CSS-Audio Criton 2TD Review | Chapter 4: Testing and Measurements

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New Record Day

New Record Day

4 жыл бұрын

#CSSAudio #Criton2TD #Measurements
Ron from www.newrecordday.com tackles testing and measuring in Chapter 4, for the CSS-Audio Criton 2TD Audiophile Loudspeaker.
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Chapter 1: • CSS-Audio Criton 2TD R...
Chapter 2: • CSS-Audio Criton 2TD R...
Chapter 3: • CSS-Audio Criton 2TD R...
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Purchase the Criton 2TD: www.css-audio.com/online-stor...
+++++Gear used++++
Source: Macbook Pro/Roon/Qobuz
Amplifier: Vinnie Rossi LIO/AVC Tubestage module www.vinnierossi.com/
DAC: Vinnie Rossi LIO www.vinnierossi.com/
LTA MZ3 and Ultra Linear Amplifier: www.lineartubeaudio.com/
NAD M10: nadelectronics.com/product/m1...
Speaker cables: Audience audience-av.com/cables/
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Podcast: anchor.fm/newrecordday

Пікірлер: 50
@caseyodonnell6621
@caseyodonnell6621 4 жыл бұрын
When I was a kid I used to buy Stereo Review and read Julian Hirsch's reviews religiously about equipment I could never afford to buy. I appreciated the amount of detail he went into with regard to measurements and what those measurements meant from a practical standpoint. What you're doing on youtube feels like the next step in the review process. I still can't afford the gear (or justify the purchase most of the time) but I appreciate your approach to reviews. Keep up the good work. :-)
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Man, that means so much to me! Thanks for the comment and appreciation!
@mb-electricalservices
@mb-electricalservices 4 жыл бұрын
OK, so I'm writing this in real time as I watch. I'm incredibly pleased that you made a point of talking about room modes. I think people need to get educated on this as, on first glance, it may seem that the speaker is to blame but I can guarantee that if you took that same speaker outside, you would see a lovely response with no peaks or dips. I sold my original pair of speakers because I thought they were faulty due to this exact type of measurement. Fast forward a few years and now I know it is just my room and nothing else. This is what miniDSP is for... 😏
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Exactly and to be frank, I think us reviewers MUST have a basic understanding of measurements, specifically our listening environments.
@mb-electricalservices
@mb-electricalservices 4 жыл бұрын
@@Newrecordday2013 100% agree. 👍
@mb-electricalservices
@mb-electricalservices 4 жыл бұрын
@@stopthefomo Exactly. The reason I sold my first pair of speakers I bought is because I was uneducated. Looking back, it was foolish but when you're new to hifi, you can very easily be led down the wrong path.... Which literally can cost you thousands.
@treyhorn5645
@treyhorn5645 4 жыл бұрын
Thanks Ron, great vid.. Very cool on how valuable of using measurements to basically set your baseline for speaker placement so as not to set yourself up for a dissatisfied experience, but to realize the other factors involved.. ✌️
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching Trey! Appreciate you man!
@Stevo19801
@Stevo19801 4 жыл бұрын
Ron, get a pair of jbl 305 monitors. Would like your take on how these measure and sound
@drewrobertson6286
@drewrobertson6286 4 жыл бұрын
Hey Ron, I fix aircraft for a living, & I use calibrated tools all the time.... are your microphones, meters & amplifiers calibrated? Just wondering, & if so, how often do you recalibrate them? Edit: ps, love 💕 the thumbnail for this video!
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Hi Drew, the mics I am using are part of a system, called "clio pocket". The mics come with a data sheet tied to their serial number which allows me to input their calibrated response into the software prior to taking measurements. I have not recalibrated any of the mics since getting them as I do not have the hardware to do so.
@versus023
@versus023 3 жыл бұрын
hey great video. i was following this series with great interest and I purchased the 1TD as Left and right and 2TD as a center channel for my home theater. Is the room measurement video as been made?
@mb-electricalservices
@mb-electricalservices 4 жыл бұрын
Oh, and you definitely do say "access" as opposed to "axis"... You've always said it so I'm used to it but I freaked out when I first heard it. 🤣🤣🤣
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Hahahaha! Son of a gun!
@NeilBlanchard
@NeilBlanchard 3 жыл бұрын
