Magic the Gathering Starter Decks Aren't Cutting It

  Рет қаралды 2,156

Jake Rowley

Jake Rowley

Күн бұрын

Hi. My name is Jake and I think Magic the Gathering has a Starter Deck problem. Starter decks are great for brand new players, but there are no products that are useful for anyone who has been playing for a while. This doesn't stop them from making great commander starter decks, but there is zero effort made towards making interesting engaging 60 card starter decks. If that sounds fun, pull up a chair, have a seat at the table, and let's talk games.
My Bird Starter Decklist:
www.moxfield.com/decks/JyOghV...
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Пікірлер: 41
@baconthegatewaymeat9131
@baconthegatewaymeat9131 3 ай бұрын
An easy middle ground would be to have magic make pauper dual decks for like $10.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
I would love if they supported paper more. It’s such a cool format. I would only be worried of stuff getting rarity shifted down in meta shifting ways.
@kakor232
@kakor232 3 ай бұрын
I'm a MTG player and i agree. Nowadays, it's super complicated for anyone to actually start playing the game for a reasonable price. The game got super "elitized". And it's hard to just sit in a kitchen table and actually play a simple game.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
Yeah i think one thing driving that is the power level floor has been rising on commander with the improvement of precons.
@ich3730
@ich3730 3 ай бұрын
not really, buy an EDH precon, sit down with the boys, start playing for 40 bucks. I dont know where you got that "elitized" stuff from, MTG has never been more casual. Commander is the most played format, tournament magic is dying, crossover sets are getting popular etc etc
@fa-tre2869
@fa-tre2869 3 ай бұрын
Lotus field starter deck was reasonably playable out of box for $35. Arc light Phoenix starter deck for around $40. Yeah, they need upgrades for league play, it they are good to go. There are also starter kits with two decks for $10. Not sure what this chap is talking about.
@kakor232
@kakor232 Ай бұрын
@@ich3730 Hey Bud! Sorry for answering 2 months later... I'm a Brazilian player, and i say that based on the economy of my country actually, lol 😄. Here, the prices of the sealed products and even the cards have gone reeaaaaallly high, and even a 20 dollar deck is something expensive here... Sorry for not contextualizing it. But i really wished to live there in the US to be able to buy cards without investing tons of money on It! Hahaha. Have a good week!!
@kakor232
@kakor232 Ай бұрын
@@fa-tre2869 I posted my comment based on the economy of my country... Sorry for not contextualizing it!
@willstewart5080
@willstewart5080 3 ай бұрын
Really appreciate your enthusiasm and well structured discussion points. I would love a return to 60 card magic and some support for magic as Garfield intended. I have a love for ck battle decks for just that reason.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
Thank you so much for the kind words. I dream of the day i can walk into a shop with mono white reanimator and get a couple games.
@draftmagicagain1000
@draftmagicagain1000 Ай бұрын
My playgroup still plays 60 card casual decks! We are out there!
@braydenc1791
@braydenc1791 2 ай бұрын
When I saw that you only have 200 subscribers I was very suprised. This video is very good. There are some weird green flashes towards the last 4 minutes of the video but besides that, amazing video!
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 2 ай бұрын
Thanks! I really appreciate the compliment. Yeah there was a weird encoding thing that i think i figured out. Should be good moving forward.
@braydenc1791
@braydenc1791 2 ай бұрын
@@TheFirstJake I also watched your most recent video and a magic/yugioh hybrid format would be fun (if it allowed proxies)
@martincoppa6417
@martincoppa6417 21 күн бұрын
When playing modern, I have several decks and I roll a dice to see which one I'll use. Sometimes my playgroup and I all pick from my decks and Sometimes they use their own whereas very seldom will we use their decks only, as in precons that were made to go against each other for instance. There has been quite a bit of power creep as we all have over time adjusted and tuned our decks to go against one another, much like you did with your guild budget decks, but some of my decks are significantly more complex or have a more specific wincon than others (Soul sisters or niv mizzet/ophidian eye vs artifact affinity, angels battlecruiser, or r/w or r/g aggro for instance). When people see some of the more complicated actions they are more turned off from learning and in that regard if introducing them to the format I would certainly start with the decks that have the least opponent interaction beyond things like permanent destruction or burn spells. Card that allow changes globally like mycosynth lattice or require constant