The irony of you talking about cars bursting into flames due to E10 fuel whilst wearing a fire emergency t-Shirt is not lost on me! 😂

The main effect E10 will have is less mileage for the same amount of fuel as it's less energy dense, in fact it's not very good for the environment as you need to use more of it to go the same distance.

Here in the Netherlands we made the switch to e10 a while ago, and so far both my old cars have been fine running on it. I did have to replace the 40 year old rubber fuel lines on one of them because they started sweat some petrol after about a month of e10 running, but I’ve had to do no adjustment to the carbs or anything. I do fill the tank with some supper 98 (that’s usually still e5 or less here) if I know one of the vehicles will be parked up for a while, just to avoid ethanol staying still inside the rubber lines for a long period.

THANK YOU for discussing this! The more "popular" KZfaq pundits are blind siding this and continue to review the latest £200k supercar and the like. Well Done!

At last someone that speaks a lot of sense , very reassuring thanks ..

I have real world experience of the problems with E10 as I live in a country where E10 has been the standard for at least a decade. Yes E10 will destroy rubber components that are not specified to cope with it. As an example I have a classic car that is 30 years old. The fuel pump is submerged. The fuel pump itself has no rubber parts but it is rubber mounted and it uses rubber O ring seals. One tank full of E10 was all it took to flush rubber fragments through the entire fuel system requiring replacement of the fuel pump, fuel filter and all the injectors. I also replaced all the fuel lines at the same time with E10 compatible parts although there were no obvious signs of damage. I have also seen corrosion damage to carburettors and fuel tanks internally with E10 where fuel was left in the system for more than, say, a month. Beyond that I also have a suspicion that E10 spills can cause damage to paintwork. I certainly wouldn't recommend using E10 to remove tar spots from paintwork. My advice is if a vehicle run on E10, or indeed anything ICE run on E10, is going to sit for more than about a month drain the entire fuel system and use fresh fuel when you next use it. You can put the drained fuel in your daily, your lawnmower or whatever. One last point. Two stroke engines generally do not get on well with E10. The problem is that with almost all two strokes I have seen the fuel passes through the crankcase on the way to the combustion chamber. The crankcases have rubber seals that are vital to the engine working.

After some 100 thousands km in several Cars 20 years old and older after the introduction of E10 in Germany about 13 years ago I can confirm that nothing dramatically happened...

Hi Hubnut. Yes, we'll have to muddle through, as you say. Fuel hose is just hose and not difficult to replace. O-rings can be changed too. Of more concern is to what extent fuel pump diaphragms or accelerator pump diaphragms will be remanufactured. Probably if you've got a Moggie you'll be catered for. But if you have something a bit less common it's rather a worry. Cheers.

Every classic car I've owned I've replaced every fuel hose and stripped and rebuilt carbs as a matter of safety .. usually these rubber parts are on their last legs anyway.. just like brakes I always start with all new parts as a point of safety.. but I'm an ex mechanic so there's no labour cost. Not sure what my point is but classic cars require love and attention which is why we like them . Peace and love brother 👍🏻☮❤

E10 doesn't like siting around for long,it goes off quicker

Been removing ethanol for use in my 2 stroke premix petrol powered tools and model r/c trucks by using the 'add water and let it settle out in a container' trick. Use TetraBoost E Guard 15 additive in my 1980 Mini, lead octane booster and ethanol protection.. Oh more Petrol Tax and VAT collected because of less mpg performance. 🤔 🤐😎

We have E10 here in Mauritius. Cars seem to run OK but don't like bing left, particularly in the summer here. It does get pretty damn hot!. The fuel tends to turn into very sticky gunk which can cause issues with carbs and injectors. If you are going to store a car for months then I would suggest that the car is completely drained of fuel. I know it's a pain but, trust me, it makes life so much easier when you want to start using it again.

A two-stroke Saab would be a great addition to the fleet!

Bring Back Four Star!

Having had to replace all the fuel lines in my Rover SD1, I can confirm that E10 eats rubber hoses from the inside and then leaves a disgusting residue that clogs injectors and carburettors. They look fine on the outside, but you don't notice until you open the bonnet and find a fountain of petrol going all over everything.

