like savaitar said the more you time travel the less the rules apply, and thawn seemed to have done it a lot

​@jacobmulligan3832 yeah in the comics he is essentially a living paradox or to put simply, thawne can alter the time-line as much as he wants and never be affected and can never die

He was a copy of wells the device he used was to copy wells DNA and face

Yet, they still had Thawne using Wells' face in the seasons that followed.

It's actually similar to Prof. Hulk's explanation of time travel in Endgame. "If you travel to the past, that past becomes your future, and your former present becomes the past, which can't now be changed by your new future." Example: If you travel to the past and kill Hitler, the only way for causality to remain 100% intact and to avoid any "timeline remnants" is to then erase the events that would motivate you to travel back in time and kill Hitler, meaning you never do, meaning Hitler lives and does Hitler things, which then motivates you to travel back to kill him, etc. So, causality needs to allow for a sort of "minimum possible paradoxes" to keep the timeline relatively intact. If Eddie killing himself erases Eobard, then Eobard is never born, meaning Eddie is never motivated to kill himself, so he doesn't, so then Eobard IS born, which means Eddie kills himself to stop Eobard.... it forms a causal loop of timeline logic, endlessly paradoxical. So, by "allowing" the Thawne Remnants to continue existing, they maintain the integrity of the timeline as much as it is possible to do so. Thawne MUST kill Barry's mom, MUST become trapped in the past in order to end up being erased. It's well thought out.

​@@perrycarters3113suddenly I understand why time travel is the most confusing thing in media

Uhmm, this explanation makes sense, because it would mean that, in the original timeline where Barry acquired his powers in 2020, Nora Allen did die in the year 2000, for that reason the Future Flash prevents the Flash from 01x23 from preventing her die. It doesn't matter if Nora is killed by Reverse Flash or some thief, but she must be killed. What's not clear to me is that, if a fixed point is so important, how come the timeline is not severely affected by the time Barry becomes the Flash in 2014 and not 2020? Nora Allen's death is a fixed point because it motivates Barry to be a forensic pathologist, which consequently leads him to be in her laboratory on the day of the accelerator explosion, not to mention that it motivates him to be a fighter in against crime, then, the creation of THE FLASH is also a fixed point in itself, because it also triggers other events, among them, the creation of REVERSE FLASH and, consequently, the death of NORA ALLEN. So why can the explosion of the particle accelerator have the luxury of happening 6 years earlier without having any consequences?

Not necessarily. In the OG BTTF Timeline. The McFly's were an unsuccessful family, Marty was a musician, and he had a girlfriend. Yet despite altering his families history, Marty was still a musician, and had his girlfriend. Barry graduated with a double major in physics and chemistry. So, whether or not Nora was murdered in the OG Timeline, he would've ended up working for the CCPD. I do find it unlikely Nora being murdered in the OG Timeline because in Season 5 when Barry and Nora went back in time to get Thawne to repair the device they needed to use against Cicada's Dagger, like I mentioned in my OG Post, Thawne thought Nora's name was Dawn because that is her name in the OG Timeline, but instead in the Current Timeline she's named in memory of her late grandmother. Thawne's arrogance is what caused his problem in the first place. As I mentioned in my OG Post, the Negative Speed Force allows him to exist despite any changes to the Timeline. However, the one thing he cannot change is the existence of The Flash, he's like the Plutonium, or the 1.21 Gigawatts in order to power the DeLorean's Time Circuits. Thawne wasn't immediately erased because he was in a Time Period where he didn't even exist yet, Barry becoming The Flash is his fixed point, and he no doubt had some extra protection from the Negative Speed Force. Thawne was originally going to kill Barry as a child, but because Barry was rescued by his future self, Thawne decided to kill Nora instead, and due to the trauma he caused Barry it caused the change in the Timeline. So, if Barry is not in Central City when 2020 comes around, say for example he moved away because there are too many bad memories for him there, then Thawne's buggered because not only would he be erased from existence, but when he's born in the 22nd Century he'll never obtain his powers because The Flash never existed. However because time is like cement he had 20 Years before it became permanent, so he had to assure that Barry became The Flash in order to protect his own existence and fate. As to why Thawne was able to cause the particle accelerator 6 years prior to when it was destined to. The most logical explanation would be what I said in my OG Post about how the McFly's successful history relies on a fixed point that Marty creates when he goes back in time. Nora's death becomes the new fixed point for Barry becoming The Flash that was created by Thawne because in order to return to his own Time Period, Thawne has to make sure Barry becomes The Flash. The same goes for the particle accelerator incident, the fixed point still occurred, it just happened differently due to interference from a Time Traveller.

@@Doctor_Logic But in S9, our Barry saved Nora and asked Barry (S1) not to interfere but then who is this Thawne that our Barry is facing?? Why does the Flash(OG) of his Timeline no longer exist???And how and why does Thawne come to 2000 a few hours before Nora's death?? And how does he know Barry is there???

