Exactly

Agree - The Maria is magic!

May I kindly ask with what speakers do you pair it? Thanks

Alta Celeste, but replacing soon w/ the Chiaras

The bass coming out of the Alta's is crazy, at another level from my Audionet Max amps if you could believe it!

Even OCD Mikey’s hairs are not a universal tool.

I get it. Both Freya and Lumin x1 are below what I would accept for DAC and this vid is about Preamps OVER 50K. ARC is below that... so you're good..

Thanks !

You are picking up what I'm laying down...

Thanks for listening

She also said to invest in the bottom end of the musical spectrum. It pays dividends

Yep, how old is she ??? EXACTLY... and she's an equipment distributor. I love Angi by the way. Know her well...

lol bro thats disrespect calling her old..........so wait she doesnt knowing anything because she old. u wild bro with a wild audiophile philosophy. I have no idea what u been trying to say about the nature of this community.@@OCDHIFiGuy

@@OCDHIFiGuy you know that crook??

Most DAC boxes/streamer boxes should have perfectly fine analog output drive, it's all about system synergy ....that's another whole subject lol

Your linestage was under $5K and is a ridiculous value.. ;-) I'm all about that..

Sure gets the discussion going, doesn't it ? Lol

That works if you don't mind doing service

That's great !! Thanks for your feedback!

It hasn't changed in 30 years.

​@OCDHIFiGuy doesn't need to 😅 I thought that lady you interviewed with that million dollar stereo rig said a pre amp was critical

Sorry, it was Thomas who had the interview with the audio equipment dealer with the million dollar stereo equipment rig

@@Jack96993 of course. She's a hifi equipment distributor...

@OCDHIFiGuy But what she's says at the end of the interview with her personal ( 1 million) stereo equipment is very interesting She uses VAV & ARC Worth watching

At this price point Hi-End is just taking the piss....;

I don't agree about the whole industry, but the above $50K for a linestage ???

@@OCDHIFiGuy I edited my comment slightly, but yeah $50k+ for a phono/line stage is royally taking the piss. Ok so some of these makers are only selling a few copies but still....

@@OCDHIFiGuy I respect big speakers & turntables take effort but the problem is elitist customers/the industry . The prices have been pushed up to ridiculous amounts . 30 years ago a Meridian cd player cost £1000 . Linn lp 12 about the same . Audio Research not cheap but achieveable There wasn't really anything much beyond it . In 2023 Dacs, headphone & phono stages , cables are the rip off.

Yes. Neve Console or SSL

Hi Austen, you actually agree with me then. I say that there's a point where hifi is sold for ego, not sonic quality. Not only do people BUY for those reasons, but companies BUILD for those reasons. So, at one point, companies totally SELL OUT for $$$ money... they lose their soul to greed... some of them even start that way... 😕

Yes, thanks for LISTENING, Skip. This vid is about 50K plus preamps and you understand why I say what I do..

I agree

No.

Yes, you are talking about a Phono pre, which I do not address here. I'm talking about the volume control, and more precisely the $50K plus volume controls. What is your opinion ?

You like the added flavor the Boulder gives to MPD-8. Nothing wrong with that. Interesting the VC is not even improved. It makes a case for my point of overpricing. It's going to be all Analog. I've got the Pinot as well. To convert my master tape reels..

I prefer a Chateneuf du Paupe - Vieux Telegraph < 1970.

Thanks for your feedback !!

He is not qualifying anything. What are you saying? Are you deaf? He belongs in the same asylum as Trump. Life is a lot easier with broader strokes. This is the era of my way or the highway. I watch this assiduously because it is some of the best comedy on You Tube.

I think you need to watch the whole video before you made your comments. Definitely long, but he clearly states his point, I dont wish to agree or disagree with it. What I can say is I would rather have you dump that money on a quality amp vs a pre amp but clearly the people who buy these products can afford anything. If you are bleeding money this video is not for you. I think what you should consider is anything you see on the market can easily be sold for 50% off the "MSRP" with no loss, so really consider what these things are actually worth to produce. The intellectual value maybe something to add, but at the very same time you have no clue what that maybe worth or if it's anything crazy

@elgustoesmiochupaki6119 thanks for your opinion. How's the weather in Portland ?

