Props to Apos. I had a problem with a select tube and they sent another one immediately.
@matthewhilty42096 ай бұрын
That's actually great to hear. What Amp were you using ?
@audiorick8416 ай бұрын
Using a pair in a Freya+ preamp. So happy with the service that I have a pair of reserve on the way.
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
That's great to hear that they were so responsive! Enjoy your Reserves - they're brilliant!
@christophernoto6 ай бұрын
I like your deep dive into this particular example of the question of tube quality and the difference it may make in sound quality. One thing, though, you said that "I think there may only be (tube) factories in China or Russia, these days." There may only be "general purpose" tube manufactories in those countries, there is a tiny factory in North Georgia, USA, just south of the city of Chattanooga, Tennessee, that has bought the name, intellectual property, and some machines from Western Electric, and are making, right there, brand new, very high quality (and very high price) 300B vacuum tubes. Thanks for a bunch of very interesting work in the reviews and other videos you have made and shared here. All the best!
@mclement0521646 ай бұрын
AND this same company is exploring the possibility of manufacturing tubes other than the 300B. I have a Cayin HA 300 mkii amplifier. It came stock with Gold Lion 300B tubes, then I bought some Chinese "perfect clone" 300B tubes and also the genuine Western Electric 300B tubes Let me tell you, those genuine WE 300B tubes are simply amazing! It doesn't require any painstaking A/B testing. That difference... A HUUUGE improvement is as unmistakable as a Will Smith to Chris Rock slap across the face! Once they're plugged in THERE IS NO GOING BACK. It's hard to believe that they're even the same kind of tube. If they ever come out with a 6SN7 or equivalent, I will definitely give them a try
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
That's great to hear! Thanks for the info about the WE tube factory!!
@TontNZ6 ай бұрын
A couple of years ago I purchased a matched pair of NIB Mullard ECC32's, (6SN7 equivalents) they were over $1,000. Never been brave enough to use them!
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
I know that feeling (although not quite to that price). I eventually realised that there's no point spending a bunch and then not enjoying it. Plug them in and smile!
@rodm19496 ай бұрын
I used a 'socket saver' to raise the tube out of the way from the power tubes.
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
Yes, that can be helpful in some amps. Which amp did you do that with?
@rodm19496 ай бұрын
A WA3 from Woo, the sound stage and separation are impressive.The real testament is I can't stop using it and solidstate just seems lacking.@@PassionforSound
@WillieBloom5 ай бұрын
I have two tube amps right now: The xDuoo TA-20 and TA-26. Even though I only have these two amps I started getting into purchasing tubes and now have a quite robust collection. While I do not possess any tubes above the 1,000 USD range I do have *a lot* of tubes below that mark. Many NOS, many used. There are many amps on the market I could buy *today* and put my own tubes into them. If you're in the EU or the US and would like to make an inquiry then by all means, do so. Note! I do not have a tube tester yet. It's on my to-do list. About my two xDuoo tube amps. The tubes with which these amps are delivered are only to send them to the customer in working order. That's it. These tubes are so bad that they don't even have a label or insignia on the glass so they're not even one of the better Chinese valves. The very first tube roll I ever performed was replacing the two 12AU7's in the TA-20 with a pair of 20 USD JJ Electronics tubes. The difference is night and day. Really. Currently I'm running a pair of NOS Siemens 12AU7's from the 1970's, Even better, yes, but not better than swapping out the Chinese stock tubes with the JJ's. In the TA-26 I have some Soviet NOS tubes which I have yet to roll again. I just got those Chinese tubes out of there ASAP. NOS tubes can be very, very expensive. My advice to anyone who wants to use tube amps and who is in the xDuoo spending category is to buy used tubes. Used doesn't mean bad especially if the seller is providing you with measurements. You can buy many pairs of used 12AU7's for the price of one pair of NOS. I supposed used should be called "UOS" for used old stock. Buy two or three different brands so that you can experiment with the sound signatures so that you have replacements if a tube craps out. Being the first person to turn a NOS tube into a "UOS" tube is a luxury as the NOS supply is finite. If you think about it, it's not like you get the best sound when you first start using the NOS tubes and then it's all down hill from there. Quite the opposite is true. Valves do burn in and get smoother. I have first-hand experience of this. Let someone else burn in the NOS tube and sell it to you for a tenth of the original NOS price. Being a tube amp owner does not need to be a rich man's hobby unless you opt to make it one. Many of the NOS tubes I currently own are either for a much nicer amplifier than the likes of xDuoo or for resale. I see no reason to spend hundreds of dollars on a pair of 12AU7's and immediately depreciate them, at least not for a cheap tube amplifier. One day when I spend a schiit-ton of money on an amp such as from Woo Audio then I will use NOS just for the luxury of it. Otherwise, no. I can tell you how crazy the vacuum tube market is. Go and look up how much both NOS and used old stock Western Electric 300B tubes cost. This is a tube used in many Woo Audio amps. Then go and look at the price for the new stock 300B valves Western Electric is producing. The used old stock costs more than the new stock by a large margin. Is the used old stock better than the new stock? I couldn't tell you but that's the nature of supply and demand. Of the three options I would go for the cheapest which immediately excludes NOS WE300B. I don't have ten grand to drop on a pair of tubes.
