"Create faster than you can talk yourself out of it". Wisdom right there!

Sorry but no point comparing these synths. If you want an ultra simple, sawtooth, house music Moog bass like in your video, then yeh sure use a Moog. If you want a world of complex sound design and sequencing possibilities, use the pro 3.

I was thinking about selling my Grandmother for a Pro 3. The Pro 3 sounds really good and I love the modulation capabilities and it’s sequencer. But every time I turned on the Grandmother I couldn’t let it go, it also sounds incredible. Ended up getting a Matriarch to go along with my Grandmother and patch them together which is a lot of fun.

I have the Grandmother, the first two I was sent by the supplier were damaged and faulty upon delivery, like serious, obvious issues. The third one they sent was fine for about 2-3 months, then the cutoff knob started rustling, - probably loose carbon in the potentiometer, - I wouldn't have minded but I'd hardly used the synth, and then Moog told me "Knob Usage" issues are not covered by the guarantee. Still, I use such experiences to tailor my buying choices, and not buying Moog anymore is a great way to save money, IMO. I've owned a lot of Moog over the years, - been buying synthesizers, etc, since the mid 80s, - and although I do love the Moog sound, I have always found Moog gear to be the most likely to fail, or require regular servicing, which is a shame, and considering the retail prices I would have thought they'd sorted out the quality control issues years ago, but apparently not, and it would appear many users of the sub £1000 Moog gear have mentioned similar issues across the internet. Rant over... love to ALL, feel no hate

I have a matriarch (along other moog stuff like dfam and sub and Minotaur) and a Peak I bought the Peak cause I was inspired by your videos, Ricky, and I totally love it. It’s my go to synth for everything and it has replaced all my vst (we talked about it sometime on IG) Matriarch is just pure joy. I love creating sound from scratch and getting lost. I love the option of semi modular to make it interact with other stuff. I love throwing on a sequence and just play with parameters. I also love its limitation, like paraphony vs polyphony, which forces me to adapt and roll with it rather than having a pure whiteboard where I can do anything (which can be intimidating and not productive a lot of times). The fact that I’m forced to Record it All the time it’s a feature for me, not a limitation. Finally: that delay is one of the best in the market, in general not just for a synth. It would be a huge pedal on its own I’d only love moog to improve its syncing and sequencing with ext sources cause it’s a pain but I totally love it nevertheless. When I just want to chill, matriarch is what I always turn on

my understanding 📻 the magic of the Moog sound in this comparison is even in the pure oscillator sound it already has a subtle, pleasant motion to it 🖤

I think that you're right when you mentioned - it is the mixer that makes also the difference and it saturates. I love my Grandmother and I believe it is one of the most influential synths of the previous decade, but I also want to get Pro 3 too, I think it is one of the greatest inventions of Dave. Nice thoughts you bring there. Cheers!

I have a Grandmother and I love it, that being, I never dreamed that It would be compared & favored over a Pro 3. I always compared Pro3 to Sub37.

Both great synths but saving presets is just so nice to have… Pro 3 for me

I think a more apt comparison would be the Matriarch and Pro 3. Grandmother is a ton of fun at first, but the fact that you didn't patch anything seems to be common across its userbase: the semi-modular nature of the grandmother is really not the selling point. There's just really not that much that you can do with the patch points it comes with, and I see most people (including myself) just using it as a presetless mono synth. The Matriarch absolutely set my heart on fire: aftertouch, velocity, paraphony, paraphonic sequencing, stereo modulation, stereo bbd analog delay (sounds INFINITELY cooler than the spring reverb on the GM), 4 oscillators, stereo filtering, and plenty of attenuators. The Matriarch really reigns supreme and still manages to inspire the same patch-from-scratch mentality but with a way more versatility. Grandmother really feels like a stepping stone --- I would get two Matriarchs if I could afford it.

