Super Saiyan and Gear 5 are so different, It's ridiculous

Say you're in a fight. One dude. Barely winning, suddenly he's 50× stronger in every stat. You lose

I don't care about this debate but, Goku's hair in super saiyan looks cool as hell

Wait, are there actually people out there that think Gear 5 surpasses Super Saiyan in any way?? EDIT:(I don't only mean power-wise, I also especially mean iconic-wise. Like, no. G5 is not more iconic or a better transformation than SSJ, like let's be real here, yall. Try to get it past UI first, then we can talk. Lol)

Nah you know what’s crazy? The fact that people are saying that Gear 5 Luffy is more iconic than ssj and UI, when just a single note from the UI theme, is so much more iconic and has more significance than anything in One Piece 💀

Even if gear 5th would grant luffy omnipotence or op power ups. It could never surpass or even reach the level of hype, nostalgia or the greatness of super saiyan. It's simply legendary.

Personally, I'm not convinced that grade 4 is over 500× base due to what Goku told Gohan in the time chamber. For context, Goku goes grade 3 and asks himself if he can beat Cell while in the form. He realises that he can't because, while the form offers alot of power, it completely kills his speed. After powering down, He tells Gohan that regular super saiyan (grade 1) is still best and that they should try to stay in grade 1 to make it their "natural form", as well as get rid of the "restless feeling" of it. After Goku and Gohan have left the time chamber, the other Z fighters comment on their form. Tien mentions that he thought it took a gigantic effort to stay in super saiyan, and Piccolo follows up by saying that Goku and Gohan must have trained themselves to maintain the super saiyan transformation as if it was their normal form. Trunks, then, asks if it means that they'll achieve another huge transformation, with Vegeta calling him a fool and telling him that Goku and Gohan have decided that "this" is their best combat state. This tells me that grade 4 is different from grades 2 and 3 in that it improves on grade 1's faults rather than giving an additional power boost like the other ones. To give a bit more credence, we see characters that are in super saiyan grade 4 (Trunks and Caulifla) being able to transform into grade 3. (p.s I know practically nothing about One Piece, so don't take this as me routing for Luffy's gear 5 transformation)

If luffy gained super saiyan, and had a 50x stat boost on top of what he could already do. He'd just put a hole through kaido with each punch. One piece doesn't scale like dragon ball. A boost like that on any already strong character would be massively overpowered. On the other hand, if you instead gave goku gear 5 against frieza, he'd just proceed to continue getting his ass beat. Sure he'd probably make frieza look silly a bit, and then the moment frieza starts using anything more than half his strength it'd be wraps. It all comes down to the gap between frieza and goku at the time being many times larger than the gap between luffy right before gear 5 and luffy after.

the doriki argument surprised me because there's no way Lucci's power is just 4,000 not only did he not hit zipper mouth seriously but he also wasn't using his devil fruit either.

Dawg putting gear 5 next to kioken is too accurate 😂

Theres always the misconception that luffy just has toon force, which he does not

in the straight fighting show it's a power amp in the exploration based show it's a creative and utility based series of different transformation types perfectly fitting transformations for each show

W video man, love your content. Keep up the work✊

No way y'all putting these two forms in the same conversation

Also about Gear 2nd, at least initially, it did to some degree lower Luffy’s life span

No way people believe gear 5 > SSJ, if you believe gear 5’s better then you need some form of therapy im ngl

I think Ssj is better in Stamina and Power and Durability Gear 5 is better in getting some additional abilities but in everything else he can't compare to ssj Grades and Gears heh About Grade 4 (full power ssj) Well you can maintain ssj as your base Without wasting Energy Great video btw

The Fact People are Even comparing Ultra Instinct to something like these is just funny to me I hate how some communities ruin characters just because they think hes stronger i liked luffy but the community is ruining him for me because they think he even lands a finger on base goku (He Don't only i goku lets him hit is there a way for him to touch him)

Even if Gear 5 was somehow stronger than Super Saiyan/Ultra Instinct, it can't match the others popularity and notoriety. Super Saiyan is THE transformation in anime, and anyone within the shonen anime sphere instantly knows the first note of the UI theme.

This wasn't important for the video, but there is a guidebook that goes over how there isn't much of a difference between Grade 2 and Super Saiyan 2 besides the addition of muscle mass. Some people use this to say Grade 2 is 2x Super Saiyan.

Awsome video!

I just came here to say Gear 5 wouldn't exist without Super Saiyan

No one brings up Luffy can’t stay in gear 5 due to stamina issues super sayian has no stamina issues. BUT imagination power is pretty op definitely has the potential to be better than a 50x power boost.

Vegeta VS Zoro VS Zebra would have been lit if the animators gave a little more care into that fight.

