for me the most frustrating bit of "lore" in the sims 4 is the fact that Johnny Zest and the Landgraab aren't connected in any way. And the excuse they gave that it's because he was disowned is so full of shit. If he's been disowned he should have negative relationships with them from the start, but as far as anyone is concerned he's just a random townie

There's no ancestry in TS4, because if you remember, they delivered this game with no family trees and no ghosts. And they just never bothered to add any later for their premades.

Plus it’s funny how they acknowledged the alien ancestors bc aliens aren’t even included in the base game, it’s in gtw, so how would they be able to tell this story when the two main plot features aren’t even in the original game to be utilized 😭 that makes it very obvious that Katrina and the lore theyre suddenly trying to hand fist into the game was an afterthought and nothing more

I think this “lore” is indicative of TS4 as a whole really. Desperately trying to sprinkle something into this game to make it interesting but it’s far too little too late. You can’t just SAY something and that’s lore. TS2 lore was great because we figured out the stories on our own through the game, family trees and memories. TS4 will simply never be able to achieve something like that with how the game works, so to do this now after so long is a waste of time imo. What’s the point of this lol. Sorry that was a rant but…i just hate this game 😂

I feel like they did something similar with Johnny Zest recently. Teased his background but not tying up loose ends?

thank you Cindy for expressing how annoying ea’s approach at the lore was at sims 4 release. Complete misread by the devs over the community’s appreciation for the pre-made sims. Can only hope sims 5 leaves the sims 4’s alternate timeline to pick up where we left off with sims 2

The sims team adding lore to Katrina 10 years after her debut gives me the same vibes as them saying that the empty strangerville houses "adds to the strange".

Why not just retcon Katrina into being their aunt? It would have been simple and linear. Edit: This way they could set Flamenco Caliente as the girls' deceased dad and Katrina as his younger sister, while avoiding the whole Nighat shit by not even having her appear in the family tree.

I always hated Katrina being there. Don having both sisters feels a bit naughty. Him living with their mother and screwing all three is just incestuously jucky to me! I usually just ignore their existence, wait for everyone in the family to die off and just interact with their descendants.

Yeah, I agree with you, Cindy. The clone lore would've worked at release and not 10 years later. Lazy work imo.

Its SUCH a shame because i dont actually mind an alternate universe take on the sims. A universe where bella wasnt abducted might've caused an entire butterfly effect that changed the timeline, but then they just left out most of the sims 2 or 3 cast and made weird decisions like making cassandra a teenager even though her most well known moment is being left at the altar by don, whos an adult in the sims 4 when shes a teen. They could've done it with other characters too, what if nervous subject hadn't been taken from olive, what if skip broke never died, they could've confirmed or explained dozens of theories! But nope. Loreless alternate timeline out of sheer laziness.

Cindy please put in a writing application at Maxis 😭🙏

I think it would have just been simpler to make Katrina a different relative, or just explain her as an adopted mother for the twins bc they're orphans in this timeline (And maybe have them researching their family and discovering their distant alien ancestry as plot hooks). If they were gonna half bake the lore 10 years after the fact, they shouldn't have bothered addressing it at all.

For me the eaiest "solution" would be to say Katrina is a step mom. That I would buy in this alternate universe but, on the whole, your take is SPOT ON.

If there was at least a slight teeny tiny hint in the game that Katrina could be a clone I would have totally bought it, but thats just bizarre. If there was to be a lab or an ironic statement in the description how no one knew their mother 'Katrina' who came out of nowhere it would change everything.

Ophelia nigmous has The same problem with her name. The N I G letters. They should figure out better this restrictions

I've already burried this thing deep into my soul. I was so dissapointed back when it turned out, that there will be NO lore with the original timeline.. I don't really care anymore tbh, it's been 10 years, I'm over it. Also, with this team, I don't even want them to screw up the original masterpiece, that The Sims 2 created..

I don’t like the story I think it’s just another half ass attempt to make it look like they care about the complaints we make cause I’m sure they could’ve found away to change her name but the whole story line is dumb! Their mom died when they were babies so why is she there now?? And why does she have a thing for don ? Like the whole scenario just kills all previous Lore

I love the story of Nina and Dina, making a clone mother, because they just wanted their mum, but it feels hollow because of a couple of reasons. As you said, it’s been so late retroactively added into the story, but the other reason is neither cloning, nor aliens are in the Sims 4 base game. They both are added to the game with the get to work expansion pack, So the “lore” is really only a applicable if you have get to work as well which the Caliente family weren’t introduced with.

