10 Motorcycle Innovations that never caught on

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bart

bart

Күн бұрын

From motorcycles with roofs to innovative steering mechanisms, here are the motorcycle innovations that just never became popular in the motorcycling world
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Пікірлер: 1 800
@johncoops6897
@johncoops6897 Жыл бұрын
Thank you so much for NOT using fake robot text-to-speech voice overs. This is the first video of yours that I have watched, and now I look forward to watching (and listening) to more!
@deus_ex_machina_
@deus_ex_machina_ Жыл бұрын
The 'fake robot' voiceovers are usually used by people who have different accents than the usual US/UK/AU/EU accents, who have determined that text-to-speech works better than their actual voices.
@johncoops6897
@johncoops6897 Жыл бұрын
@@deus_ex_machina_ - no, most are just lazy and/or using stolen content. So the mute the original audio and use test-to-speech to quickly bash out a video quickly.
@Comm0ut
@Comm0ut 8 ай бұрын
@@deus_ex_machina_ No, they're most used by thirdies for worthless clickbait garbage viewbait which is a great reason to bring back dislikes.
@GoSlash27
@GoSlash27 Жыл бұрын
The classic Piaggio Vespas had a lot of innovations that never caught on elsewhere, which is why I enjoy them so much. Aside from the twist grip shifting, they used a trailing arm front suspension, front and rear wheels were interchangeable, and both were as easy to remove and install as an automobile. The frame is monocoque, the rear suspension is the engine case so there's no separate drivetrain, and every cable, wire, and tube is routed internally. It was designed from the ground up to be the world's most practical utilitarian two wheeled vehicle.
@daszieher
@daszieher Жыл бұрын
And now even Piaggio is back building fairing-on-frame bikes voiding the advantages of a pressed steel monocoque design.
@florianvelling6427
@florianvelling6427 Жыл бұрын
Grip shifting used to be really common in 50ccs in Germany
@LordPustyni
@LordPustyni Жыл бұрын
@@florianvelling6427 in Poland too
@daszieher
@daszieher Жыл бұрын
@The Irate Lad but that one is no longer a Piaggio product.
@Blurredman
@Blurredman Жыл бұрын
MZ ES250
@g1ngersnaps149
@g1ngersnaps149 Жыл бұрын
The grip shifts used to be pretty common on vintage mopeds in Sweden. They were made in the thousands to the point where you can look on any second hand website and within a day have a 500$ moped from 1968 that’s in near perfect condition. As I said before, a lot of them (especially the early models) had grip shifts, which are notorious for being absolutely awful to use. They make your hand tired and it’s pretty finicky to use. My 1975 mustang 617 sport has a grip shift clutch assembly, but thankfully the zundapp 278 engine it came with has a pedal shift.
@Dresden358
@Dresden358 Жыл бұрын
Bajaj scooters from India also use twist grips. It's way too easy to accidentally shift gears while turning or under heavy breaking. Or maybe it's just because the one I rode was about 30 years old
@XtreeM_FaiL
@XtreeM_FaiL Жыл бұрын
Old Tunturi mopeds also had the same system.
@CuriousElectrician
@CuriousElectrician Жыл бұрын
In the 60/70 and 80's where a lot of small 50cc Mopeds using that kind of Grip shift from 2, 3 and even 4 gear versions. So its absolutley nothing which only Piaggion has used. But due to the iconic design that is one of those that is best known around the world.
@randombuilds8336
@randombuilds8336 Жыл бұрын
They also go out of adjustment due to cable stretch, and can randomly drop into gear while sitting and running. I learned that the hard way when I was diagnosing a hanging idle on a stella, rev it up and BAM scooter is at 12oclock 5ft away from you.
@MechanicB123
@MechanicB123 Жыл бұрын
TOMOS has a grip shifter on some models.
@Paul-mt7dq
@Paul-mt7dq Жыл бұрын
My experience with twist grip shifters was that they were awkward to use, particularly after a bit of wear which could make them a bit clunky and imprecise.
@WorksopGimp
@WorksopGimp Жыл бұрын
Cables always snap when older
@John.0z
@John.0z Жыл бұрын
I totally agree. One ride was all I needed to wonder why anyone would even try the idea!
@RH-xm5uk
@RH-xm5uk Жыл бұрын
Indeed. And the strange position of the wrist, right where you hit a bump on the road.
@ewann3
@ewann3 Жыл бұрын
they look shite in design anyway as the entire lever has to change angle, it should have been made to reset back to normal but was designed too cheap
@juanitooctavio9023
@juanitooctavio9023 Жыл бұрын
They were common on mopeds in the 50’s and 60’s, at least here in Sweden.
@mbp2112
@mbp2112 Жыл бұрын
You forgot air bags. The Gold Wing had them as an option. It sounds silly, but if you watch it in action, it makes a ton of sense. It's designed to keep you from flying over the bars in a T-bone collision with a car.
@alanssnack1192
@alanssnack1192 Жыл бұрын
and he forgot ejector seat option
@andyb.1026
@andyb.1026 Жыл бұрын
@@alanssnack1192 which would be far more dangerous, to the average punter. Being expensive very heavy it would never sell 😕
@rcpmac
@rcpmac Жыл бұрын
I’ve seen plenty of airbags on Goldwings… oh, I guess you weren’t referring to the riders
@noahway13
@noahway13 Жыл бұрын
@@rcpmac Ohhhh.... you didn't go there... They remind me of us as kids strapping pillows or couch cushions around ourselves before a new stunt.
@TravisTerrell
@TravisTerrell Жыл бұрын
I wish I could remember the video... One about motorcycle safety innovations like that which could be made if manufacturers wanted to. Advanced things like those airbags, as well as more basic things like designing the tank area so that flying over the bars doesn't cause groin injuries, etc. Much could be done, tbh.
@sethgordon4473
@sethgordon4473 Жыл бұрын
The Hossack front suspension concept used by the Britten is currently used on the latest generation Honda Gold Wing and the BMW K1600s.
@pashakdescilly7517
@pashakdescilly7517 Жыл бұрын
I was about to post the same. That double wishbone front suspension was developed at about the same time by Norman Hossack, Claud Fior and Tony Foale.
@LoosiuFlying
@LoosiuFlying Жыл бұрын
And was used ok K1200 and K1300
@pashakdescilly7517
@pashakdescilly7517 Жыл бұрын
@@LoosiuFlying known as the Duo Lever
@LoosiuFlying
@LoosiuFlying Жыл бұрын
@@pashakdescilly7517 Yes in did. It was straight patent abuse - no many went to brilliant Mr. Hossack :/
@peterwilliams2152
@peterwilliams2152 Жыл бұрын
And it's not a girder fork, as was stated in the video. Norman Hossack described it as a "steered upright". @LoosiuFlying BMW waited until Hossack's patent expired, before producing their overweight and over complicated version.
@PhilPassmore
@PhilPassmore Жыл бұрын
Someone else has probably already mentioned it, but on the Guzzi linked brake system, it did have two independent systems. The foot pedal operates the rear and one front disk, the handlebar lever engaged the second front disk.
@MadMaxxMoto
@MadMaxxMoto Жыл бұрын
@Phil Davies - As did the Goldwing from 1981 -2000 (rear with right front brake, 'balancing' side to side) which was NOT the best idea for lowered adhesion surfaces. such as sand, snow, rain or grass clippings! After the 2nd ride on my 1986 Goldwing (late-February in northern Illinois) where it unexpectedly snowed through my 40 mile ride home, and I inherently skidded the front tire while using only the foot brake (that'll definitely make your butt pucker something fierce!) I decided to split my braking on that bike the proper way by summer. With the 1800 series, the calipers themselves were split ( 3 piston or 6, I don't remember) so the center front pistons and the outer rear pistons were operated by the foot control and the outer front and center rear pistons were by the hand control. This way the stronger front/ weaker rear balance was by hand with stronger rear/ weaker front by foot, giving a 'balanced' linked-braking with a feel closer to a non-linked system. As for the Guzzi linked system, I've heard that in some markets (definitely not U.S./ North American) there was no 2nd system, all braking was by the pedal. That would never fly in the States because there is a DOT requirement (since 1968) for multiple brake systems - just in case of one failing - on all street legal vehicles.
@Herr_Bone
@Herr_Bone Жыл бұрын
I still have a 87 California 2 with this -at that time- innovative break system. And it is really well working, once you get used to it. The 40:60 share between the back and left front break enables nice decelerations without any risk of blocking. And with the second front disc on the hand lever you can reinforce this, or just use it in stop and go as the only break.
@BigBadLoneWolf
@BigBadLoneWolf 7 ай бұрын
early 1980's yamaha venture royal, had linked brakes, as does honda's VFR800, in fact my 09 VFR8000 has linked brakes and ABS. In EU all new bikes must have either linked brakes or abs, so many lightweight bikes have linked brakes to keep the costs down.
