How is this cheating? It's just a learning tool. Devices like this will help people progress quicker and further than ever before and with less injuries. This is amazing for skateboarding and I can't wait to see how it helps level up the sport. Chris is just salty that this wasn't around during his prime.

It's literally no different than the old hold onto the fence while trying a trick method.

It's like learning a trick into foam, it's a learning tool to minimize injuries. This shits hitting the big leagues, gotta keep athletes fresh for international competitions

It's only cheating if you're a slave to ego. Foam pits, padded landings, helmets, these bars are a welcome addition to this group.

bailing is an art

If you’re claiming it of course it’s cheating but if you’re using it in the way Garrett used it to learn a trick then I don’t see a problem with it. Because you still have to bust your a** to land it with no rings.

Imagine somebody like Kelly recovering from his injury or an older skater getting his rhythm back. These are perfect for that

Jeron is so delusional or hes just a very simple man. "Im just trying to perfect my craft on my skateboard, not practice" 😂 That is literally what practice is bro.

skating teaches u that practice makes perfect. so technically it's practice

Hahaha Jeron having a hard time wrapping his head around the fact that he's been practicing all these years.

doesnt matter what word you use if you're trying/learning a new trick you are practicing

Is This Cheating?...Nope, unless you're claiming it

Totally feeling what Jeron is saying here

people only mad because they never thought of it.

I’m a former football player that skates now. I still have kind of my football approach in a way. I hydrate, stretch, have a set of warm up tricks. But then I let the feel and vibe determine what I want to skate/work on that day. But I have friends that just show up and start trying hard stuff. Different strokes different folks

It is not, it is called FUN =)

Even if your just going to skate your still training. Just cause you don't see it as training doesn't mean that's not what your doing. Your training your body, your muscles, your even training your mind. There's nothing wrong with training every skater does it that's how you get better

The semantics lol. None says we are going to practice skateboarding. We go and we skate and we kickflip a 1000 times to get it perfected which is the definition of practice LMAO: perform (an activity) or exercise (a skill) repeatedly or regularly in order to improve or maintain one's proficiency. Even if you go to a spot and just send it, your previous tries before you land the trick, ARE PRACTICE. lol

BMXers were using rope swings back in the day. I mean it wasn't super practical, but it was a whole lotta fun all the same. As an action sport community we've come to accept falling is part of the process, but anything that mitigates the risk of injury I think is good. Like you guys said I think this works for conceptualizing and feeling out tricks, but ultimately you gotta just huck it. Cheating isn't a thing, either your ARE or you AREN'T skating/riding etc. The discourse is always great though.

REGARDLESS OF WHETHER YOU LEARN WITH THE HANDLES OR NOT, YOU NEED TO LEARN AND PERFORM THE TRICK AND IT WILL ONLY COUNT IF IT IS DONE WITHOUT THE HANDLES. SKILL MUST EXIST, FEAR IS INEVITABLE IN ANY SITUATION.

Back in like 89. The homie Jarod D from Marblehead had something like this in his yard. He had a quarter pipe and his step dad made single kick snowboards and freestyle boards. He made him a peanut shaped big board too. No concave no nose kick. Kicked noses had just kinda started. The rope in the back yard was for freestyle practice. He said freestyle was the future of skatebloarding. I would giggle. I didn't wanna participate. In hindsight he was kinda right. I can't remember his name but there's no way he didn't industry. He knew way too much and worked tirelessly on snowboards.

"It's cheating but I would use it!" -- Crob

I think if someone can learn a trick without absolutely killing themselves then do that trick without the rings thats great 👌🏼

It reduces injuries. I know getting wrecked is a big part of skating, but it’s a big part of why I’m not skating much at all in my late 20’s. I have a job and obligations that get a lot harder if I destroy myself trying to relearn tricks I had locked in my teens. This could help keep pros healthier longer, help people learn tricks safely, etc. It’s gonna advance the sport.

If I'm at a skate park, I'm training.

It's pronounced Jinner like the guy whos in touch and uses KZfaq told you (Kelly) is it cheating when you sit down and practice kickflips or tres? or hold onto a railing...no. If you're using it in a video part...yes.

