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White: "Bart gives money to charities...there may be a reason for that." Me: "Uh, yeah James...to HELP people. Crazy, right?"

My first thought when he said Bart isn't a happy man was "all he EVER does is laugh. He seems like such a happy guy"

So Bart is simultaneously a bad student, and he wrote a very well written scholarly paper? That about right?

Apologists almost always use ad hominems to discredit people. “You were never really a Christian” is a universal trope. They are running scared of Ehrman and other scholars who point out the myriad failings of their doctrine of inerrancy, etc.

I have a PhD in history. Bart Ehrman is absolutely correct about the way historians work and what history is.

So James decided to sit down and literally GOSSIP about Bart infront of a congregation? Church really has stooped to an all new low.

Dr. Ehrman is amazingly patient in the face of White's passive aggressive, thinly-veiled insults. Like an "official" explanation of Dr. Ehrman leaving Christianity, clearly implying that it's not the real reason and Ehrman knows it. And the constant attribution of motive to Dr. Ehrman's work. It's totally self-serving for White and the people who apparently like what he does.

That whole bit of him going "well what did you expect God to do, just take over the scribe and make him write the line like a robot?" had me just going "YES!" at my screen. I seriously don't understand why God can apparently 'inspire' the original authors, to write his perfect, infallible word... but then doing the same to a bunch of scribes so we actually have proper copies of it is just impossible? I seriously don't understand what is going inside the brain of a person like this...

I went to a Catholic school 65 years ago and graduated as an Atheist. I got the highest mark in Catholic Christianity and told the teacher that I wrote what he wanted to hear and read. Bart came along and confirmed it.

Bart Ehrman is a genius. He acknowledges historical Jesus but rips resurrected Jesus. Ever notice how carefully Christians choose their words when critiquing him?

The _Truth has nothing to fear from investigation._ *So when all else fails, attack the person doing the investigation.*

Bart is an incredibly upbeat individual, practically the least sad person ever 😅. He is always laughing and enthusiastically delves into passionate tangents about topics that captivate his interest. Brilliant mind, and brilliant mindset!

This thing of "all non Christians are miserable" really grinds my gears. I've dealt with chronic depression most of my life and it has never been as bad as when I was a Christian. I no longer have people telling me (or am telling myself) that it's a personal or moral failing. Whether that's not having enough faith to be healed or some sort of sin causing it or being possessed. When we're not Christian we're sick because we don't have god. When we are Christian it's not that god doesn't work - it's that we've failed somehow.

No one knows what is like to be the bart man, To be the sad man, behind brown eyes.

Bart I’m sorry you are sad 😂. Thank you for bringing joy to my life. I love hearing you speak.

I guess "apostate" is what christians call their former members who have come to their senses

Regarding "Dr." White's education, from Wikipedia: "White graduated with a BA from Grand Canyon University (formerly known as Grand Canyon College) and an MA from Fuller Theological Seminary. His ThM, Th.D. and D.Min. degrees from Columbia Evangelical Seminary (formerly Faraston Theological Seminary), an unaccredited online school. The legitimacy of White's academic credentials has been questioned."

The absolute irony is that as a calvinist James White actually believes that anything that happens was decreed by God from before the creation of the world. This would include the mistakes the scribes have made... absolutely absurd.

Dr Ehrman is so entertaining to listen to. I don’t always understand what he’s talking about because I lack his vast knowledge but I have learned so much listening to him.

I had to laugh when he got to the part about claiming that Bart ehrman isn't a happy man. As adult humans, we all struggle with finding fulfillment, joy, peace, but Bart ehrman is clearly doing about as well as can be reasonably expected. This is just the one way logic gate of Christianity manifesting itself in terms of reading emotions and mental health. In their minds, if someone ever finds joy, it is the free gift of God, but any suffering commensurate with The human experience is just a personal failing or part of the fallen nature or something.

I love when theologians claim that manuscripts written 30 years after Jesus died contain accurate information because they occurred so close in time. And then, they read someone's book or hear a debate or lecture with someone that happened recently and they totally misrepresent things that were said in it.

For those of us who were very religious and then became atheists, atheism, at least in my case, made me examine my core beliefs. When I did so, I realized that doing good has nothing to do with religion. It come from having a perspective that we can be good for the sake of doing good for our planet and all creatures that live on it. As I've looked at religion with open eyes, I've come to agree with the following by Steven Weinberg: “With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil - that takes religion." When one looks at the long history of bloody religious wars, religion has been a frequent source of human misery.

It's so weird that Christians think you need a reason to give to charity.