@jackx4311
@jackx4311 7 ай бұрын
@@MadMaxxMoto - I don't now about other markets, but Moto-Guzzis sold in Britain had the 'one front + the rear disc' operated by the pedal, and the second front operated by the hand brake lever. As to the balance between the two brakes, when you pressed the foot pedal, 60% of the hydraulic pressure went to the front disc, with 40% to the rear. I rode my Moto-Guzzi all year round, including on icy and snowy roads, and never had a problem with either wheel locking up.
@malcolmgee6812
@malcolmgee6812 Ай бұрын
@@Herr_Bone Great to hear you like it. My 85 Lario still has linked system and once used to it you never find an issue. Confuses the heck out of NZ WoF issuers though as they struggle to understand why and how it works,
@peterrockwell5862
@peterrockwell5862 Жыл бұрын
I wish you had explained the advantages of Britten’s suspension and the hub-steer suspension.
@Rudenbehr
@Rudenbehr Жыл бұрын
I literally had this exact same thought as he talked about it. EXPLAIN the advantages, don’t just TELL me. Motorcycle makers haven’t done it for a REASON
@percytom9252
@percytom9252 Жыл бұрын
Bike doesn't dive when braking - go deeper into corners before braking.
@peterrockwell5862
@peterrockwell5862 Жыл бұрын
@percy tom - Thanks!
@armadilllo
@armadilllo 7 ай бұрын
too heavy, complicated and expensive@@Rudenbehr
@fearsomename4517
@fearsomename4517 Жыл бұрын
I'm a traditionalist when it comes to motorcycles. I want my gas tank to hold gasoline, I want to shift gears. No roof or turbo. I guess you can't bend an oak. Bart, this is officially my favorite motorcycle channel. I eat, sleep, and breathe motorcycles. I unsubscribed to a couple, I guess I'm being more refined. You remind me of...me, when I was MUCH younger.
@donniebunkerboi9975
@donniebunkerboi9975 Жыл бұрын
So you're saying there are gas tanks that hold beer?
@fearsomename4517
@fearsomename4517 Жыл бұрын
@@donniebunkerboi9975 Goldwing's just hold wiring. Some bikes have dummy tanks, dummy.
@machupikachu1085
@machupikachu1085 Жыл бұрын
@@fearsomename4517 My Vmax has a dummy tank, and it's probably faster than yours, dummy. I'm surprised you didn't tell that young whippersnapper to get off your lawn. Why so hostile, gramps?
@kalanisarpi4731
@kalanisarpi4731 Жыл бұрын
I agree with you,till you said no turbos. A turbo bike from the 80s sounds like so much fun
@fearsomename4517
@fearsomename4517 Жыл бұрын
@@machupikachu1085 I'm generally happy, just never content.
@davidburne9477
@davidburne9477 Жыл бұрын
Oval pistons were Honda’s attempt to get around the MotoGP rules that limited manufacturers to 4 cylinders/pistons, and get more valve area so as to make more HP
@davidgibbings6085
@davidgibbings6085 Жыл бұрын
How do you even make piston rings for that thing 🤯🤔
@Deontjie
@Deontjie Жыл бұрын
My Honda Varadero has linked brakes. Pulling the front brakes, brakes front 75%, and back 25%. And the reverse is also true. Works on tar and dirt. And I think it is better than expensive ABS.
@Oldbmwr100rs
@Oldbmwr100rs Жыл бұрын
One friend of mine spent 2 years working for Honda racing, he said the inside name for "NR" was Never ready. Honda spent way too long and too much money and although I'm sure technology was gained, it was a waste of time.
@johndilloway9762
@johndilloway9762 Жыл бұрын
@@davidgibbings6085 I seem to remember they were 4 piece rings, did not last long but they were built for racing not road use, so did not matter as long as they lasted the race.
@nickcoppard5335
@nickcoppard5335 Жыл бұрын
@@davidgibbings6085 easy to make them , not easy to make them last , don't run a second race on them ,
@TheWatzitooya
@TheWatzitooya Жыл бұрын
Buell's bikes were full of funny innovations that never really went anywhere outside of that brand, but I think the one that makes the most sense to be adopted by other manufacturers were the Zero Torsional Load brakes. They're not ridiculously complicated, they just take a traditional brake setup and tweak it. And they work well. Buell and EBR raced successfully with them.
@taitsmith8521
@taitsmith8521 Жыл бұрын
Zero torsional load brakes ? What the fuck are those?! Buell ran a perimeter brake on the front wheel on 2004 models and up. Rear brakes were standard single piston.
@Obvsaninternetexpert
@Obvsaninternetexpert Жыл бұрын
@@taitsmith8521 ZTL brakes ... are perimeter brakes.... cos the disk is mounted on the wheels perimeter it meant no torsional load went through the ‘spokes’... meaning the wheel could be much lighter... The rear is driven obvs so had torsional load anyway... hence normal brakes
@taitsmith8521
@taitsmith8521 Жыл бұрын
@@Obvsaninternetexpert I've never heard the term used before ( ZTL). The corporate people at Harley really strangled Buell. It could have been a lot more than it was. I wish EBR would come out with a middleweight bike.
@Obvsaninternetexpert
@Obvsaninternetexpert Жыл бұрын
@@taitsmith8521 I know I always wanted a lightning 😭
@taitsmith8521
@taitsmith8521 Жыл бұрын
@@Obvsaninternetexpert I had a 2000 X1 for about 10 years. Tuber model, prior to the perimeter brake rotors, but still, it was a great bike. Used Buells go for cheap, just plan on being your own mechanic.
@dragineeztoo61
@dragineeztoo61 Жыл бұрын
Got a chance to ride a 1995 BMW RS-1000 with the telelever front end. It was absolute magic for hard late braking and, especially, trail braking. Very confidence inspiring and sold me on the idea. It wasn't a gimmick, it really works.
@resin8n
@resin8n Жыл бұрын
Interesting video. However, I reckon BMW's telelever front suspension has made it into the mainstream and definitely has it's advantages on the road with regard to separating suspension and braking effects
@googolplex5218
@googolplex5218 Жыл бұрын
Same exact thing with GS having linked brakes as well
@MisterOcclusion
@MisterOcclusion Жыл бұрын
Yes, I love that my front end doesn’t dive when I brake my big GS. I once heard a criticism that it makes the front end feel dead, but it’s dead nuts reliable to me.
@tinymotogarage
@tinymotogarage Жыл бұрын
#8 - GS 1200 has had very different front suspension for years. Interesting video - thanks.
@cliffsmith23
@cliffsmith23 Жыл бұрын
In the 1980s I had a Czechoslovakian-made CZ 175 that featured a push-rod that ran through the centre of the crankcase, linked to a cam on the pivot of the gear pedal. When you moved the pedal to change gear it would automatically disengage the clutch, so you could just flick through the gears without having to touch the handlebar clutch lever. It was simple, reliable and easy to use, but I've never seen that feature on any other motorcycle.
@Volker_GR
@Volker_GR Жыл бұрын
Good example! Wasn't it also the case that on the Jawa and CZ bikes, a single lever served as the shifter and kick starter? A typical example from the Iron Curtain period. Either technical innovations were not known in the West or they were not taken seriously. Or the engineers developed great concepts that were not approved by the old men of the state apparatus. Before the VW Golf, the GDR could have had a modern compact car with a large trunk lid (Wartburg 355/Trabant P1100) - no approval. Instead, cars with two-stroke engines were built until just before the end. A shortage of materials, a lack of funds and unreasonable politicians made life difficult for the engineers. They have our respect that they have quietly developed ingenious solutions again and again, in the two-wheel sector e.g. at Jawa/CZ, MZ and Simson. Mostly, unfortunately, hidden under an old-fashioned design, making the models difficult to sell in western markets. MZ, for example, were distributed by Neckermann in the Federal Republic of Germany and were considered a cheap vehicle for students.
@cliffsmith23
@cliffsmith23 Жыл бұрын
@@Volker_GR Yes, now you mention it, that's true. You pushed the gear pedal in, flipped it over backwards, and it became the kickstarter. It was a fun bike; not massively reliable and sometimes a bit reluctant to start, but nice to ride and incredibly tough, like it was built out of ex-Soviet tank parts. I had forest tyres on it, and it would go pretty much anywhere that my mates' Yamaha DT175 would go.
@peterwilliams2152
@peterwilliams2152 Жыл бұрын
It was a feature of the Dnepr MT-804 gearbox. First fitted to the Dnepr MT-9 in 1968, and used on all subsequent models.
@francescoporcari8597
@francescoporcari8597 Жыл бұрын
actually Moto Guzzi developed some kind of Automatic transmission for its Idroconvert (california 1000), replacing manual gearbox with a torque converter built by Sachs, and two-speed gearbox. The consequential lack of braking effect of the 4-stroke engine is what pushed Moto Guzzi to develop and adopt the "integral braking" or linked braking system.
