Billy Wagner Belongs in the Hall of Fame

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7 ай бұрын

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In his 9th year on the ballot, Billy Wagner is long overdue for the Hall of Fame. A seven-time All-Star, member of the 400-save club, and arguably the most efficient strikeout pitcher in the history of the sport, it's time for the third-best closer in MLB history to take his rightful spot in Cooperstown.
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Пікірлер: 162

@EpicGamer14_ 7 ай бұрын

Wagner should’ve been in a long time ago. It’s a shame it’s taken him until year 9, and he’s still not in.

@RealCGH 7 ай бұрын

Crazy part is that idk how he isn't in, Mariana Rivera was the first unanimous induction in MLB hall of fame history so closers aren't stigmatized that much

@kristopherwilson506 7 ай бұрын

@@RealCGHbecause Rivera has rings and was in the national spotlight

@taylormillion7244 7 ай бұрын

Tbh silly Billy Wagner should be in the hall. But I don’t think that silly Billy Wagner will ever get in

@og5466 21 күн бұрын

How can a closer be great if it doesnt reflect into a ring

@isaacangelos 7 ай бұрын

One thing that stands out to me is how highly Joe Nathan ranks in many of these stats.

@fortynights1513 7 ай бұрын

Nathan had a great career but was not good in the playoffs. Say what you want about him being in Cooperstown, but I at least would argue that he should’ve gotten 5% of the vote.

@timberwolvesguy6392 7 ай бұрын

Absolute travesty that he didn’t even get the 5% vote to have a second year on the ballot. I may be biased as a Twins fan, but he absolutely belongs in the Hall as one of the best closers of all time

@isaacangelos 7 ай бұрын

@@timberwolvesguy6392 I’m from Texas and lived in Minnesota, so two of my top three favorite teams are the Rangers and Twins, so I’m definitely biased towards Joe Nathan, but him getting so little consideration from the Hall of Fame, despite how great many of his stats are, is a travesty, like you said.

@fortynights1513 7 ай бұрын

⁠⁠⁠@@timberwolvesguy6392The thing about Joe Nathan and relievers like him is that the standards of sabermetric stats like win probability added and ERA+ for relievers at their peak are not well understood by most voters. Most of them seem to just go off of total saves, and possibly the peak years of that stat. In Joe Nathan’s case specifically, voters would’ve seen a pitcher who didn’t get to 400 saves (though he does rank 10th I think), and was not good in the playoffs, so I’m not surprised he was ignored. In my opinion, looking only at saves is flawed because while at the end of the day, a pitcher needs to finish the game with the lead to get the save, a pitcher could theoretically pitch his way into trouble, and give up a run or two, and get a save that counts the same as a pitcher who got three outs without allowing a baserunner. In my opinion, there should be a stat for what I call “quality relief appearances”, which I define as the following: 1. The pitcher has to have faced three batters after entering the game in relief. 2. The pitcher cannot allow any runs, earned or unearned. And 3. The pitcher cannot allow more than one baserunner. The raw total of this could allow us to account for all appearances of three batters or more regardless of whether it’s a save situation or not (I would suggest a split for save situations and non save situations). Joe Nathan for the record, has 712 appearances of three or more batters faced in his career, and by my definition, 463 were quality relief appearances, or 65%. That percentage is matched only by Kenley Jansen among pitchers who have as many appearances of three batters or more in relief, though several have more volume, and percentages of this stat are increasing from generation to generation as multi inning relief appearances become less common. Out of curiosity, what do you think of that potential stat? I think there should be a relief equivalent of quality starts personally, and that’s what I’d suggest.

@jamesdubeck4920 7 ай бұрын

Billy should be in that 99 year was wild Closers that always come to mind. You guessed it. Mariano, hoffman and wagner

@markmccammon266 7 ай бұрын

As a lifetime ASTROS, Colt .45's fan I had the distinct pleasure of watching this incredible man save games and blow away rival batters with seeming ease. All of his numbers are better than many in the Hall. The Hall of Fame has become a Hall of Very Good recently. The facts and stats of so many in recent years don't stack up to greatness.

