Hi jazza

Daddy

Amogus

Hello jazza

😂😂😂😂😂 •. •

I agree, it feels more like an ancient spirit who was the servant of Morgoth.

The movie balrog looks more like a devil from Christian mythology.

It does look very cool, agreed. There is still the age old debate about Balrog wings. But overall the shadow and flame in a humanoid shape IS what a Balrog should theoretically look like. They're Maiar like Gandalf and Saruman. But ones that have fallen to serve Morgoth. Sauron is actually a Balrog too. Morgoth's chief Balrog. Only Morgoth is a higher level being. The rest are all of the same kind. Which goes to show how significant their "raiment" is in terms of how they appear to others.

Yea I definitely feel like this smokey version is a much more accurate look than the movie and it feels more imposing too, and it makes it more significant that Gandalf fought it with light

@@QueenMonny Sauron is a Maiar but not a Balrog, Gothmog is the chief Balrog.

Given Tolkien heavy use of Nordic sagas as an inspiration I always felt a Balrog was closer to a fire giant of Muspelheim rather than the christianised demon form that artists interpreted it as even before the movies

The thing I think most forget about the Balrogs is that they were/are Maiar. And more based on Christian mythology around angels. Rather than the Nordic mythology which were more used to style of narrative linguistics And lets not forget the Celtic influence upon Tolkien as he was big fan of the Welsh/Gaelic languages for they melodic cadence.

I always imagined it like a guy inside an exoskeleton made of shadow. Wrapped in it and a animating it.

Can I be your friend all of you

I really like Jazza's way of depicting the Balrog. My "favourite" Balrog is still the one from the animated LOTR Movie from 1978 though. It's actually pretty far from the original description in the book - but it has such a unique and surprising appearance, while the Balrog from the LOTR Trilogy disappointed me, since it looked "impressive" but also somehow very "standard" and unimaginative... I think that Jazza's interpretation (especially after being "perfected" by Alicia) would have been much cooler and even more impressive in the Trilogy. Since instead of really exploring the elements of darkness and fire they just went with a "giant lava monster" with massive horns, wings and flames around it - actually much more a creature of light & fire than of shadows. @Glorfindel Thank you for pointing out that Balrogs are actually only the size of humans. Which means that they should actually be much more similar to a Nazgul than any "beastlike monster"...

Which is what its supposed to invoke

For me, the movie version just looks cool and badass, but not really terrifying and creepy like his design

​@@keepitsecret-dl1pr I'm inclined to think a combination of technological, time, and budgetary limitations landed them with the kind of Balrog we saw in Peter Jackson's movie. I'm sure it's much easier to render a solid shadowy humanoid-demon with the only smoke coming from its flames, rather than smoke and shadow constantly wrapping a humanoid figure while it's simultaneously on fire.

I think you should watch the movie again mate 😅

@@iPlayOnSpicauntil all those scenes when Frodo had the ring on and everything around him was whispy and distorted the whole time he wore it... I'd have agreed with you until this, lol

Right!? it felt so much more terrifying and closer to the element that Lovecraft thought of, rather than most drawings/interpretations that are seen in modern media (Just my opinion tho lol-)

Cthulhu

Hound squid?

Reminds me of nightstalker from dota 2

I think the shape was something he misinterpreted though, although I can't blame him since H.P. Lovecraft used the term: “like a Mountain walking”. Since mountains usually have arches due to them having peaks. I think he was saying it was as big as a mountain… which is what surprised our guy here lol. Although the arched back is indeed cool

This is literally what I commented before I saw yours

wow it seems Im not the only one that thought so. Like when he stick to his style I'm like nah, but then there are those videos where he is showing his skills.

I always knew Jazza is a wonderful artist. Even his playing around is still excellent art work.

A

Was about to say the same thing. He usually does such cartoony art that I forget he’s such a legitimately incredible artist.

As a Tolkien purist I too am quite impressed with that Balrog depiction, for the most part. It still suffers from gigantism. He never really says how big they are exactly but I’m pretty sure that’s way too big.

@@birdymcpig I ever thought he can change his size, he's made by shadow and flames, both incorporeal and without a stable size and shape.

@@birdymcpig I thought this too at first but after going back and reading that chapter, Tolkien talks about “man shaped, yet greater”. So he should be significantly bigger. Also, just in my mind they should be bigger than trolls but not quite as big as Melkor has been imagined in artwork. Somewhere in between, which this seems to be.

