Ultimately, I don't think it is either one. The reason I say this is that consumers and corporations both are simply reacting, over time, to the crazy de-valuation of money. Even low-ball estimates show that after 100 years, our money only buys 2% (or 2 cents on the dollar) from what it did at the beginning of the 1900s (for like, comparable goods that were available both then and now). Of course there has been massive corporate cost cutting and extreme consumer penny pinching... the natural result of a debt-based system, but not within the control of either companies or consumers.

It’s us. I have almost no issues with the stuff I buy for my reef tank than I have bought for my fresh tanks over the years, that being said they cost WAY more.

I am planning my first planted aquarium. I've done a deep dive; I've watched hundreds of videos by a wide variety of presenters. Having been in construction my entire working life, I've never gone cheap when buying tools and have never regretted it. I see no reason to change now. I hate cheap imported junk! My budget, after months of saving my pennies, is $3,000. That said, I've noticed that the most expensive things are not necessarily that much better than the upper-mid-level of equipment. That category is where I am spending my money.

Do you have a video going over all the details for the tank directly behind you (our right, your left shoulder)?

I feal it is both. The customer and the manufacturer. You did a great job explaining.

Having worked in an aquarium shop, you should do a similar one on the markups from the wholesalers price on livestock. They would surprise some people.

@BentlyPascoe . I don’t know first hand of the Cobalt debacle, but based on how you described it. Their huge mistake was selling the cheaper product under the same brand name. One bad product can kill an entire brand name. Example is the Pontiac Aztec. They should created another brand to sell cheap product. That would get a segment of the market looking at price only and not hurt the main brand’s reputation. That said, you still should not offer product that has high return rates. In the long run, it will hurt the name of the lower brand and kill the industry. I applaud Aquarium Co-Op for pulling product the hurts their reputation. It makes me trust them even more. I know that you’re thinking is the same about them. Still, if companies feel they need to compete against these cheap companies. I would create a brand. Sell product that you can compete with them but give them a long enough warranty to capture that part of the market. Make parts easy to get replacements. I would even require that you have to register to get replacement parts. This will kill off the low end bad rep suppliers using the same manufacturer. The main brand can then target the mailing list of the cheap brand. Treat the cheap brand as a competitor. “Want to stop fixing your filter every year??? Just upgrade to us. We will even give you a discount if you show us proof that you bought this cheap brand’s product.” This way you capture a market you can’t with your main brand. Then upsell them to better product. It’s a long game, but one that will work, in my opinion.

Word. Big up!

GREAT video and all good points and I vote for the multi-factorial approach. (side note, I had a brand new eheim heater made in Germany fail within 10 days last year...even eheim is cutting corners). I think a good angle to dig deeper into is *why* people in the EU choose (or maybe can afford) to go for better equipment that is more pricey. Looking at it from a macro-econ perspective workers in the U.S. work more hours for a smaller overall percentage of corporate profit. We have to pay more for utilities. Example - Internet in some EU countries is considered a public utility and they pay around $10-20 a month for high speed internet. I'm a cancer survivor (stage 3) so let's not even get into how much we pay out of pocket to keep from being un-alived in the U.S. The list goes on. In the EU they do tend to have smaller homes, apartments so not as much space, therefore they will maybe have only 1-2 aquariums but get better quality equipment. They also tend to have more nano-smaller tanks, which will cost less. Also, when I watch MD fish tanks, he shows kits as those offered by super fish and they are pretty reasonably priced and nice quality. The quality of fish available is often sub par here in the U.S. (Dan's fish is making a difference) but why put a lot of money into something if you've only had fish die in a few days? There's cultural reasons as well, this is a hobby that appeals to people who are, as you say, fish nerds, emphasis on the "nerd" part. Ultimately one needs to invested intellectually and even somewhat spiritually to be willing to invest $$ in a hobby. So a person getting into it casually will not be as willing to put a lot of money into just a fish or two.

Everything is like this now, you spend money where necessary and cut cost where a cheap item does the job just as well as an expensive one does.

I really like your take on this. It seems that manufacturers and companies really take advantage of the fact that people, appearing to be mostly in the freshwater side, aim to have the cheapest or most budget friendly build. I am in agreement that it is both us and the manufacturers/companies. I always try to tell people cheaper does not always mean better. We don’t realize that sometimes you end up spending more money buying cheaper products over time (and having to replace them often) versus spending the money and investing in ones that will last a while. It all depends on many factors. Great video! This topic is always super interesting.

I agree with you about negative correlation between price and quality; and the huge differece between the consumption manner between hobbists in north America and those in Europe and Japan. But i also want to mention a number of products that are expensive and supposed to be high quality but in fact have very disappointing performance. That's to me something is also worth mentioning.