Looking at how they manage to create shitlore 10 years later about Katrina is very telling. Project Rene is gonna suck ass in my opinion if they wont be continuing the official real lore. Life By You looks just like sims3 but slightly better. Thank you Cindy for amazing videos recently!

The most insulting part is they didn't even address anything about this so-called lore in the refresh. It literally just seems like fanfic they came up with just for that one live.

I think the people in charge of this s'more lore thing have no connection to anyone who made Katrina in the first place and it was just up to them to come up with something

If they decided to go with this story, they could've updated their house (which they haven't done for either of family refreshes) to include something alluding to the whole cloning theory, some mysterious basement or equipment.

As I’m rewatching your Strange Town rotation, this just can’t compare. Too little too late and IMO all they want is the money and they don’t care about the community. Sims2 is the bomb, though I haven’t played sims3 so I can’t compare. 😊

i can respect course-correcting, even if it's 10 years later. And i do like Katrina as another blank slate for me to project stories on. But this story really feels like scrambling. If they had gone back and given them a family tree, given them already pre-established relationships, Put Katrina's origin as a memory or a sentiment for the girls to have or whatever. But what they did isn't even the bare minimum.

I am so glad Cindy made this video. as a ts4 player, the reason I don't play with the pre-mades is because of the lack of connective lore to previous sims games. the "alternate timeline" makes me Not Care about the pre-mades. I'm sure I am not alone in this.

Maybe I would be a lazy developer but I would have just give her a shortened version of her name like Nia to by pass the restriction. The flirty cool-mum cougar has a little nickname in this version. Okay I don’t go by my full name either. Like I think people wouldn’t be talking about 10 years later if that was the case.

Oh my... on a related note, the 20th anniversary of the Sims 2 is just around the corner. We better get something BIG / special on this day & not get dismissed.

Ten years later...? I am soo old... XD

I DELETE HER EVERY TIME. She’s not real to me 😅😅 like gtfoh woman. Their lore reasoning pisses me off too lol. I think who ever made her honestly didn’t play the game. 😅

Cindy, you didn't even comment on the most egregious part 1:05 THEY GOT THE EXISTING LORE WRONG! Anyone who is anyone that has played The Sims 2 knows that the Caliente Sisters moved to Pleasantview the day BEFORE Bella Goth's abduction. It literally says it on the menu screen: "the Caliente sisters arrived on the eve of Bella's disappearance." Whilst it is part of The Sims DNA and encouraged to establish new lore, to incorrectly reference existing lore in a segment which was dedicated and intended to be an explanation is TYPICAL TS4 - patching their poor and lazy mistakes with equally poor and lazy mistakes.

I hate it when there's discrepancies in the lore, for any media. So the whole "alternate universe" bull already had me gnashing my teeth. But this is just stupid. Even if they were to clone their mother, why name her Katrina and have her have red hair? This has just been an oversight and/or lack of caring on their part. Didn't they also have no family trees implemented at the start of the Sims 4? I kind of forgot because I didn't touch the Sims 4 until they released toddlers.

Cannot express how happy I am that you’re back on the sims vids! ❤

I kept trying to like sims 4, i kept trying to gaslight myself into thinking its a good game but after 10 years ive finally accepted i will never like it and EA have completely butchered it. There’s no life, I hate the set dressing, the extortion of the playerbase, the shallowness of the game… everything. I’m ready to make peace with this being the end of the road for me and I’m anticipating life by you as the successor to sims 3.

I agree about the story it could have been good - but the way it was implemented, makes it unenjoyable. I could have handled an alternate timeline if they would have put any lore in the Sims 4 in a meaningful way and hope the Sims 5 goes back to the Lore we know and love

I had no idea you were back!!!!!!!!! ❤

I never understood why Don was made pert of their household (Fair enough there were times in my game him and Nina married, but mostly he married Kaylyn the maid lol) and why did they have to have a mother, she was gone in Sims 2, makes no sence to me at all

They didn‘t even use the refresh as an opportunity to add this suddenly made up „lore“. All they had to do was to add some hint to cloning.

