Does blackjack card counting really work? Part 1

  Рет қаралды 68,926

G Chang

G Chang

7 жыл бұрын

Does card counting really work? You win by betting more when the remaining deck is favorable, allowing you to gain an overall advantage and win in the long run. However, you need to risk very large amounts to win just a little, making it impractical as a way to earn money unless you have a huge bankroll that you're willing to risk over an extended period of time.
If you would rather read about this than watch a video, go to the companion web page at:
BlackjackCalculation.com/card-...
To “count” the cards, you only need to keep track of one number, “the running count,” which starts with 0 for a freshly shuffled deck. The low cards 2 through 6 have a value of +1. The high cards, 10 through Ace, have a value of -1. The cards in the middle have a value of 0. On average, the numbers of good and bad cards are balanced.
As each card is dealt out and revealed, you add or subtract 1, depending on whether a “bad” or “good” card is used up. A positive count means extra “bad cards” have been used up, and extra “good cards” remain in the deck, which is favorable for future hands; a negative count means the opposite. You bet more when the remaining deck is favorable.
You might wonder why high cards are “good” and low cards are “bad.” An abundance Aces and 10s means more blackjacks. This is good because when you get a blackjack, you win one and one-half bets; when the dealer gets a blackjack, you lose only one bet. Also, when both you and the dealer have a bad hand, you can stand on yours; the dealer must hit, and maybe bust. In this situation, the dealer is even more likely to bust with many 10s remaining.
The remaining deck is favorable only about 15% of the time, so you need to bet a lot more during that time to make up for losses during the other 85% of the time. When you have an advantage, the size of the advantage is very small, usually less than 1%. So you need to risk $100 on a single bet (and even more when you double down or split) to earn less than $1 on average. That's a lot of risk for a small gain.
Random variations in luck will cause huge winning and losing streaks in the thousands of dollars, even for an average win rate of just $5 or $10 per hour. The winning streaks are great, but the losing streaks are disheartening. A bad losing streak could wipe out your entire bankroll.
Physicist Richard Feynman discovered this the first time he gambled in Las Vegas. He knew that the Pass bet in Craps costs 1.4 cents per dollar bet on average. So he played $1 five times and lost every time, five times in a row! So instead of his expected total loss of 7 cents, he was behind $5. He wisely never gambled again, having learned his lesson.
The same thing can happen to you, the card counter. You fully expect to win $10 over the next hour, but you end up losing $1,000 instead. (Or winning $1,000 if you're lucky.) Can you afford to take that kind of risk?
This video is Part 1 of the presentation. Part 2 explains further why card counting is difficult and risky, and makes some recommendations:
• Does blackjack card co...
The following video explains why you need a bankroll of $10,000 to have a long-term card-counting win rate of just $10 per hour:
• Kelly Criterion: Bankr...
For more information about blackjack basic strategies, go to
BlackjackCalculation.com
To learn card counting, see the free online book "Modern Blackjack" by Norm Wattenberger at www.qfit.com/book
Watch the Simpsons (Homer, Marge) count cards here:
• Video
It's pretty realistic, except that Flanders places his whole pile of chips on one bet. A real card counter would never do that, even in a highly advantageous situation like a +20 running count; it would still be too risky. Also, a real team would arrive at the casino one at a time and not be seen together. Your overall advantage with card counting is only about 1 percent at best, so you need to risk large amounts over an extended time (weeks or months) to ensure a reliable win. Your chance of coming out ahead over an hour, or day, or even a week is only slightly above 50%.
Other FAQs:
Does card counting work with 6 decks?
Yes. Card-counting is just as easy for 6 decks as for a single deck. However, 6-deck games have a slightly worse house edge than single-deck or double-deck games with the same playing rules, which cuts your long-term win rate.
Does card counting work with continuously shuffling machines (CSMs)?
No. Continuous shuffling machines (CSMs) effectively perform a complete shuffle every time the dealer feeds the used cards into the machine. The count is effectively zero all the time, so you never have an advantage.
