Dormer Loft Disaster

Рет қаралды 29,713

4 жыл бұрын

It is almost inevitable with any building project that something will go wrong...however big or small a project is, if there are people working on it, there's a chance for human error and mistakes.
If this episode I show a major mistake we made when we overlooked something that had been specified in the Structural Engineer's briefing document, which is on the back of fairly new advice/guidance.
Thankfully we were able to fix the mistake quite quickly, and learn from it for future reference, but take heed from my mistake and you won't have the upheaval that we had.
We did not fire-proof the outside cheek of the dormer that is next to our adjoined neighbour...We will have 30 minute fire-proofing on the inside with the plasterboard, but we didn't install any protection on the outside of our house, for if a fire started in our neighbour's property.
The building control officer stipulated it needed to be in there, so we had to strip all the tiles and battens off that side of the dormer, add the fireproof board, and then re-tile the dormer.
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Пікірлер: 63

@Twiggerish 4 жыл бұрын

ngl I was watching your other videos and finally this, fact you admit you've done a mistake and immediately fix it shows how decent you are, good stuff lads

@GeekStreet 4 жыл бұрын

Damn what a hassle! Glad you managed to resolve. Perhaps when you get approval from the council they should mention the rule change on a email or letter to you.

@MIGHTYQ277 2 жыл бұрын

Great content enjoy watching all your videos keep up the good work

@OfficeBoyBuilder 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the support mate, more content coming soon!

@brianhewitt8618 4 жыл бұрын

fire board on the dormer cheeks within 1m of the boundary has been around at longer than the Grenfell. Stud, fireboard, felt, batten and tile is standard practice, the LMB guys should of known that, there just lucky they had the room to put on at that stage.

@MrGlenfraser 4 жыл бұрын

Agreed. I thought that was in the wrong order when I watched it.

@RSIMMO25 4 жыл бұрын

Standard dormer work... haha been around for years b4 Grenfell happened... builder blag

@asif530 4 жыл бұрын

Oh dear I didn't know that 6 years ago but inspector told us before we did the tiling.. We learn hey.. Thanks for sharing. Keep up the good work

@OfficeBoyBuilder 4 жыл бұрын

It does make a lot of sense, and I'm pleased we could rectify it in good time, and while we had the scaffolding up! The rules have gotten stricter since Grenfell - before that it was only necessary if you were within 1 meter of your neighbor. Now it's for everyone who is semi-detached/terraced.

@asif530 4 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder thats right mate they have and for good reason.. All the best

@PeakyBlinder 3 жыл бұрын

The joys of loft conversions, How are you fitting your Juliet balcony ?

@user-el5ot1bv8b 3 жыл бұрын

I hope you spray some cleaning agent on them tiles before taking the scaffolding down.

@DanielPaprocki Жыл бұрын

Shouldn't this information about fireproofing be in the paperwork? 🤔

@johncoppock3823 2 жыл бұрын

Surprised the BCO didn't mention when they did your structural inspection. Silly question though did you have any detailed drawings they could have looked at before the cladding went on or would it just be verbal Q and A - I'm just thinking how you would advise to try to avoid this kind of trap.

@OfficeBoyBuilder 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah I think it was a series of assumptions to be honest...builder wasn't used to doing it so assumed it wasn't needed. Structural engineer spec'd it, so the BCO assumed it would be done, and I didn't know one way or the other and assumed everyone else would! Best thing to do, is to thoroughly read through the SE's specifications and even write it into a checklist to go through. I did this after the fact, and the part that mentioned the fire-proofing to the outside of the building was stated at a page-break, so I didn't quite see it fully.

@neilhayter5770 3 жыл бұрын

What was on the specification for the dormers? Did you have Building regs past? As you are the "main contractor" you are the one responsible for the materials to be correct. But you took it well and will learn like most of us have over the years.

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

Yes it was all passed by the building inspector after the amendments were made and the fireboard was added beneath the tiles. Every day is a school day!

@trimad6128 2 жыл бұрын

Do you need cement board on the cheeks if it’s being two coat rendered and pebble dashed?

@OfficeBoyBuilder 2 жыл бұрын

No, probably not! Double check with building control, but I would argue it's got fireproofing from that.

@haroon420 4 жыл бұрын

Tom: Sorry for the wind Cue a builders bottom on screen. 💨 I braced for the worst!!!

