The more direct answer for Federer’s earlier start of swing (even on a slower ball) is that Fed has always had smoother acceleration of his stroke than the rest of the tour. Start earlier = more time = smoother acceleration to strike point. It’s part of what makes that ‘liquid whip’ feel for which he is famous. Everybody else’s stroke looks more jerky by comparison, even if the step by step stroke mechanics look perfect. As an engineer, smoother acceleration always results in lower torques on the machine, thus better control of the machine.

Another key difference is that in this forehand shot Federer is wearing a green t-shirt while Alcaraz is wearing a black one.

Roger's technique seems better. Alaraz' is more academical. Roger doesn't contract even one muscle that is not needed to to hit the ball. He's soooo relaxed. In any sport, this is what you want to achieve.

Wonderful analysis. So easy to understand since you make it so simple and to the point. Thank you.

Very good analysis esp. the "inside-out" swing path ! Thanks all for the videos in 2021 - have a blessed 2022!

I LOOOOOOVE this analysis! Taking loads of mental notes. It’s also incredible to think about the prep work that went into this e.g. timing the time it takes for the ball to get to them. Truly world class coaching, Ryan!

great analysis & clear description of what makes both of these players great. thanks.

You’re very observant! Things I take for granted you’re able to break down in detail. Great stuff!

Coming now in 2022 to learn how to get my techniques better and this was the best video I have ever seen! Thank you so much for this and the backhand ones.

Federer is a gifted player . Durung his prime playing days , he took the ball early when he saw opportunities to make opponents immidiately in an defensive mode . He would dictate the rally or immidiately finishied it off with that one early shot

Perfect analysis! Thank you!

Love this so much. Thank you very much coach. Lots of love from Bali 🌞🌎🌛

Wow, great video. Loving the detailed shot analysis.

Feds forehand is just another level....he takes it earlier....can hit flat or win top spin/high bouncing/ then he can create ridiculous angles because because of his grip/which he can change depending on whom he plays/...he can absorb and redirect pace /that's because of the grip he uses....and we haven't even started on the fact that he is a strategic genius

This is an amazing video thank you so much, i learned tons!

Great analysis. Thank you.

Super interesting video. Thanks!

Great tips. Thanks👍

This is one of your all time best instruction videos coach Ryan! OUTSTANDING ANALYSIS!! 👍👍👏👏🎾🎾🎾

Excellent, detailed analysis!

What great analysis! Just was I was looking for.

Nice comparison! I think you sort of minimize what happens after the ball is gone. I think Federer’s swing allows him to be ready for the next ball faster, giving him a bit more time to analyze how his opponent hits, and hence helping him predict where the next shot will be.

Amazing work keep making such videos !

man what an analysis, never saw analysis like this. Great

Fantastic videos you are making

Great analysis! Thanks! 👍👍👍

Your best ever video!Wonderful.And so informative!

I love it Thank you for nice review

Great explanation…👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼

Fair comments regarding the technique. Rogers forehand is to die for.

Fab Fab Fab comparison analysis. Learnt so much. Much appreciated.

Great Comparison! Thanks

Yooo. Thanka for the forehand explan swinging away from the body. I never heard it that way and im trying to straighten my swing. I realize thanks to you that I'm too close. You have no idea how much I appreciate it. I'm gonna try it today and see how it works out

Broke things down beautifully for every part of the stroke thanx

Great coaching video, liked and subbed

Fascinating. Thanks!

Nice insights. Roger's another incredible ability was his quick anticipations of his opponents mind.

Incredible coaching... You have put in so much effort! Thanks for letting us learn

This analysis is PURE GOLD !!!

Awesome Ryan

Very very amazing and interesting 👏👏👏

You really awesome ,the best analysis ,thank you

amazing analysis, thanks

This is good. My important take away is the grip here and I will be switching to semi western here on. Thanks for analysis!

Wow!! This is an amazing video

Thank you

Nice video!!!

This is the best forehand analysis I've ever seen

Very good!

Awesome analysis! Once you broke it down I can see how you might incorporate both. Against an opponent that hits harder it appears Federer techniques might work better. Against someone where you might have time to unload and go for broke on a shot then the other swing which seems a little more "loopier"might work better. Of course what they have similar, low to high, head still, hip rotation etc. are paramount. I appreciate you man and your thoughtful analysis always presented in an "upbeat" way that fires me up get out there to incorporate and hopefully perfect. You a good un!

