Thanks for watching and good luck!

Glad you liked it!

Thanks for watching! Yep, as crazy as it sounds, you should be keeping a time card for yourself.

Thanks for watching! No, short haul drivers are still technically subject to the 60/70 hr rule, though it’s really difficult for law enforcement to enforce since all we have for these drivers are time cards, which don’t have to be kept in the trucks.

@@Trucksafe You rock. Thanks again. I recommend these to people often.

Thanks for watching! In your example, as long as you don't exceed the 150-mile radius more than 8 times in a 30-day period, you technically don't even need to use an ELD on the days you exceed the radius. You could instead use paper logs. But, I know many carriers and drivers voluntarily use ELDs in those cases to be safe. The violations you listed are ELD-related (e.g., not having an ELD instruction sheet, not having a supply of blank paper logs, and not transferring electronic logs). In your situation, I would argue that the violations are incorrect because you weren't required to use an ELD in the first instance since you were exempt. However, I have seen similar violations in situations where drivers and carriers voluntarily use ELDs. The best you or your carrier can do is file a DataQ appeal of the violations to try and get them removed. Hope that helps!

@@Trucksafe Awesome! Thanks.

@@Trucksafe Kinda falls back on that old DOT rule about lights: Every light on the truck has to work, even if it isn't a required light. Apply this to the ELD, and... yep. That's how the DOT man thinks. Point is: NEVER install more equipment than is absolutely necessary to remain compliant and do your job safely.

If you qualify for the short haul exemption you don’t need to purchase an ELD.

Thanks for watching! If you qualify for the short haul exemption, the regs don’t require you to carry any hours-related paperwork with you in the truck. They just require your carrier to keep the time records at its principle place of business.

@@Trucksafe Got it. One last question if I may. So let’s say I’m driving through some DOT Scales and they pull me in, and I’m certain I drive only within the 150 air radius mile. And CHP Ask for my e-log book or electronic log What do I tell them and how can I prove it to them I’m within the 150mile radius??

You don’t have a regulatory obligation to prove to them that you’re within the radius. They’ll usually ask you where you started and where you’re going and that should be the end of it.

@@Trucksafe Thank you.

Yes. Thanks for watching!

L.A to Vegas is about 270 miles! That's beyond Short-Haul exemption. Looks like you're going to have to follow FMCSA HOS regulations. Can't drive past 11 hours, and cannot be "On-Duty" past 14 hours. If you had planned this route early on, you could have used the 8-2 or 3-7 split, and make it back without possibly incurring any violations or... If you you were driving, and notice that you are on your 11th hour, I'd suggest pulling over somewhere quick; truck stop, rest area, and put in your 10 hour off-duty/sleeper birth break, before incurring a violation to you or your carrier.

If you stay within the confines of the short haul exemption, you are exempt from the ELD requirement even if you haul hazmat.

Yes, there is no restriction on the use of the short haul exemption for hazmat drivers.

Under the federal rules, both groups of drivers would be subject to the substantive HOS rules, including the 14-hour rule (i.e. can’t drive after the 14th hour).

150 air miles equates to 172.6 road miles, so you’d be cutting it close on that move.

That’s true…and a good point in this example. If the 170 miles is accounting for the trip around Lake Erie, then he’d probably still be okay. I find it’s easiest to use the straight line distance calculator on the desktop version of Google maps to draw a straight line out from the starting point. Thanks for watching!

If you qualify for the short haul exemption, you’re technically exempt from the ELD requirement. You can use it voluntarily if you want but we recommend you put an annotation on your log each day that says your are short haul exempt. I believe some ELDs have a short haul exemption setting. The 14 hours under the short haul exemption starts when you start working. In your example, that would include driving from your home to the shipper.

​​​@@Trucksafe So where would the driver add the annotation? Off-Duty > Personal Coveyance? Then input your annotation, and then just start driving? What about at the end of our shift.. Do we go back into Personal Conveyance, stop it from running. Then click on "Off-duty" and call it a day? Or would we need to annotate "End of Shift" somewhere, before selecting "off-duty" for the day.

Yes

Correct but there’s also an hours component to the short haul exemption. You can’t exceed 14 hours of working between each 10 hour off duty break under that exemption.

If he qualifies for the short haul exemption, then that’s true for DOT purposes.