@johnstaveley 8 ай бұрын

After you have put on the cement board, what is the point of the breathable membrane? It seems a bit redudant to me

@OfficeBoyBuilder 8 ай бұрын

Yeah it's hard to argue with that to be honest mate - one is for building regs and one is for fire regs... different purposes, and supposedly don't conflict with one another, but sometimes all these layers seem a bit OTT

@Og-Judy Жыл бұрын

Oh boy. What I've read on the Grenfel fire, the issues were the CLADDING made with extremely flammable foam core placed on a high rise building. So now you need to make a TWO story home fireproof now in the UK? How insane. Sounds like overkill. Too me, a glaring mistake was this ridiculous shelter in place ruling. The building should have had TWO stairwells besides the elevator. People should have been evacuated right away when it was noticed the fire was spreading up the exterior. Well here in the US, houses aren't generally built touching each other except some of the 200 yr old original row houses in old sections of the east coast major cities. When there is a need for repairs, the entire home generally has to be reworked so even the electrical wiring and plumbing lines are brought up to current code standards for residential dwellings.

@MrOldhoot 3 жыл бұрын

I'm currently having my roof and dormer cheeks re-tiled, the property is semi detached so the dormers are up to the party wall. The job has still got to comply with building regs so I guess the roofers should be fitting fireboard behind the new battens? They seem unaware of this requirement.

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

So this is a tricky one. Re-roofing obviously needs to be done correctly, but it isn't "notifiable work" whereby a building inspector comes round to check it. Because of this, they can re-roof it however they want and it won't be checked by anyone. Perhaps ask them to add the fireboard?

@MrOldhoot 3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder They will self certificate so I will get a formal approval when it's done. I shall bring it to their notice tomorrow (Monday). I'm sure they should be doing it as they have to upgrade insulation where inadequate and are supposed to ensure there is a firestop over the party wall amongst other things like eaves vents etc. The dormers were built many years ago before this requirement and conformed at the time.

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

That's a great idea - and if they're formally bringing it "up to code" then they absolutely have to put the fireboard in there. They may try to claim that the plasterboard and skim provide 30mins fire rating, and that is true, inside the room, but the fireboard is to protect from fire on the outside of the building. It should be; OSB layer, Breather membrane, fireboard, batton and tile.

@MrOldhoot 3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder Thanks for your excellent honest video and help. Although I think I'm right in saying, if one is re-tiling more than 25% of the roof area it is notifiable, maybe it's more than 25%. From my experience getting quotes for the job it seems a lot of builders are unaware of this. It's required mainly to bring insulation up to a better level. If there isn't adequate over ceiling joists below then they should upgrade that or put celotex between the rafters. Although I maintain the celotex between rafters is a total waste of money if there is a loft void as the wind blows through the eaves vents and negates any benefit. Who wants to pay to heat the loft void. It seems there are quite a few grey areas with building regs. Incidentally my 1930's roof was a total strip to the rafters as old concrete tiles were laid over feather edge boarding without a DPM. 38x25 battens now required although the old feather edge was in remarkably good condition. Concrete tiles were worn away by moss and general aging. I've gone for a smooth Redland clay this time as moss doesn't like smooth clay so much.

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

@@MrOldhoot more and more as I post these videos, I'm finding that keen DIYers spend longer and make more effort researching regulations than typical builders! Great effort mate, and thanks for supporting the channel

@Craigo5000 3 жыл бұрын

Wow. I'm going through this exact same thing. I'm using 9mm Enviroboard rated for 67 mins. Tiles come off tomorrow!

@Craigo5000 3 жыл бұрын

Also, I would have thought the felt would also come off so it goes Studs/OSB/Fireboard/felt/battens/tiles.

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

I think technically they should have done it that way...! The building inspector was happy enough though thankfully.

@Craigo5000 3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder that's good to know. It's been good watching your progress and dilemmas as I'm living the same life. Keep up the good work 👍

@TheToolnut 3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder So to clarify the fire regs in your area, all the internal slabs need to be fire rated pink board??

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

Any wall within 1m of the boundary needs to be fire protected inside and outside to stop fire from spreading in either direction. The master board is fine for 30 mins fire protection outside. The plasterboard and skim give a 30 minute fire protection inside.

@stuartturbo 3 жыл бұрын

Oddly Medway had me do that as far back as 2011 and I wasn't even on the party wall

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

It's amazing how much it can vary across different districts/building inspectors!

