terrywho22 it all comes down to money. You would be hard pressed to find 2 mono blocks, preamp, phono stage, and headphone amp that would match my Japanese Marantz for 1200 bucks msrp.

blake makison When I got into HT I started using the front channels to listen to music, the latest a 1300$ Integra, 15 years. It was only after recently buying a preamp, and plugging it into my power amp,that I realized my error. NO contest, the sound is amazing, and I had a really good receiver,but my new Preamp blows it away, as well as the Onkyo I bought a few years ago, you get what you pay for.

Billy Grinstead I think we are saying the same thing. Spend more money, get better stuff. I’m just saying at the entry level price point, the integrated wins. And sometimes in the hifi world, you don’t get what you pay for. You may get ‘better’ but not ‘1000% better’ as an example in some cable prices

My Rogue Sphinx integrated, best $1200 I ever spent. I have had more expensive separates in the past, but this piece of equipment sounds just right to my ears.

Jason Simmons exactly

I had a Luxman a few year back. I was a wonderful unit.!!!

But if you were to compare your Luxman integrated with similar Luxman separates you would probably find the separates better.

@@sylviarienzo6955 probably true. I best not ever try them :-)

Separates are way better if you spend the extra money for them

60zeller you hit it, some gear have separate powersupplys too....

Couldn't agree with you more.

Mono Block is just Power Amp. It really means if Stereo, two separate preamp/power supply / separate power plugs.

Wht the mean preamp Is it a amp too?

Yep, an additional high-end power cord and high-end interconnects add up to a substantial amount of money.

Noooooo no way

Separates are with the extra cost

Sorry, but that's a terrible example. If you think there's any CD player ever made that can compete with a seriously high end transport or streamer, and a high end $30,000 DAC. Please LMK what you're smoking, because I have to try it for laughs.

HH Scott I’m sure if you spend US$30K on a DAC your brain will be convinced it sounds great. But little do you know that the actual DAC component doing all the work cost a few Dollars. Digital audio ideally involves one precise clock master with minimum jitter pushing the PCM data into the DAC rather than multiple out of sync clock masters in separate boxes and a cable with jitter being added.

me too its better

Separates are generally higher priced because, of course, you're getting separate power supplies and chassis for each function as opposed to combining them together as you would in an integrated. It's also true that generally speaking separates are better but not always. It does allow you, however, to make better choices than what you can generally get in a shared piece.

Azur 540r doesnt have real preamp input

I'm employing the azur 540r as a power amp now using the 6.1 Direct inputs normally used for DVD-A or SACD. Works great.

dont know what your thd is at all channels running 20Hz-20khz at whatever ohms but i use outlaw 5000 amp (cheap, quality) with my denon av3400h since they likely have high THD at any number of channels above their listed 2 channel specs

I added a monolith 9x to my Yamaha a2080 receiver. The external amp was powering my 5 main speakers. And the receiver powered the 4 atmos. I did notice a jump in sound quality with the amp added. Mainly at high volume and a little bit better channel separation.

james robinson, db is a relative scale, not absolute.

volleyballschlaeger I think I understand your reply, thanks. ..

@Newman Fertig No, he's saying that a $1000 integrated is better than spending a total of $1000 on the pre amp and power amp combined. Essentially, if spending the same amount of money, the integrated is better, or at least I think this is what he's claiming.

I see there hasn't been any reply so let me try. Firstly I would disconnect everything. For Music listening first connect either the ELACs or the Definitive BP6 and see which one you like the sound of better. Then add the subwoofer, and again compare which is better (ELAC or Definitive). For subwoofer frequency start with 80hz and then adjust from there. Connecting all the speakers at the same time is putting a lot of strain on your amplifier, which might be causing the distortion you mentioned. Because it is having to power all of them at the same time (whereas AV receivers are designed for Home theatre - where most of the sound is from front speakers and occasional sound from surround speakers). I am not familiar with your Receiver, but maybe there is some setting to only play sound from Speaker Front A or B. Especially as the ELACs are 4ohms, they are more 'demanding' from the amplifier. In terms of placement, the basic idea is to ensure you don't place them too close to the wall. Before you go out and buy new components experiment with different configurations of your current equipment and see how it sounds. If you listen to more music than movies get a stereo amplifier (instead of Home Theatre / AV receiver). Or look for a stereo amplifier that has a Home Theatre By pass connection. Which gives you more flexibility. Hope that helps. Good Luck!

Venom415 It’s price dependent. If you can spend $3000 on amplification, $1500 on an analog preamp, and $1500 on a DAC, that will sound better than a cheaper, $2500 all-in-one. The only difference is in the quality of each component (your all-in-one may have a poor DAC), they are not inherently better.

Bluetooth receiver

Wrong

bwahahahaha!

OzoneEditions they have the Sprout. I believe the new model just came out with double the power.

