How Daenerys Can Have Babies (A Song of Ice and Fire Theory)

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Michael Talks About Stuff

Michael Talks About Stuff

4 ай бұрын

In this video we discuss the idea that Daenerys Targaryen can't have children according to what Mirri Maz Durr told her. But what if George RR Martin has already given us a very direct solution to Dany's problem? A solution that might be making an appearance in the future books.
Here is the old reddit post I reference in the video
/ spoilers_was_daenerys_...

Пікірлер: 82
@ashleyofnaath
@ashleyofnaath 4 ай бұрын
I do think Dany will get pregnant by Jon but will die birthing the baby. I interpret Mirri's message to mean that the only way for Drogo to be "as he was"- ie alive to Dany- is if she joins him in death since he can't come back. I actually thought the show would end this way; that while Jon and others see Dany having a Lyanna moment, from Dany's perspective as she's dying it would cut to that scene of Drogo and Rhaego in the tent, and instead of leaving them she stays. Maybe they even ride off together on horses over distant sounds of Jon's voice begging her not to leave. Something along these lines. I do think the baby survives though, and Jon is left a single parent. Nice video!!
@a.j.carter2294
@a.j.carter2294 4 ай бұрын
Except…Jon’s dead. So the odds of him being fertile, even if he’s reanimated, are quite low. It’s said even of fire wights that their blood doesn’t flow, so then their seed wouldn’t be viable in all likelihood.
@afterbirth6deuce
@afterbirth6deuce 4 ай бұрын
John kills Dany but in childbirth instead, so he kills her but with his other sword.
@bloodangel19
@bloodangel19 4 ай бұрын
The watch taught him to use a steel blade but the mighy ser Podrick of house Payne will teach Jon how to use this mighty secret weapon
@eric2500
@eric2500 4 ай бұрын
How many Valerian descendant mothers did Mirri care for before Dany? So she could have healthy babies sometimes, and deformed dragon babies at other times, like Rhanerya.
@Djynni
@Djynni 4 ай бұрын
Yes, I do think she will get pregnant. It's heavily hinted that her cycle is returning in the scene where she's attacked by ants in her sleep.
@joshuaadams6565
@joshuaadams6565 4 ай бұрын
Pretty sure she's had periods since Mirri Maz Duur. She just can’t carry a baby full term.
@Djynni
@Djynni 4 ай бұрын
@@joshuaadams6565 "She was bleeding, but it was only woman's blood. The moon is still a crescent though. How can that be. She tried to remember the last time she had bled. The last full moon? The one before? The one before that? No, it cannot have been so long as that."
@swayback7375
@swayback7375 4 ай бұрын
@@Djynniright… so there’s a few ways that can go, either she stops her cycles after mirri, or they remain unchanged, or they become irregular, and based on the language of your quote and the timeline in the books she’s looking back at the last 3 moon cycles, so 3 months roughly, and she can’t remember if she had one or not in that time. So clearly she’s not on a regular schedule if she’s not had one in 3 months, but there’s also absolutely no reason for grrm to use language like that if she fully stopped having cycles… she wouldn’t look back and try to recount, that would be silly. That eliminates 2 of the 3 options leaving us to know that she’s still been having cycles but they’re irregular timed, also the fact she can’t remember shows use that she does t think it’s a big deal… and it you think about it, dany kind of got cursed then and there… but periods themselves are a curse for some women… why would dany be so lucky as to have one curse removed? Why not double it up? All the pain and discomfort of a period AND she’s sterile on top of it.
@nicoleackerman205
@nicoleackerman205 4 ай бұрын
Well people think she had a misscarage in the last book published though I am not sure.
@Loreweavver
@Loreweavver 4 ай бұрын
A living child, yes. A living human child, no.
@DD-ok2pt
@DD-ok2pt 4 ай бұрын
Or a non-living child a wight
@Loreweavver
@Loreweavver 4 ай бұрын
@@DD-ok2pt that too
@forest9000wry
@forest9000wry 4 ай бұрын
Or a blood magic clone of John snow that is unstable and incapable of reproducing like Maegor the cool
@eric2500
@eric2500 4 ай бұрын
oooohhhh!
