one thing Kyle kirms doesn't do that every other gambling content creator does is promote sports books...actually he literally only promotes his KZfaq channel...that alone is why I respect him over anyone else

Ok ok, my apologies to the staff and producers @ circles off. Even though I think this episode was a bit knit picky, and Kyle didnt deserve to be roasted, you guys played nice. Kyle keeps his betting history for everyone to see on his website. He wins. Very transparent dude. This video you reviewed is old and not the style of content he does usually. I encourage you to watch one of his live episodes. Just sayin…

I think you guys are awesome. I also think Johnny is a bad communicator unlike Rob. When Rob talks it comes across as someone trying to teach or inform. When Johnny talks it comes across as let me explain why you don't know but I know. Him being young doesn't help his cause either. Knowing something and teaching something are not one in the same.

I've been a poker/sports capping pro for many years and see alot of these kinda guys that use some solid rules logic and selective tracking but lack understanding the deeper logic or self control but have enough experience to survive and go on a few hot streaks until they ride their emotions into the ground or supplement their bankrolls in other ways

@Rob @Johnny I went in on you guys a bit hard before I actually watched the full episode. I think that was unfair of me , and I apologize. KYLE WOULD 100% come on and face the music. I promise you’ll like the guy by the time the episode is over. Which I understand doesn’t excuse the fact that you think his information is flawed. Would you guys consider going through a slate of MLB games and discussing some strategy and possible leans?

I tried to handle this the right way. I was polite… didn’t bad mouth these guys... I even retweeted it for them. But after months of being lied to, it’s very clear that these are not honest people. There is so much bad information in this video… extremely manipulative language and flat out bad advice. Truly disappointed… cuz I don’t dislike these guys… it is what it is.

Don’t worry about any haters. You’re doing a service giving your point of view. Just found Kyle last week watching NBA game previews. Seems like a nice guy, but if that’s the first video you see on his page, it’s all fair game. And Johnny, wish you weren’t on load management and showed up every show.

You can tell Johnny doesn’t actually believe his own statement about Portnoy’s bet size giving his bets credibility. His constant initial reflex to take the contrarian point of view bit him in the ass there

1) This episode gave me some solid LOL moments with your comments. 2) Is Johnny aware that its supposed to be "G-Note" and not "Gino"? lol

hey guys thanks for the entertainment the dudes that worship this guy with their positive comments on his podcast comments section must not understand that they are proving just how much they don't know what they don't know about sports betting if they did nothing else but binge your podcasts that how much of a bettor better they would be and would agree with the statement i just made on another note johnny you have got to get rob a pinnacle hat he is getting a lot of face and it is causing a glare on the screen while watching on utube by the way i just liked and subscribed rarely do you have to like a gambling pod and i don't subscribe to pods but it's the least i could do to try and repay how you have helped me understand gambling thanks again

45:55 "do you think this guy wins" had me in tears

Did anyone else tune in thinking this was going to be an interview haha??

Kyle seems to be actually showing his model and breaking down games. More the the kind of content the avearge joe is looking for. Instead of always talking about getting limited and kicked off books which happens too a very small % of players. Its nice that you guys are that good, but can never tell us much because you can't give up your edge.

The analogy I can think of is an AA meeting where you're getting fairly decent (or at least not harmful) advice from a speaker for a while and then they suddenly switch to a slide focusing on where the best liquor deals are

Oh nooooo…you guys are about to go in on Kyle? This is a good guy. Man I feel terrible. I congratulated him when I saw he was on an episode

Johnny tryna tell me Dave portnoy opinion is worth listening to. Ouch brotha. This is not Kyle’s normal video either btw. He post good content in terms of breaking down each team and play style for nba and nfl. Just saying Kyle is not a losing bettor. This was very nit-picky. Rarely do I tail or fade Kyle’s picks but his normal videos are insightful.

29:50, I agree, however doesn’t parlaying reduce your edge because of lack of line shopping? Hard to get multiple legs with the best odds, so would be harder to quantify your edge as well? Love the show as always guys.

You’re right about linemakers sports. They’re really bad at betting, but they make their money by scamming.

Thanks for the knowledge guys… I’m a subscriber now

I might have misunderstood but I'm pretty sure Johnny made a mistake regarding parlays at ~30 mins. Your edge DOES compound, regardless of the fact you're able to get higher stakes down on parlays. I'm in Aus and am more comfortable with a decimal system, but as example: You have a total of $200 to put down. You have 2 legs with a 10% edge. 2.2/2 and 3.3/3 If bet singles, $100 a piece 2.2/2 EV $10 3.3/3 EV $10 $200 total staked with $20 EV Expected EV given 10% edge Now adding into a parlay (assuming no correlations affecting bookie odds given nor true odds) 7.26/6 - this is a 21% edge. You gained a free 1% (product is greater than the sum of it's parts) So EV even on a SMALLER total stake is higher $100 total staked with $21EV If you match like for like and put $200 on the parlay, you're now feasting on $42EV This compounding affect increases exponentially as you add more legs (as does the var). But it also has the same affect reversed if taking negative bets - which is the reason bookes love multis/parlays

Couple thoughts, first of all I will say you guys did a good job with the reaction. I thought it was an interview when I first clicked tbh. That said your thought at the end about maybe he would come on, I'm sure he would. I would love to see that interview because Kyle does good content. It's like entertainment style on games, using trend angles etc. I've only recently watched his stuff but he doesn't seem to do a lot of 'educational' content. So this is one he probably just put out knowing the types of comments he would get and maybe a slow time in the sports world and to be fair from a couple years ago.. He makes more money from content than from betting imo and normally I don't like the style of his type of content but the way he does it I do like and appreciate his consistency and volume in production. fwiw I'm not tailing any of his picks or saying he's sharp or square.. Kyle would probably agree that some of what he said was a mistake, looking back but I would give him a pass, certainly much worse out there if you look for it. Instead of "how to bet for income" Kyle should put out a video 'how to produce **(entertainment style, geared towards recs..)** sports betting content for income' then, then my friends, we would have something 💡

I ride with circle off first and foremost. I think Circles Off is the industry standard for educational material but going after Kyle is fucked up man. I’m only a couple minutes in but I don’t like where this is going…

In all fairness, Sauce has lost a lot of weight since this video was posted.

