All the DM had to do was say that there was an outside ruling entity that enforced the laws of magic being illegal, and while the local government disagreed, the ruling government would not tolerate dissenters. Bada-bing Bada-boom, you've explained yourself and now you've done some world building.

"Sell your magical goods in regular shops" "That's illegal" "So make it legal" "Then we'd lose money without a black market" "So sell your magical goods in regular shops" "That's illegal" I wanna die

This is like the conversation between ManRay and Patrick about wether or not Patrick’s wallet was actually Patrick’s wallet

It would have been hilarious if the inquisitor had been pretending to be stupid as a form of psychological torture.

So your DM wrote himself into a plot hole and you all got jailed for it. Awesome.

This plot would easily make sense if he just made it so instead of magical items being illegal in that one town they were illegal throughout the province that way the local government had no control over it and that's why they'd be supporting a black market secretly

After reading the comments I like how people have hundreds of ways of making the DM’s dumb plot Work, but the DM himself couldn’t think of anything when he was creating the town

A black market isn't usually an actual market. It is a shop keeper selling something on the side. So one of the shopkeeper's should be saying out loud "I don't sell magic items here" while pointing to their backdoor for you to meet them there where they will sell you magical items. That's a black market.

It was basically a regular market that just so happened to be underground.

Your DM is pretty railroady

Unless your GM was trolling you on purpose, I say he's a really... limited guy.

Easier solution: "I stole armor from a paladin" *roll charisma* Just saying, could've tried that.

It sounds basically like the DM just wanted the black market to exist for story reasons but didn't put much thought into it at all.

The DM could have gotten himself out of it easily: Magic is illegal on the State/Federal level. City council can't flaunt state or federal law, but they can turn a blind eye and generate a bunch of off the Record, and therefore non-taxable, revenue for the town.

“Why don’t you sell the goods normally?” Inquisitor: “Wait. That’s Illegal.

When your DM doesn't quite grasp economics.

Hey man if she's an inquisitor it makes sense since that conversation is the worst torture i've witnessed.

“But that’s against the law.” “YOU MAKE THE LAW!”

I love the train sound effect. There is only one time as a DM I railroaded the players... That was when I put them on a literal railroad as they raced down a mine shaft in a cart. Battling foes, dodging obstacles, and jumping from mine cart to mine cart as the railroad collapsed behind them. They loved it :)

What really happened: The GM discovered the term 'Black Market', thought it was SUPER COOL(TM) and decided to put in the game.

5:45 That sounds like the dm getting mad at you for pointing out the big ass fla w in the story

If my DM tried to make that kind of argument for the black market I'd be flying over the table and hitting him

The concept COULD have worked if the ban on magical items was *regional*, or if the whole *region* had enormous tariffs on magical items. Now the local council can make a deal with criminals saying "we'll let you sell magical items and tax you half of what the high lord of xland would, and the guards will protect you and help keep the secret".

Manray: "Sir, i think you dropped your market" Patrick: "No, thats a black market"

When the inquisitor asked "you do know what inquisitors do right?" I thought the payoff was gonna be that the roundabout argument getting nowhere WAS the torture, and was really disappointed when that was not the case.

A DM should never force someone to take a certain action...

"the friendly local Walmart.... If Walmart wasn't so sketchy"

It wasn't much of a black market...More of an edgy market.

How would death be sweet release if the person about to enslave everyone is a necromancer? If anything, death would just make you have to work harder

So this DM forced the party towards the black market, failed to make the party care about this town, and then gave the shittiest argument possible for the market's existence in the first place. Was this the same DM that refused to let you die, or were you just using that drawing for the sake of ease?