@PassionforSound5 ай бұрын
Thanks for sharing your experiences with tubes. I agree that the NOS tube market is crazy!
@tubefreeeasy4 ай бұрын
Black tubes are awesome. I own four Shuguang Black Treasure 12au7 tubes. Plus a Sophia Electric Aqua 5u4g to take care of my TA22 and TA30. I’ve also owned a PSVane Cossor black glass 5u4g. Good idea to put socket savers to add weight and height for vibration and coolness respectively. You may want to find ways to reduce the vibrations on your tube amps. Spring type iso feet are superior feet.
@tubefreeeasy4 ай бұрын
Takatsuki are a Japanese company that are often referred to as the king of 300B and 5u4g tubes. Unfortunately, they cost over $1000.
@PassionforSound4 ай бұрын
Thanks for the info and for sharing your experiences!
@MsMultiwave6 ай бұрын
The Apos fits perfectly in the LYR3+.
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
That's great. How does it sound in there?
@MsMultiwave6 ай бұрын
They sound really good. As you know each tube has its own flavor. I have many different ones NOS to new. 🎉 I do not have one I do not like. Has money been spent? Yes absolutely 💯. Has it been amazing and fun hearing different presentations with each! Our hobby is to enjoy and the LYR3 + is a lot of fun with my bifrost 2/64 and the Lohius. I also have the Vanatoo transparent one encore plus. They are very good powered speaker.
@MsMultiwave6 ай бұрын
Thanks for your review. Tubes are amazing and I can run solid state also with the LYR+ also as you know.😊
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
That's great to hear! Thanks for the feedback on the tube in the Lyr+
@markmijnders1517Ай бұрын
I orderd the 6sn7 select for my Trafomatic Rhapsody 300B with Emission Labs 300b mesh tubes and the sound great (test 80 hours +). I am going to order the RAY reserve version.
@PassionforSoundАй бұрын
Awesome! I'm so glad you're enjoying them.
@urbenkam2 ай бұрын
I missed out on this video this was exactly what i was looking for :) thank you
@WillieBloom5 ай бұрын
I think that you are an under-appreciated audio reviewer. I follow a number of content creators in this genre and you are among the better but you're not getting the subs, the view counts or the likes I think you deserve. What should we do about this? I'm rather disinterested in social media but if I was more active I would spread the word. I mention this first because I don't know how active you are promoting yourself on the socials. If you already are active on the socials then keep on truckin'. To the subscribers and viewers, if you're active on the socials please help the channel and spread the word. And no - I have no relationship to this channel other than being a regular viewer. I'm shilling out of sincere altruism.
@PassionforSound5 ай бұрын
Thank you for the support! I've been looking at the growth of other channels for some time now and can't work out what they're doing differently. I can only.assume that it's activity on forums like Head-Fi, etc. In the short term, sharing links to reviews you like or telling fellow enthusiasts about the channel will always help. 🙂
@Kalgrm5 ай бұрын
@@PassionforSound , I think they are growing because they tend to review the items that are getting the hype, or at the very least, the items are popular. When a viewer searches for a review, they are looking for the item and then click on the reviewer's page. Your reviews are often concerning more esoteric, less sought after audiophile items, so people don't find your reviews as often as they find the other channels. I love the way you're reviewing: always balanced and fair dinkum. Don't change that. But if you want more viewers, it might be worth your time reviewing some of the more popular (or hyped) items too, just for the hits on the search algorithms. Anyway, keep up the great work. I don't mind that only a few of us watch your videos: We're in an exclusive club. :D (I've been watching your videos for ages but decided to subscribe today for the APOS 6NS7 tube reviews.)
