Thanks Doug Having 4 d offer of free access online course Hv 2 find time 4 that which am sure will further cocsolidate my fine tuning of yr lectures.Great Meanwhile it wld b more convenient 2 contiiue listening 2 u on youtube postings U know the thing abt buddhism or whatevet isms or religiousity ppl make of it is the buddha s message is not too far off from science.... I mean 4 e.g. like u mentioned based on yr understamdg of the buddha s definition of freewill as compatility determinism i couln t agree more.... Hey thanks again 4 the interest u promoted in us

Doug there is a problem, the current research suggests that Upanishads came much later around 14-16 Century. Also we havent found any actual evidence of existence of Upanishads or other brahminic literature at the time of buddha. It is quite clear Sanskrit didnt exist at the time. So Buddhas description of Nothingness is an original thought to buddha and not something he was responding to.

Great! Thanks empty, I can tell by your name this is a topic that captivates you!

@@DougsDharma there is also shunyata concept in hindu texts

Yes it can get quite confusing. You're very welcome xiao mao! 🙏

Thanks so much I Bhardwaj!

Well, I guess that's one way to look at it! 😄

Thanks Simon! 🙏

Thanks so much Patrick. 🙏

You're very welcome Brian! Thanks for the comment.

My pleasure, glad it is useful to you! 🙏

Cool, my pleasure Les Druides!

My pleasure, Arun! 🙏

Yes, I think the central mistake is to give heuristics and accounting tricks metaphysical or ontological character. We can treat a leopard as an agent making decisions and predict it's behavior in a computationally efficient way, but that doesn't mean that there's actually a leopard spirit floating around in the aether. Similarly we can use counterfactuals to guide our understanding and actions, but that doesn't mean that somehow things really could have been different.

Thanks, yes it's a pretty pattern!

You're very welcome Marcos! Glad you found it interesting.

My pleasure, Arief. 🙏

Many thanks!

You're very welcome chengatang4! Thanks for the comment.

You're so welcome!

You're very welcome Corpus Callosum, the early practice video will be out next week. 🙂

Yes it’s too bad but I’m happy to help out! 🙂

Doug's Dharma do you have any insight on the perfection of wisdom tradition and how it relates to Buddha’s basic teachings?

Hey that's great to hear Noah! Glad they've been helpful to you. 🙏

This two should not be mixed they are totally different..... Shunya and Advait vedant

@@Raj-sc8qs Both concepts can be mixed, in the porridge of the mind. Both of them have many similarities, and both can dance toghether. You can change that slokah of Poornam for Shunyam easily.

@@JayaDevaMusic greg-goode.com/article/from-advaita-to-emptiness/ No they aren't same, kindly read this article

@@Raj-sc8qs why aren't they same ??? And why are they different ?? Bro I have many doubts , will you try to clear it for me

My pleasure, Parker. Glad you find the material useful. 🙏

I was exactly thinking the same thing- infinity minus infinity is still infinity

My pleasure!

You’re very welcome CommonSenseNow!

🙏🙂

🙏😊

You’re very welcome Sid! 🙏

I try my best to be as neutral as I can given the evidence. 🙏

Hindu religion never have teach sunyata. Stop your proboganda What is sunyata do you know

@@kms5750 Siva is Sunyata

@@wladddkn1517 no shiva is black hall

@@wladddkn1517 no shiva is dark matter

Glad it was helpful!

I understand Ratnasagar. I make audio versions available over on my Patreon page. My friend Jon Aaron and I also have a podcast out called "Diggin' the Dharma", but it's more of a relaxed discussion.

Awesome! Thank you and welcome aboard! 😊

You are welcome!

Yes, it all does merge together, depending on how it's interpreted.

You made a good point.

The comparative study of the Āgamas and Pāli Nikāyas is still somewhat in its infancy. Bhikkhu Anālayo has done a lot of work on that front, and I'm always learning from his studies.

