Will Oval Chainrings Make You Faster? The Science

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Will Oval Chainrings Make You Faster? The Science

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Күн бұрын

Do oval chainrings improve performance or are they just another bike industry gimmick? Today I’ll be jumping into the science on oval rings to answer this question. I’ll also touch on what company makes the best shaped oval ring, will oval rings save your knees, what types of riding potentially benefit most from oval rings and whether or not they screw up power meter readings.
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Пікірлер: 416

@DylanJohnsonCycling 4 жыл бұрын

Have you ever used oval chainrings? Do you think they helped your performance?

@Funbot15th 4 жыл бұрын

Oval chainring causes rear derailleur to move twice per crank revolution. Any idea on what power loss is there?

@dralexbrothers 4 жыл бұрын

Yes I only use oval (Absolute Black). I started in 2011 after I required a significant knee surgery following an injury. The round chainrings where giving me lots of knee pain on the surgical knee at the top of the pedal stroke. As soon as I went to the oval 'no pain'. Just as you said LOL. However I did go back to round for a few rides with no pain a few years ago. I do find the oval better on the mountain bike especially in the technical climbs. So I went back to oval. Anecdotal I know.

@jeffreythree 4 жыл бұрын

Biopace on the road, ditched them because round felt and shifted better. absoluteBlack oval is on one of my MTB's, can't tell much difference with gears in the back but I also run it single speed with a tensioner and it definitely helps with traction going up hills at a low cadence.

@mrnobody9821 4 жыл бұрын

Oval chainrings saved my knees, now I can ride again! Just like you said!

@DylanJohnsonCycling 4 жыл бұрын

@Funbot15th for rotor rings the rear derailleur movement is almost that of a round ring and it isn't too extreme with other designs either. If there is there is excessive derailleur movement this may be costing you but I don't know how much.

@nopets 4 жыл бұрын

Oval chainrings boost my performance, but only when used with Beast Mode Power Enhancer in cupcake flavor.

@Piklzzz 4 жыл бұрын

this is like the best cycling training related channel

@1835dueber 4 жыл бұрын

if it's just like the best, which one is the best?

@aerojetrocketdyners-2538 4 жыл бұрын

@@1835dueber For me, Fastfitnesstips and Hambini= The mechanical part of cycling (Aerodynamics, *Bearings* ,rolling resistance etc...) Dylan=The training and physiological part of cycling Norcal Cycling and Lantern Rogue= Race analysis and race tips Vegan cyclist and Jasper verkuijl = Life of a cyclist Nationsnumber1beast= Shattering my dreams of winning a big P/1/2 race.

@jamiesutto 4 жыл бұрын

I've ridden them. I have had a catastrophic knee injury (semi pro soccer) and i noticed less patellar tendon pain. Also, my ACL,LCL repair was a hamstring tendon graft. I found that the round rings caused more hamstring cramping. Sure this could be placebo effect; personally i love placebo effect since the side effects from a dose of placebo are nil.

@rodhirejab 2 жыл бұрын

No wonder i can ride better nowadays. Had the same injury. Haven't complain about knee pain after changing to oval since then.

@veganpotterthevegan Жыл бұрын

I have a good 250k miles on oval rings. I bought a fat bike to get through Wisconsin winters and I thought all the gear and cold would make me not care about the rings so I used it as is. Never had any knee issues on the bike until a few long rides on the fat bike. Switched over and they went away in a couple rides.

@JT-bj1nx 4 жыл бұрын

I love that everything you post up here is based on actual research. Thanks for taking the time to sift through all of those articles for each of your videos.

@twowheelsandcroissant 2 жыл бұрын

he's like the Hambini of human performance in cycling :D

@javifsr 4 жыл бұрын

My experience with Q rings using them in mtb for a long time: The feeling of pedaling is more "round", more natural, more even during the stroke. The traction in very steep and very technical climbs is noticeably better. About the studies of power, I think that there is no way to test it properly as the subjects would need quite a long time to "learn" to pedal with them, and by then, you don't know which other factor could be affecting a maybe marginal gain. P.S my way of pedaling tends to be more towards low rpm and off the seat

@brauljo 4 жыл бұрын

I don't think you need more than 10 minutes to learn how to pedal with them, my first experience with them was with an all road bike. On pavement they felt so identical that I forgot they were oval, then I went onto some grass with tree roots. I thought I was going to stall because I was going very slow and forgot to change gear, and yet I was able to push on.

@TrailBreaker 4 жыл бұрын

I don't spin up climbs so oval helps me stay on top of the pedal stroke and ge over stuff. I swapped one to my singlespeed and it was amazing😀👊

@littlegoobie 4 жыл бұрын

@@TrailBreaker that's my next experiment. I didn't think it would work without a chain tensioner until someone somewhere said it can work depending on the ring used.

@littlegoobie 4 жыл бұрын

This was my experience with them also. It completely evened out the power input needed to just ride. I rode on ovals for a long time, then I went back to round rings and, wow, it felt like a bit of struggle in comparison for the same amount of work performed. If you don't think ovals take out effort/work, tell that to a compound bow user after they switch from a recurve.

@TrailBreaker 4 жыл бұрын

littlegoobie yeah it may be a bit loose when between power strokes but a retention device could fix any drops

@davidking3699 4 жыл бұрын

Oval chainrings saved my knees... now I can ride again... Don't take that away from me... I am going to keep using them... Do I win the prize for being 'that comment' guy?

@prettyargonnitrogensodium8952 3 жыл бұрын

🤣🤣🤣

@JasonHenderson 3 жыл бұрын

Oh look it's that guy

@sepg5084 Жыл бұрын

@@lesterroberts1628 it was a joke...

