T Shooter EXCELLENT point. I guess I forgot too mention that very important fact.

Cleaver lad I'm glad you added the comment I had visions of men shaking like leaves on ever test. I had a carbon fibre bottle but got rid of it because I never felt safe around it.

Yes, it is amazing, the amount of energy that is contained in a 4500 PSI air cylinder and why a hydro-test is so very important.

@@AirGunScientist ....and in a relatively small containment as well.

Thank you for a very nice post. I appreciate it when people take the time to say "thank you" Best to you and SAFE SHOOTING!

Thank you. So few people understand the necessity for a hydro. They think I post stuff like this because I want to sell new tanks. The truth is, I worked in Aerospace, and if I can, I won't allow flawed devices to be out there endangering people's lives.

Great point!

@@AirGunScientist According to the NAVY, and their testing, cylinders will show other signs of failure prior to catastrophic failure. If you have any deformation or leaking, stop using that cylinder... and get modal acoustic emissions testing done every five years... and toss the cylinder after 30... There! I just saved a bunch of money thanks to the NAVY.

@@horscategorie would a carbon tank be safer than a aluminum tank?

Oh its definitely not a good idea.. remember carbon fiber is basically just material and hardened glue.. Every time you put such immense pressures or stress the mixture will contract and expand and this could cause the integrity to be compromised.. micro cracks.. and more cracks the next time you dive.. Underwater the pressure is equally from all sides... so the moment the hull is weakened and does not have uniform strength it will collapse.. You could probably get away with carbon fiber if you seriously over engineer the strength.. but you definitely shouldn't be 'pushing it to the limits'. I used to be a road cyclist.. and i had a carbon bike.. and after a couple of years of cycling the frame is not as stiff as when it was new.. you can feel the frame bending more under each pedal stroke.. .this obviously means wear and tear causes it to weaken.

@@zaskadu8320 lol I have a solid steel old-ass mountain bike that feels like a damn rock on wheels. no bending there XD it's heavy as shit though

It actually scares me when I see people using un-hydrotested tanks.

So in 40+ years you've only dived 250 times or just over "bi-monthly" and that has "educated" you on the mysteries of "hydro testing"?

Uh...paintball "markers" use C02. Not "wet" compressed atmospheric air. It tends to cause "icing" due to the huge and total pressure drop at the "breech". CO2 is also "cheap" compared to "scuba tanks" and a "scuba compressor". Not to mention as an inert gas with no temperature-pressure gradient and a hell of a lot more density than "air" for a lot more "power" per psi at a far lower "tank pressure" CO2 bottles can be made of the same material the overwhelming vast majority of CO2 "pressure vessels" filled daily are made from. Aluminum. The "pressure vessels"? Carbonated beverage cans. And now "bottles". All air compressors capable of "high pressure" - 250 psi and up - are also "oiled" and "compress" the air so much that "cleaning" and "drying" the air is impossible. Of course compressor oil is "mineral oil" and "non-toxic" but its still a "solvent" that will "soften" the "epoxy" adhesive "cement" in "composites" like fiberglass and carbon fiber in their "raw" state and that's what "hydro testing" is really "looking for". Otherwise pressure vessels - especially steel - are only "hydro tested" when they are used to store heavier-than-air "dual threat" hazardous materials like anhydrous ammonia and after the tanks have held only "air" at any point since their last certification. Water vapor, condensation and "hydrocarbon" ingredients in the petroleum-based NH3 and the sulfur and salts that always go with "refined crude oil" can form sulfuric and/or hydrochloric acid and corrode pressure vessels even if they're not "rusty". No "pro" scuba diver would ever f&ck around "hydro testing" anything in his "toolbox" because he would see that initial CERTIFICATION for what it is. The manufacturer's "guarantee" on what is obviously a "perishable" product with an indeterminate service life but one not exceeding 5 years "reliably" subjected to "normal use".

Thanks!!

normellow Many people upgrade to our TJ3 SLO-FLO valve. Out comes complete with 2 gauges, one to show the pressure being put into the pcp airgun, and the second gauge that constantly shows the pressures inside the carbon fiber tank.