i agree with all your points here. i never really understood the alternate timeline i usually do the same thing as you and am actually playing through my own pleasantview right now. the story line for Katrina doesn't sound bad but i would actually appreciate it more if it was actually said to us from the get go. they kinda just added her for the sake of, heres another caliente ending with a and posed it to be their mother the lore doesnt seem convincing enough to me as to why they excluded nighat. Its disappointing because I would like to know what they think nina, dina and dons storyline would be now following the original timeline, same goes for all the other families! i noticed that there was no explanation as to why she even has a romantic relationship with don in the first place , how did he come to be her 'boy toy?' its just not explicitly stated and the storyline is all over the place for this family in the ts4, sad cause nina and dina were so iconic in ts2 and were one of the families who contributed a lot to pleasantview

this Katrina story is like we say here in my country: they kill an important character in a soap opera, for example, but the public doesn't approve, so a twin sister appears as an excuse 🤣 the most ridiculous excuse of all just to not admit failure

The sims 4 was an unfinished game at launch. They really wanted to push it out and said screw it to actually making it a good game. The took advantage of the sims community and their love for the previous games. The sims 4 is by far the worst in the franchise and only the good lord knows what horrors await the sims 5 is they don’t start listening to the community.

This is why we delete all the base townies, re-create them, and fix the lore! Lol.

Evne if i don't pay much attention to the Sims 4 lore, the thing with Katrina always were a currious case for me. Why she is there? Who is she? Why is she the "mother" of Dina and Nina? She is the ONLY person who gave me 100 of questions of her exsistance in the Sims universe. But hearing what the team did and who is she "really" i kinda do not mind who she is now, based on these facts. Altho, i would wanna see things like scripted events or some extra juicy lore like Don is dating these 3 womans, but the Caliente sisters don't know he dating their mother and they up for a revenge. Or something else that would give to the players the decision of give Don a bad or good life later. Sounds weird, but we do know we love weirdness, since from Sims 2

I did enjoy the lore of previous games and agree they did it a whole lot better. But I didn’t have too much trouble accepting that Sims 4 was on an alternate timeline. I didn’t really care to play the premades in TS4 until I made a save focused on all the teens and their families. That included the Goths and the Landgraabs plus many other families that never existed before. I still have no interest in playing the Calientes or Don. I feel like they’ve lived it up enough in TS2 for me. But Cassandra Villareal is an epic violinist and it makes perfect sense in my universe!

The thing with the names is what bothers me. Nighat is a legitimate name. The developers really think they did something?!

Thank you for being one of the only people to call EA and The Sims team out. It's ridiculous how lackluster this franchise has become

I always thought Katrina was their aunt and raised them, feels like I've read it somewhere but it could just be a fan theory tho. But the sims 4 team has done this with multiple families, like "The mysterious Landgraab child" "The black sheep" idk I just never bought it when he doesent even show up on the family tree.

Only when you said "some of us have been playing the Sims for 20 years", I realised I am one of them, that's huge😮

I truly appreciate your videos! Did you ever do a custom content video for furniture on the sims 2? I can’t seem to find a thing. I just got back into it❤️

I will admit, as a Sims player, I mostly played it for a casual and chill time, just focused on my own created Sim sort of in a bubble whenever I played an entry, never really got "far enough" for them to really interact with the established pre-made Sims. I will say in terms of Katrina, I like that they're at least TRYING to finally address her lore, and if they can keep this going forward, I think that'll be fine. Heck, it could lead to some interesting story potential if Nina and Dina's mom returned and found out about Katrina. I will agree, it DOES feel like it's super late to be trying to do this but hey, at least they're acknowledging it and attempting to address it, I'll take that over being radio silent any day. This DOES make me wonder what their comment of "exploring this world" means. My gut reaction comes to two conclusions, either this means that they're going to continue to add to 4 even more and longer, or Sims 5 will likely try to use 4 as a jumping off point story-wise and explore this second timeline rather than returning to the main one. If they can at least show that they're going to try and better address the lore along with the general appearances of these Sims (actually making them both look good & be better fleshed out both in text & mechanics), I might feel a bit more confident if they were to ever state if they're going back to the original timeline. It's currently very much a case of "if you can bring it on home and keep the momentum going for the future, great. But they very much have a LOT of good will to reclaim in terms of the fan's perspective." Personally, if they can bring in more MySims (preferably MOSTLY Agents related canon because that was my main entry into that subseries) characters and lore along with them being accurate to what people would hope of them along with fixing the existing ones to fit and not just be a couple handful of references, I'd say at that point we might be able to let out a quick sigh of relief and feel better that things might turn out for the better going forward from there.

