I gotta say this idea for a sonic show sounds pretty interesting and gotta ask in your opinion Think it would be a good idea if this storyline could work in the idw comics?

Wow. Credit to the artist for making something so close to DiC art that they're confused for _actual_ DiC art! Bravo!

When is the novel coming? I'd like to check it out! This has me more excited than Console Wars by Blake J. Harris!

@@macuser7048 I'm hoping to release it sometime late next year.

Yay

Or an edutainment game.

I agree

Yea

@NES At least Underground gave us two neat hedgehog designs...

In my opinion, the main reason for the failure of the series was Sonia's voice and personality. If they would have casted a female voice for Sonia, I might have given her personality and overall story a pass.

I feel like Orbot, & Cubot are Dollar Store Replacements of Scratch & Grounder.

Now I hate Underground MORE. Not that Sleet and Dingo weren't the highlight of the series (along with Manic), but I'd love to have seen a darker, grittier Scratch and Grounder acting under a SatAM Robotnik.

Don't forget boco and deco from sonic x. Seems Eggman loves having 2 robots working for him. The dumb short one and the tall smarter sassy one.

@@lPsychoMax The two dumb sidekicks craze really kicked off with Bebop and Rocksteady from Ninja Turtles. Scratch and Grounder kinda borrowed from that in the first place.

@@conradojavier7547 That's a bit generous. Personally, I just don't care for them. One is low-key snarky, and the other has a defective voice chip that makes him change accents.

I do wonder why they changed it from Scratch and Grounder to Sleet and Dingo. I think the former would've been more fun, even in a darker setting.

@@AdventureMaster18 Best guess is branding.

@@AdventureMaster18 It’s possible there might have been communication mishaps since SU was produced years after the other two shows and was a French coproduction. Perhaps Sleet and Dingo were originally created to be good guys or side characters but something happened behind the scenes where they ended up taking those two’s lackey spots and they had to go with what they had before production starts. SU in general is an oddity both for having non-standard Mobian designs and what game it was made as a tie-in for with Sonic Adventure. I’m still convinced Sonia was originally meant to be Amy Rose but perhaps a mistranslation, a faxing error or something happened that brought Sonia into existence. Transformers The Movie (1986) infamously only included four of the five Dinobots for most of the film with the missing member appearing in two scenes total because of miscommunications between the producers and Toei Animations. The original Masters of The Universe had Jitsu’s only appearance in the cartoon almost taken by a Filmmation created one-shot character named Strong-Ar who appeared in a separate episode. It doesn’t seem too crazy to think Sonia was birthed out of a mistake relating to Amy.

@@AdventureMaster18 The 90s were weird but in a fascinating way! The 1990’s Sonic DiC Animated television series (AoSTH, SatAM & Underground) were very interesting, I honestly wish they made more!

Is almost sounds like it IS *part of* Sonic Underground...

Then again, the kind-hearted Amy would not be until Sonic Adventure, where Sonic CD basically had Amy as an obsessed fan of Sonic, and the damsel-in-distress.

YES EXACTLY MISSED OPPORTUNITY!

They knew about Amy. See the concept art with Sally from Satam. Some of them looks like Amy Rose.

@NESI think they knew about her, because ABC communicate with Oshima and Naka abt future cartoons

​@NES It's during Sonic Adventure were the Rose girl gain more attention.

the poor chili dog cook....

@@targettoad691 Why do you think I said "All the Chucks"? It's so they can divide the work and speed it up.

Then add Nicky from Manga and “Tonic” from Sonic the Comic.

@NES I agree, especially with Bernie and Jules being Ken Penders' property.

1) technically, Nicky *IS* Sonic's normal self; Sonic is just a transformation. After a while, he realized he IS Sonic and managed to learn how to STAY Sonic. 2) In my mind, Lady Bernadette is actually the SISTER to Sir Jules and Sir Charles; Queen Aleena is Sonic's Mother, and Sir Jules is the father. 3) Would this also include Sonic's "Extra Life" from the Fleetway comic series?

Meh, this feels more like it could fit into the universe of AoSTH due to its mostly comedic nature, but the plot sounds like it has more of a focus on mysteries, making me wonder if this will be Sonic meets Scooby-Doo.

You don't know what the other side of the bedroom looks like. Could be normal on one side and crazy future stuff on the other lol.