@@DougsDharma Yes! Bhikkhu Sujato also did some great work in this area. His book on 'history of mindfulness' was very insightful, although can feel quite condensed.

@@Tusmylon Yes, I did a video dealing with Bhante Sujato's book awhile back: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/jrOklbmAsJqRY2Q.html

Yes, I agree!

That's certainly a reasonable way to understand it handy nas, thanks!

That’s the concept of conditionality, as in dependent origination. I wouldn’t say it’s anything much like a “god” though.

I listed the link where you can see Bhuddadasa's book. He explicitly refers to the law of dependent origination as a 'god' that 'creates' everything in the Universe. @@DougsDharma

Thanks!

I think that would be a misunderstanding.

@@DougsDharma I agree

The simple answer is that they can be understood either way. The Buddha doesn't really distinguish these two interpretations, though he does talk about "contact" with forms, sights, sounds, etc., which themselves would have these three characteristics.

Well it wouldn't have been Hindu at that time, it predates modern Hinduism. Instead it's from the early Upaniṣads. Essentially it's talking about the unity of the self (ātman) with the universal principle of Brahman.

@@DougsDharma Thank you, indeep not Hindu... but part of a tradition that May have more importance than we realized... From emptyness, fullness arrive, the moment we wake from it and see the totality without focusing in the specific. Zero turn into one, and from these, two naturally arrive... I am curious how the ancient sages saw it... zero and one, give us the original diad, from were the World of Brahma appear and it continúe the creative process that is the work of zero... Following the Buddha these give us the poétical manifestation of reality... alaya and samsara... OR so it can be seen that way... Sorry, I forgot to take the medicine... Deep Gassho!

I think it depends on the person and the context. This video is about a meditation on emptiness, so the experience here will be gained through meditative practice.

Yes, and it's also important to become aware of what is most skillful.

I would have to know the context to be sure, but it sounds like a declaration of anatta.

Thanks for the suggestion Ryan. It's a very sad issue. My practice is secular, so I view things like the claimed reincarnations of important people to be more about sociopolitics than anything.

The Gandharan canon includes some material from the early texts as well as some later material. Exciting stuff.

It's something I've considered; I might do so eventually, we'll see! 🙂

@@DougsDharma I'd be the first listener 😊

Yes, thanks George. That's a good way to highlight change.

Beautiful

Yes Buddhist history is fascinating happylum! And there are indeed questions and matters of interpretation every time we consider a translation. Sometimes the translators simply make errors, everyone does. One small point though which is that in these videos what I'm discussing is more "early Buddhism" than "Theravāda". Theravāda dhamma is based upon later teachings as well such as the abhidhamma.

Attributing later texts to Buddha is a classic way to legitimize your work. Likely made up.

Concept of emptiness is present in theravada..i can give you reference

Thanks so much Oliver. It's a bit of a conundrum in early Buddhism how to approach these states of deep samādhi. On the one hand, in his own search for enlightenment the Buddha-to-be left behind the formless attainments as essentially unedifying, as not leading to nibbāna. On the other hand, there are suttas from later on in the Buddha's life when he or others state pretty clearly that any deep state of samādhi can lead to nibbāna if understood and investigated wisely enough. It might be worth my making a video on this conundrum eventually, so I'll write it on the list. I'll be doing some upcoming videos on these sorts of states, so I may add it. 🙏

@@DougsDharma Thank you so much for your answer. I'm looking forward to your next videos 🙏🏼

was the video on topic of jhanas made?@@DougsDharma

There is this one: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/ep-CmreCtdSrZHU.html

I think lack of motivation usually stems from something more like depression or boredom. We can be encouraged and energized even by things with which we are not identified. That said, check out this earlier video for a nuance: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/kLqhnMV9sr-VfIE.html

@@DougsDharma amazing, thank you so much for taking the time to reply, I will check out the video you linked:)

Yes exactly so. It's good to see it in the frame of practice like that. 🙏

Well the word "suññatā" does mean "emptiness," and the practices used in (for example) the shorter discourse on emptiness are about lack of things rather than (say) about interconnection or interdependence. See my video at: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/jsh4ltSG072mnJc.html . The notion that "emptiness" connoted interconnection and interdependence appears to be a later teaching, as expressed for instance in the metaphor of Indra's Net. I have a video on that as well, and on the Buddhist notion of interdependence: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/ebd-ataH0snPo6M.html .