trigger evaluation like rhystic study would not be helpful as they require more attention than say, playing a raging Goblin, and have the potential for much more novel interaction. I've been thinking of getting into pauper so we could expand our deck pool tremendously without the same explosive budget that modern often entails but have not yet gotten by in from my play group. It WOULD be great if WOTC had a vast assortment of highly tuned and relevant precon pauper decks for sale so my sales pitch might Land better than, "our decks are really powerful and let us do a lot of things but let's put a cap on our power level and see what we come up with." So far the reply has been "I built these decks so I could do these ridiculous things, if I have to build a deck with low power what's the point, I may as well just buy precon decks if I don't want them to be payable against anything in the meta."
@AENock
@AENock 3 ай бұрын
Digimon TCG printed a preconstructed Advanced Deck made specifically to pilot in a competitive environment out of the box. It was a fun archetype that had a respectable win %, high meta representation, with enough leeway to adjust for meta calls. Most importantly, it was affordable, even offering themed card sleeves in the box. Wizards absolutely can make strong, meta-shaping competitive decks for any format. They choose not to.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
Oh that’s really interesting. I know literally nothing about the Digimon Card Game. Did the deck come out before the archetype or after? I’m curious if they released a deck that was meta or released a deck that shifted the meta.
@AENock
@AENock 3 ай бұрын
@@TheFirstJake if you want to investigate, it's the "Advanced Deck Beelzemon [ST14]". The big payoff cards in the deck were released specifically with this product. In mtg terms, the strategy is " self-mill, graveyard size matters". Self mill is prominent, but this deck took it to 11. It had a pretty high representation %, sometimes making up 50% of any event. It definitely skewed the meta and pushed the power level of the format upwards.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
Darn. That sounds pretty sweet. Unfortunately I’m trying not to buy into any new tcgs at the moment. I’ll definitely read up on it. I’m currently digging into lorcana as i like their “mana” system.
@AENock
@AENock 3 ай бұрын
@@TheFirstJake oh yeah for sure. the good news is Digimon is incredibly cheap, but it's very much a Japanese combo soup. Lorcana is also a banger. It scratches that old school magic itch and it's inexpensive to get into.
@Flyboyminer
@Flyboyminer 3 ай бұрын
Long time player here. I tell everyone new not to buy decks to avoid absolutely wasting money.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
Yeah it’s sad that this is good advice.
@innistrad94
@innistrad94 3 ай бұрын
The issue is that MTG isnt focused on standard anymore they are highly focused on EDH / Commander which in all honesty is a easier way to learn the game vs standard + its so much cheaper, you only have to buy x1 card instead of a play set of that $20 card you really enjoy.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
That just means they need to print those cards in a starter deck. I guarantee it won't be $20 anymore.
@violetto3219
@violetto3219 3 ай бұрын
i heavily disagree that commander is easier to learn. the onboarding process for a new player means you're going to have to learn what 70-80 different cards in your deck are supposed to do while trying to react to ~3 other people at the same time. 60 cards with a playset of 4 means there are just going to be fewer cards you need to learn, regardless of how competitive the format might be
@Twiggithy
@Twiggithy 3 ай бұрын
Card Kingdom's rookie decks are the best I found so far for teaching new people, but they still have problems. The only issues with them is that they lack instants to cut down complexity I think (bad idea imo) and can grind down to a snails pace. Their Battle Decks may be fine too. I've had fun with those.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
I really like Card Kingdom's 3rd party decks. They are definitely my go-to for "what do to after starter kit" conversation. It's unfortunate that they haven't been stocking them lately.
@Damoonmenace
@Damoonmenace 2 ай бұрын
Hello! I found your channel bc I’m a fresh noob that wants to get into magic bc of my dad and friends, so I came to this video after countless others and this seems to have great points Where I live my local players are either commander or Kitchen table players but mostly kitchen, so I wanted a way to buy a product to play with friends in the 60 card format of kitchen but every store I went is all just commander So to ask advice would it just be better to try build a deck with singles from a site like TCGplayer or would their be a good product for me to start, I wanna try the archetype of either Dragons, dinosaurs, or goblins if this helps with budget and products to purchase