There is an error in the grade 4 power because it's not the "strongest" form it's the overall best form grade 3 is stronger than ssj3 but it has that speed thing full power ssj is just a perfect control and management of the og transformation, this allows the user to use the full potential of the transformation without the strain on the body and i think that is all

Gear 5 is a better transformation but it doesnt beat Goku using SSJ. Besides SSJ is just iconic. Luffy would get ganked by 23rd Budokai Goku.

hey man, do u know where you can find daizenshus and db data books

7:59 as we read that panel, they said that it's several times its limit, it's supposed to be his but anyways, we know what luffys limit is. It's the gear. Gear 3 form. Gear is still a form and shouldn't be ignored. A gear 3 punch is exponentially stronger than a gear 2 punch. If you said gear 2 is a 5x multipler then gear 3 has to be 10x at a bare minimum. Gear 4 has to be several times by 50x his base. And for gear 5, come on, it's obvious that kiado wasn't just being affected by luffys abilities. Luffy was clearly physically stronger and faster than his gear 4. And are we forgetting that luffy literally died. That was a half dead luffy in gear 5 fighting.

Because of the different powers of the verses, it’s not even worth comparing their strength (Luffy will never be as strong as Goku, and quite frankly he doesn’t need to be), but one thing I will say is that Luffy’s transformations are interesting and meaningfully distinct. All the levels of Super Saiyan are pretty much the same, just with different power levels, but with Luffy’s gears, each one puts a new spin on his powers. Obviously there are similarities, since they are all based on the same subset of powers, but they all bring something different to the table.

Totality forgot the grades of super saiyan,but that brings up the question,is every super saiyan we’ve seen though the series a master super saiyan,are goten and trunks mastered

🍿🥤🗿 oh don't mind me I'm just sheltering from the impending storm

Hey lonk do u do commission videos

One Piece fans be like: Utility > Power 🤓

If you're looking for an additional versatile ability with at least some stat increase, G5. Overall major stat increase with no stamina loss once mastered, SS.

In terms of arsenal Gear 5 is much MUCH more versatile than SSJ. That being said, you can’t argue with a 50x power boost and the ability to shoot lasers out your hands.

great video but a small correction. Grade 3 supersaiyan is stronger (in ki and strenght) than grade 4. When trunks goes into grade 3 is mentioned that he might be stronger than cell. and when goku compares his grade 4 to cell he claims he is weaker than him. And i doubt that base trunks is stronger than base goku

Overhyped transformation, they only did that to luffy to have an excuse to give him his own ultra instinct form.

gear 5 isn't even that much known than full cowling tbh, nine tails level at max

Early gang

Tbh, as far as we know, I gotta get some points to Goku, not because of Power, but I think more because of the Zenkai Boost sayans can get on death near experiences, and we know the amount of Zenkais he got, not mention the trainings he has done like, the time chamber, Gravity room, Whis place, etc, as far as we know, already being a sayan is already a huge power up since we already know they just become stronger with training and As Luffy as also incremented his strenght too, also, we gotta know the powerscale of Each Anime, We know Goku has reached the level or even surprassed the level of Gods, and the Fruits of Devil I believe are made by gods, So We also need to know how stronger would be each Character is eachother universe.

If we talk about funny transformation with crazy foreshadow the G5 is up there. But if we talk about the most iconic transformation in the history of shonen, then that's the SSJ.

Those options alone are pretty nice, but there are even more points we can throw into this argument. First of all, lets say most average person has access to this forms, Super Saiyan from the start is much easier and simple to use, x50 to all stats, while with Luffy's power you need shit ton of experience to even use it half as effective as Luffy does. So not only this form is superior in terms of raw power, and can be evolved in more ways than Gear 5(at this moment at least) but also if given to most average person, they would be stronger with Super Saiyan than Gear 5. I adore Gear 5 but it is not first form to not use rage as trigger, hell even the bad form like Super Saiyan Blue is about calmness and control, and Super Saiyan 4 is all about taming the rage and controlling the inner beast rather than letting rage take over. I adore both Super Saiyan God and Gear 5 tho, the calm nature of the Saiyan Godly form and the always full of joy Nika power make those forms truly divine.

Happy 100th

everyone’s talking about how strong the transformations are, but I wanna talk about which one had better storytelling

You guys really need to stop comparing apples to oranges

I straight up don't even know what Red roc is lmao

In my honest opinion, all of Luffy's forms are more useful than the super saiyan transformations because they dont just work as power boosters, they also work to enhance an area that luffy is lacking on

Im a die hard dbz fan but how is super sayin garde 4 is 500× and he isnt to beat cell and sjj2 is 200× and gohan destroyed cell

MY GOD YES THIS IS WHAT I THOUGHT. STRAIGHT FAX 👏👏👏

Luffy's Gear 5 transformation is a multi-continental transformation and Goku's Super Saiyan transformation is around solar system level to low galaxy transformation.