Pro 3 actually kicked out moog matriarch out of my setup. Pro 3 offers so much more to me. I still have studio electronics SE3X for some over phat sounds, this thing also smokes every modern moog. I've come all the way from a moog fanboy to a non moog guy)

I also have Pro 3 and GM and I quite easily replicate GM sounds on Pro 3. The key is to have a ladder filter selected without the compensation which makes it to behave identical to GM. Its important to tune all oscillators volumes at half volume or even less otherwise ladder filter is easily overdriven and gives you that crunchiness. While the Pro 3 can sound like GM, the GM is unmatched in the speed of workflow. Somehow having less features and having knob per function makes you dial in needed sounds much quicker! I know GM inside out, I can create any sound with it with my eyes closed and that's what makes it great.

Good video! Grandmother will never leave my studio. It’s just perfect for bass lines and has that special sauce 🙂

… what a coincidence. I acquired a Grandmother two days ago! I floated the idea of adding a Pro-3 to my setup, but decided to go a different route. Not only did I want a monosynth, but a semi-modular one as well.

I agree, Moog's just have that special sauce. You can't just throw a ladder filter on something and expect it to sound the same. There is some special magic in there. I've hard angel tears or unicorn hairs or something. I love the Grandmother, but the Matriarch has been next level for me.

I was so on the fence between choosing between a Moog Matriarch or Sequential Pro 3. But it was the mod matrix that had me choose the Pro 3. The Pro 3 sort of scratches that itch I have to go Eurorack. Both synths are great for a controlling a modular setup. But the Sequencer on the Pro 3 is so much better than what Moog has. When I ordered the Pro 3, I had a Moog Mother 32 on my wish list, just in case I needed that low end. but the Pro 3 impressed me, so I removed the Mother 32 from my wish list. However, the Moog Studio 3 still interests me, so that may end up in my studio some day,

The Matriarch and Pro 3 in unison with seven oscillators and an abundance of fundamentals and features to characterise, the sonic possibilities is endless.

Why not use the Moog Ladder filter on the Pro-3 with this comparison? The 4pole OTA filter used is the Prophet-6 filter.

I have to be honest Ricky, you looked like you were having more fun with the PRO3 .... (and i'm not completely sold on the Moog either)....

People rave about the moog mixer and filter, but I swear there is something about the oscilators that can't be replicated. Tried putting other oscs through the Grandmother mixer+filter and my suspicion is correct

i sold my Moog GM due to its limitations, but i loved the sound. Got the Pro3 SE (wooden panels) i also have an MFB Dominion 1 that has really beefy oscillators :)

There's definitely a difference in the sound, the Moog sounds warmer to my ear

It seems difficult to choose but I play the Pro3 much more than my G’mother. This is the only place where I can imagine writing such a sentence :)

Venus Theory made a good point, the filter makes a large the sound of a synth. As an engineer, it just sounds more saturated. Anyone using Ableton Live Suite, go drag saturator onto a sine wave, and start increasing the drive knob. You'll hear the same effect of more harmonics being added, which in turn also increases perceived loudness

I think the Moog sound has more to do with the mixer (cp3 based I think) than the filter. But of course it is a combination of all the elements in the signal path.

Well the Mixer on the Moog distorts when you turn the knob above 12 o'clock. I'm sure one could get them very close sound wise.

we always like your vids, enrique.

Nice work! Thank you! I’d probably keep the Pro 3 and run it through a saturation pedal or something else to fuzzy it up. Just because its so flexible.

I mean you can't really compare the moog ladder filter with the pro 3's prophet 6 filter as you did here, the prophet 6 is kinda different and more aggressive. But I understand if you didn't want to make a comparison with the same filter type but more of the prophet sound vs moogs ladder. The pro 3 is just a more aggressive synth in general, I use it a lot, I'm a jazz fusion prog metal keys player and it naturally works well for heavy styles and as you said it terms of feature set the pro 3's mod matrix, sequencer and analog distortion is a dream on paper and is more suitable to compare with the matrixbrute. The pro 3 does have that resonance compensation with it's moog-ish ladder filter to keep the bass going for sure. Then there is the OB filter too which sounds very different from the prophet filter and the ladder so I guess it's more flexibility, sound design capabilities and complexity vs tride and true analog beauty. The Moog Grandmother sounds amazing though, such a rich sound!

