Do Men Weaponize Therapy? | The Man Enough Podcast

Рет қаралды 4,865

Күн бұрын

TW: Suicide
Join Liz and Jamey as they dive into a controversial discussion on therapy and its potential impact on relationships. They explore whether therapy can be taken to extremes, leading to an intellectual understanding of emotions without truly feeling them. The hosts debate whether therapy can be weaponized by men in relationships and the importance of finding the right type of therapy for each person. Later, the hosts reflect on past guests who have shared their transformative journeys with therapy. From mental health experts like Kier Gaines, working to create more masculine approaches to therapy, to individuals opening up about their own struggles, like our own Justin Baldoni. These powerful moments shed light on the value of therapy and its impact on both men and women.
Don't miss this exploration of therapy's potential to heal and its role in shaping better human connections.
Listen now and learn about:
Therapy’s healing potential
The dangers of a culture obsessed with mental health
The feminization of therapy culture
How to encourage your friends to seek mental health assistance
Alternatives to therapy
Timecodes:
00:00 Watch Man Enough on KZfaq!
01:30 Content Warning
01:56 - Justin’s Hiatus & the SAG-AFTRA Strike
05:08 - Are we overly focused on mental health problems?
06:43 - Can therapy be weaponized?
12:28 - Going to therapy doesn’t make you perfect
15:29 - All men benefit from the awareness therapy brings
17:38 - JOHN KIM & VANESSA BENNET from ‘Build Stronger Relationships’ (Man Enough Season 2)
25:28 - KIER GAINES from 'Becoming Your Own Role Model' (Man Enough Season 1)
32:09 - KARAN BRAR from ‘Becoming Someone I Love’ (Man Enough Season 1)
39:07 - JUSTIN BALDONI from ‘Healing is Not Linear’ (Man Enough Season 2)
49:52 - Sharing emotions can help men open their hearts
Quotes:
“I do think humanity is evolving, I do think men are evolving…because we are in touch with our feminine side, we talk things out more than we used to.” - Jamey Heath
“A therapist just told the most abusive person in your life that they are enough.” - Liz Plank
“Whenever we talk about what men aren’t doing there's a protective side of me that wants to stick up for these men…men need a hand not a finger.” - John Kim
“My therapist is more like a copilot, I run a lot of things by him that don’t make sense to me. As a therapist I do the same. I don’t tell people what to do, I don’t even really give you advice, I help you reframe.” - Kier Gaines
“I spent 35 years not looking at the root cause of my anxiety, even recognizing I had anxiety and not being willing to look at my trauma…the work I was doing on myself was surface.” - Justin Baldoni
“We go throughout our lives and we accumulate rust on our minds and hearts, when we talk about things it always us to chip away at that rust and it allows us to have an open heart again.” - Jamey Heath
Guest Social Links:
KIER GAINES
Instagram: @kiergaines
Tiktok: @kiergaines
ANDY GRAMMER
Instagram: @andygrammer
Twitter: @andygrammer
JOHN KIM
Instagram: @theangrytherapist
Twitter: @angrytherapist
Facebook:@theangrytherapist
VANESSA BENNET
Instagram: @vanessasbennet
Facebook:@vanessabennettcoaching
KARAN BRAR
Instagram: @karanbrar
Tiktok: @karanbrar
HOSTS: Justin Baldoni, Liz Plank, and Jamey Heath
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FOLLOW THE HOSTS:
Justin Baldoni Instagram: / justinbaldoni
Justin Baldoni TikTok: / justinbaldoni
Justin Baldoni Facebook: / justinbaldoni
Justin Baldoni Twitter: / justinbaldoni
Text Justin: +1 (310) 845-6909
Liz Plank: / feministabulous
Liz Plank TikTok: / lizplank
Liz Plank Facebook: / feministabulous
Liz Plank Twitter: / feministabulous
Site: www.elizabethplank.com/
Jamey Heath Instagram: / jamey_heath_
Jamey Heath TikTok: / jameyheath
Jamey Heath Twitter: / jamey_heath_
Jamey Heath Facebook: / jameyjaz
Site: www.jameyheath.com/
PRODUCED BY:
Wayfarer Studios: www.wayfarerstudios.com
Wayfarer Studios KZfaq: / wayfarerentertainment
P&G Studios
Executive Producers: Justin Baldoni, Jamey Heath, Tarah Malhotra-Feinberg, Marc Pritchard, Anna Saalfeld, Chris Corcoran
Producer: Kayla Nicholson