I'll just explain it as gamer: super saiyan is a skill that just multiplies your stats while the gears are actually new skills that allow you to do new stuff and expand your gameplay. What do you look forward to more when playing a game? Super saiyan is stronger. No denying that. But the gears are generally way more interesting for the viewer to watch.

The only issue I have with this video is you calling Grade 3 Super Saiyan a 10x multiplier because of El Manga Legendario. This just can’t be the case because as most people know, Super Saiyan 2 was originally just supposed to be Grade 5 Super Saiyan, until the Buu Saga where they attached a number to it. This means that Grade 4 Super Saiyan MUST be weaker than a 100x power boost from Base Form, since Super Saiyan 2 is x2 of OG SSJ. And since Goku describes Grade 3 super saiyan in a very similar regard to SSJ2 (Calling out how in raw power it can’t be beat, but you lose too much speed. However he made a note how Gohan instead got FASTER). This likely implies that Grade 3 Super Saiyan has the same power boost as SSJ2 (2x) but then has a weaker speed than even base ssj. Grade 4 SSJ would be somewhere then inbetween 1.5 and 1.75, because while SSJG2 doesn’t have an official multiplier, most people sort of agree it’s a 1.5x boost, and Grade 4 would likely be 1.75x.

Super sayian is already iconic

Again I ask why can't we like both and not compare two goats but over all good videos

Grade 1 SSJ does have drawbacks. In the fight with 18 It was stated they were equal but he was gradually losing power, same with Trunks and Future Gohan against the Future Androids. Also you get angry which makes you slightly uncontralable. Grade 4 SSJ does eliminate those drawbacks though.

In One Piece world, power level multipliers won't work. The new forms unlock new abilities. In DBZ, raw power is everything; techniques don't matter much and can be overcame by sheer power alone. One Piece power systems are much more complex than DBZ when 3 types of devil fruits and haki, and items like sea stone, legendary swords, among others are thrown in the mix. Base Luffy, at one moment, was holding his own against Kaido. Imagine if he suddenly got a 50x boost! Kaido would be toast. Even pre-timeskip Luffy would be able to hang with the top tiers of the One Piece with a 50x boost. Blackbeard, for example, is not insanely strong or fast, but he has two scarily powerful devil fruits. In DBZ, techniques like timeskip of Hit was easily overcame with sheer power and speed by Goku, and later by Jiren. So, in conclusion, it is very difficult to compare power systems and transformations of DBZ and One Piece. The transformations in both series serve their unique purpose, power and speed multiplier in DBZ, and hax abilities with slightly increased power and speed in One Piece.

I think we all know who would win that fight.

I might be a bit confused so if someone could help that would be great. How does mssj have a 500 time or greater multiplier when ssj 3 has a 400 time multiplier?

Its clear that SSJ is winning this debate,almost everyone tried going SSJ once in their childhood when they first saw it. G5 only affected some OP fans and some non OP fans.

Golden Experience Requiem solos🗿

Both Both is good- Heavy from TF2

I personally believe grade 4 ssj is 2,000 times becauee literally at half power goku surpassed trunks in everything and then when vegeta went back in the time chamber and goku was half power fighting cell he wasnt impressed but the moment goku went full power he completely shocked

I actully don’t agree with this video, here’s why. He’s saying That SSJ/Super Saiyan has a 50x multiplier, witch is true But later, he says grade 4 has around 500x multiplier witch is *False* In the guide, it is stated multipliyers; SSJ1 = 50x SSJ2/Grade 5 = 100x SSJ3 = 300x ---- With this logic, he is comparing and highballing SSJ and comparing an SSJ3 instead of an SSJ, and lowballing luffy. Simply put, I think gear 5 would be better, it would be around 30-100x multiplier with better hacks so I’d have to go with gear 5! *Like and Comment to spread this!

Good video I agree but I'm confused about how is grade 4 ssj a 500x boost if ssj3 is only a 400x boost?

Where is the almight vs s class vid

people keep underestimating cuz goku has a lot more forms now and tbh that makes visualizing power much more harder. base form namek goku is absolutely insane already, let alone Super Saiyan 1.

this comment section is straight goku glazing and luffy hating and yall cant honestly deny this heres what i think, ssj will always be more iconic, UI might be more iconic than gear 5 right now, but all the gears are much more unique and creative than any of goku's transformations

Is ss grade 3 is 500× base wouldnt it be stronger than ss2 and ss3?

W Lonk

(Video idea) Do you think the entire S Rank heroes from one punch can take on the Vegeta and Nappa (Sayain saga)

like technicly we have grade 5 ssj and thats ssj2 and that can rage from 100x-1000x as u said for grade 4

Super sayain is just more iconic in my opinion because it kick started the popularity of forms, if there was no super salaam there would be no gear 5 Luffy or most anime forms.