On the room response and speaker placement, the thing I have learned, first from Roy Allison and a program he gave me to help work this out, and then actually doing it - is to vary the distances from the woofers and port to ALL the room boundaries. The key thing is to avoid common even factors - if all the distances are a multiple of 2 or 4 or 8, then you will have problems, for example. If you measure from the center of each woofer and the center of the port - to the floor, and to the ceiling, and the wall behind the speakers, and to each of the side walls (from each of the speakers to each side wall), and to the wall behind you - and see if any of the distances are multiples of another of the distances, or if more than one of the distances can be divided evenly by 2, or 4 - then you need to try to change one of the distances to something that does not share a common even factor. If you can get all the distances from each woofer and the port to the room surfaces to all be odd numbers, or better yet be prime numbers, then it is less likely to have a resonance "piling up" or sucking out, at a particular frequency. The goal is to *distribute* these distances, so they all are different and all have different factors. Another issue that I'm sure you already know, is floor/ceiling bounce cancellation.
@mb-electricalservices
@mb-electricalservices 4 жыл бұрын
I live on measurements. Keep 'em coming.. 👌
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Great!
@juststuff5216
@juststuff5216 4 жыл бұрын
Measurements are important at the engineering stage. Problem then is that I don't know anyone that uses objective listening devises as an end user. What we have are subjective listening devises called; our ears. And that's where things fall apart and prejudices such as price get factored, conscientiously or subconsciously .. mostly the former! And of course acoustics aren't based around things like money. - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/mah2h7RpmODanWg.html
@Grassy_Gnoll
@Grassy_Gnoll 4 жыл бұрын
I turned off the paved road. I'm going off access! Sorry… had to! Love the videos! Keep it up! Don't go pulling off axes on me! Whoops! Did it again! 👺
@drewrobertson6286
@drewrobertson6286 4 жыл бұрын
It would be interesting to do a vertical off axis measurement with the Maggie’s
@IliyaOsnovikov
@IliyaOsnovikov 4 жыл бұрын
Some cancelations in the 100-200 Hz range could be be related to a floor reflection interference.
@Lesterandsons
@Lesterandsons 4 жыл бұрын
Thanks for objective data, sometimes it correlates well, and shows how was designed a product ( sound signature)
@msoles30
@msoles30 11 ай бұрын
Hey Ron did ever fix your room and if so did it help with the mid bass being too heavy
@stoia3218
@stoia3218 4 жыл бұрын
ok, I'm a little confused, are you saying somebody like myself who may not have the ear that you do would cringe when I heard the bass? For an average listener would the bass be distracting?
@hifiman4562
@hifiman4562 4 жыл бұрын
You are saying it off axis. That's why it sounds funny.
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Ziiiiing! I see what you did there!
@1mctous
@1mctous 4 жыл бұрын
Based on your sound clips in chapter 3, they image quite well but the GR Research NX-Otica has set the bar much higher. I instantly heard the lower-midrange warmth and upper-midrange dip (built-in) and the room's bass nodes and nulls (not built-in). They consistently compress the attacks, suggesting fairly low efficiency. If your graph reflects 2.83 V input, they would average only about 85 dB/W. (CSS does not specify efficiency on its website.) Besides the high power requirement, potential buyers should also consider the kit which costs less than half the finished price.
@kerryarmes2786
@kerryarmes2786 4 жыл бұрын
Thanks, Martin. We didn't realize we missed adding the spec for these to the website. We will get it updated. They are a true 87 dB. For reference, the Tekton Double Impact is specified at 94 dB but is actually measured at 87 dB. I don't believe Ron took his measurements at 2.83 V for the review. If he did, it would indicate there is a problem with the pair he received.
@1mctous
@1mctous 4 жыл бұрын
@@kerryarmes2786 I'd move Ron's frequency response graph up about 2 dB up to get the 87 dB sensitivity. The Criton 2 impedance curve is remarkably free of cabinet artifacts and high phase angles. Given these measurements I therefore would agree with your 20 W minimum rating.
@johanneswolff6732
@johanneswolff6732 4 жыл бұрын
please make more videos about how to use Clio Pocket
@lextr3110
@lextr3110 4 жыл бұрын