@fredsmith4106
@fredsmith4106 Жыл бұрын
Ok, the guzzi system was two separate systems. The rear brake pedal operated the rear brake and one front disc, the handlebar lever operated the other disc.
@aceroadholder2185
@aceroadholder2185 Жыл бұрын
I have an '84 Moto Guzzi Monza with this system. As Fred says it's two brake systems. The foot brake operates the smaller rear wheel disk and one of the front disks. The handlebar lever operates the other front disk. On dry pavement getting on the brakes hard will lock the rear wheel first. You do have to be careful on gravel and wet leaves so as not to lock the front wheel. Gentle use of the foot brake is usually sufficient. On a twisty mountain downhill run the system really shines and bikes with twice the engine capacity have to work hard to keep up.
@SingleTrackMined
@SingleTrackMined Жыл бұрын
@@aceroadholder2185 Pshaw. Linked systems have no place on a motorcycle, imo. Any experienced rider knows that in a low grip situation they might want rear brake only and linked system says they can't have it. I'll decide which brake to use, when and how much, tyvm. I believe linked systems are the devil's work and I'll play no part in such evil. Linked systems get thee behind me!
@alandavies55
@alandavies55 Жыл бұрын
Rudge had a system back in the 30s, then of course it was cable operated and it was easy to alter cables if you didn`t like it.
@aceroadholder2185
@aceroadholder2185 Жыл бұрын
@@alandavies55 Panthers also had linked brakes on the heavyweight machines in the 30s and 40s. Like the Rudge the system was cable operated and could be removed if desired.
@aceroadholder2185
@aceroadholder2185 Жыл бұрын
@@SingleTrackMined I would assume you've not ridden a Guzzi with linked brakes.
@carsyoungtimerfreak1149
@carsyoungtimerfreak1149 Жыл бұрын
Most mopeds back in 70s and 80s (yes, I'm that old 🙂) had manual gearbox selectors, like the Vespa's. It is indeed very, very old. And quite horrible. Speaking from years of experience it shifts slow, cables tend to get out of tune and it will be difficult if the bike has more than 4 gears. Als the angle of the clutch handle changes, ergonomically also not great. So there are good reasons this type of gear selection disappeared.
@bbjorre678
@bbjorre678 Жыл бұрын
It started on mopeds already in the late 50's. From one gear up to 3 gears.
@horsthinze4048
@horsthinze4048 Жыл бұрын
Well.... de gustibus etc coloribus non EST disputandum.... I've learned riding with my father's Iso Diva, four gears on the left grip, and, with 10 years old hands ....it was not the best. But motorcycles are for ( or intended, at least....) for grown ups! I find it comfortable for the kind of ride a scooter can give you. Wouldn't want that on a race bike or enduro of course, but the system proved to be ok for that kind of bikes... Clean, cheap, reliable, and easy to fix and maintain. Cheers!
@noth606
@noth606 Жыл бұрын
Where was this? I've been all over Europe, the only one like that that I've seen was the Vespa, everything else had a variator, or foot shifter.
@horsthinze4048
@horsthinze4048 Жыл бұрын
@@noth606 It was some time ago.... French, German, Italian scooters and small bikes..... Not the Japanese bikes, of course....
@BricoleurTV
@BricoleurTV Жыл бұрын
@@noth606 Sweden for sure!
@adamharnois7072
@adamharnois7072 8 ай бұрын
Regarding number 8, BMW had telelever front suspension on a lot of bikes for many years didn't they? Are they still doing it? Seemed to work quite well to eliminate fork dive under braking. It wasn't terribly complicated either, so I never understood why it didn't catch on more.
@ehehbwucee
@ehehbwucee 7 күн бұрын
Still on BMW bikes. once you use it, going back to forks feels really dated.
@toml7112
@toml7112 Жыл бұрын
The Gold Wing platforms have had linked brakes for years. Works well with or without ABS option. You still have independent controls that distribute breaking forces differently. The work fantastic stopping the weight of the bike, gear and two passengers. ...
@caribman10
@caribman10 8 ай бұрын
As long as you don't want to think and have middling rider skills, linked braking is OK. Otherwise, it's crap.
@stevemorris3710
@stevemorris3710 8 ай бұрын
They're OK for Americans, who can't even downshift cleanly.
@guydunstan6471
@guydunstan6471 Жыл бұрын
Back in the late 70’s I purchased a Husqvarna 390 Automatic I used in scrambles and enduros. It had a 4 speed gearbox, went up and down gears just like an automatic car. I believe it was used by the Swedish Army as well. It was a great reliable competitive bike in its day.
@TomBuskey
@TomBuskey Жыл бұрын
The Husqvarna Automatic won the NETRA and AMA Enduro championships in the 80s. One dealer in New England was adapting them for a number of riders with 1 arm. Really.
@lostcat9lives322
@lostcat9lives322 Жыл бұрын
Didn't Husky also locate the throttle as well as the clutch lever on the left side of the handlebar so as to free up the right hand of the rider to...shoot?
@olafzijnbuis
@olafzijnbuis Жыл бұрын
Grip shift was very common on 50cc mopeds in Europe. I doubt it would be an improvement as it requires 2 cables. I feel a foot shifter just gives you better feedback. Also on my bike with 6 gears, you would have to rotate the shift (AND THE CLUTCH HANDLE) between 7 positions. This would leave the clutch handle in very inconvenient positions.
@florianvelling6427
@florianvelling6427 Жыл бұрын
And you skip the cable with foot shifter
@dutchsailor6620
@dutchsailor6620 Жыл бұрын
IIRC there were even three cables, one for the clutch and two for shifting up and down. I remember using it on mopeds and always found it awkward and clumsy. Never seen it used with more than 4 positions( 3 gear). Early Puch , Sachs ,Kreidler, Zundapp and Flandria are a few brands that come to mind to have this "feature".
@olafzijnbuis
@olafzijnbuis Жыл бұрын
@@dutchsailor6620 I was thinking of the EXTRA 2 cables to change gear.
@triplem9805
@triplem9805 Жыл бұрын
I can see an updated version working, though, using ride-by-wire technology rather than mechanical cables, and a sequential up/down shift pattern just like foot shifters. Although if the objective is to make changing gear a one-limb operation instead of two, I guess quickshifters/blippers do a pretty good job.
@Jacob-co7of
@Jacob-co7of Жыл бұрын
My zündapp moped only has obe cable as far as i know
@lancecurtis6926
@lancecurtis6926 Жыл бұрын
My Lemans MK3 has linked breaks, they are fantastic, for a bike that age and weight the breaking is really good and very stable, even if you break in a corner which you shouldn't really do.
@polarpilot1
@polarpilot1 Жыл бұрын
I started riding in 1960 . My first bike was an NSU Quick. It used a dial a shift twist grip on the left handle bar. The Alstate moped manufactured by Puch also had dial a shift system.
@EZ-D-FIANT
@EZ-D-FIANT Жыл бұрын
But was it quick?
@munroberry1248
@munroberry1248 Жыл бұрын
Bert, was it the NSU Quickly? I remember them.
@polarpilot1
@polarpilot1 Жыл бұрын
No it was a Quick. NSU started producing the Quick in the late 1930s. The Quickly was a later design based on a step through frame . The Quick had a 98 cc engine while the Quickly had a 49 cc engine.
@EZ-D-FIANT
@EZ-D-FIANT Жыл бұрын
@@polarpilot1 so the quick was quicker then the quickly, sounds quick to me...... Were those dial a shift twist groups put in place to keep a hand clear to carry bags?
@ratnashekhar1740
@ratnashekhar1740 Жыл бұрын
Greetings from India.. We still have some of the features you mentioned in the video common sight on our roads.. 1. Left hand side grip gear shifters are still used on some scooters and three - wheeler auto rikshaw (Tuk -Tuk) to this day.. 2. Combined front and rear brakes are a common feature on modern bikes in India, but you also have a seperate front brake on these motorbikes and scooters. It's only when you press the rear brake the combined brakes are triggered, my Honda CD110 has this. 3. TVS tried to make the clutch less automatic transmission mainstream with the TVS Jive but that didn't attracted many buyers so it was ditched... Great video BTW..
@plymouth58convert
@plymouth58convert Жыл бұрын
For decades(!) left hand side grip shifters have been used on mopeds of many brands from Italy, Germany, Austria, France etc. Worked very well
@edilson1234567890123
@edilson1234567890123 Жыл бұрын
Combined front and rear brakes are also a common feature on modern bikes in Brazil. Today, all small cc Hondas has some sort of it.
