Dragon Ball Super COPIED Dragon Ball AF?!
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3 жыл бұрын#DragonBallSuper has certainly had a mixed reception but has given Toyotaro, the pupil of Toriyama, to test the waters with creating new villains like Moro, Goku Black as well as Zamasu...but have we seen these characters before in some way? Today we discuss in great detail as to HOW #DragonBallAF laid the foundations for a lot of things in Dragon Ball Super and ask whether Toyotaro (AKA Toyble) needs to let go of AF and instead focus on the future of #DragonBall with brand new ideas. Dragon Ball Super COPIED Dragon Ball AF?!
MUSIC - Bruce Faulconer Medley/Dragonball Z - Rob Tando • Bruce Faulconer DBZ Pi...
This video is about how Dragon Ball Super copied elements from Dragon Ball AF.
• Dragon Ball Super COPI...
• Dragon Ball Super COPI...
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@MasakoX 3 жыл бұрын
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@bladerbeast3396 3 жыл бұрын
@@rafakoroza268 that what if would be weird
@stephenquinn7931 3 жыл бұрын
What if Master Roshi raised goku?
@reunorgaming 3 жыл бұрын
Smashed the like button Masako X 👍
@prinnyEXE 3 жыл бұрын
Like your what if stories, super being a better connected "what if" of the original AF. What if toriama told toyble hey I like your story, but I want you to make it better.
@stephenquinn7931 3 жыл бұрын
@GHZ J2391 it's 2:57pm right now in the uk and Ireland
@nicwoolfe3885 3 жыл бұрын
Oof yeah...how happy Toyotaro must’ve been when the Manga got to Goku Black, only to realize “Evil Goku team up with Evil Kai? This’ll be a cakewalk!!!”
@Amplifymagic 3 жыл бұрын
He definitely helped make the original story with the editors.
@Amplifymagic 3 жыл бұрын
@Airock the Great lol not as a whole when talking about the arc. Evil Kai & Evil Goku? We’re clearly talking about elements that are related that have nothing to do with just the basic connection to an evil Goku body snatcher.
@matthewhernandez8342 3 жыл бұрын
@Airock the Great Who is going inside my son?!?!
@lapplandkun9273 3 жыл бұрын
@Airock the Great goku black was the evil goku trope every fan wanted. Turles only lasted for one movie
@lapplandkun9273 3 жыл бұрын
@Airock the Great nice of you to assume what I even want, because evil goku is a completely cliche trope and stupid. I didn't want him. But Super decided to just fanservice every fan with transformations and villains with goku black
@TaeSunWoo 3 жыл бұрын
Toriyama: the man who forgets Toyotaro: the man who remembers too well
@polarispm 3 жыл бұрын
its prob not but i can only hope this was a doctor who reference
@etam8099 3 жыл бұрын
@@polarispm you think?
@chazzt.k6576 3 жыл бұрын
A lot of information has been lost over the years as to how Toyotaro created this AF. Xicor isn't his character. Many of the ideas like SSJ5, Broly returning, etc, were fan ideas within the community for years. What made it so impressive was how he worked all those ideas into a cohesive narrative. He managed to capture Toriyama's style so well that it really felt like a canon continuation. Not just the art, but the characters interactions and HUMOR. So many artists get so caught up in cool action scenes they forget about one of the most important aspects of the show. It's still one of my favorite doujinshi's and part of my own headcanon with regards to GT.
@astraldirectrix 3 жыл бұрын
It’s perhaps Toyotaro’s ability to combine concepts and ideas into a cohesive narrative that helped land him the position he has now. DBS manga chapter 66 is one such example.
@yinbrown6212 3 жыл бұрын
Xicor and AF are major cringe. fan series of DBZ mostly suck
@brandonakira6810 3 жыл бұрын
@@yinbrown6212 I thought I was the only one who thought that. Especially the ones that wanna be canon
@yinbrown6212 3 жыл бұрын
@@brandonakira6810 yeah dude, they’re just bad lmao and ive checked out a fair amount of them but i will say the multiverse tournament one is my favorite by far, some of the interactions are exactly how i would want them to play out-worth the read.
@brandonakira6810 3 жыл бұрын
@@yinbrown6212 I've actually read a couple pages on a dbz Instagram page various times throughout the years. It does look interesting and well drawn. And the multiverse tournament aspect is dope
@TheBigAyland 3 жыл бұрын
"She stole his genetic information" I mean, if that's what you want to call it
@thunderlordabove420 3 жыл бұрын
Took his blood not sperm 😂 maybe read the manga before you say something stupid 😂
@TheBigAyland 3 жыл бұрын
@@thunderlordabove420 Lighten up and take the joke. I know it meant Goku was cloned. It...