@PassionforSound5 ай бұрын
Thanks for the comment and the sub. I think you're probably right and it's actually one of the challenges I face being in Australia - I can rarely get access to the products as early as those in the USA, especially those connected with a retail outlet like Headphones dot com. As the channel grows, I'll hopefully get more opportunities despite the relative isolation of being in Australia. 🦘 🌏 🙂
@JTB--6 ай бұрын
Have the 6SN7 Select in the LYR3 and it's definitely better than the Stock Tube Schiit includes. Worth it to pay 3X more for the Reserve for a LYR3?
@vaneast4116 ай бұрын
that’s up to your own discretion…
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
Yep. That's a hard one to answer. The Reserve tube is mighty impressive, but when you're spending over half the value of the amp, it's a tough decision.
@JTB--6 ай бұрын
@nforSound I decided to order the Reserve from Apos and Return the Select to Amazon. Somebody has to be the Guinea Pig and give the Reserve a go on the LYR3 or LYR+. Might as well be me. Seems like a worthwhile Leap of Faith. I'll chime in again after I test the Reserve
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
I have a feeling you'll be very happy, but keen for your impressions.
@Pyregazer4 ай бұрын
I have the old lyr 3, will these fit through the hole without a socket saver/extension?
@Shozimus6 ай бұрын
i see a new Tubes for my Schiit Freya :) THX for the reveiew :)
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
My pleasure. They'll be a perfect match, I think!
@NickP3332 ай бұрын
There’s also tube factories in Slovakia (JJ), the US (Western Electric), Japan (Takatsuki), and I’m sure there’s a few more.
@daniannaci32586 ай бұрын
As is usual, the paradigm of how much feedback is used in a tube circuit is being ignored. In a circuit where little or no feedback is being used the sound of different tubes is likely to be quite different. However, in a circuit where there’s considerable feedback (20- 30db), such as cathode followers, it would be unlikely to hear much if any difference between high end select tubes and standard current production tubes being as feedback can minimize many tube nonlinearities including microphonics and noise. Tweaky single ended amps are more often than not designed with little feedback and tube upgrades can be worthwhile. Vintage tube gear, like your Dynaco’s, Heathkits, Scott, Fishers, etc., invariably use a ton of feedback, both locally and globally, and would generally not gain a significant benefit from high-end select tubes, except perhaps in the phono stage.
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
This isn't intended to be a breakdown of tube amp topology the specific characteristics of every amp on the market, just a review of a tube in some clearly declared, specific amps.
@damienlahoz3 ай бұрын
in my experience there is no downside to improving the tubes in a system. while you may not get the full effect on a "cheaper" amp, the improvement over something like new stock Sol's will be obvious. But of course their are limits, a $500 tube on a $199 amp is probably a waste of money but if you own a $1k or up pre or power amp, go crazy!
@sentientsteve93516 ай бұрын
You need to get yourself a Feliks Euforia to test out those tubes.... Plus with the Atriums = wow!
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
That would be lovely, but I already have so many amps! 🙂
@Peace_Guard6 ай бұрын
Upgrades with 6SN7s? - Cayin HA-300 MK2 8W 19+10kg OTC SET (2x power Gold Lion Genelax PX300B, 2x driver Tung-Sol 6SN7GTB, 4x rectifier RCA 22DE4) - Feliks Audio Envy stan/perf 8W 15,1kg OTC SET (power stan. Electro Harmonix Gold / perf. Full Music 300B , driver PsVane CV181 mk2 6SN7) - Viva Egoista 845 15W 30kg SET (2x power Shuguang 845, drivers Tungsol 6SN7 + 6N1P, 2x rectifier 5U4G)
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
Thanks for the suggestions!
@el_arte6 ай бұрын
And last point: Rebranding an OEM tube doesn’t increase the tube supply. It simply relabels some of the already produced supply.
@Brighamdoc2 ай бұрын
For those prices I would think NOS tubes would be as good if not better - would have to be listened to. My favorite is the RCA 5692 but it's getting rare.
@PassionforSound2 ай бұрын
The rarity and lack of warranty are the biggest issues with NOS tubes so it's not about these sounding better, it's about predictable pricing and security of warranty, all without sacrificing quality of sound. 🙂
@ceylonmooneyАй бұрын
current prioduction tube manufacturing: jj in slovak several in china electro harmonix/new sensor in russia western electric in the US theres one in germany, its a small outfit like WE in the US and another...i cant remember where.