@@danielmyers76 “greater” is relative, it does not necessarily mean way bigger or gigantic or even taller. Man shape but greater could easily mean only 8’ tall. To reiterate, Tolkien’s descriptions of Balrogs are not very specific. Even so, the roughly 30’ tall depiction here is a bit of a stretch (pun intended). There’s also an essay he wrote suggesting that they couldn’t change form.

@@birdymcpig this is true. He did leave many things vague intentionally. Many things completely mysterious, and for good reason. It’s hard for me to imagine something that is supposed to be one of the most terrifying things in all the legendarium not be at the very least larger than trolls. I understand as well that the shadows about them are part of what is supposed to make them seem “greater” as well. After reading the descriptions from fellowship many times I don’t see man size or even just a foot or two taller. If part of the terror is them being “greater”, I see something in my mind very close to the scale here. Maybe a little bit smaller but not much. A chasm so large that the stones being laid down have to be laid down by trolls, yet the Balrog leaps over it? That’s a fairly big thing.

Unless I missremember, the book never sais it has a face. Only fiery eyes and bull horns. Thats it.

@@ethribin4188 The book doesn't mention horns or eyes

Yes please, I would purchase that in a heartbeat!

I agree!!

It is without a doubt a work of art and better than I could do in my wildest dreams, but with SHADOW being emphasized three times in the description, the rendering just seems too bright. It looks like fire and smoke rather than a shadow monster. It looked better without the coloring in my opinion. But as a monster and drawing all on it's own, I would definitely hang it on my wall!

Also this.

This

Man, that would be awesome! The Dunwich Horror comes to mind but there are lots of things out there.

Yes! Like the monster from Hyperion books. would be amazing to see his version!

@@supaGfunk69 I was thinking the same thing! Would love to see his Version of the Shrike.

Monsters from the Final Fantasy series could be fun too. They have some really obscure ones, especially from the older games

Folklore monsters imdediately comes to mind, would be interesting to see how he does. Monsters also from Monster hunter would be interesting too to see how close he gets.

You made me think of the South Park episode

Except little thing that it was completely different from the book description

yeah it doesnt have 6 eyes as lovecraft himself drew it and wrote cthulhu had@@averax9875

Looks like a darksouls boss

@@psysloth1728 already envisioning another fight against shitty camera position, rather than boss itself.

It’s cause he’s an aussie

Yep

yep

Yep

Yep

Yep

FAX

I just finished the books a few months ago

Especially due to the Balrog boiling down to being technically an angle type thing, it really makes it so much more faithful to the monster and all of that

It is funny, because people have been discussing this for ages and there technically just is no clear answer.

@@FrenkieWest32 Haha oh I'm aware, but she was an English teacher who latched on to "LIKE two vast wings" and she would die on the hill of using the word like clearly means it doesn't actually have wings. I just had the mentality of its a fictional creature and the movie version looked dope, but so does what this guy drew.

@@davidmoore2279 Yeah that makes sense. I think there is also a line in Tolkien's other writings where multiple balrogs ''flew'', but as this can also be an analogy for making haste it is still debatable.

nah those type of people are super annoying. to be so obsessed that their interpretation is correct over a fictional being in a book she didn't write.

@@FrenkieWest32 I think that you are referring to this quote from the Silmarillion: "Swiftly they arose, and they passed with winged speed over Hithlum, and they came to Lammoth as a tempest of fire." However, as you say, that is also ambiguous and can either just be a metaphor or it can be a result of shapechanging and "shadow wings".

yes!! i’m reading the books right now and recently have been longing to see a good interpretation and this came at the perfect time

THISSSS! Especially in the simarillion when tolkien describes the balrog as one of the first demons it kinda brought the one in LOTR into another light and I totally imagined it like the one he drew rather than the movie version

So good.

Not true, people who personally knew Tolkien worked on that movie too, Bcs of accurancy.

@@Gil-galad22 Well, Christopher Tolkien, whose editing and curating of his father's texts and manuscripts was instrumental to our understanding of Tolkien's mythology, famously didn't like the films. He dismissed them as just another action movie. So, maybe they weren't as accurate as you think. Don't get me wrong, they're great movies and I rewatch their extended versions twice a year. I'm just saying that they are still an artistic interpretation of the source text. One the first Tolkien scholar, his son, didn't particularly enjoy.

It also fits Lovecraft's own drawings of him. More empty eyes, less angry just more.. terrifyingly apathetic of your existence.