I guess Nina and Dina doesnt have alien ancestry because aliens are not a base game sim. They come with Get To Work. So they litterly can't be half-aliens.

In Behind the Sims they talked about Johnny Zest and his lore. I thought that we will get his refresh, that was in the autumn of last year. Still no news on it... he is still not a family member of Landgraabs so he can reproduce with them in the game which is messed up.

I hope we get more for Princess Cordelia

To me the Sims 4 were descendants of the families we knew in the franchise. So they didn't have to look exactly like the Sims 2 townies or have the same traits. That's why Malcolm Landgraab is slim and evil and he was overweight and good in the Sims 3. However I agree EA didn't really care. Katrina is a common Mexican first name. In my opinion they wanted to create the stereotypical mother of telenovelas for drama with Don.

LOL I remember when James Turner was always screaming about her popping up in the game and at the time I didn't understand because I hadn't been able to play enough to experience her due to all the breakage I was experiencing between my computers and the game itself but now LOL I truly do understand

Tbh, i would have had Katrina like their cougar aunt/cousin/some other relative with access to the elixir of life or something. Also, I'd spell Nighat's name with a "y" instead of an "i" to bypass the system. Idk, just spitballing ideas.

No one tell Cindy about the "New lore" of Roberto Crinkletop/Crumplebottom. I find that lots worst than Katrina. I hope Cindy read this coment.

i dont like the idea of katrina being a clone because my interpretation of the caliente sisters doesnt paint them as people who can just... drum up a clone? I always thought their alien ancestry was a red herring in the bella goth mystery. plus, in the sims, alien abductors are hands-off parents, much less grandparents. i dont see why their lineage would really influence their lives, doesnt really make sense for them to be double agents. sorry for spoiling the fun xD there could be an interesting story thread where dina isnt necessarily pursuing mortimer for his money, thats just a perk, but rather for his abilities as a scientist to clone/resurrect nighat, since her memories seem to imply anyway that she was the closer twin to their mother, whereas nina was closer to their father. would add some complexity to dina but its a story that would need years of set up. I think they're way more average young women than people tend to feel about them. theyre probably my favorite sims characters and i see them as mirrors of lorelei and dorothy from gentlemen prefer blondes lol.

It always felt to me like the people that made the sims 4 never knew anything about the sims to begin with, and never even played it

Fun (painful) Fact: the name Lothario is banned from the Gallery A _CANON_ name of a premade sim is *BANNED* I was losing my mind trying to upload my version of Don and Katrina to the gallery because I didn't know what word was banned!

A good Sims lore should provide players with two things "options" and "inspiration". Mysteries in the sims shouldn't be solvable - Like the one with Bella Goth it Pleasantview. We don't know what exactly happened, who is to blame and how should we continue onward from that. We are given many random clues with memories, descriptions and family photos but we're never guided into one possible solution. Every player is free to believe what they want to believe and that's genius. No Pleasantview will be the same between two players. Each of us gets inspired by different clues the developers left and there's no universal truth. Only bunch of options - that's how it should be. With that said, I don't mind the lore coming late. But i absolutely think saying exactly what happened is boring and uninspiring - in contrary of what a good lore should be. We shouldn't be told she's a clone or an impostor or whatever. We should be given some clues about it. Nighat should be in the game as an urn maybe or some kind of a hidden grave. That would honestly be enough for me to get into the idea of Katrina but oh well...

Sims 4 was not really my first Sims game, but when I started playing the Sims 3 I didn't know any lore and thus, didn't think it existed and thus, being on youtube during the Sims 4 era really opened my mind up to allllll the history I'd been missing. So for me, I figured Katrina was just a fun play on Dina and Nina's names and it made sense. But once I learned that Katrina was made up for sims 4, all I could ask was why? For what purpose? Why just her?? Maybe you're onto something with the name thing. And they totally could have whitelisted just that name. There are soooo many names and foreign words that look bad in English but not in their native tongue so it'd be kind of unfortunate IF that was the reason for Katrina. I am living for all these catching up videos btw Cindy, your playstyle and view on the Sims is so different from any other Sims content creator I follow so hearing your thoughts on the updates while you were away has been such a treat

I'm not a game developer, but I would use pre-existing lore as a time saving measure. You don't need to reinvent the wheel!

