We visit Omega pistons to see the fascinating process of forging a 73.5mm A-Series racing piston. Part 2 - • How it's made - Omega ... Part 3 - • How it's made - Omega ...
Пікірлер: 223
@marklowe74313 жыл бұрын
Totally different to what I expected. Great video.
@markdavies97655 жыл бұрын
have used many sets of omega pistons over the years, all have done there job faultlessly ,a quality product. Nice to see where and how there made
@nickbadi35993 жыл бұрын
I installed some heating at Omega 30years ago when they had not long installed the forge. I was chatting to the old chap who ran the business and he was telling me about how when they first started forging pistons they were nearly all scrap due to die lubrication problems. They had had various specialist companies in with sprays lubes etc but no joy. he had nearly given up and he was chatting to a guyin the pub who had worked on a forge all his life. He told him the trick of offering the pot of lube up to the die (1.22 ) they went from nearly 100 percent scrap to have a reasonable sucess rate overnight. Not long after a team from Honda came for a look around and picked up a forged piston and asked how they had made it as they didnt believe it could be forged in that shape . As luck would have it a billet was just up to forging temperature he dipped the die and forged the billet . Luckily it came out perfect the Honda team were very impressed.
@abim25992 жыл бұрын
Hgccx
@benburnett81092 жыл бұрын
BS. It was a bar not a pub. And you left the part out where the guy paid for his chicken fingers and potatoe sticks.
@nickbadi35992 жыл бұрын
The only bars around then we're the alloy ones used for forging the pistons .
@silverxiree Жыл бұрын
@@nickbadi3599 ahahhaha nice one.
@Omega-Phil Жыл бұрын
That's funny, the old bloke at that time was my dad, Fred, he's still there now operating machines at 85 ;)
@chrispilling86335 жыл бұрын
Ace, great videos!!! Really appreciate being able to get this sort of insight!! 👍👍
@nyirgu2 жыл бұрын
Great video. Thank you for taking the time and putting this together Steven. Very informative. Big Thank you!!
@geek96425 жыл бұрын
Loving these videos, really informative.
@djquick4 жыл бұрын
Very cool! Thx for posting!
@villagetube15815 жыл бұрын
Excellent work 👍👍👍
@paulerickson30893 жыл бұрын
Always wondered how they go about forging those. Very interesting.
@Limeayy5 жыл бұрын
I love this channel!
@oilylampman72522 жыл бұрын
Just got my lotus esprit pistons from Omega! they do look very very nice!
@bnghjtyu7675 жыл бұрын
Looks like a good job to have in the cold winter.
@GWAYGWAY15 жыл бұрын
When it came out of the press, it looked like one of my racing two stroke pistons after a meltdown sieze up.
@danhillman45235 жыл бұрын
Right? I have melted a few in my sled motors.
@travissmith22115 жыл бұрын
Nothing like a bot of controlled chaos.
@teukudjw77374 жыл бұрын
Great video guys, thank you. Make sure to put back that suace pan to the kitchen. :)
@sixtyfiveford5 жыл бұрын
That's neat.
@TheAnonymous1one3 жыл бұрын
Awesome vid
@haseebqureshir93242 жыл бұрын
Very nice work
@SarmatKa7774 жыл бұрын
That press can punch a hole through across the globe :-)
@ethanmurphy20062 жыл бұрын
using your manufacturing process for an engineering project in my undergraduate! what is the size of the initial aluminum bars?
@onkelt26245 жыл бұрын
This Pistons are well done. 👍😊 Like auf Steak.
@lhawoekcreator2 жыл бұрын
Amazing
@scottydntno5 жыл бұрын
Wish they would of shown the complete process including the machining.
@Mekanikpanggilanmanado3 жыл бұрын
mantap
@user-gy3xn2ub4k3 жыл бұрын
Hello , please tell me what press pressure is necessary for forming this piston, it is very important to me . The video is cool 🤘 🤘 🏿 💪
@gumerranggg46335 жыл бұрын
.....Wowwww!!.Thank you very much. I'm from Thai land.🎃🚬
@cristianpopescu783 жыл бұрын
Very interesting! Great video!👍from me
@konstantin112 жыл бұрын
What temperature do you hear up the billet before forging?
@maksud92792 жыл бұрын
hello. I live on the other side of the earth. is it possible to specify the weight of the production process? or to produce jointly in our country ?
@regimen9786 Жыл бұрын
Can anyone tell whether zinc aluminum alloy is good for making pistons of bitzer semi hermetic?
@NhatCoKim2 жыл бұрын
Chế tạo quá đẳng cấp bạn ơi.