Art ? Jesus H Christ, why don't you listen rather than trying to fight me ? This is a discussion about preamps over $50K. Take your Adderall and comment on the damn subject.

More $$$ for the unit = better superior sound. 🤭🥳

No. Not period. I don't agree. Straight out of MPD-8 is more like straight wire with gain than with the flavor of a preamp. I prefer transparency. I've tested this against a $26K tube and $35K solid state preamp.. but if you like the added flavor it's fine... add it in...

It does for sure. In the video, I said that I've only found one DAC that beats a preamp. One single DAC out of hundreds. Now, I know it's possible. And more than anything this is a stab at $50K + preamps.. not the good value ones like yours ! ;-)

@@OCDHIFiGuy Thanks for your insight as usual. Just watched your follow-up Preamp vid. 👍

Its not needed. Its an ANALOG volume control.. And yes, its world class... Yes, both DAC outputs can be used simultaneously, there is enough current on the output stage...

Appreciated!

Let us know how it goes !

Sweet.

Yep, totally. We are talking about above $50K for the preamp only in this video. What are your thoughts ?

@@OCDHIFiGuy long story short, what I was eluding to us that I think that price point is a waste of money. At this point in the 21st century, if you're willing to go that far, you should be using active crossovers and multiple amps. Even if you have to use cheaper individual components, the benefit of eliminating analog filters and the ability to fine tune the system at a much deeper level, more than makes up for it. The problem is, there's no simple solution to this approach that I know of. Certainly not as easy as plugging in all the pieces of a traditional system and it just works. I've heard much more expensive rigs than my own and they aren't much better. I've already spent more than I should have on a conventional system and my stuff is chump change compared to the uber high end.

Yes.

Only in CERTAIN systems that are DESIGNED to make you $pend more money !

Right ? There's a line that gets crossed. And I'd say 50K is clearly over the line for some of this.

OK, so you are one of the level heads with actual experience on par and thanks for your feedback. Yes, I compared the direct analog out of the MPD-8 with my NAT Audio Magnetostat SE in the chain and my First Sound Paramount MK3 with CCA tubes. In both cases a world class preamp had its tube "fuzzies" revealed. I prefer straight wire with gain sonic (purism) over the coloration of a Matisse.. Beautifu, yes, but additive vs a blank canvas. I prefer purism over colorism. Ive got a Studer A80 with FM Heads and a Doshi Tape Head pre.. SL-1 is a well known killer linestage... can pick up the 30 year old models used for under $5K and they are INCREDIBLE. new ones not much different for a hell of a lot more... They may be near $50K now and its still a single board from what I know..

