Ayeee thank you! And as I said, I'm not here to debate who won or lost. Just want to provide other perspectives as to what the judges may or may not have been looking at. Huge thank you for supporting the first ever Breakin' sneaker

Aye thanks! I find that majority of goldschool Bboys want to share knowledge and experience, but many are too busy focusing on their careers. I haven't been battling for a while so I have the time to share a bit more. In he future there will be a lot more Bboys sharing more knowledge and experiences once they retire from competitive battling

Yes most definitely. Which is the reason why I wanted to help clarify this because I too was once without the understanding and took a while for me to learn, understand and appreciate so I have a heart for sharing deeper knowledge about this artform and culture which we all love

🙏🙏🙏

Also one of my favorite clips of all time is by bboy ken swift, really amazing uprock showing how it’s done. Really speaks volumes kzfaq.info/get/bejne/q8mnlK-W0s-6YJs.html

Through all the noise, I saw that there were people who legitimately wanted to understand from a different perspective. It's not easy for people who haven't lived it or been in a raw cypher battle to understand the language going on.

wait what, bboying Olympics now ? What other dancing are included ?

@@xrizbira I’m not sure, but breaking was at the youth Olympics and it was super popular, and it’s gonna debut at the 2024 Olympics

Definitely coming back, but probably not to regular type competitions. More for showdowns that require a transparent system that focuses on "fairness" and audience education. 🙏

@@DyzeeDiaries So that's why the OUR system was used for Hong 10 vs Harricane huh. Respect Dyzee!

Agree

Ayeee much props! Loved Spain! Be safe and see you in the future

🙏🙏🙏

Maraming salamat Pareeeeee

Glad it was helpful!

That glare said "Bro, I defended and fought along side you when Jeffro was calling us out. Now you gonna vote against me like that...aight then.", lol.

ah one day when I have the time I will spend more time doing Battle Breakdowns!

Hahaha yooo evil skwerl how you been!?

@@DyzeeDiaries chillin , livin in japan with my family. If your ever rockin in japan let me know!

Much appreciated

really appreciate it 🙏

Yes!!!! I know right?? I miss style, flava in breaking. Thats why I really miss breaking back in the day. Purely street style, breaking in the bronx. I'm Malaysian, but I started breaking because of oldschoool bboys with style like Born, Kazuhiro and mostly Crazy Legz

Exactly. While there definitely are some biased calls, the judges are given a seat because they have earned the honor where their opinion is valued. While I highly doubt that BC One will ever want to adopt a more fair or transparent system, I think they can atleast get all the judges to give a dope interview where they rewatch the battles and explain what they were looking at.

@@DyzeeDiaries That's a good point. If they told ppl what they looked at after the battle it would help. Also just a change here or there with burns by Shingikix it could have turned this... never had the crowd kinda out of his favor before good learning so he will be ready next time

@@adriengadson3544 yeah we need to remember that Shigekix is really young! He for sure will never forget this experience and he will come back even harder and more dangerous than ever

Yes, if using OUR system, Shigekix would most likely win. But remember, that's usually tailored with judges that are specialist in each category, voting only on their respective category. For this battle, most of the judges, in my opinion, favored style, freestyling/musicality, and battle/cypher energy. To me, with that panel of judges, throwing power and sets would be useless if it didn't have the battle mentality and musicality. A great example of how someone like Shigekix should have responded to Flea was actually the Nadia vs Logistix battle the same night.

Yeah the big problem is that judging, is inherently biased, and until we bring forth a more "fair" and inclusive (of all perspectives weighed equally) judging system, then this will continue to be an ongoing problem which plagues our community. Until people stand up and demand accountability or a fair system, we need to just enjoy Breakin' competitions for what it is...

Yeah crazy thing is that I know Shigekix knows how to burn as he took my burn workshop a long time ago. However, I think that dope burns have been absent in Breakin for a long time so it would have been hard for anyone to prepare for that level of a burn on the big stage. While I was watching I was hoping Shigkix would flip the burn back at him and actually he did try to, but he wasn't able to sell it

Exactly!!! Every burn has a counter burn. Every move has a counter move!