@pec17395 жыл бұрын
some factory honda B series type-R pistons are made by them
@davidalejandro2442 жыл бұрын
como se llama el horno donde estan los 500 pistones?
@bigbothoee86176 ай бұрын
How Much pressure is required to do that to billet
@gautamsinghal7397 Жыл бұрын
What temperature we heat the die??
@olivderpo Жыл бұрын
What is the press effort?
@lianeko90932 жыл бұрын
Can you make piston from damascus steel.?
@SubieRow5 жыл бұрын
I need skirts that long. Might help my ej25 stop slapping... ha ha ha
@johnvillagomez6373 жыл бұрын
Just curious, what liquid do you guys use to quench the piston after heat treating? I understand medal can be quench in oil or water after heating to certain degree.
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos3 жыл бұрын
It's a closely guarded secret that one, sorry.
@rosewhite---2 жыл бұрын
what's difference between a billet and a black? I think billets are long pieces and small pieces like these piston pieces are blanks.
@chipper4424 жыл бұрын
How many forgings can you do with that tool, before it has to be reworked or replaced?
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
Omega still has some early forging tools from the '70s. So quite a long time if used properly!
@Ihaveseenthings5775 жыл бұрын
Very coool...🤔
@martinkamberov49572 жыл бұрын
Hi ! How long does it take to produce a piston - from raw material to completely finished product ready for shipment ? Thanks
@paradiselost99466 ай бұрын
i would say theres about 1.5 to two hours work, all up. they could probably check time sheets and get a pretty good idea "per unit", but remember its all done as batch work... 100, 1000 at a time sort of thing. set that die up, and just punch out blanks for putting on a shelf, then run through on another size... finally a batch gets pulled down, jigs set up for specific runs, lathes tooled, boring machines clocked in... and yeah... hard to really say? only have to set the jig up once for each run... some may stay set and be universal... as a hobby machinist i never saw the sense in one-offs. i always try to make five, ten of something... depends what it is of course!
@kevbarry64574 жыл бұрын
Techo porn....Give me more!!! Loved this Jason. What beads do you use? Show us your blasting cabinet.
@stokkelandsmia16315 жыл бұрын
As a blacksmith i do like this , heat treating aluminium has me intrigued thou but i bet that a trade secret .. right ?
@shadetreeforge5 жыл бұрын
Not really, Alcoa aluminum has specs for this and gladly supplies it to the customer, Every alloy is different, If I remember right 4032 = 950deg @ 1hr and quench in 150deg water.
@stokkelandsmia16315 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the answer 👍
@Dagowly835 жыл бұрын
MED - What options have you guys got for turbo charged applications on a +40 application without going down the 18cc dish route (as that would give my a CR of 7.8:1)?
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos5 жыл бұрын
We keep a 10cc +40 in the diecast Omega range if that may work for you?
@Dagowly835 жыл бұрын
@@MEDEngineeringTechVideos might be of interest! What piston deck height are they on a standard crank?
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos5 жыл бұрын
@@Dagowly83 They're standard 1.498" crown height.
@paradiselost99466 ай бұрын
heh heh heh. i do this at home ;) well, not quite. i dont have billet (surprisingly hard to get!) so i melt down pistons scored from the racetracks... pour in the mold, let it set... then slam it with the fly press whilst its still pliable. casting... then forged. a piston is amazingly simple to make. yet its amazingly complex! most of its in the accuracy... dead square pin with dead on tolerance bore and the ovality...
@dieselscience4 жыл бұрын
Blits of Al Millennium?
@b_mb49485 жыл бұрын
Looking forward to part 2 *:D* P.S Does Omega do piston rings in house too? If so, I would love to see that if at all possible!
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos5 жыл бұрын
Yes they do. Some are made in Japan, others in house. We'll ask - some stuff is under wraps as they've developed many of the processes themselves...
@56Seeker5 жыл бұрын
@@MEDEngineeringTechVideos It'd be nice if you could do a tech friday vid, showing us amatuers how and where we can measure things such as piston rings, pistons, bores, cam lobes and similar so we know when to send money to you for new shiny things!
@robertwalden23725 жыл бұрын
My brother works here he's claims he a shotblast technician 😂don't ya Tony 😉👌
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos5 жыл бұрын
@@56Seeker We've got a couple of measuring vids on the channel. Good ideas though - ring gapping would be handy!
@Spushed5 жыл бұрын
So how does 2000 series aluminum compare to 7000 series like that used to make AR-15 uppers and lowers? Is it too brittle after the quench?
