John Williams vs Gustav Holst or Star Wars Vs The Planets

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7 жыл бұрын

This episode of Everything Music is called John Williams vs. Gustav Holst or Star Wars vs. the Planets. John Williams was influenced by a number of composers such as Wagner, Stravinsky, Richard Strauss, Erich Korngold and especially Gustav Holst. In today’s episode I will show you the melodic and harmonic influences that Holst had on John Williams music of Star Wars.
Gustav Holst (1874-1934) was an English composer, arranger and teacher and best known for his orchestral suite The Planets. His distinctive compositional style was the product of many influences like Wagner, Richard Strauss, Ravel, Grieg and Ralph Vaughn Williams.The Planets, Op. 32, is a seven-movement orchestral suite written between 1914 and 1916. Each movement of the suite is named after a planet of the Solar System and its corresponding astrological character as defined by Holst.
John Williams (born February 8, 1932) is an American composer, conductor, and pianist. With a career spanning over six decades he has composed some of the most popular and recognizable film scores in cinematic history, to many of the highest-grossing films of all-time, including Jaws, the Star Wars series, Superman, E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial, the Indiana Jones series, Jurassic Park, Schindler's List, and the first three Harry Potter films.
From their premieres to the present day, both The Planets and Star Wars have been enduringly popular, influential and widely performed and recorded.
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Пікірлер: 1 100

@clntsprngr 4 жыл бұрын

When asked if he thought John Williams was a good composer, my college orchestra Maestro said “John Williams is a lot of good composers.”

@khtnsuwdih 4 жыл бұрын

Ooooh. Meow!

@AntPDC 4 жыл бұрын

@@khtnsuwdih LOL, yah.

@SamTahbou 4 жыл бұрын

Great line

@manuelgramajo2000 4 жыл бұрын

He said that like something good or bad? I thing is something good

@owencrawford5984 3 жыл бұрын

@@manuelgramajo2000 something bad, saying he basically copies a lot of actually good composers

@dmoth 7 жыл бұрын

Another interesting video. Thank you. George Lucus actually wanted to use The Planets suit as his score to Star Wars and asked Williams to re-ochestrate to fit scenes. John Williams said, "how about I compose a new score in the style of The Planets". So it's no coincidence that they have similarities. many people say he ripped off Holst, when in fact he was asked to emulate it. With this in mind it further, truly demonstrates Williams artistry and talent.

@RickBeato 7 жыл бұрын

HI David- I actually cut that out of the video because I wasn't positive that was true. Thanks you for that! Everyone has influences :) Rick

@dmoth 7 жыл бұрын

Rick Beato thank you for your reply. Your videos are great! Williams certainly has many influences, as I have grown up listening to his scores and discovering Classical music on the way, I hear so much influence in his music from past masters such as Prokofiev, Bartok and Stravinsky as well as Holst. I would love you to dissect some Prokofiev sometime in the future. In my opinion he was an immense genius.

@liteoner 7 жыл бұрын

And the part from 8:00 is basically just a nod to Holst, that's why he basically copy-pasted it without changing it too much.

@RickBeato 7 жыл бұрын

David Hillman I will do a video or 2 on Prokofiev. He is one of my favorite composers. His piano concertos 1-3 are some of the best of all time. The 3rd is probably my favorite besides Beethoven's 4th. Love Prokofiev!

@GObama2k8 7 жыл бұрын

+Rick Beato Lucas actually temp tracked several pieces when he screened the film for JW, including the theme to Kings Row (1942) during the title crawl. If you aren't familiar, check that theme out and you'll hear the similarity to the Star Wars main theme immediately.

@dillonmderosa 7 жыл бұрын

You seriously are the teacher I wish I had in my college years.

@mcjoelio-gb 4 жыл бұрын

I would've definitely done music in college of this guy taught it

@sisleymichael 2 жыл бұрын

Amen.

@FengXingFengXing 6 жыл бұрын

This show why public domain is very important.

@TheSpacecraftX 4 жыл бұрын

Imagine the estate of Holst was able to stop Star Wars from being released or took all the money from the first one and we never got any more.

@parapoliticos52 4 жыл бұрын

@@TheSpacecraftX And that would have been a bad thing?

@TheSpacecraftX 4 жыл бұрын

@@parapoliticos52 Yes.

@getmemednerd9616 3 жыл бұрын

@Eugenio Witaszek scam

@getmemednerd9616 3 жыл бұрын

@Agustin Digaetano scam

@jordillach3222 3 жыл бұрын

Holst: "John, I am your father".

@antitheist2000 2 жыл бұрын

Very good 😂😂

@vladskiobi 2 жыл бұрын

*Mars plays quietly in the background like Imperial March* John: No, that's not true. That's impossible!

@davidberaru2935 2 жыл бұрын

From Vaughan-Williams to John Williams?!

@Psychof1st 2 жыл бұрын

Then they joined forces to defeat the even more evil, Darth Mahler.