@shred3005 4 жыл бұрын

I’m using Absolute Black as the small ring (but sticking to round on the large ring) of my road and gravel/ adventure bikes for climbing. When under load for low-mid cadence climbing it feels smoother to me. When not under load e.g. easy pedaling on the flat, the oval feels odd but as soon as load comes in it feels good. I’ve never tried oval on the main (big) ring

@jeffbarber8481 4 жыл бұрын

I’ve used rotor qrings on the road and both rotor, absolute black, and sram’s oval on the mountain bike. All my mtb’s are 1x so shifting isn’t an issue. The main benefit of oval rings that I’ve found (on road and mtb) is seated acceleration is better. When mountain biking, being able to burst from the saddle helps maintain traction. I have felt no difference between the rotor, sram, or AB oval mtb rings. On the road, I generally prefer them during the winter when doing base. I seem to time trial better with the oval. And I treat those rides as long no coasting time trials. However when crit season comes around, I don’t like them for all out sprinting, seated bursts / accelerations = yes, but in crits you have to leave the saddle more. When in a full sprint (nose out over the front wheel) I find the oval comes at a weird position in relation to the hip that has moved forward significantly in the sprinting position. But I have bridged up to several breaks with a quick snap, and strong seated acceleration using the qrings. On a weird note, I find when I switch back to round from oval, I have a short period where I feel stronger. Like the oval rings where weight training my legs?? Power meter difference was ab 3% overstated. I tested on the Tacx neo and had my quarq going to a separate computer.

@rimtism123 4 жыл бұрын

I use oval rings. I don't think I'm faster at all but I feel like I'm simply more comfortable from the pedal stroke feel.

@thedistance1155 3 жыл бұрын

Oval is good for uphill ans trails

@Slycarlo 3 жыл бұрын

@@thedistance1155 yup, they're much easier to pedal imo. I ride most of the time in rough roads and trail daily i lived in rural and i used my bike as a second mode of transport 34T oval seems easier to pedal than a 34T round specially when uphill.

@gregcavanaugh6259 4 жыл бұрын

Dylan, I just wanted to say thanks for making this content. I went to an Education Conference this weekend where several complaints of professors were that their work is trapped behind a paywall making scientific journals only accessible to other professors which then leads to misinformation to the general public. I couldn't help but keep thinking of your channel where you use your expertise to funnel through the scientific literature and disseminate it to the public. Not sure if the literature you use is public or private, but I think more channels like yours across a wide variety of subjects would do wonders for the "pseudoscience/fake news" public of today. ...or maybe these professors should publish the results of their studies on KZfaq!

@analbumfromhell1842 2 жыл бұрын

I'm a bike messenger and one of my colleagues gave me his cargo bike with oval chainring for a day. I had never used oval chainrings and after a day of using it, I realized that it really uses my leg muscles differently. At the end of the day I felt as if my legs were falling apart, but when i went back to my cargo with round chainring after work I didn't feel as if my legs where falling apart. There is also a huge difference in bike movement when you accelerate where oval fells more steady, but round has that kick. The gearing was pretty much the same on both bikes, difference was that he had 44t and I had 42t chainrings, but my cassette was starting with 11, 12, 14, 16, 19 and his with 12, 13, 15, 17, 20 sprockets.

@ktmcourtney 4 жыл бұрын

I shared a lunch with a current top european pro team rider & this question came up .. He said... " Chris Froome gets€5 million a year or something to ride them, but it they actually even gave 1watt power extra we'd all be on them" :)

@JonathanFisherS 4 жыл бұрын

My physics intuition says they can't increase your average power, but merely smooth the delivery, increasing creature comfort

@adventuresona700dollarhard5 4 жыл бұрын

So moral of the story: Ride with oval chainrings for one year, switch back to round and have your best year ever. ✔

@ameersk3223 4 жыл бұрын

Man, you are on of the few KZfaqrs that really have useful content. Thank you!

@JosephDowski 4 жыл бұрын

I use them but not so much for performance reasons. I have nerve damage in my right leg where I can no longer pull up my toes at all. The condition is called "drop foot". I read alot of Steve Hogg's bike fitting on folks with drop foot and among the suggestions he makes are to run shorter cranks, mid-foot cleat positioning, & oval chainrings. While I don't have true mid-foot cleat positioning, I do have them as low as they go (away from toes). I'm running 170 cranks. The main effect this all has for me is to help eliminate the dead spot in my pedal stroke where I'm coming over the top. I never had consistent good luck with shifting on double cranks & now run 1x on my gravel bike where the ovality is a non-issue.

@edrcozonoking 4 жыл бұрын

although anecdotal...I find that when climbing steep slopes I do not loose traction as easily.

@johnsuarez1404 2 жыл бұрын

I love the way you talk and script. Easy to understand, concise, no bloat

@Shouldbeeasier 4 жыл бұрын

I wasn't going to mention it but...Oval chainrings saved my knees and now I can ride again.

@wazzup105 4 жыл бұрын

Well at least the science doesn't show a DIS-advantage to oval chainrings, so if you like them.. go for it. (If I would switch to a one-by setup I might consider it, just for fun)

@davel2119 4 жыл бұрын

wazzup105 Exacty what I did! Been riding for 50 yrs. but I’m probably too old to feel the difference. 🧐

@deverenfogle3201 4 жыл бұрын

I don’t think they would be testing the correct thing that make it a “disadvantage”, one example of which is the inconsistency in torque transfer throughout the pedaling stroke. When going over certain obstacles on a trail some people like to know that regardless of their foot position, they can eek out the same torque. Thus, allowing them to clear the obstacle. With oval that continuity of potentially needed torque doesn’t exist.

