Schools: *learn from mistakes* Also schools: *Don't allow students to retake tests or improve otherwise*

for me, grades are an all round demotivator. High grades = stops trying Low grades = gives up

My middle school teacher once told the class: "I hate the grading system, I feel that it's limiting student's creativity. So I became a teacher to teach students and telling them how much it sucks so maybe there's a chance one of them would grow up then change it." Honestly, the best teacher I've had.

When I entered AP Art, I was shocked. My teacher told us we could draw when she was talking, we could read when a video was running, as long as we were inspired and willing to create. Why can’t more classes be like that? Drawing during class helps me focus, yet I felt like a criminal whenever I did it

“children grow up learning to walk and talk, but when they get older theyre told to sit down and shut up” -some reddit comment i found

"The purpose of school was to figure out what the teacher wanted and then give that to them." This is the realest fucking thing and it makes me *furious*

I actually don’t remember most of what I’ve learned in school because I was so obsessed with grades that I just studied really hard and spit it out in the test. That is what my teachers wanted me to do: not to learn, but to pass the test.

One time my teacher in elementary told me- word for word- “this is too creative”. WHAT THE HELL? I was in elementary, let me use my damn imagination I did everything the paper asked, but just with my own spin on it

Good grades never made me feel "happy" or even good, they just felt neutral because they told me "That's what you're supposed to get" and every other bad grade just made me feel awful. There was never a 'good' grade, it was just the grade you were supposed to have.

My time in high school: "How are you all falling behind? I only assign an hour of homework a night!" "Probably because 6 of our 7 teachers assign an hour of homework a night"

I had a music college professor who hated it so much, he said to us from the beginning: “If you attend three music concerts and write your papers with your genuine review of each of them, no matter what, I will pass you through this class.” We didn’t even have to pay for the concerts. The last one was a full on orchestra and he himself was playing violin. We need more professors like you, Dr. Walz. A lot of older professors don’t like this system either.

It's a no win situation for top students. My little sister is one. She got scolded for being noisy by simply asking what she misheard (her hearing isn't that good, but they wouldn't allow her to sit in front). Then there's also the teachers who complained that top students are less sociable than average students and that they prefer to socialize with the latter. Who in the first place pressured top students to be quiet and behaved to the point of paralysis?

I remember my dad told me once that when he was a student, he usually got pretty bad grades, so one time he decided he wants to change that, and he studied so much for a test, that he memorized the topic word for word. The teacher was convinced he cheated and gave him an F.

"Failure is good" "The grade doesn't matter " Then why do I still have nightmares about failing tests when I'm 42?

In my opinion, the first 1-3 weeks of school are the best because nothing is on the line. I actually feel that I learn more and retain more in those weeks until all the teachers simultaneously decide to assign due dates for papers, quizzes, and tests all on the same days.

My Psychology teacher said something that still sticks with me. He said "If you come to class every day with the assignment done, you get an A. If you come to class and don't do the assignment, you get an A. If you dont want to put in the effort, you won't get anything out of this class, but if you try to learn, you will grow by the end of this year.

My middle school gave out "tickets" to kids who obeyed the rules. In actuality they only passed them out to the bullies who behaved once in a blue moon, because my constant upstanding performance is an "expectation" that doesn't necessitate reward.

"we're told failure is good yet we're punished for it" really made me rethink every single time i've ever been upset over failing a test

I remember being in 10th grade, massively interested in history and mythology and everything along those lines. My teacher was very impressed with my knowledge, he told me as much. Near the end of the year he had to pull me aside and told me something along the lines of “I know you know pretty much everything I’ve taught in this class already, but your grade can’t be the one you deserve because of the amount of late assignments you’ve handed in.” I had proved that I learned all the material, that I knew everything that was being taught but because I was late on the assignments it looked like I knew and had learned nothing. After that point I had never tried in any class because I didn’t feel like it was worth it anymore, I did the bare minimum to pass and didn’t care about the grade because I would’ve just felt worse if I did. I was too sickly to do assignments on time all the time with all the assignment heavy classes. The way grading works pisses me off

It's crazy to me that when you started talking about avoiding risks, I basically had a flashback. My favorite teacher was teaching this technology class, and for one of the units we built robots. I loved it. I loved the actual building, the coding, and how when something didn't work I could change it. When finals came around, he said that anyone who didn't want to take a standard final could build a robot that could complete a simple challenge. I had the exact thought process you described of "That's too much effort and risk. I know I can ace the final, better just play it safe." It sucked because I really wanted to mess with the robots again, but I was already swamped with my other finals and I just made the calculation that taking the easy A would make the other finals easier. So there I was on finals day, trapped in a desk, filling out the little bubbles so fast that I had ample opportunity to stare at the wall and think about how much more fun I would be having if I had built a robot instead. No one else built a robot by the way

"My teachers tell us to dream, but don't let me sleep"

So it’s basically like getting up to get the dishes because you wanted to and then not wanting to do them once your mom tells you to do it.

