i auto include 1 small squad for this. taking the obj behind a term squad so it can stay on my side without having to babysit.

They just don't do enough for their points imo

Agreed, and how do people think an msu is too expensive for points generated? They can and have scored me points on every single turn. How is that not worth it? If they do get smoked off an objective, well, that's that much less pew pew going into my good units.

Don't forget cheap mortal wounds from the grenade strategem they get

@@erikb7392 Exactly people forget it's okay for units to get killed as long as they get you value.

Heirloomification of weapon options makes the game more approachable for new players! Have a heart! 😢😢😢 What do you mean you don't want to sacrifice mechanical depth on the altar of infinite growth??? 😮😮😮

I've gotten better killing power and durability out of vanilla Assault Intercessors than I have with Outriders. They desperately need some kind of buff considering they've got for a whole detachment dedicated to them.

I just wish more units had a special unit for their chapter like hounds of morkai. WS outrides that get -1 to hit after they advance or +1 to wounds or hit after charge. Something that’s flavorful and makes the units better.

@@ZARECO1 or at least a bike captain or storm seer librarian that gives their unit those things. Mainly I think the twin bolt rifles should have the assault keyword and chainswords should have lance, considering they're front mounted bolt rifles on a speed bike and a chainsword that are swung at like 100mph.

Who need that when you have speed

Add in a phobos lieutenant and dump them into an impulsor; drive up, pop out, shoot stuff, hop back in and shoot again

@@Rexir2 took me a second to figure how how that'd work, but its not a horrible idea.

I don't play marines myself, but I am planning on triple Land Fortress so I can definately see the appeal. Looking at it again, a Land Fortress is basically just a Land Raider with the ability of a Razorback.

Consider 3 Brutalis dreadnoughts to back them up

I like to drop brutalist off up close via storm Raven for Overwatch

Another phenomenal combination is a redeemer land Raider filled with assault Terminators equipped with dual lightning claws and a Terminator chaplain. This combination provides an extremely brutal Strike Force with a massive threat range in the early game.

like in a 5 or a 10 model unit? Every game ive played with and/or against intercessors they are easily the worse unit for battleline if not the entire codex, they cant do anything and die just immediately.

@@archonwut1624it’s mainly their versatility, and home field defence Also like I did, you can use them for offence with some good character attachments, ranging from lieutenants to captains to named characters

​@@AutisticDumplingMan there will almost always be units other than the Intercessors who want to be getting that character buff more often than not. In my play group we have a lot of players running Damage 2 weapons, including myself, and 3+ save on 2 wounds just isn't super strong when you can no longer get to a 2+ in cover. In the right situation I'm sure they're great, I personally take a squad to sticky my home objective every game and screen out my back field, but playing them for their damage is very much not something I'd recommend.

@@campfire_minis sadly I’m poor and have 4 10 man Intercessor squads lying around

@@AutisticDumplingMan I'm happy you are finding success with them. I feel like i get everything that any number of intercessor have and a lot more just from using 2 5-man units of scouts, even offensively or on defense the scouts are just better imho.

Ditto. 6 heavy bolters with strikes from the shadows is intense.

It's hard to screen against lol I recommend Traitor Guardsmen, Cultists, or Nurglings. But the 3" deep strike is hard to defend against.

@@Lomhow yea cultist I try to spread them out normally and attempt to move onto another objective lol, nurglings I’ll usually have them infiltrate on a side objective, I haven’t felt like there’s been a time I should deep strike them though I’ve only been going against either space marines or thousand sons

It can, actually. 15 of them fill out a 1,000 or 1,250 point list comfortably... Though you're going to need to dig into another rank to get to 2k. We dug into this idea at my local GW store this past weekend.

Put Draxus in that unit for 5/6 chance of no shooting at them outside of 18".

Coteaz is a great option for any imperial army that can’t otherwise farm CP efficiently. He’s earned auto include status from me, where Coteaz and his henchmen have become my default sit on the home field objective unit.

I don't know if it is strictly better. It *does* maintain theme a little better, and Calli's pop and drop for free is nice

Bring em both for maximum fun

@@sirkelendor5429 Totally. The Meme Team is the DeathWatch leader who does it too

@@czigtema1 just make three strategems cost one more cp. Or use all three at once

main reason combi is better is because he can sabotage and sticky objectives... callidus is not adeptus astartes so can't use "A Deadly Prize" stratagem.

They are both good@ThatGuy-bh9qh

​@ThatGuy-bh9qhcombi lt is better IF your running vanguard sm and give him the shadow war veteran enhancement

What is the base size on the new ones?

​@@jakubmizerski5685standard 40 i assume

@@jakubmizerski5685 I am guessing 28mm

There isn't nearly enough available data on non-standard competitive performance, so it would be mostly speculation.