The only thing I like about Katrina is her triggering James Turner to yell her name every time he sees her lol

Even though I was confused when she first popped up I have Incorporated her into my tribe of OG Sims that migrate from game safe to game save for the most part. Sometimes I don't use any original Sims but frequently because I'm continuing with story lines for the ones that are in that group in regard using them in new game saves as just moving house

They also could name her Nihat instead if it was about the letter combination. Leave the G out of it

I agree with you tbh. It seemed like they couldnt be bothered with the lore and rushed the whole thing. It was obvious they didnt care about the pre mades - they didnt even think about relationships between the different sims when you start the game. It seems too little to late for me really. The clone storyline is interesting but maybe not so much for them but for another family. I personally think they should have just got rid of Katrina and put Nighat back in the game when they did the refresh for the family.

I haven't played since they deleted/replaced origin...and it sucks that my sims 3 game was locked in that too. I installed sims 2 and can't go back...the animations and interactions...even the cinamatics were cool. I just wish the story boards didn't scramble with neighborhood renames

Maybe since Don is medical field, maybe it was an egg donor 😅

PREACH CINDY!! But Idk why they even added a mother in the first place. Don and the Twins could have been separate households. Or even like you said if they made it the lore from the get go.

I always make Katrina the girls aunt. I made her Flamencos Younger sister

That is a rather interesting piece of information regarding the Caliente family. It sort of makes Nina and Dina... somewhat tragic characters. They want some of their childhood back.

At this point I don't think there's any hope left for the Sims 4, and I am very doubtful about this Sims 5 as well. I think we got 3 great games and then EA ruined it like they ruin everything. It took 10 years, but I've finally accepted it. I think the fact that multiple other life sims are finally coming out has helped me move on from the Sims 4. However, I am very interested to watch you play the Pleasantview save you made for the Sims 4. If you can make it fun, I'll be very excited to give it a try again with that save file!

It makes me mad too Cindy. So so mad 😭

Hey! Could you teach us How to make our non default face templates for Body Shop on The Sims 2? I tried following a tutorial but It was so time consuming that I didn't ever got to finish doing a single face template. I think a video would help. There is almost no one covering this subject in The community so I had to ask for help somewhere.

I do love that they tried to address the Katrina issue, as its been all over the community for literally years! So, at least they said-- Hey! We hear ya. So, I like that. However, ummm yeah, why the heck are they just getting around to hearing fans??? To be honest, if you review things they added over the last few years-- mostly fan wanted things. Babies, family gameplay, (although the Sims 4 struggles to do as much gameplay) kids activities like adding learnig to ride a bike, bunk beds after fans almost had an embolism. Skin tones, Werewolves, fireman kinda, Repo man, a few more traits (although not enough), Likes and diislikes just not as well, and some more. So, I feel like they are trying. It's just so late. So, maybe this shows signs of hope for the next Sims game and that they will know more of what we want and actually care to make the next one work.

That's just pathetic ): thank you for covering this topic!!

Like you said: if they had done this from the beginning it wouldn’t have been an issue. But now they want to make an effort 10 years later. See my vision for TS4 is that it should’ve taken place the night of Bella’s disappearance. You could choose to do the story version or not. But the way they just threw characters together with no relationships, backstories, or anything was just a NO!!

My solution to the Katrina/Nighat thing is to combine the 2 characters themselves (TS2 + TS4), I renamed her to Katrina Al Mahmoud since Nighat isn't allowed as a name and her last name b4 Caliente was Al Mahmoud, I wish they did this instead but hey ho...

when i started up the sims 4 in 2014 i didnt even realise the calientes in this game were the same as the calientes in the sims 2 because of this katrina character.. never played the household and stopped playing the game shortly after because of the lack of lore and depth to the game

In my headcanon Katrina is their hot aunt who they’re living (/mooching off of) with at the moment while she also rented out her home to local play boy Don Lothario. Cause c’mon did you see his room in the house?

It's also worth highlighting the damage they did to the Caixão family, Cassandra in TS4 is white and then they correct it but then they darken Vladmir and Alexandre, like ???? does not make sense. the Sims in TS4 have no depth, no biographies, they simply have no life even in their interactions and the graphics are terrible, a thousand times better than TS2.