It really is true that above all else, school teaches you to be quiet, obedient, and just like everyone else.

My 5th grade teacher straight up said she wishes she didn't have to give us assessments and tests. 10/10 teacher.

Gotta love how we're forced to spend the most important parts of our lives being emotionally abused for the sake of learning in a way that is awful for learning.

For me, getting a bad grade just screams at me "Your life is over. Your not going to succeed in life, nobody's gonna want to accept you into their school, you're just dumb, hopeless, and sad." And getting a good grade just makes me feel temporarily relieved.

I think a good way to conduct a class would be like a D&D campaign. The teacher(s) have the information and general guidelines of what students need to know, and then they work together to figure out what they want to learn and how to best achieve it.

god, the motivation bit hit home for me. i used to draw so much, back when my only reward was the joy of the process. nowadays i barely draw and when i do i am extremely slow and i struggle. i'm crippled by perfectionism and my reward being "you did it"-points, approval from peers and maybe some more popularity so i can use art to earn money on the side. the process has become agonizing instead of fun. it is so hardwired that i can't get rid of it, no matter how aware i am.

you know, for a time when everyone tells you, “have fun these are the best years of you life!” I feel very contained and drained of anything good i used to have in life. I can’t wait to get old enough where i can get rid of school in my life. That’s not good.

You know something’s messed up when students are EXCITED to be sick and stay home.

Hooray for deciding that fear and punishment are problematic sources of motivation and for some of us choosing not to pass along generational trauma. "iT hApPeNeD tO mE aNd I tUrNeD oUt AlRiGhT"

When I was 7 my parents bought my mom an old upright piano. There was a beginning piano book in the bench. I pulled it out and taught myself to play the piano and read music. Then my parents had me take formal lessons. There were graded recitals with report cards given after each recital. Many of my marks were “C”s. So I thought I was just very average. Fast forward to my early 30’s. I was cleaning out an old chest and found my recital cards. In very tiny print at the bottom was a legend. Turns out a C meant “excels at”. So all those years I thought I wasn’t good enough to pursue music for a career, which is what I wanted to do. It’s taken a long time to believe in myself as a musician, and some days I have doubts, but I am finally doing what I love.

I love the Carl Sagan quote “My experience is, you go talk to kindergarten kids or first-grade kids, you find a class full of science enthusiasts. And they ask deep questions. “What is a dream, why do we have toes, why is the moon round, what is the birthday of the world, why is grass green?” These are profound, important questions. They just bubble right out of them. You go talk to 12th grade students and there’s none of that. They’ve become leaden and incurious. Something terrible has happened between kindergarten and 12th grade and it’s not just puberty.”

It's weird that people assume garbage collection is an inherently "shitty job". Yes, you're going to smell really bad at the end of the day but so will the guys who work at the morgue. The garbage collector keeps human living space clean and comfortable. He improves the functioning of the community and helps with public hygiene. This is honorable, dignified work that shouldn't be looked down upon because it's "unskilled" or "dirty". Edit: By "shitty" I mean it's somehow a "shameful" or "failure" job. I am fully aware that it's exhausting and not at all good for the person in the long term.

After years of being an ADHDer in the school system, I have had to relearn how to fail. For so much of my life I was punished by the school system for thinking out of the box and getting things wrong but I have learned that that is the only way to gain a true understanding of the world around us. Failure is the greatest thing that can happen to us because that is where we truly learn and yet that's not how we are graded. Especially when it comes to homework assignments. Homework assignments are take home quizzes that are graded based on correctness, not how much the student engaged with the material. It's a terrible sentiment and is so genuinely harmful to students creativity and problem solving. You can't be a problem solver if you aren't willing to fail. You can only solve cookie cutter problems that you have crammed into your head a million times through rote memorization. I hope one day this can change but I am not confident of it.

Now imagine all of this but for someone who is neurodivergent. I have Autism and ADHD. With Autism, everything you need to learn is incredibly overwhelming, not to mention the loud environments, the cramped rooms, the smells of odours, the cafeteria food texture, the social anxiety you feel and how lonely it is to not have any friends. Though the majority of these problems can be solved with a quiet room for just you, and people like you. However, ADHD is an absolute beast... Here's Jonathan. He's 14 years old and he has ADHD. His current hyperfixation is The Legend of Zelda. Jonathan has to write about the civil war, but his brain is so incredibly messy, and he has no motivation to learn about something he has zero interest in. Because he has ADHD, rewards do not make him more motivated to work, that is not how it works. When would I ever need to use this infHow long is the master sword actually?o. It's... It's- uh..How many Links have there been so far? Wind waker...Hero of Time...hm... oh right Link, the hero that fights wars, that reminds me of my assignment... uhh.. I was gonna write about iDoes Link and Zelda like each other? Which generation of the-t they.. Uhm, oh sorry what was I saying? I should write about the civil war right... but it's so boring, I really really really really really reallu realluy realelrly realylyl realylymlm realvc reALlY reallLY REAALYLlyg don't want to search about it... it's so much work... I just.I'm gonna open youtube, I can't... I just can't...I can't do this...Ooh a tears of the kingdom playlist!!