I don't suppose we'll pay less tax on it.

I remember 2 star petrol and my grandad would only run his Cooper S on 5 star. I remember the hype for unleaded and I remember they had to change every pump because they only want up to 99p

Glad you mentioned how glass fibre goes up very enthusiastically. I saw several Reliants self-cremate back in the day, presumably due to wiring issues that are so critical in non-metal bodied cars. Pretty unlikely that younger enthusiasts will ever have seen this happen, so there's a fair chance some are driving glass fibre bodied cars with no idea of the potential for them to become mobile bonfires.

Great advice 👍I used to work at the BECCA petrol station in Sarnau, now I believe it's an army surplus store ☺️ I remember putting 2 star into my moped, also pumping 3 and 4 star into customers vehicles at 55p a Gallon ! The pumps were old and you used to have to push a button on the front to select your fuel grade and watch the GALLONS click round, a squirt of reddex in the tank sir ? Ahh the good old days ☺️

The reason I would be worried about this like hearing Jay Leno modifying some his cars like his Mercedes 600 to have water injection because of the ethanol in the petrol. I think I will use e5 super unleaded if possible

Fair points Ian I remember all of the issues when 4 star was phased out and classics have got through that and will continue to

There is a channel called Project Farm where the gentleman does all kinds of tests on things and one of them is on ethanol in fuel. It is worth a look. The main problem is going to be with vehicles that are not used much because of the way ethanol attracts water. That causes problems. This is going to open up the field of ethanol extraction in fuel additives. Good Luck!

Thanks Ian. Doesn't actually affect me but still appreciate your straightforward, honest approach.

1988 vaz 21057 (Lada Riva) , he have been running happily on E10 which I give him for much much years now - in principle , his engine sees no difference, but fuel pipes have potential of damage,yet in my example, there is none from what I have seen; and he still has original AvtoVAZ fuel pipes))

Hi Ian, what you say is correct. In the Netherlands we have had E10 for some time, I myself have renewed all fuel hoses for hoses that can handle E10. In addition, I use Ethanol Killer from Millers Oil. Haven't had any problems yet, I maintain my cars well.

I wonder if greater quantities of ethanol will lead to an equivalent of diesel bug in petrol tanks? It thrives in the layer between any water and the fuel, basically eating the fuel.

I'm old enough to remember garages selling Cleveland Discol petrol. They actively promoted the fact that it contained alcohol. Plus ca change!

Thanks Hubnut. My old Volvos have been running on E10 here in Germany for years with no issues. I like this new camera set up you're doing by the way 👌

'Project Farm' soaked rubber and alloy parts in both E 10 and plain unleaded, for 3 months. The Ethanol partially dissolved the Alloy and hardened the rubber. The plain Unleaded just cleaned the alloy, and the rubber was still pliable. It absorbs water, and you get less mpg. What's not to dislike.

Good points well made. No one wants to see an oldie lost or any one getting hurt.

The US has E 10 in it's gasoline (petrol.) In older vehicles it can damage fuel lines and inner carburetor parts made of rubber or plastic. It also reduces performance as ethanol fuel only burns at 2/3 the efficiency of 100% petrol. It also absorbs water which will rust metal parts in the fuel system. Not to mention the shelf life is only about 90 days. Bring back pure petrol!

Thanks for an objective, sensible article on this issue; I don’t necessarily think that classic car ownership and in particular usage is going to get any easier, I will jus5 have to happy that I can tinker more and possibly drive a bit less(?!)

We have had 10 for years here in the states no real issues except with 2 cycles they do not fair well and the fuel stations, some anyway, usually have 1 pump with ethanol free for that purpose.