Does card counting work with online casinos?
No. All online casinos perform a shuffle after every round. It's like playing against a freshly shuffled deck every time. The count is always zero when you place your bet.

Пікірлер: 96
@NathanHedglin
@NathanHedglin Жыл бұрын
Yup. The $100k and multiple trespass notice letters attest to it. I started with a $3k bankroll.
@e020443
@e020443 2 жыл бұрын
This is the best, most succinct description of card counting I've ever seen, and I've been casually counting cards since Thorp's book came out in the early '70s. I'm looking forward to seeing his part 2.
@senseihitmanwayofkempo8305
@senseihitmanwayofkempo8305 4 жыл бұрын
Change play is good when deck qualified n is safer then the change bet size move 2 attempt 2 balance the odds
@SP-ui6zn
@SP-ui6zn 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you for this great video. Is there anywhere I can find the calculation behind the 0.5% increment of player's edge with each +1 true count?
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 2 жыл бұрын
www.blackjackincolor.com/truecount3.htm
@bruce4139
@bruce4139 2 жыл бұрын
Idk if blackjack apprenticeship has what you're looking for but they have lots of good videos anyways
@user-du6et5wi1b
@user-du6et5wi1b 2 жыл бұрын
hi G Chang. thank you for your education. I want to ask one thing. I've been told that when TC is 1, the player's winning odds are 49.999...% = 50%. So if the TC is 1.01, is the win rate slightly higher at 50%?(player has little advantage more than house?) It's about 8 deck.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 2 жыл бұрын
No, the information you have is not correct.
@TheDougSpot
@TheDougSpot 2 жыл бұрын
You are absolutely correct, not sure why he told you it’s wrong. Even his chart at 3:55 confirms what you said
@poolserviceleakdetection7254
@poolserviceleakdetection7254 6 жыл бұрын
What is the percentage of advantage as the count moves up and how do you calculate it.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 6 жыл бұрын
It is explained in the video. See the graph at the 3:45 mark. In summary, you start with an advantage of -0.5% with a freshly shuffled deck (true count of zero). Your advantage increases by +0.5% for each one point increase in the true count. For example, TC=1 means 0.0% advantage, TC=2 means 0.5% advantage, TC=3 means 1.0% advantage, an so on; and likewise in the negative direction. These figures are approximate. The exact numbers depend on the casino rules and card counting strategy.
@funandgames2339
@funandgames2339 6 жыл бұрын
Hello, I was wondering if you knew how to factor in the house advantage when calculating standard deviation. Thank you.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 6 жыл бұрын
If you play a good basic strategy, the house edge is only about 0.5% to 1%, which has a negligible effect on the standard deviation. The big effect comes from doubling down and splitting pairs, which significantly increases the standard deviation and the volatility of your bankroll. You lose more hands than you win, but the additional amount won on double-downs and pair splits almost makes up for it. I'm not sure of the exact figure, but the standard deviation for blackjack is about 30% larger than for a simple coin-flip game.
@funandgames2339
@funandgames2339 6 жыл бұрын
I'm not talking about the standard deviation for one hand. I'm trying to find the standard deviation for several hands so if I were to play 10,000 hands of blackjack how would I figure the standard deviation assuming a 0.5% played advantage and not flat betting? It gets tricky.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 6 жыл бұрын
You're asking about the standard deviation when card counting and varying your bets. I don't think it's possible to calculate an exact answer. It depends on your aggressiveness in varying your bets, the house rules, the deck penetration, and other factors not under your control. Let's just say that the variation is extreme; if you want to ensure against going broke, your bankroll needs to be at least 1,000 times larger than your minimum waiting bet, as shown in the video.
@funandgames2339
@funandgames2339 6 жыл бұрын
There is a way to calculate your standard deviation when you're varying your bets. I don't know how to do it but it has been explained by some of the better players on some of the forums. As for the risk of ruin you're playing with: If you play with 10k you're never going broke, your risk of ruin is probably below 1%, when you're betting nickels you don't really need to be so conservative. When you have 5k your risk of ruin is something like 5%, that's really not so bad. Now let's say you take that same 10k and decide to play with an 11% risk of ruin but you scale your bets down once your bank RoR takes a hit you're playing with a much lower ROR than 11%. and you have doubled your earning to over 20$ an hour.