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 2 ай бұрын
For 60 card play, you're probably going to be better off picking up singles. If there's a challenger deck in the archetype you're looking for it can act as a good jumping off point, but they are designed for a specific format so it has some weird suboptimal choices. Also occasionally cardkingdom restocks their battle decks which are completely prebuilt kitchen table decks with a great strategy guide. Also if you already have a community that plays you might just ask around. Most people are drowning in bulk. It will be garbage, but it's a starting point.
@TheBearNecessiTCG
@TheBearNecessiTCG 3 ай бұрын
I recently got the 2 player intro starter decks to introduce my girlfriend to the game. They were boring! No synergy or even enough randomness. I played magic when revised came out and a bit here and there afterwards. It was pretty disappointing so then I got 2 commander decks and those didn't work either for introducing a new player. I agree that they need to start making better starter decks for magic.
@violetto3219
@violetto3219 3 ай бұрын
i've been wanting to help one of my friends get into magic, but i haven't been able to make my own decks for that, and the intro decks are mindnumbingly boring to me. i feel like they could easily design simple, one or two color decks that can teach you some basic synergies and themes of the game while not throwing complexity at you, but instead the theme is always Recent Draft Chaff typal
@louiskonerding7502
@louiskonerding7502 3 ай бұрын
This is exactly the reason i dont start playing Mtg. I have no idea where to start and i dont want to go online and just buy all the singular cards for a tier 1 deck for like 200€. Thats what i really liked about yugioh. Its so easy to just buy a structure deck 3 times and start playing
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
Well I will caveat my statement a little. There are excellent starter products for Commander which is the most popular casual format. There's a few at most LGS's that I've been to recently floating around $30-40 that can definitely hold their own at a random pick-up game.
@anonym3852
@anonym3852 3 ай бұрын
Just buy a commander deck and find some people to play with. You dont need more than that. Its a casual format (not like yugioh) so everyone tries to get the same powerlevel decks which is kinda easy. Yugioh also lets you pay high amount of money, if you want some specific card which boost your winrate by a lot. I own both, yugioh and magic decks. Also as soon as you got your first commander precon... Simply proxy the shit out of MTG and get for 25euro every tier1 deck in commander and so on. Its a casual format so nobody cares. Comparison to YuGiOh, where you cant even use korean/japanese cards even if they are 90% cheaper. Thats just a scam. English tournament with spanish cards? No problem. English tournament with korean cards? Not possible.
@Dimitar_Tsanev
@Dimitar_Tsanev 3 ай бұрын
Man I really love your videos but other than the intro music they're REEEEAAALLY quiet. I see that you aren't micing yourself which is fine but in that case I think it would be really beneficial for your viewership if you make some adjustments to the audio in post before uploading.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
I appreciate the feedback. I'll look into boosting the sound a bit. Thanks!
@Dimitar_Tsanev
@Dimitar_Tsanev 3 ай бұрын
@@TheFirstJake Oh I'm also building an azorius bird/flying themes deck!... Great suggestions.
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
That's awesome! I'd love to see the list when you complete it.
@TheOriginalIBT
@TheOriginalIBT 3 ай бұрын
They did it with pioneer decks, shame that the format is shit... They should just do the same for modern decks, they were really good and you can still play them out of the box and compete with other pioneer decks (and even compete seriously after upgrading a bit) Btw you have some malfunctions at the point where you talk about the blue white bird deck
@TheFirstJake
@TheFirstJake 3 ай бұрын
Yeah i would love that. Honestly though I’d almost rather it not be tied to any competitive format. It feels like right now people have the dividing line at commander vs competitive and it really feels like comparing two separate axes.
@behemoth9543
@behemoth9543 3 ай бұрын
Pioneer decks still had major issues like having a single rare shockland you would want to play, 1 or 2 copies of the card the deck is named after that is the whole reason it exists(looking at you Izzet Pheonix), outright unplayable cards because they had to fill the void left by removing expensive cards with something... It would be a major step up from having nothing at all but by god there were still lots of issues with it and there would be room to improve upon them.
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