@TheRealCortxVortx 7 жыл бұрын

Terry "Geezer" Butler was sitting around playing that G D C# counter melody on his bass after listening to The Planets-which he had recently discovered and "gotten into," he said. Tony Iommi was sitting across the room and liked it, especially the ominous sound of the tritone. They kept noodling around with it and next thing you know the dark melody of the title track of their first album, "Black Sabbath," was born.

@darkbackward4085 6 жыл бұрын

It was also used by Diamond Head for the beginning of "Am I Evil" which was later covered by Metallica.

@oliverjohn5566 4 жыл бұрын

The Birth Of Heavy Metal Music 🤘

@bradleyhohner8775 3 жыл бұрын

That is some excellent trivia, thanks. Very interesting. When it's pointed out it's easy to recognize, but pretty subtle otherwise, at least to my untrained 👂's.

@mogsy2112 3 жыл бұрын

Check out Overkill's "Who Tends the Fire".

@markkittel44 Жыл бұрын

So, Holst is the great grand-father of heavy metal....

@davebellamy4867 4 жыл бұрын

Holst is so underrated, it seems to me. The Planets is a masterpiece in the true sense IMHO. Rick is just covering Mars here. It's nice that he mentioned the double harps and that really comes into play in Saturn, which is so awesome in a completely different way.

@SamIAm-kz4hg 2 жыл бұрын

Dave Bellamy "Holst is so underrated, it seems to me." I don't think so. I think almost everyone has heard parts of the Planets, but they don't know what it is. Jupiter was used in the Simpsons, and I've heard more than one commercial with one section or another. I used to play Mars on day one to all of my grade nine music students. And without fail they would come back the next day and ask to hear it again.

@vaniamelamed5285 2 жыл бұрын

When I first watched Curse of the Black Pearl in theatres, all I could hear was Holst inspiration.

@ffggddss Жыл бұрын

@@SamIAm-kz4hg And I'm sure many have heard _Neptune, The Mystic,_ used a time or three. Also, _Uranus, The Magician,_ bears an uncanny resemblance to _The Sorcerer's Apprentice._ (which preceded _The Planets._ Was it "borrowed" by Holst?) Fred

@SamIAm-kz4hg Жыл бұрын

@@ffggddss Musicians borrow from other musicians. Good musicians steal.

@ffggddss Жыл бұрын

@@SamIAm-kz4hg Yes, I'm familiar with that old saw; which is what it is, because it's so true! And good musicians know how to steal effectively, not merely perfunctorily. As Holst apparently did, from Dukas.

@jsmenard1758 4 жыл бұрын

The Planets has become one of my favorite pieces of music. After listening to The Planets, I became convinced that most movie score composers get a tremendous amount of influence from Holst. Some of Mars actually reminds me of "Roman legion" scenes in Ben-Hur and also, (not by accident, i'm sure), the opening battle scene in Gladiator. I can hear influences of Holst in Poledouris' Conan score as well. The "Thaxted" section from Jupiter contains one of the most beautiful melodic phrases i have heard since Bach's Jesu. Holst is brilliant.

@bobbyboshay4406 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah. I think probably most scifi and fantasy movies from the 20th century I've seen I hear some of Holst in there at some point. :D

@mccartneyfan203 7 жыл бұрын

Here's an interesting fact that you may not have known. George Lucas actually originally requested that John Williams just adapt Holst's The Planets to the movie, but Williams insisted on writing original music. So, that's one of the reasons why the Star Wars score sounds so heavily influenced by The Planets.

@RickBeato 7 жыл бұрын

I just replied to another comment about that. I wasn't sure that was true so I edited that out of the video. Thanks Cade!

@Superphilipp 7 жыл бұрын

Cade Roberts, do you have a source on that?

@saltysnowflake5832 6 жыл бұрын

Cade Roberts Yeah. He used planets as a temp track as well, and George really liked it.

@ksenobite 6 жыл бұрын

Lucas should have requested that Williams also writes the screenplay. Could have been good film

@alwallace4538 5 жыл бұрын

Wow that's awesome! I always thought that was a new arrangement of Mars

@xXSoralinkXx 4 жыл бұрын

Don't forget Antonin Dvorak! Whenever I listen to his "New World Symphony" I can hear half of the Star Wars Soundtrack! ;-) But it's really great to listen to all the inspirations of a composer, in order to understand their way of composing. :)

@marcparella 3 жыл бұрын

And... mostly Prokofiev.

@Tguchi26 2 жыл бұрын

Not to mention the basically copied theme for jaws, that is the introduction to the NW Symphonies final movement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

@davidberaru2935 2 жыл бұрын

Just listen to the song “ One is the Loneliest” and you will hear Dvorak” The New World Symphony!

@luisn642 2 жыл бұрын

And the second movement of the rite of spring sounds like C3P0 walking through the desert

@markkittel44 Жыл бұрын

All of these are right. Williams borrowed a lot of styles from a lot of composers for Star Wars, in part I think out of Lucas's original desire to use classical pieces for the films, as Kubrick had done for 2001. Williams made a Star Wars score distinct enough to stand on its own, but with enough clear influences to inform listeners of the music's roots. And thus was born the sci-fi classical music nerd.......