awesome CSD... you should try to flat that curve with linear dsp and measurement mic.. i dont like that big 2k to 4k hole in the FR and I wonder what create this.. maybe too far c2c between mid woofers cancelling each other in these frequencies.. what is the crossover point? maybe they did something bad in the crossover! or its the tweeter sensitivity that cant keep up with the 2 woofers in its low band.. if yes higher crossover point and smaller c2c between woofer would fix this.. would need to truncate the tweets and woofer... not sure why they never do it anyway.. its a shame at this price to have MTM without its c2c optimized if you could you open it, unplug a woofer and measure it bare? so we know if its the woofer or tweeter itself that dip or something else haha it could be null phasing between midwoofer and tweets at crossover point too..
@kerryarmes2786
@kerryarmes2786 4 жыл бұрын
Keep in mind a couple things. What Ron is showing is still about +/- 2.5 dB for the on-axis measurement. Second, Ron doesn't have a calibrated microphone. Our measurements don't a dip that large and our tweeter level is not as depressed in our measurements. There is a null that develops in the vertical off-axis, which is real and based on the crossover design, but it has much less impact on the overall sound than if that were on-axis or in the horizontals.
@lextr3110
@lextr3110 4 жыл бұрын
@@kerryarmes2786 cool +- 2.5 db is acceptable.. looked more like a 5db drop from 2khz to 5khz any link to your measurements? using an uncalibrated mic and bad room measurements is kinda lame if you ask me.. also did he do the CSD measurement himself? or you sent yours?
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Hi Lex. Hi Lex, the mics I am using are part of a system, called "clio pocket". The mics come with a data sheet tied to their serial number which allows me to input their calibrated response into the software prior to taking measurements. I have 3 mics (all the same) and all measure identically after inputing their unique data. In regards to your "bad room measurements" comment, I am not sure what you mean by that. Can you explain that a little more in detail? Last, all the measurements you saw in the video were done by me. Thanks.
@lextr3110
@lextr3110 4 жыл бұрын
@@Newrecordday2013 then sorry for the misjudgement about the mic
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
One thing to consider: Mics can drift over time and should be maintained for their response. I know there are hardware devices out there that allow you manually calibrate mics but alas, I do not own any. Its possible my measurements are still off but I believe this would have to do with my environment over anything else. Even thought they are gated, I am still measuring in a home which is challenging to get perfect. Thanks!
@bencarignan2711
@bencarignan2711 3 жыл бұрын
Ron... you have a habit of saying access, instead of axis. There is no E in axis, yet you pronounce one. Axis is pronounced "axe-iss". Having said that, it was another great video. Keep it up!
@jayrick5174
@jayrick5174 4 жыл бұрын
How can they claim +- 1.5 db within 45hz-17khz?
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Its entirely possible my measurements are not perfect and shouldn't be accepted as such. Im sure Kerry will weigh in with how they go about their measurements but even still, they are with 2-3 with mine.
@kerryarmes2786
@kerryarmes2786 4 жыл бұрын
Jay, Ron's measurements aren't quite as accurate as ours. The measurements he sent us are "in the ball park." His microphone is not calibrated. We do not show the large dip that he has or as depressed a treble region with our measurements. Our measurements are +/-1.5 dB on-axis. Half of measurements are understanding how to take good measurements and half of measurements are understanding what you are looking at. Ron is working on getting there but is still pretty new to the whole process so the measurements need to be taken for what they are.
@andrewskaterrr
@andrewskaterrr 2 жыл бұрын
Off-access! driving me crazy 😂😂
@bigjay1970
@bigjay1970 4 жыл бұрын
Ron, was that a Vegetable Police impression in the beginning?🤫🙄🤔🤗
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Haha! I love the dude! I cant help it!
@bigjay1970
@bigjay1970 4 жыл бұрын
@@Newrecordday2013 Such a small world all things considered! And yes celery juice is fantastic for a lot if things as I have a horrible digestive system! Believe it or not my wife had a large black mole on her face for 10 years and it literally came off which is one of the possible things that can happen drinking the juice!🤯🤪🤗 And I also at times do the stupid help me line to my wife!🤪😁😂😝
@gasolin75
@gasolin75 4 жыл бұрын
access
@Newrecordday2013
@Newrecordday2013 4 жыл бұрын
Hahahaha!
@decoryder
@decoryder 3 жыл бұрын
I think the world of CSS Audio, and that won't change, but these measurements don't look good.
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