I second that. As a new player to have a list can help get figures that can be a starter

I would usually never use most characters on infaltraters. But they are nice on their own

Only problem is most opponents(in my experience) focus the invictor because incediums are scary for overwatch

Playing the vanguard detachment you dont need the war suits and id argue those warsuits arent built for war in any way as there limited firepower makes them useless against anything but light infantry mobs. I ask you, when was the last time you saw any of those? I never see mob swarms, every player i face asks the same question about their list, Can it kill Space Marines? And they build to do just that. I use light infantry tactics and support them by fire. i have one 10 man squad of infiltrators lead by a phobos LT and CPT. Target them for free and on a 5+ get more cp, lethal hits, redeploy phobos units (which you can sike out a good bit of people with at the start by deploying them aggressively and then pulling them back), and i can trap an objective for free then leave it on my opponents turn because the trap makes it sticky and go somewhere else. i send a full squad of bladeguard to the center with a justiciar turn one because of the blade driven deep enhancement and put a 10 man hellblaster squad with an apothecary to shoot over there shoulders which means i control center until at least T3 if not the whole game I have a repulsor executioner with laser destroyer and a ballistus dread that sit back and melt vehicles with a techmarine Eliminator squad with 3 las fusils as even more anti vehicle, a devastator squad with lasconnons and a librarian to give them 4+ invuls, 10 man Intercessors lead by a Cpt, and a 5 man heavy intercessor squad to hold home objective This list paired with this detachment is a power house, i played against a vehicle spam SM killforce of Druhkari that melted my vehicles turn 1 with 27 lasconnon equivalents. So i gave him hell for the rest of the game with nothing but infantry and brought what should have been a massive loss to an 11 point difference 70/ 81. he had nothing left and i was able to score all of my secondary's. of his 27 lasconnons at start he had 6 left, that 10 man infiltrator squad killed 3 vehicles, a 10 man infantry squad and his warlord, by themselves. If you take any serious amount of infantry Vanguard is the only detachment to play and plan on winning a game. Take a few phobos units and then do whatever else you want but this is the only viable option for infantry lists after oath got cut at the knees

That will change once enough boxes have been sold.

This may be old news, but they go on pre-order Saturday 17/02/24.

That doesn’t help much in my local meta with lots of deep strike options who will simply steal your home objective if left undefended. Sticky is nice in case you get shot off it forcing them to commit to going there but doesn’t really help much in holding it unattended

Usually I'll keep them on the homefield until turn 4 after all their deep strike is deployed and I know they won't take my homefield objective, sometimes sooner if I'm against a slow army with no deep strike or they deploy everything turn 2.

Found it in the rules commentary: For reinforcement placing, negation takes precedence, so no Meteoric Alpha-Legio-I-Mean-Strike. For attacks, attacker's rules beat defenders.

Lieutenant is super-inexpensive on [generic internet auction site], I just picked one up for my Dangles... not that I've updated my lists for 10th... but I might one day.

Same honestly

I swear by a unit of Infiltrators with a Phobos Librarian. It's pricey, but it's essentially a guaranteed primary objective holder in your DZ that cannot be dealt with at range or with deep strike, at all. Even if the zone out rule is completely irrelevant to your matchup, you have an immortal unit holding your home objective.

I love Infiltrators and run a ton of them. But I agree, they can be fairly match-up dependent. Especially when fighting melee armies that have zero deep strike, they will be at a disadvantage.

@@broco1163that is a good combo for sure, but for less points I can put a whirlwind on my home objective, usually out of Los. only one time it died - to a winged hive tyrant in 2 turns, but so would infiltrators in that scenario And the whirlwind can do a bit of work and contribute by hitting key units out of Los

Agreed Im running the firestorm detachment and take 5 intercessors to grab my home objective straight away and then run off to others. They're so small they won't get targeted or noticed unless I'm losing bad. I've then got termies, inceptors and either suppressors (9 S9 shots) or reivers (drop, shoot, move, charge, terror) in reserve, so if I can see my opponent is keeping something back, I will too

You can only choose 1 of the units that you shot to use this ability on

I'll try and answer your questions. First feel no pains saving throws do work against devastating wounds cause all devastating wounds does is not allow you to have a saving throws against critical wounds (6s to wound), feel no pains saves are not armor saving throws. Think about it like this critical wound automatically does it damage to it target and there is nothing you can do about that but feel no pains work when damage is dealt so there is no conflict in the rules. If damage is dealt you get a feel no pain save. Second lethal hits weapons do their assign damage charactistic not 1. If you have a weapon that has a damage value of 2 and it activate lethal hits the damage value is still 2. Hope that helps mate. Welcome to warhammer.

@@BenChard-qw4hj thank you I really appreciate the time and effort you took to write that, it helps me a lot, and thank you I’m excited at beginning my journey

Just to make it clear, for lethal hits, your opponent still have normal saving throw. On 6s for hit, you don’t need to make the wound roll. It doesn’t automatically damages, but wounds.

In the index, yes, but the codex made it army wide.

Not sure why you'd want to melt him into generic Phobos Lt, but getting actual combi-weapons back would be amazing.

His whole gimmick is being lone op and being hard to kill

They should redo combi weapons to their old style, current ones are boring