@CFlo3 5 жыл бұрын

The planets is such an incredible piece of music as a whole

@AimeeNolte 7 жыл бұрын

So fun!! Love this!

@DeltaFoxtrotWhiskey3 6 жыл бұрын

If you're going to play chords over C's don't you need a passport?

@nicolaslofgren 5 жыл бұрын

DeltaFoxtrotWhiskey3 this joke is wildly underrated

@Kasino80 5 жыл бұрын

Nice one

@olddoggeleventy2718 5 жыл бұрын

you really ought to be slapped for that...lmao

@ocantor_bc 5 жыл бұрын

Lol!

@edzmuda6870 5 жыл бұрын

Not if you go to Puerto Rico.

@MrKago1 6 жыл бұрын

I can't put my finger on exactly what it is about it, but the ballad in the middle of Jupiter is my favorite pieces of classical music of all. There is something moving about it, something, awe inspiring I think. I think its every bit as emotionally evocative as Beethoven Symphony No.7 Allegretto, but with a much more subtle emotion than the despair that Beethoven was going for.

@macscroge 6 жыл бұрын

Necroticus If you look up 'i vow to there my country' it's a longer version of the middle of Jupiter. It's composed by Holst as well.

@bobriedinger5287 5 жыл бұрын

Necroticus, I agree. That middle section of "Jupiter" is very moving. It has a certain nobility to it, I think and I get caught up in it every time I hear it. Interesting that you also referenced the movement from Beethoven's 7th. That has been a favorite of mine since the 6th grade, when the school orchestra I was in was invited to play it at the NY Pavillion at the 1964 World's Fair. Not too many years later I became familiar with the whole symphony. Great stuff.

@ravoxwasxhurr 5 жыл бұрын

I love it so much, I have a section of Jupiter tattooed on me

@jonanjello 5 жыл бұрын

Yeah, very moving. I feel the soundtrack from the original Conan the Barbarian was influenced by Jupiter. The orgy and soup scene in Conan has a melody reminiscent of Jupiter

@jairdabrini 2 жыл бұрын

@@macscroge tbh I always thought "I vow to thee my country" was an much older english folk song & not composed by Holst orginially at all, but it makes sense he wrote that one too. The main theme of the famous movie Braveheart contains a very similar melody.

@coachmichaeldeer 4 жыл бұрын

Fabulous breakdown of these majestic progressions. Thank you!!

@matthewstowell5813 6 жыл бұрын

This guy's ear is so good, I wish mine was that good

@mckenna8663 7 жыл бұрын

How Very Cool!!! Holst has been an absolute favorite of mine since high school and being trained through the Second Suite in E-flat. Our director guided us through not only learning to play our parts, but how Holst put together the arrangement and the nuances of the suite. I LOVE the works of John Williams.. and perhaps now I can see why they both touch me so deeply. Thank you very much.

@nigelroy1769 6 жыл бұрын

Mc Kenna the second suite in f....

@gerryjamesedwards1227 6 жыл бұрын

I love learning things like this about music I love, it really helps to appreciate it even more. Vaughan-Williams and Holst knew each other, I believe, I'm sure they went walking together. They also ran pieces they were working on past each other, and Holst respected V-W hugely so I wouldn't be surprised if he was quoting from Fantasia OTTT in The Planets. Vaughan-williams' piece always makes me think of rolling Atlantic waves.

@billybass4189 6 жыл бұрын

Nice teardown you brought it all out and made it much clearer, I was always aware of how similar these compositions are but now understand it better. This came up in conversation a few days ago and after a few views of other videos on KZfaq it finally pointed me to this. Cheers.

@MaxTooney 7 жыл бұрын

This score analysis is invaluable--many thanks for taking the time to do this! Thankfully the Holst and Williams scores are commercially available for those of us wishing to study them.

@timefilm 7 жыл бұрын

I try to defend John Williams when he's accused of stealing holst. The original Star Wars script called for powerful war drums and George Lucas has said he wrote the script with holst playing in the background. Btw how awesome is the planets!!

@timefilm 7 жыл бұрын

He emulated Holst. Saying he Imitated is negative and insulting.

@jennifergala 7 жыл бұрын

He did plagiarized almost everything even Shindler's list from James Horner and Puccini's "Manon Lescaut" near the end of the piece. I am deceived.

@timefilm 7 жыл бұрын

***** Lies

@quoniam426 7 жыл бұрын

He admits himself that his music is not as extraordinary as people say, compared of old great composers. Plus when you have to compose music for a movie/TV show, your time is quite limited, so you tend to emulate what you already know rather than try to invent a new music from scratch or it would take years to have a stroke of inspiration !

@johnjackson9767 7 жыл бұрын

@Quo Niam Would you expect him to say that his music is extraordinary? From what I've gathered from his interviews he rather likes to come off as a humble man.

@williamgeorgefraser 4 жыл бұрын

I think the music of virtually every SciFi movie has been influenced by "The Planets". It was the first classical work I heard as a young child and it is still the best I have ever heard.