@@DyzeeDiaries Prior to battling with Flea, he's only been battling those with musicality, variations, powermoves, footworks, toprocks & freezes so its pretty understandable he doesnt resort to burns n stuff. But now... oh boy. Shigekix is gonna be like Golden Android from Justice League Animated I tell you man. 😂✋

MD YOUSUF GAZI THANK YOU I agree infinity percent! ♾ %

​@@clutchfit982 i am really glad to see that somebody is agreeing with me.

I agree but nothing can’t be helped especially with that panel of judges that were chosen they are so biased it’s not even funny. Bigger burns and greater crowd reaction? Shigekix was hella composed even when the crowd were against him in that battle...

@@nxxiv436 totally agree with you

I know what you are saying, and I somewhat agree. But underground Bboys usually have the element of surprise which works in their favor. Also, part of the game and the culture is about "rep". Every Bboy up on that stage has earned a rep for themselves, which means people know what you are good at, and expect you to do it. So that will usually work to your advantage in the sense that people will be anticipating you do what you do best. For example, we expect Pocket to fly, Roxrite to freeze, Lilou to have crazy moves and a funny character. So it's true people expect Flea to have that original Bboy flavor and he showed it at the highest level through the burn style. That definitely does help the Bboy audience to go crazy but it's the same for everyone who has a rep and whatever approach they have.

True. My point isn't that burns should automatically win, but a lot of people don't understand what is the purpose of burns

@Dyzee Diaries 💯

Cico is a powerhead but he voted against power. Some power is too gymnastic tbh

Just like any game or "sport", if the rules aren't explained, then the audience can't learn. With that said, I also am worried that Breakin' is going to flop badly in the Olympics. However, I believe that it will still create a boom for all the youth, and there will be a quite a few investments and work coming into the scene. But if we don't do prepare, it will die out like it did in the 80's and mid 2000's in Korea.

@@DyzeeDiaries Awesome to get a response from a legend in the game. Thank you for reading my comment. I feel like the general audience will perceive behavior like throwing out cocks, slicing up an opponent with a katana, or shooting somebody up with finger guns as immature or straight up childish. I'm trying to imagine this from the perspective of a viewer with zero breaking background. I have a feeling they're gonna see actions like this and think... 'What is this? THIS is an Olympic event???' I'm probably gonna get a lot of hate for saying this, but I think breaking is just too subjective to be an Olympic event. I'm afraid that our culture and dance, when demonstrated at it's rawest, 1981 warlike dance form, is going to get scrutinized by the general public. People are gonna disrespect breaking and ask, 'WHY is this an Olympic event?' Anyways, I hope my prediction (about breaking in the Olympics) will be bad one. I love breaking and wish nothing but the best for it. If there's anything I could suggest to make bboying / bgirling more welcomed is to stop throwing out cocks. Try explaining that concept to families all around the world watching an Olympic battle. They aren't going to like what they hear.

@@tsacelbuod Ahhhh i guess you haven't heard that burns using sexualized or overly violent actions have been banned for the Olympics? This has been a really big topic in the international community. I also agree that sexual and violent burns should be banned from the Olympics, only because it's a family event and we want to have a good image, but also because we will have all the other platforms like events, future showdown leagues and ofcourse the good old fashion cyphers kzfaq.info/get/bejne/pNiUp9poxsm2aHU.html

@@DyzeeDiaries Oh snap, I did not hear about this! This is FANTASTIC news. Breaking will be much more respected and accepted because of it!

@@DyzeeDiaries thanks for sharing that! I also hadn’t seen that. I think overtly is the key word there. I haven’t watched any battles from the youth olympics to understand how clean they’ve kept it, but it seems like maybe some of the martial arts inspired movements you mentioned should be acceptable, I agree with you on that. Taking that word overtly into mind, maybe things like beheading, or otherwise cutting things off or mutilating would be part of what should be avoided. Maybe I should go watch some of those youth Olympic videos to see how it went. 😅

Well if that is true, then that would be reason for some judges to think he lost if he doesn't understand what the burns perspective in Breakin' is. Once again, the goal is to try to win at all of the different perspectives. If a Breaker only tries to win at the "Wow" factor or execution perspecitve in Breakin', then they are limiting their chances at winning judges with other perspectives.