No need to remove, as the Hydrotest facility will do so. With that said, if you can remove the valve, do so, so that you know they don't damage it by dropping it, etc..

I got 5500 on expired fire fighter tanks. Got good valves and burst disk.. yep. 5500. Fck 4500. I have a Huben gk1 air pistol.

5500psi would be nice but I couldn’t fill that with my compressor. How do you fill to 5500psi?

@@Cr125stin anything more than 4500 usually needs a very specialized compressor like scuba shops use. There are hand pumps that can get that high, but it’s quite a workout.

Chris, Thank you for the kind words. Please tell your friends or those on the forums so they'll know. We rely on word-of-mouth. Cheers :-)

Same

Normally SCBA valves aren't plated, so I am at a loss as to what the issue is. Call 714-907-0067 8-530 Pacific and we can help

The measurement of water volume determines if weakness is present. If pressuring it caused issues, the tank would over-inflate and fail the test.

Jake the test pressurize the tank to something like 1.6x its limit, he said 5/3 so 2/3 over its limit. if the tank fails at or before that point, its deemed dangerous and likely to blow if dropped or slightly damaged in daily usage. I don't know but guessing that a healthy tank probably should be testable to say 2x its nominel pressure. you simply don't want a tank thats going to fail if your cat sit on it. exaggerating but the point is, any tank will fail if abused enough, you want that point to be far from everyday operation, thats what the test is about, finding out if that point have gotten too close for comfort.

"FAIL" means it "baloons" or "displaces" more water than it is supposed to (i.e. indicating weakness). "FAIL" dos NOT mean it explodes, only that the tank stretches more than it is allowed. Hope that makes sense. Cheers.

They will typically have a burst disk system built into them that destroys the gun or at least parts of it to safely bleed out the air.

No. It is designed NOT to fail at over 15,000 PSI!

Watching it blow up would be anti-climactic, as the tanks are not pressurized with Air (or the stored energy would release like a bomb). Instead they are filled with water (hence the reason it is called a HYDRO-test) which is incompressible, and hence release very little energy if the tank were to rupture. Yeah, got to agree, it would be cool to see. I've seen containment vessles tested by using a tank, and shooting it with a 44 mag after they scored the carbon fiber so that it more easily ruptures. Lifts the whole containment vessel off the ground.

He has not, but that would really cool!

EXCELLENT QUESTION! No harm. The tanks are designed to withstand a pressure of over 13,000 PSI. They are tested to only 7,500 PSI.

This is the proper procedure. Design a tank properly, continue to make as designed, fill with air, and look at how much it expands.

Thank you for your feedback. 99% of our tanks go out the door with the full armor. The other 1% call us and order it if they didn't, wishing they bought it in the first place. They recognize that a tank is an investment, so they want to insure its safety. The Full Armor (option 3) consists of the following: Carry Handle Feet - So the tank doesn't roll around Boot - Not only protects the bottom of the tank, but also allows the tank to stand up, so you can easily read the gauges. Tank Protector More information is here: experthpa.com/cart/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=58 experthpa.com/cart/secure/images/products/611.jpg

Joe, I had a chance to read your ad and the listings. Sorry for the additional Q's but as I said I'm returning to air power after decades of powder burning so I'm a neophyte to what's available and am striving to deal with only the best. Q 1 - Are all your products USA made start to finish? Q 2 - what is the length of the fill hose? Q 3 - How many fills for FX Impact sized cylinders? Q 4 - What's the delivery schedule and is delivery included? Q 5 - Am assuming (I dislike that word...lol) the tanks are carbon fiber, and am reading the restrictions are possible going to allow a 30 year life expectancy - is that fact or rhetoric? OK..... will close and say a prayer for your patience as questions from newbies are the worst! My apologies and Thanks! Hoping for a great new friendship and business relationship - my family usually follows my lead....they'll keep you busy!

Out of hundreds of items all are American (other than obvously PCP guns made in Europe). I think only 2 are Chinese becauses they aren't avaiable in the USA.

