Who’d buy anything in that North Tower even with a “glowing” recommendation from these structural engineers. It all boils down to piece of mind!

zillow has a bunch for sale now

You can’t be any more wrong. These buildings are worth their weight in gold.

@@gregorygrimm5540 false .

@@punker4Real they always do idiot.

I read somewhere that one group of investors owns 29 units. That is enough to control pretty much any home owners association..........start with them.

Wouldn't be surprising if someone eventually goes to jail after all the truth comes out.

@@rocketrose7775 Unfortunately this is Florida and it is probably real estate investors to blame. No jail time for anyone, that would reduce the local politicians donor base any they would be wearing yellow vests in WalMart in 2 years.

Also former maintenance guy said said for years, the roof would anywhere 1 feet up too 2 feet of salt water with no where to drain. He said it would take months to evaporate and whatever seeped through the cracks and concrete, causing 40 years of erosion like bone cancer. The building had a major flaw in its engineering and was never addressed. No authority took the initiative to hold the builder and the management accountable for a poor build. It was all about the $$$ Condolences to all the families devastated by this tragedy. May the rest forever in love and peace 🙏

Yeah the city faiLed to condemn it.

Yeah never a local inspector.

Especially since the inspectors said the collapsed building was safe. Plus he old af 🤦‍♂️. Need a fresh perspective inspector from a heavy regulated state. Climate change has exasperated the outdated construction styles of the 80s.

@@olorin1710 they always say older is more experienced when younger generations are well due for the job

Bring in Japanese inspectors, they won't hold back their criticism.

@@moneyonfleek305 is 40 old enough for you? Because that guy was probably 80 something

I completely agree , God that was horrible

It would be like living in a graveyard

Some people's words are trash. They're being emotional rather than practical.

One of my friends just moved to the 33rd floor of a high rise.. This event doesn't phase her at all

They are sick!

I wouldn’t be able sleep in any building with that kind of construction.

@@NoOne-ii1th or knowing your neighbors are possibly dying next you 💔

@@victorybeginsinthegarden So very true 😔 It really is difficult

@@victorybeginsinthegarden moving is an option but to carry out can be difficult. If you live on a fixed income and nobody is going to move in and rent from you, let alone the policies in place on rentals, it leaves the residents with real hurdles to move out

That is so true.

I live in NYC. I see people on our neighborhood app trying to find out how to get their buildings inspected because of all the cracks etc

@@BrooklynAlien the buildings in NY are way older and actually built right

@@mokokoco4720 not all of them and there's constant new construction. I've seen a few brought down before they were done because mistakes were made.

I live in a high rise and absolutely love them! one poorly maintained building isn't enough to scare me or others

A lady that lived in that new high rise next to these towers immediately left and said she will not be returning! She said she immediately flew to her second house in New York.

shitty urban planning and forced amounts of revenue that must be made from each development is the only reason these condos even exist. if it was all 2-3 story live/work type middle buildings, housing would be much cheaper there, and those cheap shitty towers that were not built to proper spec wouldn't need to be a thing. Look at most american small town downtowns for what I'm talking about. Sheridan, Wyoming, my hometown, is a great example of a good one.

​@@lsbigworld6672 You can't really compare small town USA to the Miami/Dade metroplex. Real estate in S. Florida is pricey, especially when it's ocean front. If there were only 2/3 story buildings, there would be far fewer residence spaces available, making it even more expensive to live there. It would be nice to have smaller buildings as far as aesthetics go, but it isn't really possible in a city with this population. In addition, if the owners neglected to maintain these 2/3 story buildings the way this one was neglected, the salty environment, erosion and hurricanes would still destroy them in time. It rains a lot here and any leaks will quickly cause damage to any structure, especially near the coast where there is salt spray added to the mix. We have intense storms, high temperatures and strong UV levels that quickly dry out and crack seals, coatings and other waterproofing. Even for my single story home, we have to get on the roof at least annually, and after any major storm. This development while not overbuilt, was strong enough as designed to have survived major hurricanes and other events, it was the lack of proper maintenance that got people killed.