Now I understand why pistons cannot casting... Much better to pressed to compressed the aluminum material for greater strength, I saw some video on KZfaq attempting to copy the piston rod just to recycle the spare parts of a car made of aluminum cans. It works actually but didn't last long cuz it's casted...
@gulshankapoor89244 жыл бұрын
Can you share the material of die and punch are made from. Please post the material composition sothat others can make dies and punches for their own jobs
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
Sorry but this is something Omega would rather not disclose.
@gulshankapoor89244 жыл бұрын
@@MEDEngineeringTechVideos this is the platform for sharing expirences no to hide.
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
@@gulshankapoor8924 Yes, to a point.
@gulshankapoor89244 жыл бұрын
@@MEDEngineeringTechVideos anyway thanks
@lwjw31845 жыл бұрын
So can you forge a standard piston yourself ?
@Chris-yy7qc5 жыл бұрын
If youve got a 500 ton press at home, yes.
@bestamerica5 жыл бұрын
' what kind of vehicle use this piston
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos5 жыл бұрын
These are for BMC A-Series engines, so Minis, Metros, Sprites etc
@bigred84384 жыл бұрын
So, after what I have seen in another video in which the piston manufacturing process includes them being cast and machined in many different procedures which is extraordinarily time consuming, I would think that forged pistons are cheaper to make.....but somehow they aren't.
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
If you check out parts two and three, you'll see the machining involved in making a forged piston is identical to that of a cast piston.
@guyconnell22503 жыл бұрын
How do you spell Aluminum in Australia? Is it spelled "A-L-U-M-I-N-I-U-M"?
@arthurmchugh51845 жыл бұрын
He has done it for HOW LONG?? couldn't stand to work in the same spot day after day
@ZHGAmingAllTheWay4 жыл бұрын
24 years is defenantly a long time but some people do much longer. Had a friend who's mom worked at publix for 40 years
@Zohar-Modifier4 жыл бұрын
I want Excalibur be made !
@framegrace15 жыл бұрын
Wow, when I thought about forged aluminium pistons, never really thought it would be like this, just in one step. This is almost "extruded" pistons...
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos5 жыл бұрын
This is just the internal shape - there's a lot more to go yet!
@leneanderthalien5 жыл бұрын
this process is called "matrixing"...
@framegrace15 жыл бұрын
@@MEDEngineeringTechVideos I meant, forging in one step. Used to work on an iron forging company, and is done in multiple steps
@shadetreeforge5 жыл бұрын
Aluminum forging in this case is a reverse extrusion and formed in 1 shot, and must be formed slowly to prevent tearing!
@ralphcruz84847 ай бұрын
Can you make a piston out of titanium material
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos7 ай бұрын
It's not viable, no.
@jiffypangestu16884 жыл бұрын
My bike using 150 cc diasyl cylinder and forged piston.. ans liquid coollant too 😂👌🏻
@actionrazorthecut91613 жыл бұрын
Did they make custom sizes ?
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos3 жыл бұрын
Yes, but this would require a new forging tool, which can be prohibitively expensive for a small batch.
@figorrahman3 жыл бұрын
2:33 we have same boot
@Zak69595 жыл бұрын
Mechanic porn, Old-school.
@yavuz72485 жыл бұрын
Where is the part 2:)
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos5 жыл бұрын
On the way :)
@bearfacts79442 жыл бұрын
Specific!
@beedalbahgraham29815 жыл бұрын
Noice
@piotrlenarczyk58035 жыл бұрын
These could be even lighter with some perforation. I guess: consider magnesium surface layer for aluminium foam. Thank you for sharing knowledge.
@markhall9125 жыл бұрын
Yeah
@akshayV7014 жыл бұрын
what does 2618 stand for ??
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
It's a grade of alloy.
@georgew.56394 жыл бұрын
Ah-loom-in-um. 😊
@afsarauto55392 жыл бұрын
Forging per hour a capacity
@MyCatInABox5 жыл бұрын
Damn...that hydraulic machine squeezes the shit outta them pistons, huh?
@WPXTacoMan4775 жыл бұрын
Isn’t the point of heat treating then quenching to create hardness through tension in the case and the core? If you machine it, does that not reduce the hardness significantly? Like isn’t most of the hardness in the outer walls , hence, case hardness?
@hamstrtj5 жыл бұрын
Heat treatment before the forging is to make it weaker/softer. Heat treatment after the forging is to remove tensions inside the materials. The material is extremely compacted by the forging, that gives it strength. There is no hardening involved in this manufacturing.