@carlpacquing2575 7 ай бұрын

Billy Wagner's candidacy will play a pivotal role for the next generation of closers, like K-Rod, Kimbrel, and Chapman. Hopefully we see him go in so the next closers will get looked at seriously.

@troylee4196 7 ай бұрын

K Rod should be in no questions

@Osiris3657 7 ай бұрын

Stros fan here who grew up rooting for Billy in the 90s. Loved watching Billy throw 100mph fastballs past hitters back when that was still awe inspiring

@PitBullSamiTut 7 ай бұрын

Wagner yes- also- Joe Nathan. That guy’s numbers are INSANE. And yes, Chapman, Kimbrel and Jansen down the road. Also, just puttin this out there- Papelbon’s numbers are incredible.

@brientaylorcohen 7 ай бұрын

Papelbon's playoff stats are far greater than Wagner's and his regular season numbers are very close. But Pap and Chapman are both so unlikeable it's tough to see either get a fair amount of HOF votes.

@fortynights1513 7 ай бұрын

@@brientaylorcohenShould Papelbon or Joe Nathan have gotten 5% of the vote in your opinion?

@PitBullSamiTut 7 ай бұрын

@@fortynights1513 if you’re asking me who I think is better, I’m gonna say Nathan by a hair. But both guys have insane 7yearWAR stat averages. Among the best in the history of baseball for relievers for both guys.

@fortynights1513 7 ай бұрын

@@PitBullSamiTutHere’s the thing: Nathan has an ERA+ on baseball reference of 151 vs 177 for Papelbon, but Nathan also pitched roughly 200 more innings. Papelbon however had an ERA of 1.00 in 27 playoff innings and Nathan’s playoff ERA is 8.10 in 10 playoff innings. Both players are among the best ERA’s for their respective career volumes, but Papelbon had a better playoff career. I could see the argument for either one being better than the other, but either way both guys arguably played well enough to deserve to break 5% of the vote, and neither one did. If they came up last year, they may have had more of a shot.

@PitBullSamiTut 7 ай бұрын

@@fortynights1513 for sure Nathan gave up the huge dinger to Arod in the playoffs and definitely wasn’t a good playoff pitcher. But sheesh, we’re splitting hairs here. They’re both great and both HOF-worthy. Papelbon is highly underrated and when you put those 2 guys numbers up against the greatest relievers of all time, they’re both right there.

@JawaPenguin16 7 ай бұрын

I love learning about some of these older great players that are hiding in plain sight. Thank you for the video, Billy Wagner earned a new fan.

@dudochalmers10 7 ай бұрын

I'm 25 and you saying its an older player makes me think how long I've been a fan of the sport now when I watched him on live TV haha

@Kyle-gi2jb 7 ай бұрын

Wagner has been circled on my mock HoF ballot for years. He was a damn good Brave!

@theman1412 7 ай бұрын

Him throwing 100 mph was always a big thrill when I was a kid watching him on the Astros 😊

@Gnar_Dogg 7 ай бұрын

Seriously. Wasn't nearly as common back then to see 100mph on the gun. These days there's a ton of guys throwing gas.

@danielmetcalfe5589 7 ай бұрын

Damn right. My favorite pitcher of all time. As a short kid from Houston, who’s only athletic skill was throwing things really hard, Billy Wagner was my hero (alongside Craig Biggio, but I couldn’t hit to save my life). He deserves to be in, and I think this could be his year. Greatest lefty RP of all time.

@Garfieldforpresident2024 7 ай бұрын

Please make a video on Derrek Lee. He was my favorite player in MLB Power Pros 2007 and I would love to see him get the respect he deserves. (Everyone like this video so Jolly can see this.)

@jethrojacinto2798 7 ай бұрын

Red Sox legend Billy Wagner WILL be a of Famer in 2024 (along with Helton and Beltre).