@thunderlordabove420 3 жыл бұрын
@@TheBigAyland still not everyone will think that's what u meant sorry for how I said it
@soundrogue4472 3 жыл бұрын
She should've just called it bed wrestling and I'm sure Goku would've gone along with it
@tyy799 3 жыл бұрын
@@thunderlordabove420 maybe understand a joke before you make a stupid comment😳
@gokubread2733 3 жыл бұрын
Ah the legend of Dragon ball AF, we never had an ending for that
@valentds 3 жыл бұрын
drawn by toyotaro, the guy just needed to continue af instead
@chuviis3508 3 жыл бұрын
I mean there's Young's AF manga which has an ending.
@ShadowEclipex 3 жыл бұрын
Let's have Toyotaro put DB AF into Heroes!
@onyxt3589 3 жыл бұрын
Youngjijii's version (the one with ize) has an ending.
@gokubread2733 3 жыл бұрын
I am aware that the other dragon ball af has an ending
@singletona082 3 жыл бұрын
Can we have this shin? Mom: no we have shin at home Shin at home: *the useless sod in super*
@ojpickle5923 3 жыл бұрын
Shin should have stayed fused with kibito and actually trained like maybe even get the elder kai to unlock his potienital
@matsurivirus1814 3 жыл бұрын
@@ojpickle5923 kibito*
@Bezaliel13 3 жыл бұрын
@YUME The Mighty Guy Guess we cannot blame Toyotaro for Shin though.
@mds_516 3 жыл бұрын
Actually manga Shin is far better than anime one. In the anime he comes across as stupid since he's used to have exposition given to the audience, while in the manga he at least is shown to be knowledgeable about his job, and the way Toyotaro handled him during the Goku Black arc is probably the best proactive Shin we've ever seen imo.
@maadtee6281 3 жыл бұрын
Now meerus is the new shin
@1v1meinpackettracer86 3 жыл бұрын
Finally, someone else is talking about this
@markstriker925 3 жыл бұрын
Yep the title is a hot take.
@callumcrane241 3 жыл бұрын
Wait what? When did that happen?!
@thewfresno1390 3 жыл бұрын
I thought he was the writer of af?
@chozentrini5350 3 жыл бұрын
@@thewfresno1390 he is
@dr7226 3 жыл бұрын
I mean it’s to be expected it’s the same guy writing for the same series
@conermos 3 жыл бұрын
I think it is unfair to Toyotaro. His fan ideas and execution was so good it became official media. Every fanboy dream. What if R&R became official media.
@rikkisan1 3 жыл бұрын
His thing didn't become "official media", he just got hired by the official people.
@drnebulae7578 3 жыл бұрын
@@rikkisan1 Which he then added his fan ideas into an official media.
@rikkisan1 3 жыл бұрын
@@drnebulae7578 with mixed results
@drnebulae7578 3 жыл бұрын
@@rikkisan1 But he still added his own fan ideas into official material. Doesn't really matter on the reception.
@joshuaswart8211 3 жыл бұрын
@@drnebulae7578 Umm . . . I think the reception is pretty damn important.
@blacksmoke6292 3 жыл бұрын
This was a issue that was addressed surprisingly late in the community, lol.
@LavaCreeperPeople 3 жыл бұрын
super didnt copy dragon ball af at all for example, was the ToP in AF? freezer saga? battle of gods? universe 6 tournament?
@blacksmoke6292 3 жыл бұрын
@@LavaCreeperPeople I'm pretty sure we were just referring to the Goku Black arc. ._.
@Koraxus 3 жыл бұрын
Goku Black saga is basically a mashup of DBAF and DBEX-Apocalypto
@KingNexusMOCs 3 жыл бұрын
Right?? So late that I'm shocked I'm not the only one who thinks so.
@CJ-qv4sd 3 жыл бұрын
Ultra Instinct + Super Saiyan 4 = Super Saiyan 5
@matthewtambunan7827 3 жыл бұрын
@ESparda A.K.A.悪魔の死神 What do you mean? Its a joke
@joaolucasnascimentoleite2831 3 жыл бұрын
that was a good one kkkkkk
@matthewtambunan7827 3 жыл бұрын
@ESparda A.K.A.悪魔の死神 Good pun bro
@chrissadler6459 3 жыл бұрын
@[ C A K E S ] but I'm just saiyan..
@rohanabc2361 3 жыл бұрын
Super Saiyan 5 _ super saiyan 4 + spirit bomb = Ultra instinct
@drnebulae7578 3 жыл бұрын
I'm happy he referenced his own fan manga, utilising scenes that could be used in the official material would be amazing to see. Especially since Toyotaro being a Fan.