I understand. But it is hard for the condo owners in the other towers. They have so much invested in their condo homes. And they cannot sell right now because no one will buy.

:(

Nobody will buy their condos now. Some will have to stay because of money.

13 stories is not 500 feet high

@@WockFrmCrossWestern-wg2se You missed *Reading Rainbow* did'n't'cha? *"150 people squished like bugs less the 500 feet from where you sleep at night. I'm sorry, I'm moving away!"* This story is about the sister building */down/* the street Einstein. You can't move anywhere if you're DEAD! Ergo, he's not referring to the building that fell.

@@marcosmota1094 😂😂

@Maga Tears I do believe he's referring to the individual owners of the condos. Meaning, if they ever tried to sell theirs, given what has happened to the other tower, nobody will would want to purchase a unit in that building.

Same

Ditto. Good luck condo owners.

@Juan Taco Because as ignorant as people are to things they know little or nothing about that's not an excuse. This is not a typical end to a story like this and you cannot assume the owners knew how bad this would really end.

They could just move out, have the building demolished and be vested shareholders in a brand new 30 floor high rise tower built in its place. Sale of first 14 floors to help subsidize the financial losses of the original owners. Other than that, I agree. They are screwed.

I’d never wanna live so high in the air. I did a job for this lady she lived on the 34th floor. I looked out her window and was like hell no I couldn’t live like this. Edit: I did roofing 20 years I’m not scared of heights I just wouldn’t wanna be trapped so high with no way out.

Right

@@russellny8086 ikr lol

@Dan Theman yep!

@@russellny8086 yeaa and I’ve lived in Miami most of my life and love high rises but this changes everything for me 😂😂 I used to work on the 37th floor of a building in north Miami beach I actually lived a block from this building this story is crazy

It depends on the soil conditions and the design. Part of the problem on that island is that the conditions make it inadvisable to build usable space below grade. You want to stay well above the water table, and build footings that can withstand the soil conditions.

..too much weight on this entire area.....ground weakened..

Florida is a huge sinkhole.

Safer than Chicago!

@Dan Theman But people selling condos in Kansas don't promote the spectacular view of an approaching tornado.

Because you couldn’t afford one of these condos lmao

yeah or maybe he doesn't want to hear random foot steps every day above your head lol

@@310smoker what? You don’t like hearing your surrounding neighbors flush their toilet???!? INSANE. Lmao

@@kayluhluh6973 why would anyone pay 500k for an apartment that goes for 80k anywhere else in the country. 😂😂😂 and on top of that, their falling, AND on top of that this is gonna be a horrible hurricane season.

@@jayrezz988 asking the wrong person because I have no idea

Some might be on fixed income and the alternative may be live in a roach motel or their car, or worse.

@@MisterMister5893 these condos were selling for 750k a pop. I don't think these people will be living in roach infested anything.

Yeah but now they’re gonna be paying a 750k mortgage for a property with no value

@@c.2538 I bet some may have bought it years ago and don’t have a mortgage. Or some bought it in cash. These people are not poor. 💵

I thought the same thing. The guy probably doesn’t have kids

They will let their family on? What does that mean? On what??

Your smarmy remark is small comfort to the dead.

@@marmac83 I said what I said. I’ve been watching Fiduciary responsibility degrade for far too long. I knew it was only a matter of time before a catastrophic event happened. This isn’t the last one.

I heard it was a building design flaw when it was first constructed. Not just poor maintenance.

A 40 year old building can’t just fall because of poor maintenance, wake up!

@@LluviadeOrugas So true!

I believe a lot of them have been there for a long time I have probably convinced friends and family to move down over the years plus they probably have events for Christmas and Thanksgiving and things like that for the residents of both Towers so they probably meet like that too

Retirees have time

They meet in the elevators and in the social gatherings, like gyms and restaurants or walking their dogs.....They also had a nice park, between the building and the beach. They could sit there and socialize. These poor people are gone now......so many of them, just because they lived in the wrong building.