I guess my real issue is with the deterioration of the fuel system when they moved over do all unleaded that was a real physical issue because a lot of cast iron heads were not suitable unless you put hardened valve seats in them. A specific issue and a very real and simple solution however the solution with ethanol based fuels is less certain. Leaded vs unleaded when you knew the solution beforehand in this case we do not know the solution and that is what is causing the anxiety

Castrol valve master plus appears to have something in it to counteract the ethanol as well as being a lead additive so I'm planning on trying that

Its also an issue with motocycles as there are some of us who are "summer"riders due to choice/ill health. I've gone through no end of fuel lines that have just rotted away from the inside out. Worst bit is at least half of these lines had the latest BS stamped on them. Tried cotton wrapped, pure nylon, fuel grade rubber lines, they all just disintegrated internally. Great fun as you end up having to strip and clean the carburetors as well. Tried fuel additives but they just seem to slow the process down. Tried draining the tank but then you get condensation in there which is no good either. Wish I had an answer but unfortunately I don't. Will have to wait and see if the latest replacement will stand up to E5 let alone E10.

Only thing I've had issues with ethanol fuel was my old (80s) snowblower, where the priming bulb turned to mush and clogged the carb. In Finland we have had only 95E10 and 98E5 for ages. Shell has V-power, but idk about the ethanol content of that. We do have small engine gasoline in cans that has no ethanol, but it's quite a bit more expensive than pump stuff.

I would at least change the fuel lines under the bonnet that could possibly leak onto hot or electrical parts initially. E10 may be an issue for the accelerator pump diaphragm within the carbs.

Great topic. Also love the work with the better camera lens combo

I use it in classics that get driven weekly as a minimum. If they get put away in storage they get either e5 or e0. Both fuel injected and carbed.

There was a video recently showing how to take ethanol out of petrol, it uses water with food colouring poured into the petrol, the ethanol settles at the bottom of the container with the water, then you siphon the straight petrol off. Look up the video on you tube.

Funny, in Aus you can get Premium in most places! Classic car owners just use that, especially if the car doesn’t get used much.

Finally a rational approach on the internet to the situation. The solution is pretty simple, use your vehicles regularly so fuel doesn't sit around too long and check / maintain your vehicles regularly, which everyone with older vehicles should be doing already! Regardless of the fuel it will cause trouble if left to sit too long.

Glad to hear you mention 2 strokes… my LML Star (Indian Vespa) would be an unpleasant place to be struck by an E-10 bug, given that she’d likely have an engine seize… I’ll be researching this carefully!

Love your videos, proper good to see ya still going

I'm advising everyone to enjoy owning a honking great big V8 whilst we still can.....

Already changed at my local supermarket, says E10 on unleaded pumps, other than Super unleaded of course. This is more sinister as Ethanol does impact the fuel pipes and brass parts. Not risking any of my fleet.

You begin to wonder if they are trying to get you convert to electric conversions for classics?

I have upgraded my hoses already. Fingers crossed no problems.

Over here in Brazil we don't have much of a choice. All our fuel is at least E27 haha. The carb in my Mercedes w123 has a completly different fine tune from the ones sold in Europe because of that. Newer fuel injected Mercs, like w202s and w210s seem to run fine though.

Very sensible advice especially regarding owner responsibilty, not sure it's needed too much with your audience but definitely for the general driver nowadays

I hate to break it to you - but it’s here already! Filled our modern ‘boring’ car up yesterday at Sainsbury - E10 on the pump

Ive fitted R9 fuel hose on my Landcrabs Ian, suppose to be E10 friendly ?

Spot on Ian,relax and check you lines and hoses regularly and replace at first sign of problem.most older classics are not driven far so shouldn't be a problem.daily drivers just need checking more frequently.🤗

Less mpg with E10 so you'll travel less on a tankful, therefore more fuel burnt for a given distance = more pollution.

I remember at the lead/unleaded switch, people were putting lead additive into 4Star cars, is that still a thing or did people decide it's not necessary?

Preventative maintenance is what an old car owner ( the car and the owner) has to be aware of. Petseal the tank so moisture absorbed doesn’t rust it out, new hoses all round. Carry a spare float if it’s a soldered one, etc. I ran an iron head landrover a six fifty triumph and a five hundred 1948 bsa with an iron head on unleaded, no bother. Good sensible video, nice one Ian

We went through this in the states. Some air cooled cars needed valve seats replaced. Older cars (before 1991 ish) needed rubber fuel lines replaced. Older then that some carburetor floats and seals were not happy, along with some gas tank floats. Frequent changes of quality fuel filters will be needed for a while.