@THE_KIRYU 3 жыл бұрын
Masako:"Corporate needs you to find the difference between these two pictured" Pic. N.1 = Dragon Ball Super Pic. N.2 = Dragon Ball AF Me:"They're the same picture"
@devilfromhell8546 3 жыл бұрын
ah that iconic meme
@LavaCreeperPeople 3 жыл бұрын
no
@DrakeDragonSpark 3 жыл бұрын
Every time I see the words "Dragon Ball AF", I inadvertently read it as "Dragon Ball as F***".
@bryceelischer819 3 жыл бұрын
Oh. I legit thought that’s what it stood for lol
@PolarPhantom 3 жыл бұрын
ME TOO Thank god it's not just me.
@MHF013 3 жыл бұрын
Dragon Ball April's Fools
@DrakeDragonSpark 3 жыл бұрын
@@MHF013 That's what I always assumed.
@humanman9920 3 жыл бұрын
me too
@GorillaWolf2099 3 жыл бұрын
This wouldn’t be the first time don’t forget In Xenoverse 2, Mira absorbed Towa and Tokitoki's egg and also look Drastically similar to a SSJ5
@ProjektTaku Жыл бұрын
eh, he just looked like white ssj4, but that's just because he retains his white hair whenever he has a "super saiyan" transformation. He didn't have the long hair of ssj5.
@chumpchangedrawscomics5907 3 жыл бұрын
You know it's impossible to plagiarize yourself, right? Personally I think that the quality of this work speaks for itself considering it got the man the actual job.
@superlombax1561 Жыл бұрын
I remember in school and college that they said that could in fact be the case. But then again, American education bad, so take that how you will.
@a3as Жыл бұрын
I wish he would credit David Franco for his inspiration to Toyotarou's dragonball af
@sawkchalk6966 3 жыл бұрын
An odd series with some stand out moments. That's honestly DBS in a nutshell
@aarongallardo3684 3 жыл бұрын
I hope the "concept" of ssj4 will be made somewhat canon in the futurw db series.
@silverboltscrapper 3 жыл бұрын
it's possible with DBS Broly's wrath state being incredibly close to SSJ4 already
@zettovii1367 3 жыл бұрын
If SSJ4 does appear in future Dragon Ball series, I wonder if it will still be known as "SSJ4" or be named into something else... As it literally could either appear in the exact same way as in GT, or get the Broly treatment.
@ProjektTaku Жыл бұрын
it already was. Wrathful is cannon ssj4.
@gregkareem9824 Жыл бұрын
No
@FearfulDivine 3 жыл бұрын
Enjoy your thanksgiving masako
@MasakoX 3 жыл бұрын
You too! Filly and I are doing a little one for fun.
@misters6749 3 жыл бұрын
Masako-San. How much fun can one actually have considering the circumstances? Are you living in one of those heavily locked down areas?
@LavaCreeperPeople 3 жыл бұрын
hi zamasu
@kokroughtoss1257 3 жыл бұрын
Masakox: I'm sorry to say, but Xicor comes off as a deviantart character to me. Me: To be fair, he was created before Deviantart began its OC craze. You could say, he's the original OC. Precursor to the OC. He's THE OC.
@excrementgaming7764 3 жыл бұрын
He was the first of an entire generation.
@yinbrown6212 3 жыл бұрын
the form is so ugly oml
@HowlingDoom 3 жыл бұрын
>Original OC I guess you never heard of Sonichu
@Honestlynothingelse 3 жыл бұрын
@@HowlingDoom Wth is a sonichu
@HowlingDoom 3 жыл бұрын
@@Honestlynothingelse Look up who Chris-chan is.
@MedaMatchaElite 3 жыл бұрын
Happy Thanksgiving from me to everyone in the DB community! May you all feast as a Saiyan would on this day!
@LavaCreeperPeople 3 жыл бұрын
whats saiyan
@Shyruni 3 жыл бұрын
I think my main critique with this whole argument is that while some elements are certainly similar, it's ambiguous as to whether characters like Zamasu were actually because of Toyotaro. The similarities are interesting, but I have to wonder if all of these were actually his doing, or Toriyama's, or Toei's, or even if some was a coincidence.
@matti.8465 3 жыл бұрын
Also all Dragon Ball AF tells us is that Toyotaro likes the Kais as characters, him doing the Zamasu arc is not ripping off his manga, it's him exploring ideas he thought needed to be explored, same with 17's return.
@masonx3376 3 жыл бұрын
Ya know, I really preferred Young Jiji's AF overall.. Toyotarou's was alright but, it is at a disadvantage to not being finished, although I'm not sure how it would finish.. Super is in a weird place right now, honestly I forgot about Toyble/Toyotarou's AF.. this is really close lol
@BojackDaAlien 3 жыл бұрын
young jiji did copy all akira designs and drawing and scenarios from arc 20 to 40 and more
@desertsandfly2277 3 жыл бұрын
Young jiji's version also had its flaws. Like making Confusing DBS references which left plot holes as why they couldn't use SSG or blue to defeat the dragons. I still liked how he treated goten and trunks much better than toyble.