@turbo38t 4 жыл бұрын

I am a singlespeeder and used the AB oval in 17 and went back to roubd in 18 and now switched to oval again. I can bot answer the power question but two things I notice on SS is that climbing traction is definitely better in loose, techy stuff. Also, medium cadence around 70-85 seems smoother but over that it rpm it seems the same to me where the bounce cones back(maybe this is showing my pedal inefficiency. For the record I often ride the road to and from my local park on my ss(7 miles each way) and I noticed this running 34/19 and 34/16. Thanks for all these videos. I really enjoy them.

@noahhalbfoster6892 4 жыл бұрын

love my Ovals have used Q-ring and Absolute black love the Absolute black best never going back to round

@AlicanteTrailCam 4 жыл бұрын

I've used them for years, I just like them. Re the Tour De France. Carlos Sastre won using Q Rings in 2008, his team, CSC, were sponsored by Rotor. Some of the riders used Q Rings, some used round rings made by Rotor, it was all down to a riders preference.

@mikehawk1341 4 жыл бұрын

Lets see, larger lever when you have more power in the pedal, smaller lever when you have less porwe in the pedal. if you can tune the position of the ring to balance your force peaks you are smoothing the stroke and thats a good thing. used qrings many years

@carlosflanders518 4 жыл бұрын

I did a dozen cx races on a 40T rotor Q-ring. Definitely didn't go faster, felt that it held me back on the fast sections where I couldn't put down high cadence power. However, my legs felt amazing afterwards. Muscles were very fresh and I had a lot of spring in my step.Might be good if you're doing a duathlon or a stage race. Could be due to not activating all my muscles and hence limiting power output. This is very sensitive to ring orientation, I found but didn't want to investigate further as my performance was going backwards.

@TDZed 4 жыл бұрын

Hey Dylan, Great videos. From my very little experience on oval I can tell you I'm sold on them but only under certain circumstances. I did some personal testing on my Tacx Neo trainer over the winter and did notice a power benefit. I do a lot of long climbs on Rouvy where I spend 30 to 60min at 90% FTP and relatively high cadence so it was perfect to test oval. I tried Rotor and AbsoluteBlack and found AbsoluteBlack the better one for me. The biggest thing I noticed right away was less muscle fatigue (less leg burn), I was able to hold the same power for longer, vs. round, which translated into higher nominal power for long climbs. My overall FTP did not change. It was neat as it felt like I had a smaller chain ring, so made it a bit easier on the climbs. If anyone want's to try it, I would encourage just swapping out the inner ring where I think you'll get the most benefit. And, it won't affect your shifting! Shifting was terrible with AbsoluteBlack and SRAM eTap.

@JonFairhurst 4 жыл бұрын

When riding round rings, I switch between pushing “vertical power” and circling with more “horizontal power.” When I first switch to horizontal, my power goes up, levels off, and I then fatigue. I go back to vertical for a bit, rest the smaller muscles, and then go horizontal again. Using those two systems works well for me. I tried Absolute Black rings. They put me more into a single mode (vertical) and my power numbers (at the hub) didn’t show significant improvements. Shifting and setup are more fiddly. I wanted oval to work, but round is best for me. I could see how some vertical mashers might prefer them though.

@deverenfogle3201 4 жыл бұрын

Jon Fairhurst this is the exact disadvantage I explain to people, too. There’s no real advantage to oval, but there’s certainly a disadvantage. It puts your pedaling stroke in one mode.

@JonFairhurst 4 жыл бұрын

Deveren Fogle - One advantage could be smooth pedaling up rough, steep terrain. This might be especially good for newer or less skilled riders, or riders who naturally mash the pedals. (I’m not saying that I’m skilled, but I have a very steep ride home. For the first two years it was hard to pedal smoothly and manage traction on the steepest parts.) But for normal road riding, the benefits are questionable.

@hogdog567 4 жыл бұрын

I started using them to help with a groin injury, which they did but I found a noticeable improvement in my climbing. Speaking to my club mates, I've found that sprinters (like myself) really like them and climbers found they made no difference.

@stevenhamerlinck6832 4 жыл бұрын

After 14yrs on Rotor Q-Rings (I was one of the very first clients) on an MTB: they do help on steep technical terrain. On my road- and triathlon bike, I ride O-Symmetric since 5yrs and they help during climbs, given you maintain a higher then average cadence. On my tri-bike, it helps most since it helps to save my hamstrings and glutes for the small issue of running 1/2 or full marathon after the ride...

@jasonmorgan8101 10 ай бұрын

Have been riding Rotor Q-rings for over a decade. I didn’t test if the made me faster, they did help me not be so fatigued coming off the bike leg in triathlons, helping me run faster, so in the long run, pun intended, they did help me be faster. No knee issues during that time. Rode a set of round rings for the first time this past weekend on a new bike, and my knees were aching at mile 15. Ordered another set of Q rings when I got home.

@matt.eggleton 4 жыл бұрын

My experience with the AbsoluteBlack ovals (used exclusively on my #1 race MTB since 2016) is that "I think" I maintain more even traction at low rpm climbing on loose stuff. As well, I feel like I get into a better cadence rhythm for long stretches (think: rail trail at Mohican). Even if it is true, it's quite possibly a BandAid for less than optimal body positioning and gear selection, as I tend to be more of a grinder than spinner in those two scenarios. I've been riding my #2 MTB (hardtail with round chain ring) a lot so far this off-season and don't seem to miss the oval at all. Not feeling really hard over for either position. In the end, I think this may simply fall into the "comfort yields confidence" category, like saddles and grips.

