Does Compliance ACTUALLY Make You Faster?

Рет қаралды 34,735

Күн бұрын

We all hear the marketing phrases: “10% more compliant than last year’s bike”, “The most compliant bike we've ever made” and “More compliance makes you faster”.
But what do they actually mean? What does bike comfort have to do with bike compliance? In this video, Hank and Conor answer all your burning compliance questions!
Does a more comfortable bike make your riding faster? 0:00
What do those marketing phrases really mean? 0:14
What is compliance? 0:39
Different materials and properties 1:48
What role do tires play in compliance? 3:10
Influence of your seat post 4:59
Frame geometry and bike fit 5:58
So, does compliance really make you faster? 6:56
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Have you paid much attention to the compliance of your bike? 🚲
Let us know in the comments below! 💬
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Пікірлер: 156

@gcntech Ай бұрын

Have you paid much attention to the compliance of your bike? 🚲 Let us know in the comments below! 💬

@nebulous962 Ай бұрын

years ago i thought it was just waste of money but after looking into it more i have realized that it does matter much more than i previously thought.

@nebulous962 Ай бұрын

And now I am converting my MTB to gravel bike just to really test if it makes difference. 😀

@chrisdavidson911 Ай бұрын

the bmx (DP Firebird Freestyler) i had as a kid felt like it just skipped over bumps, and still does. Currently have a full chro-mo single speed (Subrosa Malum DTT) with 29x2.35 tyres (60psi) and it's like having full suspension. Both of these have double top tubes, and the Firebird has Skyway wheels which are made of nylon, i have no idea if that contributes anything to this though. I've always hated the way some bikes ride as if they're trying to smash themselves to pieces!

@larryt.atcycleitalia5786 Ай бұрын

As they used to say: "Because so much is riding on your tires" why ride on anything without a supple carcass, no matter what the size/width? My faves are sold by COMPASS...I think Panacer actually makes 'em?

@Bukoe Ай бұрын

For 95% of us weekend hobby riders being comfy on the bike is by far the most important. Your more likely to train more if your comfy, your ass and hands will not be 90% of your pain problems after riding 3-6 hours.. I do a bit of short TT riding and my old TT bike is setup 100% for speed I dont care about comfy on a 30min ride just need power and speed.. But for my 150-300KM rides witch is social/hobby Comfy is everything on the last hours of a long day..

@christiankeim Ай бұрын

This is so accurate! My race bike is chopped and dropped, I hate training on the thing. I train on an endurance bike. But racing an endurance bike I've noticed at higher speeds of 27mph or higher I can't turn worth a shit, I have to literally throw my weight into it like a BMX/DH and pray she's gonna take the turn. I think racing an endurance bike would be amazing on a grand tour.

@tommyfreckmann6857 Ай бұрын

What??? Do you realize what you said? @@christiankeim

@christiankeim Ай бұрын

@@tommyfreckmann6857 that you are more likely to train more when you feel better on the bike or that racing something like a Roadmachine 01 in a grand tour would be pretty sweet. Since it was designed for it anyways. It would have to be a 2022 or older, newer have super wide tire clearance and super relaxed head tube angles.

@agamemnonhatred Ай бұрын

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂95%? Where does that come from?

@tongotongo3143 Ай бұрын

Why weekend rider would ride a racing road bike in the first place. For weekend rides there are more comfortable city commute bikes.

@bjornharstedt Ай бұрын

Alloy isn't short for aluminium. An alloy is a "mixture" of a metal (elemental) and something else. Steel for example, is an alloy between iron and carbon. Aluminium bike frames are also alloys between aluminium and other metals, depending on what properties you want to give the material. Pure elemental aluminium would typically be too brittle.

@allegrobrio968 Ай бұрын

The steel tubing used in bicycle frames, at least the better ones (e.g., with tubing produced by Reynolds, Tange and Columbus) also is alloyed with other elements, often including chromium and molybdenum. These elements enable the tubing to be made with less material (and thus lighter) with no sacrifice in strength.

@ryszb 26 күн бұрын

A pure carbon steel is also an alloy (iron with carbon addition). Pure (non alloy) iron is never used as a construction material.

@phoffen3829 Ай бұрын

I bought a new bike at the end of last year. It is nowhere near as stiff feeling as my old bike, and at first I thought, oh oh, this can't be good. But I went faster, felt a lot more comfortable, and LOVE riding again.