@ProjektTaku 2 жыл бұрын
@@desertsandfly2277 I disagree. Goten feels more like actually what a grown up goten in dragon ball would actually be like in toyotaro's AF.
@a3as Жыл бұрын
@@BojackDaAlien who copied david franco's "super saiyan 5" drawing that started all of this dragon ball af fan fiction stuff
@joseystrife8780 3 жыл бұрын
I don't think I have any room to judge considering how I'm still holding out hope for the return of GT in some form or capacity
@johnfulcher8448 3 жыл бұрын
you have no room to judge and deserve to be waterboarded
@johnfulcher8448 3 жыл бұрын
@@MVShadow-ke2ho not as toxic as liking GT
@johnfulcher8448 3 жыл бұрын
@@MVShadow-ke2ho Gt is still garbage and is only liked by manbabies and sexually abused orphans
@joseystrife8780 3 жыл бұрын
@@johnfulcher8448 and your just a trolling hater which makes you far worse
@johnfulcher8448 3 жыл бұрын
@@joseystrife8780 I've made peace with that, the only thing worse than GT would be sonic the hedgehog fans
@ihavenonamestilldonthaveon8970 3 жыл бұрын
So...you're saying that Goku black and Zamasu are ripoffs of Xicor and the Kai. Wow...
@scifiguy9000 3 жыл бұрын
Except Western Kai in DBZ was never shown to be evil, and was a victim of Buu's rampage.
@jadenbryant9283 3 жыл бұрын
@@scifiguy9000 he was referring to af kai not canon kai
@johniidear9857 3 жыл бұрын
I think it's important to note that Super's basic plot points were decided by Toriyama, with the anime team and Toyataro left to fill in the gaps. So some of these things might be more coincidental than "Dragon Ball Super is a direct rebirth of Dragon Ball AF."
@GTdba 3 жыл бұрын
Your speech on Resilience hit a soft spot in my heart. After all is also thanks to your Channel, Masako, if I decided to pick up my oldest fanmanga a remake it from scratch. It was cringy, poorly drawn ( I am still improving more and more) but it had something that kept me from letting go and I thought about it every now and then. I think I must thank you. Again. Thank you for kindrering my resilience!!
@yahsworld2940 3 жыл бұрын
Back when Toyatoro knew how to draw necks...
@godman1117 3 жыл бұрын
Why do you have so many interesting vids? I keep clicking before I can finish😱
@josephcarr1482 3 жыл бұрын
Toyotaro did dragon ball AF you cant copy what you did but but but he did not originally make SS5
@LupineShadowOmega 3 жыл бұрын
That part, no writer throws away work. If anything you put it away, rework it and try to use it if you can.
@josephcarr1482 3 жыл бұрын
@@LupineShadowOmega that speaking some truth I 100% agree , i mean Toyotaro got picked for a reason so im sure he is not ashame of his work but i also do think its back to squeeze in your old idea into new work just reinvent you old idea into something new
@matti.8465 3 жыл бұрын
@@LupineShadowOmega Yeah, AF was basically him telling the Dragon Ball ideas he's always wanted to tell, there's no reason why him innovating in those concepts is a bad thing.
@chazzt.k6576 3 жыл бұрын
@ That isn't true. Both Jiji and Toyotaro were inspired from the original "AF" Tablos fanart. Neither of them created AF. Just had their own takes on it
@josephcarr1482 3 жыл бұрын
@thunder key not gonna lie i do have a hard time believing that , im say it not true just sounds weird
@loleo123 3 жыл бұрын
I personally liked the design of Xicor. But his personality, race and dialogs were all kinda cringe.-
@alphawolf7417 3 жыл бұрын
I do agree it's cringey, at least in execution. But i feel like there is a lot of potential with the ideas him and other creators have. Sadly i think the Goku Black Arc failed at it as well.
@loleo123 3 жыл бұрын
@@alphawolf7417 Yeah... But I think the idea behind the Goku black arc was better. It had a better concept. And the Rose form is actually AMAZING! And the fact that Zamas was a Kaio Shin makes the Kaio's relevant... FINALLY! But where it all fell flat is the same reason I lost the enjoyment of reading the Manga "Bleach". Both had the inherent problem of trying to "one up" the "one up:er". One person gets stronger and the other gets stronger again, and then it just repeats for faaaar too long. But in the Goku black arc it was more: "I HAVE A PLAN"... -Plan fails. "I HAVE ANOTHER PLAN" -Plan Also Fails... Repeat.