Not sure which items you meant - you might not have read all of my Q's as there are 5. Again sorry to take up so much of your time, am hoping others can learn along with me. Also - let's SEE if we CAN get those last two items made here - I love displaying American Made signs! If you haven't guessed - yeah I'm Vet who still believes this is the finest place in the world, and I want to keep it that way too. We're in Oregon and have a small horse ranch w/pests - the horses hate loud sudden noises in their barn, and I hate the idea of having a horse come up lame because I dispatch a critter that's not on my preferred guest list! LOL Thanks Again.

I like what you are saying about displaying American Made Sigs. Also as a Vet I always look for thing that are made in that place called USA.

Bruh people would be like “ this man is crazy but I get the idea “ that’s damn near all day air 🤣

Hmmmm, good question. I'll ask.

They are tested at 7500+ PSI. Also, cylinders have failed like that shown if severely damaged (run over by fire apparatus...) Don't forget they have a burst disk to prevent being pressurized that high, so for testing they remove the valve which has the burst disk.

@@horscategorie I do hydrotest too up to 10.000 psi. If there is no any damage on a 300/450 or 517 bar composite cylinder to see this kind of damage almost impossible with normal test pressures I think the cylinder in your hand testted at 15.000 psi

@@karakuscher Yeah - I have never had or known of any catastrophic failures in over a 24 year career other than individual cases on a national level that always had a severe compromise like apparatus driving over a cylinder. It reminds me of hose testing - Why do it? We stress the hose, it may fail at the next fire... Better just to decommission it at 10 years or whatever testing shows to be appropriate. Testing puts extreme stress on items and sets up future failure, just my opinion.

I just paid $40 for a hydro and $20 for a visual at my local shop. SCUBA is not a cheap sport, but I'd rather know my tank is safe than run the risk.

About $25=$35 or so locally in SoCal.

They one in the video was a Carbon Fiber tank.

The Airgun Scientist Joe Brancato thanks for the reply.

It was a Drager 300 bar fibre wrapped composite cylinder.

The one that was shown in the video was what is referred to as a "Hoop Wrapped" as opposed to a fully wrapped. A hopped wrapped tank is an older design (that are still made), and is basically a SCUBA tank that is wrapped with loops of fiberglass around only the middle, (not the neck and base). It's the worst of the worst of the worst. Typically all the weight of a metal tank, the 3 year recert (vs 5 for carbon fiber) and 15 total life of a fiberglass. And they aren't that cheap!

New carbon fiber tanks are good for 5 years after mfg date on the tank.

Similar here: 15 years. There is a program to allow some tanks to be sent to a special place that re-certifies them for another 15 years, but it is VERY expensive to re-certify the first time (hundreds of dollars) and subsequently alsl very expensive to re-certify every 5 years. It's not worth the cost to an individual, as it's cheaper to by a cylinder from www.ExpertHPA.com, or AirTanksForSale.com for a few hundred.

Metal Tanks need to be re-hydro tested EVERY year. Carbon Fiber every five, and Fiberglass (most are out of date by now anyway) every 3 years. HTH

Steel and aluminum SCUBA tanks in the US have to be visually inspected every year and hydro tested every 5 years.

@@Trekker326 Agree, Airgun Scientist is self proclaimed

One would never test to only 4500 PSI. If it failed at testing, it could just as easily fail at usage.

Oil and very high pressure air is what makes a diesel engine combust.

NOOO! You're PCP airgun will literally EXPLODE! I have pictures of this from others that have tried, and nearly died! Think of a Diesel engine and how it is ignited. High pressure, fuel (a little oil in the PCP), and oxygen and KABOOM!

They also will last longer if filled to lower pressures... so will your compressor... Do you really need your PCP at 4500? Isnt 4000 enough?

they measure the expansion that occurs. a healthy tank should have minimal expansion under less pressure. it is better to pop it ahead of time. it's like a stress test for humans to measure cardio fitness. if they respond poorly to some physical exertion, they can't regularly maintain that higher rigor unless they're heavily supervised or they might have a heart attack or something.