Great point about not having presets forcing you to commit to recording something at whatever progress stage you’ve reached. I know my habit is to just save presets, and not write music, because I’m always just ‘collecting,’ *_in preparation_* for doing something great… but that ‘great’ moment never arrives. It just keeps getting pushed back….

I'm curious why you are using the Prophet 6 filter in the Pro 3 and not the actual ladder-filter? Or did I miss it somewhere in the video? As an owner of a pro 3 I can say it's a super fun synthesizer! I think moog has their own sound and I'm very curious over Pro 3 vs MiniMoog 2022 but seem not to find any video on it :/

Nice comparison and funny thing is that i never thought I could get a Moog and actually saved up enough for the op-1 But then when it came time to pull the trigger I couldn’t do it. For me it just didn’t see like a good investment. I read the customer service is aweful to teenage engineering and also I was worried that I would actually lose it because it’s so small I did a query as to which synth would he the best for the money I saved and so many folks said the Moog grandmother and then the dark version went on some sale and that was it for me. I love this synth ! I like how you use it with your beats etc. I don’t see too many folks doing that. Sounds great

the mixer on Moog does asymmetric distortion witch is a distinctive Moog thing

Definitely sticking with my Pro-3, nice comp video though

Maybe I missed it, but did you try changing up the filter circuitry on the pro3 by using the ladder filter? It looks like it had 4-pole OTA. Moog uses a ladder. This may make the harmonics a little more on the same playing field.

Pro 3 has bass resonance compensation. When you turn the resonance up, i does not loose as much low end. Have to say the mid filter position sounds a lot different on the Moog...a lot better to me. Thanks for the video! Pro 3 is still a beast!

I think the Grandmother is a players synth. Simple soulful and inviting (whatever any of that means lol). The Pro 3 suits a patch designer who does more work on the DAW. To square that circle, if you must, a Subsequent 37 could work for you.

Ah man! I was lusting after a Grandmother… until I saw your videos on the Pro 3 … and now you are going to turn me around again? 😂

it isn't sponored by Moog, but let's be honest here, it doesn't _need_ to be

Hey Ricky, have you ever tried the Matriarch? If you like the Granny that much, I think you would be absolutelt in love with the Matriarch, it’s the best modern Moog in my opinion.

I dont have them (yet), but as keyboard player the solution is obvious: polysynth 4-5 octaves need ca. 90 - 110 cm, while pro3 and granny would need 125 cm together, so add both side by side on top of your rig ;-)

I had a Sub 37 for years but shifted it because I was always bummed out about the filter with resonance up. Apart from that it was the single best synth I'd ever had, it was just a beautiful instrument and you could really see the decades of experience they've got and their commitment to quality. It was super luxury! I am tempted to try the Matriarch just cos for bass I could patch into both filters with the same envelope, but with the resonance off on one of them, so do the 'two Moogs' bass tracking trick they used to do in studios in the '70s, but on one Moog. Or at least I'm hoping you can do that on the Matriarch 😬🤷‍♂️

I think you might be right about the saturation being the secret sauce. Because, the difference between those two seems to be some throaty, vocal singing in the upper mids, that's just audible through the part closed filter. That makes sense to me, because my Manhattan SVVCF also gives that secret sauce. And I always felt that the Moog CP3 style mixer at the front end, dialed past halfway was a big part of that. If I switch a signal into (orignal version) Ripples or some other nice filter, it sounds lovely, pure liquid, but it doesn't have that same 3D vibe. I highly recommend Manhattan Audio's CP3 style mixer; it's also pretty small and cheap with nice knobs. That Moog-style mixer saturation is an absolutely essential part of my modular chain now. Basimilus, Cloud Terrarium, Generate3 all sound crunchy and larger than life through it.

You can get the fat bottom end with resonance up by using the lfo as a sine wave oscillator, patch keyboard in to it and patching its output through the mixer or mixed in post filter in the multi.

The moog just sounds PHAT!!!

You brought back the sponsor "turn around"!!

With a lot of Sequential synthesizers, they do a good job of being more versatile than their competition, but sometimes lack that "wow" sound right out of the box...It's in there, you just have to tinker around a bit and find it.

thinking of getting the grandmother, its sooo nice for basses

Great vid! They compliment one another very well

One of the white keys just died on my Grandmother. Way bummer. It’s the filter overall tone. Moog is just warm and luscious.