@premmalviya4600
@premmalviya4600 Жыл бұрын
Bhai aap bajaj ke scooters bhool gaye eg bajaj super and chetak
@premmalviya4600
@premmalviya4600 Жыл бұрын
Bajaj m80 bhi
@pkskyter
@pkskyter Жыл бұрын
Back in the 1970s I had a German moped made by 'Hercules'. It had a 2 speed transmission which was selected by twisting the clutch lever assembly. You could also way that this technology is widely used on bicycles with twist grip shifting 🙂
@sootycollier5400
@sootycollier5400 Жыл бұрын
don't forget the puch maxi two speed manual had the same arrangement
@gardangy80
@gardangy80 Жыл бұрын
Here in the Netherlands there a whole lot of "brommers", 50cc mopeds with a legal max speed of 40 kmh that had handshifting, not only European and Dutch brands using Puch, JLO etc engines but also big brands like Zundapp and Kreidler . Kreidler became world champion 50cc with a foot actuated AND a handlebar actuated gearbox liked behind each other to get enough different speeds to cope with the narrow power band of the Kreidler engine. Also Honda 4stroke and Yamaha with handlebar gear change were well sold in our country.
@davidbodine1808
@davidbodine1808 5 ай бұрын
Well done. Time well spent. Thank you.
@johnhazzard9729
@johnhazzard9729 Жыл бұрын
The twist grip gear change was used on a number of scooter style bikes. MV Augusta made a version. Husqvarna made dirt bikes with automatic transmissions. Originally designed for the military but excellent on sand.
@philipmicans6123
@philipmicans6123 Жыл бұрын
I had a Kawasaki GPz 750 turbo in the mid 80s and have fond memories of it. The turbo unit was made by Panasonic and spun to something like 100k, but I never recall it being leery, no dramatic power-band; yes a litre bike was as quick and less complicated, but at the time the turbo seemed space age!
@RogerBarraud
@RogerBarraud Жыл бұрын
Possibly more fuel-efficient than a naturally-aspirated 1000cc bike too?
@philipmicans6123
@philipmicans6123 Жыл бұрын
@@RogerBarraud I think that’s true Roger. At the time, I was torn between the turbo and the then just released GPz900, but I’m glad I owned the turbo since it felt special, and now they fetch quite a bit of cash.
@Johnketes54
@Johnketes54 Жыл бұрын
My dad's neighbour had one and he rode it like a pussy never above 2000rpm,My father challenged him,apparently he didn't know what a turbo was or what it did,He just liked the word TURBO on his bike unfortunately when the turbo kicked in it would SHIT HIM UP, So rode below the turbo boost
@Bellathebear777
@Bellathebear777 Жыл бұрын
@@Johnketes54 lol, The Gpzs we're nice....Saw a twin set being sold not long ago. But they had high miles & kinda beat up, for the price. I opted for a 82 Suzuki GS 750E & I'm happy I did. By far the smoothest bike I've ever owned..Overall, I like it much more than my 82 CBX, but the sound of the CBX is by far the best sounding bike I've ever owned. I wouldn't mind owning that turbo Kawasaki now
@xxxggthyf
@xxxggthyf Жыл бұрын
My brother had one and he was more than a little worried on checking the registration when he got it home to find out he was the fifth owner in just over a year particularly given its very low mileage. He soon found out why... It was a complete dog and over half the mileage he put on it was riding it home and then riding it back to the Kawasaki dealer to demand his money back. Kawasaki were obviously having a bad day when they made it or, and this was our favourite theory, the dealer had done something stupid so he had to keep trying to re-sell it as the importer wouldn't take it back.
@TheKevphil
@TheKevphil Жыл бұрын
Your videos are consistently interesting. This was no exception. Well done!
@paceyombex
@paceyombex Жыл бұрын
Linked brakes is commonly used on Honda scooter here in Indonesia. They called it CBS (Combi-Brake System).
@steeltube195
@steeltube195 Жыл бұрын
And the Blackbird.... I love CBS on the Blackbird.
@Jaszczur-sp2tx
@Jaszczur-sp2tx Ай бұрын
All new 125cc bikes in europe now must have CBS or ABS.
@vernonspady555
@vernonspady555 Жыл бұрын
I agree. There are ideas out there that do not make sense, and someone actually proved it by trying. Great video!
@noahwail2444
@noahwail2444 Жыл бұрын
Twistgripps was quite common in Europe in the 1950s and 1960s, on small bikes, usualy 50-175 cc. I have had with both 2-3-4 gear models, but man, was it good to get it to hand and foot!
@bsimpson6204
@bsimpson6204 Жыл бұрын
NSU & Puch...
@florianvelling6427
@florianvelling6427 Жыл бұрын
@@bsimpson6204 Everyone that used Sachs engines and Zündapp.
@kaptein1247
@kaptein1247 Жыл бұрын
@@florianvelling6427 also JLO
@imagio2694
@imagio2694 Жыл бұрын
A lot of old german mopeds (50cc) had used a gripshift too. My first motorcycle, a Hercules Prima 5, had a 2 gear gripshift and my grandpa's Zündapp Supercombinette 429 had a 3 gear gripshift. ^^
@zweispurmopped
@zweispurmopped Жыл бұрын
Exactly. It was standard with all Mofas and Mopeds which were legally viewed as bicycles with assisting engines. If it had bicycle-like pedals, it had a grip shifter. Victoria Vicky, DKW Hummel, Rabeneick Binetta, Express Radex, Zündapp Kombinette… there were dozens of brands and well over a hundred various models. Same goes for all scooters that were built. Heinkel Tourist, NSU Prima, Zündapp R50, again dozens of types.
@he_exe
@he_exe Жыл бұрын
@@zweispurmopped your right but the larger 50ccm ones were not considerd bycycles anymore, at least over here in austria
@zweispurmopped
@zweispurmopped Жыл бұрын
@@he_exe The official Moped formula from the 1950s was that the bike had to have bicycle-style pedals, could be driven by them (Albeit awfully badly was acceptable…), 50Km/h top speed, 50cm³ stroke volume and up to 33 kilograms of weight. A handle to carry the Moped had to be installed as well. So they only were kind of bicycles. If you squinted very squintily with both eyes and accepted that that bicycle would exhaust any world class athletes within 100 metres of driving them with the pedals. ☺
@1nfidelCastr0
@1nfidelCastr0 Жыл бұрын
My grandfather has a bunch of old crescent mopeds with grip shift. It's pretty cool
@sbukosky
@sbukosky Жыл бұрын
Look at the love of my life. A Suzuki Burgman 650 Executive. Comfort. Amazing electric windscreen. Fuel injection for easy starting. Lots of foot room. An amazingly well-tuned CVT transmission. Will do over 110mph and give 60mpg while flogging it. Stablemates are a Honda Goldwing SE and Yamaha 650 Maxim. The "half a busa" is my favorite.
@lesmaybury793
@lesmaybury793 Жыл бұрын
Interesting post. Regarding twist grip gear change, this was common on some mopeds in the 1950/60s in the UK. Using a 50cc two speed Villiers two stroke engine with twist grip change was common for some manufacturers.
@chrisos6303
@chrisos6303 Жыл бұрын
It was also very common for European/German mopeds. For example zundapp or kreidler. They even had three speeds.
@bluvida
@bluvida Жыл бұрын
A very rare feature, the single sided front fork. Gilera made one and there have been several customs with it, and a couple of scooters I think.
@Volker_GR
@Volker_GR Жыл бұрын
The first bike (not a scooter) with a single sided front fork was, as far as I know, the German Riedel Imme R100, produced 1948-1950.
@rangerjones5531
@rangerjones5531 Жыл бұрын
Harleys MX250 rear fork suspension on factory works bikes
@dlpannebakker
@dlpannebakker 8 ай бұрын
With his knowledge on the integrated braking system. The foot brake controlled one brake opposite of the rear the front brake lever controls the other disc brake.
@travezripley
@travezripley Жыл бұрын
My first two wheeled vehicle was a 1966 Vespa Smallframe. The CC’s went up after that as I finished high school and wanted to travel outside of school, town and scooter rallies. But of all my vehicles my Vespa’s and Lambretta’s are still my number one favourite way to travel.
@robertlewis4666
@robertlewis4666 Жыл бұрын
I owned a Moto Guzzi with the dual braking system and I loved it. The foot pedal operated front and back disks. 60% braking force to the front wheel, and 40 to the back. Very useful in wet slippery conditions. The front brake handle was totally separate as normal.
@not-fishing4730
@not-fishing4730 Жыл бұрын
I also own a Guzzi with linked brakes, my understanding is link brakes prevent driveshaft jacking when braking into a corner. The linked brakes was only used on guzzi's cruisers, not the sport or sport touring bikes.