@gcntech Ай бұрын

That's what it's all about! Loving riding again is the important thing 🙌

@Sutlore007 Ай бұрын

I would like to know when the companies claim that the new bike has 10% more compliance than last year, how the compliance been measured in digits? Is it in N/mm or something else? And how can we trust that claim without seeing the evidence in actual number?

@lunam7249 Ай бұрын

its all FAKE, in terms of real measurement, except for sure they know if there is less material it will be softer = more compliance....Ferrari factory measure with machines NEWTONS/ METER = THE NUMBER IS USUALY VERY HIGH 10E11..you at home can measure your own bike..."torque" more than compliance...stand on one side on 1 pedal, it will flex, say 1 millimeter...

@veganpotterthevegan Ай бұрын

@@lunam7249 less material doesn't mean more compliance

Ай бұрын

Buy stiff, because it's faster. Then buy compliant, because stiff is actually slower. Buy hookless because it's better (to the manufacturers). No, buy hooked because it's safer. Buy lightweight because it's faster to climb. Actually, buy aero because it's faster everywhere unless on a 20% gradient. Buy integrated stem because it's more aero. Now, you should go back to traditional because look how adjustable it is. Buy electronic groupset because... look it is wireless! Damn, you won't believe there's something cheaper and more reliable. Now on the MTB side, direct mount rear derailleurs, a few more years until someone invents a little piece of soft metal to protect your expensive frame...

@kidShibuya Ай бұрын

Or just buy what you like and stop following trends?

Ай бұрын

@@kidShibuya of course, i do. But all this marketing BS is just getting tiring, especially because sometimes there are no options you would like to chose, since trends pushed logic out.

@chrisdavidson911 Ай бұрын

Buy hydraulic disc brakes because they're better in every way. Actually, get rim brakes because they're lighter and retro cool. This is why it's important to think about what you're going to use it for and where you're going to be going before you spend any money. The thing that actually bugs me is how much time gets spent talking about bikes that are all within 10% of being the same.

@sepg5084 Ай бұрын

@ then don't watch 🤷 Marketing will always exist. Professional sports is sponsor advertising galore. It existed before you were born and will continue to exist after you're dead.

@ericpmoss Ай бұрын

Well, stiffer is great for a big strong racer who wins a paycheck in the last 200m of a race, and can tolerate all sorts of discomfort the rest of us can't.

@ericpmoss Ай бұрын

I don't think their logic is quite consistent. Yes, carbon fiber can be chosen and layed up in a way that flexes this way, but not that. However... even though metal in a cube is isotropic (same in all directions), the very act of making a tube overcomes that, as does butting, as does ovalizing, as does tapering, as does selective heat treating and mixed tube choice. So, while CF still wins on weight and vibration dissipation, it loses when it comes to flexing and springing back (yes, CF reinforced polymers make excellent springs, but turning them into tubes is another matter). After owning all kinds of cheap and fancy steel and Ti and CF, I'm going back to metals for everything but seatposts and handlebars.

@veganpotterthevegan Ай бұрын

We don't build bikes out of spring steel. Carbon still wins at springing back

@danielcapson9842 Ай бұрын

The new lower tire pressures that seem to be the new norm have had the greatest impact on compliance. I thought my bike was stiff and a little jittery, but taking my tire pressures down has made a huge difference in compliance. The bike is far smoother.

@tongotongo3143 Ай бұрын

Because this way people not only will ride slightly slower, but also more likely will need to buy new spare tubes, tires, rims. While pro elite teams still ride at high pressures and keep their tires pressure a commercial secret, they would never share with anyone at what tire pressure they ride, maybe only among their teammates.

@gcntech Ай бұрын

Lower pressures are great aren't they 🙌

@dainiusvysniauskas2049 Ай бұрын

@@tongotongo3143 lmao, cope.

@jjfalk Ай бұрын

Nice video guys, very informative! Just out of curiosity... How much does that Orbea weigh with the EliteWheels set on there?

@fredmcgough748 Ай бұрын

Thanks for the video. Would you recommend a carbon fiber seat post and fork for aluminum bikes?