@@OCDHIFiGuy The CAT SL1, at least mine which I bought in around 98 or 99 replacing my Audible Illusions 3A, another great pre that I moved to a vacation at the time, is a sort of hybrid pcb in the pre and a full pcb in the separate power supply. By hybrid I mean it’s a pcb for some components like the caps and resistors but there’s at least 1/2 of the signal path passing through PTP wiring. For our comparison, at least the one I did most recently since we’re doing some reconfiguring with completion of new vacation home due in early Summer 24 and I’m trying to decide if we’ll go full digital there, full analog or similar to our current setup of having both, was mostly opera as it’s from same original tape masters and I had quality SACD’s. Comparing for example Puccini’s Turandot performed by Vienna Opera, not comparing the 1/4” 15ips tape or vinyl versions of same performance, which were 1 & 2, respectively with noticeable drop off to digital. The primary difference we noticed by adding the CAT was a more natural voice on the mezzo-soprano lead. Less noticeable on the male baritone voices. The symphony itself was largely similar in tonality, dynamics and impact. The other noticeable advantage w/CAT, which was the bigger issue for me, was in imaging. Both presentations had a similar scale in terms of height and width but there was a clearly deeper image with the CAT. The symphony was more detailed in instrument placement, it was honestly not a subtle difference. The voices were better defined for there location on stage. Having seen this opera several times, the presentation w/CAT allowed me to visualise the performance. It was ‘less familiar’ w/o CAT due to the less detailed scale. Was the CAT adding an artificial scale to the performance? I’ve never tried the same with any other preamp but playing same performance on tape, the soundstage is at least as large and more defined than the SACD through MPD-8 at fixed output with the CAT. Going back to just the CAT vs straight from dac to amp, neither of us noticed any added fizz or back ground noise. If you’re familiar with Dvorzak’s brilliant Rusalka, there are several very quiet passages in the performance, never heard those passages displaying any added noise to background. Fwiw, I do use NOS Amperex Bugleboy tubes from 60’s in the CAT, not the originals nor anything newer production. As you said, your experience may vary largely based on ancillary components. If you’re a digital only consumer, does it make sense to have ANY preamp, regardless of price? Probably not. If however you do have an analog setup, I do think it’s worth experimenting between straight out of dac, assuming dac has a volume control, and running fixed output through your pre. If you’re like me and have an older preamp that lacks remote volume control, most modern dac’s now have remotes which for some may too be an advantage of losing the pre. Good discussion, mate. Glad to view and converse with a knowledgeable’Tuber for a change 😉

I do lead by example... there's no issue with sales if that's what your considering...

Whoop there it is..

Whoa... now THERES an angle... lol

OOOPS !! Thanks man !

No shit, Sherlock.

Pretty much!

What super car is $130,000? Lambo’s, McLarens and Ferrari’s are $400,000

Previously owned McLaren...

I am a fan of utterly transparent and natural sound. I strive to do that with the simplest, shortest signal path. In order to do that, my system synergy must be balanced enough to not need to lean my system one way or another. The output of the MPD-8 is very transparent, natural and unflavored, or uncolored, as you can attest. I like my chocolate cake without coconut in the frosting. Just pure unadulterated chocolate. Some people like German chocolate kerfuffle.. I'm a purist. Does not make either wrong. Some folks want whatever the preamp adds to make their system sound more enjoyable. Mine sounds best, direct. And it allows me to put $25K into something else.. if anyone wants to paint their masterpiece using an additional set of circuitry and additional power supplies, then all the power to them. I am in complete agreement with you. This is why I offer the pallette of linestages on my site. Thanks so much for your feedback. What preamp do you use in your system ?

Your last sentence reveals your awareness. ;-) 😉

Yes, watch the follow up video.. second one after this one. I show an Exotic for $8K

Who said Analog is crappy ? This video is about $50K plus preamps... are you sure you are commenting on the correct video ?

02:15 - 02:21 "... vinyl and record players and analogue, all that crap in a freakin' preamp ...". For me, neither is crap. I do listen to digital over headphones and in home cinema. But maybe I didn't get your ironie here. That's possible, because I am not a native speaker. I do like your vids, they are always intructional and entertaining to me, don't get me wrong! 🙂

It's funny how people change my story. This is about $50K plus preamps...

Yes, but DAC Engineers that are World Class are few and far between.. Just like artists... so can we say a VanGogh is only worth the cost of paint and canvas ?? Preamp is essential in creating tone only if you want to add tone... maybe because your system needs it to begin with ....

I get it from my eyeglasses

Thanks !

I would never use a digital volume control. Any of the digital preamps DACs I sell use an analog volume control.

There is no problem !! Lol. My point was many times a preamp is only a volume control. It comes from the days when we had 5 analog sources and it's switching was needed. If you are all digital then it's a $35,000 potentiometer... to me, that's an epic waste of money. If you have VINYL, you have no choice. Submit to the preamp. And even if people want to spend 35K to control the volume, all the power to them !