@PeakyBlinder 3 жыл бұрын

No counter battens, that's not good, When you batten on close boarding you are suppose to counter battens it, Your membrane must be over the fire board, where does the moisture go that penetrates through the membrane, that is so wrong

@trevormadden4301 Жыл бұрын

Ya. School boy errors

@alexwalker9803 3 жыл бұрын

we opened up our living room amd hallway about 2 weeks after Grenhall and the building regs guy rejected it because the master bedroom window was 5mm too narrow

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

That is an absolute joke! Sorry to hear that mate. Thankfully my BC is really reasonable, but they can make life very uncomfortable if they want to.

@alexwalker9803 3 жыл бұрын

We replaced the windows 12 months later anyway but was an are you kidding me moment

@open-yours-mind 2 жыл бұрын

i was specify to put supalux..and that is so expensive..

@tristanedwards1340 10 ай бұрын

Can’t you install the fire board on the inside

@OfficeBoyBuilder 10 ай бұрын

You need protection from inside the property AND outside, in case the fire starts out there.

@AndrewSmith-bb8sh 3 жыл бұрын

Just saw this..... I used to have a loft conversion business. Cant tell you how many companies setup doing lofts nilly willy without fully understanding the regs. Let’s face it the regs should be the minimum spec, love the blag about grenfell tower tho. What can we expect when there is no real regulation in the building trade about who can setup a business. Bit of advice because your seem like a genuine guy, stop sub contracting to them. Find someone like Robin Clevett!

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

Robin Clevett is an absolute legend and I'd be lucky to work with him! I'm a keen DIY'er and helped the company who I contracted to do this work...it's not my day job or main living.

@AndrewSmith-bb8sh 3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder Anyone working for Robin would be lucky! To be fair your work that you do is very good, I like watching your videos. Also that loft company you sub for don’t seem too bad. My main issue is the lack of regulation in the building trade compared to gas and electrical trades. People spend a lot of money on lofts and if it goes wrong they can have their lives ruined. I worked in Perth Australia and to build out there you need a Licence, college for 4 years I think. Just wish our country would do something similar. Anyway keep the entertaining videos coming.

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

100% agree mate, it can be the wild west out there! The company I subbed for provide a 10 year certificate on their lofts, which is pretty good, given that there's no requirement for them to do so. And they actually stick to it, they have been back to a couple of places they built even after 8 years!

@stephan5673 3 жыл бұрын

I'm doing same job at the moment, But I was told to put cement board on And then membrane over it.

@OfficeBoyBuilder 3 жыл бұрын

I think that's best practice...we got sign off because the fireboard was there, but in subsequent jobs we've done the cement board first and then membrane after.

@andyisaac3063 4 жыл бұрын

Im surprised the building inspector didn't pick up the lack of air flow on the hanging tiles??

@OfficeBoyBuilder 4 жыл бұрын

I had a whole discussion with him about this, it's a bit of a grey area in the regulations. Tiles have pretty uneven sides, which means there's a lot of air flow around them all. Especially when you consider there are the batons behind them, keeping them away from the felt and OSB. This is exactly why we needed to add Fireboard to the side cheek of the Dormer, to mitigate the chance of fire spreading sideways. I'm not overly sure what else you could do to make them more breathable? I've not seen anyone do, or specify anything extra to what we did.

@andyisaac3063 4 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder were asked to add an additional counter batten on the outside of the felt to allow continual air flow behind the tiles and battens, it gets finished with a stainless perforated mesh to stop insects etc.

@OfficeBoyBuilder 4 жыл бұрын

Wow that's full on! A probably quite fiddly to do. It's amazing the amount of disparity between building inspectors; council vs. private, and then also how some of them are so stringent on what the SE has specified, and others take a view on what's reasonable and let you get on with it...

@Daemiex 4 жыл бұрын

u needed a lift up with the lightest material known to man?

@OfficeBoyBuilder 4 жыл бұрын

Lol that stuff's slippery! True enough, it is light as, but it's also really bulky, and we had 2 storms back to back which made it really windy

@paolomarani7957 4 жыл бұрын

Ha...ha...ha...ha.......LOL.

@jayburton9878 4 жыл бұрын

Hi mate. Looking at the front of the dorma now the corners are off its looks like theres a course of tiles that out of gauge. There meant to lap tje tile below and the one below tjat and i can see one theres a course were its missing the 2nd tile

@OfficeBoyBuilder 4 жыл бұрын

Hey mate, could you give me a rough timestamp in the video so I can take a look? Cheers for the heads up!