Пікірлер: 22

@DanielofArabia Жыл бұрын

I think the point reached around 14 minutes is key: healthy therapy should lead to greater awareness and empathy, not judgement or weaponizing therapeutic terms. I think the rise of over diagnosing mental health issues (like codependency, narcissism, etc) is not so much coming from healthy therapy, but based on social media and blog posts and is an easy way to put down people who may be immature or hurt other people (especially in romantic relationships) whether women or men (it's only a slightly more high-brow form of saying "she's crazy" to say that she has borderline personality disorder). As someone who has struggled with feeling my feelings and found help through therapy and men's work, I think one thing to remember is that things like setting boundaries and expressing feelings in a safe way within a relationship are incredibly hard if you haven't learned to do that before you're in the middle of a relationship in your 20s/30s - and men are going to make plenty of mistakes along the way of trying to communicate their needs. The important thing is continuing to grow and work through that while also ensuring that one partner's boundaries/needs aren't demanded at the expense of the other's.

@sruthisurendran831 Жыл бұрын

Disappointed this episode had the potential to discuss the Jonah Hill situation as an example of how therapy can be weaponized and the importance of setting boundaries with therapy (ex. how you share what you've learned from therapy with others, how you put your learnings into practice, etc) I wish Jamey had given Liz more space to fully articulate a common experience among women and an opportunity to discuss how therapy could be more tailored to meet men where they are at (like what was discussed in the episode with John Kim and Vanessa Bennett)

@fatu1738 Жыл бұрын

They don't want to ever go against an industry that has had a history of sexual abuse. They seem to want us to just go along and pretend like nothing is really wrong with the tone deafness many celebs have in a casting couch profession.

@kaico5712 11 ай бұрын

Liz, I have such gratitude that you are speaking about this. This is real.

@I3loom Жыл бұрын

We are always looking for certainty, and validation, clarity, or perspective from a professional feels like a form of certainty, even if it's about our deficits and shortcomings--and it then becomes something of a surrogate sense of security about oneself. Additionally, it's easier to use our "certainty" against others than for ourselves. What Jamey brought up about *why* someone is in therapy and how they're using it is important. Also, love the bangs, Liz.

@aylana7562 11 ай бұрын

Women weaponise therapy as well. I should add this, because it is as true. It happens by men and women. I have experience with both, and it entirely sucks. It can be very difficult to handle. It's never okay and I for one am an activist in bringing more clarity in this area again. True therapy is incredibly helpful and healing, and it's not okay to abuse its terminology to manipulate. It happens more often than many people think, I'm afraid.

@Jaybo454 3 ай бұрын

Random comment, I may flesh it out more, but around 10:00, talking about men being cognitively in touch but not being able to feel emotions. Please don't forget about the important implications of alexithymia.

@aylana7562 11 ай бұрын

In my experience this is a real problem at the moment, where therapeutic terms are used to manipulate. This truly happens, and I'm actually interested to hear more conversation on what to do when someone does this. On a private level, sure, leave an abusive relationship immediately, but beyond that, in the more general conversation and attitude around this, I would love to see this kind of behaviour being called out by other people more often. I think this episode was great and courageous for bringing this problem up. Therapy is incredibly useful when it's high quality and when it is used wisely. A skilled therapist should see through a client taking things only intellectually with the purpose of manipulating, and not enable more of that behaviour, but offer true help, which might start with deeply challenging this client to open more vulnerably about their real issues. A lot of therapists and coaches are not skilled enough and they can cause harm as well. This is a reality. And how many degrees they have or don't have is not the most determining factor in this, rather whether a person has integrity and applies their own theories and is strong & smart enough to see through things. I agree that most men aren't like this. But it's also true that this small percentage can have a huge impact on other men, this happens too often, where a 'guru' like type drags down the level of a whole group. That's why I'm really interested to discuss even more how to halt people like this from impacting others, and let true healing take the centre place. Great episode, and congratulations on the courage it takes to put something like this out in the public.