The problem is it’s pointless. They say she’s a clone, ok. But nothing when you play would suggest or show she’s a clone.

I thought Katrina was an older sister they added in 😂

For me, it's the fact that they're hiding behind lies instead of being honest. Lol. Indicative of corporate excuses and a lack of accountability. Reeks of PR spin. Unlike you, I can't even say that I'm appreciative of the team trying to give it lore. I'm so disappointed in the staff who claim to love the game. I'm sure there are passionate individuals at EA who, no doubt are constrained by strict non-disclosure agreements, cannot openly express their views and are striving to represent the community's interests. However, after a decade in such an environment, you ultimately become either part of the problem or part of the solution. At this point, if you're still working on the team, it's a safe paycheck, it's the fact that they don't want to put in effort to find another job, it's fear of change, it's ego that thirsts for stability... but it's not passion. Or they all suck at their job and that's the simple, harsh, honest truth they don't want to admit to, but what're the chances that all of them were hired without legit credentials? This is a harsh statement, but, lol, there aren't many excuses that they can go with that can't be immediately disproven. "It takes time to make a pack." Yeah, but for what we receive in the sorry state that it's in, it doesn't add up, and for those who understand the programming language, they know how ridiculous this claim is and what a realistic time period should be for a game that isn't broken at launch.

To be honest the all Katrina, Nighat thing does bother me yes but not as Don living with the 3 girls as ''toy boy''... DON IS NOT A TOY BOY, HE IS A WOMENS PREDATOR, not the other way around ffs... He should have is own house and live for himselves and the ladies HE drag to his own house. After all, not a coincidence he was a NURSE in the sims 2, this trade is filled with women, majoritary are women and Don knows it and was there juste like some guys for the girls aspect, for his ''victims'' lol. There have been so much bad representation of Don by the community as well, that I dont understand, and I honestly think its just perception sometimes... but as a guy, I know Don is not a toy boy lol... ridiculous and degrading for what he is supposed to be. I think the creator of that story were frustrated *** lol who wanted to make Don a lesser him and hated him, so they put him into a very vulnerable position, and wanted to tell another narrative. The guy dont have a work or home to live up for himself, he is the toy boy of an older woman (predator milf) and is not that deep in relationship with the sisters... I hate so much the Don in the sims 4.

Modern EA be like for every thing they fix they end up breaking even more.

As I imagine a number of people have done I incorporate some of the original lore as well as some that I've made up on my own in order to make all of these things work as well as adding lots of new characters like grandparents and aunts and uncles and cousins that don't exist in the game. My attempt is to create a family web that will span through all the worlds

I know no one else is fussed with katrina but in my rotational play I had this whole story planned but when she discovered don was cheating on her the argument caused her to die of anger (in lore / in universe she died of heartbreak) I was kinda sad cause she had a bit of potential in my story but ah sims don't do what I want anyway

It’s what I always tell myself: sims 4 feels like a standalone game imo, it misses every little detail that made the other games special, including the lore. This game is so successful at butchering what made its predecessors a success

I had no idea this lore existed for Katrina and it’s absolutely bonkers! 😂 I think it could have possibly worked since the sisters sent Don Lothario back in time but why have them living with Don Lothario…so weird and icky. But why bother making sense of what was obviously not intended lore. None of sims 4 makes sense. The lore and character creation is so bad I didn’t even realize many of the premades were from MySims until years later despite being a major fan as a kid.

Sims 4 really just completely gave up on any lore or depth in the game. Meanwhile, I still think about and find new things in Sims 2 lore 20 years later on regular basis.