@@lilian6613 Gotcha covered. Barry (S9) saved Nora at the end of S2 creating the Flashpoint Timeline. After Crisis on Infinite Earths, the Multiverse was rebooted, so he's telling Barry (S1) not to interfere like he was told 8 years prior. It's another fixed point, Barry (S9) warning Barry (S1) not to interfere keeps the events he knows that are to occur intact. He's the OG Thawne who knows the Flash's history differently from what has occurred throughout the series. As I mentioned in my OG Post, any Time Remnant of Thawne from before Eddie Thawne sacrificed himself will remember The Flash's OG History. The OG Flash that Thawne fought with several times no longer exists due to Thawne's own actions. Thawne was originally going to kill Barry as a child, but because Barry was rescued by his future self, Thawne decided to kill Nora instead, and due to the trauma he caused Barry it caused the change in the Timeline. So, if Barry is not in Central City when 2020 comes around, say for example he moved away because there are too many bad memories for him there, then Thawne's buggered because not only would he be erased from existence, but when he's born in the 22nd Century he'll never obtain his powers because The Flash never existed. However because time is like cement he had 20 Years before it became permanent, so he had to assure that Barry became The Flash in order to protect his own existence and fate. I haven't seen the series past Season 5, so for the last part I'm going on any YT videos I've seen, or Wiki pages I've read. As I understand in the New Multiverse, Barry is mysteriously sent back to 2000 a few hours before Nora's death. The Season 1 version of events shows us Barry chasing Thawne through time, but in the New Multiverse several things have changed. The Time Remnant of Thawne that Barry encounters in 2000 has learnt who Barry is and has come back to 2000 to change Barry's fate by killing him as a child, hence how he knows who Barry is. He thinks he's already won because if Barry interferes he'll damage the Timeline, and is under the impression nothing will happen to him due to the Negative Speed Force. However, the one thing Thawne cannot change is the existence of The Flash. Thawne wasn't immediately erased because he was in a Time Period where he didn't even exist yet, Barry becoming The Flash is his fixed point, and he no doubt had some extra protection from the Negative Speed Force.

@@Doctor_Logic ok I understand but Eddie killed himself in 2015 and yet Thawne was erased even if he was not yet born in 2015, The moment he kills Nora should have erased him from the Timeline or at least made him losing his speed and his memory which comes from his Timeline but yet when Barry created the Flashpoint he began to forget the memories of his Timeline and yet Thawne keeps his memories And I wanted to know why Thawne S1 thought he was going to return home when he just created a different timeline by killing Nora so the future he wanted to return to would have been completely different from his original timeline due to the temporal change of Thawne and the original flash in 2000 which means that the original timeline was erased and replaced with the flash timeline that we know

He doesn't know, but highly suspect and knows his "potential" future self (from his perspective) did ruin Flash's life somehow.

You guys think 9x10 Thawne is 2x11 Thawne continued?

@@kyloren114 Umm…I haven’t gotten that far yet.

@@paulyont3092 It’s a good episode.

@@kyloren114 Good to know. I’m actually starting over from the beginning. Not just THE FLASH however, but all of the ARROWVERSE shows. I still have a long way to go to get to the 9th season of THE FLASH. Sorry. 😞

My theory is that the timeline has a past past (if you know what I mean, and also, if no, then yeah, time paradoxes are so confusing.)

Because causality. If you remove Thawne from the equation, then there’s no season 1. He has to exist for the team to have even come to this point where they can talk about him.

In that newly created timeline, yes, Thawne ceases to exist, but that version of Thawne is from a pre existing timeline who came back killed Barry's mother & modified the timeline, in order for the new timeline to exist requires the existence of the previous timeline as well to avoid creating a time paradox, because without it's existance Thawne never travels back in time to change the past. Thats why he is a time remnant, he is from a timeline that doesn't exist anymore in the current timeline but continues to exist as a prior timeline up to a certain point to allow the current timeline to exist, Basically the previous future becomes the presents past, strange concept I know but its how the Cws idea of time travel works.

@@alexsurber3424 oh okay

Basically what Alex said, there was an original timeline where the loop began, and that’s why Thawne still exists. Here’s the loop (before crisis): 1. Thawne becomes Reverse Flash 2. Thawne time travels to present day but gets sent back to the future. (S2) 3. Thawne time travels to the past & kills Barry’s mum (S8) 4. Thawne is trapped in the past, becomes Wells & trains the Flash 8 years earlier. (S1) 5. Eddie kills himself so Thawne doesn’t exist. That’s why they can’t kill thawne here, because if they did it’d basically be like causing another flashpoint.

Full circle moment

Thank you!

Fr. That’s why even the past is changed, but still keeps the events intact. Now, it’s our Barry who stops Thawne _that night_ but this scene still doesn’t make sense. Why is Thawne able to go the past of another timeline that he’s yet to create?

@@tideghostBecause when he changed the Flash’s past, he retroactively changed his own as well. It’s why in the OG timeline, 2x11 wouldn’t have found Flash. But hopping into CW’s 2016 and that we saw.