What's out there less than 5%?

Did you find one yet?

@@AndersBoman Check Westinghouse WGen series

Check Westinghouse WGen series, specifically the "WGen 20000", less than 5% THD, 28000/20000 Wattage, 2 x 50 Amp connectors, 3 years warranty, display for run hours, volts and frequency, among other great/best features, and it cost a lot less than Generac.

I have a Troy Bilt. How do I know what the THD is? Is there a way to test it?

Hey John! What kit did you use? Could you please share a link and any important info? Looking at doing this soon. Thanks!

I ordered it through Amazon and it’s through Nashfuel

I am close to (finally) being done with mine if you want to check it out. I need to add another video as it is pretty much done. I need to reconfigure fans as they are not pushing up the vent panel things....kzfaq.info/get/bejne/m9hhYN2istiqoJ8.html

great! Can't wait to see it!

Your telling me. I don’t think he could have done anything more to this system that could cost a penny more. But it’s definitely very impressive

Yes loved the video but I was only looking for what oil I use to change oil in my messily 10 thousand watt piece of crap. I thought I was mister big stuff until I saw this. Oil synthetic or 30 weight?

thanks

thank you

Ditto! My inrush is running 4 amps on both of my units. I have a similar setup with the same gen set, minus the usage of 30amp outlet. I added a motor snorkel to my generator. A dozen 5-gallon gas cans only lasts 2 days with the 17500e, and you have natural gas.

Yes sir I have those on both AC units!

Michael…did you use a tri-fuel conversion kit or diy it? I’m looking at doing this next. Any advice would be much appreciated!

@@BankersSpecial did you use a tri-fuel conversion kit or diy it? I’m looking at doing this next. Any advice would be much appreciated!

Would that be a difference of potential

Hey John, sounds like you’re on your way to having a great setup! That genie looks like a beast. It appears your setup will be almost identical to mine. Friendly reminder to make sure your transfer switches switch the neutral, and that you connect a ground rod to your genie. I have a 5 ton & 3 ton HVAC systems. And yes, I did end up using the hyper engineering soft starters for both HVAC units. After installing them I saw a pretty significant reduction in stress on the genie during startup when the initial inrush current spikes. Good luck man!

Correct, the 17500 is wired similarly. The genie is rated up 72 Amps. However because of the fact that it has a 50A breaker on the 50A connection...you can't get more than 50A out of the generator unless you use both the 50 & 30A connections at the same time. Thus the reason i designed it as i did. Hope this helps!

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Yes there is a main disconnect breaker at the meter. That is the first point of disconnect from the city, so that is also where the neutral & ground are bonded (for utility power). Once the utility power passes through that main disconnect breaker, i have the Polaris splitters that split the utility into two paths. The first path goes to transfer switch A, and the second path goes to transfer switch B. The transfer switches switch the neutral as well as the two hot phases, so when that happens we immediately lose the bonding between the neutral and the ground (from utility power) that is located in the main disconnect box mentioned above. Because of this the neutral and ground are bonded at the generator and thus the generator uses a ground rod since it is now considered a self derived system and we are no longer getting that benefit from the utility. So to answer your question a little more directly, for utility power of the bonding takes place at the meter which is also the first pointed disconnect (as I have a breaker at my meter). And for generator power, the bonding happens inside of the generator, which is also the first point of disconnect. This is why I have three pole transfer switches that switch the neutral as well. Hope this helps!

1. Yes I’m sending a 240/5OA from the genie into transfer switch A, and a 240/30A from the genie into transfer switch B. These 50 and 30 amp circuits are completely isolated from each other when leaving the generator to their transfer switches…and then onto their final branch circuits. The current goes from genie output A, to switch A, to panel A (house circuits). The next goes from output B, to switch B, to panel B. These are Two streams of current totally isolated from each other (other than where the neutral & ground are bonded inside the genie for safety). 2. At the switch, we also switch the neutral so it completely isolates the utility grid from both the house and generator when we are on generator power. With this design, there is no way for current to flow from one to another. Hope this helps!

Have one as well and am considering doing the same, much easier than parallel hookups. Unfortunately I can only find outlets/Breakers up to 60/63 amps(Nema 14-60), be curious to see if you found any rated 70?