Yeah honestly the fact that it feels disconnected, illogical, misshapen feels more at home with Lovecraft

It's awesome! I need to know what kind of supplements they've got down in Ryleh. Eons of sleep and the guy's still yolked

Yeah, the thing is, nobody really knows what Cthulhu looks like because anyone who sets eyes upon any of HP's works instantly go insane because it's literally impossible for our brains to process what we are looking at when beholding The Old Ones. So imagine every rendition of Cthulhu as just fanart. Even our pronunciation of his name is wrong. It's just the closest we can get to pronouncing it. Wild stuff. HP is truly the father of cosmic horror, and horror would not be what it is today without him.

@@rish1656 Could you imagine being in a storm on a boat, and becoming shipwrecked, but thankfully you're on an island. You decide to look around and you come across a large stone palace like structure. You and your crew decide to explore it and you come to a huge stone door with odd runes adorning it. It suddenly begins to open and Cthulhu walks out, 1,000+ ft tall.... I would instantly shoot myself in the head lol

Oh yeah I agree. Would be cool to see how would he draw Ra'zac and Lethrblaka from Inheritance Cycle.

@@walkelftexasranger I forgot how much I loved the Inheritance Cycle books.

I wouldn't mind seeing his take on the Endbringers from the web serial Worm. Their descriptions leave a decent amount of room for interpretation, and I've seen some really interesting takes on their appearances.

Maybe a trolloc or other creature from Wheel of Time since they aren’t as well known to the general public

@@douglasfreer why not try Kothoga, although in the book he was called Mbwun which translates to he who walks on fours. The empty man skeleton or final form is also terrifyingly good. or even the mimic bugs from del Toro's film Mimic. I'm sure someone would love to see his version of a Morwen as well from Outlander.

in the cartoon lotr it has mane like a lion

Yeah, The Others in the books were depicted more like the Fair Folk in old legends: tall, skinny, hauntingly beautiful in a weird/otherworldly sense.

Yes! His Balrog instantly made me want to use that artwork to inspire a demon/dark entity for my DnD campaign. Far more terrifying than the generic devil look from the movies (not to slam the movies, much love, probably really hard to CGI that)

@@hoid9407 ah you’re right! Imma try to homebrew a creature like this for my next campaign, thanks for the idea!

We've never actually gotten a confirmed size on them, but all evidence points to it being about man-sized (so probably around six feet tall, maybe a little over since it's a scary monster). The idea of a man-sized creature that gives the impression that it's bigger than it actually is just from its aura and vibe is really cool, but definitely doesn't work for a movie. Gandalf wouldn't have appeared (emphasis on *appeared* ) nearly as out-matched against something the same height as him, and conveying a feeling of something being smaller than it felt would (probably) be impossible to do in a film without making it look goofy. It would have looked more like Little John with a JoJo aura vs Robin Hood on the bridge than quietly powerful wise old wizard vs demon of unimaginable power.

@@kenjutsukata1o1 Oh I had no idea they were roughly the size of a man. That actually works even better from a storytelling perspective for dnd. I love the idea of a shadow that's maybe slightly taller than them, 7 feet-ish, and just a silent, implacable, shadowy enemy wreathed in flame. I'm going to use that as my BBEG's second in command.

I would like a print of that... On metal perhaps?

YOUUUU SHALLL NOTT PAAAASSSSSSSS

Yeah, it’s the one time Gandalf actually looks worried.

I watch that trilogy once a year.

@@NewCandyCane only once a year?

​@@Inquisitor_Vexnah its against the witch king. Gandalf killed the Balrog. The Witch King would have killed Gandalf if not for the Horns of the Rohirrim

it has a hunchback?

Which is why there is few good art depictions of Cthulhu. This was not close to what Lovecraft was attempting to depict, despite his illustrations being quite similar. Whilst trying to draw an image of Cthulhu is fully intended to be futile, few attempt to depict his incomprehensible nature which is his most notable description. It actually results in being one of very few occasions where I prefer AI art over human artists. They can do 'incomprehensible' better than any human, allowing for some far more interesting Cthulhu imagery than just a humanoid octopus with wings. You kinda have to draw an 'anthropoid octopus' but in a psychidelic style to start to come close. An image of Cthulhu should suggest that description rather than clearly be it. Something equivalent to interpreting an inkblot test.

@@pagatryx5451 To be fair to most artists, the books give a very clear, well-defined description of Cthulhu in the forms of descriptions of both statues and drawings of him.