@yoepvh9250
@yoepvh9250 Жыл бұрын
I own a California, and I think the linked brakes work brilliant for the riding style. It keeps the motorcycle level even during emergency braking. Also, with the foot pedal it's easier to brake hard, in combination with the hand operated front brake. During emergency stops, the hand operated front brake is easier to reach, but less effective, in practice you kind of "pre brake" with the hand lever and add the other front and rear brake with your foot. When familiarizing myself with this on an empty parking lot I found that I could stop just as fast as a modern abs bike, without losing traction.
@mickvonbornemann3824
@mickvonbornemann3824 Жыл бұрын
I think the pedal worked the rear brake & one of the front brakes, while the handlebar lever worked the other front brake. Well I know some Guzzis worked that way.
@billeudy8481
@billeudy8481 Жыл бұрын
Great video! With regard to linked brakes, I use my front brake in most situations and would benefit from linked brakes most of the time to improve and simplify the process of slowing down and stopping. However,it would have to work in a specific way to be practical . Linking the front (hand) brake to the rear (foot) brake makes sense especially with ABS. You could more quickly grab a handful of brake and either modulate it or clamp down to deliberately achieve a rapid deceleration or stop. But, on the other hand, linking the rear brake to the front brake does not work because when you are descending a steep grade on a graveled, wet or otherwise slippery road surface you need to apply the rear brake only to drag the bike to a stop and avoid the massive forward weight shift caused by application of the front brake so as to maintain your balance and preserve as much steering traction and control as possible.
@hammondeggs3356
@hammondeggs3356 Жыл бұрын
I had a 1984 Guzzi V65C with linked brakes. The bike braked extremely well and never locked up a wheel. I felt totally safe even in the few times I got caught in rain. Had to sell the bike to pay for college, miss it to this day...
@davidgalt8107
@davidgalt8107 Жыл бұрын
About the 'grip shift'. Back in the 50's and 60's nearly all makes of scooters used this feature, with the odd exception, namely the NSU 5 Star Prima. This had 2 pedals that stuck up through the floorboards and was basically a heel & toe shifter. Nearly all the other brands of scooters and mopeds used the grip shift. I had a Vicky 50cc moped with a 2 sp as did most mopeds. (Mopeds in those days were really mopeds, ie with motor and pedals, typically 50 cc). Scooters, on the other hand, typically 100-250 cc used 3 sp grip shift. Brands such as NSU Prima, (not the previously mentioned 5 star), Puch, Zundapp Bella, Triumph Tigress and its BSA sister, Vespa and Lambretta as you mentioned, Piatti and many more. The most notable exception was the DKW Hobby, probably the first fully automatic using expanding pulleys and a v-belt. This was just under 100 cc, I think about 98 cc. Sadly very few of these brands still exist.
@Johnketes54
@Johnketes54 Жыл бұрын
As do the Italian motorcycle brands,Laverda immediately come to mind,The Laverda Jota triple was for a few months the fastest production motorcycle in the world until the Japanese took it back with the Z1000
@thinkingoutloud9126
@thinkingoutloud9126 Жыл бұрын
I think a modest turbo on a small displacement bike makes sense. It may not it may be too heavy but adding a turbo to a thumper or 250-300 could be good.
@redhunt959
@redhunt959 8 ай бұрын
apparently helps with fuel consumption efficiency
@linusmadrone
@linusmadrone 7 ай бұрын
Basic electrical and mechanical components! No electronics except for ignition! Thank You!
@doctordapp
@doctordapp Жыл бұрын
Zundapp used hand selector and clutch combined for the older 2 stroke 50cc 3-speed engines... From the 50s to the 80s...
@umarkedreturn8776
@umarkedreturn8776 Жыл бұрын
When we were growing up in the late 60's to mid 70's, there was a kid up the street who had a (Honda?) Rabbit 90. The left grip actuated a centrifugal clutch with 3 speeds on the left grip, pulling in the clutch lever was optional. It worked either way. The vespa-style scooter was off-white, and we rode it everywhere it could go in the woods. It had a rabbit logo on it like the impala for Chevrolet.
@Oldbmwr100rs
@Oldbmwr100rs Жыл бұрын
Those were made by Fuji heavy industries, the same people making Subaru cars today! The larger Rabbit model had a fluid coupling for the transmission basically making it a twist and go like modern scooters.
@howardsimpson489
@howardsimpson489 Жыл бұрын
Many girls in NZ has them, they would come to a standstill on steep slopes.
@elguitarista9487
@elguitarista9487 Жыл бұрын
I had an NSU Quickly (well, three of them actually!). Two had a two speed handlebar grip change, one had a three speed change. The three speed was always breaking gearbox parts.
@Volker_GR
@Volker_GR Жыл бұрын
My Oscar for motorcycle designers would go to the one whose innovation eradicates the WOBBLE.
@michaelclement1337
@michaelclement1337 Жыл бұрын
The linked front suspension was tried in 500cc racing and struck the problem that it lacked feel, the rider couldn’t tell when the front was going to let go
@hodaka1000
@hodaka1000 Жыл бұрын
The thing in the title photo is an SR engine
@Jay_Speed
@Jay_Speed Жыл бұрын
Twist grips I used a lot, it was found on all European mopeds. Up to four speed gearboxes, you needed to regularly adjust it a bit because the cables stretched. I was a good system and I had it on my scooters as well, Zündapp Bella, Lambretta 150cc and so on. Linked brakes, three friends of mine driving Guzzi Lemans went to the ground because of this system every time on gravel using the rear brake but the front braked to hard. Automatic, there was the Guzzi Convert with full auto. GTS was Yamaha !
@natesturm448
@natesturm448 29 күн бұрын
I had a Hondamatic Hawk. Wasn't my first choice for riding but it was such a great bike to ride around the countryside on. Super curvy, S bend, tight roads were so much easier to navigate. Really let me just relax.
@mikejohnson5900
@mikejohnson5900 10 ай бұрын
Your videos are always well researched and very well done. Your narration is very good too! Oh, and subject matter is very interesting. Thank you.
@vondenballs
@vondenballs Жыл бұрын
This self driving Honda presented in the video has a very interesting feature I hope to see in production; the wheelbase adjusts itself depending on the speed. The front wheel moves forward at high speed and back at low speed. I think that's a great feature on a bike.
@solsol1624
@solsol1624 Жыл бұрын
It is interesting without doubt. But as Bart pointed out bikes are ridden by enthusiasts. Maybe the application will be in commuter scooter like bikes
@CrusaderSports250
@CrusaderSports250 Жыл бұрын
@@solsol1624 which rarely go fast or travel long distance so the complications would be pointless.
@Johnketes54
@Johnketes54 Жыл бұрын
@@CrusaderSports250 Ya but some people love all gadgetry,I consider anti lock brakes and traction control gadgets,Water cooling on a motorcycle with no fairing it's cosmetic making pretty doing away with sharp lines and more"curves" see where we are going with the curves?
@29madmangaud29
@29madmangaud29 Жыл бұрын
Yes Bart, you've said it all , right there: The '80's was the PINNACLE" of motorcycles. Engineering, etc. If you look back and check the "#'s", you'll see that okay , the horsepower has come up, but the gas mileage, simplicity of maintenance and everything else hasn't really went any further, from where it was , back in the mid '80's!
@Elephantine999
@Elephantine999 8 ай бұрын
Rotary engines! Like the Suzuki that one motorcycle magazine called "the motorcycle that answered the question that nobody asked."
@stephanemm6808
@stephanemm6808 8 ай бұрын
Did anyone mention thta the Honda cub certainly caught on as it simply is the best selling motorbike in the world. Including all versions of bikes using the same engine and semi automatic clutch, more than 100 MILLION have been already sold... and the story goes on !!
@parsonscarlson7984
@parsonscarlson7984 Жыл бұрын
Hey Bart. Interesting video, but you left one out. Anti-dive front suspension, typically front forks, but my former boss, John Long, the roadracer from Miami, Florida raced a BMW with a manual (for lack of a better word) anti-dive setup with rods and levers back in the 80s. All the other manufacturers were using some kind of hydraulic system which diverted some of the fork oil to stop the forks from compressing under braking. Incidentally, BMW's team manager was Udo Gehtle (not completely sure about the spelling of the last name), who went on the manage team Honda's roadracing effort. Anti-dive showed up on many of the major manufacturers production bikes, but it was complicated and only made front fork maintenance more of a hassle.
@acehandler1530
@acehandler1530 Жыл бұрын
I rode a BMW R12C for many years and loved that bike (until the driveshaft stripped = $2500 repair!). The innovative telelever front end was very effective at keeping the front end from diving...I miss that bike 😥
@parsonscarlson7984
@parsonscarlson7984 Жыл бұрын
@@acehandler1530 Thanks for the response. I worked on Beemers, first boxers back in the early 80s, then K bikes later in the mid to late 80s, even went to 2 BMW schools to learn how to work on the latter. However, I got out of the motorcycle industry in the early 90s and never rode a beemer with telelever suspension, altho I did read about it. Even before telelever, BMWs were great handlers and I was very impressed with ABS. I didn't know or remember that one of the features of the telelever front end was anti-dive. Thanks for clueing me in.