​@@OCDHIFiGuyi agree about the high prices,i'm with you.But my point was about vinyl records and their sound..Thank you very much,we love your channel!!

Strong DAC output bring drive also.

@@OCDHIFiGuy Its not the same Mike, in my experience.

It's all relative.. but I'm about value for those I sell to... regardless of thier means.

Yep, sounds like you are in the know. Want to buy some tapes ??

Always looking, purchasing now from someone in Ukraine making master tape copies.@@OCDHIFiGuy

Right. No gain control !! Just power switch !!

Why would I want to add anything when I completely connect to my music in a level never experienced before ?? Makes no sense...

​ I'm so sorry, I didn't now that you had the final list of facts regarding how a system is supposed to be. Everybody have an opinion on how the sound should be like, and many people like and think that a preamplifier gives them better sound. You also have a lot of filters in your speakers, many people prefer full range speakers because of the lack of filter 😊

​ I'm in the belief, that the synergy of the complete system is what is important, instead of just looking at a peace at the time. I have a setup bought 2 hand for 1/10 of your system, and it probably come close to your system, is my guess 😊

Well you can trade it back if you like.

@@OCDHIFiGuy No you miss understood, i don't want anything else but if i would be in same position i wanted 2 inputs

Agreed

Of course not, but are the improvements worth it to YOU? If not, don't buy it, pretty simple.

I agree. That seems to be the sweet spot. I'm interested in the T + A P 3100 HV, because in addition to being a great pre-amp, it has room correction capability as well.

OK, Ill make the point more clear. Its an analog volume control.. No Analog switching. so its not an analog preamplifier in the traditional sense. In the electronic circuit sense, yes, its an analog input gain stage. In this case, no outboard preamp is necessary due to the high level of this DACs output section.. Look, if you want to spend an extra $20K for an outboard preamp, Im happy to sell one to you ...

Analogue volume control is either passive or active, and if you need a gain, then it have to be active. My understanding is that the playback design dac volume control is digital transferring to analogue.

Do it !!

This video reminds me when I just finished the twisties on Angeles Crest and went to well known Shell Gas station where all the bikers and exotic car fellas fuel up and hang for a bit. There were some dudes riding some old ratty looking gixxer and one dude was mouthing off about how the new Duc Pany and the Firebalde RR SP sucks. I was thinking, you've got to be kidding me... The V4 & Fireblade are some of the most capable track bikes that roll out of a showrrom floor. Yeah, they cost because they are big boy toys. That dude on the 10 yr old gixxer, I bet if he had the money he'd be on a V4 or SP, guaranteed. Yeah, it's about the money. If I didn't have the money and all I could afford is a ratty gixxer with 80k miles on it, well then, be cool and be glad you got *something.* Haters and trash talkers bag on the latest bikes because they don't have the scratch to play in the elite sandbox. What am I tryin to say? Nobody likes a hater. Haters, they just show their gold tooth that's all. But hey, everyone has a 1st Amendment right so, keep on truckin Mikey.

I agree. I would want eye candy for that kind of dough...

Yep. You get it..

Whoop there it is. You understand my point dead on the nuts. Thank you for listening and trying to understand the point... ;-)

To put some things into perspective my absolute favorite speaker less than 25 years ago retailed for $14,000/pr including a servo bass management box. Today I can’t imagine that speaker being produced and retailed for anything less than $100,000 rtl and I have no doubt that someone would attempt to make retail closer to $200,000 based on what is out there for $50k, $100k, $150k, $300k and more. Even dealers are getting ripped off today at these prices and clearly we have to mark things up to make a living. Even if we gave consumers dealer cost and made nothing it would still be a ripoff to the consumer if we don’t value shop for you and let me tell you it’s hard to find these days. This is why OCDM and others like myself are passionate about finding values for you “the consumers.” I would rather sell 100x the amount at lower pricing and less margin on beautiful sounding hifi systems than 10% as much that is bloated to be way overpriced leaving a few customers with great sound and 90% wishing they had enough money to buy a truly state of the art sounding rig. Wouldn’t some manufacturers want to do the same? Really get their name out there again!!! I think OCDM and other dealers like us can make a huge dent in the industry and force pricing to come down. Thanks to Mikey for “leading the charge” and having the energy to keep on feeding us with videos….maybe it is helping already. I just saw a sale on a well known pair of speakers that list for around $24,000 pr for around $10,000 discount. Pretty sure that manufacturer is still making money…. How much were they making on us when they were asking $24,000. “An undisclosed lot” plus the better part of $10,000 more to the consumer.