@edb8120 Ай бұрын

The reason that Al frames seem harsh is because of the tube sizes and frame geometries. the material itself is much less stiff than steel (1/3 as stiff). What we all want is a bike with lots of vertical compliance while being laterally very stiff. I did this by going to a bike from Alter Cycles. Great ride and still efficient.

@cb6866 Ай бұрын

Thanks JLW , Conor , and crew..slam that stem , eh ? I added a Redshift stem , and I love the thing . I'm older , and it seems that I am less sore . I ride almost exclusively off road , and it helps me to ride longer , and with more speed ? Maybe ? Could be mental as well ...I did play contact sports .

@benfarrar3140 Ай бұрын

I just realised Hank sounds like James Acaster

@harryrowland4734 Ай бұрын

I love my sloppy slow bike, so comfortable I can ride it all day without cracking my spine or loosing my fillings

@supercoder7 Ай бұрын

Seems like Hank and Conor had a really busy and productive Paris-Roubaix trip. Got 10 or so great videos out of the trip. Hope they got time to enjoy the cobbles rather along with work.

@gcntech Ай бұрын

Is there such a thing as enjoying the cobbles? 😂

@rangersmith4652 Ай бұрын

When I feel good, I go faster without really trying to go faster. When my ride is compliant, it's more comfy, and I feel good. So yes, compliance, makes me faster.

@gcntech Ай бұрын

Comfort can often be the key to unlocking speed 👉kzfaq.info/get/bejne/sNxoh8qFx8y5oac.html

@rangersmith4652 Ай бұрын

@@gcntech If you've ever ridden horses, you know how this works. It can be exciting to ride a very spirited animal, but for most riders it also exhausting. When I first got into riding horses, I liked the idea of sitting astride a fiery young stallion, but I quickly evolved into choosing a more docile mount. A very limited number of riders belong on such beasts, and I'm not one of them.

@bpfastfeet25 Ай бұрын

Somebody save Hank's bike/derailleur, that chain is so short! 1:57

@gcntech Ай бұрын

consider him told!

@meibing4912 Ай бұрын

Moving towards 70 and never felt more comfortable on my road bikes! 4-5 hours is easy. No hand buzz, numb-where-you-don't-want-to-be, saddle pain. 32mm tubeless (vs 19mm), power mirror saddle (vs hard, long nose), carbon handle bars (vs steel), padded double bar tape (vs single grip tape). Hell, even my bibs are 5x more comfortable than they used to be! Faster because I ride more.

@jameslee-pevenhull5087 Ай бұрын

Deforming a structure requires energy. Kinetic energy is converted into heat energy and sometimes noise energy. Energy that is not going to the drive tyre.

@jameslee-pevenhull5087 Ай бұрын

My bike complies with a British Standard.

@danielt91 Ай бұрын

What is the name of the suspension seatpost?

@larrylem3582 Ай бұрын

Redshift ShockStop

@cb6866 Ай бұрын

Or… Steve

@shahilj Ай бұрын

Why don’t pros use the seat post suspension for the cobbled races? Seems like it’s a win win when using it. But they don’t seem to use it.

@thenobleist9262 Ай бұрын

It probably comes down to weight savings. Pros are really not bothered with being comfortable. It’s all about speed.

@veganpotterthevegan Ай бұрын

@@thenobleist9262 comfort is speed in many cases. That said, plenty of these bikes just have all the riders want with adjusting tire size/pressure

@Flexy1234 Ай бұрын

Some things are probably not UCI legal.

@veganpotterthevegan Ай бұрын

@@Flexy1234 suspension seatposts are certainly UCI legal, as are suspension stems and forks

@tongotongo3143 Ай бұрын

When you pedal that powerful and fast the stiffness and “comfort” of a seat post is irrelevant. If you want to go as fast as possible everything has to be quite stiff.

@MacDKB Ай бұрын

First wider tires, now less stiffness? I dunno, guys…

@paulgrimshaw8334 Ай бұрын

Idk what that whine is in the background. Dragging brake pad? Or is it some kind of trick bearing intended to drive riders insane?

@darrylstark9259 Ай бұрын

Camera bike is electric.

@gcntech Ай бұрын

imagine if you could do that, activate an irritating noise to rid yourself of someone sitting on your wheel!

@darrylstark9259 Ай бұрын

@@gcntech you mean start singing. Works every time.

@MrVizzle Ай бұрын

Bro science? Where are numbers GCN? What is doctor Ollie doing?