Well take a look at my videos on the Two Truths. Here is the first one on origins: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/p7KPptahr-C1qGw.html , then there's a second one that discusses a bit about Nāgārjuna.

Indeed it is! Thanks S. Hurd. 🙏

Thanks John. I do have a separate video on emptiness practice that should be linked to there in the show notes or somewhere.

@@DougsDharma I will find it

@@DougsDharma Hi Doug, Is there a particular reason why you chose calmer, wiser and kinder? Ie is there teaching on those aspects? I was thinking about it this morning and it seems to me that they are mutually reinforcing if im kinder I will be calmer ( less thinking about me for one thing) if I'm calmer I can make more room to see wisdom and so on. So to contradict a previous e-mail of mine is there particular Buddhist teaching on these? I havent seen 3 anythings yet but I bet there are. Thanks John

Well perhaps so, though this is a later interpretation of the concept of emptiness.

@@DougsDharma thanks for the reply. When you say later interpretation, when was it? Is it during nagarjuna's time or 8th century Mahayana tradition or nyingma/mahamutra sub school time or 13th century Soto Zen time or new age 1970's time? Sorry if I'm being specific. I am just curious because recognition of conceptual emptiness really helped me in my spiritual path.

😄

There is some discussion of reality being like a dream in various schools of Buddhism. Exactly how seriously we are to take such claims depends on the case, it’s hard to generalize and different people will interpret that differently.

Why not choose to love and support people in your dream?

Christmas Hat ... u need to investigate further.

Sorry ... speller auto correct .. It shld b Christal Hat

Christal hat I have the same impression like u mate.

An example of what?

@@DougsDharma I don’t really understand nothingness like what it means

@@unknowngaming3256 Check out the accompanying video on early practice with emptiness. It contains meditation examples: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/jsh4ltSG072mnJc.html

Well "empty" can be thought of as "empty of a self or anything belonging to a self". In the way you put it, that would mean "empty of anything to cling and grab".

@@DougsDharma Ok thanks. But one thing which i see is that emptiness is based on things that we see and non self is based on what we do.

@@sdnnir4723 it takes time think more and read many books on Sunyata. You will understand later. It takes time so don't get frustrated lol

It doesn't really mean nothingness since that would imply the Buddha was arguing for nihilism. Instead the Buddha argues that śūnyatā is a middle way between eternalism and nihilism, through dependent origination. So a different word is needed. "Emptiness" implies "empty of (an eternal) self".

It’s Brhadaranyaka 5.1.1.

Thanks for that, Roger. FWIW I did an earlier video on non-dualism in early Buddhism: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/apmmac993MvZm5s.html

A completely moot point. It all came from the same place, it is all concepts. Therefore empty

Do you have a reference for that statement of the Buddha?

@@DougsDharma Thomas J McFarlance - Meaning of Shunyata as per Nagarjuna

@@DougsDharma Prsannapada on Karika 13.8.. I think commentry on Mool Madhyamika Karika

@@DougsDharma kzfaq.info/get/bejne/r62pg7KHuLzGmGg.htmlsi=KNyT7GQFt2lqbMpa

Well sort of, yes. The Buddha said it was a middle way between eternalism and nihilism. Eternalism is sort of the idea that everything exists forever in some fixed way, and nihilism is that nothing exists.

shunyata is not 1 advaita is not 2 in brahman there is still I ,shunyata is beyond brahman

Well actually they're both just opinions from ordinary people like you and me so both of them could be wrong and probably are wrong.

Well there are certainly similarities there, though it would sound offhand as though these are sort of opposites.