I'm kinda frustrated that Amazon suppliers are just buying temu products and reselling them for double the price. 😢 like. If i wanted Temu stuff, ida just bought it from them myself x.x

Interesting conversation. I think it's both the manufacturers and consumers. Imo

Not need to replace anything on my eheims yet and had mine maybe 6-4 years, I forget. Oase I sold and after 1-2 years they needed an O ring replacing, Fluval lasted 6 months to 2 years.

I’m all about QUALITY! Especially things that can impact the health of my tank inhabitants. I’m in the process of setting up a 55 gallon tank and I’ve researched, and asked questions, in order to make the best informed decisions. (Thank you, BTW)

Oh by the way, great subject. Yes we part of the problem.

One thing I would say is trade price speaks more then anything, the price few see.

I’ve seen that some Oase’ filters are breaking down. Made in Germany and are not cheap.

At least your cheap products are inexpensive. In Australia we get the joy of cheap nasty products still being expensive! The cheapest tank you can buy here is a 20L tank from Kmart for $39 (thats 5gallons for About 26usd), jealous about your dollar per gallon sales! Some things can and should be cheap as chips (sponge) others (electrical) you get what you pay for.

@Bentley Pascoe Want to go halves on the outgoing Coop Warehouse to fill up with the products you just showed us? Margins are good. Lol.

It's one thing to be buying cheap Chinese products instead of more expensive, better products from Western brands, and quite another to be buying Chinese products direct from Chinese factories or sellers instead of buying Chinese-MADE but Western-BRANDED products at marked up prices. I can buy Chihiros lights from Ali Express and pay 60% what is have to pay if I were buying those same lights from my local retailers (Australia). When it comes to pre-filter foams, why should I pay $15 for one at my local fish shop when I could pay an Ali Express seller $6 for a pack of four of the exact same filter foam delivered? Western brands are buying these cheap Chinese products and fleecing Western consumers. We now have direct access to these products. No problems at all.

I'm kind of stuck in the middle regarding quality concerns. First and foremost, we all want all equipment we buy to last until the end of time, or at least 10 years hahaha. But if that were ever the case, manufacturers would realize very quickly there is no money to be made in high end heaters, lights, filters, etc. Then they switch gears and stop making that stuff. I am still waiting on future videos relate to your anoxic 40 gallon. But that is a prime example of manufacturers not getting more money in the future. I've literally never replaced an undergravel filter unless I was setting up new tanks. I bought the Lee's premium UGF plates for all my tanks and paid a premium price but Lee's probably won't profit from me again until I get my 125 gallon tank. Hopefully I can still find a UGF when that day comes. I generally focus on getting a decent deal (or at least in my head) for something that will last 3 to 5 years. They stay in business and we all still have access to products we want. I know it won't be a popular comment, but planned obsolescence benefits consumers and manufacturers alike. Now, bottom barrel junk is just irresponsible and hurts consumers and the brand's reputation.

As far as heaters go, They are all going to fail and that is a fact, and when they do they either don't heat or they stick on and boil the contents of your tank. Therefore I have an inkbird temperature controller on every tank with a heater in it, and so I never have a heater failure that will stick on and boil a tank.

If you are not willing to spend do not be surprised if your stuff turns out to be shitty. Also a lot of stuff can be made yourself.

So, what I’m hearing is that every LFS store should have their own special branded sponge filters…?

Good sh*t, bent

2:35 personally i think its disgusting how cheap Americans are especially with live animals.... BUT I as an American understand why. Its bc largely we don't get what we should. For most of us we should be making over 5-10× what we do by what we produce and how much profit it generates. And if that were the case our 'cheap' would still be expensive to those other countries lol. But they are in the same boat, its just not as advanced yet haha. Ive come to where I just won't do it or get it if I can't do it the way I really want to or feel it should be done. Quality.

Products from China do have the potential to be great, we demand cheaper purchases and ruin the products as well as demand higher returns on our stock market investments. Human greed is definitely the reason for lowered quality across all manufacturing, domestic or abroad. People be doing Peoply things 😉

I see it on every aquarium forum, people saying they run the cheapest equipment and it's all the same. I'm an equipment nerd so maybe I'm weird, but I'm always trying to buy the best I can afford. I just bought a cobalt neo therm pro to try out when the next coop heater dies.

China... -50% negotiated can be done. If you are a very knowledgeable buyer you can do well. Buying from China is exercise in sorting thru junk and poor suppliers. A long term relationship with a good supplier is a must.

China "trump voice"