If you guys end up doing this, please make a video. Would love to see! I luckily already had two branch panels in my house, so it just made more sense for me to do it the way i did.

@@davidandrade1107 ... you won't find any NEMA outlets or plugs rated for over 60 amps in single phase.

Hi Jesse, Where are getting this “less than 20%” stat from?

If the THD is 5% or lower the manufacturers seem to advertise it. Higher THD ratings appear hidden in Generator info, imo.

Hello fellow houstonian! Thanks for the compliments. What area do you live in? I’m on the south side near clear lake. I’ve also read that the Westinghouse is 5% or less, but have yet to put my hands on one. I’m also a little worried about the weight of that unit, as i keep mine in the garage and wheel it out when needed. If you end up buying it, i’d love to meet up and run a test on the actual THD. As for the system design, there are a handful of ways you could design your system. Where is your first point of disconnect from utility power? Is it the main breaker in your branch panel, or do you have another breaker prior to that (at the meter, or between the meter and the branch panel)? Also, I read something that you might want to dig into a little more… “I am not concerned with power being fed back into the grid to hurt a lineman as the interlock kit absolutely prevents that” So then does your current interlock kit on your panel switch the neutral as well? Is it a 3-pole switchover? According to my understanding and research, if it only switches the 2 hot wires (and not the neutral), then the utility neutral would still be interacting with the generator neutral, and thus you could potential send current back down the grid to a linemen. “Do you foresee any issues with this setup or have any recommendations?” For a generator of this power, I would def recommend protecting others by making it a self derived system (thus switching the neutral on both 50A plugs)….thus fully isolating your generator from the grid. I’m happy to explain what I would more than likely do if it were me, but first I would need to know if you’re planning on switching the neutrals or not, because that affects how the entire system is designed. Just let me know and I’ll be happy to chime in! *Disclaimer: I am not a electrician, so consult a professional.

@@judjohnson4640 I live outside of Sugarland, but I am very familiar with that area near Webster Tx, and Nasa Road 1. With my Generator I also keep it in the garage and wheel it out to test and run it from time to time. I think that would be cool to meet up and test it to see the true THD of the unit. The first point of contact is pretty standard. My main panel is on the outside of my house and that is where Centerpoint brings in power. I don't have any additional breaker boxes, or anything else connected to the panel except for the 50amp power inlet box to run on generator. I can send you a pic or video if you like to see could make explaining this a lot easier. The interlock kit I have makes certain I have 1 power source at a time (never both Utility and Generator). If I am on utility power then I am physically (Mechanically) locked out from introducing generator power to the panel. When I am on Generator power the situation is reversed the main is physically (Mechanically) locked out only allowing power to the home through the 50amp generator power inlet. I want this to be safe which is why I have a 50amp breaker for the generator that powers the entire panel and then I am thinking about adding a 6 circuit manual transfer switch exclusively for the downstairs AC Unit. Now I know that if I don't add the manual transfer switch the generator will run the entire house but I will have to be methodical in everything I do. As an example I obviously turn on the downstairs AC unit first, let it run a while then the upstairs AC unit. Once both of those are running fine then I can turn on everything else in my house slowly as to not surge the generator and trip the breaker. Another thing is to turn both units down to meat locker temps so they don't cycle because a cycle will trip the system and everything goes down. When both AC units are running I am pulling about 20amps consistently and I also have hard start kits on both units. What my end goal is, is to utilize the maximum efficiency of the generator because there is wasted generated power I can't take advantage of with the additional 50a(2) plug just like you did with a 50a and 30a connection. I see the manual transfer switch allowing the downstairs AC unit to cycle at will because it is on it's own independent 50a feed. I can't do that with my current setup as I am already at the max of the generator on that 1 cable powering the whole house. I will not feed two 50a connections into the same panel at the same time even if the power is from the same source, I know my limitations and that is one of them. Which is why I would like to totally isolate the AC with the manual transfer switch, and reduce the load on that 1 cable. Thus in effect having 50a(1) powering the house and 50a(2) only powering the downstairs AC. I know what your thinking why not put additional circuits on that manual transfer switch since I would have 5 available. Actually I have thought about that and I could see adding the Dryer, Deep freeze, there but I would start to get concerned about the AC cycling because it pulls 49amps at start up and then drops to 11. But on the 50a(1) side I should have enough available power since that unit starts up at 32amp and drops to 9. So if all else fails I could just turn off the downstairs AC and run the Dryer if I added it to the manual transfer switch. My understanding of a manual transfer switch is this, if the power is out you have to have already predetermined which circuits you want to power on generator. You can't change this later because those circuits are hard wired directly to the manual transfer switch. When you connect power to the transfer switch and flip the manual transfer switch breaker (connected directly to the the downstairs AC in my case) to the Gen side then power is isolated and only feeds power to that specific circuit. No, I don't have any plans on switching the neutrals because the main breaker is already in the off position with no power coming from Centerpoint. I also totally understand the disclaimer i'm not either but I have worked with enough master electricians to be dangerous, but I will still get a professional opinion on this as well. I think this may help clarify but if it doesn't please let me know and we can go from there. Thanks,