@drewskidayosh 7 ай бұрын

Extremely based, Wagner is the best lefty closer ever, was truly fun to watch. Shame hes not in the HOF already. Excellent video, Jolly

@juliebraden6911 7 ай бұрын

Haven't heard anybody use the term based in a really long time wow

@wrathofrock8323 7 ай бұрын

Yeah this dude I always made sure to get in MVP Baseball 2005. Dude gave me nightmares facing him as a kid. Him and Lew Ford. 100% should be a hall of famer.

@ianstrong3588 7 ай бұрын

Wagner was the first Aroldis Chapman and is draft him on my fantasy team every year. Wagner was money and he threw gas.

@NDTexan 7 ай бұрын

Braves fan here. Even if he hadn't played for us towards the end I would still say he belongs in the hall and it's wrong he's not there already. And he was better than Hoffman. Hoffman was an accumulator for the most part, Billy was dominant

@Scat2533 7 ай бұрын

Jolly you are an absolute gift to baseball fans - amazing work as always

@montgomerystanley6487 7 ай бұрын

Billy The Kid! The real life movie of rookie of the year! Wagner is a legend and deserves the HoF without question.

@zackaryhaselius2226 7 ай бұрын

Wait, Dennis Eckersly isnt in the Hall either? Thats shameful. Edit: oh wait, he was a starter in his early career. So he is.

@Gemnist98 7 ай бұрын

Yeah. Eckersley is usually left off a lot of relief pitcher lists because he had significant time as both a starter and reliever. At least he’s in the Hall regardless.

@ice-iu3vv 6 ай бұрын

yes he belongs in the hall. for one thing, he's conclusively the best lefty closer of all time. shouldnt that be enough, to be the very best at something. could we imagine having a hall without the best switch-hitter, the best defensive player, the best lefty starter, the best right-handed hitter? if one constructed a dream-team 25 man alltime roster, billy wagner would obviously be selected on the basis of being the best lefty reliever. but we cant construct a 25 man dream team from the 250 people in the hall.

@coreygilliam8533 7 ай бұрын

Say title of vid and went "duh". But forgot people don't realize how incredibly talented this man was

@seancolbert9862 6 ай бұрын

I would love to see a video on the early 2010s Cincinnati reds. The best reds teams I’ve ever watched and they still couldn’t quite get it done, to the point of being no-hit in the playoffs. A recap of those years would be an interesting watch for me

@Josh-ut4wv 5 ай бұрын

I think the best way to explain why his small sample size of playoff numbers are so bad is largely he was on teams where he had to put in the work to get them over the hump to get in meaning by the time he got to the playoffs he was worn out. Now he should have been in the Hall ages ago but hopefully he gets those 5 votes he missed in year 9 for his final time. Also another intresting point is when he retired he still had more seasons in the tank but he wanted to go out on his terms

@6thwilbury2331 7 ай бұрын

I love this video... oddly, I used to get Wagner and Hoffman mixed up in my head all the time, at least when it came to fantasy ball. I started referring to Wagner as "the little guy" (he's my height) to get it straight in my head.

@lngun 7 ай бұрын

I remember watching Billy Wagner when he was on the Mets. I think he was facing the Yankees. As a Yankees fan I thought, we still have a chance here. I had never seen him pitch before. As soon as he threw that first fast ball, I knew we lost. He may be my first pitcher I had ever seen where I thought, "having this guy pitch for you is unfair".

@rickycamilo4488 7 ай бұрын

wait wait wait lmaooo.... you are a yankee fan and watching Wagner pitch was the first time you had that thought? Not to take anything away from Wagner but you didn't think that watching Mariano? Who is basically the greatest reliever of all time ie: better than Wagner at his own position and pitched at the exact same time?

@IdliAmin_TheLastKingofSambar 5 ай бұрын

That said, I distinctly remember a very annoying game in 2006 in which Billy blew a 4-0 ninth inning lead to the Yankees. It didn’t end up mattering, as the Mets ran away with the division that year, but it was frustrating nonetheless. Billy should be in the Hall, though (plus he’s one of Gary Cohen’s favorite players to talk to, which I find interesting and kinda unexpected).

