I wanted to make clips of Tamaki and Kirame's version. But they talked so long. So maybe I'll upload later. Or not.

@@EnglishNijisanji no problem, whether you decide to post it or not I just hope ppl will be mature and understanding. We are all just bystanders.

I hope we don't lose Roa over this too...

shiina didnt say anything ?

If English Nijisanji happen to not make them, I'll just tell what Kirame said. So basically she don't know what happened and how the situation was. And she said that she hasn't really contacted Meiro since their debut. They did talk sometime (in discord) but didn't interact that much. This probably because they don't have the time to. Especially when in their 1st month, Kirame us busy looking for a new apartment (maybe). She was living with her family and want a place where she can do her vtuber activities more freely. They actually planned a collab but before they can do that, the "incident" happened. This is what I can understand with my limited japanese. So if there are mistakes or this is not accurate, feel free to correct me.

I've seen this maid wearing guy around but didn't know his name. Subbing right now.

I would not blame them. Things quickly spiraled out of control when Narukami got ahold of those leaks, it was out of their control.

What happened ?

@@MukuonChannel I'm pretty sure the situation is already unsalvageable when Narukami published the video. Meiro already requested for graduation 3 times by then

@@narutohinataashgaara A rumor suggests that a huge mess happened between the management, two vtubers, one can be considered an "older employee/liver" while the other is a "newbie". (The older employee might have made an unreasonable request of making the newbie change her birth accent) Chaika and others tried to convince the newbie not to leave. But something happened between the management and the newbie. The newbie, under massive stress probably consulted her real life friend. Her friend then leaked all of the information to another vtuber that published a video on it. Causing the newbie to get booted for breaking NDA

@@Hoshino_szr Who was that other vtuber?

context?

@@LarKanon Meiro is a vtuber from nijisanji that retired and Chaika was one of her senpai that tired to talk her out of leaving.

Yeah I feel sad for him

@@MrLeseras Ah ok, I tought it was something else I wasn't aware. I only follow Ichigo, Debi, and Himawari streams...

And why do they talk about roa too?

Man now im really curious

Im curious now

Sadly it won't.

This year has been an all time low with vtubers not just graduating left and right but going down with a storm of drama too

@@zerronyx1362 As the audience for vtubers grows, there will be more and more toxic people circling around like piranhas looking to create drama. It's the same as any other entertainment medium. The important thing is for fans not to play into that.

@@zerronyx1362 It's really sad tbh. Aloe from HoloFive, the entire Hololive CN girls and now this.

@Silent Dawn She wasn't really the good girl to begin with. Just friendless, and I already understood her actions because I would've and did a similar thing to what she did in certain scenarios. The same with Meiro, but I have no desire to just cancel either of them because its just that I don't want to side with either of the two.

@Silent Dawn Ichikira also tried to be the "neutral role",but was quite biased to one side.

Can someone explain the situation from the beginning? What happened? How is Roa and ichikara involved?

@@narutohinataashgaara Roa tried to get Meiro to change her voice delivery as their voices are similar and regional accent the same. Meiro felt she was getting strongarmed by her senpai and felt it impossible to change something like that. Ichikara basically told them to sort it out among themselves. Someone from Meiro's side leaked details of the situation to an internet drama channel that twisted the details to make things more salacious than they were. Ichikara doesn't let Meiro back out of a threat to resign after the leak, ending her employment.

@Silent Dawn Ichikara always has many issues in itself and need Nijireji to correct themselves at times.

thats very much what the traditional japanese mindset is like, methinks

Pretty much celebrity/idol in general

Nijisanji Resistance stood by Meiro for the longest time. If Meiro had told Chaika and Shiina about somebody's personal DMs and somebody's rabid fanbase they would have helped her tough it out. Shiina had known about the issue since the big Powerpro tournament and personally collabed with Meiro and talked to her multiple times, if only she trusted Shiina more...