Why cant everyone just agree that both are cool

Why is gear 5 white ? I mean its suppose to be the SUN GOD right ? so it should've been either red or yellow ? I'm just really curious . I like both forms

Gear 5 is a good transformation ngl but it isn't iconic as super sayian

The only thing about gear 5 is the toon force element. Goku is better, but would the toon force element make him loose?

i like how some people take the word imagination of gear5 and stretch it soooooo much like one time i saw someone say and I quote well luffy can imagine one shoting goku like wth

Didn’t Carthu debunk the 500x multiplier?

Either way, this debate is about 2 monkeys becoming glowing legendary monkeys Sounds like Michael Jackso-

Kaioken Goku > Gear 5 Luffy. I'm being generous by only using Kaioken and not SSJ so Luffy can stand a chance. If he had even an ounce in the first place.

Right ssj is a x50 multiplier then there's a 2nd grade, 3rd grade and ssj fp. The 2nd grade gives a significant stats boost overall from ssj and the 3rd grade gives you an even bigger buff than the other 2 forms but at the cost of speed. Then ssj fp should is above grade 2 and 3. Base ssj alone is better than gear 5 but then ssj has 3 more grades to it.

Yeah ehen you said what is stronger and what is more useful i imdenetly was like super sayin is stronger but gear 5 is more useful

I feel like gear 5 has the type of hax that would give goku some issues, but wouldnt stop him from beating luffy's ass

that explanation of ssj may be tha weirdest one i've ever heard pleas no offense dude your videos are amazing and i love consuming them but dang full power ssj was a dub invention due that the actual full power ssj is the one that broly shows in the dragon ball super broly movie and that is confirmed in the databooks, the "4th grade" ssj is nothing more than a controled version of ssj, grade 2 and grade 3 are called to SURPASS the limits of the super saiyan and by description the 4th grade takes it to its limits so that tells you that the 4th grade is a control for the transformation, while grade 2 may be faster and stronger (x60 multiplier in my opinion) it tenses the body and does not let the mind to be calm as the ssj nature is to not to be so. If you start reading how does Ki works then you will know that a calm mind equals more power, so grade 2 in brute attributes is better than normal ssj but the anger it produces may reduct the power of the user, that is why Goku only gets to the base ssj to make his body and mind calm. So the 4th grades only has a x50 multiplier, but in every escenario gear 5 gets demolished cuz for transforming into super saiyan you need a minium power that goes to 2.400.000 to 3.000.000 and that power level is alredy small star

Im here to debunk all "gear 5 is more iconic than ssj" with just 1 question Did gear 5 appeared in The Amazing World Of Gumball?

tbh you can see that gear 5 is from the ultra instinct well idk from the manga but in anime form

I guess all Luffy form are like kaiyoken form due to their after effects

I mean, super Saiyan Three, I would say it does have it's draw though

Mastered super saiyan is still 50x, not 500x. So you're basically saying gear 5 is stronger, because it's also at least 50x+ toon force. And yes i'm talking about transformation only. I'm well aware Yamcha could solo the Bleach, Naruto and One Piece world in 10 minutes.

Isn't "100 FOLD" WAY more than 100x? I thought "fold" meant like "thousand" or something? Or at least "10 fold" is actually "1000x" or something. I don't quite remember.

If you wanna get technical originally super saiyan 2 was referred to as grade 5 before goku named it ssj2 in the buu saga so it should be grade 5 vs gear 5

They arent even remotely close in utility; one gets toon force and the other gets a power multiplier. I dont understand the comparison

The fact that this is even a debate is stupid

Grade 2 multiplier is 62.5 I think because I did me calculations

W take

Gear 5 has Low-Tier toon force, but a 50× amp from Super Sayian is nuts.

Nice int namek ost

This anime fan base is so toxic I just wanna go back in time to when everything was simple like dragon ball was my childhood anime I watched it everyday I was hyped when there was a knew episode every could just agree on opinions now everyone’s like fighting over if gear 5 is better then super sayan or if super man beats Goku just have your own opinion u could be watching a video no u just have to fight over stupid pixals I mean like jeez just go have fun watch anime play sports just have your opinion I’m gonna have kids one day and I don’t want them too have a stupid argument over who’s a better character or who wins in a fight I mean like just have your opinion just enjoy the anime u watch and ignore hate this is why anime gets so much hate cuz people can’t learn to have a opinion just shut up and watch what u wanna watch now please stop fighting heck half the people aren’t even gonna read this and go on and keep hating so just watch what u wanna watch when u wanna watch it

Instant Transmission

Me seeing the title: WTF