@justineharper3346
@justineharper3346 4 ай бұрын
Idk if she’ll have a baby in the books, but I’m still mad that they gave us all the baby foreshadowing with her and Jon in the later seasons of the show that amounted to absolutely nothing
@seastar4194
@seastar4194 4 ай бұрын
I believe that Mirri's prophecy is going to come true. Quentin is the sun that rises in the west and sets in the east, the dothraki sea goes dry when the Dothraki follow Dany to westeros and the mountains falling like leaves in the wind could be the Moutains men being slaughtered in battle. But Drogo will not return after these things happen. The reason is that Dany suffocated and burned him. If she had allowed him to live in his catatonic state, he would have eventually recovered. But Dany misinterpreted what Mirri said and mercy killed Drogo. I think this may contribute to Dany going mad. When she becomes pregnant she starts to realize that perhaps Mirri tricked her into killing her own husband.
@shinymk6562
@shinymk6562 4 ай бұрын
It could also be that she names her kid after Drogo after realizing everything else is coming true, fulfilling the prophecy. The only thing is it does kinda repeat the whole Drogon and Rhaego thing.
@leomesser415
@leomesser415 4 ай бұрын
Michael just refuses to stop putting out good content
@alexx5064
@alexx5064 4 ай бұрын
lmao, your memes are always on point- also your theories are so intriguing! I would never have thought of this possible plot point but now I’m 100% on board!!
@RandomGuy-lu1en
@RandomGuy-lu1en 4 ай бұрын
there's nothing wrong with her. Her sickness after eating weird berries sounds a lot like an abortion.
@thing_under_the_stairs
@thing_under_the_stairs 4 ай бұрын
I've always thought that it read a lot like a miscarriage too, possibly due to accidental poisoning, which means that she wasn't completely infertile like she'd thought. Since the medical term for a miscarriage is "spontaneous abortion", I think we're saying the same thing here.
@aprilmae274
@aprilmae274 4 ай бұрын
Yeah. That is def what is happening there. That, or GRRM is REALLY bad at writing about periods and poison berries. No. lol...Dany is having a miscarriage.
@cosmopeaches2604
@cosmopeaches2604 4 ай бұрын
I'm beyond surprised how it's rarely talked about that Dany is clearly having a miscarriage at the end of ADWD. Why else would GRRM need to point out that she hasn't bled in months, plus now she's bleeding heavier than she ever has. Clearly a sign that her womb is capable of pregnancy. Bad berries, toxic water, or just malnutrition caused her to lose the baby, though.
@vvHun43rd
@vvHun43rd 4 ай бұрын
I think she’s trying to say drogon will come back unexpectedly from something and save her during the long night which she has a kid named heihachi leading into tekken 1
@feral7523
@feral7523 4 ай бұрын
Makes sense! although imagine in GoT if Jon had stabbed a baby in the womb and she told him with her dying words!!
@emrek99205
@emrek99205 4 ай бұрын
Interesting to note that Mirri helped birth the demon child and there were a couple slave witnesses, nothing is said about the child's actual fate. It is implied that it was killed, but no one claims to have done it. Nor was it burned or buried in the books. It just disappeared and not talked about. The only death that happened when the dragons were born was Mirri herself. Drogo's horse was killed before. Drogo had already been smothered to death by Daenerys. The child went missing and the body forgotten about days or weeks before. Daenerys didn't die in the fire. Mirri was the only one to burn to death. Yet as far as we know, she was not of any kingly bloodline. Only death can pay for life, but only 1 death was in that fire yet 3 dragons were hatched.
@marcusanark2541
@marcusanark2541 4 ай бұрын
Imagine if that vision of a silver haired Valyrian Khal is not of a future that could've been of Daenerys and Drogo child but it is actually him, grown up after being found and raised by the Dothraki.
@davidsauther1836
@davidsauther1836 4 ай бұрын
Mirri’s prophecy is going to come true verbatim. The story is about the end of the world.
@DungeonMaster-zd1tn
@DungeonMaster-zd1tn 3 ай бұрын
As some others are talking about, I do think Jon will end up being fertile following his resurrection. I think the act of sacrificing Shireen, thereby waking a stone (dead) dragon in Jon will bring him back in a more complete state due to death paying for life. This is unlike the Last Kiss performed by Thoros of Myr, which has no such living sacrifice, and is seemingly substituted by slowly destroying Berric Dondarion himself as he comes back less himself each time he was resurrected. Honestly, I think it would be cool to even see Jon's hair turned white or silver-blonde in a look similar to an albino like Blood Raven, or just a person of Valyrian blood in general.
@sblinder1978
@sblinder1978 4 ай бұрын
LMAO now I picture Dany's womb as Jar-Jar Binks thank you for that
@autje1970
@autje1970 4 ай бұрын
Isn't it heavily implied she has a miscarriage in her final chapter in Dance? I see no fertility issue here.