"If I don't grade attendance, my students won't come to class" "That means your class isn't engaging" That reminds me of some storytelling advice I once got: "If your audience is cheering for the villain, it doesn't mean the villain isn't evil enough, it means your hero is boring" If you're encountering a problem, it might very well be that your approach to the situation is the real issue.

"Without grades, how will students know how well they're doing?" Short answer: You talk to them

Despite being good at English and not doing any studying for midterms, I passed all my English classes, though physics was low, at that point my parents said it was fine because I was absent for a majority of school thanks to illness, they never got mad at me for failing Chinese mathematics or Chinese history, so far the latter is doing good but Im still struggling with the former, and I can barely get my mind off of anything, stop listening to anything without being fearful and anxious of failing, to the point that I want to just stop going to school, to just stop going outside, and I just want to curl up in a ball and disappear, I just want it to stop

“In her place was an anxious teenager who saw school as a barrier to her future; or just a means to an end. And who had missed all of the learning that was supposed to be happening there. School it seems had gotten in the way of her education.” Although I am a few years older than a teenager, this phrase describes how I feel about school as I attempt to slug through my last 6 college courses.

"We're told to learn from our mistakes, but how can we risk making mistakes when everything is on the line?" This just sent me to another dimension how do i get back

It's crazy to me that there are literally hundreds, if not thousands, of videos, essays, articles, etc. about this, and yet nothing has changed

I’m 15 right now, and wow this hits so close to home. I used to be such a curious kid, and I’ve watched my work steadily get worse as I start pulling crap out of my ass, instead of putting everything into projects I used to care about.

It’s even worse at the corporate level. I worked for a company that had a push where it said ‘INNOVATE, DON’T FEAR MISTAKES!’. Of course there was no budget earmarked for ‘innovation’ (everyone had to make their numbers) and, wow, if you were a penny short the hammer came down. One of the good things about school is that if one learns the right lessons it can prepare one for how the world actually works and the scams that support it.

Hmm, this is probably why videogames are a happy place for a lot of people. No one forces them upon you, the reward most of the time is just getting to experience it and they're actually interesting/engaging, and if you don't like it you can just move on. Which is pretty much the exact opposite of school or most work.

The scariest part of getting constant A's isn't that they don't feel earned, it's that they lose their luster and become the norm for the student. When I got straight A's for the first time, I was ecstatic; That was in middle school. In college, getting all A's feels like an "oh, good job, you passed" moment.

I was 17, getting ready to go to a state college when a college rep. told me they didn’t even open HS transcripts. The bubble popped; my parents and teachers had been lying to my face for 17 years straight. Grades were less than meaningless, they were in fact insidious. Designed to measure sucking-up points and keep teachers feel validated. I went never did another piece of homework Junior year through Senior year, my folks would start screaming about grades and I would rip the assignments to pieces in front of their eyes. Teachers learned to stop talking to me because I would be completely honest in my apathy towards their powerlessness. I went from near 4.0 to like a 1.8 GPA. I graduated on time with the rest of the top students (could have finished a semester early but decided to take AP exams) and no one has ever seen my transcipts even through my BA.

Reminded of how my foster parents took my trumpet away and I was forced to drop out of band class because my math grade was low despite the fact I've historically been bad at math. Like I have report cards from 1st grade that have stated that I'm not doing well and that I need extra help. Being forced to drop band did not improve my grade, but it sure as fuck made me into a very resentful, angry, and very depressed teenager that turned into a bitter adult. I also never received any extra help in math. I am also now an adult who has a gotdamn anxiety attack over being asked unexpected math questions that are fairly simple.

The danger of grading: My brother very quickly determined that if he got good grades, he'd be expected to keep getting good grades and then his friends would make fun of him. So, his scholastic history would be him getting barely passing grades and then slowly climbing until he was getting actively _good_ grades at which point he'd realize he was gaining achievements at his actual level, and his grades would immediately tank to start the process over again. Not only did he not want to be mocked for getting good grades and being seen as a nerd, but he realized that if he stayed mediocre, he would be expected to be mediocre and there would be no risk he could disappoint anyone because they didn't expect anything out of him, so he made sure that he never achieved beyond that level.

This video is like every shower thought I had as a crying teenager.

I’ve hated school the way it is for a while. I’ve always loved learning, but school isn’t learning when the focus is put on the idea that if you don’t meet a certain standard, you’re a failure. You’re worthless. You don’t deserve a good place in the world. I used to love reading, and it’s not like I hate it now, but there was this dynamic put on it. “Read this amount of books by the end of the quarter or else”. If something is threatened to be taken away from you, or even given to you for a certain task’s completion, it diminishes your resolve and compassion for that task. But no matter how much I preach, everyone seems to just think I’m losing my passion for learning.