Absolute pain

Life is Pien

2020 sucks

Imagine thinking an accent is your property. Really, I never watched to Roa's streams, and after this, it only shows I’m not missing anything

@@paodebatata6606 not really the accent per se maybe something like the speech flaw. But i guess its kinda her character and she felt that someone having the same speech flaw kinda makes her character no longer unique. But yeah i guess roa overreacted abit too much too

@@moistpotato2739 im new to vtubers and I haven't watched anything from wither of the vtubers but I did look up what this was about, wasn't it a regional dialect and not a speech flaw ? Dialect would be super hard to change cause it can slip out when you are excited or nervous

@@darkangel9551 according to the translation of the official statement i believe it was speech flaw but some also translated it as accent And yes, it is pretty unreasonable to change someone’s accent

@@moistpotato2739 hmmm I see, damm tho either way this feels like it shouldn't have blown up so much

All the more reason not to pointing fingers, eh

@@derrilazkia1002 I would still point it at someone though

@@Hoshino_szr it's not like we know to full detail about it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

@@derrilazkia1002 The truth will not come out because companies like to sweep their mess under the rug. If they don't have anything to hide they would gladly prove that Roa is not doing power harassment and is innocent. But they don't.

@@Hoshino_szr just point it to Narukami.

what happened to roa?

@@SnowVillers789 This whole thing started when Roa asked Meiro to change her accent , nothing would have happened to Meiro if Roa didn't came up with such selfish and absurd request and the there is also fact that the Niijisanji staff didn't said anything about such selfish and absurd request coming from a Liver to another and even let her continue with it

There's also the fact that this news was somehow leaked to that N guy as well. The request was quite selfish yeah, but had Meiro not broke the contract by unintentionally leaking info to N guy, there's a chance Niji management would refused Roa request. It could have ended differently had Meiro chose not to tell her friend about it. Overall, it's just a string of terrible decision from both side.

@@TioHell1991 I read the translation and summary on megathread on reddit. If I need to point someone, it's Meiro's fault. 1st, if she have an accent from where she was raised, she either lied on her video application and/or when she debuted. 2nd. Roa keep asking to talk eyes to eyes in this, but she keep refusing. She (Roa) even plea to sort this out without escalating to Ichikara but she still refuse. 3rd. She keeps asking to be graduuated and then cancel it when it is granted. It's either a bluff or a genuine unprofesionalism. 4th. She disclose this information without Ichikara permission to indie vtuber. That's an automatic breach of contract. That's what I got from this.

@@TioHell1991 According to what I read in principle, it was not Roa's fault copy and paste this I read the translation and summary on megathread on reddit. If I need to point someone, it's Meiro's fault. 1st, if she have an accent from where she was raised, she either lied on her video application and/or when she debuted. 2nd. Roa keep asking to talk eyes to eyes in this, but she keep refusing. She (Roa) even plea to sort this out without escalating to Ichikara but she still refuse. 3rd. She keeps asking to be graduuated and then cancel it when it is granted. It's either a bluff or a genuine unprofesionalism. 4th. She disclose this information without Ichikara permission to indie vtuber. That's an automatic breach of contract. That's what I got from this.

Is that narukami guy again??

what is NDA?

@@SnowVillers789 Non disclosure agreement

@@SnowVillers789 Non Disclosure Agreement. A contract that says "You are not supposed to reveal / talk about X thing".

@@gmastersecret5566 in my opinion, he's part of the escalation and actually how Ichikara was able to invoke the NDA thingy

Alot of comments also were saying that "she's a devil after all", "i thought devil was just her role, but she's actually a devil herself", etc. That's kinda sad tbh. I don't want to pick a side, but it's better if we just lost 1 rather than 2..

@@Kanegane indeed, i love roa's character and would be a sad day for me to lose her

I'm not sure if Roa can ever rebound from this. This reminded me of the Sio situation.

​@@Hoshino_szr yeah, i notice that possibility too it's exactly why I said, i don't know both had fair share of their wrong doing so far by what i'm reading I really wonder how Ars and Banderas feel toward Roa

Both have share of fault, and thing can actually be handled better, that make this suck so much

Yeah a series of unfortunate events kinda happened, really just an unfortunate case.