This is basically a storyboard sketch. The most we could expect is a few blobs with "LAVA LAMP" etc written on them tacked around the place

@NES I have no doubt on that, but imagine what the fans would have done with the concept. (Not that they can't right now that we know about it, we'd just have more "lore") I'm looking forward to seeing if anything else will be unearthed, or see what the community has for ideas.

It’d be weird if they were just done independently. I do think that cancelled game could have possibly influenced this show, maybe even have access to some designs that we still don’t have any concept drawings or artwork for; possibly making this cancelled cartoon our first look at anything related to ‘Sister Sonic’ since the magazine announcement.

@@rayvenkman2087 If they were connected, the link between the show and the game would explain a lot about the game's nature and cancellation. It'd have to be an incredibly elaborate re-skin to overhaul Mail's D&D-style world into a sci-fi space high school, and it'd be way more difficult to re-write the story with all it's cutscenes and voice acting compared to, say, what Mean Bean Machine was for Puyo Puyo. That said, it's very likely that like Mean Bean, there'd need to be more of the show to work off of for an actual game prototype to exist in theory. Mean Bean had scenes and characters recreated from AoStH's pilot... but if there's not even real concept art for Super Sonic Sisters, it's not very likely the doll-up got very far, making the talked-about Sega CD localization easy to cancel without sunk costs.

@@cabbussesI believe Sister Sonic’s cancellation wasn’t to do with the backlash it got in the magazine announcement because I find it hard to believe people in the early 1990’s in an era where gaming magazines reigned supreme would be that outraged over a Japanese game getting the Sonic branding. There’s games that were completely reworked from their original artworks including the original Persona for Playstation 1 when they got localised and no fuss were made about those games. It’s more likely they saw the sales for the Sega CD and the 32X (Not too sure if it and Knuckles Chaotix were out at this time or not) along with seeing the logistics of how much effort it would take to Sonicify the game as well as concerns about diluting the Sonic IP (Ironic giving what Sega had signed off on over the years...) which led to the plans being scrapped before localising the game as it was without any Sonic branding on it.

@@rayvenkman2087 The thing that's most strange about the "backlash" is that, logically, the cancellation would have gotten worse backlash... UNLESS you somehow already knew Working Designs got the rights to make a new localization. If the game and the document pitch are linked, then it's best to surmise that the game localization never got very far in the first place. My speculation: SOA and DiC may have worked on this pitch together, and then perhaps Sega tried getting a deal with Falcom to make the localization. The deal would be probably similar to Compile with Mean Bean Machine. However, going by the pitch vs. Popful Mail itself, I'd surmise all parties involved were in over their heads in regards to the sheer scope of the localization changes vs. the projected sales of this game, especially with Mean Bean as a comparison point. It's easy to believe that at this point both Falcom and Sega wanted out of the game tie-in, which may have contributed to the show's cancellation as well. Personally I'd be kinda disappointed if this was the case as that means there's likely no playable prototype, but it'd at least be a solid closure on this project's story. The reason Falcom made up the story about the fan letter campaign? NDAs. They would not have legally been allowed to discuss the project on a more nuanced, detailed level because of heavy involvement from DiC staff, including probably having access to these Sister Sonic documents and, if they ever existed, concept art or even a pilot. So Falcom decided to spin it in a way that made it sound like they listened to their own fanbase instead.... it probably helped that they probably already signed a deal with Working Designs by this time.

@@cabbusses That’d be more likely than a pre-internet gamer backlash for a game that’s not a big title like Driver 3 was before release. Considering the time it takes for the announcement to come out, how long it would take for the fan response to reach them and how far along they would have been by the time the announcement came along. Heck, I believe there’s more to the Ken Penders vs Archie lawsuit than what we know and I think that there could have been some kind of espionage sabotage involved on Ken’s behalf when it comes to Archie not having the papers to prove they or rather Sega legally owns the characters and thus Ken winning ownership of his characters. Why I think this? Because considering Archie is apart of the same industry as DC Comics and an industry known for swindling creators out of their character ownership including most famously Superman. Archie’s been around long enough to know how to practice that hustle and thus I find it so hard to believe that Ken Penders was able to get one over them in the lawsuit but not the other more highly regarded creators. Archie and Sega realistically would have legally squashed him like a bug under their boot in any other point in time.

