Also don't forget they weren't just a one season wonder. At that point they were consistently top1 regular split team for like 4-5 splits in a row. Ofc they always choked in playoffs that's why their eventual win mattered a lot, but going from consistently 1st place to consistently is tragic.

same thing as DRX no?

@@justinliu1014 DRX wasn't ever considered as top-tier org/team. They were always kind of bottom-mid, sometimes grabbing/finding good players (Zeka, Keria etc.). Their worlds win was rather unexpected and it was pretty clear the org wouldn't maintain that level. They had no money to keep the players that won them worlds, because thos players all of the sudden were very high rated and alot of teams were willing to spend big on them. So it was kind of inevitable that DRX would fall off again.

​@@justinliu1014 DRX was a dark horse. They are the only team not first/second seed of their region to win Worlds.

​@@justinliu1014 DRX has had 2 good years. 2020 and 2022. Thier 2020 season they finished 3rd and 2nd so they were actually doing pretty well that year since they had Chovy, Doran, Keria and Deft alongside a then fairly unknown Pyosik so that year they were expected to do well. 2022 they werent even expected to qualify for worlds. They barely scraped victories over KT and Sandbox (Now FearX) to qualify. 2022 DRX began thier miracle run before they had even qualified.

I think the bar was set so high from 2018-2021 that now getting back to the mean feels bad. The produciton was really insane + having some really good teams makes it hard to reproduce, especially considering the layoffs. I think the level of play is not as low as people make it out to be but there is for sure a huge drop between 2020 and the years after. The biggest problems are the lack of new personalities and a lot of good players leaving. But this year the overall level of gameplay in all regions is lower compared to last year (excluding GenG). LPL also feels a lot weaker and a lot more boing to watch too (compared to last year) because the good teams from last year got separated and the good players are not concentrated in the best teams.

​@petarpetrov1784 I think problem with lec as well is the level of play not only dropped, but as viewer there isnt much of a narrative. We all know G2 is gonna win because these teams cant help but choke during the playoffs. Im not blaming G2 I think they are the expection that is actually trying to carry this dumpster fire of the region. Lec in itself with contract blocks and nepotism from staff is starting hurt any competitive nature the league has.

​@petarpetrov1784 Nah to even, I didn't watch or played the game for years and only came back in 2023. The EU LCS from 2015 was more entertaining than this year league, last year was a weak year for LEC as you saw at Worlds but it was really nice to watch for the entire year.

LPL production is worse for english viewers lmao, LPL aint even that good anymore

You know it’s bad when LCS is better than LEC now

Yeah after last year. I was kinda done with league. If not for Co streams, I would definitely not watch any league anymore. Except for G2 Vs TES I can't even remember a game I fully watched this year. I thought maybe it's just me, but Lec game quality is abysmal. But I also have to say I am fatigued with always the same picks and nothing new at all. They should just drop a patch that nukes everything and then try to balance it again maybe then we don't have to watch the same shit over and over again.

@@gokuderahayato2304 I honestly started watching the YT vids of most games and tune in to the stream for the "hype games " but even the LEC hype games have become so boring and do not get me started on draft picks when every game was lucian / nami , Zeri/ Lulu or Senna Tahm with Ksante. Absolutely disgusting and resident sleeper

I went from watching G2 games during dinner on my phone along with all other games after dinner to missing most of their games because i just couldn't be bothered with these 9 game seasons, not even sure i'm gonna watch the playoff stage.

The 3 season split is horrible. You have barely 4 weeks to "make it", trophies feel worthless. I remember when splits were longer G2 once also almost didn't make playoffs, if it had been such a short format they had been out.

Never expected him to be like that. Pretty cool actually. I kinda like him when he is not in the "omg pro flash against wall? What a silver" mood

That's the real Dom, I feel like he has this weird perception outside of his own community, he's seen as this weirdo hater toxic guy. But if you stop and watch him, he's exactly like this clip shows it, he loves the game, he has a genuine passion for content creation, and I'm sure he's mad because the LEC being boring is bad for league competitive and his not happy about quitting.

@@laeliuss7495 I just know some clips of them where he was mostly fair and his commentarys together with Yamato where he is super unfair and toxic. One time he watched a game solo so i warched him and he was not toxic at all. Seems like he gets toxic in group but idk i dont watch him enough to know that.