@jeffreywollard922 Жыл бұрын

I somehow missed this video until tonight. I’ve always noticed the similarities between these composers’ work, and you have explained it brilliantly. Quite remarkable…so glad I found this video after five years!

@TrevorAllen 4 жыл бұрын

I know very little about music, but having noticed the similarity between Planets & Star Wars, I searched it to learn more. And this is easily one of the most instructive (while still accessible to non-musicians) videos I've seen. It's interesting, educational, and clearly presented. Many thanks to Rick!

@scott1564 Жыл бұрын

I think Holst is the single most underrated composer of all time. The Planets is arguably the greatest work of the early 20th Century (if not the entire century). Holst wrote some of the best concert band music, all of which is still being performed.

@ToxicTurtleIsMad 2 ай бұрын

It is crazy to say that

@sinfoniarc 3 жыл бұрын

I've frequently heard the influence of other composers in Williams' music. He certainly wears his influences on his sleeve.

@driplordvonskullmangler6106 6 жыл бұрын

In my high school's music department I was known for being a Holst fanboy, so when we got the chance to see the LA philharmonic perform the suite in its entirety, I jumped on it, got goosebumps when Mars began

@sandra.chengc 2 жыл бұрын

I wish I could afford to see one some day.

@driplordvonskullmangler6106 2 жыл бұрын

@@sandra.chengc an admirable goal, I hope you're able to go someday

@laertesdd 7 жыл бұрын

Aaahhh... here is the video I have been looking for!

@iansimpson27 4 жыл бұрын

I remember noticing the similarity when I heard the Star Wars theme for the first time, having previously had Holst's The Planets for the first time. At the time, I had wondered if it was intentional, or if John Williams had independently come up with the idea (which to my mind is a good indication of it being on the right side of the line between homage/inspiration and plagiarism). Finding out that it was intentional hasn't dented my opinion of the Star Wars score or theme - after hearing Mars I had been quite keen to hear other composers put their own spin on Holst's idea with the menacing interposition of D-flat and C chords. In harmonic terms, I think its menacing sound comes partly from a sense of it "threatening" to resolve, via C, into F minor (indeed I get that impression from the harmony of large parts of Mars), but in neither Mars nor Star Wars does it get there. I noticed the similarities between Mars and Gladiator's soundtrack as well. I think Hans Zimmer mostly stayed on the right side of the homage-plagiarism line, with the exception of a segment of the track "Barbarian Horde", which sounds uncomfortably close to Mars to my ears - something that I have never felt about anything from Star Wars despite the obvious and recurring influences from Mars.

@alfonzoginibi9513 7 жыл бұрын

Rick, could you do a video like this analyzing music from Howard Shore? He's one of my all time favorite film score composers, and I'm very curious as to what techniques he uses in his music.

@lanechange1063 7 жыл бұрын

Alfonzo Ginibi Agreed. His score for Cronenberg's Dead Ringers is amazing. The opening credits score is both beautiful and disturbing.

@greatwriterssteal8844 7 жыл бұрын

Shore also scored one of Tim Burton's few non-Elfman films: Ed Wood, possibly the best film ever.

@theMad_Artist 6 жыл бұрын

Yes, me too!! The Lord of the Rings trilogy has perhaps the most beautiful score I have ever heard!

@federicoriccobono651 2 жыл бұрын

The materialization of what my ears have always intuited! thank you so much for the wonderful comparative lesson!

@eastwind32 10 ай бұрын

Just found this video. This was great! Please do more of these. So interesting. A piece of music I’ve heard but never really LISTENED to before.

@andrefjbernardo 6 жыл бұрын

Gustav Holst... What a composer! From Mercury to Pluto, such a master at work. The whole concept, everything is beautiful.

@mrmogensen 5 жыл бұрын

Except there is no Pluto Suite

@andrefjbernardo 3 жыл бұрын

@@mrmogensen That's true. Pluto movement was composed by Colin Matthews.

@andrefjbernardo 3 жыл бұрын

@der Führer Yes, I was mistaken. Wasn't composed by Gustav Holst; Pluto movement was composed by Colin Matthews in the year 2000.

@marksonsparks698 Жыл бұрын

Anyway Pluto was deplanetised so the 7 still stand.

@alexlok5890 7 жыл бұрын

Don't forget Hans Zimmer used much of Mars for Gladiator score

@putinscat1208 7 жыл бұрын

Hans Zimmer is a goat next to Williams.

@TheMusicscotty 3 жыл бұрын

Caught that as well! Nice, Alex!

@happypapi1903 3 жыл бұрын

As did Alan Silvestri with Back to the Future

@mpemusic4815 7 жыл бұрын

Thank you for sharing this, an excellent discussion, demonstration and illumination!

@davidburgreen2469 3 жыл бұрын

Ever since I was a teenager and started getting into classical music, I recognized similarities between Holst's Planets symphony and Williams' Star Wars orchestration. I could hear it, but now I understand it intellectually. THANK YOU for teaching me, yet again, about music.