@kyleharrison9944 Жыл бұрын

I think Liz is making a point about a narcissist. They can’t be fixed but they are also the minority. They also are typically the ones using therapy terms to gas light you.

@OrtegaOY Жыл бұрын

Thee irony of the question posed in the title of this episode, is that it can be used as a sound byte and weaponized against men in therapy in order to deflect from taking accountability 🤣

@fatu1738 Жыл бұрын

The irony is also that men are supposed to be vulnerable meanwhile folks here are in an industry that gives jobs to "lead men" who are often strong. When an emergency happens, do you really think feelings will help?

@OrtegaOY Жыл бұрын

@@fatu1738 Nothing wrong with feelings. The larger issue at hand, seems to be that people are trying to launder oppressive systems like Capitalism through changing individuals behaviors. The Systems are out of alignment with Nature, and hence....will only produce adversity and strife. I've been watching this show for a little while now, and I appreciate all the jewels dropped by it's guests. However...as much as I appreciate what Liz brings to the discussion, it seems like most of her issues with Men are about the one's she's attracted to not being, or doing what she wants them to do or be. She then makes generalizations that it's Men as a whole who have those problems. Having a public platform, such views are irresponsible and highly problematic. Men know that there are Good Men (not Perfect Men, as this concept doesn't exist) out there. So when we hear that she or her friends are having difficulties in trying to relate to Men, the question I then ask is "Who are these men you are trying to relate to?". What's your criteria of attraction, and how is it leaving out all these lonely Good Men? Fuck Boys, Players, Liars and Manipulators aren't lonely. They're the one's getting the time of day, when Good Men are left in the dark for not being this enough or that enough.

@fatu1738 Жыл бұрын

@OrtegaOY I see your point. But even in the woke culture we live in...including the leftist school I go to, if a man is attractive and he approaches women it's alright even if he gets rejected. But if the guy is not attractive physically (either by muscles or looks) he's called creepy.

@OrtegaOY Жыл бұрын

@@fatu1738 "Woke" is a term adultered, diluted, and polluted by White Folks. It means one's aware of all the ways they have and are currently trying to destroy or dominate anyone who isn't White. As for your point about how women qualify attraction, and persecute those who aren't deemed attractive....those women are lost causes. Food for the Beasts. Though Wrong, they're within their Souvenir Right to be so. Leave them, as you don't have to protect or defend them. Leave them to their chosen devices of their own self-destruction. Take Care of the Righteous Ones 🙇🏽‍♂️

@SPFAN00 3 ай бұрын

She has a great point. Hasn’t anyone seen The Sopranos?

@joesyogafitness6085 Жыл бұрын

Very interesting! From the title why limit men's irrational behavior to therapy? Growing up male most boys had to defend themselves to avoid being bullied or bullying. No one wants to be in the victim role. Male domination is power, showing emotions takes every male back to that spot. Any vulnerability especially fear made it worse. You might want to look for a therapist who will just listen and not tell you what to think, that is trying not to get you to "fit in." This is not an individual failing. This is a failing of our species. Keep up the good work.

@kaico5712 11 ай бұрын

I want to add that all therapy is not the same and there are so many therapists out there that are not up to the task and it can absolutely be a disaster if someone has a personality disorder and are then reinforced through therapy.

@realdeal139 11 ай бұрын

Great cast, Therapy has become a hustle in the U.S.,

@AndiAlexander1 11 ай бұрын

Liz you’re describing the “woke misogynist.”

@omarromero7571 Жыл бұрын

I usually love the show. The lady was very off for this one.

@mannyphr3sh17 Жыл бұрын

From the short period of time of being a listener, she’s definitely hurt and it bleeds on the show. Has she ever stopped and realize that may be she’s the problem

@maryemmacherwa1237 Жыл бұрын

I can definitely see both perspectives well and clearly, in the beginning of this clip - before the montage. Love this space for good conversation that is lead with empathy and care.🫶🏼😊 I also have “immense face in men”- said so well at acknowledging both sides. Love this episode.