@@DyzeeDiaries people are just dumb to be honest like you, thinking that something values more than something else in this dance, who are you to telll that what marcio and kill is worse than burning? they both have their skill difficulty, it just shows how disrespctful and dumb you are to give more weight to some aspects of the dance, it is as original and difficult to burn with a katana than to do a one handed airflare

@@papalusho8626 I don't think people are dumb, I'm just saying that there are different perspectives that Bboys and Bgirls are judging on. What is dumb, that we as a community haven't accepted the fact yet that there are different approaches and perspectives to this dance, nor have made a system to account for every perspective and leave it to the nontransparent opinions of the judges. This is the reason of the outrage. In my opinion, one hand airflare and burning are two different approaches, like punching vs kicking and depends on how or when it's used. Just because someone burns more doesn't mean they should win, and just because someone does a one handed airflare, doesn't mean they should win either. What matters is how it's done in context of the battle conversation and if it has an affect on making the opponent look bad.

Df are you talking about. We have menno, kleju, and they smoked on many powermove. Should have won? Are you a clown? Even hong 10 would vote for flea rock. It is story telling style, powermoves aint shit.

@@HoangNguyen-jd2mr I'm not talking about Menno or kleju , there is 1 judge in there is not even the scene the female judge.

@@HoangNguyen-jd2mr m để ý có 1 con đàn bà k rõ tên nhưng xem bboy 7 năm nay chả bh thấy xuất hiện . Chứ mấy thằng menno kleju nói làm gì. Shigekix làm footwork còn nhiều hơn thằng flea :)) , à menno m nói nó smoke power move à ? V xem menno vs pocket 2015 redbull chưa :)))

From a conversational perspective, responding to burns, with better moves and skill is not as good as responding to burns with an even better burn while utilizing better moves and skills. No matter what the approach is, the battle conversation aspect of Breakin' is the ability to take the best of what your opponent does and throw it back in their face, especially if you think that what they did is easy. Ofcourse, the conversation perspective is just one of the five main perspectives in Breakin but my goal is only to shed light on different perspectives, not argue about who should have won as both were amazing in my opinion

Yeah both of them responded on a basic level, saying "I can do that too, but can you do this!" Which is what made this battle so great. Shigekix said "I can float too, so what? But can you halo to shoulder freeze? " And Flearock responds by basically saying "I can headspin into HALO, into windmill, turtle to 90... But can you burn?" It was just a really good conversation, from a conversational cypher perspective

Looking forward to it! Just make sure to not cross the line where you can get in serious trouble. In the street if you point your fingers at someone and shoot, you are telling them that you are going to kill them so be careful.

Actually, it's the culture and people who created the "sport" that get to explain what the rules are. Just because certain traditions aren't intuitive doesn't mean they aren't necessary. Just because the audience loves dunks in basketball doesn't mean they are now worth 5 points. In the 80s, the media turned Breakin' into all about the hardest moves and neglected the culture aspect of it.... Then Breakin' died out. It was the street culture that saved it through the underground. This time around, the actual practitioners of the artform are going to fight to preserve what battles are truly about. This is a war dance, all nations of the world know war, which is why this dance is universal in every country. Ofcourse in Olympics there will be rules against violent and sexual burns, but BC One isn't the Olympics and the true Bboys will do what they have always done, bust egos and get their egos busted