@RyanAlexanderBloom 7 жыл бұрын

The planets is one of the most covered, rehashed, drawn from, influential, however you want to phrase it, pieces of orchestral music. The latter 20th century is just absolutely rife, littered, and saturated with Holst references. Some subliminal, some quite overt. From Sands, to Cream, to ELP, to King Crimson to Overkill, Diamondhead, Symphony X, Nile, Isao Tomita, Rick Wakeman, And at least a dozen other pop/rock/metal bands and artists have done a rendition. That's not even mentioning other film and tv scores.

@nahor88 6 жыл бұрын

I have absolutely no idea who those people/bands you listed are, Iol.

@halcyon289 6 жыл бұрын

No Mars = no Progressive Rock

@petruccichile 6 жыл бұрын

@nahor88 ignorant

@lapamful 6 жыл бұрын

Ryan Alexander Bloom Agreed, the Planets was certainly influential. But if you want to hear 200 year old 'heavy metal' don't forget Mozart's Requiem or Bach's "Dracula theme" (toccata and fugue in D minor) which has been endlessly borrowed from for metal guitar solos, to name but two major works. And who hasn't been influenced by Bach or Mozart? All this is just another part of western musical history. You can't just dismiss such a large body of musical history as all being down to one composition, great and influential though it may have been...

@brianlowry1355 6 жыл бұрын

lapamful He said "one of the most ..." No one here dismissed any large body of musical history, nor anything else for that matter.

@jbaldwin1970 7 жыл бұрын

Thanks for this. Looking forward to the Tallis Fantasia video. Just a quick point: Holst and Vaughan Williams were friends. They studied together at the Royal College of Music. Holst definitely knew the Tallis Fantasia. The two would play their works to one another and provide critiques. Both said they were influenced by the other. RVW was devastated when Holst died as he'd lost his closest friend and critic. I'd recommend listening to his fourth and sixth symphonies- I believe they've been very influential in film music. And RVW wrote several film scores, most famously for Scott of the Antarctic, which he later developed as his seventh symphony, Symphonia Antarctica. Perhaps the subject of a future video?

@RickBeato 7 жыл бұрын

I almost made the Tallis Fantasia video last night. We were listening to it at dinner. Maybe today or tomorrow. Symphony Antarctica great idea!

@kennywowie 6 жыл бұрын

Try to find the version with Sir Ralph Richardson reciting the section intros, amazing. Another great film score of RVW: the 49th Parallel. I listen to it EVERY night to go to sleep. Usually out like a light after five minutes but to hear that main theme just relaxes me so much . I am usually just about asleep when he suddenly brings in the "oh Canada" theme. the build-up to that is worth the price. Very good film, too though the whole Raymond Massey character at the end is pretty annoying, ok, and the Leslie Howard scene of him walking into the cave while a Nazi shoots at him, ridiculous, but the rest of the film is very good mainly because of Eric Portman's perf as the Nazi commander. BUT I DIGRESS! ha ha.

@lisaarmstrong5461 6 жыл бұрын

Rick I'm sure you've forgotten more about music than most of us will ever learn it's always entertaining to watch your videos. Thank you so much

@JustJessDev 7 жыл бұрын

I've been anticipating a John Williams video, very excited to see Holst as well! I have fond memories of "The Planets" playing trumpet and helping my music peers through High School. Thank you, Rick!

@diazconias 7 жыл бұрын

Thanks man. I have no idea of music, but your videos are "easy" to follow, and entertaining also. I wish I had a nikel or somethink to contribute, but is really hard here in the south. cheers from Argentina.

@diazconias 7 жыл бұрын

I hope some day, you will talk about Piazzolla. :)

@adanmiller890 5 жыл бұрын

@@diazconias Jaja,mas ahora con Macri.Anoche fui a ver The Planets por la filarmonica de Orlando,espectacular,y justamente la semana que viene van a hacer las Estaciones de Piazolla y Libertango,con arreglos de un finlandes.

@ciaranhedderman8083 7 жыл бұрын

I'm absolutely sure that Holst was influenced by Vaughan Williams. Not only were they in the same place at the same time, but the two were very dear friends, and valued each other's criticism over all others. They would often play each other pieces in the works, and little was published by either without the other's approval.

@Abby-km6vr 6 жыл бұрын

Ciaran Hedderman Two of my favorite composers :)

@direnova6284 6 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the info, didn't know that :) .

@kennywowie 6 жыл бұрын

me too... be sure to listen to Hovhaness "Mysterious Mt."

@angelsartandgaming 4 жыл бұрын

So in a nutshell, Williams inspired Holst who inspired Williams.

@bradleyhohner8775 3 жыл бұрын

I read that Holst was also a friend of Hank Williams and that some subtle influences from Move It On Over can be heard in the Jupiter Suite.

@davidrandolph1863 6 жыл бұрын

Facinating video. Loved it and thank you for the musical history lesson!

@erikdahl3825 6 жыл бұрын

Rick, great video. You are a great instructor and talent. Thanks for all of your videos.

@anthonyd8835 7 жыл бұрын

the Anthony Bourdain of composition

@WolfclawTheGreatwolf 5 жыл бұрын

Anthony D RIP Anthony bourdain

@astroandyborgloh 5 жыл бұрын

There is a lot of Shostakovich in John Williams' music as well.