I could get an F, I could get an A, it doesn’t ever phase me because I spend my time in classes teaching myself useful skills like coding. Crazy to think how even if I failed all my classes I’d have a leg up on all my peers because I’ve built up real skills for the world. Shows how useless our education system is.

As silly as this must sound... This totally explains why I can write 10k words in a language that is not even my own of a silly little fan fiction, but will procrastinate until the last seconds to write a single one page essay for a grade.

This is why kids love video games... they are systems that reward you for curiosity and taking on challenges, kids can't get enough of fortnite because they are not getting that fulfillment irl

“Everything was a calculation, everything was a decision. Everything was based on what is my teacher looking for. What is the right answer and what is the path of least resistance that will get me there. The purpose of school was to figure out what your teacher wanted, and then give it to them.” The moment I heard that and my gut reaction was “well yeah, duh, of course that’s all school was.” Before realizing how messed up that is was a life changing moment for me I think.

i am currently 13 and i am in a private school. whenever i ask too many questions or have to go to the restroom way too many times (i have excessive peeing). i get punished. in class, i always answer the easiest questions because i am scared of my successful friends's picture of me. sometimes whenever i get a question wrong i feel more scared of doing it. sometimes i just feel like i dont want to answer questions or do a project and that fear just keeps making me have worse grades. i cry every time i get bad grades on a test and my teachers dont care if i dont understand the class. there's that one time where my teacher saw me crying because i got a C- on a test and he just stared at me and left.

The one meaningful that thing school taught me is how to succeed at something by putting in the least amount of effort possible

"if she got an A, her parents gave her 10$" If I got an A, my parents gave me a little bit of consideration.

Here’s what grades meant to be i basically barely passed everything in school, right on the line Passing for me, meant not getting the consequences for not passing It meant not needing to suffer more under a system i hate It wasn’t a joyous moment of accomplishment, it was a moment of relief, a moment of avoiding consequences

I had a class where the teacher graded us entirely on participation and effort. We were all encouraged to ask questions and go on deep dives. It is still my favorite class of all time.

POV: It's the end of semester and your grades and motivation drops

When I was 14 I once got an automatic F on a math test because the teacher was 100% convinced I cheated. Why? Because I did long division in my head without jotting down the steps. Wouldn't give me the chance to prove myself either. :/

I have not looked at my grades in two months. Compared to when i constantly checked my grades, i noticed multiple things 1. My overall mood has increased. 2. I've been paying attention to smaller things in class a lot more, learning more in general 3. Ive been focusing a lot more due to my better mood, and I've been much more talkative and interested in what im learning in class, feeling more excited when walking into school

For me, school has always been determining what the teacher wants. I've said objectively true facts and been physically yelled at for it. Every time one of my friends got something wrong when they were right, I told them school isn't about whats true, its about what people want to hear. I used to ask all of the questions, I was the kid who spouted out-of-nowhere facts somehow pertaining to the topic. That has only gotten me into trouble and hostile situations with other students or even teachers. I've had many a teacher ask why their students aren't learning anything. The answer, the teachers aren't teaching. They give us lists of facts to memorize and them forget after exams or tests. We don't have debates, because in these arguments there is a right and a wrong. That's why my favorite subject in middle school was math. There was a right and a wrong answer, but the further you go with math the less absolute the answers are until its just as dubious as all of the other subjects. School doesn't work how its supposed to and the students are the people getting blamed for it.

I dreaded grades. I was an undiagnosed autistic until 27, so my school years were hard. My old Boomer parents believed that grades marked your worth as a child - bad grades meant disobedience, which meant brutal verbal abuse. School was my own personal hell for 12 years. Never understood people who are nostalgic for their childhoods.

It always baffled me that there's litteraly a field of science called "science of education" and that experts in those subjects are *never* consulted for anything regarding school or teacher's training

The more I learn about how messed up our education system is, the stronger my passion for teaching grows. If I can't make a change myself, I will inspire our youth to do it. I will bring hope to the world, and it's all because of the teachers and role models who inspire me to make the world a better place.

I was afraid to watch this video for a long time because my self-worth was fully tied up in my high grades. I think that sentence speaks for itself for how necessary this video was

It's appalling how a photographic memory will get you way ahead in most schools and colleges than actual intelligence. Every time I do an exam, especially for SST, I get marks cut because of "improper framing of the answer" which is to say that I lose marks because I couldn't quote the school book.

"The moment you take away the reward, they have no reason to keep doing it." At the end of every school year, I got an award for perfect attendance. Until one year when I was disqualified, because I had to leave class early so I could seek medical attention after being injured. It made me realize the school didn't care about rewarding effort, only results. My attendance dropped signifi after that.