@NosEL344 ай бұрын
Basically $500 for a pair. Thats a tough one as you can almost get any NOS pair for that price..other than the really rare ones. Apos has a 12 month warranty though..plus if its noisey or microphonic in any way one can return it. I wonder what the life expectancy is? 10,000 hours would be nice
@PassionforSound4 ай бұрын
The key benefits here are that they're truly new so you'll get maximum life (hours of hard because it depends on the amp), they have warranty as you said, and they are readily available at a predictable performance level that's on par with excellent NOS tubes.
@bobb.99176 ай бұрын
Great review! VERY EXCITING!. ..I have a question about the tube, which I cannot seem to find on Ray's website, surprisingly? Tube dimensions. I want to try a pair of these in my Schiit Freya+. It sits in a cabinet and my headroom (height) is tight. Pretend that the pins are not there. I need a measurement from the bottom of the base to the top of the glass globe. Width is not a factor for me. 😀
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
The tubes are 10.5cm tall excluding the pins. From memory, that's 3.75 inches.
@bobb.99176 ай бұрын
@@PassionforSoundThank you soooo much! 👍🏼…I can see a pair of these tubes in the near future. 10.5cm = 4.13 inches Edit: scratch that…they are HUGE and will not come close to fitting in my cabinet. 😕 Thanks for saving me the disappointment of ordering them!!!!
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
Hold on. Let me check the measurements - that was from memory, but I posted the correct measurements for someone else...
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
Ok. I was actually correct on my inches recollection. They're 9.5cm / 3.75 inches. I hope that gets them in!
@timhall72978 күн бұрын
Ok site says you have 12 ax7 and el34 both of those are in marshall dsl 40cr, yet its not lidted in compatible amps why?
@PassionforSound8 күн бұрын
The compatible amps list is not comprehensive and only focuses on HiFi amps at the moment. (That will hopefully change)
@mclement0521645 ай бұрын
That reserve looks a LOT like PSVANE CV 181 Tii., a 6SN7 equivalent. I'd like to know how those 2 compare against each other. I'm willing to bet they're twins
@PassionforSound5 ай бұрын
There's a good chance they're coming from the same factory, but I don't have a Psvane to compare.
@ScottoGrotto23 күн бұрын
@@PassionforSound Would be great to see a video, if you haven’t made it, comparing the reserves to psvane cv181-tii and maybe the Shuguang treasure cv 181z? Inquiring minds :) I’ve got about 90 hours on the Select Rays. In the Schiit Saga og it is convenient to compare to the passive line stage in 2ch and headphones. Tonally the Rays Select has a positive uplifting pleasing vibe. The stage front instruments & voices seem clear well defined and have pleasant harmonics. There might be a mild lift in volume of upper mids/ low treble. As the tube gains hours the balance of other frequencies especially the mids have developed. The leading edges of notes seem a little diffuse, background instruments voices blend together a bit, background bass is present but not well defined. Harmonics are pleasing but some are missing relative to the passive line stage where the whole image is more distinct and harmonically fleshed out. Enjoyable listening experience, if not too picky about nth degree details and harmonics. If you’re not listening on a device that shows you what you’re missing, passive line stage in this case or a higher resolving tube, this sounds good! There is soundstage depth, a more euphoric sound than the solid state. I think the Rays select is good value for money, and it may improve further with more hours. Plus Ive rolled a few old stock tubes. Like the Raytheon: subtle note weight improvements doesn’t compromise too much detail. Not as sweet euphonic as the Select.
@PassionforSound22 күн бұрын
@ScottoGrotto I don't have those models here to compare, but will have some new tubes from Psvane coming in soon for review.
@Keith-ux9ku8 күн бұрын
$184 for a tube is a reasonable look at the prices of NOW 6SN7.
@Keith-ux9ku8 күн бұрын
NOS 6SN7.
@PassionforSound8 күн бұрын
Absolutely!
@EnriqSandoval5 ай бұрын
Um, you rocked it 😎
@PassionforSound5 ай бұрын
Glad you thought so! 🙂🙂
@brianthomas33546 ай бұрын
I see a silver MJ3 back there.
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
Really? 😉
@brianthomas33546 ай бұрын
Looking forward to your review of it. ☺@@PassionforSound
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
I still don't know what you're talking about... 😁😂
@ceylonmooneyАй бұрын
the price gouging is out of control.
@sjqideez66266 ай бұрын
All these tubes are making me go inPSvane 🤪 Soz, couldn’t resist
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
I like it!
@ferozfalix74552 ай бұрын
What would you recommend for the new Schiit vali 3?
@PassionforSound2 ай бұрын
I haven't tried any of the tubes it's compatible with so I don't know. Sorry.