@Hairashi696
@Hairashi696 5 жыл бұрын
I guess my opinion on the matter is I thought the point of counting was to have the higher chance of hitting blackjack which pays off more..
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 5 жыл бұрын
Yes, that's part of it. More Aces and 10s remaining in the deck means more blackjacks; player blackjack wins 1.5 bets whereas dealer blackjack loses 1 bet.
@zelda12346
@zelda12346 6 жыл бұрын
Do the running count changes have inherent mathematical properties or are they just estimations of a parameter where trying to use more precise steps wouldn't be humanly possible (e.g. say 6 has a true value of +0.872... instead of +1 and 7 has a value of +0.014...)?
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 6 жыл бұрын
The running counts are an approximation. The removal of each type of card has a different effect on the house edge. In the hi-low counting method, we approximate the value as +1.0 for removing a 2 through 6 card, or -1.0 for removing a 10 or Ace card; and 0.0 for 7-8-9 cards. But the true values vary from these approximations. Other counting methods attempt to get a more accurate appraisal, for example, counting +0.5 for the 2 card and 7 card, or keeping a separate count for Aces and 10s (since Aces are considered a high card for the house edge, but a low card for hitting/standing decisions).
@BlackjackLover
@BlackjackLover 6 жыл бұрын
Great video
@azjohnson4735
@azjohnson4735 Жыл бұрын
What are your thoughts on reko counting system??
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc Жыл бұрын
A good system, www.qfit.com/book/index.htm
@janglee3863
@janglee3863 2 жыл бұрын
And cheng i have on more question. If we cant win money on card counting much enough then why casinos make card counters back off ?
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 2 жыл бұрын
It's difficult but possible to win in the long run using card counting. The casinos don't want to risk it so they aggressively back off card counters, even more than is wise -- many of those card counters would lose their entire bankroll if allowed to play.
@janglee3863
@janglee3863 2 жыл бұрын
@@blackjackcalc thank you i have been 3k up since I started card counting and i lost entire my bankroll today. Total of 6k gone so fast on losing streaks. We can’t actually win money on blackjack if you are not already rich enough haha
@lindencamelback2305
@lindencamelback2305 2 жыл бұрын
Since you win/lose hands about equally with best play, any advantage, which counting cards enables you to do, any slight advantage is profitable. The advantage may be small but very profitable in the long run. Why do you think casino's throw card counters out?
@bengaliinplatforms1268
@bengaliinplatforms1268 2 жыл бұрын
They throw them out because they can, bookies ban AP gamblers online because they can too.(Gamblers trying to hit the extra place offered in horse racing while also betting against the horse on the exchange, so both the bookie and exchange pay out) There's plenty of mugs to replace you.
@emmanuelvacakis4463
@emmanuelvacakis4463 Жыл бұрын
Continuous shuffle machines are used by many casinos. This kills card counting because a card played can come up again in the very next hand. All players must avoid playing at any blackjack table where continuous shuffle machines are used. Also many casinos pay blackjack 6-5. This game is also unbeatable with card counting with typical deck penetration.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc Жыл бұрын
If you're not card counting, continuous shuffling machines are OK.
@emmanuelvacakis4463
@emmanuelvacakis4463 Жыл бұрын
@@blackjackcalc no they aren’t. You get more blackjacks as the cards run out. So with continuous shuffle machines, you will get fewer blackjacks in the long run. So please help all blackjack players by avoiding both continuous shuffle machines and 6-5 blackjack games.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc Жыл бұрын
For basic strategy players, continuous shuffling machines are actually helpful. See wizardofodds.com/games/blackjack/cut-card-effect/
@emmanuelvacakis4463
@emmanuelvacakis4463 Жыл бұрын
@@blackjackcalc thanks for this. The basic strategy player suffers by not making the proper deviations when the count is negative. But the player will never have an advantage on any hand dealt from a continuous shuffle machine. The game is unbeatable with card counting. So we must all do our part and pull all players who are playing against continuous shuffle machines and 6-5 blackjack games. When I’m in a casino, I actually walk up to those tables and convince those players to get up and leave. This causes the casinos to lose more money in potential earnings than they would lose to me as a card counter.