@erikknudsen4034 4 жыл бұрын

I ran rotors on my mountain bike, round on my road bike for a few years. The ovals just felt more comfortable, so I switched my road rings. For me they really are more comfortable, and I'm usually a sceptic. It's not drastic and I didn't do it for any perceived performance gains. So, just like saddles, go with your personal preference. Just know that you stand little chance of holding someone's wheel if they are using ovals 😂.

@stopglobalswarming 4 жыл бұрын

Did you use them with the largest ring measurement at top of stroke or opposite?

@davidnolting6980 4 жыл бұрын

Yes, i have used Absolute Black Ovals (50t, 52t, 36t) for the past 2 years. i started out as a mountain biker and had a "masher" spin. in the begging i had a hard time pushing a ROUND 52t ring (stock bike part). i switched to a 50t OVAL because of what i hoped it would do. after about a year i began to "spin out" on the 50t and switched to a 52t OVAL. now that my cadence has increased to 95-100, the OVAL doesn't seem to "work" for me. i feel that "dead zone" way too much. even using the 36t up a hill has that "dead zone", unless i lower my cadence do 75. i will also say, sprinting on an OVAL has done me no favors. In the beginning when my cadence was between 50-70, the OVALS greatly helped me stay with the pack and was giving me some good PR's. I personally feel that if you come from Mountain biking, using an OVAL may help train you to have a "roadie spin". i have now "graduated" to a 52t ROUND ring, and i have instantly improved my PR's. i absolutely (see what i did there) loved my Absolute Black Ovals, but it's time to move on to something that fits my spin better.

@TheTinyCyclist 4 жыл бұрын

Man, my video being in this video made this your best one yet!

@ChrisNieves 4 жыл бұрын

I just installed a 34t oval chainring on my cross bike and on the rides on a familiar loop i do and being not in the greatest shape-it made the climbs much easier imo. in the final sprint I cant say i noticed my difference. Ill keep it on there.

@jeroenberger9064 Жыл бұрын

I have been riding both for years and the difference is that oval rings make pedaling easier and definitely helps you climb much easier. Round chainrings cost more energy and make it harder to keep momentum going. Don’t look at all those studies and just try it for yourself. You will be surprised.

@alexandra4334 Жыл бұрын

Helps mtb climbing over roots and at times when you are trying to just get the crank turned over and keep momentum over bumps since there is less of a ‘dead spot’ when turning the pedals over. Like a 32T oval chainring which acts like a 28T or 34T at different points when turning the crank over. The downside is frame clearance limits the size of oval chainring that can fit.

@BlackWaterCyclist 4 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the great video Dylan. I have used them for a few years but after getting my pedal based power meter and seeing how my power zone in the pedal stroke changed tremendously when climbing and standing, I figured that there was no point because I was no longer in the "optimal zone". I believe this is why you see Chris Froome seated most of the time during his hard efforts. I also found that the research didn't support any benefit. So I did away with them due to compatibility issues on some bikes, knee pain, and change in power zone while climbing.

@spencerking7777 4 жыл бұрын

Using an oval ring on my single speed I felt I could use one tooth less on the rear cog. Felt I could get through the 6 o'clock position when pedaling quicker. But like in the one study discussed, you often find yourself pedaling a low cadence while on a single speed.

@xGshikamaru 2 жыл бұрын

While I don't see front shifting issues at all, oval chainrings have a few drawbacks : chains last a little less and the small/small combo isn't really recommended cause it rubs against the chainring during part of a pedal revolution. Also one thing to note is it recruits muscles a bit differently so it takes some time to adapt to them which is something I'm not sure the studies can really account for when comparing round vs oval.

@JonathanFisherS 3 жыл бұрын

Came back to rewatch this a year later, after experience riding with an oval ring. First, _nothing_ can increase your power except training, your equipment can only eliminate losses. Is an oval ring wildly more efficient at transferring power? No, it's likely equal if anything. What about load matching? So think of your whole legs, chainring, chain, transmission and tires as an interconnected torque transfer system. Your legs have the least mechanical advantage at 0 and 180 degrees, and a massive mechanical advantage at 90 and 270. This leads to uneven torque transfer across the pedal stroke. Many commenters, and honest manufacturers like OneUp components, say the only advantage of Oval chainrings is traction because the cyclical torque transfer graph is flattened. By removing the spikes in torque, you are less likely to break a tire loose in a rock garden or slick surface. Your average power remains the same (same work delivered in one full rotation of the cranks), but the curve in the work is delivered is smoothed out rather than having spikes at 90 and 270 degrees. My intuition tells me experienced cyclists subconsciously manage torque output to keep from breaking tires loose with a round ring. An oval ring assists a newer rider with the same skill.

@davidpinnington213 4 жыл бұрын

I’m oval rider - came back to road bikes 3 years back after 20+ years on mtb’s when i bought a TT bike which came with Qrings - did not think too much about it as it was a supplied - until I bought a road bike to go on group rides (hmmm still generally ride solo but it’s another bike) this came with round dura ace rings and I was back to back making more power with the Q rings on my local flat TT course with the oval rings fitted. What hammered it home for me and it’s mentioned elsewhere here in comments is when on my fat bike (another bike) when going flat out (or fat out?) in top gear (35f-11r) there is a real smoothing out of the pedal stroke as that mashing cadence. Placebo? Possibly but I have now swopped all my bikes apart from the emtb to ovals - works for me but osymetric were just one too far when it came to shopping out the road bike rings

@garymartin557 4 жыл бұрын

i have had oval wheels, they slowed me down! marketing.

@happydays8171 4 жыл бұрын

Duh, you should shop for round wheels, why would you buy oval?