@Tkarma776 ай бұрын
Could you advise best tube for slot at the back for ta 26?
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
I haven't done lots of rolling, but I like the Tung Sol 6AS7G.
@chefsteve83816 ай бұрын
philips jan 6080 tube
@Tkarma776 ай бұрын
@@PassionforSound thanks but I couldn't source one of these
@PassionforSound5 ай бұрын
Sorry about that. I don't have any other current suggestions...
@Maver1ck9116 ай бұрын
Do you think i could get away with: 6N1P -> 6SN7 to 6922 Adapter -> insert 6SN7 in the Valhalla 2? to adapt one of these bad boys? I'd swap in an Electro Harmonix 12BH7 or JJ Gold ECC99 on the other end. For your upgrade! The Woo Audio WA33 might be able to work with a matched quad
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
Im not sure if there are issues using adapters into adapters. It's generally better to minimise the number of contact points in a circuit, but you might be able to get away with it. As for my upgrade, the MZ3 might be my answer if I can get a big bottle to plate for it. 🤞
@Maver1ck9116 ай бұрын
@@PassionforSound TBH i'll probably get the CFA Trifecta before upgrading tubes X'D. I'm too into IEM's with very low impedance/high sensitivity to benefit too greatly. Only with the RN6 can i get away with runing the Valhalla 2 on Low for a 4.8->26 Ohm output impedance balance.
@Maver1ck9116 ай бұрын
@@PassionforSound OH! the 6N1P is the same as 6SN7. It's just one adapter. the bias voltage and current range is serviceable, I'm only concerned with the input impedance which is why it would be funny to have the big tubes on the input side (up front).
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
Don't tell me that! Looks contemplatively at the Folkvangr...
@Maver1ck9116 ай бұрын
@@PassionforSound I listened to that with my VC's and IEM's at the Schiitr store in CA. It's amazing. I just can't help but think omg the cost of tubes. Also the Mjolnir 3 is 100% worth the Hype and works with 4OHM iems'. It's a little scary but amazing. Just don't switch between gain/Push-Pull & single ended while plugged up. I will buy one when I move into my next duty station.
@shaunyweaver11446 ай бұрын
Tubes can become a money pit, trust me I know, the upgrades your chasing never end . Eastern block counties like Russia have some of the best out there, for me the biggest difference in your audio, comes from the pre stage . Great fun but expensive .
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
I agree. It's one of the reasons I'm a fan of quality new production tubes - lower cost and less risk.
@matthewhilty42096 ай бұрын
Now if we could just get APOS to make 6922/7308 tubes so I can stop testing piles of Russian ones off an ancient tester.
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
Haha. Yes, I have a wish list too: 12AT7, 6922/6N1P, 6N6P, KT-66, EL34 😁
@el_arte6 ай бұрын
LOL, 😂 no, the Ferrari / Fiat metaphor is wrong. You couldn’t get a Ferrari out of a Fiat assembly line. Here, the situation is entirely different. The specs of a 6SN7 were codified exactly by RCA/Sylvania in 1939; all parameters included. What Apos supposedly does is pick the best conforming units at the end of the assembly line. That, in itself, is a valuable QA service, but it’s still a 6SN7 that falls within the parameter ranges defined in 1939, not a Ferrari. And NOS tubes are still likely to be better.
@PassionforSound6 ай бұрын
It's a metaphor, not an exact case study. The point being, the components and materials used in the Reserve tube must be different than those in the Select because the sonic differences are significant. As per your suggestion of NOS tubes, if all 6SN7s were so similar, there would be no benefit going NOS. And, finally, I've bought a number of expensive NOS tubes and have yet to hear one for the same price as the Reserve provide the sonic quality of the Reserve.
@el_arte6 ай бұрын
This Reserve appears to be a LINLAI CV181-H. Linlai is a step above Psvane. As for “it sounds better”, that, obviously, cannot be argued, as it is a subjective opinion. As long as you believe it, you are being honest and you should carry on. PS: All NOS 6SN7 made to specs sound the same indeed.
@dangerzone0076 ай бұрын
Russian Tubes are the best
@mariodrv6 ай бұрын
LOL no.
@bongofury31766 ай бұрын
only if bought from Ukrainian sellers
@dangerzone0076 ай бұрын
@@bongofury3176 if bought from a Ukrainian seller it's probably fake.
@bongofury31766 ай бұрын
there are lots of tube sellers in Ukraine just like there are lots of toilet sellers in Ruzzia@@dangerzone007