@radusamy5901
@radusamy5901 3 жыл бұрын
When you say advantage of 1/2 percent, does that mean 50.25/49.75, or 0.5% return rate for each bet because 0.25% is only 0.25% return rate even though the advantage is 0.5%
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 3 жыл бұрын
For a coin-flip game that pays 1:1 and lands heads 50.25% of the time, betting on heads has a 0.5% advantage. Blackjack is more complicated because you have ties and uneven payoffs (3:2 for blackjack, doubling down, etc.)
@radusamy5901
@radusamy5901 3 жыл бұрын
@@blackjackcalc 50.25/49.75 is 2.5/1000 but it takes 1 win and 1 loss to take the 2.5 in a coin flip, so if blackjack has 0.5% house edge, how can it profit more then the coin flip if they are the same house edge so how can the profit be 5/1000 instead of 2.5/1000. You telling me I need to make 1000$ worth of bets for 2.5$ plzzzzz say 5
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 3 жыл бұрын
5 is correct! For every 1000 flips, on average, you win 502.5 times and lose 497.5 times. Subtract total losses from total wins, and you get 5.
@radusamy5901
@radusamy5901 3 жыл бұрын
@@blackjackcalc Are you gonna do a video on the math behind deck penetration coach Chang
@sajkaca1
@sajkaca1 4 жыл бұрын
At 3:45 you show a graph of how the player advantage increases as the true count increases. The graph shows a lineair relation between true count and player advantage. Is there mathematical evidence for this relation? I would like to understand how this relation can be substantiated. Or perhaps you can reference the source you have used.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 4 жыл бұрын
The linear relationship is approximate, but accurate enough for this analysis. The exact function of advantage vs. true count depends on the card counting strategy used. See Blackjack in Color: How do Blackjack indexes affect advantages of counts? www.blackjackincolor.com/truecount3.htm
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 4 жыл бұрын
The green line in the graph represents a typical good card counting strategy. You can see it is highly linear between the most common true counts, from -5 to +5, with a slope roughly equal to 0.5% per 1.0 true count.
@sajkaca1
@sajkaca1 4 жыл бұрын
@@blackjackcalc Thank you for your response. Now that I've seen the complete graph this makes sense to me again. Important note to your graph is that the function is lineair as long as the player includes the most common playing deviations in his game at higher true counts.
@adamwhite7540
@adamwhite7540 6 ай бұрын
doesn't it matter how many decks they use also?
@nextari
@nextari 4 жыл бұрын
If you stop for a break, then you must wait for a new shoe to re-enter, but that makes it obvious you're counting?
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 4 жыл бұрын
Everybody takes breaks, but if you do it more than once or twice in a session, it is likely to be noticed.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 4 жыл бұрын
To be less obvious, don't wait for the shuffle. Start playing again right before the shuffle, using your minimum waiting bet.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 4 жыл бұрын
Or start playing a little after the shuffle. Start the count at 0 if you miss seeing the first few cards.
@jso2332
@jso2332 2 жыл бұрын
Why don't we count 789? If +1 becomes +2, and -1 becomes -2. 7 becomes 1, 8 is 0, and 9 is -1.
@dustinjames1268
@dustinjames1268 2 жыл бұрын
Because 7 8 and 9 are statistically neutral on their effect to the player vs the dealer whereas cards below 6 are bad for the player.