@@84warhead (Apologies for the long essay but it's interesting to me so F it.) Hmm. Technically, yes. But keep in mind it makes very apparent in the story that those literal descriptions are simply the closest words can come to describe it, again, like an inkblot test. It is not a description made easily. Both descriptions are also given from the human perspective. Call of Cthulhu has a first persona narrator, based on notes. So, again, we're seeing the aftermath of someones interpretation of Cthulhu. There is no trustworthy description of him. If we cannot comprehend something, our descriptions are inherently flawed/dumbed down to become comprehensible. I don't exactly blame artists for drawing him how he is literally described, but I feel like art should not just be faithful to the descriptions of the characters, but the central ideas behind them. Art is a form of storytelling much like literature is. My problem with AI art is that it loses the storytelling aspect for the sake of a simple visual depiction. That's not art, that's just a drawing/painting. If, as a human artist, you simply go for depicting literal descriptions much like an AI, your art is...wasted. I feel like art that understands the material and adapts it to a visual medium is where humans won't be bested, and art that is most impressive to me. So, I think any art video that's about adapting non-visual characters from their descriptions should REALLY focus on more than just a literal description. AI can do that. Humans can do better... If you read the short story, are aware of the concept of cosmic horror, or understand Lovecraft's general style, then you'd quickly understand that the entire point of his work is the incomprehensible. That which breaks our own understanding of the cosmos. So, any faithful art of his work should still illicit, or at least attempt to, the same ideas he was going with when he originally created Cthulhu. A being that we cannot comprehend visually or otherwise. So the art should incite the same fear of the unknown, and incomprehensible style. Junji Ito, for example, does this in Uzumaki. Lovecraft does draw the clay bast of Cthulhu, but that was not included in the story, is hardly canon, and again is man made and it has already been dumbed down into human comprehension. But I guess that's beyond the scope of this video. I just feel like visually interpreting Lovecraft is a VERY bad idea if you don't understand that the core concept of his work makes it essentially impossible to visually interpret accurately. If you draw Cthulhu similarly to other artists, you failed at adapting Cthulhu in my opinion. So just ignoring that entirely, like most Cthulhu art seems to do, just seems like pop cultural adaptations for people who like the mood/atmosphere of the Cthulhu Mythos but haven't actually read Lovecraft. Because, if you understand it, they're just illustrating 2nd hand, human descriptions of something that is not meant to be comprehended by humans visually...

cthulu

There is an Argentine comic artist called Breccia who is a very old comic artist he has the best art of what would be Cthulhu is a drawing that me explaining would not have the same impact, but it's literally a rorchac-style blur but at the same time referring to the description it's too perfect.

X doubt.

Giant shadow fire man or a giant hell beast engulfed in flame. One of these are not like the other

Missing wings tho.

​@@themonsterunderyourbed9408 Tolkien never mentioned wings, he merely said "shrouded by shadows LIKE wings". It is open to interpretation but it can easily be a metaphor of how a shadowy aura surrounds the Balrog like wings snuggle around a bird's body.

I 2nd a part 2

Now Harry Potter please

Tbf, R'lyeh (Chtuluh's city) IS indescribable, because there isn't a way to fully make an image of how would it actually look like, because as stated, it's virtually impossible to guess the angles of every element, such as the ground and sea itself, which they didn't know if it was on an horizontal or vertical position

​@@tomiketheamogushunter7370I mean it's not too hard to do impossible geometry. MC Escher comes to mind.

It's a long running joke about Lovecraft that if he tells you something is indescribable, you know for a fact he's about to spend a long time describing it in excruciating detail.

The "inspired by but legally distinctive from" ouroboros is real!

The movie version was actually based on John Howe's depiction, him being a well known Tolkien artist and hired as a concept artist for the movies.

The major issue here is that is a description of a statue, not the priest itself. Some sailor saw the thing, his descriptions are more thorough.

I personally found it funny how he said he "didn't realize it was this big" even though Cthulhu is actually described as even bigger than that. That one young man who saw him in a dream claims he was "many miles tall", which would also explain how Cthulhu is able to simply stand up from the ocean floor.

@@user-crane Cthulhu also got his head burst by a steam yacht. I don't think Lovecraft had a particularly good grasp of scale.

From the books I picture the Balrog to be of Beorn size (ie an incredibly large human). After all they are Maia the same as Gandalf, Saruman, Sauron, Radaghast etc. Something that looks (somewhat) like the Avatar of Khaine from 40K.

@@The_Tradie_Trainer I like the comparison with the Avatar of Khaine, as I think in the books their size is never explicitly mentioned, but got the idea that it can't be as big as it was depictured in the movies.

​@mapro3948 yeah, in the book, it went into the room with Balin's tomb (Gandalf magically fought it trying to break through the back door they ran through) So it couldn't be much bigger than the Cave Troll cuz that thing barely gets through the door

@@kharnthebetrayer8251 does the book describe how big the doorway is though? (Been a while since I’ve read LOTR!)