@jamescammack6720 6 жыл бұрын

Amazing amount of info you have professor. Incredibly informative and helpful. thanks so very much

@bthellam 6 жыл бұрын

As soon as I saw your title for this, as I know the works of both composers pretty well, the first thing I thought was how much is he going to talk about Mars on this since it so obviously influenced Williams. I enjoy that you were able to hear it, too!

@AceLM92 7 жыл бұрын

I think you can hear the Venus section of the Planets in Williams' Superman music when he has romantic moments with Lois Lane

@grantshepherd5402 6 жыл бұрын

Our high school band played all the planet arrangements, my favorite one was Jupiter

@Davo2233 5 жыл бұрын

I’m calling horseshit on that. A high school marching band could not learn all the suites and a field program too. If a high school band did do it, my ears would be calling horseshit as well.

@hufflute0 5 жыл бұрын

Ray Day33 I think he means in concert band and I wouldn't be surprised, there are some really amazing high school bands out there.

@gantmj 2 жыл бұрын

@@Davo2233 You're the only one who said anything about a marching band.

@jjaammee11 5 жыл бұрын

I love your videos. Thank you for posting them.

@DangerConGame 7 жыл бұрын

Bravo! Outstanding job. Really awesome. Many thanks!

@JustWasted3HoursHere 7 жыл бұрын

John Williams would be the first one to admit that he was influenced by many composers of the past, not just from Star Wars either. However, he has certainly put his stamp on everything he's done. Make no mistake, John Williams is one of a kind. Other composers like Howard Shore and Jerry Goldsmith are also excellent, but when I leave the theater I am usually not humming their tunes. JW3HH

@gwaptiva 5 жыл бұрын

I'm shocked nobody mentioned the influence of PDQ Bach... and that man was under the influence a lot

@borgthederanged 2 жыл бұрын

Nice! :-)

@liquidsolids9415 4 жыл бұрын

This kind of analysis is incredibly helpful to those of us who are trying to learn to compose music. Thanks so much!

@larrysouthern5098 4 жыл бұрын

I've been looking for this a long time...thank you sir!!!! the library lady will thank you... I've drove her crazy about this subject!!! :)

@youmothershouldknow4905 6 жыл бұрын

Rick, if you’re out there checking out responses to older videos, might it be possible for you to interview Robert Greenberg, the great and popular GreatCourses music lecturer? I’m sure you would have an epic discussion with him.

@christopherprim1973 6 жыл бұрын

So that's where Jimmy Page got the start of the figure from 'Friends'.

@jimpemberton 7 жыл бұрын

Thanks for putting this together, Rick. I did a paper on John Williams back when I was studying physics. I had already been a music major and a professional musician when I went back to school. I needed an easy course to satisfy some weird requirement and music appreciation was one of the classes I could choose from. Easy peasy. I explained this very thing in my paper and the instructor poopooed my assessment citing all the awards John Williams had won. I still aced the course, but couldn't believe they had a music professor who didn't understand John Williams' influences.

@LuleNorrbotten 4 жыл бұрын

Bruckner's 9th symphony, 2nd movement may have inspired Holst's ostinato in the Mars theme.

@michaeltrombetta8559 5 жыл бұрын

The Holst estate sued Hans Zimmer for his similarity to Mars in the film Gladiator. Awarded $10 million.

@susanpetit2848 3 жыл бұрын

Interesting. I presume it's the score from the opening battle scene in Gladiator that sounds similar to Mars.

@surfersilver6610 2 жыл бұрын

Seems Holst is one of the few classical composers to have a legal hold on their music. Sad that much more modern (50+ years later) artistic entities did not copywrite or got ripped off of their works. I bet Holst made more money after he passed then when he was alive....like most artists unfortunately.

@bilanggoboy 2 жыл бұрын

One of my favorite videos of yours, Rick! Wonderful!

@yes_its_THE_Dave_Alleckna 7 жыл бұрын

Hi Rick! Thanks again! It's really hard as a working musician to find content that's still useful and provides me with knowledge I didn't have before and that's not only aimed at aspiring musicians! I really look forward to much more along these lines from you! Thank you and big cheers from Hamburg!

@brumels1570 7 жыл бұрын

To be fair that ostinato pattern is not unique and not first used by Holst. Wagner used it in his Ring Cycle when Wotan and Loge descend into the Earth to find the Ring.

@kevinsargent3780 6 жыл бұрын

And R Strauss in Ein Heldenleben

@bordaz1 6 жыл бұрын

that Nibelung theme in Reingold is in a compound meter with a way different harmony; i don't think they're related, but i'll admit Wagner was a more likely inspiration for Holst than his own contemporary, Stravinsky

@dleins 5 жыл бұрын

Still waiting for the commentary on "Fantasia on a Theme by Thomas Tallis!"

@bernieschaloske6711 4 жыл бұрын

Doug Leins agreed!

@ruramikael 4 жыл бұрын

at 14:40 you will recognise a phrase.