I am autistic. As an autist, I can't just go along with whatever. I am curious, and I can't just stop that. My autism protects me from conformity, and so I've never stopped asking questions that my teachers didn't always like. But, honestly, I like that. I enjoy considering questions that the rest of the class simply won't. I feel smart when my AP calculus teacher doesn't answer my question about complex derivatives or roots of unity-- I can always find answers online. I hate school because I love learning, not dealing with people. I can't wait to go to college, it'll be easeir than this; it has to be-- college is more focused, more academi, more in-depth, etcetera: I won't be bored becasue the classes that call themselves "Calculus" can't teach more than a single formula a month; I won't be quite as bogged down with paperwork from six differet classes that only hint at what you're actually trying to learn; and I won't be quite as exhausted by meaningless nonsense. I want to cure ageing, learn 日本語 to fluency, do Quantum Physics and Vector Calculus, learn to code in Linux and C++, understand all the math there is to understand, and not be bogged down by stupidity.

Last year we had to write about our favorite season of the year. Fall is my favorite season, so I got really into this paper. Over the course of a day, I wrote the perfect paper. Spending the most time on it as possible, going through many iterations. It captured everything I loved about fall, and I was so proud of it. When I actually care about something I am writing about, my true style of writing shows though and it becomes very descriptive and elaborate. I can admit the way I write is odd. In a way, it reminds me of how lovecraft described everything. My admiration for his work has rubbed off on me. Maybe it just wasn't what the teacher was looking for, maybe they were looking for an essay. It would have been a typical essay I would have written nonchalantly because it wasn't interesting or didn't align with my writing style. Whatever it was, my perfect showing of my feelings on fall, was marked with a C. I have not written in my style since, and for some screwed up reason, my grades are better. Here's what I wrote, because this is still one of the best things I have written. "The waft assists the cool breath of Autumn, distributing its mellow circumstances unbridled far and wide across the lushness of crimson woodland. Following the chant of rustling, leaves plucked from the tree's foliage. While the wind drifts, it seems they become animate, dancing their own particular steps. No two leaves perform the same motion. They each display individuality in an entirely different manner, and with time they stagger down until they join the hoard throughout the underbrush. The breeze propels the fragrant Maple deriving from the secretion of trees. A trace of wood smoke from chimney tops; then the outlying growl of thunder as though emanating from depths of the loch. Haze rests on the gloss of the rippling water; reflecting a wash from the orange radiance of a setting sun. This is what I mean by beauty. A long-tailed bird has presented itself to leisure upon a bough, serenading its rendition of Autumn. The song is a symphony. The symphony is a composition. With Fall's symphony surrounding me, I can view its elegance. There is not at all one aspect that I do not adore. My sentiments carried onwards along the leaves. Autumn is the season of beauty, I declare, but only complete after it ends. Completion must be achieved only when the last leaf dances away. The symphony will cease, leaving behind the memory of Autumn's music. But who knows if the memory of this beauty may not linger even beyond?"