@normangraber1047
@normangraber1047 Жыл бұрын
@@parsonscarlson7984 Had a K1200RS for awhile, really liked the bike, especially the Telelever. Trying to work on the bike was such a PITA I sold it.
@Giitzerland
@Giitzerland 8 ай бұрын
Honda had a great linked braking system where the rear brakes engaged the middle piston of the front caliper, as well. It works amazingly well, I have it on my VTX1800, and it adds stability to stops that really helps on larger bikes. You can still skid, since the front has3 pistons on each side, total of 6, you're only engaging 2 of the 6, just barely noticeable, but very helpful in some situations. I believe the front brake lever works the same way, engaging about 20% of the rear, but I'm sure.
@Krikstar123
@Krikstar123 4 ай бұрын
I have the same on my Honda Silverwing scooter. Works great! It was invented by Moto Guzzi :-)
@Jonathan-L
@Jonathan-L Жыл бұрын
Good presentation. Thanks for sharing Bart :)
@KampfBrot3778
@KampfBrot3778 Жыл бұрын
3:42 Nope, in Germany there were also a lot of small 50cc mokicks and mopeds with the handshifter, for example old rixe or a zündapp Bergsteiger. It was very popular on 1950s and 1960s German 50ccs
@Amuzic_Earth
@Amuzic_Earth Жыл бұрын
I started riding at the age of 15 with one of these grip shifter scooters. The scooter is from Bajaj(now part owner of KTM). There used to be competing scooter models from Vespa and Bajaj here in India in the 80s and 90s. After I moved up to motorcycles, I never missed them, but it felt good to be able to see which gear I was in. Always missed that in a motorcycle.
@WilliamLithgowGuitars
@WilliamLithgowGuitars Жыл бұрын
Was the Bajaj the copy of the Lambretta! I remember you could get one imported from India for £1200 or something! Maybe bit more expensive but bargain nonetheless!
@Amuzic_Earth
@Amuzic_Earth Жыл бұрын
@@WilliamLithgowGuitars yeah..pretty much same design and stuff...though I must admit I wasn't aware of Lambretta back then. 2 stroke engine meant it was quick and powerful.
@hodaka1000
@hodaka1000 Жыл бұрын
I can usually tell which gear I'm in by looking at the tachometer and speedometer
@Johnketes54
@Johnketes54 Жыл бұрын
My Suzuki GT550 two stroke had a "gear selecter" between the speedo and the rev counter a LED in red,Novel in it's time unnecessary though because the gear pedal would not move past top gear,Where the previous HONDA 350 the pedal would flop about giving you no indication of what gear you were in
@apexxxx10
@apexxxx10 Жыл бұрын
KTM KRONREIF TRUNKENPOLZ MATTIGHOFEN
@junk_rig_81
@junk_rig_81 Жыл бұрын
Nice review! 2 things missing in my own opinion: - my BMW R69 had a swing arm for, known here in France as "Earles" fork. Amazing thing was that the drummer brake was mounted on the horizontal arm, and when braking, the front of the bike and the head light
@marvikenplowingandracing4668
@marvikenplowingandracing4668 Жыл бұрын
In sweden the R69 (euro model)'s front suspension is could "ölgaffel" the translets to "bear"(that you drink)-fork, but the usdm models had normal "right" way turned forks (by old standard, meaning hydraulics on the bottom).
@russbilzing5348
@russbilzing5348 Жыл бұрын
I have used an Earles front end on a bike I was building and when it came to riding and braking, it had both good and bad habits, as follows... When braking, application of the lever caused the front of the machine to thrust UPWARDS instead of down. On normal bikes, using the front brake will tighten your cornering ability. With an Earles, it takes you to the high side of the turn, but, it also applies more downward force on the rear wheel. In short, it imitates the motions and results of a panic stop by a horse. This, in a motorcycle, is not to be despised. I became rather adept at juggling these reactions and hoped they would become something more of the norm, but with the exception of the R-69, I never saw another. Mine came from a junk pile that was all that was left of some antique European bike that had been between a concrete barrier and an 18 wheel truck.
@paulqueripel3493
@paulqueripel3493 Жыл бұрын
Apart from BMW, most seem to be aftermarket systems for sidecar use.
@junk_rig_81
@junk_rig_81 Жыл бұрын
Just to finish my comment, before I got pissed by my computer keyboard errors... I was surprised you didn' mention the Moto Guzzi 1000 Convert, which had a real "convertisseur" and not a computerized operated gearbox. I chickened out at the time, and bought the 5 gears manual version. In my very early days of riding, I had a Honda PS50, wich had a 3 speeds gearbox controlled by handlebar rotating grip. Very slow bike, but gearbox and 4 stroke engine were not common on mopeds at the time!
@rogerdodrill4733
@rogerdodrill4733 Жыл бұрын
@@russbilzing5348 in the 60s Sachs,down& Greece's dirt bikes had leading link front forks,which were handy. They didn't dip when brake's we're applied,so you had full travel when you hit bumps after braking, but hard to wheelie ,cause extra front end weight
@stevecambers3190
@stevecambers3190 Жыл бұрын
The commentary & presentation of your videos is excellent. Clearly spoken & with no annoying music. The subject matter is also great. Thank you. Keep up the good work...
@brucerogermorgan2388
@brucerogermorgan2388 8 ай бұрын
I started riding in 1965, and almost all scooters and mopeds then had twist shift, it was considered standard equipment. One noticeable scooter that had foot shift was the C-Zeta, and that was also made in New Zealand under license as the N-Zeta. Front Suspension: You didn't mention BMW's amazing Telelever front suspension. I was given a ride on one when they first came out and it is astonishing. Totally stable, you could apply full front brakes and there is no dive and the front end is completely stable. Remember that BMW were the first company to have hydraulically damped front forks, too, in the 1930's.
@malcolmgee6812
@malcolmgee6812 Ай бұрын
BMW have always tried something different with front ends. Dont forget they used leading link well into the 70's
@brucerogermorgan2388
@brucerogermorgan2388 Ай бұрын
@@malcolmgee6812 I have an R75/5 that was made in 1973, it has telescopic front forks. The Earles front forks were gone in 1972.
@dirkvoninnsbruck9458
@dirkvoninnsbruck9458 Жыл бұрын
The Simson Schwalbe also had a Gripshift. It was also quite common in the mountain bike industry. BMW used a system called Telelever that is different from the usual teleforks. The main reason to favor this system is that these bikes literally have no diving in under front braking. You always have full front travel even under hard braking. In the 90's a man from Austria invented a parallelogram front fork for mountain bikes that works similar to the telelever front suspension. But in the bicycle industry it did not catch on.
@peterwilliams2152
@peterwilliams2152 Жыл бұрын
The BMW Telelever was invented in the UK by Saxon-Motodd.
@VintageSG
@VintageSG 8 ай бұрын
@@peterwilliams2152 Norman Hossack is credited with the design.
@peterwilliams2152
@peterwilliams2152 8 ай бұрын
@@VintageSG Learn to read - Telelever was designed by Saxon-Motodd. Duolever was designed by Hossack amongst others.
@jala6707
@jala6707 Жыл бұрын
My friends and I used to ride our German-made Puch and Zundapp mopeds (49cc) to highschool back in the '70s. Left hand side grip gear shifters were very common back then. But it required some serious hand-strength to hold and twist the grip (to the right gear!) at the same time. It was just NOT a convenient system!
@zorktxandnand3774
@zorktxandnand3774 Жыл бұрын
It was indeed common on a lot of 60's and 70's mopeds. Never found it hard to shift, maybe you rode a bike with bad rusty cables. And this is one of the problems, the control cables have to be adjusted right to get in to the right gear. The way the system works means it is also not suitable for higher power bikes, say >150cc.
@thorman1742
@thorman1742 Жыл бұрын
AFAIK the Puch was also sold with left foot gear shifter, but I remember the left handlebar shifter on several 50 cc mopeds back then.
@denniscook390
@denniscook390 Жыл бұрын
@@thorman1742 My first motorcycle was a Puch, an early 60's moped, and I was 14. It had a left foot shifter and true to it's moped name you could pedal it although up hills was almost impossible.
@madbrowndog4887
@madbrowndog4887 Жыл бұрын
My first bike had some very unusual innovations. Fully enclosed chain. Rear wheel could be quickly removed leaving the chain and sprocket attached to the swing arm. And the front and rear wheels were identical and interchangeable allowing you to even out the wear on the tyres. And sometimes, when I thought I had engaged first gear it would reverse! (I'm not sure if that was a feature or a fault.) The mighty Voskhod 175!
@grene1955
@grene1955 Жыл бұрын
My 2003 BMW R1200CL has linked brakes, and I love it! It feels very controllable.