@nova01huawei985 жыл бұрын
BTW he's from England
@Limeayy5 жыл бұрын
I didn't think they'd use billet stuff to make forged, i thought more of cast aluminum. Wonder how much strength, compressive strength, tensile strength going to billet to forged makes any difference or some difference vs. cast to forged.
@Limeayy5 жыл бұрын
@steve gale I understood the top portion but not the 50x stronger. i really have hard time believing its 50x stronger though... Anyways, thank you for information. :D
@jimthomas7775 жыл бұрын
Lime , you could make a cast piston yourself , just heat aluminum until it melts and pour into a mold , a forged piston is already forged aluminum then heated up and pressed with 400 tons of pressure forging it again , any of this and what Steve Gale said sinking or being forged into your brain yet ?
@Limeayy5 жыл бұрын
@@jimthomas777 ooh ok. Thanks lol i was just curious :D
@Bricksandmortars5 жыл бұрын
@steve gale wont the heat treatment cause recrystalisation undoing all the strain hardening of the forging process?
@leneanderthalien5 жыл бұрын
@steve gale no microfractures: cast aluminium =cristalisation, forged aluminium stretch the cristals to fibers: this made it much more flexible and streong...
@dadybig65225 жыл бұрын
This fire is on more than 8 hours I amagin the bill
@WPXTacoMan4775 жыл бұрын
dady big probably not that much to be honest, industrial grade fuels can come pretty cheap
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos5 жыл бұрын
Pretty high yes!
@TungstenCarbideTempe4 жыл бұрын
Interesting process because in when you quench carbon steel it makes it brittle and really hard. An opposite happens with aluminum, copper, gold and some other metals.)If you mechanically squeeze those metals they get hard and brittle and if you need an additional mechanical work to be done on it then you’ll need to either: heat it up or, better, heat it up and quench it. Surprisingly in this video, they first press it then heat treat it and yet it is still stronger. Interesting.
@SevenDeMagnus11 ай бұрын
Cool word 'forged' like Thor's hammer, or Excalibur: "forged by the gods..." God bless the ancient engineer who inventing the first forged tool, I wonder who it was?
@deaniversen3513 жыл бұрын
polish the fugg out of em, then coat, then balance match, oh boy, knife edged crank all polished up and balanced to the nuts.. fugg it, polish and balance the cams too, everything, weightmatch rods, rings, anything that moves
@kevintucker33545 жыл бұрын
Who doesn’t love to see that hot aluminum squeeze out of the forge press! Sorry, aluminium.... Why is aluminum underlined in red?
@daniel_67415 жыл бұрын
It is called Aluminium, youre missing an i ;)
@camgnilpe93004 жыл бұрын
@@daniel_6741 not in american english!
@SunilSundar4 жыл бұрын
What alloy is used for pistons?
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
These particular ones are 2618 Aluminium
@SunilSundar4 жыл бұрын
@@MEDEngineeringTechVideos thanks, but I'm curious, isn't it better to have a lot of silicon in the piston? What the advantage of using 2618?
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
@@SunilSundar This is something Omega have spent many decades to perfect. You'd be best to contact them direct for more in-depth tech info.
@SunilSundar4 жыл бұрын
@@MEDEngineeringTechVideos ok. Thanks
@Omega-Phil4 жыл бұрын
@@SunilSundar In a race piston 2618 is the best, it can get a fatigue crack and still hold together, it can bend and bend without breaking. When you add silicon as in LM13 for casting or 4032 for forging, it adds a high wear factor but the trade off is a level of britleness. This is why high silicon piston are used more for road engines. Having said that, many people race a whole season with one set of Omega/MED dis cast pistons.
@saeedqab2 жыл бұрын
if you permission me i want to dubb your video in urdu launch your video in pakistan
@doanprasmana14442 жыл бұрын
we aply lubrican.... the lubrican gone to vapor wgeb touch the hot iron... then he swap the iron with towel...
@tonyroma90464 жыл бұрын
Do they spell aluminum differently too?
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
Do you mean aluminium? :p
@tonyroma90464 жыл бұрын
@@MEDEngineeringTechVideos Really... You spell it that way? That just doesn't seem like a word we'd have different.
@jameswilson88204 жыл бұрын
The English spelling is correct😎
@leneanderthalien4 жыл бұрын
@@tonyroma9046 the only country in the world who say "aluminum" is the USA, in all other countries in the world it's aluminium...
@tonyroma90464 жыл бұрын
@@leneanderthalien Apparently Canada is same as USA www.thoughtco.com/aluminum-or-aluminium-3980635
@BigRW5 ай бұрын
I was expecting the billets to be hotter, as in glowing red.