I love that you say Moog the correct way 😀

What a great beat and sounds amazing Ricky

The Grandmother is not in the same class as the Pro 3. One envelope. One. ONE-that’s the Moog Grandmother. Yes, the VCOs in the Granny sound great, but the Pro 3 sounds great also. But whatever.

The Grand seems to have more character more range in the mids.

Where's the melodics link? I'm interested in checking it out, and I want you to get credit for the referral.

No easy answer, there are so many variables. For starters, you should be using the Moog inspired ladder filter (middle position) on the Pro3 to emulate Moogs. Then deactivate the Q comp on the second tab of the filter settings. Then play with the OSC levels to get appropriate gain staging, that make a big difference on Pro3. As well as filter drive, because Moog filters are kinda aggressive by default. That should help you get into the ballpark but in the end Moog & Sequential have a different sound. I own both Pro3 & Moog (Voyager). The Moog sounds fatter, and has more of a vintage vibe, no question about it. Its also more straightforward with no menu diving. The Pro3 is more of a Swiss-army knife, endless possibilities. I lean more towards the Moog for effortless 60s/70s classic type sounds on sampled drums and what not and the Pro3 for 4/4 stuff with the sequencer and crazy modulation. It's really great having both, don't let go of the Pro3 as you're certainly also in honeymoon phase with your new Moog!

Love your videos as always!

I prefer the bass from the Moog than the pro three pro sounds digital IMO still a cool synth though 🤔

Why not keep both? I have the Pro3 and I love it. I also have the Moog One 16 and I still keep the Pro3 and the Prophet 6. Something about Analog just sounds so full but the Pro3 fills that itch that I have for heavy crazy sounds.

06:22 HAHA ur sense of humor LOF IT 😂

From just a short listen, I think you helped sell the Pro 3.😁 🎶🎹🎹🎵 Play On

The 256 step sequencer is great for live jams.

Thanks' Ricky that was tight.

Do you think the bass is better than on the Matriarch and Sub 37?

Funny learning to play Avril 14 when Aphex programmed it with a sequencer. Great tune!

I had the grandmother for a bit less than a year, then sold it. Honestly I don't think it's worth the money for what it gives. Yes the tone is great but it is too limited, I will probably get the pro 3 one day instead. I have a little modular system and patching with the GM wasn't that convenient as i thought it would have been being semi-modular, and for my actual situation the GM was taking too much space. If you have no space problem and be able to invest more, I'd go with the matriarch. Matriarch + Pro 3 would be a dream to cover mono synth duty, with a bit of nice paraphony.

Why Grand mother and not sub 37 for exemple ?

The Pro3 can produce the same sounds as the Moog for those saying otherwise. I have put both Moog Minitaur vs. Pro 3 and the range of the it is wide dynamically. Moog is tamed to a specific sound and the Pro3 is the wild child

Going straight into the video and doing the ritual intro after is jarring! 😂. Still glad to see it though. Losing bass when raising resonance on the ladder filter is just the nature of the filter design. Question - did you level match these when doing the AB tests? The Moog had more oomph with the raw oscillator but I couldn't tell if it was louder or actually beefier. I don't know if it's possible with the patch points but could you take the second osc out and bypass the filter to keep the bass when raising the reso? (set to something like sine or triangle not sure what waveforms it has).

Dig it! Thoughts on the Grandmother/ Pro 3 vs the Subsequent 37? That’s my bass go to. Love the content as always!

Just like when I was a kid with toys, I want to collect them all.

Great video. Always wanted to go down the Moog road, just never really have. Definitely got me interested! What is that stand you have on the desktop? It’s a great design.

Loved the grandmother, but mannnn you gotta try the Matriarch if you dig the Grandmother.

Either one 👌yes please but to have both, a blessing

Awesome video as usual Ricky! Really appreciate your insights. I have recently been offered a trade on my OP1 for a Grandmother. I currently have the Sub Phatty and Minitaur and was wondering what your thoughts are between those and the Grandmother. I love the sound of the Grandmother and the flexibility. But I am just not sure if its worth the trade with already owning two Moogs and if I will be producing the same tones. Any feedback is much appreciated!