Fr

@@dinomaneofficiall3973 fr fr

Let's face it. As much as people like Sonic CD now, it wasn't really all that popular when it first came out (mostly because it came out for an add-on that most people either didn't want to shill extra money for or just weren't interested in general because it was a dumb idea). Everyone's attention was on the mainline Genesis games. We have rereleases to thank for CD's popularity and the first one on PC didn't come out until 1996. Heck, it took Archie until mid-1995 to introduce Amy Rose.

@@ScatterbrainPete Sigh guess you’re right, not even Metal Sonic, outside an anime thing, got much animated appearances. This is despite him mainly being the more popular of the two before Amy became a main character, even after Metal was still a very loved character.

I find it hard to believe Sister Sonic was cancelled because of the negative reaction to the announcement. Especially in an era when the internet wasn’t quite the place to be for gaming knowledge while gaming magazines were the dominant source of gaming-related information and where not many people would know what’s in Japan unless you knew a forum about it. I think they were just going to go through with the initial localisation plan before changing their minds when they saw how the Sega CD was doing in sales and having second thoughts about dilution of the Sonic IP at the time which led to the game in question to make out of Japan without the Sonic branding.

Probably a case of reusing a name. Happens all the time in Transformers with Bulkhead being a notable example.

@@rayvenkman2087 Considering DIC didn't seem to know about Amy since she wasn't used for their female centered Sonic series, it's more than likely they never knew about Monica Mouse with her only being in the manga (which Amy also first appeared in prior to Sonic CD.)

@@KatelynJewel It’s probably like the case of how Transformers’ Tailgate was somehow turned into Wipeout in the Marvel Comics where Trypticon debuts while Tailgate himself never shows up in the US Comics or the whole case of Hauler’s existence in the More Than Meets The Eye three-parter of the Sunbow cartoon as a precursor to G1 Grapple In 1984 while it’s believed Grapple’s toy was meant to be apart of the 1984 assortment when the pilot aired and for Amy, they could have erroneously turned her into Sonia for Underground or whatever through some kind of behind the scenes mixup.

I assume it's because she has pretty much no story to work with. While adorable, she's easily the most tacked-on & irrelevant character of the SatAM cast

I’m convinced Sonia’s creation in Underground was a mistake they just ran with. They were probably meant to include Amy Rose but a mixup occurred with the name being smudged or misinterpreted the name on the sheets somehow and no one bothered checking with anyone from Sega on if that was kosher with them.

“Barely to do with the source material “ to be fair it’s not like aosth, underground, and Satam were accurate in the slightest

@@MILDMONSTER1234 even compared to those, I'd say

@@MILDMONSTER1234 Satam adopts the environmentalist story of Sonic 1 into something that’s more sustainable as an animated series, AoSTH adopts the Sonic travelling the world concept of Sonic 2 and 3 & Knuckles into a comedy series and Underground is just some red headed stepchildren that’s remembered largely for introducing Sonic’s actual family with names. The first two are both based on what the source material were about at the the time just adapted for a televised medium. This scrapped spinoff is so far removed from the source material that it may as well be divorced as a Sonic cartoon if you removed all the Sonic elements and make it some other DiC cartoon.

Actually, thinking about it a little more, I wonder if the idea of Robotnik having a twin brother would've been DiC's way of explaining why there were two different-looking Robotniks in their previous two shows. Also, after reading those documents about "Sonic and Friends", is anyone else thinking that Merlina (especially regarding her personality and dynamic with Sonic) may have later evolved into Sally? Also, I can't help but wonder if whatever work they had done for Super Sonic Sisters may have ended up being reused for Sonic Underground, particularly all the alien character designs and backgrounds taking place in outer space or in a futuristic city.

Not that well I bet.

Just wanted to say that the art seen here was made by GwenLongcrierCat, and isn't actual art made by DiC. So any visual similarities to the other shows were interpreted by Gwen and isn't exactly what DiC may have went with.