Hi! From my research, if you're wanting to use both the 50A & 30A on the same building at the same time, you would need two separate panels...that are totally isolated from each other (other than the grounding), which is why i did mine the way i did. You would also need to split the utility feed to both panels as well with polaris or some similar device. An idea...you could keep the 50A Gen receptacle on your main panel (as currently setup) and then purchase a MTS like i have (Reliance XRK series) and use the switch as your second panel...thus moving a handful of circuits from your existing main panel over to the new 30A XRK panel (as it can hold 16 branch circuits). This is a possible solution. *I really advise that you setup a system to where it switches the neutral as well. Using one of those mechanical interlock kits wont do this. You really need a 3 pole transfer switch. #1. This is what code requires for a self derived system...for safety. #2. We have a very powerful generator...72Amps, 26000watts. In a event where current was sent back down the neutral to someone working on the utility line, it could seriously hurt that person. However if we switch the neutral as well, it ensures that won't happen. As for the shed, you could easily setup the 30A receptacle to power that structure. I however would make the same recommendation...adding a second MTS panel ( 3 pole) right next to the main panel. And move a handful of the house circuits & the main shed circuit to this panel. No need to do anything to the circuit in the actual shed. Also How big is your house and how many AC's? Maybe Your 50A might can power your entire house and shed sufficiently? Remember, i'm at 4,000sq ft and a 3 ton & 2 ton AC...and my genie is running at only 50% with the house at full load. If it were me, I would probably swap out the main house panel with a reliance 3 pole transfer switch panel and use that as my main panel. Then if needing more power, add a second MTS right next to the main MTS and move a handful of the house circuits & the main shed circuit to this panel. All done! Hope this helps!

Digital Meters... www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07JB9B2QL/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1 Reliance MTS panels... www.reliancecontrols.com/Catalogs/transfer-switches/?page=48

Whats the reason you couldn’t feed both cables into the 2 outlets and then combine each leg into one cable feeding a main panel with 80 amps? As long as you match up the correct legs by checking for voltage difference, what else could happen? If you can turn 1 cable into one with multiple outlets on it, would it work the same in reverse? Not an Electrican, just general curiosity as I see these 20kw portable generators will no real use case unless you do a set up like yours and your the first I’ve seen do it. The average home owner doesn’t have a set up like this. If there’s a reason you can’t, could you tap into the main feed of the generator and create one cable with 72 amps?

Just a bit more thinking as I wrote this, I guess the problem would be is that you wouldn’t be able to control how much is being drawn from the 50 vs the 30. I’m not sure if it would run evenly or based on resistance of the wire but if you got close to the full 72 amps, it could run more through the 50 amp side or the 30 amp side and trip both. Just doing head experiments but it seems doing a main panel 50 and a 30amp sub transfer switch is the best option. However there is a Westinghouse generator, like 20kw or something like that that has 2 50 amp outlets. Would amps be split evenly through both?

@@MrSkunks I typed up a reply already...and it vanished, so ignore it if you see 2. Anyway, for my situation, I think I was so hung up on the fact that it "wouldn't output" all its power into one outlet....that I didn't even research to see if it was possible to connect up both. (Possible and/or if not suggested, etc.) When I called Generac, I think they said it was possible....but not 100%. So, I just had the electrician hook up the 50 amp. Not sure if it is worth for me if it is worth going back. I haven't had the need for it yet, but tested the 50 amp side and it ran the house just fine. I had a hard start capacitor installed in my AC....and it will run my AC too.