When I went to school I hated it. When my mum would ask "How was school today?" I'd answer "Bad" pretty much every time, I had several friends whom I still miss today, I wasn't bullied or anything, I was pretty good in class, good grades and behavior and all that, but there was never any joy. So my mum would say "Well you might not like lessons and work but at least you get to see your friends!" and I'd say "I'd rather not have to go to school just to see my friends." Otherwise she might say "It's the weekend soon!" or "It's the holiday soon!" (we're British, so you guys might call it vacation). I didn't know how to express it at the time, but I hated the idea of spending 5 days out of 7 just waiting for a weekend, and then you don't even get to enjoy the weekend because you have to spend it recovering from the previous week, and preparing for the next. (Having to do homework on weekends certainly didn't help with this calculation.) The thing that made me stop complaining was when she said "Wait until you're in secondary school, it's much more fun and you'll enjoy it." I told myself "I'm just a kid, I guess they must be right, everyone goes to school I suppose it's just a fact of life..." So secondary school comes around and guess what. It's just as bad and I still hate it... The same discussion happens again "The holidays are soon" "You can spend time with your friends" etc. etc... I told myself a second time "I'm just a kid, they must be right, everyone else seems to be enjoying school, I just got unlucky..." At some point I started to lie, she would ask "Did you have a good time at school today?" and I'd say "Yep". I was sick of hearing the same things every time I said I didn't like it, part of me hoped that if I lied to myself I might start to believe it, part of me knew that my mum worried about these things so I didn't want to upset her. So eventually secondary school comes to an end too. I'm pretty sure I'm the only person who didn't attend the achievement ceremony (of the people who passed, that is) [I don't want to call it a graduation ceremony because I'm pretty sure that's an American college thing, this was for a European baccalaureate if anyone knows the proper word for it]. I can't deny they did a good job of teaching me, I am pretty good at maths, physics, chemistry, I speak a couple extra languages, I can read a map, I'm slightly more musically educated than the norm... University comes, my teachers had been telling me that university was the place for me, I was looking forward to it. Living away from home for the first time was great, making new friends was great, being responsible for my own timetable and daily routine was great. This lasted about six months until I realised I was just doing more of what I had been hating my whole life, but this time I'm taking on student debt for it. So I dropped out. My parents encouraged me to try university again, so I took a gap year to chill out and tried again. I dropped out a second time. "You've just got to find the right course" someone told me... so I tried a third time and dropped out a third time. The problem was that I was looking for the dream I had been promised when I was in primary school. The "You'll enjoy it when you're in secondary school" promise that had overlapped onto university. I was told I would enjoy it and I didn't. Every assignment I completed was a chore. My dad told me "But you find it fulfilling don't you?" I didn't. When I was 19 years old answering maths questions about chemical reactions and quantum mechanics, it annoyed me just as much as when I was 9 years old and answering maths questions about counting boxes, or trigonometry problems. It was more of the same. At this stage I wasn't able to say "I'm just a kid" any more. I had to do something, and listening to what people were telling me to do wasn't going to work any longer, they obviously weren't right, and hadn't been right all along. I'm now 24 years old, I'm still living with my parents, I've still never had a job, I've dropped out of university 3 times. In the last couple of years of me trying to find something else to do I've taken up hobbies. I gave Duolingo a try after a friend showed it to me. I found that learning languages is actually pretty fun, which makes me wonder why I hated doing it at school so much. I have been making things, board games, models and so on, using my 3d printer. When designing the geometries of the things I print, I need to do a certain amount of trigonometry and I've learned that doing those calculations is actually quite enjoyable also, which makes me wonder why I hated doing it at school so much. Even the simple act of running I've found to be fun... I sometimes wish I had more opportunities to be late for a train so that I'm forced to run and catch it, because running is fun, which makes me wonder why I hated doing it at school so much. Looking back, I see all the things I was made to do as a child, things that I might have enjoyed doing if I hadn't been made to do them... it just makes me sad. Lots of people my age are coming to the "I wish I had listened" stage, where they realise how much of their education they missed out on by misbehaving in class and not doing any work. I like to think I didn't miss out on my education and the only thing I can say about it is that I wish I hadn't listened. Thanks if you've read the whole comment. I don't know how many people are going to read this, but I wrote it just to get it off my shoulders as much as anything else.

School: mistakes make us smarter Also school: Oh no, you've failed your final test, now you must lose a year of your life seeing what you already know to finally complete your final test again

I remember recently I failed my 10th grade shop class midterm. However I was shocked that my grade didn’t really go down, and my teacher even seemed to blame himself. I realized then that I actually showed interest in that class and wanted to grow my abilities. My teacher noticed this and called me a good student because of what I wanted to learn, not from what I didn’t learn. We need that kind of mindset in every class.

Im currently in what would be high school in the us, and that example in the start saddens me, because thats just straight up bad teaching. In my class i ask alot of questions and i always try my best to understand everything and all my teachers have been understanding and excited about it

The main thing that stands out to me: Sure, *let* students work together, but do not *make* students work together. I always hated group assignments and that was a quick way to sap all the life out of an otherwise interesting assignment.

Damn, I didn't know my name was Maria.

The funniest thing to me is that I was just like Maria in the beginning of her story. And I stayed like her in the beginning. Only because I was an undiagnosed Autistic kid with horrible ADHD. Teachers wanted me to be quiet and do things like every other kid and I sometimes did, but when you have ADHD and you LOVE a topic the teacher is teaching, and you can't keep your inside thoughts to stay for long enough, you can never shut up for very long. I could be a good student but was framed as a bad one because I never did my work the way teachers wanted. I also would sometimes just not do the work at all because of my autistic driven perfectionism (If I can't do it right, I won't do it at all, or I'll do it MONTHS late, and it'll be amazing). Not only that, but I had/have horrible grades, I'm not/was not in class often, and genuinely would be deemed a lot of teacher's WORST nightmare. But I've come to appreciate it. Sucking at the system has made me actually understand topics deeper than a lot of my classmates. It's also really made me love learning and learning to ignore grades because they really don't matter (the only reason I say this is that my uncle went to Harvard and works at Costco. Tells me how much that education really mattered). I learned to embrace failure and really enjoy it. A lot of teachers actually really enjoyed me and made me their "fav student" because though I never showed it completely in my work, I loved the topics they would teach, and I would never write a paper for a grade. I remember Freshman year of high school, my ethnic study's teacher wanted us to create a piece of multimedia or hand drawn art to reflect what we were learning in class. A month after this was due, I turned in 2 hand drawings I spent weeks on, and a painting that I was so proud of. He oddly enough ACCEPTED IT!!! And my god, he loved it. He couldn't give me an A or B, but he did give me a really nice C and asked if he could keep one. I said sure, and he apparently had it on his wall for a bit after I left his class. That alone felt better than an A ever could. And I've had A's weirdly enough. I worked hard for one but felt nothing from it. My parents were proud, but I sure as hell wasn't. I almost got a 4.0 once, and it felt like shit. After that, I just focused on learning and doing what I enjoyed. Even if that meant my grades were shit. I'm in college at the moment and taking a jumble of a mess of classes, but they are all things I want to learn about and enjoy! I'm doing what makes me happy! And oddly enough, I've had 2 of my friends follow me down this path. My friend's mom even gave some incredible advice to me and her daughter, which I live by: "A grade does not define your intelligence or your understanding of the subject. A grade does not determine your value." And I stand by this. I had a long history of doing poorly in school mainly because I'm a perfectionist, I have ADHD (which causes me to procrastinate and do things waaaayyyy later than normal along with forgetting things), I have trouble with deadlines (ADHD), and because I never seem to be able to do my homework exactly how they want it (I'm always too detailed, I sometimes ramble, I provide too much research?? And sometimes I overanalyze XD). Oddly enough, this is quite common for my dad's family. Yet, all became scientists or engineers XD What I've learned over time, though, is that sometimes being a "bad student" helps you learn more. Along with helping you do things in a way that works for you.