What’s wrong with Marty Gale?

Another great vid - sharing your channel in my betting circles Re: losing streaks and martingale. - I used to track all my bets (now summarize given volume). But with avg true odds of 3.5 I've had many, many, many runs of 8 to 10 losses in a row. A few times have hit the 50 region. Fresh bettors truly underestimate the power of var, and how willing it is to bend you over. Tversky had some good studies on the 70s/80s about human stupidity and pattern recognition

re: Bigger bettors have more valuable opinions. I think it’s obviously wrong as a hard rule, as you have trust fund babies with no edge losing millions. However if you caveat that you’re looking at winning bettors, then you can assume that the person betting big has a longer track record/experience to build up their bankroll that much.

Gino talk got me laughing

Kyle is a good capper and runs a 🔥 discord so yah next time u wanan rag on someone mabye dont do it wearing a pinnacle hat these dudes baught and paid for just like everyone else

Fake Johnny +150 didn’t hit.. martingaling this angle now… 😂 Great show! No clue how you’re only at 7k subs if people are serious about learning how to bet

What a plot twist! I laughed a lot when the martingale part began

you reference your edge alot in this video In what ways can you quantify/calculate your edge as a bettor?

Rob listen to Cold As Life…Born to Land Hard. Thank me later.

Boys, a thought I had on how to maybe make these less hostile: Clearly this guy is just misunderstood in a lot of aspects of the betting space and should absolutely be guided in the right direction. Listening to his video I responded similarly to you guys by laughing and just wanting to make fun of the absurdity of what was being said. I think a better approach could be less joking around and animation which can so easily come across as you guys just clowning this guy (especially when clipped) and IMO won’t lead to any of his fans, who will come here extremely defensive, actually maybe learning something. I think maybe just laying out the logic and math of why he’s wrong without laughing at the guy could be more beneficial, but also who knows that’s just my thoughts. Great work as always gentlemen.

These guys work for Pinnacle. FADE THESE HATERS

How do i get the merch? Pinnacle

That’s the only thing about the industry that’s a bit sad. Everyone’s out for themselves yet there’s this underlying herd mentality. I “vouch” for circles off all the time. Just like I vouch for Kyle and the Sauce network. At the end of the day our only enemy should be the book. Unless you watched the Berryhorse episode, in that case everyone placing a bet on the same game is an enemy.

Ya'll on Kyles nuts too much. Ya'll don't have locks like Systemplays.

DO NOT LISTEN TO DAVE PORTNOY ! He can afford it…that’s all, he’s about as sharp as beach ball

He mentioned the Martingale system and warned that it's not something you should do if you're betting for long term success. He probably shouldn't have added it in at all. But he wasn't advocating outright for it. He basically said he has used it, and that it's a dangerous approach.

make your own "how to bet for income" video, easy to tear someone else down now do it correct if this advice is so bad or work with sauce on a colab on good advice for newer bettors.

46:18 is the worst thing ive ever heard in my life HAHAHA

How do you guys not blast him for saying don't replenish losses and then advise adding from your paycheck to your bankroll after a losing week

@kylekirms stop worrying about me and worry about making a new bankroll management video cause this one is fraudddddd

Kyle said he reached out to have him on but was told you guys said you’re booked for the next couple of weeks. Would be nice to have him on in a timely response to the video.

martingale priming is fine

Oakland Raiders #54 Greg Biekert

You actually can martindale it when your loaded? Tell me why not?

I thought you guys were interviewing THE MAN Kyle Kirms. Click baiting his community of 83K followers, to increase your measly 7k is cheap. Good luck, circles Off

go ahead and block me too because i know that’s what you guys will do. don’t want your subs seeing these types of comments because it takes away the little credibility that you do have

Actually seen alot of kyles stuff he does have staff that are competent but they are by no means great altho each is ok at their respective sports with that said u guys are right horrible advice

“presented by pinnacle sportsbook” YEAH you guys feel threatened.

You guys put out good content and don’t need to stoop to this level to get more clicks.

Been following sauce for years. He has help me pull in 242 units in 3 years. So good try. There is a reason your channel is so low

Never trust a you tuber who promotes a sport book EVER. Rule number one

Lol these are such clown takes holy wow

🌽🌽🌽

A bit of nitpicking going on here….this is nothing like the syndicate idiot, Vegas Dave etc…..Reminds me of the Rob vs Darren R. panel at Bet Bash….Rob knows his stuff and has the respect, but seems to have only his opinion on how to try & educate bettors…..at least that how I perceive it.

These guys are clowns. Trolling for you tube clicks lolz.

Nothing worse than trying to generate interest in your show by shitting on a hardworking guy like Kyle. C’mon guys. Your show was good without this.

Albright I’m gonna chill and watch the full episode before I comment again but if you guys are going after people like Kyle, you’re just an elitist that’s being snobby and picking on him for a podcast he did early on in his career. This is knit picking. Alright alright. I’ll chill and just watch before I assume what you’re gonna do or say…

if these people are winning why would they need to sell picks or even give them away on youtube? think just a little bit

Player props sure way to go broke