save people. He believed that if he (or someone else) did not get the baptism done, and the unbaptized child died, the lack of that Baptism and the lack of his effort to get it done meant the lack of salvation for that child. Because, Baptism is necessary. I do agree with the Lutheran stance that it is Biblically of secondary importance to think of Baptism as a testimony; a testimony the baptized gives of his faith. Instead, it should be taught as a sacrament, God's promise given. I can look back at my Baptism and think God has spoken to me in a very sacramental (Word plus element) way that he has marked me as his own. I am marked with the death of Jesus in a very experiential way. Christ's death, God says in Baptism, is not just a long-long-time-ago happening, but a a day to day reality. This is because it is his message to me that I have a new identity in Christ. It is true I confessed his salvatory work in me when I was baptized in front of the church family, my friends and relatives. But the Biblical concept is more than just a testimony of the baptized to those witnessing it. Instead, it is the Word of the Gospel in and with physical elements applied to me. God has said that Jesus' death is for me. Jesus' resurrection is mine. I can remember that at baptism God put his Word of grace and salvation (found only in his Son) on me! Specifically on me. To me, my Baptism is kind of like the wedding band I wear. I look at it and remember (even when she is not present) that my wife really did tell me that she would love, honor and cherish me (at least) until death do we part. In that way her promise is always with me. In Baptism, I find myself aware of God's promise always with me. God did something. He committed himself to me when I believed on Jesus. I remember that that faith came to be mine because of what the Holy Spirit had done and is doing. At Baptism all of this becomes more than a stance and concept. It is my identity in a whole new way.

Let’s go!!!!

Most important question: where are the hoodies from?

Man I have been gleaning from your music and videos like this for a while now. I love the insight although I don’t yet call myself lutheran but I think the Lutheran faith bring a lot to the table. One thing I heard yesterday is that the phrase Christ alone is something that Luther invented. I didn’t agree with it. However I’m humbling asking is the Lutheran faith just another man made doctrine? I love the insight though and I haven’t heard anything that I can’t agree with.

Great stuff. Thank you for this video. I was just wondering where can i get the same hodie as the guy on the right (evangelical catholic) ? If someone would drop the link, that would be nice.

Some questions, to help me understand: 1: Are you saying that everyone who gets baptized is saved? Even if they get baptized without faith? For example, if my Grandpa hates God, doesn't believe in Jesus, but gets baptized, will he be guaranteed salvation and faith? On one end I'm hearing you say that baptism is a gift, and he can give it to people who can't intellectually think through belief. On the other end, we see clear passages where faith is required for salvation. (Not baptism OR faith, but faith is a requirement) so curious how you would handle a situation like this. 2: Assuming that you do believe everyone who gets baptized is saved, including infants, we do see a lot of people later in life, that were baptized, that choose not to live for the Lord, are you just saying all of those people just made a conscious choice, with the Holy Spirit inside of them, they all made a choice to walk away? And they lost their salvation? Just trying to understand your perspective

While not a baptism passage, on the night of His betrayal, Jesus took off His outer garments, filled basins and began to wash disciples feet. Peter, (likely speaking for the others as well) exclaims Lord, you will never wash my feet, then Jesus replied, if I do not wash you , you have no share in me, then Peter exclaims then wash all of me, Jesus then says you are washed (purified by Jesus teaching but, for Passover also) only your feet need cleaning. My take away was A. I need to be cleaned by Jesus…not the other way around,. B. Nor I (like Peter,) get to demand how Jesus will do His work the Father sent Him to do. I do not get to give permission, demand, nor declare how God sends salvation to me. I am saved by faith through grace of God, but He told us in scripture how He will do it, we do not have to know how’s…we have to believe the why…to have a share in Him. Meddlesome Lutherans’ and Holy Spirit brought me out of evangelbaptocostalmethodism and into confessional Lutheranism. The baptismal versus, along with communion passages, along with John 13 washing of disciples feet, helped me understand clearly Christ is doing the work, not me. He does not need my help, but is clear I need to help my neighbors. Thank you for this discussion all of you. A rapping Lutheran…now I have seen it all…loved the Extra Nos album and many of your Calvinist ones previously. Anyone able to rap and fit in hypostatic union…has skills

Nicodemus had plenty of faith "we know (positively know) that you... come from God for no man can do these things you do unless God is with him" (Jn.3). Though he had faith, he still was not born again. Proof that one is not saved at the point of faith. Regarding Paul, when Jesus appears to him on the road, he now "believes on the Lord," but Jesus did not save Paul as He did the thief on the cross. Instead he instructs Paul to go into the city and there it will be told you what you MUST do. "For it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them who are lost." When Ananias arrives and finds Paul on his knees, he says "arise and be baptized washing away your sins." If we are saved by faith only, why was Paul's sins not forgiven when he first believed? Instead, Paul needed to be born again of water and Spirit. When Paul was baptized, is when he was born again.

Great conversation from your friendly neighborhood Presbyterian… 🤓

In this view, would the unbaptized babies/disabled receive salvation? The pastor mentioned that the gift of salvation can only come through God given means of grace and flame mentioned that appealing to Gods character isn’t sufficient to excuse salvation being given to the mentally incapable apart from a God given means of grace.

You are in a whole new level (flame) ima get confused with all this....

Dang I'm way behind....

The conservative evangelical hermeneutic often acts as if the Bible is accidentally contradicting itself, but not substantially contradicting itself; therefore, it is up to us to solve the accidental contradictions. So theories are invented to solve them: spirit baptism, baptism as a metaphor, etc. The Lutheran hermeneutic is nearly identical to the conservative evangelical hermeneutic, except that it denies the existence of accidental contradictions. The notion of accidental contradictions makes the Holy Spirit out to be sloppy in His work of inspiration, with the Bible being unclear not merely because it sometimes goes over our heads (we've all been there when reading Revelation) but because the Word of God is being a bit misleading in its phrasing of certain concepts. No! Reject such nonsense. Paul meant to write what he wrote the way he wrote it, and the Holy Spirit meant him to write what he wrote the way he wrote it, and nothing was written to test our fealty to another thing that was written.

Lutherans?

Yeah I watched the video and shared it with my other pastor friends still disagree with stuff but I take my comment off because Bible says Titus 3:9 But avoid foolish controversies, arguments about genealogies, quarrels, and fights about the Law. These things are useless and worthless. I’m Wesleyan we believe in being saved baptized and also entirely sanctified as John Wesley says a man of God . there was things I agreed and things I disagreed on . But your still sharing the gospel and that’s what counts .so as a Christian brother in Christ I apologize . flame I still love your music . right now I’m getting hate from a ton of people cause I’m a pastor and I do christian punk pop and people are saying I’m going to hell that it’s devils music .

Baptism is an outward expression of an inward transformation!it does not save you alone my brothers! Jesus said in John 3 to get into the kingdom we simply believe! Read Romans 10:9! The thief on the cross was saved( he never even hit the water). We so need the baptism of the Holy Spirit to help us not use logic in trying to interpret the scriptures! See John 16:13

Lutheran aren't ancient my dude. Martin Luther was a Jew hating Catholic from the 16th century. Jesus and his apostles were alive 2,000 years ago, not 500-600 years ago. Do you know what church is ancient and was around when the apostles we're alive? And who gave that church the power of Apostolic Succession from Jesus, who gave it to Pete "The Rock"? Your theology is missing 1500 years bro. Your being mislead. I hope you find the true faith. God bless. 😁🙏🏻🤍✝️