@karanmalhotramalhotra18733 жыл бұрын
Sar Fiat petra kar ka piston ring piston
@MrFuguDataScience5 жыл бұрын
I would have to do blood work and chest x-ray for long term workers.
@hamstrtj5 жыл бұрын
You what?
@MrFuguDataScience5 жыл бұрын
@@hamstrtj , doing that kind of work over years I would suggests looking into health effects.
@hamstrtj5 жыл бұрын
@@MrFuguDataScience you should focus on your English before complaining about others profession. You can clearly see they suck off the air from the forge. The rest is just dry and not toxic work.
@shadetreeforge5 жыл бұрын
@@hamstrtj Even with good ventilation, there is still the physical wear n tear on the human body! Working at Wiseco piston, (a larger manufacturer) I forged hundreds of thousands of pistons by hand no robotics every year for 16+ years! had to give it up because of health concerns!
@Omega-Phil5 жыл бұрын
Maybe he didn't wear his apparatus so that he could do a live commentary.
@florin31613 жыл бұрын
To be very good forged is need that the clamping has no escapes on sides....if has escapes...os only presed aluminium not forged...
@larryhooverpedofilekillerc41774 жыл бұрын
hello good afternoon thank you for being beautiful thank you for being wonderful I hope you have a great day. Goodnight greatness in you is beautiful
@DumbCarGuy3 жыл бұрын
Love the video but can anyone answer why you can get 8 forged pistons for a common Chevrolet 350 engine for $300 but it will cost you $1200 to get 4 pistons for a fiat, or lotus or escort
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos3 жыл бұрын
Not sure. We sell the forged Mini pistons for £540 Inc vat
@alreed24343 жыл бұрын
Quantity as production numbers go down price ea goes up. How many people order lotus pistons probably not millions. So the same people probably make multiple types therefore tooling changes e.t.c.
@KarrasBastomi5 жыл бұрын
Forging a MotoGP piston? Wow... What manufacturer?
@shokrefumi5 жыл бұрын
Ducati
@redpillsbluepillsАй бұрын
Its not so labour intensive and fairly a simple process, so why are they so expensive???
@MEDEngineeringTechVideosАй бұрын
Material cost and an enormous energy bill. Forging the piston is only the first process. There are many hours of machining once forged.
@davids9704 жыл бұрын
Why do they cost so much?
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
Check out part two and three and this will likely answer your question.
@claritoresdiano10213 жыл бұрын
kzfaq.info/get/bejne/qLRigaeQq7bShXU.html You can understand why forged piston still the best choice of durability
@jatigre15 жыл бұрын
A lot of "eye-balling-technology" being used here
@ke6gwf5 жыл бұрын
Eyeballing and touchy feely is the best way to find imperfections, and then measuring is used for the critical dimensions.
@Kurosaki990Ichigo5 жыл бұрын
Amiga pistons?
@subramaniamchandrasekar13975 жыл бұрын
Never heard extrusion can also be called forging.
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos5 жыл бұрын
This is not extrusion.
@subramaniamchandrasekar13975 жыл бұрын
Thanks. You are the expert. No arguments. Regards.
@leneanderthalien5 жыл бұрын
@@subramaniamchandrasekar1397 yes this is not extrusion: this process is in reality called "matrixing"...but the pistons from the common cars (inlusive GTI's) are mold , not forged/matrixed...
@siggyincr74474 жыл бұрын
Extrusion is when it is pressed through a shaped die and comes out the other end with the same profile as the die. Kind of like how some pasta is made. Forging is when a chunk of metal is heated till malleable and then formed between and upper and lower die.
@motherphoque88434 жыл бұрын
i thought forging is just put it in oven till its glowing red and then just put in water
@MEDEngineeringTechVideos4 жыл бұрын
Well that's part of the process.
@georgew.56394 жыл бұрын
That’s called tempering. It’s for hardening of the material.
@motherphoque88434 жыл бұрын
@@georgew.5639 well, theoretically, if i do that to my stock pistons, theyre gonna be hardened/more durable, right?
@AmrinderSingh-zx9hr Жыл бұрын
I am running a garrage with the name of PUNJAB RACING STORE Kharar-140307 in INDIA 🇮🇳. Where I modify and tune bikes for RACING. I usually use Wesico,woosner,Pro-X etc. Please tell me, How you can send me Pistons in INDIA as per my requirement.
@DerekGraham7775 жыл бұрын
Wow all that work but then they cheap out on the rest of the engine