@rioriggs3568 3 жыл бұрын

Great work Rick! Can't believe you did this video!

@perhaar 7 жыл бұрын

Thanks for taking the time! It's just great stuff you are presenting here on this channel :) /Per

@abbasalikhan 7 жыл бұрын

Danny Elfman please and thank you for yet again an amazing video

@TheTim001 6 жыл бұрын

What an ignorant comment. Danny Elfman has written several original pieces. There is a definable difference between composers and orchestrators.

@calm.aware. 5 жыл бұрын

Star Wars vs. The planets. Actually sounds like a sequel 😂🤣

@philbrown5723 6 жыл бұрын

Great video to watch. Both informative and entertaining. Thanks!

@stratowhore9051 2 жыл бұрын

BRILLIANT video! Over the years I have heard so many film scores that have taken whole pages of music from Clause Debussy and it goes way beyond "influence."

@kyloten-raikerz6638 7 жыл бұрын

5:06 sounds like Kylo Ren's theme from the Force Awakens lol

@NoahAngott 7 жыл бұрын

Fantastic analysis. Really ought to have loaded up a patch with better attack though!

@tiluriso 6 жыл бұрын

Yes,this is great. Thanks. I definitely hear Stavisnky and some Ravel in JW's music, but this is just mind blowing...Just bought the London Symphony version of 'The Planets'. Yours is arguably the greatest music channel on you tube. Thanks for sharing.

@joshuajouet Жыл бұрын

So glad I found this video - I’ve been telling people for years to listen to Holst if you wanna hear the wellspring of so much Williams

@lukeswain3630 5 жыл бұрын

When is Saturn ever going to get love? Mars is THE most overplayed classical song. Sigh. Ah well, I appreciate the in depth geek love. 😁

@masonb9788 5 жыл бұрын

It's like, no one even knows that there's an hour more of absolutely brilliant music after "O Fortuna" in Orff's Carmina Burana!

@elechliter 5 жыл бұрын

The first several times I listened to the Planets, it was just background music to working and I was entertained enough by what I could hear and not worried about the 'silent' parts in Saturn. Then one day I took the time to stop and listen to Saturn entirely - what an incredible journey of emotion I was missing, lush and powerful. I'm with you on this one, Saturn is not to be eclipsed by Mars or Jupiter.

@matiasdg 4 жыл бұрын

And when is Uranus ever gonna get some love?

@apophis7712 4 жыл бұрын

@@matiasdg As soon as men are aren't made fun of for getting pe- Oh, you meant the music piece...

@amandaaugust8818 7 жыл бұрын

The score from Gladiator during the battle sequence is basically a rip off of Mars as well! I also really love your channel. I've never subscribed to something so fast!

@kennydreadfuls861 6 жыл бұрын

Amanda August Hans Zimmer got sued over it. Gladiator is blatantly more of a rip off.

@nirvanachile24 5 жыл бұрын

@@kennydreadfuls861 Yeah, huge chunks of Gladiator are cut-and-pasted from Spartacus and Fall of the Roman Empire.

@kennydreadfuls861 5 жыл бұрын

Paul Watson and the battle music is more than a hint of Mars.

@jsharp1701 4 жыл бұрын

@@kennydreadfuls861 It often IS Mars, note for note.

@localbod 6 жыл бұрын

Great video. Fascinating. I love Holst's Mars. It is so powerful. Thankyou for posting this.

@rpredl Жыл бұрын

How have I missed this video for five years? Genius.

@tuanngo8575 7 жыл бұрын

John Williams vs Stravinsky Star Wars' OSTs are heavily influenced by Stravinsky

@brumels1570 7 жыл бұрын

Tuan Ngo Hoang Anh Frankly, I dont hear any Stravinsky in John Williams at all. On the other hand Ive only heard Rite of Spring, Petroushka, and Les Noces.

@BahamutNull 7 жыл бұрын

Brumel's Parakeet just listen to rite of spring, part 2, introduction. It's Tatooine all over the place:)

@codswallop321 7 жыл бұрын

Brumel's Parakeet Try his War of the Worlds soundtrack. Very close to the Rite of Spring.

@mythicreactions7280 6 жыл бұрын

But is it Rite of Spring or Debussy's Nuages? Therein lies the question lol

@PauLtus_B 6 жыл бұрын

Just the bit on Tatooine.

@122112guru 7 жыл бұрын

and the Ewok & imperial/vader marches were strongly influenced by Prokofiev's Love for three oranges march and scherzo as well,though not a direct lift like the Holst here.

@richardhunt809 3 жыл бұрын

Really interesting video. Nice one, Rick. 👍🏻

@torresalex 6 жыл бұрын

Fascinating!! Great video!

@ManelRuivo 7 жыл бұрын

hey rick! they say stravinsky was the man, and that he caused a harmonic and compositional revolution, and i fuckin dont know why. they say he was the major influence on zappa and other foward thinking XX century composers. could you do a video like this explaining hows that? i think it would be pretty interesting!