@brendanables7367 7 ай бұрын

2:47 RIP Jose Lima

@Radmetalmonk 7 ай бұрын

Get him in! Great vid

@Speedster___ 7 ай бұрын

Jay Jaffe has a fantastic article

@VyeSpree 7 ай бұрын

I loved billy on the Phils. Killed me when he signed with the mets

@Roy-or6ev 5 ай бұрын

Mr. Wagner has Nolan Ryan's stamp of approval. Enough said. 🤩

@ethanniedorowski116 7 ай бұрын

For over a 10 year period closer to 15 he was top 10 closer alltime yup he should be in it... throwing 100 before science made it easier he just did it. He was nails ask any player from 95 to 2008 it was him an mo for most part nobody wanted to see

@Coreyy12 6 ай бұрын

5:58 hi random Chris Martin cameo wtf. Never did I think I would see Chris Martin on a list with Mo Rivera and Billy Wagner

@Brah42 4 ай бұрын

Fax, no lies told

@TheFreelanceTeacher 7 ай бұрын

I agree.

@alton31ellis 6 ай бұрын

I agree that he belongs. He was iconic and a legend during his career. Little guy who was naturally right handed and threw 100mph southpaw. Billy the kid. Put him in.

@hussassain2745 7 ай бұрын

Was something else being a braves fan during his last season

@andrewtaylor1492 7 ай бұрын

Jolly throwing out another banger

@Gtasplayer 7 ай бұрын

It’s a decimal point so in ERA that would be a Point. 2 point 00 era for example. Dot would be used in something like an IP address

@CumLordGary 7 ай бұрын

Both him and K-Rod deserve to be in the hall

@artvandelay1099 7 ай бұрын

Informative video. I actually thought Billy Wagner was in the hall. I'm shocked and in disbelief. He was a very good pitcher. My only question, did his poor playoff performances cause the eliminaton of his teams from contention, or did he just get blown up in games that were already lost?

@Manbearbull 7 ай бұрын

4:40 my favorite part

@jrodsep 7 ай бұрын

Yes getting in. It's gonna be Beltre, Helton and Wagner. Mauer will get in next year or the following year.

@Cheryworld 7 ай бұрын

yes. John Franco too.

@pacolibre5411 4 ай бұрын

I have no clue how this man did not snap his elbow with every pitch. Put him in the hall just for that.

@jordanpatience9249 7 ай бұрын

Amen Wagner belongs in the hall along with Joe Jackson Dick Allen Lou Whitaker and Dale Murphy

@whatskevupto2964 7 ай бұрын

Some of the numbers he put up were insane, both Wagner and K-rod should be in

@pwrinnmbrs 7 ай бұрын

Wagner has a lower career WHIP than the six relievers in the HOF, slightly lower than even Mo’s, that’s wild.

@jackcoogan310 4 ай бұрын

73.8% is so darn close. He'll be in next year.

@JefferyJohnson-od1mm 6 ай бұрын

Rob was my favorite Br pitcher lol

@krafgeetar4013 7 ай бұрын

My high school coach coached this guy at Ferrum

@BXMarathoner26 7 ай бұрын

Part of me thinks if Mets made the WS in 2006 and didn't have the collapses of 07, 08 he probably would be in. As a Biased Mets fan, it just felt more lively hearing Enter Sandman for Wagner considering Mo Rivera hated the song and that genre of music in general.

@EHeroClayman 7 ай бұрын

Late to the party. Agreed with what Chris Rose said. When I saw Wagner I thought Hall of Famer. He should've been in the Hall already. If he doesn't, hopefully the Veterans committee will rectify that omission.

@diegoci2179 7 ай бұрын

As a Dads fan I request a formal apology for showing me a picture of brewers Hoffman

@theebronks 7 ай бұрын

the problem with the MLB hall of fame is the idea that there's a benefit to keeping people out. noone would complain if the top 3 percent of MLB players were inducted rather than the struggle to keep it as the top 1 percent.