@gcntech Ай бұрын

Ollie is counting calories! 👉 kzfaq.info/get/bejne/id5hgr1ktp_Rc3k.htmlsi=M0hZM3oPDQTtrpYm

@barrykearney-luc7232 28 күн бұрын

Where in Ireland is Conor from?

@MandyH1972 Ай бұрын

I have some steel bikes and some carbon and aluminum. They each have their plus points.

@tongotongo3143 Ай бұрын

What’s a plus for aluminium frames? Thank you.

@mb10kx Ай бұрын

@@tongotongo3143 cheap

@sllntrn76887 Ай бұрын

Compliance We just need your compliance You will feel no pain anymore

@darrinschwarz7446 Ай бұрын

There is no way Hank's saddle is that high.

@Bobby-wn5yr Ай бұрын

Unpopular opinion maybe, but having aluminium and carbon bikes and aluminium and carbon forks I just don’t really notice much different in the frames in the real world tbh. Tyres for sure.

@kippen64 Ай бұрын

My bike is aluminium and very stiff. Skinny tyres too. Ouch 😳 I am currently eyeing off a gravel bike with 650B wheels for the commute to work.

@drooghead Ай бұрын

My aluminium bike was so stiff that I stripped the parts and put them on an old steel frame from 1984. Steel is much nicer to ride especially with the curved forks which absorb vibration. I can run skinny tyres and still be comfortable. I was also scared of fatigue failure of old aluminium frames.

@rasmuswi Ай бұрын

A thing worth noting is that a really stiff bike with tires pumped really hard actually feels great under some circumstances. I used to LOVE riding with my tires pumped really hard, because vibrations are essentially information. It made me feel like the bike was telling me absolutely everything about the road!

@dainiusvysniauskas2049 Ай бұрын

Yes, vibrations tell you everything on the road, but they also make you slower

@DaveCM Ай бұрын

You will also have less control and grip in corners.

@gcntech Ай бұрын

There is something to be said for being able to feel the connection between road and rider 🙌 Do you think this is lost with the trend for wider tyres?

@fredmcgough748 Ай бұрын

Totally agree and it also feels quick and responsive.

@rasmuswi Ай бұрын

@@gcntech I sure do think you lose some of it with wider tires, but on the other hand, carbon frames and wheels make up for some of it by being way less noodly than old steel frames and allow wheels. Also, I'm 50 and not 20, so I prefer giving up some directness for extra comfort that I wouldn't have wanted to give up 20-30 years ago..

@questgivercyradis8462 Ай бұрын

At a certain point, if the potholes and road quality is so bad, any bike is going to bounce you around like mad. Pretty sure the road I went on last weekend to get to the nice smooth road would have been better as cobbles! It was trying to eat tires. Any tires. NOM NOM NOM. I'd have rather been on gravel than that hideous ground out and pitted asphalt-debris mess.

@sepg5084 Ай бұрын

If compliance is faster, then suspension lockouts on MTBs are useless 😉 Frame compliance is expensive, tire compliance is cheaper. Use the right tire for the job.

@zzhughesd Ай бұрын

Thai smooth silk tarmac yes. UK. Nope.

@Ivan-oh6ug Ай бұрын

Of course it does, we've always know it and most of us opt for compliance over outright stiffness for comfort and less wear to components like bearings, wheels etc. A bike that glides more smoothly over rough surfaces results in a happier rider with less energy spent wrestling the bike as it skips and bumps over uneven surfaces. The bike industry is run by amateurs and charlatans. First it was lightweight, then stiffness and lightweight, then aero and heavier, then lightweight and aero combined, then overcomplicated compliance from companies like Trek and Specialized, now it's wider tyres and more forgiving components which is stating the bleeding obvious.

@larrylem3582 Ай бұрын

Please stop calling aluminum "alloy". Steel is an alloy. The titanium tubes used in bicycle frames are an alloy.

@russellian01 Ай бұрын

Yes compliance makes me faster, when i am compliant in actually RIDING my bicycle.

@michaelre7556 Ай бұрын

All I know is that aluminum bikes have a terrible ride quality, and steel has a great ride quality. I've never coughed up the cash for any other materials besides those two.