It's the usual thing: Ehrman's departure from the faith makes Christians uncomfortable, but they're incapable of addressing the arguments so they find fault with him personally. "He's an unhappy, unfulfilled man" and "he gives money to charity---I find that highly suspicious". They don't realize how transparent they are.

This was an excellent video Paul! I love your segments with scholars!

It's funny how walking away from the self proclaimed authority a Christian or Christianity gives itself is an attack. God does not scare the christian nearly as much as the christian's own reflection in the mirror. A critical and objective look at christianity, islam, judaism, or ancient mythologies is not an attack.

Bart tells the truth uses facts and research he doesn't push it on anybody you can make your own decision.

I will never understand the compulsion that so many people have to assert they know the "heart and mind" of others. It's just gross.

Imagine that, an apologist misquoting and outright lying about someone who they see as a threat to their indoctrination of children.

I tell you, I just love, *LOVE* (sarcasm) when theists try to tell me why I "really" deconverted or what I really beleve, how I feel, or felt. Oh boy its SO GREAT.

I liked the part where he tried to paint giving to charity as a character flaw.

I thoroughly enjoyed listening to Bart... refreshing and enlightening. Thank you Bart.

I have the utmost respect for Bart Ehrman. He makes sense, he is charming and like all humans he makes mistakes. On the other hand, Mr James White has to rely on falsehoods and questionable claims to support his unwavering position. Personally, I think that Mr White was frightened by Bart's charm and eloquence. This must have shaken White's core beliefs to the bone. "Atheists are unhappy and evil" suddenly seems less realistic.

Paul: thanks for making this video, great job 👍 Bart: Your life does indeed have purpose and meaning, you mean so much to many of us in this world. Thank you for all your hard work. Hang in there, thank you!

Like Bart, I found my morality feels more real and authentic. It's so much easier to live my values. There was a very real anxiety that came from living in fear of extrinsic morals.

The irony of James White saying Bart is not a happy man can be cut with a knife.

Dr. Ehrman is a treasure for those who are interested in learning history. I have benefitted a great deal because of his breadth and depth of knowledge gained from a whole professional lifetime of research and study, combined with his ability to recall details, and then present them to laymen in a clear, concise manner that makes it all understandable. I thank him for what he does. Society is better because of his work.

Funny how he blames his daughter's deconversion on Bart ,, when in all truth ,, He was the cause !

Calling James White “Dr” is an insult to anyone who went to graduate school. His ThD was from a diploma mill

I've noticed that there has been a deliberate effort to encourage christians to refer to atheists as "apostates" and to cry about it not being the social norm anymore. It seems like a weird move...like, do they aim to label us apostates, and then bring back laws that punish apostates? I guess I don't understand what their goal is, but certain apologists have been pushing for it so there has to be a reason.

Space aliens would be a natural explanation but historians can't just appeal to them either. So when the apologist suggests a naturalist presupposition why god isn't accepted as explanation, he's wrong. Both extraordinary claims should have evidence to back them up.

I didn’t know until this week about Bart donating all proceeds from his blog to charities. Even though I have no time to read his blog, I will be signing up for it this weekend just to support that work.

James White is upset that his daughter now sees through him. I am a daughter in a similar position.

Bart Erhman is probably the most objective historian of the new testament to have ever lived. Apologists are forced to criticize him because he's really good at what he does.

Bart's reaction to being called unhappy was hilarious. 😂

“Bart is an apostate”…. Yup, many of us are too! Haha

It's so frustrating, in any arena, to hear someone talk about someone else in clearly inaccurate ways in order to prop their position up on fictional stilts. Let me make this clear to any believers out there: I counted myself among you for most of my life, but it has specifically been tactics like this - distortions or disingenuous strawman arguments, delivered with a kind of gentle condescension - that helped me transition into well-considered non-theism more than any life event or unanswered prayer. I remember in the 80's when "Satan" was described as being too smart to show up as evil, but that he'd be so smooth that he'd just tell you what you want to hear and the next thing you know, you're following the antichrist. Funny thing is, here we are in the 21st century, dealing with a demagogue like Trump who exemplifies the diametric opposite of Jesus' teachings, and evangelicals flock to him. It's just amazing to me, truly. I sip my coffee this morning, feeling bolstered in my release of all this tortured thinking, and am left only with a deep curiosity for the world and how humans think their way through it. Such a goofy and glorious time to be alive. Cheers!

'God can kill whoever he chooses.' - a christian 'We get our morals from God.' - also a christian. ... Awkward!!!