Curious why the Grandmother and not Subsequent 37?

you ask you get it, Thanks

Great content

it sounds if there is a transient pop at the attack on the envelope of the pro3 ..maybe the secret sauce is the envelope with the moog grandmother..I dunno both are a m a z i n g synths

It’s made in the heart of the southern Appalachians. The mountains are solid quartz crystals. The energy is magic here. But not for the weak hearted.

Hi Ricky- thanks for the video. Thoughts on the GM as a first analog synth? 👀

its to different beasts... got a pro2 and a subsequent 25... the moog is simpler but heavy and well balanced across the entire signal chain... the OSC are warmer and fatter (very settle) and when saturating it in the mixer or with a little resonant it has more beautiful overtones and cuts way better through a mix... the pro (which i use mostly with some OSC from my modular) is more experimental... with the sequencer and tons of modulation it gets me deep into modular sounddesign without patching a single cable... both together... sweetspot :-)

That's exactly why I replaced my Waldorf Iridium with other wavetable synths, simpler in features (kinda, Modwave is still a rabbit hole), but fuller in character and sound (paired it with a Waldorf M). Sometimes you get so deep in the technical featureset that you forget about how good something simple can sound straight out of the synth and keep the creative juice flowing. P.S. love your improved lighting / aesthetic, damn I even love your taste on furniture ahah, are those ball lamps / plants from Ikea? All the best mano

Synth noir .. very dark lighting..spooky Halloween episode😮

love synth!

If you do 1:1 sound comparisons you should set attack to the same value otherwise it will obviously sound different. Also if you spend tons of money on Moog it would make sense to "gravitate towards it" otherwise what is the point of having it in the first place?

No denying the Moog's mixer is nice, and I've yet to try a Eurorack version that is as good. Granny is far from perfect but it's fat and begs you to play it. I love a lot of Dave's work but the Pro3 sounds boring to me.

I’m at my local store debating between this and the Sub 25

The grandmother totally rules imo. We want more, man! Love your sound.

Definitely more bass from moog at 2:12

The transients are punchier but still smooth, Lower and mid harmonics come through more, it’s definitely louder from the start but I assume just level matching with the Pro 3 won’t provide the same effect. The difference is probably negligible to most people but if a creator hears and it’s enough to keep them inspired then that’s all that matters

Hey Ricky - Nice video 👍 The X factor is simply the name. Yeah, gonna get shot at for that but Mark at Automatic Gainsay did a 'Can you spot the Moof' test and people can't. Dozens of synths and soft synths can make Moog sounds and put thenm in a mix an, really, no one could tell and - although producers don't want to hear it - the majority of listeners couldn't care one way or another. It's the music, not the means. USING a synth is another matter. I have a Grandmother and it's probably my favourite synth. Great sounds but that's not why I love it 😊

Succinct and to the point - the Pro 3 is obviously more versatile - but you're probably also better off getting a fully polyphonic workhorse synth and a top tier mono/bass synth like the GM to round out the studio (IMO). I love having a digital synth capable of giving me so many unique sounds when exploring. But I always want a funky or growling bass line - so having a dedicate go-to that's mostly WYSIWYG and patch-able like the GM would be an easy buy from me if I didn't already have the Model D filling my needs nicely.

I have both.

Interesting that you're talking about bass on headphones that you cant hear the bass on. I hear that bass here on headphones :)

That bass i like.

Sound should always be primary, and features secondary. Plus, limitations usually boost creativity. The Pro3 has a modern edge to the sound, but the Moog has that vintage vibe.

@ 5:58 . when homie doesn't realise the quantiese actually made the beat worse and must have some nice speakers up loud for that bass to sound good.

Are those the Aiaiai wireless headphones? They couldn't reproduce anything with the filters all the way down at @2:30? Do you typically have complaints about their bass response? Was considering picking them up.

When you compared them both Filtering to 50%. . . there is a very clear marked difference, the Moog sounding more low end and power. e.g. @02:11 here is a notorious difference (at least in studio monitors 🤓).