@garymartin557 4 жыл бұрын

@@happydays8171 oh dear! it's called irony. I don't believe the hype around oval chainrings, so i made a quip about oval wheels. Metaphorical not literal.

@ketond3973 4 жыл бұрын

I'll buy your oval wheels. Then you don't need suspension. I'm sure they'll roll better over uneven surfaces.

@vanskis7618 4 жыл бұрын

I'd buy that

@168grhp Жыл бұрын

Yes! Thank you for sharing the research and your own personal experience! ...I still might get one though, 'cause I watched another KZfaq video that said oval rings are awesome: "The Little Secret THEY Don't Want You to Know About...100x your cycling ability in 2 weeks!"

@danielcox9850 4 жыл бұрын

I recently added an absolute black to my tall boy, (32t) with sram eagle 12 speed gx drivetrain. I agree that I think most of it's just mental, the biggest difference that I noticed his maybe in the low RPMs and a lot of chain noise. The chain noise itself is why before the race season and I will switch back to round.

@twowheelslater7112 4 жыл бұрын

I haven't used them but about all the faster people I know seem to use them. One thing they do is help get you through the dead part of your pedal stroke easier. Great for if you get caught out in the wrong gear or are just a masher in general. One thing they have said is it helps to even out the power and keep them from spinning out on technical climbs. IDK I will try them at some point. I am either going to replace my cranks on my gravel bike with grx or fit the super compact ovals to it.

@veganpotterthevegan Жыл бұрын

Marianne Vos has Olympic gold medals on the track using rotor rings, on top of the bulk of her road wins. Rui Costa was also a highly successful Q-ring rider so it's not just the osymetric rings that have been used successfully.

@chuckm.5032 2 жыл бұрын

One if the best videos out there on Oval rings!!! Great job!

@330_Crew 3 жыл бұрын

My Strava times at my favorite local trail has not shown a time improvement on my trail bike after switching to Absolute Black ovals. But I did see the ability to drop 1-2 cogs higher (smaller) during climbs and my knees are happier. I like it enough that I just bought another oval for my fat bike.

@andrewnelson3276 4 жыл бұрын

So if all the studies either show an improvement or no improvement I think the better question is why not go with an oval? At least when I built my last MTB, the cost was the same for an AB oval ring as a round ring. No idea if the ring makes me go faster, but the ring definitely improves traction on technical climbs and it feels like it lowers exertion for long steep climbs. Sure, the improvement may not be enough to justify replacing a perfectly good chainring, but when building a bike from scratch or replacing a worn chainring, why not go with an oval?

@DylanJohnsonCycling 4 жыл бұрын

Good point.

@georgehugh3455 4 жыл бұрын

Short term studies didn't focus on disadvantages. Possibly: 1) Poor shifting 2) Development of other pains long term (e.g. Tendency to use lower cadences causing more knee wear) 3) Increased noise 4) Cost differences vs quality of chain ring (IMO, Shimano may last longer and definitely shift better than most other rings) Plus, I have five bikes - to switch over is just an unnecessary expense; $ that could go towards something else.

@njm3211 4 жыл бұрын

Nice objective no B.S. overview. I have a 34 tooth Absolute Black oval on my road bike. It's barely oval LOL. It "feels" comfortable when I use it on my usual steep terrain. Can't really say if it made me faster or more efficient. You really do some excellent videos.

@timurhant469 3 жыл бұрын

I use a 54t 1x oval Garbaruk with GRX 810 and i saw significant change when moving from 50t round chainring. Of course there are other factors 1) Straight chain line for the start of the sprint. 2) Totally 1 piece /closed (no cut out) blade design of the ring and 3) 54 being the bigger ring also being the more efficient ring That said, it reduced my knee strain when sprinting but has 0 benefit during zone 2 training. The effect is more pronounced on my weaker leg, which feel more even in terms of power. And it changed my sprinting efficiency by giving my left leg a bit of help. I still would go with round without reservation. the Oval was not a let down.

@znhendraxxx7523 4 жыл бұрын

as long as sagan use round ring.. i wont use oval ring😂

@franzroast6658 3 жыл бұрын

The problem is... You are not sagan

@donsworthiiiphilpott4897 3 жыл бұрын

Appreciate how thorough your research moves from pros to cons. At 56 years old I'm going to lean on the placebo effect for that edge.

@stevec6232 4 жыл бұрын

I found Rotor QXL and Osymetric work for me. I think pedalling style has a lot to do with if they work for you. They definitely reduce pedalling deadspots in my opinion and if they feel good I'll use them. Probably work better for trained high cadence riders. Adam Hansen said he considered changing teams to use them. My guess is most sponsored teams don't allow it and of course increased risk of chains dropping in racing situations could be a big problem. That's my view anyway.

@robertwhyte3435 4 жыл бұрын

I watched this video a while back and a comment you made stuck with me. You mentioned that the year after you came off the oval rings you had one of your best years ever. I've noticed that round rings feel easier to push after I've been on the ovals for awhile. Could it be that ovals effectively change the gearing, gain ratio, as they go through a revolution so the effect is somewhat like pushing a larger sprocket but at a higher rpm than you'd likely push that bigger sprocket because you get through the dead spot faster. Maybe it results in more muscle or maybe it trains you to push harder where it does the most good. I don't know, but I do know that standing is a bunch easier for me on ovals because I don't have the grace out of the saddle my friends have and round rings feel easier to push after I've been on the ovals in spite of my ovals being 52 and my round rings being 53. I started riding a bike 16 years ago when I was 52 after being a runner up till then and I'm still working it out. Your videos are some of my favorites because you're honest and committed to helping. Thank you.