Alex Knight I believe the Sprout is made in the PRC.

a BHK integrated would be awesome.

Dragan Antonijević If we're supposed to accept it without explanation, why follow up with an explanation?

Maybe... because it's not strictly technical? And can also applies to other things other than audio stuff?

Dragan Antonijević Do not bother with an explanation. Great, you could not better proof it is not worth dealing with you, who is not able to argue. Typical high end phrases, you lost the fight for truth, you do not care about the truth.

I miss the good old days when FM was live. There was a DJ in Phoenix, his name was Bill Compton. He had an encyclopedic knowledge of all things music, and could put together collages of music that were beyond belief, and in real time. Unfortunately those days are gone and we now get downloaded MP3 files packaged to fit a “demographic”. I still listen to my pure analog tuner sometimes, but it’s just not the same when the content sucks.

Astra Oovier I want to know the same thing, starting to learn about audio equipment and I would love to hear examples of how things differ in sound

Venom415 It is in my opinion very difficult and expensive to compare equipment. In no order I try to use some rules. A) The performance of any component must succeed in your room and not in any other room. Whatever you hear in the studio of the retailer will unavoidably sound different in you room. B) Different doesn't mean worse or better.C)The most relevant improvement in my room was experimenting with the speaker position ( look for sumiko master protocol). D) cheap method to reduce standing waves: curtains.E) Before you try to look for a new cartridge, cable, speaker etc. try to make absolutely clear, which property of the old component is bad or insufficient or not acceptable. If you can't name the fault, you are doomed. F) How loud can you listen, how loud do you want to listen. Don't listen with more volume, when you are at the retailer. G) Turn the volume from zero to louder, the earlier the music starts to sound lively, the better. The later it sounds to be annoying, the better. H) Never underestimate convenience and longevity. Buy established products from established brands. I) Try to listen in the nearfield and change listening position to learn how soundstage appears and disappears. J) Helpful for speaker positioning is a mono recording. K) There has been provided overwhelming evidence, that all electronics are tenfold or more superior to mechano-electrical converters (cartridges) resp. electro-mechanical converters (speakers). Don't waste money on amplifiers, spend it for speakers. L) Even if it's hard to find a store that cooperate, try not to listen in a sighted test. Give a budget, listen without knowing which brand, which price. If you find a dealer who levels loudness with a voltmeter you're save. M) Close your eyes during listening, it enhances your imagination by synaesthesia. Nobody is lamenting about bad sound while enjoying a clip or whole concert on a good bluray disc. N) The quality differences between recordings are far greater than between components in my opinion. If there's a single recording you really appreciate and enjoy on your home system, than it can't be bad. O) No piece of gear will make you happy. Never. P) Buy at least one outstanding recording from an artist or genre you love and compare it with a highly compressed modern music with much electronic content. Small scale acoustic music can be reproduced with high fidelity in a home system. Opera and symphonic can't. Q) Listen to live music. R) If your musical taste is more or less Venom-like, I can't give you sound advice how to listen properly to this kind of music. I was raised on Black Sabbath. S) Never rely on a single source of advice. T) Don't listen and test in a store and buy afterwards online.

Couldn't agree with you more. I was thinking the exact same thing. But he's got products to sell, so he tells the story so that he can sell more product. Cable directionality? Insane!

Measurable improvement vs audible improvement are very different. Sure - separates with a 120db SNR may measure better than an integrated with a 115db SNR, but can you hear any difference? Only if your speakers have a 120+ db sensitivity. So I agree that “sound better” is most definitely not the same as measures better.

YES IT WILL PROBABLY BE FINE..............YOU ARE MORE CONCERNED WITH THE PEAK POWER WHEN SIZING AN AMPLIFIER TO SPEAKERS AND SUBWOOFERS,........AND YOU HAVE TO APPLY POWER FOR A LONG TIME BEFORE BLOWING THE DRIVER.

YOU WILL BE FINE, JUST DO NOT TURN THEN VOLUME WAAAAY UP. WITH YOUR MESSAGE STYLE THAT MAY BE AGAINST YOUR NATURE THOUGH.

Self-justification is a powerful tool..."lied to be Sorry"? Nice sentence structure - what does it mean?

Buckhorn Cortez if you can't figure it out it shows your lack of intelligence ...

Price has nothing to do with sound. Numbers are important but dollar amounts are not part of the equation.

I mean that I don't think they lied to me.. Sorry I wasn't clear..

TJ Roelsma You're right on. I believe the one paying money for the system has the right to decide what sounds good to them.

@Newman Fertig Any honest electrical engineer will tell you that an amplifier does one thing only , it amplifies , it does not or should not add it's own signature sound , I can't understand why some people get so hung up about pre amps , amplifiers CD players ect , these devices are designed to be neutral , if you want better sound focus on good recordings , speakers and room acoustics .

Separates are way better than any receiver