@alphawolf7417 3 жыл бұрын
@@loleo123 yeah. There was also the case of NOTHING getting explained. What is Trunk's new form, why does Black just get to skip to Rosé, the hell is up with the scythe space rift thing, why is Zamasu SOOOO much stronger then most other Kais, why is Goku insufferabley stupid in this arc, why does immortality turn Zamasu into an evil cloud? These just ruined the arc for me.
@loleo123 3 жыл бұрын
@@alphawolf7417 I htink you could get away with the "Rosé skip, Schyte space rift and Zamasu's strength." Since I think it's just to skip the whole introduction to speed up the pacing. But the rest... Yeah. They make no sense.
@alphawolf7417 3 жыл бұрын
@@loleo123 i mean I'd prefer explanations on that over Goku and Vegeta losing and retreating 3 times. Seriously that 2nd trip was pointless except to explain who Black was....which could've easily been explained in the 1st trip there.
@goatgeta6549 3 жыл бұрын
Also I’m pretty sure he was the one who wanted Broly to be canon because he included Broly in AF
@cryamistellimek9184 3 жыл бұрын
It’s obvious what was seen in him and why he should write super, the fact that he keeps tien in the background because he’s never allowed to do anything.
@herobizarre6010 3 жыл бұрын
Now here's an interesting what if. What if Xicor teamed up with Zamasu?
@techramancer 3 жыл бұрын
Xicor Rosé
@LavaCreeperPeople 3 жыл бұрын
________if this is anime DBS, xicor would get massively outclassed in everyway and get clapped easily even in rose form, zamasu gets sealed. anime dbs is just on another plane of power if this is manga DBS, then it would go differently because everyone is significantly weaker. for example, perfected ssb going up against zamasu whereas in the anime he stood no chance
@jadenbryant9283 3 жыл бұрын
@@LavaCreeperPeople well do what they did with Broly make him stronger
@LavaCreeperPeople 3 жыл бұрын
@@jadenbryant9283 yep
@ale-xsantos1078 3 жыл бұрын
Oh yes Frieza's mommy Zamasu and her new son Xicor Black
@HiPHOPx87 3 жыл бұрын
Yep. Inspiration
@FantazmoGoricohh 3 жыл бұрын
Man youre so good at talking to a camera. I wouldn’t be able to do that😭 amazing video btw.
@JakeSmith-mq5dc 3 жыл бұрын
I did really like his take on Goku Black because it felt like a more refined and polished Xicor whose rough personality contrasted Goku's gentler personality, like the Saiyan's savage nature was taking control over the body. An interesting take on an evil Goku. Meanwhile Anime's Goku Black feels like a more refined and polished Turles which feels more natural coming from a Kai inside of Goku's body.
@JDubs1464 3 жыл бұрын
Read the title, immediately went “Evil Kai? Angered by mortals?”
@ernie4795 2 жыл бұрын
Yes, mortals are annoying.
@Eric-gp3hi 3 жыл бұрын
This is interesting information about AF and Super. Happy Thanksgiving Masako!
@randallellison6421 3 жыл бұрын
Your video makes alot of sense Masako! I also agree that the scene with Pan and Bulla going super saiyan just rub it in on Vegeta had me chuckling too, but my favorite image was the look on Trunks' face, that was the money shot for me! I mean seeing his 10 year old sister doing that and him having this "I AM SO SCREWED!" look on his face was priceless! But yeah, explanation of that among others had me scratching my head too! Have a good Thanksgiving!
@mrowley7300 3 жыл бұрын
Do you reckon this is the reason that some of super kind of missed the mark, because he wanted to bring his ideas to the forefront?
@charmatic_yt2195 3 жыл бұрын
I remember even in 2009 about Super Saiyan 5 and how me and my friends had a huge argument about it’s existence.
@Badalight 3 жыл бұрын
2009? Lol. Try 2000
@Gashnaw 3 жыл бұрын
I still have an issue with SSJ3, and it is actually canon
@LavaCreeperPeople 3 жыл бұрын
ss5 is fan made
@zacharygregory1764 3 жыл бұрын
I totally didn’t know that the kai’s were fruit
@PolarPhantom 3 жыл бұрын
And considering how Kais act, it's easy to assume they reproduce the Mortal Way, what with Elder Kai being... Elder Kai and Supreme Kai of Time/Chronoa expressing admiration for the male form. I wouldn't be surprised if they could in fact do the deed and reproduce in that way, but the children would not be "real" Kai. I mean, they're gods. You can make up all sorts of heck.
@Keegstar 3 жыл бұрын
@@PolarPhantom yeah! Maybe the first kais were made from trees and every now and then a kai gets born but they can still reproduce
@alphawolf7417 3 жыл бұрын
@@Keegstar me and my friend were actually making a story based on that concept.
@ernie4795 2 жыл бұрын
,@@alphawolf7417 I like the idea of reproducing in both ways.