What a silly criticism that a thesis from a new scholar in 1985 is outdated. Dr. Ehrman’s continued writing and researching in the 40 years since then. Is he still working from an old, outdated framework? Probably not, or Dr. White would have said that.

As someone who's tight on funds at the moment, I'm ecstatic that Bart made this particular course free.

I find it odd when these apologists go into telling people how others think. Yet they say gossiping is wrong.

This was a super interview. In just minutes, Bart cleared up James White’s misunderstandings of Ehrman’s approach to biblical scholarship and he did it in good humor. It’s probably true that Ehrman’s scholarship has caused several Christians to question the notion that the Bible is inerrant. James White no doubt thinks that this is a major problem, so he attacks Ehrman’s character. But as Ehrman points out, there’s no reason a Christian cannot remain a Christian knowing that the Bible contains mistakes and contradictions. Faith doesn’t mean an absolute allegiance to the inerrancy of the Bible, rather it can accommodate the notion of errancy as a normal part of human existence and still be deeply spiritual and transformative.

Dr. Bart is so much fun to listen to. An absolute wealth of knowledge. Years of content to read and watch.

Jimmy White was right about one thing. Teenagers are OK with anything if you give them enough pizza and pot. Wait, he said pizza and pop... never mind.

A classic example of somebody who thinks that they are so clever, they can only be "beaten" by a nefarious person with a sinister "plan". Projecting what he is actually doing onto the other person, when his cunning plan failed.

Wow, this a a great interview. It demonstrates how apologists operate against critical scholarship. I laughed when White said “let’s be honest …”.

Yeah, it's totally common for students not doing well at university and not particularly interested in their field of choice and related topics to end up with a Ph.D. in that very field - if their Alma Mater is a christian title mill.

Don't we love all those mind reading Christians?

Bart, your scholarship is outstanding. Keep it up!

Thank Paul! I really enjoyed this video. I left Christianity about 5-6 years ago after discovering that the NT self proclaimed apostle Paul didn't teach the teaching of Jesus and then realizing that even Jesus didn't teach the same as the God of the old testament. Over the last 10 years I've read the scriptures front to back about 12 times as I sought the truth and nothing but the truth. I've concluded that there is a Creator Almighty but not the one that man has created in the bible. Ever wonder why God only spoke 10 statements aka ten commandments? When we answer that question, suddenly things start making perfect sense. There is one clear truth in the NT and that is that the truth makes you free; however, it's only if the person is wanting and willing to accept the truth. Most people can't handle the truth. It's too simple and it frees people rather than enslaves them. The truth does feed the religious coffers or buy the new Mercedes for the pastor. LoL The truth is that our Creator Almighty needs us and we must be willing to stop listening to and giving our esteem to others and develop a one on one relationship with him. He would never ask us to blindly follow or blindly trust (faith). He wants us to use our minds and senses and simply ask the questions. If you only seek truth, it will come to you. Truth will change your world entirely. God is real. He doesn't change. He gave us freewill to choose. We have the ability to change our direction and look directly to him for instructions. If your eyes are opened by him, you'll read the Tenakh and his truth will stand out and be separate from man's lies. You'll see and understand. There is very little in those pages that are actually from God.

Bart is a very a productive human and seem like a great guy. Thanks Bart

This guys whole tirade is just because his daughter has begun to think for herself. And apparently she saw some Erhman content. Now he’s blaming him for exposing her to facts. The enemy of fundamentalists.

What a clever way to approach this!! Great job.

I'm pretty sure I just watched a deconstruction of a deconstruction of a deconstruction. These back and forth videos are like having the longest debates in history. Still entertaining and educational though! 🙂

THANK YOU, Dr. Ehrman, for acknowledging that Apollonia of Tyana was a miracle worker who ascended into heaven. I have the damnedest time convincing anyone of this.

"I know some people who knew Ehrman, and [completely false description]" Exactly why we shouldn't trust the nth-hand accounts in the Gospels!

23:14 when I was a kid my mom told me that if the scribes made so much as one mistake they would have to Throw away the entire Book and start again from Genesis and WRITE IT AGAIN!!! And that's why there are no errors.

If Bart Ehrman is not happy, I'd like to know who is.

Dr. Ehrman is always such a gentleman… as someone who’s a bit too mouthy, I really admire how he responds to these folks. 🤣

"He is not a happy man" This has to be the most tone-deaf assessment ever. I don't see how you can have any interaction with Dr. Ehrman and come away with such an opinion.