Because you dont go out or dont talk to anyone maybe?

Retired folks that’s why

If you're older, it's hard to keep a house and garden in tip top shape. Thus keeping coast line apartments in high demand, hence expensive. But apart from their prime location, they're just jollied up projects.

It’s expensive to keep up any building, let alone a large one.

It’s either a house or an apartment. Don’t know what you mean by racket since people have the freedom to choose and what price to pay.

It is.

It is not

Exactly! It seems like the general consensus of people is that all apartment buildings are inherently unsafe, and that there were no warning signs for the collapse, when that couldn't be further from the truth. Then, you show them evidence that this is simply a criminal lack of maintenance by management/building owner, where you can compare practically the same exact building when maintained properly, to the one that collapsed, and they refuse to believe it!

The south looked like it belonged on a different side of town.

It's difficult to pin this on the "people running" the tower. Board members are often limited by what the home owners will allow them to do or pay for. Often, an underfunded association is due to the the membership not voting to increase HOA dues. They only had 750k in reserves. That was not nearly enough to maintain the issues going on at that property.

There has been a lot of turnover on the board, according to one survivor. The current board was taking steps to have restoration and repair work done, but did not believe they were in imminent danger of collapse. Most likely, the blame goes much farther back than the current board. The building could not have gone from “safe” to “collapsed” in just three years.

Now go onto Bing Maps and look at the same building again...those images are from 2015. No spalling at all on the balconies 6 years ago. And you can see the enormous condo tower project next door had just broken ground. I am convinced that the vibrations and earth settling from that massive demolition/excavation/erection, combined with poor soil quality, caused this building to become over-stressed in all directions. Factor in the poor design, the bare-minimum construction and very poor maintenance and you get the perfect storm needed for this tragedy to happen.

Uhhhhh... the engineer from 2018 said there was major structural damage and it needed to be repaired immediately. The documents are all public record. I guess you missed that

I am not saying the engineers were shady . Surfside officials are shady AF... To be clear... The engineers contracted by Surfside officials report to Surfside officials... I believe THEY are the ones that are not trustworthy. I think they need to step back now since they didn't seem to step up when they had a chance...

Yea right safe my ass. Move your family in there mr inspector man.

They were shaddy when they wouldn't have had. Doomed either way. Problems were well know by the board of owners the engineer and city officals

@@kimberlyflanigan I'm not getting you. The engineers were hired by the Surfside officials-and by Surfside officials I assume you mean municipal building inspection and permits department. Those engineers gave their expert assessment. It was bad news. Did the Surfside officials hide those findings? Were the individual owners kept in the dark about those assessments? Not getting why the Surfside officials are shady AF.

I'd say both south and north towers were neglected based on the filthy condition of the roofs. That's either mold or algae. North tower is gray (mold). South tower is greenish (algae). Both indicate standing water issues on the roof. The tower between them with the bright white roof obviously had building maintenance that wasn't asleep at the wheel.

Poor concrete and bad design is the main reason! Sooner or later the second one with fall also.

@@markmd9 Did you see the video where the dude points out on the architectural plans that the vertical columns supporting the portion of the Champlain Towers that fell are considerably less beefy than the columns supporting the portion that remained standing? Also the horizontal concrete header (seen in the parking garage on google maps street-view), it supported the center section of the condo that fell first. It was already missing in that video the next door residents shot of the water pouring out of a busted water main? That structural horizontal support was already laying in huge chunks on the floor of the underground parking...Jeeeez. Their last minute warning to the the Champlain Towers staff was dismissed.

@@IMCcanTWEESTED yes, saw that. Even if a column fail, it shouldn't start a domino chain and lead to total collapse. I'm sure they must have had some serious violations.

@@markmd9 IDK, with each vertical column failure, the horiz load bearing on that first column will be transferred to the next closest column(s) and exponentially compound that load. I'm not an engineer, but I was an architectural draftsman back in the 70s and 80s and understand the basics of load transfer.