I always use the 102 octane from Aral- that doesn't have any ethanol in it and my 60yo Volvo does run better with that. But on my modern car I can't see or feel any difference between E10 or ultimate 102

On some vlogs from owner's in the USA they advise to drain the fuel tank if not running the car's for over 3 month's as the fuel goes off.

Ian, we have had E10 in Australia since 2005. I have been running my kombi on E10 for the last 15 years and the only thing I have noticed is that regular fuel hose if left on for a long time will tend to swell and can cause pipes to slip off barls. Most people use fuel injection rated hose which is ethanol stable, and I always use thin wire to tie the fuel jubilee's to the carb or fuel pump. No issues at all with valve seat recession. For iron block cars/heads people do put hardened valve seats and use an upper cylinder lubrication additive when they fill up. Best thing to do is consider all your fuel hoses service items, check them all at service time and replace them every 2 years.

We have had this in Australia for many years. It's fine as long as you don't let it sit in your car for a long time.

Nailed it on the head there Ian (excuse the pun). We never converted ANY of our cars, from a Morris Minor to MGB's to Ford Anglia's to Vauxhall Viva's to hardened valve seats and never had any issues for the same reason you noted. If you don't drive them hard, it's not an issue.

Good and routine maintenance is good advice. I recall putting a small bag of lead into the fuel tank of my Vauxhall Viva only to see, years later, that it was unlikely to do anything! Apart from carting about a small bag of lead I didn't notice any difference in any case.

From what I’ve seen and heard in the states the problem starts when cars are left standing with this fuel in it it’s a tax as you have already stated the rubber brass and aluminium housing in carburettors I’m not sure if there is some sort of fuel stabiliser you can get for long-term storage but as a season mechanic who is now retired everything you said isIs sound advice and I will add if you’re going to park up your vehicle drain the tank down run some super unleaded through it and that fuel stabiliser and you should be good stay safe

Ive put E10 in my 2001 vauxhall omega it ran fine for a while then started idling fast, diluted it with E5 and its back to normal.

My own research has told me that they are still going to keep 97 E5 (premium fuel) at the pumps for a good few years yet . That means apart from a cost increase ,no old cars will be affected.

On my Escort MK2 i used an aditive for unleaded fuel, and for ethanol, aftermarket is going to change, pipes and spares are going to be ethanol compatible, it going to take time, but the car community always finds a way out. Some countries already have high ethanol and spares to mitigate that so maybe at the beginning some people need to search spares in other countries, but in my opinion is not the end of the world. What is important is what you said, check the fuel system for leaks, is something that you already have to do on regular basis, and now even more.

Please give further advice about this. For example, adjusting an older engine to run extra-rich helps it to run a little cooler, and diminishes valve recession. Several small mods might help.

On mine I had to change the fuel lines where needed, the petrol pump is already compliant and the Weber carb got a new plastic float to replace the brass float with the vulnerable soft soldered seams. Not a huge job.

"Lead-replacement petrol". I'd forgotten about that stuff! Unleaded was certainly around in the late 80s as I ran my Datsun Sunny on it. Certainly in 2014, ethanol-only fuel was very common around Rio de Janeiro.

Thank you for the info... It's seems after a few months its still an experiment. Are there any replacement hoses that won't persish? Edit.. I have an x300 xj6 and do very few miles in it. I would like to keep it mint.

Hi Ian, my 31 A model Ford was in California since 1961 so it has been running on ethanol blended fuel since it was introduced in the late eighties. It does require a lead substitute in the fuel but I guess the answer to the great question is mechanically it doesn't appear to have affected it at all!. It still starts and runs fine after 30+ years .