As a student, I repeatedly try to make my teachers enjoy teaching, but the problem with my highschool is that they teach you, but they don't try to have you learn

I was a choir teacher for 5 years and only graded based on whether or not students acted respectfully toward the learning process. I.e. if they were disruptive to the learning/rehearsal. Long story short, everyone got an A and almost all of them learned to or improved their ability to read music without pressure. One principal did not like this approach so he asked me to include more statistics based off of collected dated (testing and assignments). My solution to this was to make up assignments and tests in my grade book and cook the books. Everyone still got an A if they were respectful in the room. I didn’t even force anyone to sing who didn’t want to, because I knew eventually they’d get into it, and they all did. I was blessed to be teaching choir,which let’s face it, no one cares about your choir grade.

this year my grades are the highest they've ever been, but simultaneously my mental health is at its lowest

As someone with possible ADHD, I've been working on school a lot and doing good, but everyone says I've gotten much quieter. TBH I can relate to maria. I used to be happy and talkitive and all that but now, no. Because in my school, you cant talk during lunch, in between classes, even at hometime or in the bus. Interaction is a big no. And also, homework and tests. We have tests every other day, and complete things like algebra and ratios within one or two days. Our teachers just write problems on the board and if we do badly in tests, we're idiots who know nothing. Parents dont do much either, You're on your own here. Nobody dares ask a question. Half term is over and people must have asked like 3 questions in all subjects (7 subjects) combined until now. Another thing, This is how it is in the 6th grade.

I know this video has been out for a long time, but I only recently discovered this channel and have been working my way through the catalog. Thank you for this. I was like Maria as a little girl. Teacher's pet, read everything I could get my hands on, excelled in every subject, tons of diverse interests. My test scores were always high, advanced for three grades above me all the way through high school. But I still barely graduated high school with a 2.5 GPA. I burnt out in HS. I learned the material in school, and I had a teacher that taught me how to use logic to increase my multiple choice test scores on things I didn't remember. I refused to do homework because it made no sense to me. I hated not being able to understand the concepts I was being taught, disillusioned with how interesting these subjects could be but hating the way it was taught. Once I was an adult, I took my education into my own hands. I read books, I read papers, I sought out educational content on YT, and I taught myself all those concepts I failed to learn in school. I regained my curiosity, my love of learning, all the interests I had bypassed in my literal childish disillusionment. I knit and am learning to sew, so I needed to re-learn more complex math skills I dumped out of my brain when I left HS. I write novels, so I've had to learn media literacy, how to do research, how to critically analyze material, how to recognize patterns, dissect dense text. And that's before the nitty gritty of learning to actually write technically. I've been educating myself on politics, history, culture, debate and discourse, critical thinking skills. I have the luxury of being a stay at home parent for almost a decade and I recognize that, but I have never been more happy of more fulfilled being able to spend my days learning about things that make me happy, chasing my interests and creativity, falling down rabbit holes of research or finding new things to love. The public school system failed me, and I am proof the arguments you're making are very real and valid.

Children deserve as much respect as an adult, that is when you actually start learning from both ways.

My best friend of over a decade killed himself because his grades were dropping in college and he honestly thought he would never be able to succeed in life because school never taught him that learning from your mistakes is the most important part of education.