The difference between the forehands can be summarized in one word "grip". And it's the most important factor in a person's game and defines his/hers skill set. Swing path and arm position are all defined by how closed the racket head is at contact. And that's the real difference between the next gen and Fed's modern forehands. Never heard one coach say this. They all teach one technique but after using every grip, and having to change my complete skillset each time, that's my conclusion.

Hats off to you 👏 🙌 👍 ❤️ 😍 thank you so much for your priceless videos I wish you were here when I was 7 years old, I am 38 and I have a Alcaraz forehand mechanic, although Federer had always been my Idol!

Mind blowing video. Thanks

good stuff, ty

This is great stuff Ryan! Please do more of these with different strokes of these super heroes and compare them. It's too bad that there is not enough footage of the guys and girls from the old days to do this with. Anyhow, Cheers and Happy New Year! MM

Fantastic analyse, thanks. Next Time, another explaination with how to control the hips before the shot (?)

Superb analysis

Dude, phenomenal analysis of two pros and their forehands. Similarities and differences.

You are great thank you 👏👏👏

Great analysis!!! Can you please do the same for backhand? Love your channel. Thank you!

Focus over an extended period of time seems to be my major challenge when I am working on correcting the mechanics of forehand. It happened easier for my backhand maybe because there is much less bad muscle memory on it.

I think the biggest difference is there is one swing path on the left. And one the right, the swing path is divided into two by the lag. Maybe that’s why you can see Roger often change his mind before he hits the ball

Danke!

Fantastic video. Please make more just like this. It is a treasure trove of information and is the reason why you are the #1 tennis channel to see in the world.

Very interesting análisis forehand strike😎🎾😏👌👍

single best tennis channel on youtube

Automatically liked!!!

Great analysis. I wish you would've touched briefly on their weight transfer

a really good effort, especially at clarifying the variables that could cause the differences in the swing in these specific examples. Almost all of the changes noted, in position of lag and swing pathway, relate back to the initial observations of the grip and wrist positions. You can't change one part of the machine without affecting the rest. The remark about gravity assisted lowering of racquet is a common error in the non biomechanics qualified coaching world. Any minimal effects of gravity on such a light and aerodynamic object as is a racquet have to be measured along with any eccentric action in the shoulder girdle. There is more effect on the arm if able to be totally passive and not decelerating - which is tough for many to do. More interesting for aspiring coaches is finding the common principles between the two, such as torso direction relative to contact point; grip position relative to type of lever in the lag, and most importantly position and time the head is stable relative to contact point.

I might be getting this now. I do better if I’m moving and split step vs. standing on my heels. Tanks!

FELICITACIONES por el minucioso análisis, sobre todo del forehand de Roger!! Es lo que buscaba, a qué distancia llevaba su brazo en el backswing Federer hacia atrás y su codo!!! Muchas gracias!!!

Great instruction, Coach Ryan ! seems it is the same hip forward movement , look at their right foot at the contact point (due to hip movement ) ...

BecaUSE Carlo`s favorite player of all time was ROger, and I believe while he grew up he tried to copy(learn) his forehand. It`s almost identical from my point of view, with little diferences like you said, but when you`re a kid, most of the time(in your childhood) what you do is copy copy copy, mimic mimic mimic. This comes from an ex professional tennis player who turned into an Actor over the years. I copied every Federers moves when I was a child. I find a video with a young Carlos Alcaraz saying that his idol is Roger. It turned out so well for him :) Dreams do really come true!!!

Which style is causing less stress to the wrist ?? I have a wrist injury so want to use a less stressful style .. thanks

Wow, I think this is one of the best detailed videos I've ever seen! I love detail and sir you brought it! Thank you and please do more! When you have a chance can you dissect the David Nalbandian's amazing Backhand. His backhand was a thing of beauty and one of the most deadly backhands ever in the game! He could put the ball anywhere on the court and made it look so easy! Andre Agassi once said that Nalbandian's backhand was hard to read, because he would hold it for so long before he flicked it cross court or down the line. Just watch this video and in the first minute wow! He hits a down the line backhand so effortlessly, and then cross court! This was the 2007 Madrid Masters. Nalbandian is the only player to have ever beaten the top 3 players in the world in the same tournament. His road to the tournament was, he beat 1st rd. Clement, 2nd Rd.. Berdych, 3rd Rd. Del Potro, QTRs. Nadal, Semi's, Djokovic, in the Final. Federer! Nalbandian is the greatest ever not to win a Major. This Madrid Masters's in 2007, was so sweet for him and for his fans, he proved when he was on, he could beat anyone! David Nalbandian is the greatest player never to win a Grand Slam, but in 2005 he won the ATP Tour Finals vs the top 8 players in the world, beating Roger Federer in the finals in a 5 set thriller. Ryan if you can do a Nalbandian Backhand step by step detail, it would be awesome! BTW his forehand was not bad either! Here is the link for the 2007 Master's cup, kzfaq.info/get/bejne/pL2bi8eSurS3qGQ.html , Link to the 2005 ATP Finals kzfaq.info/get/bejne/opmjo6R4vbnDh5c.html, and Nalbandian Backhand Magic, kzfaq.info/get/bejne/bL5yl7GDtZiuaZ8.html