I am absolutely in line with your statements about the unleaded fuel and the moderate use of classic cars motors! Here in Germany we have E10 in parallel to E5 since more than 10 years and there has been a huge discussion and rage about it in the classic car community... A lot of short term and long term testing was done with the result that the effect on classic car parts is far less than assumed... The only really bad fact is that the more ethanol the fuel contains the less long term stability it has... E10 will not work in your car after the winter break if you didnt put in special fuel stabilizer and fuel tanks will rott quite fast with E10 in it.. That is all! Price policy in Germany made E10 5 ct cheaper than E5 but E10 is about 8 to 10% less efficient (up to 1l more consumption per 100km)... Its so silly

When unleaded came in New Zealand all the fuel pipes on my Austin Maxi turned into a kind of jelly. One leaked at Countdown in Dunedin dumping a full tank of petrol into the side of the building... lots of fire engines arrived. The fire brigade made the car safe by claiming the hose and it was pushed well away. I purchased some hose and some tools from Repco up the road and drove home before the fire engines left.

Have been using E10 to a larger or smaller degree here in Australia for about 20 years - no noticeable difference when used in cars made from the mid '90's on. Maybe different for earlier models, but I haven't heard anything to that effect. The only thing I've heard is that E10 will degrade (go off) a little more quickly than regular unleaded, but regular unleaded lasts a couple of years, and is still usable at that stage, so I can't see any major issues. Keep up the great work Ian. Cheers! p.s Let me know if and when you would like me to source and ship that AU Fairmont to you?😉

In the 50's Union Spirit was all the rage in KZN it was made from sugar cane and Morris Minors,Renault Dauphines etc thrived on it. Regular re-seating of valves was quite common though.

Our first Skoda Favorit with the carburettor and no catalyst absolutely hated unleaded even though it was supposed to be adjusted for it. We just had to use leaded and it ran like a bird. Bio ethanol is a whole different ball game, and as you say it's an unknown right now.

Here in the US e10 has been around for a while. Get used to doing more carb rebuilds! But yes replace your fuel lines, run generators, lawn mowers etc. out of fuel when storing and use something like stabil or sea foam in the fuel for long term storage. As far as 2 stroke engines go I have not seen any issues about oil not mixing.

Nice to Hear you talking sense mate well done I'm defanetly going to take the same view I have a 1947 lister stationary engine runs fine on e10 so far but tend not to leave any in tank defanetly not in carb run it until it stops so well said mate

We've had to suffer E10 here in Maryland USA for quite a few years. Besides the rubber issues - It seems to not hold up well for longer-term storage. It separates, gets water in it and doesn't want to burn if it's been sitting for 6 months. Even using fuel treatments doesn't seem to positively help with long-term storage. With boat motors, we try to drain the carb before storing it, and if you're running the vehicle every few months it seems to be not as bad.

As you say it’s going to be interesting. I currently only use Shell V Power together with an additive. I’ve two classic cars one of which the MGB is ok except when I do a long journey and can’t get Shell. I topped up with Texaco which promptly bought it to a halt. After some trials I found Texaco has to be avoided the only fuels which are ok are Shell, BP and Esso. I always use a Castrol additive in addition and this works well on both cars the other car being a 1275cc Midget. As to E10 I’ll continue as now using Shell as my number 1 choice followed by Esso and then finally BP but I’ll use the highest grade V Power or whatever the equivalent is in Esso and BP. I don’t do a big mileage the two cars together probably only do 4-5,000 miles but probably less. They are regularly serviced and checked and last year the two cars did under 1,000 miles I.e. under 500 miles each due to not going anywhere to compete on tours. So we’ll just have to wait and see. But thanks for the video as you say it’s our responsibility to check and maintain our cars and make sure they’re ok to use. I’d rather people use their cars less and then all this wouldn’t be necessary. I live 25 miles from London and never go there as I see nothing to go for but I can’t see any reason to use a car if I did go. The trains, buses and tubes are perfectly adequate!! Why anyone wants to drive in London is beyond me.

Happy to report that the Moggs fleet are mostly diesel except for my '93 Astra, and that, is a long term project . . . We will probably be on Hydrogen by the time that's finished!

If you can, I would stick with E5. I know in my state (New York) there is one convience store (Stewart's) that uses no ethanol in premium fuel ⛽. For small engines and two stroke, it is dangerous, as it destroys small engines. They do sell ethanol free fuel (petrol) for lawn and garden equipment.