@@AdventureMaster18 Yeah, I know, I more was referring to the ideas....but i suppose in the middle of writing that comment that my memory kinda got all wonky for a second, i'll edit the comment in a bit

@@rushedadventurefan4380 aosth is amazing cause it’s a looney tunes tier shitpost and I love it. Satam is good but just another generic 90s action cartoon

@@MILDMONSTER1234 yeah i agree tbh, AOSTH kind of had more potential than SATAM imo

And kind of ironically, Bunnie appeared less and less in Season 2 (and Rosie Woodchuck seemed involved, but only in the Blast to the Past two-parter), while Lupe is only given one episode- her debut. (Extra surprising is that they didn't use Amy, but that's a general Early Archie thing.) At least Stargazing/Dear Ally onwards, Reboot, Prime (by not having Amy be the sole girl), and IDW Sonic are aiming to balance the roles.

I can't stand that this is right.

Lmao

They were already on it with Sally, so...

@@cabbusses That is true, as Rule 34 had two words at the end: No exceptions.

Fieryfurnace got the documents a few weeks back, and we decided to properly announce the discovery of the documents with this video. You can check out the actual documents in the description if you wanna read them yourself!

@@AdventureMaster18 awesome, I appreciate you spreading the word, I found the wiki updated so I was curious. I'll definitely check out the documents.

Maybe but that just leaves us with a Transformers: Earthforce’s relationship with the Marvel US/UK canon for Sonic in terms of how do these two things co-exists because of timeline contradictions between each other.

I find it hard to believe the backlash was why they scrapped it because who actually knew what Popful Mail was outside of hardcore gamers with access to Internet forums.

@@rayvenkman2087 that's what it was claimed from a magazine scan on the Sonicretro article on the game

Yeah, there's already fetish art of the episode premise on Deviantart lol.

@@AdventureMaster18 Had that episode aired, it would have been like the Passion Patties of the Sonic franchise. I hate that I know that. Also, seems that whoever wrote the movie Mean Girls owes Phil Harnage a check. Wasn't that something Lindsey Lohan's character did to the Queen Bee girl?

@@AdventureMaster18 is there? ... ayup, there is. Somehow I'm still surprised.

smol^2bee

She's a Dragon Tales character pasted over a Sonic show. Made a Poochie.

Dude is a gender neutral term.

@@AdventureMaster18 I personally wouldn't object to it being used that way tbh, I wouldn't mind at all if someone casually called me 'dude'. But I get the impression it hasn't quite gained the same gender-neutral status in general as 'guys'. Maybe it's starting to though? No reason it can't, I guess. :)

I don't hate Underground. I like some elements, it's just that it's a pretty flawed show imo.

There's sadly not much regarding the identity of the siblings' father aside from this brief mention of his whereabouts being an ongoing mystery for the show. The people behind the show didn't even have an ending to the show in mind... although there was going to be a conclusion in the Archie Sonic comics. If you wanna know how it would've gone down, here's what the writer, Ian Flynn, revealed about it: "I can't remember all the details off the top of my head. I remember it involved all the friends and allies they made along the way coming together to support them, the trio setting up a concert on Angel Island to broadcast to the world below, and Queen Aleena joining them at the end of the set. She joined the band as their lead singer - the literal "voice of the people" - and together they finally overthew Robotnik. From there I think we had a brief time-skip to show everyone's happily-ever-afters." - Ian Flynn, 2021

Oh ok! Thank you!

Oh wow. Now that you mention it, it IS pretty similar to Space Channel 5. I never even thought about this. Mind blown.

Space Channel 5 meets Splatoon basically.

It’s tough to get through 😢

That's kinda rude.

@@AdventureMaster18 i’m truth it was a compliment

Consider as co-anchors to Wes Weasley in the Champions arc, a pair of porcupines named Bella and Moniker.

You mean Monika not Moniker, and what do you mean co-anchors to Wes Weasley

@@manicgamerthehedgehog No, I mean Moniker- as a sort of "spin" on their names, instead of literally the kids.

@@amesstarline5482 oh I get it

Yeah I think it would definitely work for a idw storyline so we could see some of sonic's family in it Plus we would get new original characters characters we have never seen before and were in development for a long time

But Rename them as The Rose Sisters, & Amy is Split into 2 characters in this Cartoon.

Thanks for the constructive criticism, I'll keep this is mind when I'm recording future videos.

@@AdventureMaster18 thanks for reading and considering. I think you’re going to notice a lot of new viewers coming in. People will like your presentation and subject matter so I think you’re already building a good future with this channel