@brusox20 7 ай бұрын

I totally forgot that Billy Wagner played for the Red Sox

@Tyrannis07 6 ай бұрын

No. I like Wagner but there has to be a threshold for greatness and Wagner was just really good. He never led the league in a single meaningful statistical category, and his playoff numbers are embarrassing. I can't think of one meaningful game he closed out. The same goes for Joe Nathan: pitched 10 career postseason innings and gave up 25 baserunners. Nobody cared about his 40 saves when that was going on.

@Nyx-qw5yh 7 ай бұрын

Both of the top 2 guys on the HoF ballot should’ve been in a long time ago. Wagner was lethal, and Helton was the only player to bat .500 in a single month

@SupErC24 12 күн бұрын

Could you do a break down of why Jeff Kent should be in the Hall of Fame?

@jamessinclair5859 7 ай бұрын

Ur a mets fan so I don’t expect u to but u should make a vid of why Utley should be a hall of famer

@MattPilkiePilkiewicz 6 ай бұрын

While we're talking about mets closers, what're the chances of a video on John Franco?

@Trevorlahey365 7 ай бұрын

Just bought myself a Red Sox billy Wagner jersey

@pickletheparakeet 7 ай бұрын

I got an ad for the black market!?!

@CharmCityGamer 7 ай бұрын

Wag’s should’ve been in ages ago. But I think this is the year for Wags.

@EthanRKassel 7 ай бұрын

The best lefty reliever ever.

@Gnar_Dogg 7 ай бұрын

Hopefully the voters show some sense this year an finally vote him in. Hated seeing this guy come out of the pen against the Cubs back whenthe Astros were stillan NL team. Though as much as I disliked it, I loved watching him pitch.

@jaredperkins8066 7 ай бұрын

Wagner is the man. He is more than deserving of the Hall.

@gabrielv.2647 7 ай бұрын

Billy Wagner, Todd helton, Jim Edmonds, Carlos Delgado, steroids shouldn't matter because David Ortiz got in, so curt schilling, Roger Clemens, Sammy Sosa, Manny Ramirez, Alex Rodriguez, Gary Sheffield, mark McGwire. And if I'm missing anybody off the top of my head, but all those should be hall of famers.

@glenndayz5865 7 ай бұрын

please make a video about Andruw Jones also not being in the HOF when he should be

@nathangursky4628 7 ай бұрын

Couldn’t pitch in October…

@Drewlocs 7 ай бұрын

Can you please make a Julio Rodriguez video

@richardlewis7172 7 ай бұрын

So does KRod

@ripuncleted 7 ай бұрын

Wagner begets Britton. Good video, thanks.

@patricknashh 7 ай бұрын

john franco and k-rod should also probably be in

@wwpjd28 7 ай бұрын

Do you post your Stathead search queries anywhere? I've tried to replicate some of them to look further down the lists. You are taking out all Negro League players and starting with Live ball era for these right?

@JollyOlive 7 ай бұрын

Yes, I usually start from the Expansion Era.

@wwpjd28 7 ай бұрын

@@JollyOlive Okay. That makes sense. Thanks!

@kennybailey4641 7 ай бұрын

Todd Helton video please!!!

@jameshudson169 6 ай бұрын

there's a 400 save club?

@jacobcisneros5651 7 ай бұрын

Besides Wagner, will we ever see relief pitchers get into the Hall again? Especially with the current trend of pitcher use?

@CatsDubbing-zt7jb 7 ай бұрын

Kimbrel

@fortynights1513 7 ай бұрын

How about Jansen?

@jamman950 5 ай бұрын

Less then 2% short damn

@ryancarroll1697 7 ай бұрын

Larry Walker video 2.0?

@dustinhealy1676 7 ай бұрын

Yes he does

@BennyintheBoothPodcast 7 ай бұрын

I call Billy Wagner the Lefty Mo for a reason

@Iamhungey 20 күн бұрын

Minus the postseason success.