@dainiusvysniauskas2049 Ай бұрын

Doesn't work it like that though

@paterjan9733 Ай бұрын

I shortened the development of the perfect fast compliance bike and bought a trekking bike today. With an electric motor.

@gcntech Ай бұрын

A trekking bike is a great choice! Comfort is key 🙌

@stuartmisfeldt3068 Ай бұрын

Funny how a lugged steel bike with box aluminum rims and 32 spokes and 20 mm tubs worked for 40 years.

@kidShibuya Ай бұрын

Wow you are old.

@petersouthernboy6327 Ай бұрын

Well - landlines, faxes, and iceboxes “worked” as well.

@stuartmisfeldt3068 Ай бұрын

@@kidShibuya 66

@stuartmisfeldt3068 Ай бұрын

@@petersouthernboy6327 and they still do…

@keithjenkins7919 Ай бұрын

77 and still riding and agree steel and aluminium not to mention the lower cost, and in 60 years of racing and riding rim brakes have never failed to top me.

@michaellynch1132 Ай бұрын

When you say Carbon, Steel and Alloy, I assume you mean Aluminum? Because all of the metals used in bikes are alloys, which is just a combination of metals. Sorry, this is one of my biggest pet peeves when it comes to discussing metal. Steel is an alloy as it is Iron and Chrome and other things. Aluminum is an alloy because it contains at least magnesium. Titanium contains vanadium and aluminum. So, when you say alloy, it is not possible to know which metal you are talking about. Not to mention, I would love to hear that British Aluminium roll off your tongue. 😝

@raybarber9837 Ай бұрын

Compliance to my wife's demands, is my main issue.

@chris1275cc Ай бұрын

So, 15(+) years ago: Stiff + Light + Skinny High pressure tyres + Aggressive position = Faster but very uncomfortable 10 years ago: Even Stiffer + Full Aero + Less skinny still high pressure tyres + Uber Aggressive position = Even faster (But Heavier) and still uncomfortable 5 Years ago: Stiff-ish + Aero-ish + Lighter + Less skinny low-ish pressure tyres + Aggressive-ish position = Faster still, and less uncomfortable/tolerable Today: Compliant + Aero-ish + Light + Wide low pressure tyres + A position that suits you and your riding style = Fastest yet and mostly comfortable. All that suffering for nothing 🤣

@gcntech Ай бұрын

go on, spoil us: 5 years on - 10 years on - 15 years on - and if we can have the lottery numbers too, that would be nice! 😂

@StrikerSG Ай бұрын

buy, buy, buy and make them richer...

@BennyOcean Ай бұрын

The frame should be stiff. Get your compliance from riding bigger tires at lower pressures. Best of both worlds.

@ericpmoss Ай бұрын

I agree about the value of the supple tires, but 'stiff' is relative to rider strength and weight. A rear triangle that is too stiff causes tire scrub during hard pedaling.

@darrylstark9259 Ай бұрын

Compliance with UCI rules might make you slower. Oh... It's not that kind of compliance you're taking about ..

@WerdnaLiten Ай бұрын

Stiffness really only applies for the pros, everybody else, including weekend warriors should always go for comfort.

@veganpotterthevegan Ай бұрын

Fabian Cancellera used the Domane in every road race after it came out. The comfortable frameset is often still stiff enough for the very best

@tongotongo3143 Ай бұрын

Weekend warriors inside themselves are more warriors than real warriors, so they would never opt for comfort. They want to look like real.

@gcntech Ай бұрын

Comfort is great 🙌 For most of us that's what will make us want to ride more🥵

@veganpotterthevegan Ай бұрын

@@tongotongo3143 oddly enough, some weekend warriors bury the needle whenever they can get on their bike. The bulk of a pros mileage is very low intensity

@tongotongo3143 Ай бұрын

For elite professionals riding low intensity is absolutely irrelevant. They ride lots of tempos and intervals because that is the only way to ride fast at races. Looks like you believe that bullshit about “zone II” and “low pressure”.

@FatboyAussie Ай бұрын

Another win for titanium bikes?

@bikeanddogtrips Ай бұрын

is compliance faster and better than stiffness? That's what she said 🤣🤣🤣🤣

@Dustmadeout Ай бұрын

Aluminium alloys are three times more "compliant" than any steel (70GPa vs 210GPa). Stop spreading the bs about alloys please, better google search what's a Youngs modulus.