The only reason we are hard working in school is because of the grades, not knowledge. That's what the education system turned us into

I agree with you almost entirely. But also: My son is in a school that became gradeless and also homework-less school two years before he started school (our local district school). While it has caused him less stress, it has also caused him to not really care about school or learning. Teachers would teach according to the concept, but they didn't seem to be educated enough about it, and not understand fully how it influences everything about school and teaching. It just became school as usual, but asking less of students. He and I also found it hard to understand his level and where/if he needed help. Because the assessments were always so vague. Now in the last years (year 8 and 9) he is on another school in the district with the same system. And they quickly discovered glaring holes in his knowledge and skills. And are working to help him improve. So it matters a lot that the school, the teachers, don't think that the gradeless and homework school mean that they can just chill, and students will automatically want to learn, and do learn what they need to. And. This school grades two times a year in grade 8 and 9. It is required for further education. And him getting grades for the first time, was a wake-up call for him: What they do and learn in school has a purpose, and he needs to have learned certain things to be able to progress in the higher school system. So at least for him, it did provide something of value. It could have been provided in a different way, by teaching students more about how their school skills are necessary in adulthood. How certain effort is needed in order to, well live. And that in order to able to choose what to work with, and in the way you want (say a cosy desk job, and not having to do manual labour), you have to have learned certain knowledge and skills. And they, and I, apparently didn't do that enough. But that set of grades woke him up. It became real to him.

In college, grades tend to feel like weights. I could get straight A's all semester and a single F makes all the effort worthless in the final grade. Don't even get me started on the teachers that grade on "I like/don't like this" in my major (Visual Design). I just can't understand how you grade creativity and art when it is supposed to be subjective.

"Students need to work together, not be in competition with one another." I've had teachers who not only don't acknowledge that, but seem to be against students helping each other. Just around a week ago, a teacher of mine got mad at and berated a student, because she was helping a girl understand the lesson. They weren't even bothering anyone, they sat together and barely made any noise. I couldn't even notice until the teacher brought it up.

Grades made me terrified of risk. Everything I did while at school was either rewarded with a good red number on a piece of paper or a bad one. The former meant _nothing_ , but the latter meant incredible shame and humiliation in the eyes of 20+ people. Your number is smaller than theirs. You are worse. And now, every time I need to step out of my comfort zone, a voice in my head judges me, evaluates my chances and forces me to lay low, to avoid attention, avoid trying, because I may get a bad red number if I do. And all the shame with it. It's been hindering my creative and personal life for 6 years now. I wish I could get this red pen out of my head...

Great stuff! I’ve been teaching for ten years, and I’m just starting to figure this out, especially the power shift and student freedom. We have to stop blaming students for not being engaged by boring, lifeless learning experiences!

A grade is just product quality. You learn to memorize and replicate. That's pretty much how modern schooling is. The grade just shows how well you're able to perform rather than really learn. Hence the reason why most parents can't really help their children with their school homework, because they forgot. You're taught to only know and memorize the important stuff needed to pass the test at the end, but you end up walking out with a grade and losing that knowledge because it is no longer needed.

I remember back in high school, we had this INSANELY rebellious kid in our class, who absolutely despised the entire school system. He constantly talked about how school teaches close to nothing when it comes to critical thinking, logic and common sense. He also disliked the idea of university, which although I didn't really agree with, I totally understood his points. He'd go to the point where he just wouldn't come to class or refuse to do work. He would also voice his opinions to the teachers. But you know what's funny about this? The teachers almost NEVER argued with him. They completely agreed that this system is effed up, but they couldn't do anything about it, and they explained that they must teach based on a pre-written template. Kinda sucks that even the most passionate teachers are stuck teaching in a way that the system wants them to teach.

they say that mistakes are proof that you are learning but say you dont learn anything if you make mistakes

i’m one of the people who does well at grades, but i’m still barely hanging on because of this new “well-rounded student” everyone is looking for. i’m autistic, i’m the opposite of well-rounded. i don’t participate much in extracurriculars on paper, because most of it is by myself and/or too niche to have a club. i do well in class because i learn well but i struggle with homework and projects. and i can only get A’s or zeros. i have to learn a subject to A level to feel like i’ve learned it at all, and i’ve never figured out how to do anything at half-level. so my grades often look like: C+ (8 As and 1 missing assignment). which is super frustrating

School Guy: "Hey, do you think we should ask the students what they think of the grading system?" Other School Guy: "Students can think?"

fun fact: my high school was actually designed by an architect who was known for designing prisons! and I can wholeheartedly confirm that it felt like one too!

im so burned out right now i’m a really good student and things come to me easily and im really good at putting things into words but it’s getting to the point where my need to try soooo hard it happening like every day. i need a break, if i keep trying and pushing wayyyy further than what i need to just to feel happy and good with my grades and myself and im running out of effort to give. im not learning, im staying up until 2 am working on an assignment writing stuff down stressed out of my mind waking up at 6 being so sick and running out of care or passion and just being so exhausted but the scare of bad grades or being less smart is so scary i hate it they need to prioritize our stress and well being over a basic unimportant in the grand scheme of things assignment. one assignment does not define our smartness but we are feeling so stressed about being smart for it that we’re slipping mentally and becoming worse people. i’m so sick of caring about my grades and being “smarter”, it just scares me into needing to keep it up and if i don’t, then what else do i have? i’m just stressed and upset and burnt out at that point, not even smart.

School is like strict parents, they think they are teaching kids how to behave, but they are just teaching kids to hide what they really feel and want