I'm not really bothered by the lore being either nonexistent or inconsistent in The Sims 4 because I played lots of other Maxis games (SimCity, SimEarth, SimAnt, SimTower, SimPark, SimTown, etc, etc, etc) and the developers weren't really great about lore in those games....nor great at consistency in those with more than one version of the game [I mean that as both the obvious sequels of some of these, but also mean that as in different versions for different ways the same game gets played: i.e. the PC version and various console versions didn't usually align either). I mean, Malcolm Landgraab was originally introduced in SimCity 3000 as one of the petitioners that could pop up in the game with offers or comments that you the mayor could read and accept. The Landgraab name had already been established in SimCity 2000 as a name that got mentioned, jokingly, in newspaper articles and either referred to some prominent family or the name of company depending on the joke article's usage. There wasn't much lore about the character other than he was a wealthy industrialist who was constantly buying up companies and was quirky. He'd disappear in SimCity 4, but the name Landgraab did still popup in some of the names of zoned industrial buildings. And Malcolm Landgraab and the Landgraab family would enter into The Sims franchise in varying, inconcise, ways. Honestly I hadn't even realized how inconsistent it was until I watched Plumbella's video on the Landgraabs. Anyways, my point is that it didn't start with The Sims 4 so I wasn't bothered by it when I bought The Sims 4. I remember being more annoyed there weren't swimming pools in the game even though there were builds where a pool was obviously meant to be. I don't even think I realized that Katrina was meant to be Dina and Nina's mom (because I didn't initially read the descriptions on the households of people I was familiar with) and thought maybe she was like some older sister or aunt. When I finally realized she was supposed to be their mom, my initial thought was something like "Oh ok then." But I think that's because I had realized that the game itself didn't seem to have any real lore and that no matter how load into the households, it didn't feel like the sims actually knew each other in any way (be they supposed roommates or family or whatever). Like the descriptions didn't match the gameplay. And that's generally why early on I just didn't play with the pre-made households since it didn't feel like it was any different than when I played with sims I created in CAS. And I certainly did enjoy playing with pre-made households in previous Sims games. And so I had mostly just ignored the lore issue with The Sims 4, even though the developers like to bring it up in livestreams whenever they're showing off new packs, and just forgiven them for being so inconsistent in their storytelling since they're making a simulation game where the players get to use their imaginations. But then they started doing these S'More Lore segments and that's when I did get annoyed because, like, as someone who enjoys writing and has been writing short stories since I was a child, it feels sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo incredibly lazy to come back and be like "Oh we have come up with some explanations for why we did something." Like, no, if this is just some simulation game where the players are supposed to be the ones using our imaginations and I've accepted that excuse as to why you can't even come up with consistent stories for your pre-made households in your pre-made worlds, nevermind all the other games you once made and abandoned, you don't get to come back in and then try to do the lore. That'd be like writing a cook book that's mostly just recipes and knowing that some folks who bought the cook book were upset because you didn't write stories to connect to the food like you sometimes did in previous cook books and then posting a KZfaq video to present the possible stories that relate to those recipes in the cook book, but still being vague about it like you don't want to commit. And so I agree, the clone thing could've worked if that's what they had started with. And while I appreciate that they're trying to make folks happy who are unhappy with the lack of lore, they're still going about it lazily. I mean, the segment doesn't say outright that Katrina is a clone. It says "maybe she's a clone." Maybe? Maybe? Oh I know what that is! That's the "test the waters" model of engagement. It's where you put something out and then see how those who watched react to it. If it's positive, then you decide to go that route and do more with that, if it's negative you either abandon the idea (something Maxis and EA seem to excel at is abandoning ideas; I mean there was once supposed to be a SimMars, but then EA thought i'd be unprofitable so it get jettisoned; today there's Surviving Mars which is very profitable and has DLC) altogether or try something different because after all you didn't commit to any specific storyline. And honestly I prefer that if there's going to be storytelling, however inconsistent, that the people writing it stick to whatever they put out there and not be all "maybe it's this" and "maybe it's that." Like either come up with an idea and stick with it or move on. So yeah, I wasn't bothered by it UNTIL they started doing the S'More Lore.

When I set up my personal Sims 4 savefile, I deleted Katrina but gave Nina a daughter called Celina, who looks suspiciously like a certain Don Lothario. Meanwhile Don and Cassandra are married with a kid of their own.

This never made sense to me. Always remade all of the Sims to be true to their selves in TS2.

I just can’t stand with the concept of this alternate universe so instead, I just gave new names to all those premade sims except the new ones for the sims 4 and treat them like a new set of sims prepared for the sims 4 lol.

To be honest the best thing to do is create an optional DLC of Pleasantview and put the Sims 2 characters in that.

This is very telling of the current state of EA. Garbage nonsense which we are supposed to just accept without questions! Maddening!

i feel like the cloning thing falls apart when you think about the fact that cloning is exclusive to the get to work dlc, so like if they'd introduced this character with get to work i'd get it... but they didn't so this feels like an excuse, you know?

I feel like a bad sims player because I’ve been playing since sims 1 - 4 and never played any premade or knew anything about them until I started getting really into sims 4