Just call me to chat about options..I do this for free and am not a hard closer type.

Your DAC is not musical enough to rival Vinyl.. The one I sell is. I guarantee it 100%. I totally know what you mean about sleeping during music.

My audio alchemy pro 1 transport with my pro AA upgraded dac came close but didn't own for long I've bought a lot of thousand dollar dacs china brands and so forth USA brands I still love the sound of my old Rotel 30 year old player with black gate caps that our stock no mods other than installing a iec on the back.

I disagree

@@OCDHIFiGuy you are not into classical music, based on you

ALL dacs have digital input switching. There is no stand alone "Digital preamp" that I know of. Care to enlighten us ?

Thank you !!

Dude, thats called coloration... paint your shit all you want... I prefer a blank canvas..

@@OCDHIFiGuy there is no such thing as a transparent component.

Totally valid and I love the media which is vinyl from a tactile art perspective. I designed and sell a vinyl carrying case to back up my mouth. It's on 11stereo.com as we speak. Next, this vid is about $50K+ preamps. What's your opinion on the subject at hand ? Third, please name 5 albums released on vinyl that I can't stream right now off the internet.. I presume "a lot" is at least 100, so 5 will do.

My comment was concerning physical media specifically vinyl.(which requires a preamp) I don't stream music because like I said for me cover art etc is part of the musical experience. (plus music can be removed from streaming sites but not from my collection). Anyway here are 6 albums (some old some new) only released on vinyl. Again I have no interest in streaming so i don't know if you could find them there. For me it is about physical media. 1 - Norman Moron Y Su Combo - De Todo Un Poco 2 - Giolito Y Su Combo - Cosecha Tropical 3 - The MPS Rhythm Combination & Brass - My Kind Of Sunshine 4 - Suzanne Ciani & Jonathan Fitoussi Golden Apples of the Sun 5 - Iglooghost - Lei Line Ion 6 - Hainbach - Light Splitting

We open the books up...

Thanks Davy. Zero editing. It's automatic volume leveling and automatic white level balance. So in percentage of importance, what percent to you is the ratio of video production quality vs the message/info being delivered ? Thx. NAT AUDIO Magnetostat SE is my reference at $26K.

Yep, we are talking about 50K plus preamps here...

I have the mp 701 with nos tubes and van dam caps. I get get great synergy with a Vincent sp-223 amp.great midfi system. I would change nothing.

@@magnaman94 Absolutely! I use the vcaps on mine. I ordered three 6sn7’s with adapters to replace the nos rca 12au7’s suggested by someone who says the 6sn7 makes a big difference.

@@progrock3603 i have brimar cv4003. I would love to get some 6ns7's and copper oil bypass caps. A bendix rectifier. Other than that its very musical.

I'm good at the incoherent rant. It's what built this channel. ;-) 😉

@@OCDHIFiGuy Watching your video gave me an idea. Buy one of those ridiculous preamps, disassemble it and look up all the parts in a catalogue to find out how much they all cost. Then add up for the total cost. Btw, don't let my comment distract you. You're doing fine. 😃

Not interested.... lol. Thanks tho..

Absolutely... freaking Hammond ? Not even Lundahl ?

OK. So let's mark it at $60K...

@@OCDHIFiGuy I agree that you can get a great preamp for much less. ...and vintage ones for s steal.

@@StGCfiLife that's the point... ;-)