@@DougsDharma I have heard of the Ananda sutta where the Buddha is asked by a Brahmin whether there is a self or whether there is no self. The Buddha doesn't reply. He is then asked by Ananda why he didn't answer, and the Buddha said that there is neither a self nor no self. Instead their is a middle way between externalism and nihilism. Advaita Vedanta, the concept of Brahman also takes the middle way by saying that there is no eternal individual self. This school of philosophy agrees with the Buddha in saying that all concepts of individuality are false. Instead their is an Atma, however, it is impersonal and our individual consciousness is the same as the cosmic consciousness. Do you think it is the same as the Buddhist concept of Shunyata which says that all beings arose from the void, where the void is = to Brahman?

@@shivendias9602 good question dude I have this same doubt But if we are from void , then is the void from us ??? Because it is also arising dependely and not independently

Happy to oblige! 😊

Well yes, that's one way to look at it.

Consciousness is a way to understand emptiness in the Yogācāra tradition, yes.

Thanks Susmita. I'd say following Bhikkhu Bodhi that emptiness was the Buddha's rejection of the "fullness" doctrine of the Bṛhadāraṇyaka; they aren't the same thing, but opposites. And there are two major discourses on emptiness in Pāli.

Heat and Cold are opposites but as well both of them are temperature. Hatred and love are opposites but both of them are emotions. Black and White are opposite colours but both are just colours. And we can continue going on with all kind of opposites. So easily Poornam and Emptiness are seemingly opposites but both of them are concepts or visions of the same reality or existence. So .. there is not a big problem at all with this two. It's just the mind trying to grasp reality, existence. We could say existence, reality is full, and empty, and it's hot, and cold, and black and white and its love and hate, all of them are qualities of existence. There is place for all of them.

@@JayaDevaMusic sir if i ask you..... What if i say Emotions are empty of independent existence.... This means there is nothing like love and hatred existed without emotion, but here emotions are too empty, empty of independent existence .....। Even emptiness is empty sir....so How can you say both shunyam and purnam are same thing..... It could be sad so if we just stop at emptiness, but we do not stop at emptiness we take one more step that emptiness is even itself empty of Emptiness 🙏🙏🙏

@@Raj-sc8qs close your eyes.. feel emptiness.. now feel poornam... everything that you see.. that you know.. that you can gasp of this reality is trough your perception, senses, and mind. You can perceive emptiness cos you are empty, you can perceive fullness cos you are Poornam. The infinite is dwelling, boundless, unattached, empty, full, its beyond gunas, understanding. So it can have all the qualities and none. it doesnt matter.. its just the mind trying to grasp. Name it silence. Name it love. Consciousness. All the saints try to describe it, so ones see it as empty, and it's true and others as fullness and its also true. Its the perception of the infinite.

@@JayaDevaMusic Sir......Emptiness even itself becomes Svabhava.....that means Svabhava of being empty and so the Fullness is also Svabhava..... Svabhava of Being full Sir here you are still holding, emptiness and fullness, because you are still holding svabhava.... Svabhava of Being empty and Being Full Swabhava means essence.... Essence of being full or being empty.... Here im saying that emptiness is empty of Essence...... Which means it is empty of emptiness and fullness both. Emptiness is empty of emptiness, it holds no essence neither emptiness nor fullness. However you are holding Fullness, and thinking that we too are holding emptiness. We don't say emptiness is every thing, and it is absolutely full and it is the ultimate emptiness is like a medicine given to a patient who has fall under prapancha. so Sir even this Emptiness is empty of Emptiness and fullness In this way these teachings are not same... You are not understanding sir, because you are wearing glasses of Advait Vedant. you have not understood emptiness, you are taking it as something which is absolute.....❌️ emptiness is not absolute, it is like medicine given to break all views, but people hold this Emptiness as absolute and full, so it becomes like a medicine which doesnt come out of stomach and makes the patient ill.