@thing_under_the_stairs
@thing_under_the_stairs 4 ай бұрын
That's how I always read it. Possibly from poisoning after eating those strange berries. *Never* eat unidentified berries you find in the wild - did Dany not remember this from Dragon Scouts?
@Vmac1394
@Vmac1394 4 ай бұрын
I don't think so. I think Dany was crapping water because she caught dysentery. Earlier in Dance, Dany decided to go play Jesus by shaming her council and then helping people dying of the dysentery plague herself. Then in very GRRM fashion, Dany caught the deadly plague she thought she could interact with without consequences.
@nicoleackerman205
@nicoleackerman205 4 ай бұрын
@@thing_under_the_stairs Dany did not have time to join them her and her brother were constantly moving to different places. 😂😎
@thing_under_the_stairs
@thing_under_the_stairs 4 ай бұрын
@@nicoleackerman205 That jerk Viserys probably wouldn't have let her mingle with the "common" kids anyway. poor girl missed out on so much vital knowledge. Like how to light a fire without a dragon, find safe food and water in the wilderness, and not to marry the first barbarian warlord you meet!
@JamieEgg-qs9mc
@JamieEgg-qs9mc 4 ай бұрын
Great video! I am thinking “mountains blowing in the wind like leaves” could be a meteor shower. After all, mountains are very, very large rocks. Perhaps the moon “getting too close to the sun” and shattering from a comet impact could cause this meteor shower. Perhaps the long night was caused by a similar cataclysm long before. Secondly, I wonder whether the role of Lommy “Greenhands” helps illuminate some of the story of Garth the Green or the isle of faces. The leaves of the red leaf wierwoods are likened to bloody red hands and therefore, Lommy’s green hands make me think of the green leaves. We should also look for clues from the chivalric Order of the Green Hand, directly related to House Gardener and House Manderly. And to stretch this even further, perhaps we could also look for illumination from Otto Hightower, the “green” Hand.
@michaeltalksaboutstuff
@michaeltalksaboutstuff 4 ай бұрын
Lommy Greenhands is a super interesting connection... I hadn't thought about that before but you are right that is a super interesting thing from GRRM to make him greenhands vs any other color given the order of the green hand and garth greenhand. I will have to think on that a bit
@moiz85
@moiz85 4 ай бұрын
At some point several theories hinge on whether Jon will have blood flow
@michaeltalksaboutstuff
@michaeltalksaboutstuff 4 ай бұрын
This is a very good point, can undead Jon get it up... Maybe green magic can help that too
@Ilargizuri
@Ilargizuri 4 ай бұрын
Actually, I think the more accurate interpretation is that Dany dies at that Point. Because Miri doesn't say: that he will as he was before! Dany asked specifically WHEN he will be as he was, But Miri doesn't answer that not only in a straight Fashion she actually answers a different Question, a question that is more like: "When will he be back?" Daenerys asks something like "When will his Health be totally restored?" and Miri doesn't answer that, what she answers is shown in the last sentence: "Then he will return, and not before!" He will return, but she doesn't say if Daenerys will go to him or her he will come to her. "Return" doesn't only mean "coming back" it can also mean that somebody reappears or resurfaces (given the fact that we literally have Creatures who can raise the Dead, that maybe is not the best case scenario we can wish for, I know Drogo was burned to ashes, doesn't mean Daenerys won't have PTSD-like Flashbacks [she smothered him with a Pillow during a very emotional bad phase for her] and sees her Dead Husband in some of these reanimated Corpses remember GRRM said it will first go much worse before it becomes better). Sometimes "Return" means that something returns to a situation as it was. So let's assume Return means the reunion of Daenerys with her Husband Drogo, she just barely survived the stillbirth of her first Baby. It is safe to assume that her next Pregnancy (which I think will happen) will be worse. And worse in this case means: It will kill her. "When the sun rises in the West and sets in the East when the Seas go dry and Mountains blow in the Wind like Leaves when your Womb quickens again and you bear a living Child" If these are all Actions of some sort, that gives us a Countdown. And I think Miri did want to avenge her Village and all those she knew died in the Dothraki raid of her Village. And she wasn't wrong in doing so, I mean we all praise Daenerys for killing her when Miri presumably killed her Baby in this Scenario. Daenerys avenged her Son and Husband, why is it wrong of Miri to avenge her People from her Village, most likely the Home of her Relatives and Family. Both Women did the same with different Methods, Miri with Bloodmagic and Daenerys with Fire. In the end, I think Daenerys will get Pregnant, she is not infertile, she has just problems Conceiving a Child. Will it be from Jon? Not sure about that, most likely one of the Ironborne will be the Father. Mostly because of the time frame, Daenerys