Impulsive isn't the right word. A lot of people cannot handle pressure and are not always equipped to deal with this sort of thing with grace and mindset. Meiro seemed like one of them. I hate that she's gone and I hate that this whole thing turned out like this.

it's a long story, basically, a drama happened between meiro and one of the senpai, the case dragged on that she needed to be retired, chaika and few others tried to make her stay but failed

Try looking her name up in reddit, there should be a detailed post there.

man, thats pain

Hurt

Kaoru, Aloe, and now Meiro. This is rough to see.

@@CrystalTigerclaw not forget nobuhime

Lots of Vtubers retiring this year, or maybe it's like this every year we just didn't notice before as they weren't as relevant.

We kinda forget that vtuber is a job, just like being an actress, musician, comedian, isn't it

I agree, they have more than 100 members and still remained almost drama-free(some things happened here and there, but not a big deal).

What happened has happened. I hope Ichikara can be more careful when handling requests that are too extreme, and not be TOO hands off.

@@Hoshino_szr or just ask the very group that was formed a.k.a. NijiReji to help settle such disputes especially when it was the same NijiReji that helped Ichikara change multiple policies.

@@ousamadearudesuwa Even though NijiReji is a group that pushes for change, they probably don't have the power or the authority to do so.

that would be hard to do after someone from meiro’s side leaked it for the whole world then both sides leaking more and more to social media..... both sides wants to tell the world their side of the problem and it spirals into a big problem

Basically Roa from asked Meiro to change her accent, as it was part of her lore that the accent she used was from the demon realm. Meiro said she couldn't and that it was her natural accent and it came out when she wasn't thinking or if she was nervous. They couldn't come to an agreement about it, and Meiro requested graduation but then went back on it, she apparently told a friend about everything that happened who leaked what was going on and resulted in a breach of NDA and termination of Meiro's contract. There's a bit more details and allegations in there than what I just said but you can read it more detail here if your interested: old.reddit.com/r/VirtualKZfaqrs/comments/je2syn/kingyozaka_meiro_megathread/

@@sweptay Thanks for putting that as no one else was putting anything to explain it.

People always need something or someone to blame whenever something bad happens. Always. They never stop to think that it maybe just some kind of misunderstanding. For both fans and talent. This is just a bad situation going worse.

I think they are anti

I think the healthy thing is to ignore them, support both of them and not drag the issue anymore, otherwise we end up affecting more than 1 person and like that end as a toxic community which isn't something I want for us in the vtuber community

@@0dorii There is no confirmation on that rule. There is also several people still sounding like eachother. Even it is a rule, its on ichikara to tell people applying about it. The rumour is, that is a "stealth rule" which makes no sense.

@@0dorii no

m.kzfaq.info/get/bejne/mpZ9o7yEnqmah2Q.html

they did, resistance changed her mind in her first attempt to retire but they cant change her mind for the second time plus she violate the NDA pretty much locked her career so everyone cant do anything about it

Wait what happened with mahiro?

@@arueru88 mahiro was previously asked to change her accent too by a certain someone.

Trigger happy toxic fans are gonna kept harassing Roa now cuz they think it's entirely her fault. I'm not as blind as not to see the error in Roa's request with Meiro but I'm also not that much of an asshole to put the entire blame on Roa. I believe she's a good person, which may makes her feel entirely guilty now that all of this happened. I hope she's not too depressed and also hope Meiro will be successful in her future endeavors.

You can probably find a better understanding of the situation by reading through some of the comments, or by searching her name up in reddit. Just come to your own conclusion about the situation.

From what I've read Chaika should of just meet up and it would of solved basically ever situation and even if it didn't then she showed that she tried, she tried to solve it. Roa asked to meet in person. Chaika declined, Roa sent some more wanting to meet and Chaika said she never said she wouldn't meet (even though she did say she wouldn't.) And more stuff happened. But it's odd that it looks like most of this would of not happen if Chalka just meet Roa. Even if they couldn't sort it out then Chalka could say she tried and actually went out of way to try to solve the problem. But we might not have all the info so this thought could change on more info but I did read a good amount.

@@kclink1579 Apologies, did you mean Meiro? We can always say that x vtuber or x company could have done something to solve an issue, but hindsight is 20/20.