Thanks for the comment Shinjo. In the video I'm discussing emptiness in early Buddhism in particular. The phrase you cite is from the Heart Sutra which is quite a late text, from the early centuries of the Common Era. So the ideas cited in it are different from what one finds in those early texts.

Yes the monastic life is very rigorous and not very popular as a result. I think nowadays there are more "middle ground" practices that encompass the lay life but include some monastic practices such as meditation that can be very useful. Hopefully it will make a difference.

Yes dhamma is the Pāli term, but since dharma is already in English it works better and is less confusing. It's the same word anyway.

Both are same Buddha dharma = Buddha dhamma And btw , I have something to ask you on emptiness and dependent arising if you know about it ....

I wonder if you even know anything about it ...

Yes thanks Alan. I’d simply respond that one of the leading experts on Pāli, Richard Gombrich, has argued in his most recent book “Buddhism and Pāli” that the Buddha spoke Pāli or at any rate some language very, very close to it. This is a controversial claim to be sure but it at least opens the door to the possibility among scholars.

Thanks for your reply Doug. Just a point that I think worth noting is that the importance of recording the Buddha's teachings in a textual language - rather than a spoken one - is that words in spoken languages have a tendency to change their meanings over time. One example I often use is the word 'gay'. As a child this word meant 'happy' (as in Wordsworth's poem 'Daffodils' where he wrote, "A poet could not but be gay in such a jocund company"). However, whereas in my childhood days I may have described my mood as 'gay', I would certainly never do so today given its radical shift of meaning. And, as Wittgenstein famously remarked, "The meaning of a word is its use." With a textual language like Pali the meanings of words remain - to all intents and purposes - static; precisely because they are not exposed to conversational usage. That aside, I want to congratulate you on presenting an impressive and enjoyable set of videos. You are doing an excellent job and are making a valuable contribution to the spread of the Buddha's Dhamma. Thank you and bless you Doug!

Right wiew...

Well it all depends on how Nāgārjuna is interpreted, and his writings are notoriously difficult to interpret.

@@DougsDharma We whill never know. Butt we can learn from the results off hes learnings...

😄

Well, read the suttas and see what the Buddha seems to have said. They are linked in the information box below the video.

@@DougsDharma I don't need to read Sutras I know that there is nither self nor non-self both are wrong. If there is no self there is no Buddha nature and no sentient beings and no one to save. Buddha nature is always present even in deep sleep when five skandhas are dissolved including consciousness yet you still pull a blanket on yourself or hug a pillow. I don't read suttras because I'm self-realised I know this from my own experience. I will explain you where you went wrong as obviously you are a scholar. Now when one meditates on the nature of mind one comes to the conclusion that there is no mind as it is used in Zen and thus because one cannot see mind concludes there is no such thing so he call it no-mind or no-self. However this is true and the reason why one got it wrong is because mind cannot see the mind just like the eye that can see but cannot see itself. Now in order for you to see you eye you need a mirror likewise to see mind you also need a mirror. The only way you see yourself is through other beings. All beings posses Buddha Natrue and have mind. If you ask every1 does rock have a mind or does a three have a mind? Any1 will say no but living beings have minds and Buddha Nature even theo they are not aware of it. I have a cat that digs litter every time he goes to the toilet and he likes it to be clean and noth filthy now is that an expression of no-self or is it and expression of Buddha Nature. Even tho animals not aware of their minds or emotions they still have Buddha's minds. If you look at an ant how diligent he is working for his ant nest and if you put sugar there he will come and eat it and spread the news to other ants to come. You cannot convince me that ant or a cat or any living being for that matter are self empty. Now Buddha nature is always empty of other never empty of itself. It is fullness compassion love joy and all these qualities are Buddha Nature. The only and true thing is our Buddha nature which is alwas present and always there it is knows without knowing it does without doing it is this mind that is hollness. The Buddha nature is not dependent on anything and thus is empty of everything except itself. It is our true self that is Buddha. If you like to know more about this, check out some books on Zhentong teachings that will clear your understanding.