@leighdean1537 Жыл бұрын

I had a muddy fox in the late 1997 and it had the 1st gen of oval chainlinks that Shimano made. I found that from a standstill, on the take off i was faster than round rings . I found that climbing steep hills and rocky uneven surfaces, that the ease of the task and the performance was better for me, just a easier and less physically tiring for me personally.

@RichardMigneron 3 жыл бұрын

I heard/read somewhere that it's not to increase your power that you should use Oval chainring, but for recovery. The hypothesis, is that since you use your power in the best spot on oval, you get less tired in the spots where you have less power, therefore recovery is faster. That could be an argument when riding everyday or for very long rides. I doubt there are studies on that subject though.

@luiggispeed4081 3 жыл бұрын

So I tested one today after years of procrastinating, I only bought it as a curiosity and I thought I was going to be tossing it after the first test but boy was I wrong!! All I can say is I was smiling from the first few pedal strokes to the end of the ride because the way it feels! For me they are a thing and it's not about power or performance increase, is that the power to the rear wheel gets flattened out instead of coming in waves, it feels more "electric motor-ish", you mentioned the MTB will find more traction and I found that spot on, that's the first advantage I found while doing technical climbs.

@grzegorzkwasniewski5137 3 жыл бұрын

I basicaly watch your videos for the guy with cap and hilarious comments! :D GR8!!

@tgoods5049 4 жыл бұрын

I keep watching your videos and continue to be impressed. Very well researched!

@jbullinga 2 ай бұрын

I've had 10 years of experience with Q-rings and circular rings as an age grouper triathlete (half IM, IM distances). Also gravel biking. On flats, basically no difference. Power output mostly a function of cardiopulmonary fitness and energetics (glucose, fat metabolism). On long hills, power output again dependent on cardiopulmonary fitness. On steep hills with out of the saddle max power effort, oval rings have a clear advantage. Per distance traveled, there is more opportunity to exert power which better maintains speed. On steep gravel hills, there is more continuous delivery of power with oval rings and less gravel slip/spin. On steep gravel hills out of the saddle effort with round rings, there are higher power peaks which more easily leads to slips. In the end, flat endurance races - oval/round no difference. Hilly races - 2x setup with oval inner and round outer is better for speed up the hills. Gravel grinder (5+ hour effort) with steep hill climbs - 2x setup with oval inner and round outer is best to power up the hills and minimize wheel slips.

@tomkruger3496 4 ай бұрын

I switched to an oval chainring a few years ago and I really l like it, especially when climbing. I admit it might be the placebo affect, and if it is, I'll just live with it because it's better overall.

@GeekonaBike 4 жыл бұрын

I'd wager most Single Speeders & Gear Mashers will say they perceive a definite benefit, w/ the provision you install them allowing for the 90 deg offset between crankarm & chain/ring pull point. PS nothing wrong with a placebo if it works

@jthepickle7 4 жыл бұрын

More room for placebo all the time!

@RGCastro7 4 жыл бұрын

Very interesting, Dylan. I use Absolute Black Ovals and I love them. I feel that they've helped me with knee discomfort during and after long climbs. As you said, the studies are limited and some contradict others, but I feel they've helped me and most of the friends who have bought them. Thank you for your considerable efforts and for sharing your knowledge with us.

@augustlandmesser1520 3 ай бұрын

For the test, just place oval in the wrong position (larger diameter parallel to vertical position of the cranks) to see would that degrade your cycling performance. I did, and find a notable difference.

@carstenweiland7896 4 жыл бұрын

That once was called Biopace in the early 1990's my first ATB had those, felt a bit weird but was ok, I do not recall that I missed those when I changed to circular chainrings!

@jacookerbad 3 жыл бұрын

Yes biopace

@davomccranko 3 жыл бұрын

BioPace had the wrong orientation, so they had a reputation for hurting knees. With the modern oval rings, they seem to help the knees

@crazy8sdrums 4 жыл бұрын

I have never used oval chainrings, but I have studied anatomy a fair bit. I think oval rings may help flat pedal riders more than they would those who use a clipless set up. For a rider who spins properly, I don't see much use for oval rings and they may even impact a good spinner's efficiency negatively. In sprinting, it makes sense that oval rings help. Basically, if the rider is just pumping down, right then left, and not following the whole circle of crank duration more, oval rings may help that.

@hots2215 4 жыл бұрын

Love the way you don`t get one side`s hand over another one by your idea... I stick to my round one and save the money on a better power meter :)

@DebonairOnline 4 жыл бұрын

AB Oval 32T on my CX MTB made a world of difference in climbing, makes the power delivery feel so linear rather then choppy. AB oval 48T 1x Gravel on my gravel bike definitely feels rounder but not as much of a difference in climbing to the round that was there before. Still looks awesome.

@k.o.7405 4 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the review, I just install one and I like it, working for me, took away my knee pain and it’s easier in climbing. Did it make me a faster cyclist? No but it made it easier for me to paddle.

@k.o.7405 4 жыл бұрын

Steve King I did go faster, broke some segments on strava. Was easier for climbing. Not sure if it’s the placebo or the chain ring.

@Advcrazy 4 жыл бұрын

I use them, but mainly because I find them more comfortable when in and warp tuck. My highest ever 20min power was set on round rings but there’s only 2w between that and my best on oval rings. I don’t feel like oval rings give me and advantage or disadvantage other than more comfort in the aero tuck when my hip angle is at the minimum. Worth noting that I’ve only used Qrings and Absokute black which I believe have the same amount of ovality. I tried to change back once but pedaling the round rings just felt too weird for too long so went back to oval. Personally, when I’m asked I recommend people stick with round figments for the superior shifting...and because they might not like changing back to round should they choose to

@edgarpereira4865 4 жыл бұрын

I used oval on my moutain bike, they only help when I was 1 gear doing about 40 rpm on a very step climb...