It's quite a messy situation with overreactions from the vtubers and underreactions from the management but the basic events are: -Roa contacts Meiro about her accent/dialect, asks for Meiro to stop using it since it is Roas "trademark". -Meiro declines -Roa flaunts her senpai status, people see this as "power abuse" -Meiro declines and contacts management -Management gets involved -They tell Meiro to stop using her accent -Meiro says it's her natural accent and she cant just stop using it -Roa asks to meet Meiro IRL to discuss things, Meiro declines and stops communicating with Roa -Asks to retire -Gets permission to retire -Doesnt retire, leaks some information (?) and talks about "behind the scenes" things claiming she had permission to do so from Nijisanji -Asks for permission to retire again -Gets permission -Doesnt want to retire after all, asks for her retirement proceedings to stop -Doesnt get accepted, Nijisanji pushes for her retirement "against" her will -They say it's due to breach of contract, for leaking/discussing private Nijisanji things, but it's a messy situation so who knows. I might have got some things wrong but that should be a very simple version of the events that took place.

@@TheMegaRin you forgot to add "Meiro didnt get permission from nijisanji to leak anything, and leaking it while streaming when she had no permission to stream" and nijisanji doesnt "pushes for her retirement "against" her will" she got fired for "Leaking" that same information Don't made it sound like "Meiro is victim" BOTH livers are wrong, and Nijisanji is incompent

Dont get me wrong, i didn't hate Roa but telling someone to change their accent just because its similar to u is not cool

@@izu1624 yes i totally agree, this whole incident didnt need to happen if roa just being open minded about it,it just really sad that something so small can lead to a talented vtuber graduate

@@izu1624 didn't hate? so now you hate her? (please don't be offended with this message, just genuinely curious )

You're basing your thought off reddit posts. No one will know the truth, only the people involved. You people take this way too seriously and get involved as if you were the one's who personally got hurt. So sad. Bet you'll be binging Roa's clips if she decided to off herself out of shame for something people have no real idea about.

@@necodriver1419 You're basing your thoughts off of assumptions. When did I say I knew for a hundred percent what happened? I know nothing, I'm simply speculating and trying to find a balance between the people for and against Roa. However, based upon what I've seen and read (that being the Tweet from Roa showing the messages between her and Meiro, and the official Ichikara statements) I have come to a simple conclusion: I can no longer in good faith support Roa, or watch her clips. Ever again. And you're bringing up the "Omg, she's ttly gong to cummeet soosaid guyz" that you heard Nora talk about. One problem: Roa was the cause of what happened when she called management on Meiro, not even a month into her streaming activities. That's a *fact* . What happened in-between, don't know. Only the people involved know. I only said that I will no longer support Roa, or watch her videos. Of course I don't want her to off herself. And I don't want Meiro to off herself either. That's the last thing anyone wants. What people want is more info. What really happened, and what caused this conflict? Are you sure you're not the one who's too invested in this based on things you just wanted to hear? Also, you're forgetting that there are people hurt. People who genuinely enjoyed Roa, who, in the wake of this mess can no longer support her. The people who supported Meiro, who now no longer can do so due to her being released. And then people who supported both, and wanted the best for both girls. Hurt can be described in a number of ways, but you seem too shallow to have a firm grasp of it. How sad. Let me also reverse the question: Will you be more invested in this situation and looking up, binging Meiro's clips if Meiro offed herself?

@@necodriver1419 Not really. If a vtuber made it to my dislike list I wouldn't care about what happens to her afterwards, since I don't care about it anymore