@@NoobNoobZug Group calls make it more about entertainment and not analysis. Its usually pretty funny but the in depth stuff is gonna get lost

​@@NoobNoobZugif you watch him with The Sack is pretty obvious that they'll ramp up the talking so that they make each other laugh. It's genuinely funny when they just call: "Every player here should be jailed" after a bad play. But if you watch his tier lists for example, he gives all good, well researched, reasonable takes. And the guy is genuinely like an encyclopedia of competitive league knowledge.

Last year LCS? Havent this guy heard that Riot is making LCS a minor region next year. The problem with LEC is like you said, its boring and the format is so bad, but people still watch the league by some miracle, LEC this year had the highest viewing numbers ever so people clearly watch it alot its around 800k-1mil. The problem with LCS is that no matter how good the format is or what changes they make, no one watches that league like… they just cant get eyes to watch NA. They do good at worlds and win FNC and no one cares, there is literally zero souls that give a fck. There is hype for the core NA audience who always watch like Dom for example, the format is great and all, but still NA is less viewed than Europes tier 2 league LFL… Like tier 2 leagues like LFL or Brazil has more viewing than NA and it will never change sadly. They now merge NA to a minor region and it literally pissed off the minor region?? Shouldnt they be happy to become a ”major region”, no they hate it xdd

@@leevimasalin2301 It's not solely the fact that no one cares, But legit the only "Good" They did at worlds is NRG Beating G2 Which let's be honest was a fucking hail mary in it's own accord, and then One team did good cause they beat Fnatic yes, But did you forget that FlyQuest legit got dropped by Paris? Like the difference between LEC and LCS is that in LEC there are good Teams like SK , Fnatic , G2 and BDS , While also there are shit teams like VIT , Mad , Rogue etc. In LCS literally there isn't a team that they can say, YES we can compete in worlds or MSI , Cause again in MSI the only "Good" Run TL had was beating the second seed of EU , their second seed being beaten by the PCS and literally have their First Seed Dumpstered by the east, Not saying G2 did any better but come on, G2 at least took T1 to 5 Games and dismantled TOP. And even then G2 doesn't even seem to be the strongest Team in EU cause SK Beat them and only lost like 1 or 2 Games. Like a lot of people are saying Eu just has a Lot of stupid and pointless games along with the "Shields" Being a mickey mouse competition that doesnt matter if you win or not. It's basically just Ego boost.

@@vvuulven6382 I agree with you on everything you just said. Hopefully the format changes next year.

​@@leevimasalin2301That's not a format fault. The problem is that Riot makes their professional league in the franchise model. They should reverse all changes to the point when they start. In this case every match will be for something. There will be also more new players.

Bro i don't think we had a spring stadium finals since 2019.. maybe i am missing

i was there too, it was indeed crazy hype

@@Snootz86 na you might be right, G2 vs UOL was in 2017 spring iirc

Exactly! The finals feel like just another day at the office, it's so sad what they did to LEC when it used to have so much hype. The rap battles they did for playoffs a few years ago were so good.

Franchising kills everything...

@@Darkyryus_ franchising kinda killed NALCS as well. yeah more money got put in but how many of those nba teams backed out. how many of those companies maintained the spot they bought? Echo Fox? Houston Rockets? Golden State Warriors? Etc?

It’s the mentality difference. I feel franchising works in specific ways and regions, but not in general. When you have a huge player base, competitiveness by nature and people passively practicing the game every day, I feel franchising feels wrong. It’s a little bit comparable with European football. You can’t franchise this, the nature and history doesn’t allow it. Not that it’s impossible (like in the USA) but far less interesting and emotionally intense for the millions of people who played this game from scratch.

​@@ceejaybalbinna franchised and now local players don't even get a chance to play.all teams that make it to internationals are either 4 koreans,4 chinese or 4 europeans

i mean, tha format is really bad, teams this bad as the bottom, should be in elimination brackets, not giving them a second chance to play

​@@sergioradicy8550 Then they'll never get better, even if they wanted to. That's a pointless argument.