@awful999
@awful999 Жыл бұрын
what’s killing me is having to play through the negative fknnn countsss
@PianoImprov.rjgc1991
@PianoImprov.rjgc1991 2 жыл бұрын
Hoping to only win when the count is favorable is a waste of time and money when it is against you. And counting the cards is a hassle. I was making 224$/hr at a 21 table with 10$ minimum stakes long before I decided to try to count cards. I have a winning system that works indefinitely as long as your win rate is at least 44% . Now a days I know how to count cards. I just don’t do it.
@garysharp849
@garysharp849 5 жыл бұрын
Yes it works if your betting correctly
@andrewdixon7894
@andrewdixon7894 3 жыл бұрын
Should say: You only need to keep track of the "True Count" instead
@andrewdixon7894
@andrewdixon7894 3 жыл бұрын
Yes, that is correct
@spekenbonen72
@spekenbonen72 2 жыл бұрын
Does it work? No. How many decks? At twhich point will left-over cards be reshuffled? Will you be punished (removed from the casino) if you suddenly alter strategy (adjust your bets according to a counting strategy). Every casino can have their own rules on this. Etc. If you really want to know if it is possible to "game" a casino, the answer might be in a "mathologer" (a KZfaqr who knows a thing or 2 about maths) video about this specific topic. ANY game in a casino is made to make the players lose. If not, they change the rules. Wanna go to a casino to have some fun, with friends. Sure go ahead. Beat the casino??? Nope....
@mattvisconti8456
@mattvisconti8456 Жыл бұрын
bro knows literally nothing of what he's talking about lmfao
@spekenbonen72
@spekenbonen72 Жыл бұрын
@@mattvisconti8456 clearly havn't seen enough video's about how casinos counter cardcounting... good luck not getting caught. 😉
@mattvisconti8456
@mattvisconti8456 Жыл бұрын
@@spekenbonen72 Have you lived it? If not then don't presume to speak lmfao
@justforfun5391
@justforfun5391 6 жыл бұрын
Unfortunately, there is a thing called LADY LUCK...and no matter what the count is she can beat you...
@blackjackwiz8860
@blackjackwiz8860 6 жыл бұрын
You're right. I remember seeing Lady Luck one time. She was riding a unicorn on a rainbow and she was going towards a pot of gold,
@MsGabijota
@MsGabijota 5 жыл бұрын
but you can always train your success:)
@skylerdrabing4323
@skylerdrabing4323 5 жыл бұрын
No, she actually can't if you have a big enough bankroll and play correctly. Her real name is Probability, only the people she plays for tricks call her Lady Luck.
@oteeec
@oteeec 3 жыл бұрын
you can go and learn about statistics, - just for fun (get it?) and learn, that with repetition on your calculated odds, the winnings approximate to calculated odds. Take coinflip for example - if you do it once, you win once or lose once - you either have it all or none of it. But if you play a coinflip 2 times, you are 25% to lose both of them, 50% to win one, and 25% to win both coinflips. So your LADY LUCK, with doubling of a number of runs has half the chance to beat all of your coinflips. You can increase it further and go for 10 coinflips in a row, and I guarantee you, that you will be throwing your coin for a long time(on average, it will take around 700 runs).
@justforfun5391
@justforfun5391 3 жыл бұрын
@@oteeec lmfao...don't tell me about stats...I have been playing BJ since I was 11 years old...and been counting card since 15...I am in my 60s...lady luck is always there....I made good money for years until lady luck or should I say lady unlucky joined the table...i stop playing for 2 years to see if lady luck came back...nope...seems like I am the only one in the table who always gets the crap hands even at high count...i have learned how to finesse over and under betting...oh yeah probability....it's probable...not absolutely
@tecnolover2642
@tecnolover2642 5 жыл бұрын
Card counting only ever worked with single deck games with no random shuffles. There are few single deck games left and even if you find one they have horrible rules which offset most card counting advantages.
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 5 жыл бұрын
Card counting works with multiple decks, even 6 decks. But you need a lot of patience and a huge bankroll because your advantage is so tiny.