"He does give money to charity, I think there's probably a reason for that" Yeah, like "wanting to help others" or something like that. Obviously because it's not explicitly about giving glory to God, it must be actually evil or something.

I hate that being this early to a video, and have nothing witty to say

I really enjoy listening to these men tegether or individually. They are so thoughful and come across as very nice people. That's a nice combination!

I would hope a dissertation from the 1980's would be outdated. If it isn't that basically means we've learned nothing since then. Only an Evangelical would expect for nothing to change in like 40 years.

This is your public testimony/baptism a digital copy for the whole world to see. 🙏🙏🙏🙏.

Funny how one author and debator can accuse another author and debator of trying to change people's beliefs in order to sell books... without realizing how easily his words can be turned around on him.

I love the Bart guest spots the most. I’m gonna start a drinking game where we take a shot during your video any time he does that signature giggle.

These guys are running scared. They can not stand even reasonable questioning of their dogma, so they make a full-on hit peices to poison their congregation's well. It's sad, really.

What a despicable hit-piece. Bart did really well to ignore the thinly-veiled insults and misrepresentations. This sort of thing reminds me of Hitchens talking about how religion makes otherwise decent people do horrible things. I have no doubt Mr White thinks he is doing the right thing by attacking Bart like this, including the insults and completely misrepresenting him. His need to “protect the children” from hearing reasonable objections to the faith they’ve been fed on since birth is so strong that it’s fine to act this way. The end clearly justifies the means to him.

You do not require religious beliefs to be an ethical and decent person...amen

James White was very passive aggressive, like an abusive spouse. Not cool, Jimmy.

Woo 🎉 Bart's on Team Apostate. Go team!

12:38 - And now the gloves are off, and Dr. White wants us to believe that Bart is personally unhappy and unfulfilled in his life. Because, you know, it's just so obvious to him and if Christian apologists know anything, it's that throwing a good handful of poison down the well is never a bad idea when dealing with non-believers. Shameful, absolutely shameful.

Interviewer's face looks so bewildered by how Dr. White got into these talking points from the original question he posed. He looks like he's on the verge of asking, "Who's this Dr. Bart Ehrman guy?" Thank you for the free course! Circumstances keep me from affording the courses I'd love to audit, so this was a lovely opportunity.

I'm worried about this guy's daughter. . . Dude won't even let her have her own opinion. It's a scary mindset that comes from the patriarchal Bible.

lots of scholars try to communicate their work with the general public, which necessarily involves a different style. as long as the factual claims between them are identical, i’ve no problem with there being a “popular version” of any given scholar.

I'd definitely like to hear Dr. Ehrman explain his phd thesis! I know a few things (both my parents were school teachers) but I'm just a retail worker at job so when they get into the real technical language I have to google every other word for definitions, and even then I'm not confident of my grasp of what's being said. I've been deconstructing heavily this last year and had only ever heard his work spat on so I'm definitely gonna buy his book!

This is really fun, thank~you.

I think White just extrapolated from his experience of debating Bart. Bart is miserable in that debate. It's just not enjoyable because White is so mean and bad faith. It's a massive difference to when Bart debates someone like Licona.

When people object to the Cristian fundamentalist beliefs the fundamentalist attack the person. Such an ad hominum approach.

I LOVE these collabs. Bart pls never stop making fun content like this and engaging the community. I love your work. And I'm glad Paul is a gentle soft spoken thinker for you to pair up with as opposed to more vitriolic and angry atheist content.

Excellent conversation. Love Bart Ehrman.

It's weird that some people can tell others what they think. Are they mind reader?

Error-free copying would actually require less divine intervention and potential abrogation of free will than the inspiration for the original text. The argument James presents is that the original texts must have been so clearly wise as to supersede human capacity without holy guidance , but God must have been prohibited from the tiniest prompt that would have prevented the occasional, still relatively rare for the size of the text error in spelling or punctuation.

There have been early copies of the Koran that had differences, there were also apparent errors in the transmission of the Koran.

It's very telling that attempts to seek truth are always treated as attacks by apologists.

That thing about God being "active in history" is just baffling to me. Like...yes... If the Christian God was real, should we not expect that he was active in the history of human events? The bible certainly portrays him as such. And if the bible is supposed to be inspired, why *_*couldn't*_* we expect that the supposedly all-knowing/powerful god that did the inspiring went through the trivially simple task of making sure the people writing/copying it didn't introduce errors?

Bart's PHD paper is dated... but the Bible isn't.... I think this guy's brain is a bit dated.

When people don't have anything to say for themselves, they speak for others When they run out of that, they speak for their gods