​@Tum Tum Thanks. As I posted in my OP: Meiro isn't free from guilt. But circumstances considered, I can go lighter on her, since I know very well what power harassment can do to a person. In this case, seeking help from a third person. Which was against Ichikara rules, so she got punished for it. That's the only thing I can hold against Meiro, but again the keyword here is *circumstances* . But I can see why this may prevent her from getting signed to another agency, unless they understand her situation. Roa deserves the harshest critique of how she handled herself (needless to say, poorly) to a newbie in Nijisanji, and calling the management on her not even a month into Meiro's streaming venue. We know this from Roa's own DM message to Meiro, and from Ichikara's own statement. Furthermore, there was an *Edited* next to Roa's first message. We don't know what was truly said, and will never find out. So I won't speculate on it futher, other than finding the response Meiro gave REALLY defensive. That is, if it was a simple message. But given what Meiro wrote, it just seems a little doubtful that it was the furthest thing from *simple* . We cannot trust Roa or Ichikara to be upfront, as both of them can say whatever they want and Meiro can't defend herself. And even more so, we can't be sure if Roa did indeed step up to Ichikara and told them she'd quit if Meiro did not change her accent. As that is all speculation too, I won't comment further on it. But you can see why this gets people thinking in the wake of what happened? I find it very difficult to feel sorry for Roa when she was the one who first messaged Ichikara management about Meiro for "sounding similar", and that it'd be damaging for her brand if someone sounded similar. Which again, if a dialect is your whole brand, pretty weak brand. And now what, is everyone from Kyushu now ineligible to sign up for Nijisanji because they might sound similar to Roa? This could have been like Ars and Amamiya, but Roa had no interest in it. Which brings us to the power harassment bit. You don't flaunt your "1.5 years of experience and character building" to a junior who just joined a month ago. This is what also caused people to mockingly message Roa with lines like: "Oh yeah, let's smash all the juniors! You've got my support!" and I can't blame them for it. As I said in my OP, those words were very carefully chosen, no matter what the intended point was for it to come across. I assume it caused Meiro quite a lot of panic (again, I'm taking from her first response to Roa when Roa sent the first edited message) when she said that: She wanted to talk, and by no means did she want to offend her senpai/kouhai. As for what happened behind the scenes, again. We don't know. I'm not fueling the speculation, but I am looking at what's come out from either Roa herself or Ichikara. Which brings us to Ichikara themselves. I don't know what the person was smoking when they decided to take Roa's request seriously, but I want some of it if it means I can just smoke these troubles away. They never should have agreed to take her request, but they did. And that showed their bias, when they didn't agree to Meiro's request, but listen to Roa's unbelievably dumb request for someone to change the way they've spoken since birth. And before someone says: "Well, Meiro spoke in standard Japanese during her job interview!" Yeah, to sound more professional! She didn't have her character assigned yet at the time (I'm assuming), and the way one speaks in an interview is obviously going to be different from when they're adding personality to their character. I don't even get why people brought that up, it's just...really a dumb point to bring up. Would you speak formal during a job interview? I'm sure you do. This can't be held against Meiro. If you do, you're no better than Roa and the management at Ichikara who told Meiro that she can't speak the way she's spoken for years with friends and family members. So again, to sum it up: 1) Meiro is not free from guilt. She's made mistakes, but none of these can be held against her for too long as it appears that a lot of pressure was put on her that Ichikara did not, would not help her with. And as a final resort, she contacted a third party to share her story with. During this time, Shiina and Chaika tried to talk Meiro out of resigning, but this seemed to not have worked. Depression and feeling backed against a wall changes people. We can see the result of that in what happened. 2 ) Ichikara lost one of their newest, faster rising members in Meiro. She was getting a lot of popularity very quickly, and it was taken away from people too soon. This spurred people into action against not only Ichikara, but also Roa. Because they lost one of their favorites, if not their favorite, VTuber too early in her career due to lack of management and guidance. I can understand where these people are coming from. A lot of them, like me, brought up that their four-page statement was riddled with errors and inconsistencies. Again, in page one they said that Roa never made a request for management to talk to Meiro about her accent, but on page three in their timeline, they DO say that Roa made a request to management in regards to Meiro. So which one is it? I am unsure if this was a mistake, but given the rest of their statement, I doubt it was. After all, Ichikara holds the narrative. Now that Meiro is gone, they can say whatever they want and no one can dispute it, as only they know what really happened, and they're not telling us. It was an insufficient summary. 3) Roa has come out of this damaged and possibly irrepairable. It was her that brought this on when she felt so threatened by Meiro that she felt that she had to call management on her instead of talking things out personally. If that was the intended purpose, you wouldn't need to call management on someone if you really just "wanted to talk". Most likely this will have long-lasting consequences for Roa. I highly doubt she's in good favor inside Nijisanji, and the court of public opinion has deemed her VTuber career smashed, in the wake of what happened and knowing what we know based on what Roa and Ichikara have said. I can't see anyone wanting to do anymore collabs with Roa in the future, as her cutesy and innocent persona has been stained, damaged. Like a broken vase, and the push that caused it to fall to the floor was essentially harassing a younger co-worker out of the company. That may not have been what Roa wanted, but that is what happened due to what Roa did. (And let me state once again, I want both Meiro and Roa to be safe and not take their own lives.) I'm sure in due time, people will forget and move on, but the damage will stay forever most likely. If not that, it'll take a long time for the scars to heal from this incident. Roa is not the victim, she was the instigator. I cannot find a reason as to why she shouldn't face some kind of punishment, but the internet has already spoken. If Roa decides to retire, in my opinion? It'll be fair game, since she caused someone else to quit. And futhermore, she never apologized to the one person who needs an apology. She never said sorry to Meiro. It was all huff and fluff in her apology. Me, and many others, are truly convinced that her career is as good as over. She probably won't have people wanting to collab with her. And to think, it all happened because of a dialect. In Roa's quest to defend her brand, she has caused her brand irrepairable damage. Had cooler heads prevailed, and had there not been this much petty nonsense going on, we could have had some fun lore with Roa and Meiro, like Ars and Amamiya making fun of each other for their voices sounding similar. Or when VTubers do impressions of each other. It's in good fun. But the fun stops when people get hurt over it. And that's what happened, and that makes this all the worse for it. Did I sum this up just fine?