I mean, my favorite take on this scenario is a little different. I had a town that had a thieves guild, and the guild would extort money, and steal from the townsfolk, but the townsfolk were happy because their graceful lord would lower taxes in order to compensate the townsfolk for their loss. The party thought that this was dumb because it meant that the lord couldn't hire guards to defend them from the thieves guild, and apon further investigation, they realized that the lord was in charge of the thieves guild. He was using it to milk extra money out of the people, while lowering taxes to stay in their good graces. They then had dig for information and go through so much fighting and political discourse to expose the lie that they realized it was probably just better not to try from the beginning. It's not that I didn't want them to rescue the town, in fact had they, I probably would have rewarded them greatly for it, maybe even giving them a writ that allowed them lordship or at the very least a council seat in the towns affairs, but I mostly did it because I liked to think that the easiest way for a dark group of people to get away with dark deeds are to have sway in the highest reaches of their territory, and it just doesn't make sense to have some kind of omnipotent group hiding in the shadows of a fine every day happy-go-lucky society.

"Oh My God!!! This is like talking to a blacksmith and him asking me where all these swords come from!!!"

Can Paladins not lie? If they can, then why not just claim he killed a Paladin and wears the armor as a trophy?

All you'd have to do to fix this plot: Add a group of non-progressive NPCs who hate magic. In order to prevent a rebellion, the king keeps magic items illegal. But he does absolutely nothing to stop the trade because it is the lifeblood of the town.

Paladin: *leans over and whispers* "I've got a plan" than immediately starts killing people

Wait, the premise made no sense. If everyone knew the Black Market was there, then why would the town guard even bother investigating at all??

I'm just saying, but with the DM basically forcing its party members to do what the DM wants (going to a specific place), and also not giving much thought to the reasoning behind his "blackmarket" scheme. This guy doesn't sound like the greatest DM.

This is a prime example of circular reasoning

In my friend's campaign, we had a rogue that was part of an anarchist group and would regularly meet with members or collect stuff for the group IN FRONT OF OUR PALADIN CITY GUARD.

“So... Lemme get this straight... Your town creates the rules for other towns that you also have to follow, right?” “Right” “So, you can make selling magic items illegal in other towns, right?” “Right” “That means you could make a market full of magical items to help the town get money, while others can’t, right?” “Right” “Alright, I get it now, sorry for causing trouble”

So here's what that DM should have said: "This town used to make and depend on the trade of magical items, but a while ago the town ticked off the king, so by the king's decree the town's lifeblood the trade in magical items was banned." Then you have a reason for the town to want to have and support a black market while at the same time being forced to shut it down due to the commotion as they don't want to draw the ire of the king.

The DM's reason to have a black market sounded like the part in Idiocracy where they talk about why they use Brawndo to water plants. "Brawndo is what plants crave. It's got electrolytes." "Do you even know what they are?" "It's what they use to make Brawndo." "Yeah, but why do they use them to make Brawndo?" "...'cause Brawndo's got electrolytes."

4:12 "But it's Brawndo! It's what plants crave!"

That girl with the ponytail: you do realize that I’m an inquisitor, right? Do you know what inquisitors do? My elf wizard rael: they inquisit?

When the people you play with don't understand economics. Play as a banker......

lol, GM was pissed his plot got BTFO by basic logic. Off to the iron maiden with you.....solver of the town's problems and morale dilemas!

The conversation at 4:13 reminded me of ManRay trying to return Patrick's wallet

"You know what inquisitors do, right?" "YES I KNOW! YOU TORTURE PEOPLE! YOU'VE BEEN TORTURING ME THIS ENTIRE CONVERSATION!!!"

As an economist, the thing that is like nails on chalk board for me is when some "economics" wrong in their game. You are 100% right about the black market. The point of black markets are to sell restricted good and avoid tariffs. The fact that town council was making money off it means it effectively had tariffs on it and the fact that town council was okay with its existence means they did really restrict the good. This is why I hate "thieve's guilds".

I do not understand why police closed black market if everyone in charge of the city(town council) knew about it and let it exist.

Unless the "No magic" law was from higher up(like a region law). The black market would be an effective way to bypass it, and they would be able to charge more for products.

This does not make sense! The town only has a black market because it would be a tourist attraction?? They could achieve the same effects without outlawing magical items. Why not get magical street performers or be a go to place for traders since it’s a good distance away from the desert? The inquisitor is not making since, the people running that town doesn’t make any since, and finally if you want to make bank on your magical goods; WHY NOT ADVERTISE THEM!!! A black market is normally for items that can’t be obtained by legal means and therefore it location is always kept a secret from law enforcement and regular folks to make room for ideal costumers such as cut throats or questionable buyers/sellers. If the law enforcement knows about it, if the town knows about it, then it’s not a black market but a shopping center trying to be edgy!