Honestly, I disagree. I think the top 2 (BDS, SK) have been playing well and fairly cleanly. G2, FNC however, have not been. FNC were doing fine, then they just started playing noticeably worse since their 1st loss. And G2 have been playing around all split.

@@FitzgeraldStanburyWeissV they don't get better even with more chances so it's still pointless, the format is really bad, but there are a lot of other things that are making LEC really worst every year by

Well put 😂

its crazy how Rogue management speedran a championship winning, worlds quarterfinals roster to 10th place LEC, that nobody wants to watch. so fucking disgusting.

Yea that was pretty bad. I remember h2k getting first place in regular and getting relegated the next split. That was crazy.

This take has never made any sense to me. Relegation teams 90% of the were worse than today's 9th and 10th seeds. Most of them were underfunded amateurs with no chance to take a game from anyone else. Frachises have more incentive than anyone else they're investing millions of dollars every year into coaching, infrastructure, players. If they suck its -$1,000,000 that isn't a concern of relegation teams. Every region had its highest peaks under franchise system korea for instance is better than ever. Teams can afford to pay players and build massive orgs. Its just that league esports as a whole in the west is on a downturn + poor economics around the world.

They should just do what the premier league in English football does and give parachute payments to teams that make the LEC for if or when they go down, they give a certain amount of money for 2-3 years so that they can potentially fight back. We desperately need EXCITEMENT return to the league.

Ahem - also MAD ;)

That and MAD, both of them

genuinely sad to see these new "fans" of teams get into the league. completely clueless i may add, and pile on top of actual analysts, Content creators and talent and attempt to tarnish these longstanding figures' credibility in the lol scene. Actual aids how kc and mad fans in certain areas of the scene have acted and continue to

Kc and mad fans should be banned. I dislike both teams because of their fans.

Reason why these fandoms annoy me is because fan mentality of mentioned teams feels like: "oh you're not french/spanish? Then F*** YOU". I get the feeling that league/gamestate/plays are completely irrelevant to these fans.

You mean life support

@@SoulxWeaver technically maintenance lol

2018/2019 were OFF years and anything but the norm and despite universal praise, had lower viewership than LEC right now

2019 SCHIZO

@@Xzibitfreek I mean the seasons before that felt a bit like it does now, I started watching worlds 2018 because my friends who were long-time fans of fnc was extra hyped. But 2019 brought it all together and got me hooked, it's safe to say its just been a downhill experience after that. Maybe they'll bring it back soon, but it sure sucks being where we are. Oh well, at least we get an extra international event next year so there's that.

@@Xzibitfreek That's in part due to the fact that the pro scene viewership is almost always growing. More and more people get into it each year.

2018-2020 was peak lec after that shitshow

Tbh the format alone makes it way more interesting as theres so much more variety in champ pools and tacticts. LEC is pretty much boring as theres nothing new, everything is copy and paste what ever Korean top teams are running. And the teams play with 20 champ pool. Only ones who dare to be different even a bit are pretty much Wunder and Adam lol.

@@Vilhomatto Agreed. For a while I felt that there at bare minimum needed to be more bans to count for just how large the champion roster is now. The format Fearless Draft or whatever it is they are calling it is, like you said, a nice change that forces at least a larger variety of champions during a series. It still might end up being the same champions picked over the course of the series, but at least it means that each game will be at least different.

damn really....and we started losing to NA when they were free games since then.

And G2 is such a giant the seasons feel like they don’t matter either. You see bds or fntc make it to playoffs and you just know they will choke like a mfer and G2 will sweep again.

@@mbrown7325 True G2 is the undisputed best team we've had for years now, but that is also because they are the only team that genuinely cares about the league and is constantly trying to push and improve our region as a whole. I would also find it refreshing to see anyone else win besides G2 and actually challenge them, but non of our teams have been able to come even close to that (except for maybe FNC on a good day). This has led me to cheer only for G2 as they actually still give a crap and try to improve themselves as well as the region

@@MoutPessemier I think SK has a real shot this year. I imagine bds and fntc will be more of the same.

i agree now that every region will have 3 splits and probably fearless draft there's no way that they change the format for each region . Just copy what LCK does and import the best LCK challengers players and get the league to a better lvl then eu rookies will come in at 18 yold hopefully not 25 and if they are good they will be able to play and grow in the lec and reach top teams

the saudis will come bro and rescue the league dw

The saudis are busy with dota 2

@@GothPaoki not for long...