There’s so much truth to this debate. With this new skate generation also changes the mindset and thus the terminology

Same as a gymnast using harnesses to practice, to get muscle memory going. Its smart training, better than getting injured imo.

One time i entered freestyle skate contest and I got up in front of everyone and put on my Skater Trainers and ollied my fuckin' ass off.

I teach skateboarding lessons for a living. Often, clients will say to me well, he or she hasn't really practiced lately. I tell them, while I can teach you how to get better on a skateboard quicker and safer, what I cant teach you, is the experience. I encourage them to not think about it like practice at all, just go out and ride their skateboard: there's nothing quite as fun and rewarding as the doors that open up to you internally and externally by just going skateboarding.

Learned all my flip tricks on carpet and grass. Learned my balance on a round small attachable rail in the house and did stalls on. Mother always said, "Don't play ball in the house" Never said no skating in the house, haha.

Reminds me of learning how to kickflip holding onto my dads table saw in the garage

In skateboarding the only person you can cheat is yourself and the only way to do that is to not have fun. If Garett is having fun then hes winning.

They had a rope swing in a park in Japan(true players in hakuba) an the kids progressed super fast.

When it comes to the word “practice” plenty of people, including pros, use the word practice. Like “man I really need to practice my nollie flips because I don’t have them down perfectly” “dude just keep practicing your kickflips and eventually you’ll get it” we all practice when we skate. Training..?? Idk lol the rings are cool but when it comes to cheating, it make sense because there might be certain tricks that you would NEVER try without those. Like, without those rings, you wouldn’t even try certain tricks at all. Period. So it is a tool and I would use them…. But without them there are tricks that I wouldn’t even try, so It’s a tough debate. Seems totally subjective.

I don’t think there’s such a thing as “cheating” in skateboarding outside of competitions. It’s both an art and a sport but more art than sport.

bro has to be trollin jeff dechesare and garret now omg bro

I see this the same as holding onto a fence as example learning how to ollie or kickflip. This is that concept to the extreme but if it unlocks the mental block for a trick hats off. Skateboarding is evolving to "training" working out wasn't cool when I grew up skating and now we have skate companies and skaters that have training facilities with dietitians and personal trainers. Times change and so does the level of skateboarding, I see no difference than doing a trick in grass cause you are scared at first.

I mean there's no rules in skateboarding so it's a no from me. But he did do it without the rings afterwards so it's no big deal anyways.

It is all training and practice until you pefect it (which you never do). The use of word "practice" or "training" or "trying" is just semantics. What about the other "training devices" and helper tools such grip tape, urethane wheels, wider trucks, a kicktail, and a nose on your board, convave boards, and shoes, pads, or wax or the clothes you wear? What about wax, or prepping a ledge or a rail, or building a ramp that is not kinked? Are all those cheating? I remember when some vert skaters would invert their two front truck bolt with extra long bolts their front foot could catch onto for lofty ollies-- we called those "cheater bolts", and it was kind of like cheating as if you were using "skyhooks" to do an ollie. They were still having fun and experimenting with their skateboard, but if they used those in a contest, i think they would lose credibility. I used to think of wax as cheating, and would say you need to skate faster instead, but the technical combos on such diverse terrain would not have happend if not for wax and bondo and plywood and sawsalls and tennis shoes. Just skate and have fun and let go of the drama and negativity.

Not cheating. Everyones done their first kick flips in the grass, or holding a fence, rail, pole, etc.

If you've ever tried a trick multiple times, you've practiced that trick, by definition. This conversation is crazy 😆

Imagine this at the vans skatepark in the mall in the 2000’s 😆

I hope you enjoyed that conversation because it had me seeing both sides … super interesting.

I think its a great training tool. It definately will make progress quicker and lesser injury in the process. Skateboarding has evolved over the years. We just need to embrace the change. Im in my 40's and now skate with my two sons. And i love it. Skating had change my life and i want my boys to appreciate it too. We have our bonding skate sesions daily. Its like therapy to me. Seeing my boys landing new tricks makes me so proud. Skateboarding for life 🤟

Chris straight butchering names on purpose. The disrespect.