Does the GM know how Black Markets work? They don't tax their items. *The government doesn't get any money.* This doesn't help the economy at all.

There is tons of advantages to have black market while you are ruling body of city. 1. Hiding big powerful trade from king of the land, no taxes or regulations from him. 2. You can destroy any competion by sending them to jail. 3. If someone manages to fuck you over, you can just jail him. 4. If some one buys some really expensive shit you can confiscate it and sell it again. 5. If you are in trouble you can take down whole black market and score tons of political points in procces. 6. You can sell counterfeit magic items and nobody can sue you.

solutions. 1. for the paladin. "I stole this armor, it's cool." 2. for the black market deal. "Well, the kingdom is fine, but our king is very paranoid about magic weapons."

The part that irritated me the most was the DM sort of forcing the PC to go somewhere he didn't want to go. Watch CriticalRole! There are numerous times when characters got split up and the main story continued while their characters were in a side story. Matt Mercer does a good job of improvising and finding creative ways for unexpected things to work out. A DM should learn to be flexible with unexpected decisions, and still maintain a cohesive storyline, allowing the characters to shape their own destiny.

You need a better DM

Answer to problem: Get a new DM

"Because then it stops being a tourist attraction."

"-a ballpit of live grenades." I am *so* using that for future analogies, hahaha.

As someone who has only been aware of your channel for a week, but has also watched all of your content within said week. I must say that your animations are swiftly improving. Likewise with your audio. Well done sir.

Jokes on you, Walmart is JUST as bad.

They had a black market so they could increase the price of the items and take away any magic items brought in and then sell them

the plot would make sense if the town had used the black market to ramp up the prices of magical goods to make more money off of them but that still wouldn't make much sense because then my wouldn't customers just go to another town were it wasn't illegal

Our DM is good at not pushing us in a certain direction and letting us do what we want :) Most of the time this will lead to us messing around and playing drinking games and knife throwing games in a tavern for ages XD

The more I watch your D&D stories the more I realize your DM kinda sucked at Their job lol

You just explained prohibition, thanks.

You've basically described the war on drugs.

The inquisitor could have just said "Forcing the black market to be illegal makes its goods three times as expensive and thus makes three times the profit." But even then it's a stupid logic. That's a baaad DM, man...

That can only be described as Kafkaesque

..."only if Walmart wasn't so sketchy." #Trollmfao

Evil Necromancer : Sweet release of death Thats were youre wrong kiddo!

The situation could have been handled a lot better. The DM could have argued that the town wasn't making money from a regular market, so they created a black market they controlled to attract people that thought "a black market? I could get a lot of off the shelf magic items and goods from here". Basically the illusion of it being illegal peaks the interest of those that hear about it.

Soooo I actually had a situation like this. We were running a pathfinder campaign though. I'll be honest I was not you in this scenario. I was random party member #4. They put my samurai in magic chains THEN threw him in the cell. We then argued meta game that a town with a "black market" for magic goods would most certainly not have magic chains to tie some random warrior up with, only fields of antimagic to stop casters. So an annoying councilman with two weak ass paladins comes down and goes down basically that same train and the magus was basically you in that. I got pissed off and said "I break the chains". So they're arguing while I just stand up and snap chains off my body. I proceeded to rip a bar out as well and stab the town councilman and one of the paladins to death. Everyone forgot I quietly raised his strength to a 32 (+11), but he made a big issue of that after that, even though I used methods he gave to us.... was the second to last session he held.... don't miss him dming -_-

This is like my 20th time watching this video since it came out. Just as good as the first time. Looking forward to 40 over the next year.

"But, my lord, is that legal?" "I will make it legal."

Yeah, just bad writing. Obviously the GM didn't think out the implications of his hook. A hook that needed him to strong arm you into getting involved with.