@aghaanantyab 7 жыл бұрын

how about star trek?? star strek also has beautiful pattern such as the use of augmented and 7th chords

@billli9719 6 жыл бұрын

aghaanantyab uh no

@billli9719 6 жыл бұрын

aghaanantyab sorry to disappoint you

@alemorichetti6368 6 жыл бұрын

Sorry but it’s not even close to Star Wars music.

@sk8rdad 7 жыл бұрын

Great video Rick! I learned a lot. JW is one of my music heroes and learning that he took a lot of influences from other composers is a relief since I've always felt bad when the Director tells me he wants a Hans Zimmer vibe or for it to sound like the Insidious credits I feel like I'm copying and I hate doing that! Now I realize that it's not copying it's being influenced so thank you for your insights!

@4422michael 5 жыл бұрын

Invaluable! Thank you so much.

@veerchasm1 5 жыл бұрын

Can you do this for Greta Van Fleet and Led Zeppelin? 😂😄

@MUCKER1314 6 жыл бұрын

there is no comparison, Holst was a genius beyond comparison

@mrs.featherbottom5901 6 жыл бұрын

The music sound alike. That's the comparison. Being stubbornly star struck with your favorite musicians is very annoying.

@hervedupre7894 5 жыл бұрын

Sincerely, Holst is superior, although Williams is not bad. But without the movies Williams would have died in anonimity, not Holst. 😉

@musiclistsareus1029 5 жыл бұрын

How many works by Holst are you familiar with? He wrote more, but most of them seem less inspired than The Planets. Williams has many brilliant movie scores that I can hum from memory, and that I love; Seven Years in Tibet, Schindlers List, Saving Private Ryan, Empire of the Sun, Jurassic Park, the Indiana Jones movies, the Star Wars movies, and I'm just getting started. I don't mean any disrespect to Holst, but Williams is a musical giant in my book, it's only because he works largely in the popular genre of film scores that he is underrated as an artist.

@starrynight1657 3 жыл бұрын

@@musiclistsareus1029 Holst had to do a load of teaching to make ends meet.

@carlkocsi261 3 жыл бұрын

Rick - As a trumpet player in high school in the late 70's, I remember our band director playing the Star Wars soundtrack and comparing it to the Holst's Planets pieces (Mars and Jupiter) we were playing. Love your videos.

@andrewlorenz6335 7 жыл бұрын

I have always loved Vaughn Williams - my favorite composer by FAR. The London Symphony is absolute genius - that 2nd movement is, for me, the apex of music. Very happy to see his name finally.

@DrewReynolds 7 жыл бұрын

Yeah, it actually goes further than just being told to emulate. Back then, convention was to edit the film to classical music early in the process prior to time locking the film. There is no doubt that Lucas used that convention and edited the film to a recording of Mars and Williams was forced to go in that route. This even becomes more evident when you see some moments in the desert that were clearly Stravinsky Rite of Spring that Williams was also had to work into his own sound. For a "Space Opera" (as Williams describes it), the planets works incredibly well. I know Lucas with the prequels even did the editing to cues from the originals. If you look at the tempo and beat structures, they overlap for several cues in the prequels. I don't have time to research it, but I've always wanted to look and see what commercial recordings of the planets were available in the 70's when they made the film and see which one they edited the film to.

@DrewReynolds 7 жыл бұрын

Also, just for proof of that editing trick, Stanley Kubrick in directing 2001 a Space Odyssey actually hired Alex North (Sparticus etc) to write a score for the film, but they edited the film to classical music, didn't like Alex's score, so simply used the classical music instead.

@RickBeato 7 жыл бұрын

Fascinating Andrew! Thanks!!

@MREmusique 6 жыл бұрын

The studio hired Alex North. Kubrick, ever the a$$hole that he was, had never had any intention of using North's wonderful score.

@SouloftheTroll 6 жыл бұрын

It's an absolute fact that the Planets was used by Lucas at first. It was a challenge for Williams to stay in that lock step already provided by the temp tracks while still making it as original and freshly Williams sounding as possible! I think history has proven he did "ahright".

@TheBespectacledN00b 6 жыл бұрын

Sort of the audio equivalent of using World War 2 dogfight footage to fill in for where the space combat was going/would roughly look like while they finished filming it?

@zingpulse4138 7 жыл бұрын

Williams draws from Stravinsky The Rites of Spring as well

@tunesmusic8929 6 жыл бұрын

super cool. So similar where does influence by end and copied begin

@killboybands1 6 жыл бұрын

my thoughts too but even Stravinsky said "A good composer does not imitate, he steals"

@flipperpitstudio 3 жыл бұрын

‘Thomas Tallis’ has been one of my favorite pieces for as long as I can remember. 🥰

@kimble02 7 жыл бұрын

My new favorite KZfaq channel! I love your videos, keep up the amazing work. I remember discovering the planets and having my mind blown. Venus also makes an appearance in William's score. Zimmer channeled Mars for Gladiator and Howard Shore's Shire theme I believe borrows elements from Jupiter (around the 3:00). You seem to hear the Planets pop up all over film scores. It's a testament to how amazing the original composition is!appreciate the breakdown, entertaining and informative as usual!