😂 Why are you guys taking it seriously? Its skateboarding. Its a children's toy that we still use as adults. Chill out. There's no rules. If people wanna hold onto shit and do tricks then thats fine. If we're talking about video parts then of course its not acceptable. But to learn new tricks and have fun, why not? Not everyone is trying to be a professional.

I wouldn't necessarily call it cheating. I would call it cheating if someone was using the rings in a video part😂. This thing is a training tool, just like those wheel stoppers that help people learn flip tricks without the risk of slipping out.

Skateboarding is an Olympic sport now, meaning that there are always going to be those elites that skate to compete (Ribiero''s Yuto's, Nyjah's), and therefore need to "train" a lot. Then there's the ones that skate for passion, and although they won't feel the need to "train" as such, they would probably like the idea of "practicing" a trick before actually doing the trick, perhaps to overcome a fear. God knows if I'd have something like this 20 years ago to overcome my handrail fear, I'd have gone A LOT further in my skateboarding career, without a doubt. I wouldn't say it's cheating, not unless you're tryna claim tricks with them, which nobody in their right mind would do. It's just a new way to learn skateboarding, and if that somehow opens the sport up for more people to want to engage with it, even just one person, then I am down with that.

There is no cheating in skating. One could argue a board with concave is cheating. You dont skate metal wheels? must be cheating. You waxxed a rail? cheating. Making shit easier and enjoyable isnt cheating. Core skaters are mad annoying.

If you can't hurt yourself you're not skating

Brilliant learning tool. I used to have a rail that I learned grind ticks into a grass lawn

I feel like saying it’s cheating is BS. It’s the mentality of “I had to go through shit and it was hard, so you have to do it the same way.” Like having the opportunity to get hurt isn’t a good thing.

Learn how to skate like a real original core skater is my opinion but progression is gonna sky rocket probably because of these hoops. Put them on a zip line with a safety harness so you cant fall when doing big stairs and rails

They're acting like they're landing these tricks in a skate part and green screen the rings out lol

I'd rather use those rings and learn blunt tres than to have never learned blunt- tres

.. i grew up in a world where "i can dial this trick in at a skatepark..And Then i take this to the streets and throw this into a line"... in my mind.. doing it that way is practice for the real world.

Humble opinion, But I cant start my session without doing a flat four as practice or "training" to make sure I'm firing on all cylinders, And knowing what stance I'm stronger in that day is pretty relatable I am sure.

Now you see how they learn their runs at SLS. There's a huge crane with rings on it that gets hauled off the arena when everyones learned their lines.

I learned hardflips by holding onto these beams under the half pipe so I could hang a bit long and stay over the board. Once I dialled it in there I was able to take it out to the streets. I think it is ok as a training strategy.

This is brilliant for learning

I think a better analogy would be "If you played soccer but only played soccer games it wouldn't be considered training or practice. You're not running some kind of drills or doing strength training or stamina training techniques. You are just there for the game."

My first kickflip was holding the table on my living room and then I did it the right way, and I think a lot of us did something similar.

As someone with recent injuries, I support being able to be supported while you heal and learn tricks. The end goal is just being able to do it right? Are they releasing skate parts with it? Don't be a boomer here.

It's the same as snowboard mats, trampoline mats etc. It's a mental preparation forsure. But practice is more the first few tricks (Ollie, kickflip, shuvit, 180) once the basics are done my Era was go skate park then film so "park' was like training.at 35, now everything feels like "s"training more than anything

I don't think it's cheating, anything that helps skaters build confidence on their board through some assistance is okay when they graduate to not using said assistance. Look at the skate stoppers, those rubber things skaters can put on their wheels to stop them from rolling so they can practice ollies more comfortably. I wouldn't say that's cheating either. Using just a deck on a trampoline to practice flip tricks while minimizing injury also comes to mind, harmless, because it's just a temporary circumstance as a means to build confidence.

Could you imagine someone going around with a crane set up to spots to get their trick?

I think this is awesome because of safety. skateboarding has always been an individual thing. If you use this tool cool. Our approach to skateboarding is what differentiates us and it speaks for itself.