@yoshidracos.a.1125 3 жыл бұрын
What about Dragon Ball Multiverse and Dragon Ball Super? There are multiple similarities as well.
@crowing3886 3 жыл бұрын
Then add db heroes an then you have the same argument lol
@ArcticTehWeirdo 3 жыл бұрын
I always thought the whole tournament thing from DBM was based off of universal survival/tournament of power....
@Pinklaeti75 3 жыл бұрын
@@ArcticTehWeirdo DBM debuted in 2008, though. If anything, it’s DBS that borrowed the idea of a multiversal tournament.
@ArcticTehWeirdo 3 жыл бұрын
@@Pinklaeti75 oh, I didn’t know that, but still, very similar!
@LordProteus 3 жыл бұрын
The Universal survival tournament was probably inspired by Dragon Ball Multiverse.
@morel5018 3 жыл бұрын
Fun fact: Originally, the blue transformation was going to be white (as the UI) but Toriyama decided to do it blue because it would be too confusing when he had to fight Zamasu. So yeah, this makes super even closer to the last drafts of AF where (spoilers?) Xicor goes SSJ 5 whith the white hair and it's supposed that Goku would do the same thing
@ndiaz1982 3 жыл бұрын
What if, in GT, goku stayed and trained in the time chamber until he became an adult again?
@savaged49 3 жыл бұрын
Still I would love to see the shadow dragons done again in super. With the dragon god zalama being a thing could be very interesting
@andreatrenbeath8983 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you so much for putting this together! I was so curious about Toyotarou's DB AF doujinshi, but apart from a few articles about the characters and gist of it, I didn't know what it was all about. This was very comprehensive, and it was fascinating to see how some of Toyotarou's early, original ideas continued to have an influence on Super.
@ernie4795 2 жыл бұрын
Still love Xicor.
@a3as Жыл бұрын
dragon ball af was originally by david franco and toyotarou "stole" the trademark name dragon ball af without crediting him.
@Rain593 3 жыл бұрын
Since we have this video covering Toyble's AF, can you do a video covering YoungJiji's AF?
@TheRealWipper 3 жыл бұрын
Well this video definitely had my eyes rolling all the way to the back of my head lmao
@crystalballstudiostm2355 3 жыл бұрын
Hey Masako, great video but could you perhaps turn the music up just a bit. Everytime I read the text "Music by" and wonder "Where is this music?"
@dylanvanhise503 3 жыл бұрын
Okay I definitely think some of your points are stretches, also I don’t think it’s bad to rework some of your own writings anyway.
@RATLANTIS 3 жыл бұрын
There are a few things I don't agree with here; it's not fair to blame this for Goku's stupidity in Super; that's Toriyama's doing. He wanted Goku to be more like he was in the original series, after he got Supermanified in DBZ. Also, the "7 Super Saiyans Recharging the Dragon Balls" thing being too much like SSG? That's unfair- there was a *very* similar ritual in GT. And then saying that 17's refusal was Toyotaro shoving his own plot points in the story makes no sense either. Toriyama wrote the notes and sent them to both Toei and Toyotaro, who then make the anime and manga respectively. Since both the anime and manga hav a reluctant 17, it's safe to assume that Toriyama wrote that into the story and not Toyotaro. Good video overall, though.
@youtubecyan7061 3 жыл бұрын
Ngl I like toyotora's work but I don't like his version of AF I prefer Young Jijii's take I never liked Xicor that much
@wolfherojohnson2766 3 жыл бұрын
You and me both brother
@SlickSkuddy 3 жыл бұрын
What’s that one called? I’ve always heard about AF but there was another one that people talked about that I could never remember the name of.
@youtubecyan7061 3 жыл бұрын
@@SlickSkuddy it begins with Frieza's son and they all have to fight him they all lose but I'm pretty sure he get's hit with the blitz wave and turns ssj4 and then ssj5 out of pure rage
@SlickSkuddy 3 жыл бұрын
@@youtubecyan7061 wait so they’re both called AF? There’s two versions?
@SlickSkuddy 3 жыл бұрын
@@youtubecyan7061 that plot sounds familiar too I think I saw like a fan animation on it or something
@AntiHeroMedia0 3 жыл бұрын
Your videos help me sleep and deal with my bad insomnia
@SilverSSJyt 3 жыл бұрын
I actually been telling my friends this for the longest glad u made this into a video
@larmock2399 3 жыл бұрын
Ah yes, my favourite series, "dragon ball as f*ck"
@Danielsworlds 3 жыл бұрын
I mean the entirety of the super anime is basically just what if Dragon Ball Multiverse but Cannon.