Thank you for getting back to me, I love all your videos,loved the white rover 800 Didn’t see the last video on that car did you sell it?

We will end up having to buy that expensive 'Aspen' petrol that they sell in plastic bottles in mower shops, its about 4 quid a litre but purports to have a 5 year shelf life.

You speak so much sense on emissions. Obviously the next car will be less polluting than the old one as has happened for years. We need cleaner air for sure but we shouldn't penalise cars already made and it certainly isn't green to be scrapping a car that is still working. My dad's 65mpg diesel Nissan Note was sold as so green when new 8 years ago it has something like £30 road tax but now he'd get an £8 fine for going into Birmingham. I think that would be ideal if we could all use the public transport option sometimes where possible.

Very interesting video, not many people come on to the internet and admit that they just don't know the answer. It will be interesting to see how things work out over time. Some good news though, is that historic vehicles (those over 40 years old) are exempt from London's ULEZ restrictions. As a natural optimist I feel this must mean there is a clear policy decision to encourage the increased use of classic cars

Here in Canada the big problem we've had is with deterioration of rubber fuel hoses. But it's not a big job on most classics to replace the rubber lines with current production hose, which should be E10 compatible. And the fuel does go "off" very quickly if the car is in storage.

Very level headed assessment of the situation I think. Let's face it we've been running on unleaded and then E5 for ages - the difference between E5 and E10 might mean a few issues cropping up over time but it's not going to be an instant disaster. Like you say as owners we should be mindful and check our cars regularly. At the end of the day we are going to have to get used to jumping through a few hoops to keep our old cars on the road. But they're not going to suddenly be forced off the road by things like this.

For my early high compression Rover V8 engine, my regime is Esso Synergy supreme 99 Octane (5% or 0% ethanol depending on where you are in the UK) a FBHCC approved additive (Millers VSPe)) and new latest spec fuel injection standard hoses. Car seems quite happy with all that.

Well said. One should check their fuel lines on an old car as a matter habit regardless of ethanol use. I use Stabil 360 in every tank in my Frogeye since we’ve had ethanol fuel here in Ohio for awhile now. I don’t put many miles on her so it’s not a financial issue using a stabilized/additive each tank.

Hi from North Carolina. We have had fuel with alcohol 10% for years. I drive old cars, 70s and 80s mostly, some fuel injected but mostly carbureted. Just make sure your rubber fuel lines are good, I mean replaced with good quality. And don't leave it sitting for more than a couple months without taking the gas out. Only time I've ever had a problem with corrosion is when left sitting. I don't have any experience with gas preservatives. Always if you can use non-alcohol gas in lawn equipment especially two stroke. We have non-alcohol gas available a few places for boats and Recreation equipment.

The oldest car in my fleet is a 2005 MINI One. All rubbers degrade, some quicker than others. When leaded petrol was fazed out in 2000 my 1977 Mini 1000 (Now gone) had new fuel lines.

My local Sainsbury's petrol station has been selling E10 since June. I'm just going to start running my Morris Minor on Super unleaded instead. That's going to stay on E5 and it's closer to the old 4 star petrol anyway.

Hello, luckily my car is a diesel Peugeot but my bike's manual says up to 10% ethanol is ok. The bike is a 17 year old Suzuki with rubber hoses, which look fine but are the originals. If I do wish to change them, do you know how ethanol is for silicone hoses, as a replacement for rubber ones ?

Good point, even some compatible cars, if they have had fuel components replaced with cheap non-compliant ones may no longer be safe. I had assumed that everything sold on the aftermarket since 2011 would be compatible, maybe that isn't a safe assumption.

There are several videos on you tube on this issue. You can remove the E part and there are various videos testing these additives.

I think in general that it's good practice to have either bottles of water or a fire extinguisher in your car for emergencies

The only input I can have is that using biodiesel in my vehicles in the past led to changing the fuel filter seal more frequently which I guess was from the ethanol left over from the transesterification process. Just as with unleaded fuels, we will have to do our bit to update our vehicles. A very sensible view on the matter from yourself.