Brilliant! Seems like the Eastern allows for greater velocity striking the ball head on, whereas that velocity on a semiwestern is lost on spin, so to generate more forward speed the semi westerner would have to rotate the body with more rotational velocity, correct? Can you do an analysis between one of today's champions and one of the champions from the good old days, for example, Federer vs Borg? Can you do Jimmy Connors? Does Connors change grips going between forehand and backhand? I have a hard time telling, but I think not much. Certainly MacEnroe I think doesn't. Sorry, I'm old school player at 62 years old.

What about wear and tear on the elbow and body for most rec players - E vs SW technique and the turn of the elbow required to compensate for the SW? May generate more top but is there a price paid longer term?

The thing that this analysis emphasizes for me is how much of a hand eye genius Federer was/is to compete with and usually dominate the plethora of lower risk higher spin semi western players in his era, esp latterly. He had to take the ball early to take time away from his opponent as his technique forced him to hit flatter balls!

One question I have is how the relative strokes deal with balls at different heights.

My two favorites. The legend Roger and the young beast.

What about the hip rotation between them? I think this is what results in more power.

Will be interesting also if you will analyze it in a real game situation with tactical decisions (where to hit) and not only how to hit (technique).

type of racquet, its balance and weight is a fact that determines the technical aspects. Fed uses a very heavy one and it is altering his racquet head speed. Besides your anatomical structure, the racquet you use formulates the technique you choose.

Thanks for the detailed analysis. Would you say this is a good example of why rec players need to be careful when trying to 'imitate' the Fed forehand

Would the follow through direction difference comes from different grip type? My grip is more like Federer, follow through is like Alcaraz, maybe that's why I'm struggling in generating power?(I'm a newbie)

Should talk about the loading and unloading of the legs too. Great instructional video though

Ryan, Here's something you forgot - if you copy Roger you may develop tennis elbow on the inside, so becarefull, but in time it will go away if you ice it after each work-out - have patience it will come. Love your analysis - best one I watched - See U coach Miguel

SO waiting for your one backhand comparation of Roger

Could you do a video on Carlos high elbow ?

I hit both eastern and semi-western. If my opponent has a great serve and I need to use more of a blocking forehand return, I use the eastern, but if Im more aggressive with a weaker serve or playing on clay, I use semi-western, or something between the two. In my opinion, Federer’s Eastern grip and forehand technique is more efficient, but not always more effective. Efficiency=less effort and more longevity in the sport.

@2minute tennis how does Federer handle high balls by dropping raquet so low?

The follow through for Federer is more across purely because of the shot he wanted to play on that particular shot. There are a lot of forehands where Federer finishes like Alcaraz.

love your comparation, the fans from China

Notice also they use their legs to slightly squat then elevate into contact, enhancing the low to high swing path.

i think a factor is also the upper body in relation to the hips. if u take a look at 4:14 alcaraz belly pretty much doesnt lean in an direction its just straight up from the hips whereas federer belly and the area above his right hip is bend and not in a straight line from hip to head. i think that causes some differences in the rest of their swing. if the body is straight compared to the hips and so on i believe its easier to enable the arm to swing free. its pretty much what you said but as i said i think a factor why it is like that is federer kinked (if thahts the right word) hip/belley area. i hope its about clear what i am meaning.

Great analysis.My coach teached me a forehand in different way: without lag,dropping racket head down,witout using wrist.and he sayed i should stay very close to ball.so my forehand was very weak.

Can you compared Bautista Agut's and Federer's forehand?

Would be good to see a comparison between feds forehand from 2003-7 compared to today

Awesome comparison!!! Ryan is already an expert in knowing what his followers enjoy!! 😄 What is not so noticiable from behind in Alcaraz fh is how distinctly out in front seems to be his impact compared to other players. Perhaps only like Federer. It's a trait that draws attention. Next comes Jannick Sinner please.

So which grip ends up being harder on your elbow?