They are going for basically every sport and esport they can.

I know this is going to sound blasphemous for a LEC fan but LCS is actually fun this split.

@@escorption6284 the new blood on the scene as made for some good story lines at least and drafts are creative

same here

My small wishlist for you: Take that wig off your head.

I'm also disinterested, despite being a regular watcher since season 2. At most it's second monitor content and I maybe glance over at it from time to time when it sounds like something's happening, but for a good decade it was always the focus of my attention. Getting older will have something to do with that, but it's definitely also feeling stagnant. I don't really care too much about legacy players, as long as the new ones coming in are also exciting. Some are. I like the new Mad Lions roster at least, but most of the more successful new LEC talent lately is Korean imports, which I find it hard to get excited about. I like seeing new local talent rise up and succeed. Also, for me the EU region had always been the region of innovation, right back to when Moscow 5 revolutionised how pro play worked. We almost never had players that could keep up with LPL/LCK equivalents, but we could always beat them by playing unconventionally, rewriting the rule book again. Nowadays it's only really G2 doing that (and Mad Lions a bit), and everyone else is just doing the exact same cookie cutter comps with no innovation. Fearless draft would help this though.

Wait are you telling me you dont enjoy people screaming during the game so that you cant even hear what casters are saying? Yeah thats what kill it for me, I just turn on something else where ppl dont yell in my ear

Tbf that is more of an LEC studio being tiny ass than the fans. LCK finals fans were crazier and yet nobody was bothered by the shouts. Imo it just shows that lec is not adapted to entertainment yet

@@biim3051 Yeah thats fair, its on them to cancel out noise from the crowd. That could be another task for the casters :')

@@anterimac5196 It does feel like, if they did put some money they could isolate better their casters however it wouldn't solve the problem of the interviews, you would need more space for that. The big orgs fans have always been annoying (FNC/KC/MAD) but at the same time that's what makes us either root for them or for their oponents and by proxy, watch the content. You would be like "damn those KC fans, i hope KC loses, let's go [insert oponent]. And in the end those big fanbases would make the LEC feel more alive, but the format man that format is ass and the studio is trash.

Lmao the only reason lec had some spark of hype is because of the french and Spanish viewers this year If you don't count them the league was even more boring

LCS going down to 8 teams made the level of play go up so much. It’s the strongest LCS has looked in so, so long. Honestly maybe since 2016.

frfr

He mostly gets the hate because LCK fanboys have become so disgusting and they hate him because he dislikes T1 fans, plus live-streams LPL.

@@FitzgeraldStanburyWeissV why didn’t he get LEC co streaming and LCS way back when. There was Reddit threads about him years b4 he even co streamed he’s been hated for years

@@Satrim373 I'm just referring to now, tbh. I'm not entirely sure why he was hated back then, but I'd imagine it was probably due to the same reasons you listed. I only started watching Dom like 3-4 years ago tbf, so I'm not 100% sure. But yeah, I assume people had him wrong and probably thought he was toxic.

@@FitzgeraldStanburyWeissV Personally, I dislike him because it really looks like he's farming the hatewatch from LCK fans with some of his takes. To be fair, it's a really good tactic to get engagement.

It's not a problem of lack of ideas, it's there's no budget for doing more.

just make a qualification tourney with double elim for everything but worlds and screw the splits

because Riot keeps pumping resources into LCS even while it's failing. Meanwhile, LEC keeps losing resources. Also, LCS leadership is willing to make changes to try and keep it interesting while LEC leadership seems like it's trying to keep things the way they have been since last year, even though it obviously isn't working.

@@vaqueroliquido7339 Bro WHAT. Riot is not fucking “pumping resources into LCS.” LCS got huge cuts and layoffs too, and on top of that they are deleting the entire region next year, losing 2 teams, losing a world’s spot, are you joking? That is the most delusional statement ive ever seen.

Tbh most of the current lec roaters are rookies / players that joined in the last 2/3 years. Some og's like caps wunder miky hily jankos are still there.

@@hubertdabrowski3548 I see, I probably just caught it when they were playing