@@DyzeeDiaries " it's the culture and people who created the "sport" that get to explain what the rules are. " - man, imagine if rap was like that, reductive and dependent on the american understanding of what's important .. you'd never evolve. Not rules but essence, rules, along with the culture evolve or you think bboying should stay in bronx? So i know that's not true, rules evolve with the game to suit the different circumstances. "In the 80s, the media turned Breakin' into all about the hardest moves and neglected the culture aspect of it...." - so how about flow, execution, consistency .. are those also hyped up by media? You are straw-manning me, I never said that shigekix should win cus he did hardest moves, that would be ridiculous to say. So why are you engaging in that bro? " This is a war dance, all nations of the world know war, which is why this dance is universal in every country." - Yes, but every nation has a different dance and understanding of that war dance. So imagine a native american, in past times, coming to a maori warrior doing his dance trying to intimidate him and the other bloke just not being intimidated by him 'cus he doesn't get his culturally specific signs. But letting them fight it out in a proper battle will be decisive and that is universal. What if shigekix didn't get those burns and he just dismissed it all with a hand wave that he did, which is how it seemed to me (I'd do the same thing). You can't really say much than he got it cus the crowd responded that way and that's it ... what if they responded that way cus he was introduced as an old bboy, and that's what gave him props, that's also how it seemed to me, cus even when he crashed the audience still cheered him up which they didn't do for others. All you are saying sounds like a big stretch which I completely disagree with cus it leaves bboying naked to the subjective preference of judges that might be just too pretentious to realise it.

I apologize if I made it seem like I am trying to argue or debate with you. I had a lot of comments to reply and may have just wrote my comment quickly. The point I was trying to make with this video is not who should have won, but rather that there are other perspectives in Breakin' which are 1) important to the practitioners and need to be preserved if we are truly going to represent all the Bboys and Bgirls, and 2) properly explained to the general audience. The video was only meant to show a different perspective than what most non-breakers may intuitively look at. Obviously the dynamics, skills and execution are at the forefront and of course very important (despite some people saying it isn't) but at the same time, the dance goes deeper and is rich with tradition, rules and culture which many people want to preserve. To argue which ones should be weighed more is personal preference, but for the sake of being "fair", all we need to do is make sure that all perspectives are present on every judging panel and properly represented by Bboys and Bgirls who have proven themselves and earned the respect to give their opinion for that particular perspective. I think most large scale events try to do that, but we should then ask ourselves, who selects the judging panel? Anyway, I agree with your analogy on the Native VS Maori warrior and that it should just go down to the "battle", which is exactly what I believe happened in this battle which made it so great. Whether or not Shigekix understood or not, the crowd did and so did the judges, and if it's truly a battle, then the point is to make a rebuttal or comeback so specific to the previous argument, that nobody can deny it, otherwise it boils down to what the judges and audience "preferred". And yes, flow, execution and consistency is hyped up by the media (social media) and there are trends that come and go, but one thing is certain, whenever we say "now this is what Breakin' is all about, the next trend comes in to counter that. All we can do, is preserve the values and perspectives a long the way like the foundation, the essence, the skills, the originality, the music, the conversation, the burns, and YES the flow, execution and consistency. All of them is what make Breakin' so amazing to so many people.

@@DyzeeDiaries sorry I didn't replay, saw a notification but forgot to replay. Anyway it's all good. Thank you for taking your time to elaborate your perspective more. I think I understand your point better, still disagree but I appreciate you. I think there are people who embody those roots better in some of the new gen bboys like Amir. I think Amir might represents tradition without sacrificing any of the new gen ambitions. But tbh i never appreciated "loud mouth" bboys that couldn't walk the talk.. i never saw burns separately. For me it just raised the stakes for that bboy in particular cus if they can back it up with the moves then more points to them than they would get without rising the stakes with those burns, and if they can't then they are just talking smack and we have a sign for that in bboying to ridicule it. So for me it's impossible to see it that way. Flea rock just had the talk and i could not see that as an element in its own right. Lilou is a good example of being crazy with the burns but backing it up with crazy moves and musicality. The role of the burns, as I see it, is to rise the stakes for the bboy but I get that that used to be seen as an individual element but the times changed and the skill gap is pretty low to be able to define it as an individual thing. Feel like bboys should have more discussions on this just so that they can come to a more realistic and representative criteria.

@@DyzeeDiaries Flea crashed like 2 times in that battle but the judges were blinded by it sigh...