@LavaCreeperPeople 3 жыл бұрын
no
@suvojitbaidya7470 3 жыл бұрын
You are great dude. Keep going ❤️
@rodrigomarcondes5857 3 жыл бұрын
I also wanna add that in his drafts for volume 5, Vegeta is able to switch transformations in each strike against Xicor, something that he does against merged Zamasu with super saiyan god transformations
@KingKeanuTheFirst 3 жыл бұрын
The very concept of Roshi dying hits me as much as Jiraiya's death, I'm crying, what's with these masters and their ability to engrain themselves into my very being.
@stproducciones9140 3 жыл бұрын
Oh yeah. I remember back in 2009 or so reading a mexican blog that talked about the "plot" of AF, and the first Saga was supposed to be about an evil goku. Almost a decade later, we got Goku Black. The blog also mentioned some old villains coming back and fighting in the afterlife alongside our heroes, very familiar.
@DethaneGames 3 жыл бұрын
I thought we heard Masako actually swearing for a second had to do a double take 🤣
@8BitPreston 3 жыл бұрын
I really wanted AF to continue. We was honestly left at such a cliffhanger. It’s a shame it never saw the end of its first and only arc at least. I hope that one day this can be adapted to a future arc of Super and of course implement characters like the new Broly over the old one in a good way. Toyo is getting a too wrapped up in his past. They should allow him to realise his vision if only for an arc, allowing him to move on and create something new that’s fantastic.
@blackight6845 2 жыл бұрын
Same :/
@ernie4795 2 жыл бұрын
@@blackight6845 Time flies.
@EvanSol919 Жыл бұрын
Is there a place to read this?
@onearmedbandit4538 3 жыл бұрын
I’m close to 30 and I found the af picture years go I thought if was a myth never new that I was a fanfic
@Glenningway 3 жыл бұрын
I feel that maybe Jiren was inspired from Xicor's nigh-invincible power.
@SpardaAlucard1 3 жыл бұрын
Is it copying if you are stealing from yourself?
@MasakoX 3 жыл бұрын
It's copying in the sense that you're just reusing your old stuff and not innovating. We believe that Toyotaro should let go of the past and not rely on AF for story beats.
@guycrew3973 3 жыл бұрын
@@MasakoX it could be his way to make his original story kinda canon in a way
@medicdroid1 3 жыл бұрын
If you turn in the same essay you wrote in college for two different classes you can get in trouble for plagiarizing your own work. So yeah you can copy your own work.
@SpardaAlucard1 3 жыл бұрын
It's nice to see growth and honestly, I think Toyotaro would benefit if he was allowed to cut loose with his own manga unrelated to Dragonball. He could stand on his own and not live in Toriyama's long shadow.
@guycrew3973 3 жыл бұрын
@@medicdroid1 I didn’t say what he’s doing is good he can and should move on super seems weird because he’s trying to put do much references to af he should move on
@kakarotthesupersaiyanwarri130 3 жыл бұрын
I'm not trying to be annoying but when are you going to make what if Goku never hit his head part 2 please
@MacVerick 3 жыл бұрын
This was really cool. I thought i knew about everything DB but i had no idea about this.
@Shift_Salt 3 жыл бұрын
I like how he tried to bring in everything Dragon Ball had established at the time, even if it was movie stuff or filler. And honestly I think what he was doing with Broly was pretty interesting, and in a way it shows that regardless of how you went about it trying to explore that character more could lead to some interesting things. The "New" stuff like Xicor really doesn't come off well but even then we can't say much about it since it's unfinished material. He clearly tries to hold onto this project and incorporates it however he can by taking bits and pieces but in a way that's understandable. It's frustrating for an artist to just let go of something entirely just because their current position provides them more opportunities. In a way he's fighting against what he's wanted/now has and where he used to be and the things he created back then. Hopefully he can find his peace as an artist and continue to work on this series he truly loves in a satisfying way for everyone involved.
@christopherlitzner8445 3 жыл бұрын
I remember finding so many fan made dragonball stories from 03 til 07. And I saw a lot of stuff in super that was in quite a few of the different fan made stories. I enjoyed reading some of those stories back then and thought they would be good continuations.
@moonboicosmic999 3 жыл бұрын
I would really like you to review Youngjijii`s version of DBAF. Unlike the original, it's finished and I think it's like 15 volumes? I think it would be pretty interesting to see your opinion on it.
@gamerjeyofficial 3 жыл бұрын
My “WHAAAAAAT?!” level was over 9000!
@IlliterateSage 3 жыл бұрын
Masako, as a wannabe author (finding an agent is hard), I must say that the first few minutes of your speech summed me up in a nutshell. You could not be more right. Best of luck with your book! I'll read it for sure.
@zhaolang1215 3 жыл бұрын
Sooo....Goku got Talia Al'Ghul'd
@ernie4795 2 жыл бұрын
YES!
@kizuuwu7563 3 жыл бұрын
12:19 just sounds like something straight out of DBZ Abridged
@JJ_R 3 жыл бұрын
Happy Thanksgiving, Masako!