Skateparks ganna have gymnastic handles at each spot indoor parks ganna sell like hotcakes now.

I bet when they changed the shape of the board all the old skaters thought thats cheating not having to use big heavy boards. Ive always loved skateboarding but was never able to land tricks. So always felt abit left behind. This is a very good idea to get used to the movements needed

idk, seems like you can hold your body weight while holding those rings for extra air time like the dude doing hardflip 5-0. yeah it can help but dont rely on that shit.

The actual title: old guys that are salty and willing to debate semantics for 15+ minutes.

5:24 nice Allen Iverson reference

To any skaters who are not birds, please tell me how your arms have ever been an integral part of momentarily cheating gravity and I’ll tell you how you are not skateboarding. Pretty clear cut, those rings allow you to skip the gravity attack which is the war every skateboarder wages to be able to plant the trick flag at the top of victory hill.

I'm going skating. Point blank

Doesn't matter what you think, every other country for high level skating is starting to use methods like this. They got 8 year old korean kids learning every trick under the sun using them.

That isn’t cheating. It’s training.

No. Not at all. Use it to practice or learn a thing. Then take it to the "streets". No different than a foam pit or whatever.

You never practiced a trick before??

its not cheating unless you get caught.. film all your lines below the waist line! lol.. nah,, i mean.., its like when you're a kid and you're learning to kickflip with just a deck.. or a deck and a trampoline.. or a kickflip with wheels and all.., but you're staying still.. it's not 'cheating' .., its just a way to get your confidence up.. get some muscle memory development... I don't think its necessarily wrong.. you can call it 'training and cheating'. ..., but for the ppl that can't do those tricks.., its ' learning.. and ...fun..' they still get the good feeling.. and it helps them get comfortable to later do it without those hang rings.. I'd love to play around with something like that.. looks fun/interesting

I thought cheating until you brought up foam pits 🤔

Talking bout practice! Not a trick! Practice! We’re talking bout practice not a trick, practice!

There is no right and wrong in skateboarding. It’s all subjective. I can say I’m gonna go skate flat that way I can work or some new / old tricks, but realistically we’re practicing. Now if I’m practicing for a certain contest then that’ll be training.

It's the same thing but different wording. You typically practice to prepare for a game in traditional sports. There's no games in skateboarding, so it sounds crazy, but same thing

It can work both ways, making something difficult first; like keeping up a bean bag then it's easy with a football, it's why I always skate at 200% gravity, super sayan

training, practice, Dubz hates words

For todays skaters, this is not cheating if they use it to learn how to do the trick. But just like “fake video spots”, this would not be acceptable in the 90’s and 00’s. As an old guy, eating shit was part of skating.

This is perfect for kids with autism who want to learn how to skate

It’s an Olympic sport now so everything’s gonna get nutty. I dig the parks but the days where the entire city was a giant skate park will always have its own generation with memories. A spot was illegal 99%-100% of the time and always was sick. Keep charging 🇺🇸🤙

In snowboard bigAir they use big inflatble crashpads to lern a trick. So why not using whatever you can to learn a trick in a save environment.Imagine skateboarding for a circus.At practice you would probably use every safety device you could to not get injured.Progress comes for shure much faster with the benefit of less injuries.

I mean for training anything should be allowed we gotta keep finding ways for people to get better without damaging there bodies like foam pits doesn’t matter if you are trying to learn triple backflips if you break your neck and cants walk again

Is the only last name Chris can pronounce correctly Vallely? Or what?

We play to win the game!!!

I think that landing the trick should speak for itself, regardless of the journey that gets you there. Is it cheating if a trapeze artist uses a net to reduce the possibility of harm if they bail? Or what if you never saw Garret use the rings but saw the clip of the land. Does the process matter or the outcome?

Kids these days are better than these host ever were 100% the fact that they tried to gate keep garret like they didn't know his name reveals their attempts to maintain a weak grip on their relevance.

dont be a hater..learning technique safe is bad ass!

At the end of the day, if it helps someone learn a new trick and push their boundaries, I'm not gonna hate on it.

Dude isnt trying to put it in a video part.

You could learn so much like that

Dubs got way stuck on the word practice. ❤😂