@jasperfontaine8680 4 жыл бұрын

Very interesting video, thanks for making it! I've been using ovals for a while now (i guess they're medium ovality), and yes i _think_ i'm benefitting from them. Two separate reasons: 1. i have a slightly 'varus' left foot, causing my knee to go towards the top tube when pressing the downstroke, which after many years of cycling (even with inner soles and wedges underneath the cleat) caused a lot of knee pain on the inner side. Switching to ovals greatly reduced that pain, and i strongly believe it must have something to do with the more even distribution of force during the full stroke, which reduces the pressure needed on the downstroke. This is only anecdotical evidence of course, hardly scientific. But still, there seems to be a pattern here, judging from the other comments. 2. I know my sprints are bad (my power build-up is not explosive at all), and i have much to improve on my climbing. My long-punch and TT skills are pretty OK though. So i've concluded that clearly my muscles are slow twitch. Since using the ovals, both my climbing (only the small oval ring is needed) and my (even seated) sprinting have improved, while my punch and TT have not suffered. I don't see this discussed anywhere, but might this be a big reason why ovals (anecdotically) work for about half the people and do not for the other half? I can imagine the fast-twtch muscles thriving on the on-and-off mechanic of pushing the downstroke, and slow-twitch muscles being more comfortable during a more even circumvence? Do any of the papers you studied even mention this rather crucial difference between athletes? I'm really curious!

@alextasch8114 4 жыл бұрын

I have owned Qrotor and even go way back to biopace. I have a serious knee issue that just disappears with consistent cycling. I think cycling period is the best way to generate synovial fluid in the knees, which I believe can actually partially patch a torn miniscus etc. Plus I have no ACL in my left leg due to an injury, and cycling has made my legs strong enough to forget about the complete ACL tear and the torn miniscus.

@jameshegeman5660 Жыл бұрын

I don’t think oval chainrings should affect crank- or pedal-based power meters. In other words - if you’re seeing an increase in power with an oval chainring, it’s because you’re *actually* producing more power. Power produced by the cyclist depends only on (i) the force on the pedal, and (ii) the pedal velocity (alternatively, the angular velocity combined with the crank length). Analogously, your power meter does not need to “know” the size of your chainring or gear in order to tell you how much power you’re producing, and similarly it does not need to know the shape of the chainring either. Note that this is not to say that the oval chainring might not affect your power. Just as gear choice affects power output, chainring shape will also affect power output - it’s just that the change in power output is real, not an artifact of measurement.

@whitneypost5590 3 жыл бұрын

It seems to me that all the existing studies have failed to account for variance in rider height, crank length & other bodily factors which control hip angles and the theoretical biomechanical advantage from Oval rings. If you're tall enough and your bike setup is good, and you aren't dealing with trouble in the "dead spot" at 12&6o clock then there may not be much for you to gain. But for all of us under 5'4'' and even taller people with short inseams or those with flexibility issues due to other body shapes who struggle with extreme hip angles / issues getting through the "dead spot" at 12 / 6 I would love to see a study with a specific category like this.

@eteran23 4 жыл бұрын

I'm running the same set of QRings since 37.000km on my road bike. Honestly I don't think they improve any short duration performance much for me. They might be beneficial on longer duration rides of 4h+. I also don't feel a noticeable difference when I switch to my other bikes with round chainrings. However, I feel like they helped me with my knee problems. Even if that's just a placebo it's one worth keeping. Thanks for the excellent video as always Dylan.

@BuexxTM 4 жыл бұрын

Hey Dylan, maybe an idea for a future video. With companies / apps like WHOOP, HRV4Training, Polar (with their watches and straps) getting more and more customers, what is the science of Heart Rate Variability (HRV) as an indicator of training / recovery? Thanks and keep up the great content!

@trbeyond 4 жыл бұрын

BuexxTM agreed. This would be a great topic. Especially since I’ve tried 5 different companies/ products doing HRV and not one seems reliable.

@BuexxTM 4 жыл бұрын

@@trbeyond I just ordered the WHOOP strap after seeing and hearing a lot of their claims. Hope I don't regret it. 😉

@sepiarain 4 жыл бұрын

I am a road cyclist, massive grinder, and I've gone from a 50t to a 50t oval... I ride daily and am very attuned to any small changes in the feel of my ride. Basically, It feels like I'm riding on 46t now, and I can reach higher speeds, climb easier and have an overall faster average speed on my rides. Where a lot of upgrades I've made have had noticeable changes, this is the first upgrade I would describe as a game changed. I chose the absolute black as it had the 5 arm 110 bcd I needed and a narrow wide tooth pattern... if my frame's chainstays allowed for it, I would go up to 52 or 54t in a heartbeat, but this will require spacing out my bottom bracket and I'm not happy to do that. Just to note, I do not clip in, so all of my power is in the downstroke, which is what the oval is designed to exploit. It may not be noticeable for novice riders or an advanced rider who has already worked hard to get the maximum efficiency through the full 360 degree of their pedal stroke. I'd consider myself intermediate, and understanding the levers in my effort is what lead me to wanting to try the oval ring. The difference for me has been completely quantifiable.

@ketond3973 4 жыл бұрын

I went with an exponential chainring and installed my crank arms 6' apart for social distancing. This also greatly improves groin cooling and raises testosterone levels.

@gerardnc 4 жыл бұрын

Again, cutting through the noise with a clear analysis. Thank you Dylan! I'll presume the two thumbs down are from employees of Absolute Black and Osymetric, who were too defensive to listen to everything you said or didn't like that you weren't effusive enough.