15kw...is that starting...or running wattage? Which make/model are you looking at? If your house's draw is similar to mine, then more than likely yes...15kw running watts should be more than sufficient to "run" the house. But what you have to watch out for and consider, is the amount of inrush current the generator will have to supply when a HVAC unit turns on. For example, the generator might be more than enough to power the house in normal use...UNTIL...one of the HVAC compressors turn on and creates a giant spike/inrush of amps... and thus either flips the generator breaker...or makes the generator completely shut down (as a safety mechanism). Either way you loose power. Some people on here have criticized my selection in generator, saying that its oversized and not needed. But what they fail to calculate and realize is that if i have a smaller generator, the inrush for both HVAC units would cause a shutdown every time the HVAC attempts to turn on. I have Hyper Engineering Sure Start units installed on each HVAC compressor unit, which helps lower the inrush amperage and thus reduce the spike transient/stress it puts on the generator when turning on.

It’s stored in the garage. The ground wire only take me about 2 mins to connect. I have the ground wire coiled up and hanging from the generator with a zip tie, and One end of the wire stays connected to the generator grounding lug at all times. When I need to use it, I just wheel it out of the garage and connect the other end of that wire to the ground rod (which is already permanently installed in the ground). So it’s just one simple connection. 1-2 mins tops!

I store mine the garage...then move it out into a "generator shed" when needed.

if you are doing most of the work yourself you may find it's close in price to use a larger standby set with a 200 amp automatic transfer switch. He's well over $5k for what he's showing, and its a full manual system.

@@rupe53 yes I agree but I think you can do the 50amp in the main panel with just an interlock kit. Then add a transfer switch panel for the 30 amp feed which is sort of a subpanel approach.

@@donaldjeansonne8667 ... I see where you are going and I believe it's possible, but if you power the 50 amp interlock first then you run the risk of energizing the entire panel via the 50 amp cord. IOW, your idea is not idiot proof. The video shows the secondary system in another panel and while complicated / expensive, it is basically idiot proof.

@@rupe53 I would put an interlock on the sub panel which has normal feed from the main panel and interlocked with the 30 amp generator feed. Thus the main becomes fed by the 50 and the sub fed by the 30 but the interlock prevents them from being tied together.

@@donaldjeansonne8667 .... based on your response I don't think you fully grasp what I posted.

A lot - lol. At 50% load they run through about 1.6 gallons / per hour

My next project with this genie will be to convert it to tri-fuel. Through all the natural disasters we’ve had in the area over the last few years, I’ve noticed that we’ve never lost natural gas.

Also, i personally don’t store gas until only a few days prior to an event. Being in Texas, we usually get a few days of warning before an event takes place…hurricane, freeze, etc.

Since switched neutral transfer switches are being used (meaning the house neutral is disconnected as well), the generator is considered a separately derived system and needs its own ground rod, per the electric code.

Yes Miguel is correct about this. I discussed this with Mike Holts team, and it is considered a self derived system since it's 100% disconnected from utility power (including the neutral)...so i needed to provide a ground rod for it. Since the neutral and ground are bonded at the generator...the ground rod is connected there. Hope this helps!

@@judjohnson4640 ... you do realize that both of those power cables have a 4th wire for a ground that's hardwired inside your main panel... and that DOES NOT ever get disconnected by a transfer switch. IOW, the extra ground rod is a code violation when properly connected to a home via the cables. Yes, you can buy a transfer switch that switches the neutral also, but it's not necessary per most local codes.... BECAUSE... neutral and ground are bonded in the main panel and again at the pole transformer. BTW, utility companies operate under different guidelines and are not subject to NEC rules.

@@judjohnson4640 do those reliance transfer switch panels switch the neutral as well? I was under the impression they only switched the lines. Edit: it seems the "X" series can switch the neutral. I learned something new. What model transfer switches do you have exactly?

@@cullenevanhall Yes...the neutral is being switched as well. They are 3-pole transfer switches