@BraxtonMeyer 7 ай бұрын

is that the same chris rose from battlebots.?

@MLBTwins 7 ай бұрын

27 war

@avrahamscher1356 7 ай бұрын

Jolly banger #2

@zachkatsihtis4152 7 ай бұрын

So Does John Franco…?

@Snazzeo 7 ай бұрын

First! New jolly olive banger 🎉🎉🎉

@Kowloon_City 7 ай бұрын

Chapman is third best. Need a video on him

@NoNameNo.5 20 күн бұрын

Ok, now do Curt Schilling

@imagine9265 7 ай бұрын

Well one thing we know is Billy won't be wearing a Mets Cap when he's inducted But as a Mets fan it would be a Honor to see him in it !!

@juliebraden6911 7 ай бұрын

It's not his choice

@dustinhealy1676 7 ай бұрын

Do you think Torii Hunter is a hall of famer?

@fortynights1513 7 ай бұрын

I would say no. Credit him for getting 5% of the vote though.

@hardyworld 6 ай бұрын

He mentions Jansen and Kimbrel at the end...but I really don't think Jansen is nearly as good as Wagner. You can argue Kimbrel is deserve of serious consideration for HOF, but I'm not convinced you can say that about Jansen (he's more of a Hall of Very Good).

@MrBendylaw 7 ай бұрын

Billy Wagner was a gunslinger who projected death out to a 60'6" radius, and that is all anyone needs to know.

@juliebraden6911 7 ай бұрын

lol wtf I hope you were high when you wrote that

@MrBendylaw 7 ай бұрын

@@juliebraden6911 Drunk. It's true though. Wagner would eat you up with that fastball, and he didn't mess around.

@Tabbitt 7 ай бұрын

I understand the comparisons to Hoffman, I just don’t think either of them are hall of famers.

@dannovikoff8454 7 ай бұрын

jolly olive should have a HOF vote

@SconnerStudios 7 ай бұрын

Wagner deserves in, but k rod was better. K rod imo was 3rd greatest closer wagner 4th.

@antonioreconquistador 7 ай бұрын

K rod shouldve closed for longer. Did he have a ped or crime scandal?

@VenomousStare 7 ай бұрын

@@antonioreconquistadorno, he burned out. Age got to him

@marcusy.6372 7 ай бұрын

Respectfully, how? Wagner beats KRod in just about every category, both rate stats and career stats, only trailing in career saves and IP. KRods a legend but is a solid #4

@SconnerStudios 7 ай бұрын

@@marcusy.6372 I think a LOT changed around what's demanded from pitchers in the course of roughly a decade between Wagner's retirement and K rod's. Right around the late 2000s to early 2010s, there was a push on closers pitching faster and faster and faster without any regard to their long-term durability. I think K rod suffered victim to this phenomena and the tail end of his career fizzled out, whereas wagner's prime was half a decade before the demands started getting crazy. Wagner didn't have to compare himself to quite as many pitchers as K-rod did later on in his career. And I just checked on b-ref, and k rod pitched in over 100 more games than wagner too, which really says how hard he fought to prolong his career (which probably hurt some of his career ERA, whip, etc.) in lieu of all the Aroldis Chapmans throwing 100+ MPH every single pitch. It's really hard to compare players who are even just a decade apart because in the ridiculous changes in pitching standards, but that's my take. Same reason why I think these pitchers getting 180-200 career wins are more impressive than players 30 years ago who got 250 career wins.

@rapalbumdepot7648 7 ай бұрын

Kenny Lofton and Jimmy Rollins >>>

@johncrace911 7 ай бұрын

If you have to think about it or convince people, he does not belong in HOF

@TheTEN24 7 ай бұрын

I hate how annoying these old voters are about the HoF. For Christ sake the NBA allows more dudes in every year and have like half the players in the league each year. Guys like Wagner jones Helton are obvious hall of famers and yet aren’t in yet