@sdhaskell 4 жыл бұрын

Oval on the Epic, Round on the Tarmac.

@wandae6352 Жыл бұрын

I tried oval chain rings I noticed that i was giving it more power than i used to on lower cadence though managable Thus it easier maintain a higher rate of speed than circular rings, Downsidr is when your small ring is circular, You'll always find yourself in a dilemma if you rather use a big oval or smaller circular during a climb,

@gervasebarnes 2 жыл бұрын

Been using Rotor QXL, after a year or 2 just on the Q's QXL are more extreme, I have been riding them for 10 years. I have 9 bikes, 2 with ovals are my fastest, cervelo R3 & S5. I sprint really well, but I also find contrary to what Dylan is saying is that I spin better with ovals, and it feels smoother. Change bikes mid ride to rounds, and feel like part of the stroke is missing. I do and have for years focused on turning around the circle (pedal) for me, I just feel better on QXL. The studies Dylan shows, some say better some say the "same" none say worse

@Tubercyclosis 4 жыл бұрын

Stages power states that their meters read 4-5% high with non-round chainrings. However, my experience on my MTB with an Absolute Black ring was that the Stages PM was reporting about 10% high. Here's a link to Stages' statement: support.stagescycling.com/en/support/solutions/articles/1000158537-can-i-use-the-stages-power-meter-with-oval-or-osymetric-chain-rings-

@Islandstonr 3 жыл бұрын

I ride an absolute black oval ring. With an 11 speed drive train it definitely made a difference in helping me climb and keep power down when I needed it. Not sure if that would of been the case with a 12 speed but in my case it worked in the way it was marketed.

@Queenmania2007 2 жыл бұрын

Great overview, recognition of contributing factors e.g. bias, sample size, blinding, conflict of interest, placebo. It's crucial to acknowledge these off the bat. What might be interesting is to hear your suggestion for what study you would do - in the day of indoor trainers with power meters you'd think there are so many more metrics that can be controlled to produce a more robust and reliable study. Hopefully in years to come. Thanks Dylan!

@jerryx2000 3 жыл бұрын

This man just saved me some money.

@SGTMARSHALL1 3 жыл бұрын

I found MTB triple derailleurs were more suited to more pronounced elliptical rings, Bio-pace work well in fact ( when mounted with correct orientation ) and while you might laugh at 5% gain, over a 100 km ride it means the rider with elliptical rings has time for a coffee or while the others that chose the cupcake protein shake are still finishing the last 5 kms

@Jeff-bd4gg 4 жыл бұрын

I have only ever ridden round chainrings. I suffered a knee injury a year ago that has been slow to heal. I am just now starting to get back into a (reduced) normal cycling routine. Anecdotally, here and many other places, users of oval chainrings seem to frequently praise them. For me the cost to potential benefit ratio was enough that I ordered AB for my mountain bike. I will install it when it arrives and see if it helps.

@ML-lg3hv 2 жыл бұрын

the problem with most of the study about it is that we simply taking people who have several thousands hours of practice on oval chainrings and basically all their neuromuscular system used of it. And trying to see an improving of the performance after few hours of usage

@kovar2344 Жыл бұрын

Most of the peloton is under heavy pressure from Shimano and Campy. So they cant use them. Its not 2005 anymore. I believe lot more people would use em but they simply aren't allowed to. Plus these guys cant risk losing time/contracts getting used to oval. Round simply works and so does Oval. Its not for everyone and not for every race/situation tho. Btw in 2011 Vuelta the whole podium was non-round cuz Cobo had qrings too. And notably Sastre won his tour on em, aka before it was cool.

@MrTeff999 4 жыл бұрын

I used Q-Rings on one of my road bikes for about five years. Switching between that bike and my other bikes, I never felt any difference.

@bryceridesbikes 4 жыл бұрын

Cool to see you repping a family bike shop jersey in the opening sequence! Just stumbled across the video and see a jersey for where I work.

@toddmanley2983 Жыл бұрын

I recently did a test on the same climb (~10* grade) and with identical 5-minute power (397w) to see if there was a difference between round rings and qrings. By holding the power constant, what I did find was a significantly difference power phase (based on the Garmin cycling dynamics power phase definition). With round rings, power began ~19* sooner than qrings in the standard position - it would be interesting to see if there's research to say what degree is optimal for the start/finish of the power phase. This is where I could see the value of the qrings come forward given you can find tune where in the cycling stroke/vector the ovality if focused.

@happydays8171 4 жыл бұрын

More even power through the deadspot. Watts are applied, not wasted at top & bottom dead centers. I have Qrings, and black planet oval, and have noticed, for me, the longer the crank arm (I'm 6'4", have 180 and 177.5 cranks) the more the benefit from oval rings.

@Cicadawee 4 жыл бұрын

If you walk and run daily we know the oval ring works efficiently in cycling, Gravity teaches people to strengthen what is natural to humans that is pushing down your weight. Once the user adapts physiologically on the oval ring, the user ultimately enjoys the difference. Try using the same "Cycling program" on the "Oval chainring" then compare it on your previous Round ring performance. There is a power difference. If you are an Oval chainring user and go back to Round chainring you'll notice a "smoothness" in the round ring but "decrease" in power especially on a higher gradient or simply some uphills.

@DDanksAKADoubleD 4 жыл бұрын

As other have said, I prefer the constant pressure that ovals provide, eliminating the feeling of jumping over the top of the stroke. Surely in these days of powermeters and head units that show torque measurements throughout the stroke this benefit could be quantified fairly easily. Then you have an interesting corollary with the "normalised power" concept, "normalised torque". Round rings will provide spikes in torque, and will require a higher "normalised torque" to provide the same average torque and therefore average power.