What if i end up working 9 hrs do i have to take a 30 min lunch? I qualify for short haul exemption in every other way just time on the clock varies from day to day

If you stay within the short haul confines (time and distance), you are exempt from the 30 min rest break for DOT purposes

Yes, you are technically still subject to the underlying HOS limits (except the 30 min rest break). That said, without logs, it’s difficult for anyone to tell how many hours you’ve actually driven.

Agree, but keep in mind that short-haul drivers are still subject to the 11-hr driving limit, so the most they can drive a CMV during those 14 hrs is 11 hrs.

Understood so the drive time is then based on an honor system?...if lets say DOT pulls a driver over or he or she have an accident when they are lets say at their 12hrs since they punched in their time card in the morning and are not running ELDs or paper logs because they are exempt from having them could the driver when asked how long he or she has been actually driving"theoretically" say he was held up at loading and has only been driving 9hrs?

Correct. Very difficult to enforce.

WHY ARE SH DRIVERS NOT REQUIRED TO TAKE A 30MIN BREAK ? THANKS.

Yes. The short haul radius doesn’t stop at state lines.

Hello! Yes, you should have a paper log on days that you go beyond the 150 air mile radius and would have to show that log during a roadside inspection. As a practical matter, it’s difficult for officers to know whether or not you have exceeded the scope of the exemption more than 8 times in a 30 day period, so it’s more likely to come up in the context of a carrier audit than roadside.

@@Trucksafe thanks a lot.

I believe also that if you did get pulled over for a roadside inspection, the safety inspector would want to see current, and 24/hrs - previous 7 days of logs.

Yes

@@Trucksafe yes to which, I gave two options lol. Love the channel btw. very helpful.

Works across state lines. Thanks for watching!

And an FYI I have to keep the schedule and brakes are included but as the state grows in population traffic is measurably worse month by month and my brakes are burned up I am behind the wheel for literally 11+ hours out of the 13 hour day.

Yes. As long as you work 14 or fewer hours a day and stay within a 150-mile radius, all your company needs to keep are the daily time cards.

@@Trucksafe so I don't have to do the 60/70 hours ... and for sure if you add all the driving for a week .. it's probably not even more than 30 hours in 7 days ... and can I do 14 hours everyday? with no day off? Thanks

The short haul exemption that we’re discussing is just an exemption from the ELD/logging requirement and the 30-minute test break requirement. So you are still subject to the 11-hour driving limit and the 60/70 hour rule. So I’m your example it sounds like the 60/70 hour rule would be the biggest problem, but remember that rule just prohibits you from driving a CMV after accumulating 70 hrs in 8 days. It doesn’t prohibit you from continuing to do non-driving work beyond that time limit.

@@Trucksafe Thanks so .. basically I can have 100 hours work payed .. but 60 hours driving in 7 days?

This job that I want to go in .. is pay per hour .. so as long as I don't drive past 11 hours a day, and not past 60 in 7 days? I should be okay to get payed 80 90 or even 100 hrs?

Interstate drivers are limited to 11 hrs of drive time per duty shift.

Try this tool: www.calcmaps.com/map-radius/

I got another question I work within 150 Air Miles delivering propane can my job take 30 minutes from me for break time and do they got to pay me those 30?..

If you’re regularly exceeding the 150 air-mile radius (more than 8 times in a 30 day period), you should be using an ELD to track your duty status.

@@Trucksafe Thanks

But What if u have an older truck and your Exempt from eld can I use paper logs if I’m going pass the 150 air miles ?

Yes.

True, but they actually have their own specific exemption called the driver salesperson exemption. The short haul exemption is a little broader. A lot of last mile delivery drivers qualify (e.g. Amazon, UPS, etc)

@@Trucksafe thanks for clearing that up. i work at 7up so i was curious.

Yes, short-haul drivers are still subject to the substantive HOS limits including the 60/70 hour rule.

@@Trucksafe we use a time clock, they automatically subtract 30 min for a lunch break after 6hrs. Trying to figure out if the 30 min counts towards the 70. Say I clock in a 4PM and click it out 4am, its 12hrs but only get paid for 11.5 Worked 6 4p to 4a. Comes out to 69 working hours. They said I went over 70 because I didn't add the 3hrs from my lunch

Only on-duty and driving time counts against your 70-hour clock, so assuming your lunch breaks are off duty, they wouldn’t count.

That said, the interim off duty periods do count against your 14 hour driving window/short haul limit.