@@windmanv3158 Thank you man, for your long ass explanation. I've been saying the same thing as you for a days, with people who seems didn't understand that "if Roa didn't starting all of this shit, this mess isn't gonna happen" and they are trying to switch the blames to Meiro by saying "But Meiro is the ones who escalated the problems". I was like "are you out of your fcking mind, are you just gonna turn blind with Roa started this mess" Geez, i'm so tired...

Retirement?????? Wtf just happened? Why I couldn't find anything about my Goldfish? Is something happen again???

​@@lowxianwee666 www.reddit.com/r/VirtualKZfaqrs/comments/je2syn/kingyozaka_meiro_megathread/

The only one to blame here is Narukami. If he hadn't spread the "news", this problem wouldn't have become a drama and they could have solved this peacefully.

@@bit0016 Nope, we're gonna have the same result either Narukami spread the "News" or not. In fact, i appreciate Narukami for doing that. If he's not spreading the "News", none of us is gonna know why Meiro is graduated.

what was supposed to happen? info pls

@@SnowVillers789 You can read in this channel community tab.

If they can sit down and talk, this never gonna happen, if such minor thing like this resulted like this, i don't what will happen if she got actual major fuckup.

nah the accent was made by her tho m.kzfaq.info/get/bejne/mpZ9o7yEnqmah2Q.html

Every comment you have posted here does seem pretty biased.

@@jm329 Of course I'm biased. Everyone is. Like those that pledge that Roa did nothing wrong and will die to defend it, I'm just on the opposite side. Everyone has their own narrative, even if they pretend to be neutral.

@@Hoshino_szr And you choose an extreme position instead of being rational. Why?

@@jm329 Like I said. What might be extreme to you maybe normal to others. Would standing behind the possible power harasser a rational position? Would standing with a company that cannot solve such a easily solved issue a rational position? There is no rational position here, and no, sitting on the fence doesn't make put you in a rational position

@@Hoshino_szr No, not taking sides immediately is the only rational position. Jumping to defend a side is not. You don’t know everything that happened yet, and may not for a long time. Edit: and everyone else seems to think so as well, considering that your comment has been downvoted to the very bottom of the comment section. Don’t get emotional as that is the last thing anyone needs right now.

4th. She disclose this information without Ichikara permission to indie vtuber. That's an automatic breach of contract. From what I read she did not disclose the information to N she disclosed it to her friend but that said friend told it to N.

@Tum Tum the problem lies in the 4th point, she disclosed it to her friends, this is an NDA, and to make matter worst that said “trusted” friend leaked it to N.