@russbilzing5348
@russbilzing5348 Жыл бұрын
I once had an old hard tailed, HD, two stroke, single that had a left grip mounted , 3 speed, shifter clutch like you show here. I thought it worked just fine, but I did not ride it in the woods or on the trails, either. I imagine that it might have some problems, there.
@stephencummins7589
@stephencummins7589 Жыл бұрын
The Jawa Checoslovaquia 250 1956 if I recall the year had a clutch activated by the gear shift, plus the hand clutch, I rode that bike a lot did not know much but thought it was pretty cool
@MrJcmoore
@MrJcmoore Жыл бұрын
Excellent review. I do enjoy the DCT Africa Twin...quick seamless shifting...very fun. I am very interestedd too in the self balancing bikes...i see some cool uses for this. Thanks for sharing.
@alternator7893
@alternator7893 Жыл бұрын
My favorite innovation that never caught on was the Triumph sprung hub. It’s a suspension unit contained within the rear wheel hub and it was designed to give Triumph’s existing rigid frames the option of rear suspension.
@alternator7893
@alternator7893 Жыл бұрын
@Retired Bore not only that, it was also “potentially dangerous at high speeds” and one of the first moto accessories to come with a safety warning. It is also remembered as “a pain in the ass” literally and figuratively to repair and “one of the weirdest and worst rear suspension systems of all time”.
@P_RO_
@P_RO_ Жыл бұрын
It was a good enough concept but simply didn't work well. Using modern metals and dry teflon sliding surfaces it would make a good addition to a hard-tail chopper, adding a bit of cushioning for the worst bumps without losing the classic hard-tail look; certainly more visual appeal than a 'savior' frame which works as equally bad as the old sprung-hubs do. Can't see much use for it on any other kind of bike though.
@Jay_Speed
@Jay_Speed Жыл бұрын
@@P_RO_ Maybe on bicycles ?
@Deontjie
@Deontjie Жыл бұрын
What about the Buell? Everything is different.
@CrusaderSports250
@CrusaderSports250 Жыл бұрын
Sounds like someone has never riden one or had anything to do with them, an atrocious idea that fortunately never caught on and lasted but a few years, there are reasons why swinging arms are used on all bikes.
@Volker_GR
@Volker_GR Жыл бұрын
We talked a lot about turbo bikes. I just remember another, quite similar innovation on scooters that - as far as I know - never caught on in this segment (only in motorbikes like the Kawasaki H2): The compressor. The Peugeot Satelis 125 Compressor (2006-2012) and the Peugeot JetForce 125 Compressor (2003-2007) were both 4-stroke-scooters with a Roots blower, available with 15 or 20 hp. Fast 'n' thirsty 🙂
@gruffrossi5420
@gruffrossi5420 Жыл бұрын
nice triumph mate well clean cant beat brit iorn every one china an japan nicked alot jus made it better but they neve make there own #
@gruffrossi5420
@gruffrossi5420 Жыл бұрын
i ridw a firestorm vtr 22 year old bike still keep up with most bikes i like a bike yo have to ride not all these stopid mods the weekend bikes with all the kit more money than sence cant werk o new bikes have to put them in a shop its a big rip of the 400 deram waz auto an cub waz the first
@Volker_GR
@Volker_GR Жыл бұрын
@@gruffrossi5420 I agree, even if I have no idea why you wrote your posts under my comment 🙂
@marekmamot7986
@marekmamot7986 Жыл бұрын
Polish 50cc moped Romet "Komar" (mosquito) from the '60 used to have gripshifts it was necessary because the moped had a crank like a bicycle, it was used to start the engine and you could use it to ride it like a bicycle if you ran out of gas or an engine failure (which was common because it was commie times) They dropped it later in production in favour for kickstarter and classic gearshift, mostly because the gripshift was unreliable (not switching when you wanted and switching when you didn't) and they ditched the bicycle crank since riding it like a bicycle was more of a hassle than just pushing it along ;)
@Arthurzeiro
@Arthurzeiro Жыл бұрын
Funny thing is, here where I live the vast majority of motorcycles sold do have linked braking systems, in fact hundreds of thousands are sold yearly. Several years ago regulations passed mandating any bike to either have at least single channel ABS, or some sort of way to apply force to both brakes with only the foot one. That's a by-product of most riders being taught not to use the front brake therefore being scared shitless of using them since, that means much marger braking distances and lots of avoidable accidents, so by law the rear brake pedal applies 30% of the braking pressure to the front regardless of lever pressure.
@grenzviel4480
@grenzviel4480 Жыл бұрын
I think the problem with grip shift is that it turns with the clutch lever. Detaching the clutch lever, however, isn't really an option as it would be pretty hard to twist it while doing a 100% squeeze on the clutch. Unlike the throttle where you're either twisting the throttle to accelerate, or squeezing the brake lever to stop using the front wheel. Actions that you usually don't do at the same time compared to clutch and shift.
@TiagoBarufi
@TiagoBarufi Жыл бұрын
Vespas also have spare tires, and that could be an eleventh innovation: Kudos, very informative and well made
@BikerMage
@BikerMage Жыл бұрын
My Ural has a universal spare mounted, swapped it when my original pusher tire started wearing down. The problem is that most motorcycles use different front and rear wheels.
@railtrolley
@railtrolley Жыл бұрын
@@BikerMage There are also those small Isuzu cabover trucks, that have different size front and rear wheels: 2 spares bolted together, hanging under the tray, or van body.
@johngranato2673
@johngranato2673 Жыл бұрын
Everything else being equal, sales are the final word on the need for an innovation
@christophergriffin1695
@christophergriffin1695 2 күн бұрын
The Moto Guzzi linked brake system was two separate brakes. the handlebar operated one front disc, and the foot pedal operated the other front, as well as the rear disc.
@brianhill2515
@brianhill2515 Жыл бұрын
I think a small to medium capacity supercharged bike would work well. Plenty of torque and great fuel efficiency would be perfect for real world riding.
@carsyoungtimerfreak1149
@carsyoungtimerfreak1149 Жыл бұрын
With regards to hub center steering I tend to differ. it is by far the best solution. Much better than traditional forks. The CTS 1000 proved that clearly. Yet it does not look nice, it looks sort of clumsy. And most motorcyclists are very traditional...
@carlbruhn1772
@carlbruhn1772 Жыл бұрын
Erik Buell and radial braking. Superior in nearly every comparison but changes the looks drastically.
@funkiwikid6106
@funkiwikid6106 Жыл бұрын
The BMW moped with a roof, seat belts, no helmet, bare arms and T shirt. Such a great add for safety? About as safe as a gyrocopter ! And about zero chance of getting me in either.
@zacbell03
@zacbell03 Жыл бұрын
My father has a classic 150cc vespa with a grip shift, I can tell you why they didn’t catch on, it’s because they suck. Trying to let out the clutch in 1st is horrible because your fingers are pointing to the sky meaning your wrist is bent really weirdly. It’s hard to get any finesse with them
@finlaymcdiarmid5832
@finlaymcdiarmid5832 Жыл бұрын
Imagine running into the back of someone with your hand like that.. thats gonna hurt!
@P_RO_
@P_RO_ Жыл бұрын
There's been numerous kinds of front ends on bikes, and some do work better than telescopic forks for some situations. One oddity was the British "Dot" trail bike, which had no springs or shocks, but instead used rubber bushings in torsion. Hub center steering dates back to the 1920's as does many of the "modern" ideas used on motorcycles. Telescopic forks do well at everything with low cost, durability, and simple engineering which is why they will always be most common. I have to agree on the disliking of anything between me and my direct control of the bike, for me including ABS and linked brakes too. I don't want anything to think or do for me those things I can and should be dealing with myself; it is exactly that which makes the experience of riding a motorcycle so unique and so rewarding. But sometimes I can understand others wanting different... I was parked in a bike shop waiting my turn for something when I noticed a guy on a Honda pull in. There was something a bit odd about the way the bike sounded and how he was riding. I noticed the bike was one of their "automatic" models as he too pulled into the shop, kicked the sidestand down, then hopped off the bike onto his one leg. Gotta respect someone who loved riding so much they wouldn't let an amputated leg stop them from doing it- for him the automatic trans made all the difference in the world.
@Johnketes54
@Johnketes54 Жыл бұрын
I helped a young man who had lost his hand and made a clutch operarated with his knee against the fuel tank,He had a mechanical hand probably not strong enough to pull the clutch
@munroberry1248
@munroberry1248 Жыл бұрын
I agree P RO with your dislike of ABS, and can add to your info about centre hub steering - Militaire had it in 1914. Despite its French name, it was made in the USA. Cheers, Munro Berry
@changsangma1915
@changsangma1915 Жыл бұрын
As much as simple fork steering design is well, simple in engineering....what i don't get is the apparent mechanical stress all going to the pivot point, the whole weight of the bike along with rider....& not a single engineering rectification on it. Seen bunch of bikes & cycle mishap & that's the first thing that's breaks off under stress. This is more of production cost cut leverage for its simplicity sake in engineering, that's why it's still prevalent. It's cute when certain narrative seem to favor but not quite.