Prices of condos on rhe beach are dropping

They could name it “PANCAKE PLAZA”

@@fabiohoyos4199 I hope it's true. I've been planning to buy a condo in Miami Beach.

@@elena79rus buy new

@@fabiohoyos4199 Apartments in new buildings cost millions of dollars.

Hotels stores all highrise structures then..

The city is responsible for inspections . Not the state or federal governments

Actually they didn't...plenty of documentation of degradation that was ignored. Maintenance does make a difference for preserving anything.

Days before the collapse, there's pictures taken of the pool maintenance room, and it was covered damage with standing water. The parking garage showed major cracking. It was never safe. Yet these pictures only emerge after vast deaths? Ridiculous. Pictures like that should be released publicly at the end of every inspection.

@2BuckGeo I'd probably at least go to a temp place until maintenance schedules and engineering has been fully vetted. But if I had some hundred thousand invested, you just don't give it up.

You couldn’t afford it.

And wild life smart guy

That sounds so quaint! I think I’d like a cottage some day, too.

was looking at a cabin in the woods untill wildlife ate everything in its path.

@@moneyonfleek305 The only critters I've seen on my property are black bears, coyotes, bob cats, raccoons, moose, deer, skunks, red fox, eagles, crows, field mice, red squirrels and other animals which I have no worries about. So your point is?

@@TheFlatlander440 sounds like you have groceries for a lifetime👍

This guy looks more like a captain than an engineer. Not about looks and yes this is Florida. But first impression He he would be my pilot: no.

@@paxundpeace9970 I WAS THINKING THE SAME THING!

They will have a line to buy them.

🖐🏼🖐🏼🖐🏼🖐🏼🖐🏼

john doe unlikely. if dead, their body has been the same temp as the items surrounding them. there’s no internal heating. for those potential survivors… there has been trapped fires and it’s unlikely to accurately find survivors. Plus, no matter what, they have to navigate the pile as it is safe enough to do so to avoid collapse or shifting it and entrapping others.

@AJ XOXO All of the people in these buildings are affluent there's not conspiracy.

😂right!

They hired the best … they know the world is watching them

@Saul Doy looks are deceiving

Everybody wants to be a tik toker now a days, we running low on new engineers 😂😜

@ismael estrada That engineer probably IS half asleep! He's probably been on the site for a while and might have showed up behind the EMTs and rescue teams. Sometimes good people just show up to help, like they did @ World Trade Center after 9/11. If you think *HE* looks bad, wait till you see the fire chief....!!!

I would let my ex husband go in the building.

He bopped his nose like Pinocchio to check if it was growing lol 😅

@@jacquir8331 I tried not to laugh, I swear. Lol

@@jacquir8331 with ur children or without 😳

@@jacquir8331 lmao

same thing is happening to condo east and north

Yes

I agree!

Just think King Tides on steroids...

really......they need more opinions.....

The other engineers that inspected it before told the truth!

The 2018 engineering report said there was much damage and that it was "exponentially" failing. The HOA chose not to act, and some of them probably are now dead...buried under a pile of debris.

It wasnt for the engineer to pass amy judgment. Their job was to indicate the repairs that needed to be done. And of you read the report, there is a part that says that the repairs would create significant disturbance to the tenants and would cost 9 million dollars. I would judge that as "move out!".

“Their” lives. 🙄

@@justin8894 Thank you !

@@justin8894 Just corrected it for you !

Body language, You are so smart, I noticed that also

He bopped his nose like Pinocchio to check if it was growing lol 😅

Probably hates his kids too

Exactly😡

@@janetjones967 Here is the video of the pool deck falling first kzfaq.info/get/bejne/g9J_kpCH2pfLY2w.html

Amen

Not when everyone sees cracks in the walls and cracks in the foundation.

Would you also say that Humans aren't meant to invent the internet and watch videos/communicate instantaneously from around the world? A poorly maintained hut would collapse and kill you too.