@The_Tradie_Trainer I don't believe specifically. But the Troll ducks through the door. And Trolls are like.. 8 or 9 feet in the Hobbit I believe. So I'd assume the door to the tomb in 8ft or so. So the Balrog couldn't really be bigger than 10ft and still reasonably fit inside

First time I've heard that but what immediately comes to mind is a continuation: "Comparison is the thief of joy, unless you compare your self to your past self and see positive progress."

No wings

@@GentlemenGhidorah the books said the aura of shadow surrounding the balrog is LIKE giant black wings. Just a simile, not an actual attribute. It doesn't matter tho, although I suppose a balrog with wings wouldve just flown out the hole

@@GentlemenGhidorah I mean, they rode dragons into battles. If you are a winged creature yourself, why would you need to ride something else?

@@LibeliumDragonfly humans ride horses, while having legs.

@@GentlemenGhidorah Incomplete, although with how many analogies Tolkien used, it is not difficult to imagine them wingless.

Both are great, taking creative liberties is nothing Bad and works in the concept of the movie.

This is a great idea!! Jazza should do something like this!

I am the same, however, I only provide useful information. I'll say the most apparent features/details without going too much into detail. For example: "She was a woman with dark red "scarlet" hair reaching down to her shoulders, wore a shiny iron armor with a golden rose apparent in the middle of her breastplate, a red cape with golden details and two swords, on her waist, with straps hanging from their hilt, a blue and a green one, respectively. Her face was decorated with scars showing her experience in battle and she had a bright green and sky blue eyes capable of captivating anyone's gaze. Her posture showed that she was ready to attack anyone that came close to her and she look bloodthirsty, to say the least." I left a lot of information out that is going to be revealed later as plot.

If I make my dream of being a mangaka come true, what I really want is for them to make their own visual interpretations even if they deviate from what I designed.

​@@thecommenternobodycaresabout your idea to reveal more of the character along with the script made George RR Martin proud

@@thecommenternobodycaresabout I really hope this doesn't become a youtube debate- but I actually do some writing and editing myself- and as a fellow writer, I might say even in this instance you tell more than necessary. Make sure you are showing only so much as is needed, and keep telling the reader things to a minimum. Especially if you are writing in deep third person, so you aren't using narrator voice- don't think in terms of what is important to the reader to visualize- instead try to think from the perspective of the character they are following - how does that character witness the scene, and then try to find a way to incorporate that perspective into a means of showing the description within the action. So for instance, I might rewrite your description from lets say a youthful protagonist seeing this knight/general cutting an imposing visage on top of a hill before a battle. "... she stood on top of the hill, her scarlet hair falling like wild rivers of flame down to her shoulders. She turned to face them, her cold blue eyes, eyes which could entrance an entire army to fight at her behest, were hard and fierce. Scars marred the porcelain surface of her face, matching the deep gouges scratched into the chrome plated surface of her chest plate. Her battle worn cape, still a rich red despite its obvious age, billowed out behind her; its golden inlays catching like gems in the sunlight. MC fixed their sights on the emblem on the warrior's chest, afraid the woman could read their thoughts if their eyes met for too long. There MC saw a golden rose, not unlike (insert connection to world or back story etc). When MC looked up again the red woman outstretched her hand, offering it in greeting. She kept her other hand tight around the hilt of one of the two swords around her waist..." of course this was just a quick and dirty attempt to show the idea- but you should remember, only show the reader what they need to know. If your description starts sounding like a police report, or a tinder bio, you'll run the risk of losing many readers. I'm sorry for the unsolicited advice. I mean no offense and I wish you the best of luck! I simply saw your comment- thought how cool it is that you are brave enough to share an excerpt, nd thought I could offer some feedback! Good luck and keep writing!

@@randygerson911 Cthulhu bless your blasphemous putrid shape! A bunch of very, very good suggestions you've got there! 👍

Loft, this is intriguing

The Others/White Walkers aren't dead though, at least not in the show, and we don't know in the books but it seems unlikely.

@@7heSlime Then Un-dead.

i thought it could have been a lich

Breaking bad reference

Please end my life

Yeah, the first time I read the balrog description it sounded almost like an unholy knight style of creature. Imagine if something like that or Jazza’s drawing had come looming out of the darkness in the movies! Too me, that would almost be scarier than the giant beastial creature.

cool idea

Yeah really cool

Oh yes pls!! That would be such a perfect prompt for this

Yaaass!

This please!

I’m reading this series right now and yes! That’d be awesome!