needs to go to Westeros, which will most likely need a whole Book, like Victarion needed a whole Book going from Westeros to Meereen. She will become Pregnant during their Travel by Sea, and only then she give birth to her Child in Westeros, also because of the time frame. Will the Ironborne be the Fathers in a more educational Sense? Most likely not, it is very possible that both die during the Battle for the Iron Throne. And with Dany without any other Relatives, the only person who can Raise that Child will be, again the Starks, just like they raised Jon. It would also fit in with the Bran becomes King- Idea. Bran being the trueborn son of Eddard Stark, who can't have Children of his own, becomes King as a Placeholder until Daenerys's Child comes of Age. Jon stays in the North, taking care of the new Lord of Winterfell Rikkon, who is still a Child ( let's say the new winter will last 6-7 years a very common period of winters in Westeros) most likely between 10-12 years old, so still someone who needs help in Terms of Government. Bran takes Daenerys's Child as his Heir, saying he and Daenerys were married and this is his Child (would be a very fitting switch on Tywin's statement that Tyrion is only his Son because he could not prove that he isn't, same thing here just in a good way). So Jon stays in the North, like in the Show, Daenerys dies, like in the Show, A Stark becomes Lord of Winterfell again, like in the Show just a different one than in the Show, Sansa will be in the North and takes motherly care of Rikkon and his Household, unlike in the Show but close enough.
@griffin3508
@griffin3508 2 ай бұрын
Dorne's plans ended by a Targaryen/ the vale, Dothraki sea burned by drogon as he gets larger and larger and raises it in flame, the Vale of Arryn is brought down and the mountain buckles under dragon fire that has concussive force somehow, sending up mountain ash in the wind for miles around.
@nirvana6708
@nirvana6708 4 ай бұрын
hey , do you have the link to the old reddit post you mentioned in video?
@michaeltalksaboutstuff
@michaeltalksaboutstuff 4 ай бұрын
www.reddit.com/r/gameofthrones/comments/c518cg/spoilers_was_daenerys_supposed_to_be_pregnant/ I will add it to the desciption as well
@snocades
@snocades 4 ай бұрын
you took peanut butter and jam then made a PB & J, love the idea
@tombullard123
@tombullard123 4 ай бұрын
I think dany might kill her child again. she might get pregnant from jon snow, and have to sacrifice her own child (again but on purpose this time) and the child will be her nissa nissa. I think it makes sense as weve seen her do it before and george likes history to “rhyme” it might also be part of all the mother imagery she has associated with her. I think either she will have to sacrifice her own unborn child or one of her other children (dragon) for powerful magic to defeat the others
@kewl0210
@kewl0210 4 ай бұрын
Another great theory, Michael of house Talksybowtstuf
@eric2500
@eric2500 4 ай бұрын
Takes some serious joo joo to restore JON's ability and fertility - he's rather dead.
@michaeltalksaboutstuff
@michaeltalksaboutstuff 4 ай бұрын
This is a very good point, Jon might need the same help getting fertile again
@robertsmiley2207
@robertsmiley2207 3 ай бұрын
Dan and Dave already admitted in interviews that they didn't like the magical aspects 😕 of the show and they wanted to get rid of it in the later seasons
@BeteBlanc
@BeteBlanc 4 ай бұрын
Possibly have a child? Maybe It's the unfortunate oversimplification of asoiaf that was presented in GoT that raises the real issues. There is a great deal of cyclical sort of events. One of those is during Targ civil wars there is almost always a battle somewhere near the God's Eye. For that reason alone I am fairly confident Dany will at the very least reach the God's Eye, or someone fighting for her. The opposition and how it resolves is debatable. My guess would be fAegon, though I'm sure most people would prefer Jon. I think the show to aggressively simplified several aspects into Jon making it necessary to tell the story the way they did. I don't think there is any chance of those two having a child. I'll give any theory a fair shake, but to be honest I find most theories like this to be overly romantic ideas more about imagining ways they can get what they want than ideas that make sense within the cyclical nature of narratives in the books.
@Pranrss117
@Pranrss117 2 ай бұрын
It would be great if dany is pregnant and jon has to kill her and the his child. Given that all he wanted was to hold a son of his own. It would be on track for grrm to shaft the guy that saves the world it would also make sense why he doesn't become king and decides to go north to do what he has done his whole life which is brood. That would also make "I don wan it", make a lot more sense. It would be even better if he can't die after that and has to spend an eternity protecting the realms of men(which he would have grown to hate at this point) as a punishment for kinslaying. It would also go well with ned stark and Aemon targaryen parallels and give new meaning to Aemon's love is the death of duty speech.