I both agree and disagree, it's very human to adapt and live to all types of living arrangements, city to rural. No animals live in cities like humans do, but nor do other animals live in space and we're currently living out there. I think that's incredible, and starts with adaption beyond nature as we know it. All life forms have their preferences. A house can fail just as fast as huge building if not maintained/designed well. This was a tragedy that was not only completely preventable, but the negligence will send some of these souls to hell.

…but there are caves with different levels in them and what about trees? Yeah trees. 😝

Don't base your philosophy or risk assessment on headlines. This is the same logic that would say "humans weren't meant to fly" if a plane crash were in the news. Never mind that you're more likely to die in a car.

Well put !

That didn't sound good to me either ! It smells rotten as dead possum !

It’s still a Ford engine. Not I .

Well put !

That’s what you would have to pay me to live in there now. Even then I probably would refuse the offer.

What is the value of a life?

Can you imagine the value of a life?

That's crazy! Imagine the home you can build for a million $

All condos will go down in price specially on the beaches

A pool was on top of the garage leaking for three years. Neglect due to greed.

Concrete is porous & steel REBAR rusty loosens structure internally ! Hairline cracks aren't visible !

THAT's what you're concerned with....?????

It's the steel re bar which causes the problems

You are correct. The flintstones home was built with stone and they were still around in the sixties sitcom from the stone age.

The Pyramids are also in an arrid desert, not on a barrier island oceanside. Not exactly apples and oranges.

They're also pyramids. A strong shape but not the most practical for everyday needs.

Hoover, not Hover duh!!

Also the residents agreeing to go ahead with the maintenance.

Well now we know that they withheld a damning report stating their building too was dangerous.......

It is not their job to investigate the structure. They have to hire experts and pay them and the homeowners get cheap when spending money.

They told everyone in 2018 the building was safe now we gonna take their word the other building is safe

In a couple of years, it will all go away.....New people will want to live there, and few will have a chat with the engineers....and if they did ? what would they learn ? nothing....It will be about location and esthetics and whether they can afford them or not. People forget, very fast. Human nature. Put a little time and everything is forgotten.

I think so too. But people do forget. They just need to keep the units in the family. Once they rebuild the other side it may look ok to the next generation. But the current owners are screwed.

you are passing a judgement according to external maintenance you see with your own eyes. Not enough. The structure could be rotten and it may not show.

Bridges are designed for that, which is why they don't fall.

Bridges have far more columns for the weight supported.

At least Ryun New Mexico, bridges are regularly inspected with equipment capable of detecting deteriorating rebar, among other things. Usually, bridges are much easier to inspect than high rise buildings.

How many buildings have you see fall due to saltwater just in general

You say bridges were built to do what they do but this building wasn't built to do what it did for 40 years with hurricanes exc. Then why did it not fall in 2 years or 20years...maintaining buildings is important but bridges need the same and yet much of the support systems is under water stay tuned this wont be the last thing you see this happening to

No they wouldn't have .

Bullshit they said it in 2018 it's been years

Have you not seen the images of the ridiculous water damage to the building that collapsed? The South building had notices on the doorways that the building was unsafe for months before it fell. Buildings don't randomly fall down, the North tower is fine. This is a problem of lazy management/owners, who'd rather save a few bucks, than maintain a building. There better be criminal charges for the south building's owners/management.

@@lookaquarter those owners are mostly dead. It was a condominium not a rental apartment building.

@@richardstrongismokecigarsa7215 in that case unfortunately thier apathy signed thier death certificate

If that was the issue it didn’t occur overnight. Those inspecting it would say put all your $$ here and fix this!

Considering it's really expensive real estate, they should be able to find new housing if they could afford a condo room in S. Florida. But what a reason to have to...

@Dan Theman for some it would be. Apparently most of them feel safe enough to stay. Strange.

Condo owners who sat on COA, themselves...meetings come up an they want to save money, now they are in the rubble with their saved millions.