@MasakoX 3 жыл бұрын
You too!
@08415 3 жыл бұрын
im just surprised this wasnt noticed sooner, especially since many of us were aware of AF way before Super even existed
@Fractorification 3 жыл бұрын
I remember hearing so much about AF back in my mid-school years in the mid 2000’s when broadband Internet was becoming more accessible. That’s when I caught a glimpse of SSJ5 and whatnot. Never knew there was a fan manga though. Might have to check it out sometime. But, I agree. Toyotaro really needs to leave his ideas in the past. However, I wouldn’t go as far as to praise him for Goku Black’s concept or Super Broly’s creation as we have no clue what when behind the scenes and who did what. What we do know is that Broly was brought back at the request of executives because of the character’s popularity, and Toriyama himself said he rewatched the old Broly films to reimagine and design the new one. Toyotaro has nothing to do with that, at least until some source confirms it. So I wouldn’t pat the guy in the back for everything unless it’s confirmed, that’s just me.
@Trujones 3 жыл бұрын
Damn it was loooooong ago when i would print out DBAF pictures at the local library and show friends at school.
@inactive-ot9mj 3 жыл бұрын
I saw the title and instantly thought of The Mortal Instruments's *very infamous* Harry Potter fanfiction origins.
@pirotessc1811 3 жыл бұрын
I need link to that manga, anyone please ?
@JoelRiter 3 жыл бұрын
1998. That’s how long. Since I was 11. Now I’m 33. Maybe I will have to write that story. I don’t know. Either way that intro REALLY TRIPPED ME UP. THANKS.
@Sean-rv5yp 3 жыл бұрын
Bro I wasn't even born when you had that thought
@seang7578 3 жыл бұрын
Getting my popcorn for this one 👀
@Andyf1069 3 жыл бұрын
I've gotten so used to the Super canon that going back to AF and seeing a story that takes place after GT is quite jarring
@BlackThane 3 жыл бұрын
whole video made me realize, we never really had big bad female
@artemiostriantafyllou7986 3 жыл бұрын
We almost had 18, but then she quickly got replaced by Cell.
@felipe_drawmania1604 3 жыл бұрын
There's was that girl Shadow Dragon In GT,I don't think she lasted long.
@jantheking7028 3 жыл бұрын
I don't trust either Toriyama or Toyotarou with writing a useful female character. Kefla is the closest thing, but her powerscaling is so wonky that it makes me dizzy.
@felipe_drawmania1604 3 жыл бұрын
That's the type of realization that led to the creation of Android 21.
@TheRealZXXZ 3 жыл бұрын
we did, its called Episode 89.
@freezasama5802 3 жыл бұрын
Well masako toyatoro is the one who did the manga art for DBS so it kind of makes sense
@ArnulfoSalgado 3 жыл бұрын
...literally what he says in the video, constantly
@bobbymiczobby 3 жыл бұрын
I just watched the final chapter of Dragon ball Af, and almost cried
@asteleus2252 3 жыл бұрын
I think this makes sense for the most part. But I feel like Toyotaru's extra world building is something we have all been craving for a long time, I disagree that it's overcomplicating things. I also don't think it's necessarily a bad thing he is reimagining his original ideas and adding them to super. I am sure MUI came from SSJ5 and I love that
@XNightwolfX729 3 жыл бұрын
I would like to see a super version of xicor down the line. Doesn’t have to be the same origin or anything but something similar
@ernie4795 2 жыл бұрын
I defenily love the idea of a Saiyan Kai hybrid for a weird reason.
@linksnivey1161 3 жыл бұрын
Can you do a "review" of YoungJiji's version? I know this channel isn't a fanfiction reviewer one, but I do think Jiji's stuff is pretty good and could maybe have some more interesting analysis.
@Zmods64Modding 3 жыл бұрын
There were some special chapters toyble made on his af. Like why is tapion training under the ancestor he also made an explanation on gt ending.
@sharakujr.khalil9043 3 жыл бұрын
7:31 thought you were gonna say "never wanted to rule anything but the buffet table."
@ihavenonamestilldonthaveon8970 3 жыл бұрын
Happy Thanksgiving man.
@onetnecghoti3473 3 жыл бұрын
the shadow dragons referred to as Ryu'Kaioshin was pretty cool
@IAmMightyMike 3 жыл бұрын
I'd love to see you talk about DB Multiverse (the fan manga)
@ultragodzillafan 3 жыл бұрын
Did Toyotaro have any input on the creative decisions for the anime? I thought he only wrote the manga based on a rough outline from Toriyama.
@JohnnyTightlips2007 3 жыл бұрын
So I'm guessing Dragon Ball Multiverse is next at some point? I heard you were playing Goku for the show in 2021.
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