@janglee3863
@janglee3863 2 жыл бұрын
@@blackjackcalc what do you mean by your advantage is tiny? Then what about all the successful cardcounters who made millions of dollars? It’s a huge advantage if you can make that much money isnt it
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 2 жыл бұрын
No, the advantage has always been small, and it is even smaller now. The stories about big wins are exaggerated. Also, you never hear stories about the card counters who had big losses. Nobody brags about losing.
@janglee3863
@janglee3863 2 жыл бұрын
@@blackjackcalc what do you think about colin whos founder of blackjack apprenticeship? You think he’s exaggerating?
@blackjackcalc
@blackjackcalc 2 жыл бұрын
I don't comment on the work of others. To see what I think, just watch my videos.
@travisg761
@travisg761 3 жыл бұрын
Card counting works if the dealer isn't on a win streak. Also a player can win close to 100 percent of the time if, they not only count cards but also utilize ace 5 count, and other strategies, and play only one on one with the dealer. Each player that sits at the table decreases your advantage against the house and can result in a negative expectation game. Especially if the other players at your table are idiot players (play their hands foolishly) or gamblers.
@medexamtoolsdotcom
@medexamtoolsdotcom 5 жыл бұрын
You make several mistakes. First of all, it is a common myth that most of the advantage of counting cards comes from blackjack paying 3 to 2. It isn't. Otherwise, the blackjack-pays-6-to-5 games would be all but invulnerable to counting methods, and though they suck and I wouldn't play them, they are in fact beatable. Most of the advantage actually comes from the fact that you'll succeed more often when doubling down. You won't be doubling down as often mind you, but when you do, you'll be winning more often because usually you want a 10 when you double down, and the times when you are doubling on a soft hand, it means that the dealer shows a bustcard (2-6), and if the count is very high, it means the dealer is more likely to bust from that point on. Another is it is not realistic to say that the breakeven point is a truecount of 1. It's closer to 2. For an infinite # of decks, it's at 1.8. That means a house edge of 0.9%. You're assuming 0.5% across the board regardless of the number of decks in the shoe. The house doesn't have an edge of merely 0.5%, it's more like 0.7%, more like 0.8 or 0.9% in a 6-deck game. So it's certainly not a breakeven point of a truecount of 1 in a 6-deck game, so you wouldn't say a count of 6 at the beginning is the breakeven point. I usually just round up and assume 2 as the breakeven point myself. But you can't just take the house edge in a 2 deck game and apply that same ratio of low cards to high cards that produces breakeven to a 6-deck game. It also depends on the exact rules, like whether you can double down on any 2 cards or just 10 and 11, and whether resplitting aces is allowed. As for the % of the time the advantage is yours, that depends on where the cutcard is and also the exact rules, like whether you can double down on any 2 cards or just 10 and 11, or whether resplitting aces is allowed. It's not nearly as cut and dry as you depict, it is extremely dependent on the conditions that vary from one game to another. Finally, it is not linear. If the count goes super negative, the house edge starts to disappear again. It isn't as simple as a 0.5% edge for each 1 of the truecount. Try playing blackjack with just the 2's, 3 4 5 6 7 and 8 cards of a deck, and the 9's 10JQK and A's taken out, but now hit on 17 or less every hand no matter what the dealer has, and you'll see that for yourself. You shouldn't take a bathroom break every 10 minutes FFS, just play through and calculate the way your optimal strategy changes for both positive and negative counts. If you leave in the middle of a shoe when the count goes negative ("wonging out") what you are actually doing is stealing from the other players, because they'll play more hands in the rest of that shoe in your absence, this is why I generally don't do it unless I'm the only one at the table and I'm planning on leaving for a long while. After all, what are you going to do, constantly leave and come back? That's a good way of getting heat. In fact, it's the BEST way of getting heat. You sit there and take your punishment when the count goes negative, and don't you wong in either (mid shoe entry), that's also stealing from the other players, because then they'll be getting fewer hands from the rest of the shoe in your presence. You're there to take the house's money, not the other players'.
@Hoinhom
@Hoinhom 4 жыл бұрын
Counting card will never work if there are selected cards! So many people are dump! Stop gamble
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