No offense, but if my DM did that to me? I would say, "And thus, my Mage just gives up on life, unable to handle the torture. He dies; the end of his story. Avenge me, my compatriots." And then I would proceed to pack everything up and leave.

This is how I think the DM should have handled the situation after the arrest: The inquisitor says with a smirk to the Wizard. "You see, when non-locals and adventurers such as yourself come into the town, we assume you do not know about the illegal law saying no magical items are allowed and are not allowed to be used, yes?" The wizard shrugs, "yes. And?" The fur-caped ginger looks down at her fingernails and scraping out grime from beneath them. "Well, when an outsider hears about the black market being heard around town like it's no big deal, you must assume it's a popular marketplace. So what we did is that we have a secret group of guards to spot adventurers and non-locals coming into the city to play an "act" of sorts. People know the black market exists-- in fact, we RUN the marketplace and is our *MAIN* shopping area....w-we chose the cave since it's more conspicuous for black marketing and since it holds conditioning magic very well than homes and domes of illusion magic. Better to do one spell a week about a cool breeze than to do one every day about a powerful illusion magic. no?" The wizard rolls his eyes and cross his arms, impatient. "Yes, AND?" . The woman clears her throat. "AS. I was saying....We purposely have a black market set up just outside of town with a very minor illusion spell over the wall so that it LOOKS like a black market. And since it's a "secret" market, we are able to put the prices up higher and have much more leeway in pricing than if we were to do it in our town. If I sold you a crossbow for 100 gold in our town, and the same one for the same price that was in the black market, you may think that crossbow in the black market may have something off about it, no? So because of it, people go to the market, buy our normal-but-expensive goods, and we can get money. The arresting was a play to get you all scared--you should have seen the LOOKS on your faces when we caught you all........Buuut in all seriousness, you killed 3 of our people, so we would like any magical items you have purchased from us and leave. You're free to go."

0:38 “Or it’s like a key all the time and when you stick it in someone... it unlocks their death...” - Michael J. Caboose

This is the dnd equivalent to the war on drugs here in reality xD

I love how all fictional stories treat the black market like it's an actual place or something. Instead of just literally anything some off the books or illegally

The inquisitor sound like a game character with limited lines of dialogue

Reminds me of John Wick, where basically EVERY business is part of some underground assassins club. Where's the mystique when everyone is part of it?

1) I hate being railroaded into a scenario 2) I hate even more when the scenario is stupid, 3) I hate stupid DM's

2:17 ...What was his intelligence stat? In-game and real life?

Whenever you say "Don't worry, it's a little crazy, but it just might work", I'm expecting the person to ask people to piss in a bucket... Man, that left a mark.

I feel the gradual rotting of my brain as I watch more and more of these videos. And I love it.

So if EVERYONE goes to the black market, and the paladin didn't have a problem with it, why did the assassin guild have a problem with it?

I feel like a reasonable explanation is making it illegal essentially lets them have a monopoly on it, so they could sell it at whatever price they wanted and since nobody else is allowed to sell it, everyone has to buy it from them or not at all.

Really enjoying watching all these videos, happy I found this today.

Black markets in Elite Dangerous, you entered shouting "I want to sell illegal goods!".

Terrible DM

Yet another story about how horrible your DM is. Why are you still playing with this guy?

Thank you youtube homepage for giving me yet another channel to sink my life into

Great work Sir thank you

The guy running this game had the wrong attitude. DMs aren't supposed to WRITE a campaign!! The idea is to tell stories WITH your players, not to tell them how the story goes. Railroading makes games so dull and boring. Players need to feel that they can make an actual impact on the world, otherwise it isn't enjoyable. I think a lot of DMs are just afraid of giving up control instead of enjoying how the story can change in surprising and fun ways that you and your friends will remember for years to come.

On the black market being known thing: I get the point, but there are plenty of real-life examples of "public secrets". Things that aren't supposed to be done, but everyone kinda does them discretely, while the social game is that they're not talked about.

Your paladin could've just said he was wearing a disguise to do something

I have been benge watching this while I work, like a d&d podcast. Love it ❤️