@spliffertonsheldrake6007
@spliffertonsheldrake6007 3 ай бұрын
Nobody has a theory of what will happen if Jon stays dead.
@chables74
@chables74 4 ай бұрын
Personally I think she can get pregnant, she just will never carry to term. I don’t think she got her period in her last chapter, I think her body was removing a still birth that she accidentally caused in order to survive the fire in the fighting pit.
@robertsmiley2207
@robertsmiley2207 3 ай бұрын
She can have them by using the same thing that hatched her dragons 🐉 blood 🩸 magic ✨
@KetilK
@KetilK 4 ай бұрын
It can take years to get pregnant in the modern world when the people who want a child are actively trying and seeking advice from modern healthcare professionals to maximize their chances. I don't think Daenerys slept with Daario or Hizdahr for long enough to conclude that she isn't fertile. I think Mirri understood that she could be blamed for killing the Khal, regardless of whether it was her intention or not, and that she would be willing to say anything to avoid prolonged torture. Better to claim that it was intentional and hope that she would be granted a quick death than to live in fear of torture.
@carastone3473
@carastone3473 3 ай бұрын
Why does everyone assume that Mirri was telling the truth?
@LilBrownieD
@LilBrownieD 4 ай бұрын
If the white walkers represent climate change, I'd expect green magic to play a big part in the book's resolution
@charlinethom1624
@charlinethom1624 3 ай бұрын
This moment highlights that Daenerys was never infertile to begin with, as she believed. In both of Dany’s pregnancies, she suffered from a miscarriage caused by either being given or accidentally ingesting an abortifacient. “Mirri Maz Duur was there, the maegi, tipping a cup against her lips. She tasted sour milk, and something else, something thick and bitter.” -AGOT Dany IX …. “Its flesh was tart and chewy, with a bitter aftertaste that seemed familiar to her.” -ADWD Dany X The similarities in language and familiarity Dany feels when eating the berries signify that, more likely than not, Mirri gave her an abortifacient in order to produce the stillbirth of her son. In ADWD, Dany unknowingly ingested the same abortifacient, which produced her miscarriage. Bottom line: Daenerys is very capable of carrying a child and likely would have if she didn't eat those poisoned berries in the Dothraki Sea.
@matro2
@matro2 4 ай бұрын
If she can't have children, it makes me wonder why she's willing to bring war to Westeros for just one woman's reign. She sounds like a villain to me there. Such as how Emperor Palpatine ran his Galactic Empire without a successor.
@umwha
@umwha 4 ай бұрын
Yeah it is strange she hasn’t ever thought about who would succeed her
@umwha
@umwha 4 ай бұрын
Come to think of it, Dany thinks she can’t have kids and yet she married Hizdar without telling him. You’d think she would consider that fact. Maybe she’d be glad with the knowledge that she won’t have his child. But she would also know her time is limited, as the Mereenese would be irritated if she persisted in her marriage for years and years never producing a half mereeneese prince
@eviesholette
@eviesholette 4 ай бұрын
This is the kind of thing that might be meant to remind the reader that no matter how mature Danerys is, she's still a kid. And she definitely thinks like a 14 yr old girl quite often.
@uglukthemedicineman5933
@uglukthemedicineman5933 4 ай бұрын
@@eviesholette I'm 14 and this is deep
@scubasam4255
@scubasam4255 4 ай бұрын
id guess she desperately hopes it is not true and wants to try have kids no matter what. prob not thinking in terms of "i hope i can have a successor" and more of a "i will have kids!"
@emrek99205
@emrek99205 4 ай бұрын
Jon has to stab and kill Daenerys in order to ignite Lightbringer. He could do that in the prolog of Winds of Winter so that we're done with her storyline and instead we could focus on Jon being Azur Ahai. While I'm sure she has more of a role to play than just that, I personally grew tired of her character after just a couple of chapters. I've no idea why anyone really cares for her character as she was always a victim and now is a Mary Sue.
@LilBrownieD
@LilBrownieD 4 ай бұрын
thank goodness the books are not based on your preferences
@SEVENNumber-my1gj
@SEVENNumber-my1gj 3 ай бұрын
Ewww woman wanting baby's probably the Catwoman in twilight actor batman movie
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