@chrisdavidson911 Ай бұрын

Isn't this overlooking the frame design though?

@Dustmadeout Ай бұрын

@@chrisdavidson911 He was talking about material. You can make the frame as stiff as you want with a given material.

@jontylewis7301 Ай бұрын

I guess the point was that the alum bikes end up less compliant (due to tube shape, geometry etc) rather than specific material properties, at least they didn't put on lab coats when explaining young's modulus lol

@Dustmadeout Ай бұрын

@@jontylewis7301Nah the guy was talking specifically about material properties pulling the facts out of his аss.

@two-eyedRoy Ай бұрын

@1:30 .. can we please stop honking this 90s BS please? From hydro forming tubes (of multiple materials) to 3D printing this is just no longer the case. CF might be one of the easier materials for shaping, but 3D printing 100% recyclable material (just requires energy to recycle) toe pokes CF in the gooch and we need to stop treating CF as a disposable product material. (tbf it's the resins at issue, the filaments are less so) again @2:48 No! It's a *designers* wet dream material for control and concepts. Recycling, reutilising, UV degregation says otherwise. [Aluminium's lack of long term elasticity isn't too dissimilar but it can be zapped into another design whilst CF cannot.]

@petersouthernboy6327 Ай бұрын

Thanks for that, Greta.

@two-eyedRoy Ай бұрын

@@petersouthernboy6327 OK

@chrisdavidson911 Ай бұрын

"we need to stop treating CF as a disposable product material. (tbf it's the resins at issue, the filaments are less so)" resins being replaced with nylon is already being done, and has been mentioned in a gcn/gcn tech video

@two-eyedRoy Ай бұрын

Still a one-time use use product though, not easy to separate/reclaim. There's a flax based alternative also, which is all moves in the direction of less impact on the Earth. Tis is good. To me, in this day and age, the complete life cycle of any product produced should be accountable on the producer.

@chrisdavidson911 Ай бұрын

@@two-eyedRoy not being easy to reuse applies to many things, especially once you start introducing colours or different types of the same material. Carbon Fibre does get recycled, have you ever seen things like milled carbon fibre powder?

@BikesKomsCRO Ай бұрын

You've talked alot about compliance but you never really showed or explained how to test.. Its impossible to test and the marketing numbers are bullshit under all regards. Maybe you should say that.

@mb10kx Ай бұрын

wrong, road bikes are not made for comfort but for speed

@gcntech Ай бұрын

what if you could have the best of both worlds?!

@David-qx8jm Ай бұрын

YOU SHOULD REALLY FIRE YOU CONTENT MANAGER.....

@chrisdavidson911 Ай бұрын

why?

@drooghead Ай бұрын

Steel is an alloy. I wish you would say aluminium or aluminium alloy if that's what you mean. No need to lazily redefine the English language.

@andywalford7544 Ай бұрын

I agree, but to be fair, “alloy” is contraction of “ light alloy” a term often used for aluminium alloys in engineering,…. but possibly applying to magnesium alloy too……wish I hadn’t started this….

@petersouthernboy6327 Ай бұрын

There are so many *different* steel alloys - why make things unnecessarily and overly complicated ?

@drooghead Ай бұрын

@@andywalford7544 Alloy is not a contraction of "light alloy". Alloy means alloy. There are innumerable types of alloys that aren't light and don't contain aluminium.

@ScotChef Ай бұрын

There's a science channel or metallurgy channel covers just this subject but most of us are here to watch cycling content 😂 go for a cycle you will feel the tension slip away 😊

@palicar Ай бұрын

You’re as rigid as any frame material. I bet we’ve adopted ‘alloy’ because people like you quibble over Aluminum / Aluminium.

@nemure Ай бұрын

Lies lies and more lies. Alloy frames aren't any close to carbon on being uncomfortable, nothing Is worst than carbon fiber frames. They are rigid and weak. Alloy bikes are more comfy and durable and yet cheaper. Unlike you I do speak from personal experience AND science studies. I own 2 road bikes, one carbon (I shouldn't have listened to the shop guy) and an alloy one. Same weight, same group (105) and alloy one is way better

@Al.2 Ай бұрын

Yep, any patchwork and my carbon-equipped mates lag behind.

@dainiusvysniauskas2049 Ай бұрын

This is not how it works, lol.