@bigcheese781
@bigcheese781 8 ай бұрын
Grip shift is far more common than those Italian brands. It came from mopeds and small cc utilitarian bikes.
@SteveMuir
@SteveMuir 9 ай бұрын
The front forks on the Britton are innovative but the guys that raced it said that they were the main problem with the bike in bumpy corners . I still love it.
@MrBuellMike
@MrBuellMike Жыл бұрын
The grip shift appears nice and simple, as long as you’re not riding in the dark and/or bad weather. Also, the clutch cable needs maintenance regularly. And, yes, in Europe, there were a lot of Mopeds with this shifter setup; I.e. Zündapp, Hercules (Gernany) Puch (Austria) and Simson (German Democratic Republic), and I’m pretty sure there are more. Greetings from the other side, ride safe.
@etiennedecarpentier9353
@etiennedecarpentier9353 8 ай бұрын
I can add Flandria, malaguti and garelli for sure and maybe gitane test and Peugeot :)
@truthsRsung
@truthsRsung 8 ай бұрын
@MrBuellMike...Why do you think that an extra cable running up to the handlebars is nice or simple? Or that one side of the handlebars has more play in it than the other? Just because there were a lot of this shifter made does not make it a good idea, unless there were a lot of people in Europe missing their Left Foot.
@MrBuellMike
@MrBuellMike 8 ай бұрын
@@truthsRsung hey there, you got me wrong… I always found the grip shift unpractical, that’s why I wrote „APPEARS nice and simple“…! Greetings, Mike.
@truthsRsung
@truthsRsung 8 ай бұрын
@@MrBuellMike ....Hot tip...Sarcasm does not translate in written form well without an 😉.
@MrBuellMike
@MrBuellMike 8 ай бұрын
@@truthsRsung 😋👍🏻
@crapple5759
@crapple5759 Жыл бұрын
I always wanted to see someone develop a real-life "Keneda's Bike" from Akira. I'm surprised you didn't mention anything like the single-side swingarm or dual-spar frame (both included on Honda's amazing 1988 NT650GT "Hawk".
@steeltube195
@steeltube195 Жыл бұрын
Most BMW and Ducatis have single side swingarm, and some Hondas too besides the amazing 1988 Hawk... I love the Hawk too.
@rackkimigayo8358
@rackkimigayo8358 8 ай бұрын
Googling the word "Keneda's Bike" and this one came up. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/rseXa5Oruc6bZ2g.html
@martinpook5707
@martinpook5707 Жыл бұрын
I had an Italian Itom Tabor Sport 62cc with handlebar mounted gear change - this was back in the 60s - and the problem was that it used two Bowden cables and keeping them in perfect tension was difficult. A missed gear could result in stripping the teeth off the gear primary drive.
@papaballoon
@papaballoon Жыл бұрын
I got a Honda helix by accident and loved it! I am a dedicated scooter rider now.. and have been for 30 years.
@thinkofsomething4782
@thinkofsomething4782 Жыл бұрын
many small mopeds in germany also had a grip shift system. they had mostly 2 or three gears and where used in mopeds/mofas from many manufactorys like Hercules, Puch, KTM, Zündapp, NSU or Simson. some also had an 2 speed automatic transmission
@electric_boogaloo496
@electric_boogaloo496 Жыл бұрын
I learned to ride motor equipped bikes on a twist grip shifter equipped scooter. My dad owned a Vespa knock off. It took an good amount of strength to get it to shift because the mechanism uses cables. Also, the position of the clutch lever would keep moving and put it way out of a comfortable position if it had more than 4 gears. The clutch lever position was already drastically different between 1st and 4th gear. The clutch develops all sorts of up and down play because all the twisting torque from the left hand passed through it. Good riddance I say. Nothing beats the cost, weight advantage and simplicity of a fork. Good enough for MotoGP, Motocross or Hard Enduro, or even downhill mountain biking, good enough for all consumers. Some suspension dive is desirable for motorcycles because it reduces wheelbase and makes a bike more willing to turn under braking, and often, the fastest way around a turn involves trail braking.
@thefantasyreview8709
@thefantasyreview8709 Жыл бұрын
Dude, twist grips were the only gear changing mechanism on Vespa scooters, from the 1940s though to 2017 - bajillions of them were made, and people were quite happy with them.
@idiotluggage
@idiotluggage Жыл бұрын
There were people making grip shifters as an aftermarket product. The guy I bought one off of (for my mod'd Vespa) said he designed it for a friend that was paraplegic and wanted to race. They also tied both brakes to the handle bar lever.
@mattiaikas1634
@mattiaikas1634 Жыл бұрын
GTS owner here ;) It `s a good handling bike, bit heavy to push around but for it`s size and weight surprisingly agile up to about 90kph, not sure what happens to it when you enter highway speeds but the whole bike just transforms into a very steady high speed mode like if it had adaptive power steering. Can also lug quite a bit of cargo with the full pannier kit without affecting ridability. A real unsung hero IMO.
@Cartier_specialist
@Cartier_specialist Жыл бұрын
He mistakenly called the GTS 1000 a Honda. I don't know if you noticed that or not.
@MistaWeeGee
@MistaWeeGee Жыл бұрын
WIth the Guzzi linked brake, did the pedal not operate one front disc and the rear? I think there was a proportioning valve so the effort wasn't evenly distributed as well. Anyways point is there were still 2 independent circuits on the bike, so you still had redundancy. Many who ride these older Guzzis swear by the system although ABS has made it redundant, it could be a real bitch to bleed though On Hub centred steering ISR a small volume Swedish company, more notable for their brakes, offer a hub centered steering kit for custom frame builders
@zorktxandnand3774
@zorktxandnand3774 Жыл бұрын
Correct, the pedal operated the rear brake and one of the front disks, the other was controlled by the normal brake handle. not sure there were models with a proportioning valve. At least the small block Guzzi's I own do not have one. But I converted them to conventional controls. Also Moto Guzzi also made an Automatic bike with a torque converter (V1000 convert) And 2 wheel drive bikes.
@mrjoneseastend
@mrjoneseastend Жыл бұрын
You could stamp hard on the foot pedal with confidence knowing that the wheels would never lock especially in the wet. A very simple system which was pre ABS but a bitch to bleed with a tube and bottle but now with inexpensive vacuum pumps it's easy.
@johnnyjorgensen4768
@johnnyjorgensen4768 Жыл бұрын
Keep doing what you're doing, I love this stuff. Your channel is gonna be the next Fortnine if you stick with it, quality two wheeled content is hard to find unless it's secretly a sales pitch or money grab for the author. Thank you for another great vid
@TheSuperCaralho
@TheSuperCaralho Жыл бұрын
Nice chanel .. nice video! What you was looking for about the self driving as a remark is "self driving is good for transport machines, motorcycles are usually not used as transportation, they are primarily a fun moment, and on top of that, have the benefit of taking us around".
@vrancdouwma8868
@vrancdouwma8868 8 ай бұрын
Handle bar shifting: The older German Zundapp and Kreidler light bikes used this kind of shifting… And for combined braking: this is used on BMW’s as standard, where the rear brake is engaged together with the front brake in order to stabilize the bike.
@philipgrice1026
@philipgrice1026 Жыл бұрын
I love the way you credit Honda for the GTS hub center steering as the GTS was a Yamaha, as clearly shown in the picture accompanying your voice over. That about sums up what your opinions are worth to me. You might actually try riding some of these bikes before expressing your flatulence about them. For example, twist grip gear shifts have been, and still are, used on a wide variety of two wheeled vehicles where it is impracticable to use ones feet to shift gears. I have two bicycles that use a twist grip to shift gears. Just because you are ignorant about them does not mean they don't exist. They still do and they work very well. Sadly today's motorcycles have descended into fashion statements, Most are like their riders. Fat and loud. I was drawn to motorcycling sixty years ago as it was the closest thing to flying that could experience. Modern bikes are too big, too heavy, and too slow to change direction, including many so called 'sport' bikes. I blame the lawyers and accountants.
@howardosborne8647
@howardosborne8647 Жыл бұрын
Yes,I noticed that glaring cock up as well. I guess he thinks you can just call it whatever you like...a Yamkawahonzuki is as good as anything. Another channel that is very light on accurate detail.
@dutchsailor6620
@dutchsailor6620 Жыл бұрын
Hear hear. If this channel shows anything, its the lack of knowledge, experience and research of its owner.
@Johnketes54
@Johnketes54 Жыл бұрын
You said it for me as well
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